Venture Is BUFFED | Overwatch 2 Hero Gauntlet Discontinued And MORE!!!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ย. 2024
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#Flats #overwatch #overwatch2
If Gauntlet wasn't limited to 3 players, had at least 2 or 3 map variations and they were themed it wouldn't have been that boring.
Yup, felt very low effort. Just 0 variety to find except for your hero.
It also wouldve been better if you could play it while queueing
They should’ve honestly made some location maps for it. Can’t believe they just threw it away.
maybe if was the pve we were promised could be good
The exact reason I did play it was because it was an eyesore to look at
Flats every single season
First week or two: This season they cooked, its the best it has been in a while.
Third week and after: This season kinda sucks tbh.
its starting to be a meme for real. I'm really believing that the devs listening to these guys is harming the game. These streamers play the game a lot, but are really ignorant to how to make things better.
@@puck2694 100% these streamers don't know what they're talking about
The changes could feel good at the start because it something new, but that doesnt mean its a good change in the long run.
"So chat, you ready to play Apex today?" - Flats
I think it’s more about the streamers get burnt out. But I could be wrong
honestly i just want them to put the PVE missions in the custom games setting so people can customize them, like they do it with Junkensteins revenge, why not do it with the PVE that you payed for? just make it so you cant get any rewards from doing it in customs and there could be so much creativity just by letting people make custom games with it
yeah i think it's always a good idea to let people get wild with workshops. i feel like it's not too difficult to implement and generates so much replay value
@@3amAfterlife I agree, like there's no way it would take a bunch of resources to put it in customs
I think that would be great. On top of that they should still add atleast 1 challenge a week in your weekly challenges to play a specific mission on a specific difficulty (defeat Gothenburg on normal) that was the people who want to hunt down their weeklies get funneled into a specific mode and they get rewards
Because it's blizzard... That's why
i wish they let us spawn PvE enemies instead of doing everything from scratch w/ dummy bots... 😓
Flats being mad critical for somebody who's about to go "we are so back" the second the Season 11 dev letter drops
Oh yeah for sure. “Tank got buffed WE ARE SO BACK” “Roadhog might be a little too strong now” “Mauga is getting nerfed WE ARE SO BACK”
LMAO SO TRUE 😂
Yall know the we are so back at the beginning of every season is a meme right. He doesn’t seriously believe “we are so back” before they dropped the tank changes he even said he didn’t believe they would make tank fun to play or be good changes and he still feels that way now.
5:50 people are coming back from college, schools are starting their summer break, and overwatch is in a much better state for beginners.
Unlocking every hero was a good move by blizzard and it definitely helped with bringing in more casual players.
lol the game is awful for new players, finally the game is not pay to win but a new player still needs to play a lot to get everyone, and there is no good way to learn to use the characters, hero mastery is useless, you already need to know how to use the characters to play and training room provides no feedback on what a character does
Imagine praising blizzard for doing the bare minimum, no wonder this game is crap
@@rav_productions2136he's not wrong,we are in a much better state compared to when ow2 launched
@@talhiavargas8939 no were not why do you think people want to go back to 6v6?
@@hawkeyemihawkgettingmoneylord5v5 is great for casuals, and obviously casuals won’t have as much as a voice as the pros
removing the hero master gauntlet but not low gravity? ok devs
Excuse me, low gravity is peak overwatch, never open your mouth without considering this slander your spreading
@@Lyfred17 this comment made my day it was so peak
@@Lyfred17
Shhhhh if they discover low gravity is peak they're going to nerf genji again
now that you mention it who tf is playing low gravity enough for it to stay in arcade
On God time to axe it! Spread the word!
11:35 Refusing to take a step back to re-evaluate anything in life is always a bad idea. A lto of good things can come from going back a few steps or fuck even to square one in some cases.
Lmao yeah dude I can't explain how much hope it gives me that Flats actually said that
oh no a gamemode nobody ever played and nobody cared for is gone. how unfortunate.
why add it in the first place?
Well no one plays it.
then why did the devs add it in the first place.
@@Bubbagaming90000 do you know how game development works? you see what works and what doesn't. clearly this did not work.
I think I both played and enjoyed CTF Blitz comp more
@@Bubbagaming90000 they thought a small amount of players would enjoy it and it was simple to make. but clearly they had even less interest then they expected.
As soon as i saw it I thought why is this a thing
Idk is 5v5 actually better for casual gamers? Is hopping on and playing winston, then having 4 people on the enemy team counter swap you a better experience for casual players?
I'd guess that shooter casuals just don't play tank. Why bother learning the heady role when you can just play shooty shoot?
I’m mean, 4 people countering you is better than 5 people lol
@@bsgsmusic3451 this literally didn't happen in ow1. the only reason it even happens now is because they decided to over-inflate every role to adjust for the game not being 6v6 which ended up causing the competitive part of the game to become insufferable.
Better queue times, no matter how good a game is if no one is playing or the queue times are long there won't be a casual audience for said game.
Besides i think it's much that in the switch to 6v6 we got rid of alot of oneshots and alot of CC, that alone was worth it for me. I cannot believe how frustrating sombra and mei were
@@bsgsmusic3451that’s not true when the counters are harder.
Having giga buffed orisa or hog counter you is worse than an old tank countering you.
Also, if the enemy team is all countering your one tank, your other tank isn’t getting hard countered and can help compensate.
I think that Flats is cooking with the 6v6/5v5 discussion
I think that both sides do have lots of merits (namely queue times for 5v5 and tank population), but the fundamental refusal to have a discussion or even a "try-it-out" PTR-esque mode with 6v6 and nerfed tanks is incredibly frustrating.
I think that the core of why Overwatch "feels so bad" IS the tank role and how they affect the gameplay loop. They're so intrinsic to the game that a discussion of the game's health necessitates a discussion of the health of tanking.
That why OW1 and OW2 should be two separate games. So we can pick. The reason the didn’t do it is because nobody in their right mind would ever play OW2.
Thats exactly it, you cannot make the game feel good in 5v5 im sorry. Either the tank has to be unkillable which makes dps and support pissed (and even tank players when it means playing orisa/mauga/hog every single game), or they're just their as an ult battery for enemy teams.
Even if tank is the best role in the game its still dogshit to play. All that responsibility and pressure is on your shoulders alone, you have to simultaneously protect your supports while initiating teamfights while saving ults so your dps can hopefully capitalize, and even if you play PERFECTLY, the enemy team just went brig/sombra/Ana into your ball and now he's worthless. And even if tank sucks its still the most impactful role, so as long as you counterswap to counter their one guy, you more than likely win. Tanks are damned if they do damned if they don't in the 5v5 format, they just don't work.
6v6 had broken combos, but they were purely balancing issues. Double barrier? Nerf sigma's whole kit and orisa's fortify (the thing that actually made orisa a problem), that comp goes away. GOATS? Role queue killed it, open queue is just for fun anyways so who cares. Dive? Brig/moira were introduced to counter dive, you can rework kits/make new heros to address certain metas. I genuinely cannot ever imagine 5v5 changes that somehow make every role feel fun to play, ESPECIALLY tank. And the new heroes are the worst we've seen since brig launched. Lifeweaver was worthless, and sojourn/kiriko have been meta basically since the game launched. It's an embarrassment that these 3 heroes were released in their initial states and have more or less consistently been at the top or bottom.
I didn't even think of that queue time observation, very good argument, but I need a little more convincing, I would be fine with it either way as long as its done well.
@@darcidious99pretty much, except that nerfing the tanks alone wouldn’t stop double shield. Blizzard never, ever… ever touched the aoe healing/immortality abilities, especially inspire and double shield remained because of it. Because the big bad tanks could stay alive even if their shields broke.
But yes, no one asked for 5v5 for a reason, double tanks made taking all that pressure a lot easier via spreading the responsibilities. Also making counter picking not as bad, op combos? They need the required skill to make that combo work, which is pretty much at high elo. But seriously? These devs don’t like being wrong so they keep their heads in the dirt about this discussion
I think more people would want to play tank if it was 6v6. It would make playing tank easier for those scared to take on the responsibility. Plus it would make all of the tanks more fun to play
Flats realizing the 6v6 discussions needs to happen😮
Copium must be running low
"A lot of long time older players are kind of beyond fed up at the moment." Gee I wonder why
Where is he pulling this bs info out of? He doesn't know. Long time players who stick around and always complain will continue to complain no matter what
@@bui3415 It isn't BS when the criticism is valid my friend. They complain because the game could be SO MUCH MORE! The complaints come from a genuine place. Whereas the people who don't complain are mostly the people who play other games more than OW so don't have that emotional investment. (Either that or if you are a content creator, you kind of want to be on Blizzards good side) He is pulling this "BS" from his eyes, he can see the people who love this game are slowly growing away. And he probably feels the same, if on the midseason patch he was saying tank is so back but now is saying it kind of didn't fix the problems in the first place. Go back to Fortnite, if you don't care for the longevity of OW then go away.
@@bui3415 it's just obvious?? So many older players have made videos about why they hate ow2, and some like Seagull are just playing other games like LEAGUE lmfao
This 5v5/6v6 situation reminds me of mythic items in league. 2 seasons ago they reworked the item system with mythics and struggled to balance it for rhe entire time. This season they pulled the plug and went back to the original item system reworking mythics to fit in the new power level and it was a massive success from the community pov.
Yeah I see where you're coming from. Mythic Items/Mythic passives created a lot of hard to address flaws on top of people not really liking this 'out of the blue' direction to begin with.
5v5 similarly, felt like an out of nowhere change to the game's format.
Albeit, I think people felt more negatively about Mythic items then how people feel about 5v5.
Well it flopped because half way through the season they half assed it. This isn't a fair point. Pykes skins was great, pantheons was *ok* at best, and all the rest was and IS DISGRACEFUL to call mythics that shouldn't even be 975RP. Sylas? Mid. As. fuck. I am a sylas main and I'd rather use battle wolf or project over that "mythic" skin. I hated that skin so much I created a support ticket to get my rp REFUNDED.
@@KingBLUCK What the fuck??? We're talking about Mythic ITEMS, not Mythic SKINS
@@coldshock5181 That's hilarious that they actually said that it would lessen counter-picking and improve individuality
@@20yrspen he had me very confused for a second there lol
Bronze Support players not gonna like the Venture buffs
nerfing a mid character becuz bronze players cant turn around was dumb af anyway.
@@itsOZone Faxs 😂
Nobody wants to play garbage trash boring ugly venture 😂
@@amaanasif7819found one
@@amaanasif7819youre adopted
I think it's crazy how Venture got more QoL buffs in one season than Doom got bug fixed the past five
Hotfix is coming for over 32 doom bug fixes according to one of the lead esigners at Blizzard (@alec).
It's cause current OW devs are very knee-jerk when it comes to hot topics. Venture is the newest hero. A lot of people were probably playing them and forcing the winrate to be super good. Then they knee jerk gutted the character. And knowone played them anymore. Likely causing the pickrate and win rate to plummet. Plus doom has always been a niche high damage brawler. And Venture is just a hero that does everything kind of okay. Except for poke. So If the hero is weak, then they become dogshit. Imo it's not real balancing. It's just tweaking numbers to make it seem like they're doing shit over there.
I feel like more testing goes into bug fixes than numbers changes.
Atleast doom has skins
It's also crazy that despite doom being so bugged, he's still doing better than ball.
I genuinely love tank as a role but with one has happened over time I legitimately have just come to dread it to the point that I barely play the role anymore despite it being my favorite
Same here when I first started overwatch I mainly did tank in overwatch 2 I can’t really play it much cuz the moment I pick a tank the entire team just counter swaps I try to go to a new tank and they just instantly switch the moment they die and then I’m forced into basically either getting screwed or playing mystery hero tank
Same,the game isn't about teamwork anymore.its just a big death match because people can't stand working together and the devs indorse that type of gameplay 🥲
@@KURENANI exactly and when I got silenced for thirteen days cuz of a little argument about playing tank I got my endorsement down to level 0 I can’t get it back up and then I get even more people mad cuz I won’t talk and they think I’m not a helping in anyway and it sucks cuz trying to be a team player I can’t talk but i still try to listen and if they ask me to switch I switch but it honestly went from a ( yay fun team game to screw everyone cuz I know I’m better but no one seems to understand that) mentality
@@thecrazyskeleton160 i insult people very regularly for telling me to switch off doomfist but i still have endorsement level 5, what you said must have been outrageous
@@TheMortalKombatent I do that to but the one that finally got me was when I said at least I have fun with the game and my wife unlike a certain (gamer tag) that needs a toy and that took the cake
After watching the 6v6 custom games 6v6 is just better.. 5v5 will always be counter watch or mirror watch.
6v6 had problems too. Theres a reason overwatch 1 was dying and the queue times were long.
6v6 = double shield meta that helped kill the game.
Hey, now we have doom ramattra venture etc, i dont think double shield would be a problem@@B..P..
@@B..P.. queue times were not that long. I played dps in 3.5 during like peak overwatch drought and most queues were less than 7 min long. The only time I got those super long queues were very early morning on weekdays like 8am on a wednesday because im unemployed
@@21nyxx Queue times for DPS was10+ minutes in quickplay....even longer for ranked. Even longer for high ranked players.
The matchmaking was also horrible because there weren't too many good tank and support players
Overwatch 1 was dying. Blizzard panicked and released overwatch 2. If overwatch 1 was doing good, blzzard would've never released OW2.
Also Double shield meta was a nightmare and made many players quit.
@@B..P..yeah but the queue times are still terrible. Also double shield wont exist anymore.
All I want is Mann vs Machine in Overwatch.
A simple, wave-based tower defence where robots walk in a branched straight line, and you upgrade your hero with the credits you earn.
Tie unique rewards like weapon skins, sprays, and victory poses, and I'm sure people would actually play it.
I'm not even asking for a super polished game mode or custom map pool to accompany it. I'm sure I speak for all of us when I say we just want something new that Overwatch is willing to invest in, I don't mind playtesting a blocky simulation style map like in the mastery gauntlet.
If it goes well, you can even do paid tours like MvM to incentivise better weapon skins, etc.
Allocating resources to making the "2" mean something would be nice
I'd just drop that shit, the game is still a shell of it's former self.
who gives a crap about the "2"
when anybody asks me what game I play, I just say Overwatch. The number 2 died with PvE, everyone just needs to embrace that, including the devs.
The 2 is the shop
guys i think this xokzu fella has a point
@@bigfudge2031 but this game isnt even overwatch, this is shitwatch 0.5, i would love to keep playing overwatch at least
I believe it's a bit of both, and Bogurs talk with you made me think I'm kinda right, some of you ancient OW1 survivors feel a bit too tired and burned out, so even if the flow of the game is better, even if it is getting better
the shitty parts of the game, the more complex parts that are making the game worse to play, they feel worse for the old folk
But I, as a OW2 player that got to the game at the end of 2023, I feel so tired too play...I'm a tank enjoyer so, yeah....
other things like the lack of people in comms, people going AFK, the toxicity, the slurs....it's all so tiring
I mean I don't think bad actors in games will ever cease to exist, even if you switch to another game there will still be griefers and I've played a handful of games much worse than OW in that regard. I was burnt out for sure which is why I stopped playing for around 9 months (been playing since 2017). That being said after coming back it wasn't very long before I found the game to just not be enjoyable, maybe just cuz I'm a tank player but if 1/3 of your roles are horrendously unfun then you need to address it.
the game no longer requires teamwork for 98% of the people playing so yeah the amount of people that dont give a fuck while playing will only increase
@@wayfer7243 the problem is those bad actors are actually perpetuated by choices glizzard has made in ow2, and it's something noone is willing to speak on.
Welcome to why PvE was such a kick in the balls.
Im tired of competitive games that require an absurd amount of comms and teamwork, I just wanted some of my favorite characters to have their stories fleshed out and have some fun, whacky/broken kits, in a stress free gamemode. You can't even play quick play casually anymore which is honestly the most embarrassing a game can ever get. If your casual matches are supposed to be seen as competitive and important as the ACTUAL competitive mode, your game is dumb and I'm not gonna play it.
I played the game once post PvE cancellation, and the problems from the beginning were still there. Fights were steamrolls every time, tank had too much pressure on them, kiriko and orisa make me wanna commit war crimes in minecraft... It's just sad seeing how horrendously one of the largest new IP's ever was handled, going from breakout success to what I'd call an objective failure on management.
That’s every live game
'6v6 Flats' is slowly starting to break through...Embrace it Flats.
He's not saying anything that suggests he's in the 6v6 camp. He was saying that people might want to go back to 6v6 and then cry about something else, whether that is the format change or something else. He was also saying that the 6v6 cry is getting louder.
@@Ajaylix
Getting louder because it's getting more and more apparent that 5v5 doesn't work
@@MeepFromSpongebob It works for me and many other people. You're not the entire community. I also liked 6v6, but I really don't mind 5v5 even as a tank player.
@@BeastiezCyZ keep lying
not gunna happen, theyve fked the code up way too much at this point. the game can barely handle 5 v 5 without crashing servers, theres just no way they go back to 6v6. this is without mentioning other stuff like q times.
They should make all of the hero mastery playable during matchmaking so that more ppl play the mode
especially if you could race against your friends or your own ghost.
As someone who never touched Overwatch 1, but plays OW2 just about every day for multiple hours as a DPS main, I think that it's worth implementing 6v6 even as a Quickplay: Hacked event. I, personally, believe that Queue times been a reason for 5v5 does not really add up because players who do enjoy the game, a balance team that buffs/nerfs the right characters, and keep releasing new content will always attract players back into the game defeating the long queue times (obviously longer queues the higher you rank up). By no means a 5v5er or 6v6er person, I just want OW to be a really good game for as many people as possible.
Move the arcade games and the mastery stuff to the quick play menu and there will be an immediate rise in participation
The only thing i have had a problem with since OW2's release is the cancelation of PvE. My friends and i have a blast 3-4 times a weeks playing for few hours. Still my favorite game and has been since release. Really helps not taking it very seriously
This is the biggest lesson most OW players need to learn.
i think pvm would have been cool and all(esp for lore)... but lets be real, pve wasnt going to be anything that "saves" the game or really be a reason for new players to play.
As someone who takes it somewhat seriously, its still a lot of fun imo. Rn Im grinding bc some friends invited me to a faceit team, but im low plat while they're masters, so I have a lot to catchup on to be useful lol.
As a tracer player theres annoying things like hinder and whatever other bs. But those alone dont make the game unfun, they're rough edges and in a game like this they will always exist and thats fine
The only thing that worries me abt OW is the tank role, I used to be a tank main and while I do like the recent changes hog is way too strong and I fear that whatever comes next in the meta will be just as bad. Hopefully when I get decent at tracer and come back to tank they'll have figured smth out (like removing hog from the game)
damn im a casual player and the tank change just made tank feel 10x worse than last patch to play, just die way faster if you play a tank with armor cause the armor change was just a huge nerf to tanks against everything other than tracer
I'm casual but played for years and no you don't die faster, what are you doing
@@bui3415 same as i would before lol, dont really know how to explain it. expect now much weaker cause nearly every hero does more damage to me if im playing a hero i enjoy like rein cause the armor change made him so much weaker health wise
@@memearella The armor changes was to compensate for the headshot changes, it's effectively the exact same as before and I'd say mostly a like placebo/nocebo effect that makes you think you're dying faster. You will still blow up at times, but in general there's a greater window of opportunity to react to the incoming damage and put up your shield or get behind cover.
@@Drysand11 i mean easier to die now than last patch lol cause even wit the headshot dmg reduction you still take more damage if you have armor from nearly every hero based on the stats, so the change basically did nothing other than nerf the weakest role lol
@@Drysand11blizzard has to realize that they don’t need to add a nerf to every buff especially in scenarios like this
30 minute queues in gold console? No shot. Queues are instant in mid range console. My dude is in an extremely wide group.
wide group or playing at 3am on the west coast. or just flat out lying.
@@ubadman1 my friend and I consistently have 20+ minute que times during peak hours in our wide range (in gold)
I believe they said they were in a wide ground with low silver players
I was playing gold 1 queued with a friend that is Silver 3 and we waited 25 mins. This was console queue
They're always disingenuous to complain.
I've been seeing a good number of friends playing it on Steam now. They all played before, so it isn't like they are actually new players. We are probably just seeing a lot of people transition over to a better platform.
Ow numbers are really healthy rn
@@waverazor I'm not sure what that has to do with my comment. I'm just pointing out that a noteworthy number of the steam players is due to people transitioning to steam rather than it being brand new players. I never said the game is dead or anything similar. Perhaps you responded to the wrong comment?
@@Hyde472 you could've taken that as an: I agree, you're probably right. Overwatch numbers are really healthy.. 😑
Add Hero Mastery, make it 1 thing that you can finish in 3 days, add nothing, nobody plays half a year later... "WHY NOBODY PLAY??"
Hate to join the 6v6 bandwagon but my group of friends has 2 tank mains, myself being one of them. My other friend however only really has fun on tank and doesn’t like the other roles whereas I play more flex. Would just be personally nice to be able to play tank with friends again instead of solo queuing toxic QP lobbies. Also the game just felt more interesting with all the different tank combos
So Flats basically said that 6v6 is the answer without blatantly saying it.
Blizzard fucked up with the change to 5v5 that nobody wanted and now more and more people want 6v6 back. It's not nostalgia, you fucked up and people want it fixed.
I am sick of the people in the creator group just echoing what Blizzard is telling them. They are so scared to lose whatever benefit they get, when in reality they should just be honest.
So far Flats got the furthest to the 6v6 side than any other of the creator group. I hope you make our voices heard.
^its guys like this that make me believe the community is partially to blame for the death of this game
Unless Blizzard can find a way to fix queue times in 6v6 it's never going to come back again. It doesn't matter how much better 6v6 might be, people aren't going to care if they have to go back to waiting 15-20 mins for a game that can last half that time.
@@coldshock5181 I tried to get back into OW1 in its later lifespan, can confirm it was 15-20 minutes.
6v6 never had a queue time issue, it was caused by bad balance that was left there for 2 years. Nobody wanted to play tank because in high ranked they didn't wanna play double shield. In overall less people played support.
@@Swyfty_ Make roles fun and people will play them, you can't make tank fun in 5v5, but you can in 6v6. Oct2020 proved it when all queue times even in high rank were good, because the broken dlc characters got nerfed.
Oh no I still do not care about hero mastery bc there were no rewards worth going for
Giving the players something worth grinding for, for free? Without giving them our credit cards. That’s a funny joke.
@@claridge7549overwatch USED to be like that, would you believe you used to be able to get FREE skins just from logging in and queueing for the least queue role for once a day, also got free lootboxes from winning a certain amount of wins per day AND got in-game currency to buy them JUST FOR PLAYING THE GAME. And quite often just for logging in.
LMAO
"Our player numbers are dwindling, what do we do?"
"Remove content! Yes, of course!"
but they're not?
@@bui3415 the hero gauntlet is content. they are removing hero gauntlet. they are removing content.
@@DEVil-po5xz He means the numbers aren't dwindling
I think in a sense, 6v6 may be necessary for tank players not going insane from stress, but blizzard may need to rethink how overwatch as a competitive product functions to facilitate issues that caused them to deviate from 6v6 in the first place.
I am going to say, the hero gauntlet, as a concept is not a bad idea, it's just a shame that It had no substance and felt like a tech demo for what would be a PvE game mode, unfortunately the entire reason the 2 in overwatch 2 existed is just completely gone
"lets start with the bad news"
my brother in deity... whole overwatch 2 has been nothing but bad news...
I forgot about the knock back change. And couldn't figure out why my zarya jumps felt wrong
I think its impressive how they managed to keep tank feeling bad to play and also make it bad to play against at the same time.
I play overwatch casually I have 500hrs and only 3 are in ranked but the cracks really show when you play for long enough
Been playing since a year after release of over watch one and I still play casual unless my friends are on
@@thecrazyskeleton160 exactly I just can't be bothered to be trying to be the best I just want to have fun for a few hours a day
I do not know game design well enough to say 6v6 is better, but my personal experience with it is I enjoyed tank in 6v6 and do not in 5v5 which is a real shame because i think some of my best times in ow1 was playing tank.
Although I was against going back to 6v6 for a long time, I am starting to think it might be the right choice. Recently I have been playing Open Queue and it really hit me how much better the game felt to play (for tank and support especially)
But the sense of euphoria you’re feeling is in 5v5 open Queue, with the lack of 1 dps or even no dps I suppose.
@@MetroBreezyy That may be partially true because Blizzard massively overturned dps in season 9.
But the gameplay itself feels way more like classic Overwatch. 1 tank isn't eating all the abilities and damage from the enemy team. Supports can keep up on heals because there is less burst damage and smaller health pools.
Samitos been doing frequent 6v6 pugs with reduced tank stats and the game actually looks really fun
Honestly, what they might have to do at this point is just have a Season of 6v6 (For both Quickplay and Competitive) with possibly an Arcade 5v5 mode, but that honestly will probably take away from the Quickplay Player Pool too much for testing.
Maybe Season 13 or 14 after the next character is released (Season 12). They'll likely have to make changes to characters (The Tanks if nothing else), so the extra Season for design space might be needed.
I don't think they can commit any less time to see whether or not 6v6 would work, because there likely wouldn't be enough feedback and data if it's only a 1 to 2 week thing.
At the end of the day though, I only see 6v6 working long term if there are enough people wanting to play Tank. This change could bring back many players from Overwatch 1, but it's hard to know how that will be long term (This also gives them another chance to drop the Overwatch 2 name lol. Just calling it "Overwatch" is probably more salvageable at this point tbh).
@@BandannaBread I'll play tank every single day if it means getting 6v6 back
@@BandannaBreadYou’re treating humans like probability statistics. If the roles are fun, people will play them. Simple as that
I still think 6v6 might fix some things but it'll just cause different issues that people will complain about at the same intensity but with longer game queues on top of it. At this point the community will never be pleased.
6v6 is a better format thats why every new game like overwatch is 6v6
@@hawkeyemihawkgettingmoneylord Valorant, Apex Legends, League of Legends, Call of duty, Fortnite isn't 6v6. Any popular fps (AAA) game that is out of pre-beta isn't using a 6v6 format. 6v6 will double queue times for most roles, and people are already complaining about waiting 10-30 minutes in their elo's. Adding another role will not fix this unless you guys want silvers to play against masters.
Currently, pre-beta games like Marvel Rivals, and Multiverse is already talking about going to 5v5 per their latest developmental blog.
@@oof_robo241 Valorant, Apex, League, COD, and Fortnite also aren't objective based hero shooters in the same sense Overwatch is.
Aaron Keller admitted in the Flats interview that October 2020 when game balance was good that queue times across all roles and all ranks were good.
Queue times are bad right now because 5v5 solved nothing and quite frankly has only made it worse.
Marvel Rivals hasn't made any statement about going 5v5. I don't know what Multiverse is so I'm not going to talk about that one.
5vs5 bring more problems than 6vs6, they just need to nerd shields and the orisa rework clearly planned with 6vs6 in mind
@@oof_robo241 not a single one of those games are like overwatch no shit they're no 6v6
Flats just described the Sunken Cost Fallacy at the end of the video. Which is the idea that you can't change your stance because of the time/effort you have invested into it, even tho the amount of time/effort you spent on something in the past has nothing to do with what you could do in the future.
Supports now have a much better QoL after they added self healing mechanism, they just have to come up with something for the Tank ,but apparently the healing reduction did the opposite. At least Tanks should have instant respawn to ease their impact of death, which is the source of all hate for the role.
I don't see how this is much different than just having a second tank
One of the big problems I see is blizzard often uses a band-aid fix rather than trying to balance and it causes problems later. Rather than trying to balance the supports/survivability they created the dps passive, rather than nerfing damage they buffed health, rather trying to fix queue times they swapped to 5v5.
As a relatively new player it definitely seems like some people need to take a break or something and come back with a refreshed perspective. I hear a bunch of people talk about how much they hate the game and hate playing it, and I just question why they’re still so invested in something that makes them unhappy. Nobody is forcing you to play overwatch. If I wasn’t having fun I wouldn’t keep playing.
That’s the thing about this game it’s entrapment u leave come back be happy for a little bit then go back to being salty because while this game is great it slowly grinds you down until you break.
Some people are straight up addicted to the game, and it really shows when they're screeching about a nonissue on OW forums or acting very unhinged in-game. They do really suck the fun out of the game sometimes.
Sad people lol, just play and chill and when it’s not fun stop.not that hard 😂
ehh people that are upset are always the loudest and people that are content say nothing. Its just a very vocal miserable minority. Honestly just a side effect of the internet/ the way devs use social media as their forums now imo. its not something exclusive to any specific game community, you see it in literally every fanbase these days.
Have you ever considered that a decent portion of players love the game, its world and characters, and are upset that the game has been in an objectively poor state since for so long?
Criticism isn’t inherently negative or hateful, it definitely can be. But most people complaining are doing it out of passion for the game and genuinely wanting the thing they have come to love and used to enjoy be better.
I think Samito was right, Flats will be one of the first to convert to 6v6.
I think having the discussion with the devs is the most important thing we can do as a community now. I need to know why they want to move forward with 5v5 and why 6v6 was given up in the first place (assuming it was something other than queue times). If they gave up 6v6 because of balancing issues and they think it would simply be even more impossibly complicated than what it was I wish they would tell us. I want to know if player satisfaction has gone up with overwatch's casual playerbase since 5v5. From my point of view every person feels less joy but less frustrations as well. "It feels as though the soul of the game is gone and now it's a deathmatch" is often something I hear.
So with that in my option I hate the 5v5 because I’m not the greatest sheiks tank ever so by my self being tank can’t really do shield tanks I’m learning but still not that good and with 6v6 I could be an off tank and my other tank being a main tank meant I could do some more stuff or help flank an enemy draw the fire from them and let my dps players take that person out. With that though I think they took that out to help balance things and make it easier for some people
About the difference between casual and veterans, it is 100% just a question of some people playing the game too much. I have played the game for many many years, but I only play as much as I want. I enjoy the game. If you’re a full time streamer, you will be burnt out.
I've played the game since launch. The match quality is now so bad the game just isn't fun anymore.
Yup, long time player I've been dragging my feet on the battle pass and am fed up.
Instead I'm playing helldivers 2, which is a lot of fun and doesn't make me feel disappointed, disrespected, or dehumanized.
#bringback6v6
I think hero mastery overall is a missed opportunity. There should have been some type of instruction as to how to best use the hero to max your score.
6v6 needs to come back. Not having any tank synergy, or someone to swap out with sucks. Either the enemy team just walks past you to kill your team or you just get focus fired..
It really has just felt like an incomplete game since it came out..
They've literally taken more away from the game than they have added in a positive way.
This game will never be competitive when you have 1 role that is broken yet unfun to play. Fixing the tank gameplay will never work without realizing that the whole problem with the role has to do with the format and not the role itself.
Genuinely think people just expect too much from multiplayer games nowadays. Very, very few people are built to grind one thing for thousands of hours a year and year after year. Even if that thing tries to make changes as much as modern multiplayer games to keep the fun coming.
Also the streaming community basically has this game at a job, and people can start to hate their jobs pretty fast.
Southern california is just something else...I love how they feel surprised that no one gave a shit about this mode lmao. Waiting for them realise that perhaps 5v5 is not the way to go.
Flat meat riding blizzard as always cant admit this game is boring now
This game is fucked if theres decent competition like marvel rivals or a new fps games that innovates the hero shooter genre in some way.
I think main issue doing back to 6v6 is that the tank issue of people not wanting to play tank is just going to make longer queue times and people being more mad about the tank role when they autofill
Here's what I think happened with 6v6, people kept quitting the game because they "didn't wanna shoot through 2 tanks." It's the reason I quit the game, I hated it... fighting two good tanks was the most awful experience I've ever had in an FPS. They changed it to 5v5 and ive been playing every season ever since, and I bet a lot of people did the same. Anyone who liked 6v6 is honestly the loud minority, most people I know, don't want that awful experience back
THIS! My friends wanted to play 6v6 scrims and I personally thought it felt awful when we did, which I obviously know is partly that heroes aren’t balanced for 6v6 right now, and it was a custom game, but it felt like so much standing around. I like the fast pace of 5v5.
Bap and brig made those tanks unkillable.
In 5v5, you arent shooting 2 tanks, but you are shooting through a suzu, shooting a life grip, shooting a lamp or a heal dumped tank. Which is kinda weird. In 6v6, you werent even suppose to be shooting tanks unless your team called for it to happen (or to force them out of a superior position on the map). Same with 5v5, but since there is more denial abilities happening now, its like wth am i even suppose to shoot at without something surviving😂
the fact that the queues are very similar to what they were like after role queue disproves this whole vocal minority notion, if you have a whole group of people willing to regularly play tank and then split the requirement in half, then all those people would still play tank making the queues balanced among the roles, the fact that they arent means that a lot of those people either stopped playing tank or stopped playing the game altogether. shooting through both those tanks was easier to do than shooting through one tank in ow2 lol any issue with killing tanks in 6v6 wouldve been fixed with properly balancing healers.
Literally nothing you just said is new information.
I hate the 6v6 argument. The game was broken in 6v6, going back to it won’t fix it. Tank wasn’t fun in 6v6, tank in 5v5 is just as bad with just different problems. Tank as a concept in overwatch has almost never worked and has never been satisfying. We need to do new things to fix tank, not go back to old problems
Man overwatch has to stop canceling everything first pve then Hero Mastery what next arcade or something like that
Bro no one played that shit lol. It was not good, and there's zero point to spend dev time maintaining it if literally less than 0.1% players play it.
Yall will complain about removing a game mode that none of you even played lol
Overwatch is canceling the fun
I didnt even know it was a mode thats how forgetable it is that i didnt even hear of it
Right, the only good thing they canceled was loot boxes………
😏
@@MrCalalf loot boxes also gave u stuff like skins mastery just gave u a pose not many people care for poses they are just there
what i want from the hero mastery courses is 1. let us play them during queue and 2. let groups load in together & u see eachother as ghosts
I wish anybody loved me as much as Blizzard loves Ls
Its at this point you can't really trust blizzard all that much. It's false hopes alot of the time that isn't the shop. Pve, the reason I wanted overwatch 2 to be, and alot of people, was cut, they cut their own survival game short, and to be fair, the game has hardly changed at all cause its just counter swap tanks, Ana and kiri owning, sojourn somehow not being nerfed and is STILL GOOD since her launch, along with kiri as well. They don't touch those two. As a long time player, it's frustrating dealing with all these things that are just so oppressive and having these huge dreams of, I can't wait to play that pve someday for the enjoyment of it, unlocking stuff and doing challenges, to just then (as a tank player) hop on, get countered and told tank diff every time I just want to play my favorite characters... IN CASUAL! I don't dare to touch comp that much as it's just very long matches for me, and not all that interested in the sweat in it. Wish I could get those jade weapons though by another way than comp. But that's my take as a long time player for like 4 years.
And yet no mercy buffs
I like how I sat through all that talking and somehow understood it without understanding it
About steam players, i couldn't play on the battle net version cause it wouldn't update properly for some reason so i had to switch to the steam version i'm not sure if that was just a me problem with battle net but if it wasn't that could account for some of the steam players cause i can't see why new players would get on steam see ow2 at mostly negative and still download it
It baffles me how flats is really struggling to phrase his words when talking about the 6v6 / 5v5 topic. This smells like a blizzard contract agreements thing to me or/and he doesn't want to split his own community. I hope for flats that at any point of his career, he'll be able to freely talk about things again and be genuine with his fans and community without being scared of potential financial drawbacks.
I’m 90% sure those in the OW creator discord aren’t allowed to openly endorse 6v6. Remember Keller told flats not to bring up 6v6 in his last Q&A. It was also the most frequently asked question and he started banning those asking it. Around that time all the popular OW creators started some negative 6v6 propaganda.
The gaslighting is another reason why the game is dying
Casual Person here, I left a while ago durring overwatch one, and I love overwatch 2. I'm forever in the metal ranks, and I know that there are problems, but I'm having fun anyway. I very well might get fed up if the devs don't fix the issues I notice, but as of right now the issues mostly don't impact my fun.
My take relating to them changing ow to a 5v5 from a 6v6 was, they didn't need to remove an entire role from ow just to "fix the problem"
I don't know why but it genuinely surprised me that the community was vehemently, Unitedly, against 5v5, and yet were not listened to.
Now it looks like the old members, and perhaps new (?) members of the community are ready to scream bloody murder, myself included, to bring back 6v6.
I personally would love to see an overwatch hacked event occur where they play around with the idea.
i think 6v6 coming back as an arcade mode with some balance changes would be very interesting and fun for a ton of people, and also low commitment for blizzard seeings whether people are interested in 6v6
What they could do is go back to 6v6, unite the Dps and Tank queues and make Tank 1 minimum and 2 maximum. Gotta rebalance but that’s okay.
The only thing I don't like about the venture buff is that she feels really bad to fight because she does a decent bit of dps, can "self heal", and have a get out of jail. Having her get out more often kinda sucks to play against. It feels like fighting sombra but instead with a bunch of soft cc. I'm ok with her other buffs, but the cool down decrease allows her to correct mistakes she should have lived from.
I started playing OW in 2017. Obviously I had my season I played more and seasons where I played less. But recently, I started to play WAY more again. Currently I learn to play some new heroes, for example I am trying to get better with Sombra. I don't play ranked though, only quickplay, but I have fun.
Things feel really bad after that mid season patch, thought it had promise and it has been a giant disappointment as a tank.
I love that they're so happy about gaining more players when it's literally a bunch of people basically practicing, wanting and waiting for Marvel Rivals to come, not even most of the streamers want to go back to OW when Rivals comes out XD
Honestly... the BIGGEST problem for me was the map... i dont want to play a game in that boring white-ish blue-ish yellow-ish mess.... i mean, isnt maps variants more logical in "overwatch training matrix" thingy?
I mean its crazy cause a TD mode could be fun... If the map had an actual design that felt "overwatch" and not "we just made this in like 5 minutes", or if there was any real creativity or fun to it at all. The training bots just do nothing, it sucks and isnt fun at all to slog through.
But hey lets not try and actually do something interesting lets just cancel it, that seems to be the overwatch team's specialty.
Never played ow1, I have really liked the state of ow2 since start of season 9
I just don't like how they got rid of the drill dash underground gimmick cutting in half whenever it was used underground
You know what honestly I hope in the future they release a overwatch classic so I can complain about bap immortality and brig, instead of complaining about exploding on tank or can’t kill tanks, or wow they use grip to deny me of a kill when they were clearly feeding. It feels like there is to much to complain about in ow2 I would take longer queues for in my opinion the better format
The biggest issue with playing tank in 5v5 is that it is the easiest role to counter. I cannot play a single tank game where I am not forced off the tank I am playing because the entire enemy team swaps to counter me while everyone else on my team refuses to switch to help. Until you have 2 tanks again, this counter swap culture will persist. 5v5 has better queue times, 6v6 has better quality of games. I would rather play quality over quantity.
What did they expect when you can't even navigate the menus during a Gauntlet queue? People realize they have to sit facing an endless queue screen and that premonition becomes a reality. Zero thought put into making it achievable with randos for higher difficulties and no useful bots to backfill.
The problems with the gauntlet is:
I always forget it existed
the other consideration is that they have already said their stance on it in regards to 6v6 put people persist anyway, but at the same time there are those in the community that have offered great suggestions for the 5v5 format but feel ignored, what needs to happen is an open constructive discussion, not a samito rant. Where suggestions are offered from both camps and blizzard responds to each in return. everything is kept logical and not emotional
People said we would never get wow classic, people said we would never get old school runescape, yet here we are. They are the most popular version of those games because they got changed into something literally nobody asked for. Overwatch needs to go back to 6v6 and listen to its playerbase when it comes to balancing. A good player who understands the game at a high level could make a patch within 10 minutes and the game would be in a good state, yet the devs refuse to change it. Its sad to see
My biggest issue with playing tank us I just never know what I'm supposed to be doing. I peaked Gold 1 in season 9 after not having played ranked since OW1 and I honestly felt like I didn't deserve because I don't know what I even did that was working. Now I find myself more attracted to damage because I'm tired if trying to solve a puzzle that I can't even begin to comprehend. Just let me blow stuff up with Junkrat.
Tank has to figure out if their dps will poke or brawl, push or not push. What's frustrating is that there's dps that will complain if you don't push when they're poking? Causing you to get aggro.. There's times where it works...
Tank will always feel like shit on 5v5, there's no escaping it. I almost never touched other roles during all of my time since the release of OW 1. On 2 I never touched tank since S2, and that's the only way I was able to enjoy this game.
I desperately hope they someday revert the tank knockback changes and forget to do the same for zaryas self knockback so she can briefly litteraly launch herself
Tank can feel like the best and worst role at the same time, one game you're immortal and farming the whole lobby the next game you instantly explode no matter how good you play. 5v5 will never work even if everything was perfectly balanced because you would only see 5 of the same heroes in every lobby.
"you'll never be able to get these hero poses again"
I give it 3 years until it's in the shop.
Top 10 reasons 6v6 role queue won’t come back
1. Queue times
2. Queue times
3. Queue times
4. Queue times
5. Queue times
6. Queue times
7. Queue times
8. Queue times
9. Queue times
10. Queue times
6v6 role queue would literally kill the game, new players are already slotted into their roles and likely won’t make the jump to tanking, and people who say they’ll start tanking again aren’t enough.
Theres a better chance we get 6v6 open queue before 6v6 role queue
Rebuttal: October 2020 patch.
The game felt great for 90% of the roster and queue times were fast across the board. Blizzard even stated they got queues to good levels.
Everyone was pissed the moment a new patch came cause the game finally had a close to perfect balance.
In ow1, i was a support and tank player.
In ow2, im now a support player who occasionally plays dps.
yeah but 5v5 was the solution to 6v6 when everybody was complaining about 6v6.... the game has been meta dependant and everyone has been complaining about said meta since forever... nobody liked dive... nobody liked goats... nobody liked double shield... lol the game is just hard to play and kind of a tedious teamplay game. So they tried to make it less team oriented and we're still complaining. idk. The pros like a dps meta when either genji/tracer or widow is meta but most people don't.
I'm adding to the steam player count. I quit wow, burned out on d4, and never got in to HS. There's just no need for a separate launcher.
Dude is king of saying “I don’t wanna be the guy to say it” then immediately saying it. Why is he so scared to speak his mind lmao
My favorite part was when Blizzard hired Gandalf the PvE canceller, and shouted "You Shall not have PvE!" and cancelled all the PvE activities.