Cliffe Knechtle Explains the Holy Trinity (Father, Son, Holy Spirit)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.ย. 2024
- #cliffeknechtle explains the Holy trinity by giving an analogy, to help the audience understand the concept of 3 in 1. He also explains how the Holy Trinity is good concept.
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The analogy that I use when I try to think of or explain the trinity is you take a big bowl of water. that bowl of water represents God. Then you take a cup and you scoop out some water and let it evaporate and vaporize, that represents the Holy Spirit. You take another cup of water from the bowl and you freeze it and that represents Jesus Christ. All three are H2O, yet in different states. They can exist independently of each other at the same time in the same room, but they are not separate from each other because they are the same thing. The three states of water is something that always has existed, and they will always be part of the water. Obviously not a perfect analogy, but that's just my two cents.
sus
Modalism
@@MakimaDog That's where my analogy fails at explaining against, how would you change it to have it properly describe Trinitarianism and not Modalism?
I guess to have it be more like Trinitarianism, you could say God = H2O (like the molecular structure), The Father = Water, The Son = Ice, The Holy Spirit = Vapor. So they are all God, but they are not all each other. But that still has its flaws, I don't believe it's possible to describe it in a way to cover all bases against heresy.
@@MisterWiza We can’t compare the creator with His creation using worldly analogies. The problem with the water analogy is that it implies that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are 3 different forms/expressions of God rather than 3 distinct persons.
Son is God in flesh, Holy Spirit is God in us, Father is God in Heaven
Sounds good, but it’s not the whole story. The son existed before he became flesh. Like god the father the son has always been.
Yeah bro, you're right about that, Jesus is originally a Spirit, He is also a God, He is equal with the Father in nature or essence because they're both God but the Father is greater in authority because the Father sent the son. The Son of God is also a God, A son of a human being is also a human being, a son of an animal is also an animal. In original Greek manuscript, it says "Monogenes Theos" or only begotten God; in John 1:18. Jesus existed in eternity with the Father before everything was made in John 1:1-3, 14. Jesus became a human being because God the Father sent him to be in a human body that was prepared for him in the belly of Mary by the power of the Holy Spirit. And Jesus claimed to be God in John 8:56-58 and Revelation 1:17-18.
The son, in flesh, called the father "the ONLY true god." John 17:3
Mark 12:28 *One of the scribes* approached. When he heard them debating and saw that Jesus answered them well, he asked him, “Which command is *the most important* OF ALL?” 29 Jesus answered, “The *most important* IS Listen, Israel! The Lord our God, is *one Lord.* 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength. 31 The second is, Love your neighbor as yourself. There is *no other* command greater than these.” 32 Then *the scribe* said to him, *“You are right, teacher.* You have *correctly* said that *HE* is one, and there is *no one else* except *HIM.*
So according to the Israelite scribe and Jesus Christ, the God of Israel is One Person and not three in one. You deny the first and most important commandment of ALL, that God is One Lord, not two, not three, not more!!! In fact you're calling the Scribe and Jesus Christ liars because of an unbiblical doctrine.
@@JudeOne3Four there is only one god. However, Jesus also said „the father and I are one“. How do you explain this?
You are a father to your son
At the same time, you're a son to your father
At the same time you are a husband to your wife
And at the same time you're a brother to your brother/sister
All the while being absolutely singular and not schizophrenic.
@@SocietalRift is that about god or me?
Modalism.
@@caseyfenton90 yes but works the best for me
@joshclips2053 Modalism works the best for you? Literal heresy? How about we avoid trying to explain the mystery of the Trinity, and stick to what the Bible says?
The analogy I use is scripture.
God, is not a trinity, but family. Ephesians 3:15.
Consider this:
If we are to become joint heirs, brethren with the 3rd leg of a trinity, that's still elohim, family.
One God, with a family of holy spirits.
SO. If it took an immortal holy spirit to tell Mary she would be visited by the holy spirit, that either makes quad, or family of God.
This Duo was greater analogy than the one Cliffe brought up. Father and Son, one is Spirit but different minds
The way I like to think of it is like its a family. Or better the family unit is a representation of the Holy Trinity.The Father is the head/mind the authority.The Son represents the mother.Just like woman came from mans rib the Son comes from the Father as the only begotten Son. God is masculine in representaion but is the originator of both the masculine and feminine virtues. Christ like the mother is the grace and love and mercy the nurturer. The Holy Ghost representing the union between the two. Two shall become one flesh Gen 2:24, and also I and the Father are one John 10:30. The one flesh is the child and just like the Holy Spirit it is fruitful and multiples. A family is one but three persons (or infinite when considering the Holy Spirit) all in unison.
Dios es
Infinity + infinity + infinity = infinity
Father + Son + Holy Spirit = God
Analogy: water, water can be liquid, solid, and or gas… water is something of a trinity… if water can do it The Father DEFINITELY CAN!!!! #CANTLIMITTHEFATHER
"I and the Father are One"
"If youve seen me youve seen the Father"
Did Jesus mean that he is God at John 10:30, when Jesus told the Jews while in the temple that "I and the Father are one" ? No. Rather, what he meant is explained at John 17:11, 20-23, whereby Jesus said in prayer TO God:
"I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, watch over them on account of your own name, which you have given me, so that THEY (Jesus disciples) may be ONE (in unity) just as WE are ONE (in unity, purpose)......."
"I make request, not concerning these only, but also concerning those putting faith in me through their word, so that THEY may all be ONE, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in UNION with us (or work together as "one"), so that the world may believe that you sent me."
"I have given them the glory that you have given me, in order that THEY may be ONE just as WE are ONE. I in union with them and you in union with me, in order that they may be PERFECTED INTO ONE (Greek teteleiomenoi eis hen, meaning "to make perfect or complete, i.e. accomplish, into one") so that the world may know that you sent me and that you loved them just as you loved me."
The world is littered with people who are divisive, while Jesus on the other hand, set the example of imitating "the Holy Father", God, whose name is Jehovah (see (Ex 6:3, KJV), in being "one", in unity and purpose with his disciples by teaching them how to be humble (see Luke 18:9-14), and NOT "the greatest" (see Luke 22:24, creating division), so that "they may be one just as we are one" in unity.
At John 10:31-38, the account says that after Jesus had said to the Jews that he was doing the works of his Father and that they were not his "sheep", the Jews attempted to stone him, so that Jesus asked them for what works were they stoning him, so that the Jews said: "We are stoning you, not for a fine work, but for blasphemy; for you, although being a man, make yourself a god."
Jesus now clearly explains that he is NOT God, as so many falsely believe: "Is it not written in your Law (at Ps 82), ‘I said: “You are gods”’? If he called ‘gods’ (or the apostate, corrupt judges of Israel) those against whom the word of God came-"
"and yet the scripture cannot be nullified-do you say to me whom the Father SANCTIFIED (or made holy by the Father, in which Jehovah is to he one who sets the standard of holiness and NOT the one who is made holy) and sent into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, ‘I am God’s SON’ ?"
"If I am not doing the works of MY Father (clearly showing as NOT God, but has a father like ALL sons do, see 2 Cor 1:3; Eph 1:3; 1 Pet 1:3), do not believe me. But if I am doing them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, so that you may come to know and may continue knowing that the Father is in UNION WITH ME (as "one") and I am in union with the Father."
So, Jesus made it "crystal clear" that he is NOT God, but God's Son, as he told Nicodemus: "“For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life."
"For God did not send ("send", Greek apostello, meaning "to send out on a mission") his Son into the world for him to judge the world, but for the world to be saved through him. Whoever exercises faith in him is not to be judged."
"Whoever does not exercise faith has been judged already, because he has not exercised faith in the name of the only-begotten ("only-begotten", Greek monogenes, meaning "single of its kind, only-born, sole" child of a father, see Judges 11:34, in which Jephthah's daughter "was his one and only child", being the Hebrew yachiyd, meaning "only, only one, sole, solitary, one") Son of God........"
"For the one whom God sent ("sent", Greek apostello) speaks the sayings of God, for He does not give the spirit sparingly. The Father loves the Son (showing Jesus as NOT God, but rather a father loving his son) and has given all things into his hand. The one who exercises faith in the Son has everlasting life; the one who disobeys the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God remains upon him."(John 3:16-18, 34-36)
Hence, the belief that Jesus is God is false, a lie.
@@timhaley3459 do you read what you just commented? Im sorry, your comment doesnt make any sense in the slightest.
@timhaley3459 Lots of gymnastics to undo the plain text of the scripture. When he says "ye are gods" it's referring back to genesis. "They have become as one of us knowing good and evil"
@@asdasdasd-o5b
It makes perfect sense, for when Jesus said that "I and the Father are one", it was CLEARLY shown that he meant being "one" in unity, in purpose and NOT being "one" as if Jesus and the Father are God. Is that so hard to grasp ?
At Matthew 19, when the Pharisees tested Jesus by asking if a man could divorce his wife on every sort of grounds, Jesus quoted Genesis 2:24, saying: "Have you not read that the one who created them from the beginning made them male and female and said: ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be ONE flesh’ ? So that they are no longer two, but ONE flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together, let no man put apart.”(Matt 19:3-6)
Jesus made CLEAR that a husband and wife were to work together as "one" in purpose, unity, in accomplishing a common goal, their main goal. There is so much disunity everywhere, from marriages, whereby in the United States, some 4 out of 6 marriages ends up in divorce (many of the rest are "on the edge" of divorce), to the religions of the world, with Christendom broken up into some 41,000 denominations and sects, to the political nations that are "split down the middle".
On the other hand, Jesus CLEARLY explained that he and the Father, Jehovah God (Ex 6:3, KJV), were "one" in purpose, working together to accomplish a common goal (see John 5:17, whereby Jesus said to the Jews, that "my Father has kept working until now, and I keep working"), of completing Jehovah's everlasting purpose of a paradise earth (that was momentarily "lost" in the rebellion in the garden of Eden, Gen 1:26-31; 3:1-6) for "meek" ones to "find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace (or COMPLETE unity)......forever" (Ps 37:11, 29), by means of a heavenly government called God's Kingdom.(Matt 6:9, 10)
ALL who want to keep the status quo of disunity, of NOT wanting to become one of Jehovah's "sons and daughters", as 2 Corinthians 6:14, 17, 18 states: "Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers (who pushes disunity, telling others to chase after their OWN ideas or dreams). For what fellowship do righteousness (that has unity) and lawlessness (that has disunity) have ?......."
"Therefore (quoting Isa 52:11), get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take you in. And I will become a father to you, and you will become sons and daughters to me (as ONE unified body),’ says Jehovah, the Almighty", will be destroyed.(see John 3:36, whereby Jesus states: "The one who exercises faith in the Son (becoming Jehovah's "sons and daughters") has everlasting life; the one who disobeys the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God remains upon him")
So, what do YOU want ? Unity or disarray ? All who wants to keep things as they are, with broken families, broken national groups, keeping people divided one from the other, will be "crushed" to death, as Daniel 2:44, 45 states:
"In the days of those kings (of "the feet and toes of iron mixed with clay", Dan 2:33, the Anglo/American world power, with the United States taking center stage on the world scene) the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people."
"It will CRUSH and put an end to all these kingdoms (the Anglo/American world power, along with the rest of the political system with its some 8 billion supporters), and it alone will stand forever, just as you saw that out of the mountain (Jehovah's sovereignty) a stone (God's heavenly Kingdom) was cut not by hands (or NOT through divisive politics, that keeps people angry and agitated), and that it CRUSHED the iron, the copper, the clay, the silver, and the gold. The Grand God (Jehovah) has made known to the king what will happen in the future. The dream is TRUE, and its interpretation is trustworthy.”
One what?
Thanks!
We're created as a trinity. Body, soul and spirit, in the likeness of God. All of creation exist on the principal of the trinity. Time, space and matter equals creation. Time has past, present and future. Space has height, width and length. Matter has solid, liquid and gas.
We ARE a soul. Gen. 2:7
Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are more than synonyms for God. Jesus behaved as if God was comprised of 3 persons; he prayed to the Father not my will but yours be done, said you may insult me but not Holy Spirit, when I go then Holy Spirit can be with you, and so on.
Just think of it this way. This not biblical, just an analogy.
A Computer game creator, created a simulated gaming world did all the programing, designs everything. He is human and his he created world is software. (creator, technically a god of that game world)
He created an avatar, a pixie of himself so he can interact with other gamers, NPC on that world but is limited within the program (Jesus in human form) no Players or NPC can see the creator, but only interact with the Avatar.
The creator can bend the laws of the program so matrix like, by altering, creating, editing programs within the game, making in game "miracles". (kinda like the Holy Spirit)
It's not a perfect analogy since the game creator is not perfect. And he did not create the other players. Also other players can see the creator via tech. But that's the idea.
Now imagine a perfect being, beyond time and space. that created this world, in time and space and all it's natural laws. Then also created all the players inside a body that can live in time and space and gave it free will.
Then he gave his laws and his will for everyone. However those buggers since having a free will, said nope, were not doing that, were doing this instead which defied the creators will. To the point that they are no longer listening to his messengers and is on their way to death and destruction because of the wages of their sin. So he sent an Avatar of himself to interact and save them.
I really like your analogy, it makes a lot of sense
In Luke 18:18 Jesus says only God is good and not himself and in John chapter 17:3 Jesus calls The Father the one and only true God
Cliffe Knechtle says Jesus spoke of himself and the Holy Spirit as being God. When did Jesus say he was God or the Holy Spirit was God?
Elohim and Marriage are defined with the word echad.
Echad is the Hebrew word for one, but more precisely it means a single entity but made up of more than one part.
In marriage when making a covenant with God the two "man and woman" shall become one.
God said let "Us" make man in our image in Genesis in the original text.
In light of this it displays consistency.
@@ashleyabrahams4827 When a man and a woman become one, scripture goes further and describes them as one flesh. But we don’t interpret that as meaning they morph into one physical body (although their offspring could be the morphing of two into one) or into becoming one being. A husband and wife are still two separate beings despite being one flesh or one couple. Likewise the Godhead maybe one (and we are meant to become one with them John 17:21-23) but that doesn’t mean they become one being any more than we can become one being with them. They are three separate beings hence three separate Gods but fully one in purpose, manner and temperament.
For those who accept Jesus as their Savior will go to heaven & see clearly how the Trinity exists. Not in heaven,, you’ll never know the answer how 3 persons in one God works.
Nobody goes to heaven
"There is none beside me, no, I know not one" - God Always and forever. Do your research, the counsel of Nicaea in 325AD invented the trinity to unify the Christian church and the pagans....just like they did all the other holidays. The bible old and new testament was written by Jews who understood God as absolutely monotheistic and singular in number. It was nearly 300 years later by Constantine and the roman empire that the trinity was invented. I love you Cliffe, but there is only ONE God singular and his name is Jesus. One God with 3 dimensions maybe, but this multiplicity community nonsense from the boy borders on blasphemy and heresy.
Trust you or the Bible? 1 John 5:7.
Unbeliever
Not sure if this is a good analogy. But I use the Egg example. Egg Yolk, Egg White, Egg Shell. Separate parts but together they are an Egg.
Partialism
Partialism is heresy, friend.
@@caseyfenton90 I recognise that every analogy falls short and I have not seen anyone provide a good alternative without going into a long explanation.
Just ppl shouting partialism, modalism, etc.
Each flawed analogy can useful to help a person grasp an aspect of the Trinity as long as they understand it's not perfect.
@@mellenix We ought not fall to pragmatism in order to simplify the person of God.
@@caseyfenton90 Yet Jesus used stories/analogies to explain/simplify the Kingdom of God. Did he use only 1 that could perfectly give us the full picture?
For you, because you're experienced you see it as a failure. But for others, it's a step forward in their journey. We all have different building blocks and sometimes those blocks could be replaced by better blocks. It's just like a kid you can't throw quantum physics at them straight away.
There is no trinity, holy or otherwise. Adrian Rogers said it well about 2--23 years ago, "Try to explain the trinity and you will lose your mind."
It’s easy to understand. Maybe you’re just in denial.
Denial. Trinity adds to god divinity. Doesn’t take away from it 👌
Leave that thinking for it is false. Ask Christ for He to be light of reasoning and turning from denial
The Trinity is an unbiblical creation of the council of Nicaea in AD 325. The Godhead (Father, Son and Holy Ghost) is taught in the Bible but never the convoluted trinitarian concept of three persons in one being. The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are three separate beings. That concept disgusts trinitarians because it would mean an end to monotheism which the council of Nicaea tried to maintain with the irrational invention of one being with three persons. If Jesus and the Father are the same being why did Jesus say the Father was his God? John 20:17. If Jesus and God are the same being why did Jesus say the Father was greater than he was? John 14:28. The Apostle Paul taught that our one God is the Father and our one Lord is Jesus Christ. 1 Corinthians 8:6.
1 Timothy 2:5.
Elohim and Marriage are defined with the word echad.
Echad is the Hebrew word for one, but more precisely it means a single entity but made up of more than one part.
In marriage when making a covenant with God the two "man and woman" shall become one.
God said let "Us" make man in our image in Genesis in the original text.
In light of this it displays consistency. Don't seem convoluted based on the fact that God doesn't change.
The "Holy Trinity" is the central doctrine of Christendom, but it is NOT taught in the Bible. For example there is "God the Father" (1 Cor 8:6; Gal 1:1; Eph 6:23; Phil 2:11; Col 1:3; 3:17; 1 Thess 1:1; 2 Thess 1:2; 1 Tim 1:2; 2 Tim 1:2; Titus 1:4; 1 Pet 1:2; 2 Pet 1:17; 2 John 3; Jude 1), but there is NO "God the Son", nor "God the holy spirit". The "Holy Trinity" is often discussed in "theological terms", while Bible "truth" is discussed in plain language, whereby 1+1+1 is NOT "1", but 3.
At John 14:28, Jesus said that "the Father is greater than I am", and at John 4, Jesus told the Samaritan woman that he worships "God the Father", saying: "You worship what you do not know; WE WORSHIP (Jesus includes himself in worshipping God) what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews."
"Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father (NOT Jesus, for he also worships God the Father, and in which he is "God's only-begotten Son", John 3:16, "the beginning of the creation by God", Rev 3:14) with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him (only). God is a Spirit (NOT a man of flesh and blood), and those worshipping him (NOT Jesus) must worship with spirit and truth.”(John 4:21-24)
At John 6:57, Jesus told the Jews: "Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father (or am alive because the Father gave him life, just as all fathers are "life-givers" for their children), so also the one who feeds on me will live because of me (or that through Jesus those who exercise faith in Jesus will also have life by means of him, John 3:16, 18)."
At John 8:28, 29, Jesus tells the Jews while in the temple: "After you have lifted up the Son of man, then you will know that I am he and that I do NOTHING of my own initiative; but just as the Father TAUGHT ME (in which God is NOT taught by anyone, see Isa 40:13, 14, while Jesus is, as Isaiah 50:4, 5 shows), I speak these things."
"And the One who sent me ("sent me", Greek pempo, meaning "to dispatch on a temporary errand", whereby God sends out his servants to do his will, NOT himself) is with me; he did not abandon me (How can Jesus be God and yet speak of not being abandoned by him ?) to myself, because I always do the things PLEASING to him (How can Jesus be God and yet speak of pleasing the Father ?)."
At John 17, Jesus said in prayer to God the Father, showing he is NOT God, for God does NOT pray to himself: "This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, AND (Jesus made a clear separation between himself and "the only true God", whose name is Jehovah, see Isa 12:2, KJV) the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ. I have glorified you on the earth, having finished the work YOU have GIVEN me to do."(John 17:3, 4) How can Jesus be God and yet be God's servant, "having finished the work you have GIVEN me to do" ?
At John 20:17, Jesus told Mary: "Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to MY Father and your Father and to MY God and your God", showing Jesus as having a father, as we all do and being his God, just as God is our Father.
At Matthew 12:18, it says of Jesus, quoting Isaiah 42:1: "Look ! My (or Jehovah's) servant whom I chose, my beloved, whom I have approved ! I will put my spirit upon him, and what justice is he will make clear to the nations", showing Jesus as Jehovah's servant, as his "beloved" Son, that has Jehovah's approval.(see Matt 3:17, that says: "Look ! Also, a voice from the heavens said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved", Question: Does God need his own approval ?)
At Matthew 27:40, 42, 43, when Jesus was on the stake, mockers said: "You who would throw down the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! If you are a SON of God, come down off the torture stake !......Others he saved; himself he cannot save ! He is King of Israel; let him now come down off the torture stake, and we will believe in him. He has put his TRUST IN God; let Him now rescue him if He wants him, for he said, ‘I am God’s Son."
At 1 Timothy 2:5, 6, it says: "For there is one God, and one mediator BETWEEN God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all", whereby for Jesus to become "a corresponding ransom for all", he had to be equal to the first man Adam who rebelled, becoming "the last Adam", "life for life" (Ex 21:23), a perfect MAN (NOT God) replacing the once perfect man, but now rebel man Adam, see 1 Cor 15:45)
And of John 1:1, 2, according to interlinear reading of the Codex Vaticanus of about 350 C.E. that predates the King James Bible by some 1,260 years, it says: "In a beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the God, and a god was the Word. This was in a beginning with the God".(Emphatic Diaglott, pub. in 1864)
And 1 Timothy 3:16 does NOT say "God was manifest in the flesh" as the King James Bible reads, but accurately that "he (Jesus Christ) was manifest in the flesh". And 1 John 5:7, 8, the words "in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth," are spurious, being added by an unscrupulous hand to give support to the "Holy Trinity".
At 1 Corinthians 11:3, it says: "But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn, the head of a woman is the man; in turn, the head of the Christ is God."
And Jesus is a deity, being "a god", an angel (Gal 4:14), in which the apostle Paul further makes note of that, at 1 Corinthians 10:1-4, saying that the "rock" (or angel, see Ex 14:19) that released the nation of Israel from Egyptian slavery in 1513 B.C.E. was Jesus Christ.(see also Num 20:16)
There is more that could be provided, but this should suffice for sincere Bible readers who are reasonable.
Denial. Repent
@@Cheemz1 You say two words, and I provided DETAILED information. So whose words has more weight ?
✝️ THE TRINITY DOCTRINE ERROR. ✝️ The Trinity Doctrine (as defined in the Nicean and Athanasius creeds 4th Century) states that God is 3 separate persons. 3 persons = 3 separate beings = 3 God's = Tritheism, and this is NOT biblical. The bible is strictly Monotheistic (Deuteronomy 6:4) and states that God is One Spiritual person and not three persons. The Biblical Trinity is ONE TRANSCENDENT DIVINE SPIRITUAL PERSON (GOD) manifest in 3 different "states of being" as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit but all are still ONE SPIRITUAL person and not 3 as stated in the Athanasius Trinity Doctrine. ✝️ DEFINITIONS: BEING = defined as anything that exists or lives. PERSON = defined as any being that has its own center of consciousness and will, its own intelligence and personality (eg, human person "being" or spiritual person "being"). Therefore, a person is by default ALSO a being. So 3 PERSONS = 3 BEINGS = 3 GODS = Tritheism. This is not an accurate description of the "Biblical Trinity" which is strictly Monotheistic.
Original texts state that Elohim and Marriage are described with Echad.
Echad is the Hebrew word for one, but more precisely it means a single entity but made up of more than one part.
In marriage the two become one which displays consistency. God said let "Us" make man in our image indicating relationship within.
This is my understandin from the scriptures. Always open to more insight however attempting to define God with our finite minds has and still is a contentious topic.
Israel is Jacob. But you would not call the nation of Israel literally Jacob. That is what Yeshua meant when He said "If you have seen my face, you have seen the Father's". He is not claiming the Throne but proclaiming it. If a king sends his messenger, it is as good as speaking to the king. If that messenger is his heir, it is even better than speaking to the king, as you're speaking to the future. That is what Yeshua is, the SON & HEIR of God who sit at Gods RIGHT HAND. When the angels & prophets spoke, they too often spoke as if they themselves were God speaking. But no one in their right mind took it as the individual speaking on their own behalf. When Yeshua says "Why do you call Me good? No one is good but God alone." It's not to be taken literally. But when He says "Me & my Father are one." It is to be taken literally. God is not a man that He should change His mind (Numbers 23: 19). So why would He ask Himself to take away the burden He layed on Himself (Matthew 26: 39)? Either God changed His mind & is therefore a liar, or Yeshua & God are not the same person/individual/entity.
Zecariah 12 says otherwise; the vision includes an insight into the weaping of the tribes at verse 10; Yahweh spoke there.
Then, Jesus at Matthew 16 affirm He was the Son of Man, another title of the Messiah; then at Matthew 24 Jesus said that the Son of Man would come in glory and all nations would cry, the same way Zecariah 12 describes; Jesus was speaking when Zecariah delivered the vision.
Another thing, Micah 5:2 or 5:1 depending on the Hebrew version explains the Messiah was from eternity; it used "olam", how can that be possible?
Yeshua is God
@relativemx1369 The Word of God is eternal. Yeshua is the Word Made Flesh. Thus He is eternal. I can read the words you put here, but I can't claim these words are literally you. Instead, like Yeshua is with God, your words are a representation of you. The Body of Christ is his followers. But which one of His followers can claim they are Christ? Why, still, would someone who denied his own deity do so if He was God? Wouldn't that make God a liar? Also, the new age understanding of the word Messiah & Christ has been conflated with God. You can look both up, neither means God at all. Not to mention, you can't take prophecy literally. Where are the winged cats of Daniel 7: 4-6? We know what they mean. We're told in Daniel 7: 16-17.
@relativemx1369 Yeshua is the Massiah. The King of Kings. The Word Made Flesh. The Law. And the Sacrifical Lamb that sits at the Right Hand of God. Only through His Holy Blood can you hope to reach God in Heaven. He is the Son of Man. But "God is not a man, that He should lie, nor a son of man, that He should change His mind." Numbers 23:19.
@@belialyofeehevel2508 the man numbers is spaeking is different
This just proves what Adrian Rogers said is true, "Try to explain the trinity and you will lose your mind." Jesus NEVER claimed to be God. The Father alone is Gos and Jesus so refers to Him in John 17:3. A triniterian will claim that is only because Jesus was a man at that time. If that is true why does Jesus, in John 20:17, refer to him as "my god"? That was AFTER his resurrection.
Why do you quote John 17:3 but leave out verse 5? Verse 5 shows that Jesus shared the glory with the Father before the world was. Isaiah 48:11 says God shares his glory with none other...
Nowhere does John 20:17 prove that Jesus isn't God. Jesus recognizes the Father as God here but you can't prove that this shows Jesus isn't God
It's not too late for you to abandon God, the church and everything associated with it.
For years you have been dictated to and told that you are unworthy. How dare any teachings demean you and tell you that you're not worthy or good enough to be in the presence of a God who obviously doesn't care about your fate. You have wasted a good deal of your life on this useless entity and it hasn't done you one skerrick of good.
It's time for you to shake off all the hangups associated with Christianity and become a real person, begin to appreciate and enjoy what the world offers you, fun, adventure and hedonism. No more feelings of guilt, paranoia, fear and unworthiness.
Banish Jesus, God and all the luggage they have loaded you up with since childhood, explore your potential which has been suppressed for so long, open up your mind without any religious restrictions.
Tell Jesus to mount his camel and take a hike. You'll be amazed at how good it makes you feel. Religion is for people who are afraid of life and don't have any faith in themselves.
Christianity isn't a religion it's a relationship with Jesus our lord and Saviour. What I will say to you is. JESUS IS REAL GOD IS GOOD, it's never too late to turn to Christ.
Faith in yourself is overrated. You can feel it as soon as you put it in Jesus Christ. It fades in comparison. If you think, the world is a playground to be enjoyed and fun is what everything is all about - you are, where I used to be. I am self employed, make a lot of money, have a beautiful girlfriend and a stable family. Still there was a void. I can tell you: as soon as you throw „believing in yourself“ overboard, you can start seeing the truth. And that my friend feels even better. Just think of it: someone can steal your sportscar, your girlfriend can leave you, your Rolex can break, your adventure vacation ends. Nothing here is permanent. And that’s your hint: Only your relationship with god is forever. That’s why it is the only source of joy no one can ever take away from you.
@@ShamrockRagEll HORROR GAMES Lili
Jesus brings the sickness, death, despair, it’s his means of full control
For when mankind’s in turmoil it’s when the faith is strong
People crying for relief, any new world would be better
He strikes the Faithful, Infidel, the righteous and the wrong
Those that are left will be the pure, survivors God’s vendetta
God’s zealots preach the dogma and draw the gullible throng. -
That’s where religious power is, there’s no joy on this Earth
The faithful bow and scrape their lives away, they follow all the rules
The rules are never ending as man imposes thoughts within his mind
Every thought’s maybe a sin, is Heaven for the simple and the fools?
For only the simple could believe, the simple and the blind
The gates are closed for everyone, the promise over-ruled. -
For it’s all a game from a twisted mind, humanity made to be destroyed
He made life on Earth to be a Hell and in the end we burn
So it’s best if we discard this cruel monster from our lives
And take the best that we can find, to live and love and learn
For Jesus offers nothing, his promise false and trite
Nature offers joy and pleasure without the hate and spite. -
There’s no Heaven, Hell waiting us, it’s just his nasty game
Satan’s never promised us a future bright filled with ever bliss
At least he’s honest with us all, says take the cup and drink
And make this Earth your Paradise, the sex, the love, the kiss
Leave Jesus to his horror games, he’d take you to the brink
Of insanity with all his rules, rules to discard, dismiss.
Blessed be.
Sounds like you had a bad experiences growing up or in the church. Sorry to hear that. However, the reality is that we are really nothing. Just a tiny inconspicuous speck in the entirety of the universe. To think otherwise, is in fact delusional. If God didn't care, why would He come down in the form of a man to experience the fragility of human life, be subjected to all manner of evils and die for you and me in order that you could be restored to have a personal relationship with Him that is no longer bound by religious separations and traditions.
See if you don't believe there's anything after death then you're perspective is focused on this worldly life and you start getting offended by God, church, politicians, parents, the weather, relationships, etc. However, God places more value on what happens after and this life is just like a bootcamp for your personal and spiritual development. I'm not afraid of life nor death.
Total freedom without knowledge, wisdom and accountability leads to chaos, evil and destruction. You want to be your own god, yet your feeble mind is so limited. Even the smartest people over history don't understand 10% of the universe. Freedom without boundaries and God leads to never ending search to fill the void with pleasure, pain, riches, power and glory. Even King Solomon felt empty at the end of his journey of no restraint. True satisfaction comes from loving God and loving people.
A life framework with boundaries, discipline and suffering actually is more beneficial. Boundaries provide protection and also generate creativity. Discipline develops character and healthy mind. Suffering build resilience and strength. eg. Muscles don't grow without applying tension and resistance.
All I hear from you is blame, anger and running away from your own issues. One day, there will be a time when all is lost and the only option will be is Jesus (most likely on Camel) waiting for you. Test him and he will be there for you.
@@mellenix Do you browbeat this nonsense into your kid's heads and turn them into fearful, paranoid, guilt ridden followers of your fairy tales?
The absolute worst type of abuse that can be inflicted upon children is that of psychological abuse, far more damaging than even physical abuse.
Christians seem to believe they have a right to terrorize the young pliable minds of children with stories of people being burned alive and continually tortured for eternity if they don`t fall into line and worship a mysterious entity that nobody has ever seen.
Would you subject your children to hours of the most realistic horror movies such as the Evil Dead series or the Texas Chainsaw Massacre and then expect your kids minds to not be affected? well the equivalent of that scenario is to give them hours and hours of horror stories about what will happen to them if they don`t love an invisible man who lives in the sky and dedicate their whole lives to the promotion of that belief.
The sanity of whole generations is being put at risk by the vivid imaginations of religious fanatics all over the world, Don`t believe me? take the case of a young 11 year old child in Iran who suffered from Down's Syndrome, she was found absentmindedly tearing pages out of the Qur`an, the howling mob were intent on lynching her on the spot and she was only saved by a Police Officer who barricaded her inside a police station to protect her, later she would be convicted and sentenced to death for Blasphemy (since commuted)
This is a prime example of what happens when generations of children are brainwashed from birth and grow up to follow any religious doctrine, The whole world is suffering from severe mental breakdown and religion plays a large part as a cause of this malady.