Best and Worst Version of Every Smash Character From Smash 64
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 เม.ย. 2023
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In today's video I talk about what I think is the best and worst version of every Smash character competitively from the original Smash 64 roster. So I will look at every version of the character starting from Smash 64 to Smash Ultimate
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good question
you could put 50 raid ads back to back and I wouldn't be able to tell the difference between any of them
@@leeum20realfact
FUN LARRY FACT: Larry Lurr has defeated the #1 ranked player in tournament play in every single smash game except for smash 64!
So we would say Larry's worst iteration is 64, and smash 4 would be his best.
#1 ranked player at the time?
When did he beat the #1 Melee player and who was it that he beat?
@@sheridan5175 Yup
@@MeesterTweester who was it?
Watching the Brawl footage is so weird. It reminds me of trying to fight in dreams but your body is too weak to move.
And you're fighting mk being ganon
r/new sentence
The dream part hit me a little too hard.
I feel that way when I dream too.
I imagine this is what watching all other smash games will be like once I get better at melee
Kirby was good in 1 game and has been suffering ever since
Deserved. Hate him.
Sakurai is a strict father
Kirby is a decent mid-tier in Brawl. Make that two games.
@@h8thegr8 if you're not top 10 in brawl, you were trash (or at least not solo viable). That's just how brutal that game was
@@shadownite3378 Kirby vs. Falco (assuming he got his powerup) is seen by a large majority of the modern Brawl community as an even matchup. And his Of course he gets walled out by MK/ICs/Olimar, but his general matchup spread against the other characters above are a minus 1, or even, which is not as bad as you may think.
Crazy how Brawl is the worst iteration of like half the characters in the Smash series.
yeah but i miss some brawl characters. DDD and Marth my beloved
Best for Meta Knight (obviously), Ice Climbers, King Dedede, Diddy Kong, and Snake tho.
@@emanueltheodorus1056 Pre-patch Smash 4 Diddy > Brawl Diddy. Otherwise you're right about the rest.
Most likely, because in brawl, you were either viable or completely useless, and there's very little in-between
And many of them are bad because either they are vulnerable to chaingrabs, are combo characters in a game where everyone is on PMLG state, they have a bad MU against Meta Knight or they are just horrible (Ivy, Ganon)
64 Kiby's up-tilt was the original Brawl Snake up-tilt.
Or the other way around
@@aesthetic-moon-wave no its the right way
Extremely long hitstun will go a long way to make everyone viable in 64, it’s no wonder it was a 5 stock game
Link and luigi are trash
And they’ll still kill you on hit
@@ABC-ik9vj Link and Luigi may be the worst, but they still have things they can do. Luigi’s combo game is fantastic in a game where having a good combo game is highly rewarded. Link honestly wouldn’t even be bad if it wasn’t for his dogshit recovery (same with Ness). Considering he’s the only zoner in the game, he can actually get away with camping you out with bombs. Everybody in 64 can put in work, even if some characters are better than others. It’s not like Melee where half the cast is unusable garbage, with most being outright unfinished (Mewtwo, Game and Watch, Ness), and you have to be a literal God to do well with any character below 7th or so.
@@Mr__Jack don't forget Roy, he wasnt finished in melee either, which is sad
@@Mr__Jack lmao you're telling me bombs that take 3 seconds to take and slow af movement are a good proyectile?
I appreciate the 64 knowledge, as a 64 pro, alot of people who are unfamiliar with the game automatically think the lower tiers are unusable (like other smash games) you perfectly explained that even tho they are lower on the list, they are still a power house.
Not many people know or understand that, thanks for such a great video
Aside from perhaps Link and Luigi the other characters do stand some of a chance against the high tiers from experience
@@thejedisonic67Isai convinced me 64 Luigi isnt as bad as i thought.
the fact there is a worse link than 64 link is rough
He does put Smash 64 on a pedestal, however. I can imagine him diving into it and wondering why he's losing stocks so fast.
Im suspect of brawl link being worse than 64 but idrk. Also 64 dk sucks too, but he has regrabs and brawl dk gets regrabbed so i get that one.
The thing with Fox, is that at the end of Brawl's life, he was climbing the tiers. If Brawl kept going, maybe he could have still ended up in high tier. Just speculation of course, but hey, it's all we can do with Brawl now.
People very much still play brawl. Its small but its definitely active
@@illford6921 No.
@@plumebrise4801 Wdym
I'd say brawl is still clearly his worst. He's regarded as a top tier in every other smash game.
this is a great idea, I had this conversation lots of times^^
I agree with pretty much all of these, brawl wasn't a nice game for combo heavy characters
I’ve always wanted someone to make a video like this glad someone finally did it!!
For grapplers and zoners it was pretty good. DDD, Snake, ICs, ZSS, Marth (Kinda) were all good
You mean brawl wasn' a competitive game. Imagine trying to make a sequel game that was intended to be casual for competitive
Idk Larry brawl jigglypuff was the worst thing ever created on a screen. In smash 4 at least she can spam rest out of bayo combos
Smash 4 Puff might've been buffed from Brawl, but she was lower on the tier list then Brawl Puff. So it's a 50/50 tbh. They're both garbage.
SSB4 Puff is definitely the worst Puff. Brawl Puff at least still possesses great aerial frame data, down air trip -> Rest which has a generous 50% chance of occurring, and is in a game where most characters can be trivially edgeguarded by its wall of pain.
SSB4 Puff while it definitely gained more power, is hurt immensely by numerous frame data nerfs (particularly to landing lag), losing out on down air trip -> Rest with its new KO combos being more situational, and being in a game where recoveries are extremely strong and more difficult to edgeguard across the board. SSB4 Puff does have some stuff over Brawl Puff, but in the end, it is choosing which pile of turd is the stinkiest.
Yeah while she was last on the tier list in Smash 4, she's better than her Brawl version, and actually had results
The removal of edgehogging REALLY hurt her because it made gimping nearly impossible. Literally the only thing she was good at and it only worked against a few characters with really bad recoveries. That's what makes her worse in Smash 4.
@@MeesterTweester i mean she did lose all of her excellent ledge play
Fun Jigglypuff fact, in Brawl, if she runs out of jumps, she will spam Pound until she hits the blast zone. Pound’s vertical gain was reduced going into Brawl, so you have to listen to her all the way down.
I'd argue Ness' best iteration is his NTSC-J regional variant in Smash 64. He has ridiculously disproportionate KO power with all of his smash attacks dealing 19% minimum, Up Air dealing 17% with huge knockback and PK Thunder 2's hitbox staying out for all 28 frames of the move's animation and making him invincible (not intangible, this makes him tank incoming attacks) for 17 frames. Not to mention the insane presence of his DJC.
Keep this series going, maybe combine both Melee and Brawl if you have too
This video was sick! Hopefully you make videos on the Melee and Brawl newcomers best iterations!
The crazy part about this: You aren’t wrong. Brawl sucked for a lot of these characters.
Cool idea! Looking forward to melee newcomers
Kirby's best and worst version is so clear-cut lol. Need Smash 6 to revamp Kirby and make him top tier again!
What’s smash 6??
Clearly you haven't watched Copperhead.
@@GlitchanBlack No. I haven’t. What is it?
Very interesting watch! Would love to see you do this for Melee and Brawl characters
Sick video Larry. Looking forward to the next one
Thank god they made BOTW Link good. From the only Zelda game where you can jump freely, it makes sense that he has good mobility. His broken nair also makes sense, because you can upgrade armor in that game.
Man brawl was goofy as hell. I wonder how many character were at their worst in that game.
Mario, DK, Link, Samus, Yoshi, Fox, Luigi, Captain Falcon, Jigglypuff (arguably), Peach, Zelda (arguably), Ganondorf, Pokemon Trainer, Sonic (not bad tho), ROB, and Wolf comes to mind.
@@emanueltheodorus1056 Lucas and Pit too
I think you should include 2nd best or honorable mentions when they are good in 2 games
I think yoshi is better in ultimate since it took like 20 years to develop the meta for him in melee
Great Video, can't wait for the Melee Characters!
this was a really sick video, great work larry
This is an awesome idea for a series
Pikahu's "worst" iteration is already better than most, which is impressive to say
1:28 skip ad
64 Pikachu is among the 2 most dominant characters in the entire series
I’m still shocked that they somehow managed to make Jigglypuff worse than she was in Brawl
They fought to themselves: ok, we fixed the main issue of her moves being unsafe on hit and gave her more overall KO power, so lets give the character largely air-game focused egregious amounts of landing lag on its aerials. What could go wrong?
Also doesn't help that recoveries have been heavily buffed across the board in SSB4, so its main draw of being able to gimp opponents is nowhere near as applicable in SSB4 than in previous games. Losing down air 50% chance to trip -> Rest hurts it a lot as well.
and the funny part was that she was BUFFED.
We need more videos like this Larry!
Wehn di you hit so fast 100k followers?
But Congrats to it
Bro why did brawl do most of the og characters so dirty?
The slower engine and introduction of hitstun cancelling
Hope you're making one for all the characters.
I like how you used alpharads iconic luigi footage for the luigi segment
Awesome video. LARRY LEGEND!!!
Continue this series!
This video made me really realize kirby never catches a break in smash
Let's see... Kirby in Brawl was a mid-tier, and Kirby in Ultimate got buffed in *_7 UPDATES_* (1.1, 2.0, 3.0, 6.0, 7.0, 8.0, and the final update). Also, if you look at Copperhead's Melee content for Kirby... yeah, Kirby can catch a break in Smash.
Might as well guess the melee characters while waiting for that video:
13. Peach
Best: Melee
Worst: Brawl
14. Bowser
Best: Sm4sh
Worst: Melee
15. Ice Climbers
Best: Brawl
Worst: Ultimate
16. Sheik
Best: Melee
Worst: Brawl
17. Zelda
Best: Ultimate
Worst: Brawl
18. Dr. Mario
Best: Melee
Worst: Ultimate
19. Pichu
Best: Ultimate
Worst: Melee
20. Falco
Best: Melee
Worst: Sm4sh
21. Marth
Best: Melee
Worst: Ultimate
22. Young Link
Best: Ultimate
Worst: Melee
23. Ganondorf
Best: Melee
Worst: Brawl
24. Mewtwo
Best: Sm4sh
Worst: Melee
25. Roy
Best: Ultimate
Worst: Melee
26. Mr. Game and Watch
Best: Ultimate
Worst: Melee
I think Peach is better in Ultimate than in melee but i agree with you in everything else
@@spookyboo4074 yeah that was a tough one she's really good in both.
Bowser's best iteration is Ultimate no doubt. He may not have up throw into up air kill cheese like he used to but everything else about him is just straight up better. Fire breath was way better, side special is ridiculous, the frame three jumpsquat tremendously helped the mobility on what is used to be one of the sluggish character in game. Uncontested best superheavy in this game.
@@spookyboo4074it’s close but melee down smash makes it… not so close
It would have been cool to have PM/+ as honorable mentions of certain characters
most of the characters are the best in their PM state
@@666blaziken yeah, that's why it would have been cool to see what they improved to get them there, like the M2 float
PM isn't official tho
@@blocks4857 you are 100% correct, that's why I mentioned it as honorable mentions, not as part of the rank itself
Ganondorf is a perfect example of being the best he's ever been in PM, not bad but not top tier
Will you do this for the Melee & Brawl characters too?
good video idea larry
Everyone sucked in brawl lol
Well… almost everyone.
Banger vid as always
Ain't no way this dude saw 64 link and Samus and went "yeah these guys are playable"
Brawl link was something else bro. I do think that 64 DK is worse than his brawl generation
@@Migota_ nah, 64 DK actually has grab release cheese that requires a frame perfect roll and has actual combo routes on the top tiers. He does have shit neutral but his Bair is an actual menace, fair being hard to sour spot and dair being a consistent and very active spike makes him a solid and functional character
At least in 64, link could do stuff unlike in brawl where you had an ass recovery and couldn't do anything
Can't wait for Melee version! 😊
This is a very nice idea!
This is the video I've been looking for so long!
Please make a part 2 for me to sub!
Me and my friend one day had the same idea and talked amongst ourselves for all characters
super cool video idea. reminds me of falseswipegaming’s smash content
Brawl: I am about to end this men's whole career
secure the bag goat
You know that now you have to do all the rest, right?
Right???
👁👁
Meh you only need to do up until Smash 4 anyways
you should continue this series for characters with 3 or more smash appearances
If this series continues, I'm curious what characters would have Ultimate considered their worst iteration?
Off the top of my head:
Sheik (having her damage hit like that really sucks, combined with her strength in most of her other appearances)
Ice Climbers (No practical infinites, and the fact you can screw over their recovery by body blocking Nana should've been patched imo)
Meta Knight (Debatable between Ult and 4, but his ladder combos losing consistency is why I put him here)
Diddy Kong (arguably not if you include the infinite that got patched out, but even then it's not like he's particularly bad in any of his appearances)
Snake (definitely debatable, but the debate is basically Land Mine and bigger Up Tilt vs faster Nikita and universal jumpsquat)
[Placeholder Slot for a Brawl vet I'm probably forgetting]
Greninja (Insert meme)
Duck Hunt (Air dodging out of up-b is nice and all, but Clay Shooting got a bit screwy and hard to get rid of if you miss, which makes Can harder to use)
Robin (Again, hella debatable. Arc Thunder got gutted, but Arc Fire does the job now. Jumpsquat helps mobility and setups, but Levin Sword isn't available at the start so it's a lot harder to keep people out initially. I personally like him more in Ult, but it's a fair call if you disagree since Checkmate got reduced).
Little Mac (I personally think he's way better in Ultimate due to the engine changes, no side-b freefall, canceling neutral b, and KO Punch poking platforms. But I can see the arguments the other way, like only 1 side b per airtime even after hit and down tilt not being a free 30% delete button with ko online. Faster jumpsquat also makes it easier to escape him)
Ryu (RIPyu, Rage Shoryu doesn't delete stocks under 50, and universal jumpsquat makes it a lot easier for the cast to bully him)
Cloud, Corrin, Bayonetta (Got their DLC passes revoked. Their moves are now mostly fair, while they had their existing weaknesses expanded due to the expanded roster having tools for them).
If you count Small Miis for some reason, then uh, sure? They're here too.
Definitely Ice Climbers, Marth, Meta Knight, Diddy Kong, Villager, Ryu, Cloud, Corrin, and Bayonetta.
Sheik is worse in Brawl, with her power significantly worse than Melee and also poor endurance. You generally never go Sheik when you have ZSS or Meta Knight.
Little Mac is definitely worse in Smash 4 by far, it's just that Ultimate's aerial favoring engine didn't help him shine at all. He has way better recovery options as a whole.
Greninja is overall better in Ultimate IMO.
@@emanueltheodorus1056 fair, for some reason I misremembered Sheik still being good in Brawl bc the idea of sheik being outright bad feels incorrect ig.
Mac I 100% agree is actually better in Ultimate, but I wanted to cover ppl with weird opinions.
And Greninja just doesn't feel like it got anything in the transition, while losing footstool true combos. Then again I don't play the character so maybe the engine itself is just that much better for it.
Also, not sure how Marth slipped through my list. Mans got gutted in Ultimate.
Villager feels almost identical to me when I'm fighting them, and since the characters I tend to play (Samus, Lucina, Ganondorf) are all explicitly better than they were in 4, I just chalked it up to Villager being stronger too.
Larry “Legend” Lurr
Back at it again with another BANGER!
Thanks!
actually samus is really good in brawl because it gives you the option to not play samus
Ain’t no way I’m watching this for the first time and hearing the outro music be the Team Galactic HQ theme and I’m playing Platinum while watching and bring in the Tram Galactic HQ. What a coincidence
they have done my boy kirby dirty for longer that it should be
do more of those
8:06 "He has good kill power..."
Now I'm wondering if people aren't playing a hacked version of this game, because people seem to regurgitate how broken he is, when in the version I've played, he literally has zero kill options.
I was surprised to see 64 Falcon as the best version. I always thought the melee one was the best.
Great video
Still can’t believe they took away DK’s pimp slap.
I wanna see more of these with other smash characters
1:46 NAX THE GOAT
Anybody else remember trifoce tier in brawl? I miss the game su much.
Great video.
Next time I'd put the ad a little later in the vid since it'll help retention :D
Great vid. I've thought about exact concept a bunch and agree with a majority of your takes. Pika by far the best overall and imo Link the worst.
I'm writing this before watching the video, but these are my guesses:
Bests
Mario: Smash 4
DK: Smash 4
Link: Ultimate
Samus: Ultimate
Yoshi: Smash 64
Kirby: Smash 64
Fox: Melee
Pikachu: Smash 64
Luigi: Ultimate
Ness: Ultimate
Captain Falcon: Melee
Jigglypuff: Melee
Worsts
Mario: Brawl
DK: Smash 64
Link: Smash 64
Samus: Brawl
Yoshi: Brawl
Kirby: Melee
Fox: Ultimate
Pikachu: Melee
Luigi: Smash 64
Ness: Melee
Captain Falcon: Brawl
Jigglypuff: Smash 4
Edit after watching the video: I got a lot of the predictions correct, with few differences. I'm interested is seeing videos like this for the Melee, Brawl, and Smash 4 characters. This was very interesting to watch.
Haven't watched prediction: *Brawl is going to be most of these characters worst game performance.*
Brawl sounds like a nightmare lol
When is the sequel coming out
Please do Melee next!
how are you today larry
I want justice for the good boi Kirby
I’d say DK is worse in 64 than in Brawl. Haven’t played a lot of Brawl but I’m fairly experienced with 64. 64 is a combo fest for every character, but you can get free 0 to deaths on DK, he’s slow as hell, and doesn’t even have a good combo game himself.
Edit: commented that before watching the whole video, and I have to say fair point. Although I would say DK and Luigi might be exceptions, that’s only because I haven’t really played Brawl much in a competitive sense. Great video overall!
small question is this considering the actual character or the character´s place in the meta of X game?
3:50 funfact: the probably best brawl dk player, ook beat mikehaze who was one of the best players while mikehaze was using dedede. Mikehaze mained marth, didn't know how to do the infinite, and was on green greens but that doesn't matter
cool list
Best Luigi in my opinion was Ultimate because 0-death grab combo
Smash 4 pre patch Luigi was waaaaay better
Sakurai dropping his son to bottom tier in smash shows there is no mercy to your faves being nerfed
As a Luigi main, I’d say the worst alliteration of him was 64, where he was the worst character in that game.
Melee Ness makes me sad
Brawl Link is trash. But I still think 64 Link is worse.
That's obvious, worse recover than mac is terrible
Link on 64 you can do tricks with bombs and boomerang and have insane strings and weird recoveries.
Brawl on the other hand due to the cast been bigger and boomerang not having a hit box and "one sided MUs" , it cant win. On 64 Link can have a glimpse of hope because eventhough hit stunts are insane , each character can zero to death each other but Link can run away with the lead due to projectiles
th-cam.com/video/-i8lE1sqJ1g/w-d-xo.html
Here Isai winning a tournament with Link in 64 , super hype to watch
While in Brawl .... well you have Toon Link lmao
@@henryreturns1397 link on 64 can't recover, on brawl he can. The worst is pretty obvious
@@ABC-ik9vj He may not be able to survive a back throw at ledge but he controls space better than most 64 characters and can use his spacing tools to set up true 0 to death combos, or just nickel and dime you until you die to a strong disjointed sword move. There are other characters who similarly can't recover but Link has better onstage presence than them.
It's like brawl did to everyone what Tekken 5 did to jin
i would like to make the argument that ness while in theory better in ult had better tournament results in smash4
Hear Me Out, Someone Should Remake Smash 64 But Everyone Is In Their Best Iteration Like In This Vid Cause I Need To See Hyphotetical Meta Out Of It
Lol brawl was such a great game. I miss it.
I'm sensing a theme with this video
Score for Each Game
64: 4
Melee: -1
Brawl: -8
Wii U: 3
Ultimate: 3
Placements
5th: Brawl
4th: Melee
3rd: Ultimate (cuz Wii U got it's points 1st)
2nd: Wii U
1st: 64
The best version of Kirby is obviously Melee. I have a many times caused my opponents to shed salty tears after beating them with this absolutely busted character.
I find it interesting that the two games Yoshi are not competitive in are the ones where the whole community just gave up altogether, Brawl and Smash 4
I would argue that sm4sh pika is worse than melee pikachu because of pikachu struggling to kill in 4 as well as less movement options. In melee, pika has chaingrabs against spacies, a frame 3 nair that can kill early and combi depending on DI, and an upair that spikes.
Can we get more of these?
Best DK: Smash 4
Project M DK: Hold my Banana