I have the opportunity to test the new upgraded features on the JCB backhoe range for 2024 and even get to try a full spec 4CX with Engcon tiltrotator!
If it's like the huddig, there are a few things to note. 1) A front bucket full of gear makes a huge difference 2) Driving while grading with the backhoe bucket makes quick work of a lot tasks. 3) direct mount tilty, with a very short stick is the only way to make it work. 4) dual drive is the biggest game changer by far. We couldn't have a backhoe without one now.
I just think the current line up of tiltrotators don't suit the backhoe sadly. And Engcon at least is going away from direct mount which is a shame - its a good option for many people. The 5CX has a bigger boom and dipper, I did wonder if the 5CX boom with 3/4cx dipper would sort some of the issues with the boom not lifting enough - but fundamentally, the unit is too heavy for the machine as it stands. Ill keep my eye out on options, but wont be going down the tiltrotator route myself just yet. I would love to try a Huddig, but not sure there is even one in the UK. And who knows if it would fit down our small roads, its bad enough in a 3cx with everyone wanting to be in the front bucket as they overtake!
Thanks, it was great to meet you both that day. You have some excellent skills on the backhoe - very impressive. I look forward to learning more operating tips from your channel in the future.
I’ve run a tilt bucket on a backhoe and a tilt rotator on a rubber tired excavator(just long enough to sell me, not long enough to get good, lol) and I’ve thought a 4CX with an engcon would be pretty slick but you hit on many of the points that I thought would be limiting factors, I think the versatility gained would off set any of the issues that the extra weight would cause but the ultimate dream for me would be a Huddig 1370, I’ve never sat in the seat of one and they only have a handful here in the US but the things I’ve seen online look like an outstanding piece of kit for so many different jobs
@@RWLockwoodConstruction you are a lucky MF’r! The more I look into them the more times I think of where a Huddig would have been the cat’s ass! I know work comes first it but I follow you on the ‘gram and enjoy anything you post with your Huddig until I get the chance to put my butt in one, let’s just say my 5 year plan has changed since I took a serious look at them
Those Huddigs are a serious piece of kit, and Robert is showing how to get the best from one for sure. I don't think there's one in the UK to even compare it to the 4cx side by side.
Great watching used to king of the very older jcb mkk 2 3 then the white cab site master came out before jcb I drove the 50&50b massey Ferguson with operator leavers for everyone movement thanks for sharing ..ps.. went to jcb open weekend 30 years back a charity weekend driving rubber ducks ect thanks
Great video Ollie, really enjoy your thoughts and insights! Always a pleasure to host you at JCB so thank you for coming along. I’m sorry for cutting your digger playtime short 😂
I loved it, thank you so much for getting those machines together for us. With an investment this big, its very hard to know what you do or don't want until you can play on one for a few minutes. I could have stayed playing all day, as you know. Its like the ultimate sandpit for adults in that quarry!
That 4cx with the Engcon would have been my dream machine back in my days on house building work as owner operator Think a roto-top might be a good compromise over full tilt rotator setup 🤔
The "Mini (Midi?) CX" is actually a 2DX, which is a scaled down 3DX built in India for the Asian and African markets, primarily used in agricultural settings. Not very common in Africa, but they are a complete backhoe loader and the backhoe does not come off.
Great episode Ollie, thanks for sharing your thoughts raw and unfiltered. I'm in the same spot with Case. While they have made some changes and refinements to the TLB line, and which I applaud them for, I struggle to justify financing another $130,000 to $150,000 just for the minor upgrades, as they are. Seems like my 2018 digs just fine for that kind of cash. A couple thoughts: 1. With that tilty installed, that JCB is not a dirt hogging machine. It is however, probably a most excellent curb and gutter, and other fine work machine, while still retaining the versatility of the TLB. Honestly, at this point I think the only TLB machine that can handle a tilty properly is the Huddig. But they are HUGE. And expensive. 2. If you think about it, you're butting right up to the edge of TLB/wheeled excavator territory. A wheeled 360 machine would handle the tilty better, give you more options on spoil placement, be better at mobile work like curb and gutter or just cleaning up, and still retain the ability to self transport. You do lose the loader on front, but if you bring a high volume grading bucket you can still get by loading trucks and such. Plus, you have a better profile when working as you don't have to worry about the front loader being out in traffic while digging. 3. You got to hang with the_happydigger, so fun times indeed.
That dual drive is a real game changer, the amount of times I've used the backhoe to place bedding sand in a trench where the loader couldn't reach or couldn't place accurately enough. I doubt I'll see anything like that here in Canada, most manufacturers don't have a sideshift option for us so we're always stuck with the centerpivot shit show and not being able to see around the boom. Some day I'll make a trip to the U.K. and Europe and be a Heavy Equipment tourist.
I believe dual drive is coming to America so don't see why that doesn't apply to Canada too. As for the centermount vs side shift debate, I think there is advantages to both designs but the sideshift machines come into their own in tighter spaces that we find here in the UK which is why the centermount design never really took off here
@@Olliegunns Yeah I've been on a multitude of jobs where that sideshift would of been very handy and made the job go a lot faster, the bulk of these jobs in confined urban areas. On another note I ran a North American equivalent to the 2CX that was called the 217S about 25 years ago, loved the 4 wheel steer function and being young always had fun driving it around the site in crab steer. Lol
Struggling to lift up 😮. My case would piss that. 😂 nice to see they moved forks from the 23 model jcb site pro i had on demo . They would of clashed with bonnet once they wore in.
Try entering the pile at the V ( to the side) of the previous entry point - it fills the bucket easier and avoids burying the Toe Plate in Dense material for the full length of the Toe Plate hence maintains Lift ability- to enter the pile in the same slot buries the Toe Plate in Dense material for the full length of the Toe Plate creating difficulty in breaking out
Its a good point. Ill try to remember that next time. You don't always see my best driving on these videos when I'm trying to drive an unfamiliar machine and talk to camera!
just had a new 4cx pro on pre order with all the extras £99500 ended up not going ahead with it after thinking about how many times I would need to have a jcb laptop plugged in to diagnose constant teething problems😢 Ended up buying a Cat 444. The weight being 1.5 ton heavier speaks volumes in build quality 💪
I'd be interested to know how you get on with the CAT. No shortage of electronics on them either! But mostly because I think the curved boom might solve a couple of the problems adding a tiltrotator gives a 4cx. What sort of work do you do with it?
@@Olliegunns work is mostly heavier civil construction, steel frame buildings, industrial work areas. The reverse drive was what originally pushed me towards the jcb, but why make a 180 digger reverse drive 🤔 just avoid the hole hassle and go straight for a 8/9 ton wheeled excavator. Every digger has it cons and pros I suppose never be the perfect digger
Interesting, it been 10 years since i try new JCB backhoe, i could see new JCB doing farm maintenance, fencing much more versatile then standard tractor.
Give one of these new ones a try. Honestly, they are a level above the older ones in terms of tech and features. Some would argue all that makes them potentially less reliable but the world moves forward and I would rather have a seriously productive machine with excellent backup than an older machine that can do the work, but makes hard work of it.
I found with my jcb 4cx with a tilt rotator the hydraulic oil consumption dropped Dramatically soon as i switched the tilt rotator to normal bucket or breaker the hydraulic oil consumption reduced but i love the comfort of my 4cx
I've seen a few of those Knox tiltrotators running standard 3cx buckets under them on backhoes. They are a bit lighter without the gripper and can be direct mounted too which helps with the build height. But they have the same issue all the manufacturers have with the backhoe - they want you to fit the next size up tilty because the 3/4cx falls right on the line between the two models. And a bigger tiltrotator on the smaller machine is never ideal - better to have the biggest machine with the smallest tilty you can. Handles it much better then
It's a shame jcb can't produce a good excavator I loved the 3cx as I've mentioned, but firm I work for tried jcb excavators I just found the hydrolics weren't really good build quality was rubbish and reliability was an issue especially with the 220 it was horrible nobody wanted to drive it changing bucket was a real pain all the stupid safety features but most of all was the hydrolics you couldn't grade with it was a horrible machine glad it's gone ,good thing jcb cabs fairly comfortable better than the case 130 e series I'm on now it's a horrible uncomfortable cab,not been on x series but my boss has and he says the demo machine he drove was gutless, for me a good machine has to be able to grade with tip of bucket not many new machines can do this nowadays due to load sensing hydrolics volvo and takeuchi are best on market in my opinion I've driven tractors and plant since I was 7 I'm 54 now so I know how a machine should be ,but I'm still learning everyday drove our 9 ton whacker nueson for first time what a nice machine its a couple of years old ok cab rattles a bit but hydrolics are smooth ,anyway guys all this is just my opinion each to there own
Not been on one my boss demo one and he knows about machines driven everything ever made he loved jcb but he tried a jcb 220 x series said it wouldn't even lift it self to spray round but he's been used to volvo 220 ,can't beat volvo for power and I will argue that all day long having driven jcb hitachi cat case takeuchi kubota doosan must admit not been on hyundi or some of the Chinese machines machine
I.own a 2017js 220 the past 6years with topcon 3d system . My work involves a lot of fine grading on roads and plenty of foundations and sewer and storm lines.6k hours and no issues thank God. A lot of operators here in Ireland don't rate JCB excavators and swear by Hitachi,Volvo and even Sany FFS!!. I always tell them to put their money where their mouth is and buy a better machine than the one I own.Most of these experts drive a car or van worth 3 grand.My js has made me more money than most of them will ever see.I started work at 15 and am now 57.Haven't heard or seen it all but not far away.
@@andrewbrady6385 a mate of mine has a 1989 jcb 814 powerslide and he loves the jcb brand but he has found the hydraulics a bit ropey on newer machines but I've driven jcb js360 and volvo equivalent but just find jcb much more user friendly
We shall see. Ive always liked the look of a 3cx, they just look right. But got to say, that 4CX is some weapon of a thing on not much larger footprint to the 3cx
I'm not sure engcon do PUP hitches anymore? But some of the other manufacturers do. And yes its possible, but the PUP hitch increases build height even further which is its main disadvantage!
Interesting! That's exactly what I'm thinking.... And for £3,800 very good value for what in my opinion is 2/3rds of the advantage of the tiltrotator. How have you found it on your machine?
Hi olly I drove a 3cx for years loved them then we got a cat 432f what a machine run rings round a jcb had miles more power faster hydrolics good machine, little tip when going in stop pile with front bucket lift and shake a little it loads your front tyres and reduces wheel slip👍
Not sure if cat have 50k it's years ago I was on the cat 432 on track machines now on a case 130 e series with gps and engcon case is shite not patch on volvo I had
Great vid, thanks. Maybe the 4cx and tilt rotator would be worth trying with the tyres ballasted? Or wheel weights on the inside of the rims, which would mean more weight and more offset on the wheels so would probably make the machine around 4" wider. Could make it a much handier machine!
This had entered my mind, removable wheel weights like the tractors have. I think it would work well and be a fairly low cost solution without too much compromise
A bit too much camera focus on you talking. Would have been nice if more direct camera recording towards the machinery's mechanical movements/abilities.
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If it's like the huddig, there are a few things to note.
1) A front bucket full of gear makes a huge difference
2) Driving while grading with the backhoe bucket makes quick work of a lot tasks.
3) direct mount tilty, with a very short stick is the only way to make it work.
4) dual drive is the biggest game changer by far. We couldn't have a backhoe without one now.
I just think the current line up of tiltrotators don't suit the backhoe sadly. And Engcon at least is going away from direct mount which is a shame - its a good option for many people. The 5CX has a bigger boom and dipper, I did wonder if the 5CX boom with 3/4cx dipper would sort some of the issues with the boom not lifting enough - but fundamentally, the unit is too heavy for the machine as it stands. Ill keep my eye out on options, but wont be going down the tiltrotator route myself just yet.
I would love to try a Huddig, but not sure there is even one in the UK. And who knows if it would fit down our small roads, its bad enough in a 3cx with everyone wanting to be in the front bucket as they overtake!
Good vid dude nice to see the tilty in action
Excellent video showing what the 4cx can do.(and its a lot!). But maybe one to move on when the warranty runs out!😊
Great video
Beautiful video, beautiful explanations. I watched the entire video. Keep it up!
Thanks, it was great to meet you both that day. You have some excellent skills on the backhoe - very impressive. I look forward to learning more operating tips from your channel in the future.
I’ve run a tilt bucket on a backhoe and a tilt rotator on a rubber tired excavator(just long enough to sell me, not long enough to get good, lol) and I’ve thought a 4CX with an engcon would be pretty slick but you hit on many of the points that I thought would be limiting factors, I think the versatility gained would off set any of the issues that the extra weight would cause but the ultimate dream for me would be a Huddig 1370, I’ve never sat in the seat of one and they only have a handful here in the US but the things I’ve seen online look like an outstanding piece of kit for so many different jobs
I've got a 1370. great machine, very. productive,
@@RWLockwoodConstruction you are a lucky MF’r! The more I look into them the more times I think of where a Huddig would have been the cat’s ass! I know work comes first it but I follow you on the ‘gram and enjoy anything you post with your Huddig until I get the chance to put my butt in one, let’s just say my 5 year plan has changed since I took a serious look at them
Those Huddigs are a serious piece of kit, and Robert is showing how to get the best from one for sure. I don't think there's one in the UK to even compare it to the 4cx side by side.
Great watching used to king of the very older jcb mkk 2 3 then the white cab site master came out before jcb I drove the 50&50b massey Ferguson with operator leavers for everyone movement thanks for sharing ..ps.. went to jcb open weekend 30 years back a charity weekend driving rubber ducks ect thanks
Great video Ollie, really enjoy your thoughts and insights! Always a pleasure to host you at JCB so thank you for coming along. I’m sorry for cutting your digger playtime short 😂
I loved it, thank you so much for getting those machines together for us. With an investment this big, its very hard to know what you do or don't want until you can play on one for a few minutes. I could have stayed playing all day, as you know. Its like the ultimate sandpit for adults in that quarry!
Another brilliant video look forward to the next one
That 4cx with the Engcon would have been my dream machine back in my days on house building work as owner operator
Think a roto-top might be a good compromise over full tilt rotator setup 🤔
The "Mini (Midi?) CX" is actually a 2DX, which is a scaled down 3DX built in India for the Asian and African markets, primarily used in agricultural settings. Not very common in Africa, but they are a complete backhoe loader and the backhoe does not come off.
I figured that as I was walking round it. Kinda looked a useful size though for smaller jobs, now the 3cx compact has gone down the highway route
Top man olly. Very informative
Hi Ollie Looked like you had a good day out looked good machine's Thanks again
Great episode Ollie, thanks for sharing your thoughts raw and unfiltered. I'm in the same spot with Case. While they have made some changes and refinements to the TLB line, and which I applaud them for, I struggle to justify financing another $130,000 to $150,000 just for the minor upgrades, as they are. Seems like my 2018 digs just fine for that kind of cash.
A couple thoughts:
1. With that tilty installed, that JCB is not a dirt hogging machine. It is however, probably a most excellent curb and gutter, and other fine work machine, while still retaining the versatility of the TLB. Honestly, at this point I think the only TLB machine that can handle a tilty properly is the Huddig. But they are HUGE. And expensive.
2. If you think about it, you're butting right up to the edge of TLB/wheeled excavator territory. A wheeled 360 machine would handle the tilty better, give you more options on spoil placement, be better at mobile work like curb and gutter or just cleaning up, and still retain the ability to self transport. You do lose the loader on front, but if you bring a high volume grading bucket you can still get by loading trucks and such. Plus, you have a better profile when working as you don't have to worry about the front loader being out in traffic while digging.
3. You got to hang with the_happydigger, so fun times indeed.
That dual drive is a real game changer, the amount of times I've used the backhoe to place bedding sand in a trench where the loader couldn't reach or couldn't place accurately enough. I doubt I'll see anything like that here in Canada, most manufacturers don't have a sideshift option for us so we're always stuck with the centerpivot shit show and not being able to see around the boom. Some day I'll make a trip to the U.K. and Europe and be a Heavy Equipment tourist.
I believe dual drive is coming to America so don't see why that doesn't apply to Canada too. As for the centermount vs side shift debate, I think there is advantages to both designs but the sideshift machines come into their own in tighter spaces that we find here in the UK which is why the centermount design never really took off here
@@Olliegunns Yeah I've been on a multitude of jobs where that sideshift would of been very handy and made the job go a lot faster, the bulk of these jobs in confined urban areas. On another note I ran a North American equivalent to the 2CX that was called the 217S about 25 years ago, loved the 4 wheel steer function and being young always had fun driving it around the site in crab steer. Lol
Where i live they make the ec209 with a hydrema coupler they run on the backhoes direct mount, They are quite a bit lighter than the s45 option :)
Struggling to lift up 😮. My case would piss that. 😂 nice to see they moved forks from the 23 model jcb site pro i had on demo . They would of clashed with bonnet once they wore in.
Try entering the pile at the V ( to the side) of the previous entry point - it fills the bucket easier and avoids burying the Toe Plate in Dense material for the full length of the Toe Plate hence maintains Lift ability- to enter the pile in the same slot buries the Toe Plate in Dense material for the full length of the Toe Plate creating difficulty in breaking out
Its a good point. Ill try to remember that next time. You don't always see my best driving on these videos when I'm trying to drive an unfamiliar machine and talk to camera!
just had a new 4cx pro on pre order with all the extras £99500 ended up not going ahead with it after thinking about how many times I would need to have a jcb laptop plugged in to diagnose constant teething problems😢
Ended up buying a Cat 444. The weight being 1.5 ton heavier speaks volumes in build quality 💪
I'd be interested to know how you get on with the CAT. No shortage of electronics on them either! But mostly because I think the curved boom might solve a couple of the problems adding a tiltrotator gives a 4cx. What sort of work do you do with it?
If you put an engocn on it you should see if they can add the rear driving feature.
@@Olliegunns work is mostly heavier civil construction, steel frame buildings, industrial work areas.
The reverse drive was what originally pushed me towards the jcb, but why make a 180 digger reverse drive 🤔 just avoid the hole hassle and go straight for a 8/9 ton wheeled excavator. Every digger has it cons and pros I suppose never be the perfect digger
4cx and tilt-rotator YUM YUM!
It does look good doesn't it!
@@Olliegunns Yes indeed! I have a '76 3cmk2 so that 2024 4cx looks like a space ship in comparison!
Interesting, it been 10 years since i try new JCB backhoe, i could see new JCB doing farm maintenance, fencing much more versatile then standard tractor.
Give one of these new ones a try. Honestly, they are a level above the older ones in terms of tech and features. Some would argue all that makes them potentially less reliable but the world moves forward and I would rather have a seriously productive machine with excellent backup than an older machine that can do the work, but makes hard work of it.
It would be interesting to see you test operate a Hydrema equivalent. Price difference would be amusing. 🤔. Good vid as always.
I found with my jcb 4cx with a tilt rotator the hydraulic oil consumption dropped Dramatically soon as i switched the tilt rotator to normal bucket or breaker the hydraulic oil consumption reduced but i love the comfort of my 4cx
Do you still run the 4cx with the tiltrotator? How did you find it?
2.8 is impressive!
I recently saw a steel wrist top coupler with a Knox tilt rotator and that seemed alot less bulky of a compromise.
I've seen a few of those Knox tiltrotators running standard 3cx buckets under them on backhoes. They are a bit lighter without the gripper and can be direct mounted too which helps with the build height. But they have the same issue all the manufacturers have with the backhoe - they want you to fit the next size up tilty because the 3/4cx falls right on the line between the two models. And a bigger tiltrotator on the smaller machine is never ideal - better to have the biggest machine with the smallest tilty you can. Handles it much better then
The twin steer looks great, I wonder what the turning circle is like vs the old model? 🤔
I believe its the same - depending on tyre choice.
It would be awesome to see you try a proper scandi backhoe like a Huddig or a Hydrema. Any chance there is a dealer of those anywhere near you?
It's a shame jcb can't produce a good excavator I loved the 3cx as I've mentioned, but firm I work for tried jcb excavators I just found the hydrolics weren't really good build quality was rubbish and reliability was an issue especially with the 220 it was horrible nobody wanted to drive it changing bucket was a real pain all the stupid safety features but most of all was the hydrolics you couldn't grade with it was a horrible machine glad it's gone ,good thing jcb cabs fairly comfortable better than the case 130 e series I'm on now it's a horrible uncomfortable cab,not been on x series but my boss has and he says the demo machine he drove was gutless, for me a good machine has to be able to grade with tip of bucket not many new machines can do this nowadays due to load sensing hydrolics volvo and takeuchi are best on market in my opinion I've driven tractors and plant since I was 7 I'm 54 now so I know how a machine should be ,but I'm still learning everyday drove our 9 ton whacker nueson for first time what a nice machine its a couple of years old ok cab rattles a bit but hydrolics are smooth ,anyway guys all this is just my opinion each to there own
I Totally agree with you The
There’s nothing gutless about them X Series machines. and best cab in the game!
Not been on one my boss demo one and he knows about machines driven everything ever made he loved jcb but he tried a jcb 220 x series said it wouldn't even lift it self to spray round but he's been used to volvo 220 ,can't beat volvo for power and I will argue that all day long having driven jcb hitachi cat case takeuchi kubota doosan must admit not been on hyundi or some of the Chinese machines machine
I.own a 2017js 220 the past 6years with topcon 3d system .
My work involves a lot of fine grading on roads and plenty of foundations and sewer and storm lines.6k hours and no issues thank God.
A lot of operators here in Ireland don't rate JCB excavators and swear by Hitachi,Volvo and even Sany FFS!!.
I always tell them to put their money where their mouth is and buy a better machine than the one I own.Most of these experts drive a car or van worth 3 grand.My js has made me more money than most of them will ever see.I started work at 15 and am now 57.Haven't heard or seen it all but not far away.
@@andrewbrady6385 a mate of mine has a 1989 jcb 814 powerslide and he loves the jcb brand but he has found the hydraulics a bit ropey on newer machines but I've driven jcb js360 and volvo equivalent but just find jcb much more user friendly
great vlog ollie the 4cx is something else isnt i would love to drive one i think your 4cx kind of guy 😁😁
We shall see. Ive always liked the look of a 3cx, they just look right. But got to say, that 4CX is some weapon of a thing on not much larger footprint to the 3cx
can you use normal jcb buckets on a engcon
I'm not sure engcon do PUP hitches anymore? But some of the other manufacturers do. And yes its possible, but the PUP hitch increases build height even further which is its main disadvantage!
34:00 can you drive the mashine while sitting sideways?
Up to 45 degrees turned from the back yes. Cuts out if you go past that I believe
Don’t they make a carriage style gripper now? That’s removable
For when you don’t need it? Or was it for larger machines?
The cat 444 eats the ec209
Does it not have any of the issues I outlined in this video? I know the banana boom would help with at least two of the issues I had with the 4cx
Thought provocing stuff as ever Ollie, what about the Holp Rototop hitch ? many of the advantages and less weight, less money and gripper available ??
I've thought about it Jerry, but not seen one in the metal yet to get a feel for them
@@Olliegunns Another video potentially ? MPS down the westcoutry seem to be shifting a few.
Why are they not using jcb's own raptor? Tilt.
I think its only available on the Hydradig at the moment, although the pin sizes and dims are the same for the backhoe....
Have a look at a JB rotating bucket I have one on my 3cx
Interesting! That's exactly what I'm thinking.... And for £3,800 very good value for what in my opinion is 2/3rds of the advantage of the tiltrotator. How have you found it on your machine?
@@Olliegunns I'm delighted with it game changer very light they recommend the GRB.4 .R for the 3cx.
Hi olly I drove a 3cx for years loved them then we got a cat 432f what a machine run rings round a jcb had miles more power faster hydrolics good machine, little tip when going in stop pile with front bucket lift and shake a little it loads your front tyres and reduces wheel slip👍
Have they got a 50km/h model yet or still 40km/h?
Not sure if cat have 50k it's years ago I was on the cat 432 on track machines now on a case 130 e series with gps and engcon case is shite not patch on volvo I had
Great vid, thanks. Maybe the 4cx and tilt rotator would be worth trying with the tyres ballasted? Or wheel weights on the inside of the rims, which would mean more weight and more offset on the wheels so would probably make the machine around 4" wider. Could make it a much handier machine!
This had entered my mind, removable wheel weights like the tractors have. I think it would work well and be a fairly low cost solution without too much compromise
Maby you should look at a huddig
I would venture a guess that they are way more expensive compared to a JCB.
No doubt! And Ive not seen one in the UK at all. Maybe because they are massive in size compared to the JCB/ CAT machines
Hi Ollie be great to have a chat soon mate 👍📞
A bit too much camera focus on you talking. Would have been nice if more direct camera recording towards the machinery's mechanical movements/abilities.