THIS WAS THE BEST THROTTLE BODY DIAGNOSTIC I HAVE EVERY SEEN , VERY STRAIGHT FORWARD NO TRYING TO PLAY LIKE SOME SUPERTECH THANKS SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME !
I agree!!! I'm not a mechanic by any means but I love doing troubleshooting with my partner I do all the homework reading repair manuals, scouring the internet and he does the labor, when we're unsure of the issue right off the bat. Thanks for the video!
This instructional is of exceptional quality! I work at a post secondary educational institution and this exceeds the quality of some PH.D. professor lectures and tutorials!!! Kudos to you for educating us all so well on proper troubleshooting techniques for such troublesome issues! You deserve a raise!
Hi, your thoughts of approach is so clear and complete analysis of verification of the entire systems to be with no malfunctions whatsoever. I am 74 years old and have been a mechanic for the last 52 years and you are a major asset to the automotive industry with your effort and dedications. Thanks a billion. Keep up the good work.
I have an 08 Caliber that needed a new throttle body - the mechanic I took it too thought it was the CVT! Luckily, I went with my gut and dug into the issue deeper, cleaned the throttle body which helped. Not satisfied with 'better,' I replaced the throttle body altogether and that resolved the issue completely - no more intermittent 'jerking' when accelerating, especially under heavy load. Moral of this story: there are mechanics that still don't grasp current automotive technology and are quick to swap parts, even if they're thousands of dollars.
@Guitargreat Eric is a well rounded mechanic but nowhere on the level of Mike when it comes to this kind of diag. And I say this with all due respect. Ive been a subscriber of his channel since 2015... Dont be fooled by the power of editing
I ran into this video looking for reviews on the caliber but actually stuck around to watch all 40 minutes of it. Definitely learned something new, subscribed! Great explanation!
I enjoyed that. It shows how easily you can make the wrong diagnosis. It also shows how you can fall into a trap with Identifix if you're not careful and read how others came to their conclusions.
Hey wysetech2000, thanks for watching and commenting! It's too often that we find ourselves dancing around the trap trying not to fall in. Hopefully this video helps people avoid that. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
THANK YOU SO MUCH. I live in a country where dodge is not a big thing. My car has been standing for 3 years and R30 000 spent on it. It has been to multiple mechanics and they have redone the engine, replaced the throttle control body, ECU twice. Then "repaired" the ECU twice. Finally got tired and got the vehicle home. About a 5 hour drive. Had to tow it so more money. I saw your video and realised someone remived my temp sensor. Stuck a random R35 fridge temp sensor in it as a test and it ran perfectly. Wow
This is the best diagnostic video on this problem. I had a car brought to me from a shop and after I replaced the throttle body, repaired wiring and a connector, as well as replaced an ECU fuse, it still wouldn't reprogram... until the iat sensor was connected. Thank you for that nugget!
Wow, what a great diagnosis and awsome tutorial. I bet this burns many technicians. You definitely earned this subscription! Thank you for taking us along.
I learned in school that it is critical that you know the operation of the system before you do any diagnosis, glad you caught the IAT being unplugged didn’t allow the voltage to be given
THANKYOU MIKE FOR THAT! Somebody out there in scantool or Chrysler land dropped the ball! Maybe they were thinking (or not) or assuming that all removed parts would be reinstalled. However, going through diagnostic trouble trees, if it isn't mentioned now, it will be later, meaning don't reassemble at this point, do it later on. We've become accustomed to this, only this time all parts needed to be reassembled. Thankfully you had that information in identifix. Great Job! !
Hey Mike, thanks for watching and commenting! Burned on this one a little bit...but learned a valuable lesson...that's for sure! Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This was exactly what I was talking about in my last comment. I had a 14 patriot that I bet takes the same part number and it comes with a new harness as well that needs spliced for that application. Went to a older video from this channel and it was just a good part install video but lacked on diagnostic side. The pricipals in this video can apply to any ETC system. There is a "deicing" mode programmed into PCM on FCA systems that if thorottle blade is stuck it stops control until its warmer which explains IAT is a vital critical component in testing or relearning the thorottle.
@@GoTechTraining Yeah for whatever reason the FCA cars seem to have this failure more than others. Id bet that most can be tracked to carbon buildup and the thorottle blade getting stuck.
Great video and great info especially on the IAT. Mitchell ProDemand actually has a Note: ECT must be between 41-230 F & IAT greater than 41 F & B+ greater than 10V to do ETC Relearn and also has under Possible Causes: ECT or IAT Out of Range will set a P2119 DTC while doing a PCM program or ETC Relearn (The ETC Relearn is either turning key "On" or performing it with scan tool). It also shows the resistance of the motor should be 2.5-12 ohms. This just points out the difference in sources and why we need multiple repair sources Mitchell, Alldata, Identifix, etc; Internet & forums, IATN, etc and never to forget "Phone a Friend and of course You Tube!!!! Research takes up a lot of our time but saves us in the long run! Great video as usual Mike and diagnosis & repair!!!!
Damn Mike! Who would ever thought that a sensor being unplugged would cause this issue. I didn’t mention the sensor or symptoms as I don’t won’t to give away the spoiler. Great video content with very important information! Have s great weekend coming up! 😀👍
Hey Terry, had me scratching my head for a bit. Just another "lack of info" type of thing! You have a great weekend as well :) Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Speed density mike!!!! (MAP,IAT,ECT,BARO) I'm really suprises that's the other shop Didn't check the motor operations!! I had a newer truck came in for a bearing noise, lift the truck up and let her spin. The usual ABS/TRAC lights came on afterwards.... Got the new bearing in. Went for a test drive,vehicle went into limp mode!!! Never ever had something like that happened before!!! Had a code in the tranny, from spinning the wheels!!! Clear all codes from that moment on!! PS: always do a relearn after any EFI repair/tune!!
Great video, Mike! Boy, I'd have got burned on this one for sure. Lesson learned, when in doubt, plug EVERYTHING back in before condemning a PCM! What an expensive lesson for the other shops!! Thanks for sharing, and have a great weekend, brother! 🍻
brilliant video explained why i had to change throttle body and air mass sensor on 2 nissan xtrails 2 years ago without the equipment i didn't have to do a relearn just replaced and got going
Great video I will not replace a ecm with out knowing why it went bad I’ll check every Circuit A lot of manufacturers have different characteristics When it comes to relearning and drivability strategies All I can think of this one is that Chrysler Doesn’t want the throttle body to open if the iat is not connected because there’s a chance that intake tube is off and unfiltered air will be entering the engine And also check systems with everything contact and working. I would’ve replace the oil sensor at the same time because you don’t know if the programming might not give throttle response due to no oil pressure But that’s just me I fix what I know is wrong as I chase a challenging problems never over look the obvious again great job
Hey Mr Ae. Thanks for watching! How many times does it REALLY end up needing a computer?! Probably one of the most improperly changed components on the car. Great points on checking everything before condemning. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Why is IAT essential to TB motor calibration: if you have noticed in the video, the TB plate never moved during the correct calibration. It did not need to. Based in IAT and MAP sensor, a value would be stored, which is taken from a 2D map. That would be your basic settings. Once the engine is running, corrections are added to this stored value, to match what the rpm command would be. Another option, seen with other vehicles, on every contact on event, ecu drives the TB from 0 to 100% and back, thus storing the TPS values and calibrating the control range.
Absolutely a great job Mike Really enjoyed this one as much as all the other vids. I will never overlook the IAT. The key was finding out that the PCM needs the IAT PID for the re-learn. 👍👍
The iat is self explanatory. It measures the incoming air by temperature.cooler air is denser so there u go.pcm uses this information and throttle position to run the engine properly.so of course the relearn would need the iat plugged up.mitchell.all data. all u need is a wiring schematic.great video mike
if it is fly by wire it is the gears that went bad as well as the cam sensors trying to protect the engine. I actually took one apart most of them have plastic gears and tend to break do to heat cycles. go from there and check the cam sensor that follows it because they both tend to try to prevent engine damage
Yes!! This right here.. This is the mindset all mechanics need and many are missing. Not just throwing parts at a problem and even after parts installed recheck your readings to verify. Amazing video not just for this car/issue.
It was long but informative and Excellent education. Thank you for taking time and making this video for us all. God bless and give you all the return.
I hate to bring this up, because it puts me in a position to defend Identifix and the factory service info. (I despise saying nice things for either.) But what I found is that your answer was already in the factory service info & Identifix. If you have the time to go back into Identifix and pull up the car again, then type the P2119 into the search bar to pull up results. Go down to service manual diagnostics and click on the P2119 code link. When the sub window opens, you first get a factory wiring diagram. Scroll down past that and it gives you a list of the possible causes and the first thing they tell you is "ATTEMPTING TO PROGRAM PCM WHEN ENGINE COOLANT TEMPERATURE OR INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE ARE OUT OF RANGE." I'm not trying to throw mud in your eye, but let's face it. An open from a disconnected IAT sensor is out of range. I get the frustration of trying to find that info though. Often enough, it's just not in there or, in this case, you have no idea where it's hidden. It's still a good video and keep up the good work.
Good stuff! I probably wouldve put the test lamp right on the throttle body connector to test PCM control . Would make a suitable substitute for the throttle body before smoke testing the harness
Would you look at that! That would’ve been a head scratcher. Having a diagnostic process, following it through and still having issues. What else could it be right!! (Always variables) As always thanks for sharing Mike
Ugh yeh, it was a bit of a head scratcher Angel. I'm just glad I was able to get it figured out before throwing another PCM at it. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
So after watching this video I tried spark plugs . Didn’t work. I figured it must be the throttle body like this video concludes, so I skipped the coil packs and replaced the $250 throttle body. Still didn’t work even after calibrating the computer by turning ignition to on and pushing gas pedal. What worked for me was the coil packs. My computer diagnostic was cylinder 1 misfire .
Wow I didn't see that coming. Just curious what would of happened if you unplugged it as soon as you seen no signal at the throttle body? Before taking everything apart IAT. That would of been my third step. Clear codes Scoped for control clear codes unplug check control then add a substitute (test light just in case the pcm needs a complete circuit) while checking for control. That would of been my method but I would of never thought of the IAT. That's going in my notes because my memory sucks.thanks for sharing. Even if that method would of worked I'm glad it went this way because I would of never learned something as critical as that. Again thanks for sharing. It truly helps me tremendously. I've gotten far because of guys like you doing amazing detail and explanation.
Thanks for watching. It is a good lesson to add to the notes. I'd be willing to bet it's not just IATs that can cause this issue on relearns. I'm going to look at all sensors next time I see something like this. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Funny that I found this video after I decided to keep this sensor plugged, just because the computer likes to see all sensors working properly, I have always kept this in mind, unfortunately my issue is a little different than in this video but I believe that the PCM is seeing inconsistencies in the signal return that it decides to shut off the engine after it starts briefly. My case is a start only if I cycle the key after 6-8 seconds and if I hear the fuel pump and the weird noise at the engine that was observed in this video. The fuel pump cycles multiple times and this is the first time I see something where the fuel pump cycles multiple times KOEO.
@10:15 you say.. pcm is not sending a signal to TB. But then you test the TB. Also,.. I would not apply full power to a TB. They are PWM controlled. The noise might be it eating itself. Good video. Nice to see non parts changer. After finishing the video.. I see why ecm was changed so many times. Would of better been said "we have no signal from pcm, but because it has been changed so many times.. let's continue to look elsewhere". This would have stumped most people. Got the dealer. Lol
Hey man, thanks for watching! PCM's are good for shutting themselves down when a component has failed. That's why I went to testing the TB. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video Mike, I have replaced about 50 of those throttle bodys, but never unplug the iat for my testing, just roll the hose out of the way, because I hate messing with those red clips on the connector, good info to know for sure, lucked out and never went down that rabbit hole
Had a Jeep Wrangler with the same code the other day and no throttle response. Checked the powers and grounds and found 1.89 k ohm on one of the ground wires for the throttle position sensor. 5 minutes later I found the problem, the engine bay had been detailed and the detailer spent a lot of time concentrating his pressure cleaner on one of the main harness connectors, it was full of water. About a foot of the main harness need to be cut out and new wiring and pins put in place as the green death had worked it's way back either side of the connector inside the wiring insulation.... Not fun on a connector with 30 odd pins lol
PS, the cheap Chinese scan tool I use most frequently will throw a message during ETC relearn that says conditions not met if any current codes are present during the relearn..... Sometimes budget tools work better than the expensive ones 👍
Great video and great information.Ive done several of these.And tested them the same way but didnt know that the iat had that effect,i just happen to always plug it back in , just habit...please keep the videos coming
I'm working on a 2007 with a 2.4L. Owner fired the parts cannon at the car for approximately six months. One item was a new throttle body. Now I'm wondering if the relearn was performed properly. Thanks for your time and sharing your knowledge.
Great info. I would have made the mistake of putting in another PCM. This is where service information is soooo very valuable. I feel like its sabotage on the manufactures part to sell more parts.
Thanks for watching! Sabotage may be a little far. I think it's them protecting their assets. Tons of R&D goes into that PCM. IF it were easy to know what was going on in there...it would be easy to reverse engineer for other companies to turn a profit on. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great Video, I had a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6l would not run unless my foot is on gas pedal but when I put it into a gear it shuts off. So won't idle,won't run in gear. And no codes. I get a little back fire. But I believe you solved my problem.
I was a VW dealer mechanic back in early 60's/70's.....don't recollect -(at least on any air cooled VW's) any ignition kill switch integrated with the 1 wire block mounted oil pressure switch???? Please enlighten/refresh my old brain....
@@johnbeech2192 probably vanagons, not worked on many, but I kind of recall two switches on them, one closed on low pressure one closed on high pressure and pretty sure it was for the fuel injection pump systems to not run when engine isn't. rusty memory :)
My 2008 Caliber has 245,000 miles on it. This issue has popped up a couple times. The car goes into limp mode. Cleaning the throttle body fixed it every time. This car is still running strong. The high miles and still running strong I thank the 5 speed manual trans.
First off great video Mike,thank you for posting! Secondly,I'm going to be honest and say I can't believe the first shop didn't figure out the TB is bad! Why? Well,because of the fact that even if you don't know anything about control, it is still a motor that spins one way, reverse polarity and spins the other...simple as that! Just look up the power and ground for that TB on a wiring diagram. Thirdly,I thought it's common knowledge that PCMs are smart these days and they will shut off that circuit if a problem is found : clear codes and proceed. Lastly,I didn't know the IAT has to be plugged in, but I do know it is a vital data PID that the computer is using : like passing an EVAP test, perhaps even on starting by comparing the IAT to the ECT...which should be pretty close temperature wise on cold start...etc. Another example is when you are trying to run certain tests in " special functions " : the PCM will not allow some of them if the temperature(coolant or IAT) is not between certain values...👍
Nick, thanks for watching! Sometimes things just get overlooked in the shop I suppose. Crazy how that little bugger is used for some many things. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video, Mike! The ETC learn routine should return error code "Conditions not met". Either the scanner reports it as "Passed" anyway, or the PCM actually returns "Passed" instead. Either way, there are basic software errors here plaguing not their creators, but unsuspecting technicians. Quite distressing.
KOEO the throttle will not move when you apply the accelerator pedal. You have to first go into "ETC Follower Test" under system tests. Then it'll allow you to control the throttle KOEO. Really enjoying the new videos, btw. I remember watching the early Wells videos with the army dude ages ago when I was in school. I'm happy you went with videos aimed at more, real world diagnostics.
Nice work! Great video, as always. I've always thought of the electronic throttle bodies being too sensitive to just hook up power and ground to them to see if they work. Thanks for sharing that. I can see the IAT sensor thing burning just about anyone. What I can't see is a code for the TB but the shop putting in two PCM's. Any good old parts changer with a code reader may have fixed this car. Throttle body code? Install new throttle body. Put back together and start it up. Fixed. Would have had a high idle and just needed an idle relearn at the end.
Hey, thanks!! Yeh, i'm not exactly sure how two PCM's ended up in there...not the way I would have done things. But, that's probably why it ended up by me in the end. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
It is also important to thoroughly read the factory dtc information. It states the IAT has to be functioning properly when performing the relearn. "NOTE: Engine coolant temperature must be between 5° C (41° F) and 110° C (230° F), intake air temperature must be greater than 5° C (41° F), and battery voltage must be greater than 10 voltswhen performing the ETC Relearn function. If these parameters are not met during the relearn process, this DTC may set."
2009 Dodge Caliber - I have a ETC warning light. My mechanic changed the throttle and programed it - but has not fixed the issue. I will get him to verify the new throttle is opening - check the OHMs of the new throttle and then try a relearn with the IAT. If this fixes my car... I will just be so excited. Goes in tomorrow morning.
Thanks for the video this helped me alot!! Just replaced my ETB, I think there should be a part about manual Throttle leaning for us who dont have the computers!
Thank you Jim! I assume there is more than one "Jim Morton" out there. Are you the trainer, Jim? Is this your ignition waveform book I have sitting here on my desk? :) Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
IAT is very important when it comes to the density of the air, comparing it to an oil pressure sensor isn't even close. This is why I remove the sensor from the ducting and leave it plugged in. Great video though.
Well done mike this was a great video. Very interested all the circuits like IAT needs to be connected during relearn programming I would of never guessed that. I’ll keep that in mind now.. good job ... Jay
Absolutely...Great info to know. Wow.! Thank you so much for putting this out there Mike. That would have been a typical WT? moment. Lol. Cheers Buddy!
That was some good diagnosis and very informative even though I don't own one of those cars. Who knows this might be the same procedure on other vehicle with electronic throttle body?
These are notorious for TB and TPS issues, on mine I replaced them both, had a issue with a lightning bolt on dash coming on, replaced TB again, same issue, code that was thrown had to do with the transmission sensor, had dealer look at it and they reset it and that didn’t fix it, after some research and checking ended up being a bad cam sensor so I replaced both and never had any issues after that
Hey Dylan, yeh i've heard that now. Interesting how they can have such a rash of TB issues. Thanks for watching! Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Another food for thought post to add here: the force the TB return spring makes, it is relatively constant between throttle body rest position and 100%. So the makers could not make a direct relationship between TB motor torque and % opening. Because if that would be the case, you would have seen proportional voltage control. Instead, they relied on fast PWM motor control, which has also the advantage to keep the IGBTs cool, if you actually measure, you will see the PWM in order of kHz, is a constant, between 0% to 100% at steady rpm. You can try this with the bi-directional control of the scan tool. Therefore, the TPS, two of them, are also critical in this application, as they were sitting down in a risk assessment study, usually a HAZID, discussing the design and how many fatalities per mile per year, what is acceptable in the industry and public perception. If you ever have the chance to attend one of these risk assessments sessions, at NGK, go for it, it will be interesting. So coming back to TPS, one of the solutions to the risks identified, was to put 2 TPS, supplied from 2 separate 5V reference voltages. If you try to disconnect both TPS, you will find another ECU strategy, which is kill the engine and store faultcode TB motor control failure - forced engine stop. It is safer to have a stopped engine that an full power running engine.
The freaking IAT has to be plugged in!?!?! Gee thanks dodge/chrysler, wtf. Gotta love their crap wiring diagrams too. Great vid man, also liked seeing a technican use ohms law, very good stuff.
👍Excellent work! Thanks for sharing. Last I checked with my parts guy, that's a high volume part😀. Junk. Seems like it has more spring return in it than necessary. Maybe that's why so many fail?
Ismar, what happens when the PCM doesn't supply power or ground because it's shut itself off? Happens all the time and could lead you astray. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining well Mike I had that situation two times.One on the 99 pathfinder where pcm stuck in to the limp mode due to fried throttle motor control drivers and pcm has been replaced and second on titan with pcm in limp mode due to acc.pedal sensor issue.as soon as I disconnect plug from the sensor pcm come back to function (pcm has separated from affected circuit).in this particular case whoever work on cars professionally should be aware of weak throttle assy escpecially on chrysler,jeep products.every case study and diagnose is separate story with different variables.anyways this was proper diag and i really like your methodical approach to the particular problem.cheers!!!
THIS WAS THE BEST THROTTLE BODY DIAGNOSTIC I HAVE EVERY SEEN , VERY STRAIGHT FORWARD NO TRYING TO PLAY LIKE SOME SUPERTECH THANKS SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME !
Hahah thanks 8Power0!!! Appreciate it :)
Mike Becker Senior Instructor
I agree!!! I'm not a mechanic by any means but I love doing troubleshooting with my partner I do all the homework reading repair manuals, scouring the internet and he does the labor, when we're unsure of the issue right off the bat. Thanks for the video!
Proof that getting schooled is a daily adventure. Much respect sir and thank you for your continued efforts
Daily man...daily. Thanks for watching.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This instructional is of exceptional quality! I work at a post secondary educational institution and this exceeds the quality of some PH.D. professor lectures and tutorials!!! Kudos to you for educating us all so well on proper troubleshooting techniques for such troublesome issues! You deserve a raise!
Hey Metal L, thanks a ton! I really appreciate the kind words!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
i could not have said it beter
Hi, your thoughts of approach is so clear and complete analysis of verification of the entire systems to be with no malfunctions whatsoever. I am 74 years old and have been a mechanic for
the last 52 years and you are a major asset to the automotive industry with your effort and dedications. Thanks a billion. Keep up the good work.
brother u just saved me a pcm. u walked write threw and I found a broken wire on the temp sensor. fixed and car is running great
That's awesome Derek!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have an 08 Caliber that needed a new throttle body - the mechanic I took it too thought it was the CVT! Luckily, I went with my gut and dug into the issue deeper, cleaned the throttle body which helped. Not satisfied with 'better,' I replaced the throttle body altogether and that resolved the issue completely - no more intermittent 'jerking' when accelerating, especially under heavy load.
Moral of this story: there are mechanics that still don't grasp current automotive technology and are quick to swap parts, even if they're thousands of dollars.
Glad you were able to get it fixed up Robert. Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hey what was the issues you were having with your caliber
I LIKE THE NEW CLASSES AND THE FREQUENCY OF THEM..., PLEASE KEEP THEM COMING THANKS SO MUCH !
I second that!
Im trying guys! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@Guitargreat Eric is a well rounded mechanic but nowhere on the level of Mike when it comes to this kind of diag. And I say this with all due respect. Ive been a subscriber of his channel since 2015... Dont be fooled by the power of editing
Eric O is great at everything he does. No need to compare, just watch us both :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Lots of great automotive repair channels out there. Every one has there own style. I follow quite a few and i learn from them all .
Excellent instructional young man. It’s the electric gremlins that confound so many of us!
I ran into this video looking for reviews on the caliber but actually stuck around to watch all 40 minutes of it. Definitely learned something new, subscribed! Great explanation!
Hey Servando, thanks for watching! Welcome to the channel :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I enjoyed that. It shows how easily you can make the wrong diagnosis. It also shows how you can fall into a trap with Identifix if you're not careful and read how others came to their conclusions.
Hey wysetech2000, thanks for watching and commenting! It's too often that we find ourselves dancing around the trap trying not to fall in. Hopefully this video helps people avoid that.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
THANK YOU SO MUCH. I live in a country where dodge is not a big thing. My car has been standing for 3 years and R30 000 spent on it. It has been to multiple mechanics and they have redone the engine, replaced the throttle control body, ECU twice. Then "repaired" the ECU twice.
Finally got tired and got the vehicle home. About a 5 hour drive. Had to tow it so more money. I saw your video and realised someone remived my temp sensor. Stuck a random R35 fridge temp sensor in it as a test and it ran perfectly. Wow
Hi Dovahkiin,
Glad you got it fixed! Thanks for sharing your story, it is always nice to hear stories like that.
~Ryan Wilsing
This is what I call a awesome informative video......these are the little kind of things that makes this an amazing community......
Hey Kevin, thanks!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This is the best diagnostic video on this problem. I had a car brought to me from a shop and after I replaced the throttle body, repaired wiring and a connector, as well as replaced an ECU fuse, it still wouldn't reprogram... until the iat sensor was connected. Thank you for that nugget!
Wow, what a great diagnosis and awsome tutorial. I bet this burns many technicians. You definitely earned this subscription! Thank you for taking us along.
Hey Freddy, thanks for watching! Welcome to the channel :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank you! The speaker/ tech is very good and explains things very well, excellent!!!
Hey David, thanks a ton! Glad you enjoyed the video!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I learned in school that it is critical that you know the operation of the system before you do any diagnosis, glad you caught the IAT being unplugged didn’t allow the voltage to be given
Hey Darby Hood, thanks for watching! Understanding the monster you're dealing with always makes it easier to work on.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
THANKYOU MIKE FOR THAT! Somebody out there in scantool or Chrysler land dropped the ball! Maybe they were thinking (or not) or assuming that all removed parts would be reinstalled. However, going through diagnostic trouble trees, if it isn't mentioned now, it will be later, meaning don't reassemble at this point, do it later on. We've become accustomed to this, only this time all parts needed to be reassembled.
Thankfully you had that information in identifix. Great Job! !
Hey Mike, thanks for watching and commenting! Burned on this one a little bit...but learned a valuable lesson...that's for sure!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I never slept so good while listening to this dude.
Awesome Blackie Chong! Glad I could help :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hahaha your not the only one!!!
Brilliant throttle body diagnostic tutorial mate, definitely the best I've seen. Cheers.
This was exactly what I was talking about in my last comment. I had a 14 patriot that I bet takes the same part number and it comes with a new harness as well that needs spliced for that application. Went to a older video from this channel and it was just a good part install video but lacked on diagnostic side. The pricipals in this video can apply to any ETC system. There is a "deicing" mode programmed into PCM on FCA systems that if thorottle blade is stuck it stops control until its warmer which explains IAT is a vital critical component in testing or relearning the thorottle.
Hey Eddie, thanks for watching. I guess this is a common issue on Dodge products?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Yeah for whatever reason the FCA cars seem to have this failure more than others. Id bet that most can be tracked to carbon buildup and the thorottle blade getting stuck.
Could be. Interesting theory. Carbon buildup is a real issue on many modern cars.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank you very much for taking the time to document and share this. Subscribed !
Now I have to watch all your other videos !
Thanks for watching!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video and great info especially on the IAT. Mitchell ProDemand actually has a Note: ECT must be between 41-230 F & IAT greater than 41 F & B+ greater than 10V to do ETC Relearn and also has under Possible Causes: ECT or IAT Out of Range will set a P2119 DTC while doing a PCM program or ETC Relearn (The ETC Relearn is either turning key "On" or performing it with scan tool). It also shows the resistance of the motor should be 2.5-12 ohms. This just points out the difference in sources and why we need multiple repair sources Mitchell, Alldata, Identifix, etc; Internet & forums, IATN, etc and never to forget "Phone a Friend and of course You Tube!!!! Research takes up a lot of our time but saves us in the long run! Great video as usual Mike and diagnosis & repair!!!!
Hey Bob, great the one that I don't have has all of the secrets! Go figure! hahaha. Have a good weekend
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Yea but Mitchell misses stuff Alldata & Identifix identifies. I think they are all in cahoots 😂🤣
For sure, they are all laughing together on the ride to the bank, haha!
Damn Mike! Who would ever thought that a sensor being unplugged would cause this issue. I didn’t mention the sensor or symptoms as I don’t won’t to give away the spoiler. Great video content with very important information! Have s great weekend coming up! 😀👍
Hey Terry, had me scratching my head for a bit. Just another "lack of info" type of thing! You have a great weekend as well :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike you do a awesome job and I appreciate what you do so much. Thank you, thank you, thank you. You are helping our entire industry
Thanks Joel!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Speed density mike!!!! (MAP,IAT,ECT,BARO)
I'm really suprises that's the other shop Didn't check the motor operations!!
I had a newer truck came in for a bearing noise, lift the truck up and let her spin. The usual ABS/TRAC lights came on afterwards....
Got the new bearing in. Went for a test drive,vehicle went into limp mode!!! Never ever had something like that happened before!!! Had a code in the tranny, from spinning the wheels!!! Clear all codes from that moment on!!
PS: always do a relearn after any EFI repair/tune!!
Hey Henry, yeh it definitely should have been checked.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
What a video man! superb diagnostic and no idea IAT sensor must be plugged in! you rock!
Thanks Xavier!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video, Mike! Boy, I'd have got burned on this one for sure. Lesson learned, when in doubt, plug EVERYTHING back in before condemning a PCM! What an expensive lesson for the other shops!!
Thanks for sharing, and have a great weekend, brother! 🍻
Hey man, thanks!!! You nailed it! Before pulling the trigger on anything else...plug everything in!!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
brilliant video explained why i had to change throttle body and air mass sensor on 2 nissan xtrails 2 years ago without the equipment i didn't have to do a relearn just replaced and got going
Thanks for watchin Maurice!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video I will not replace a ecm with out knowing why it went bad I’ll check every Circuit
A lot of manufacturers have different characteristics When it comes to relearning and drivability strategies All I can think of this one is that Chrysler Doesn’t want the throttle body to open if the iat is not connected because there’s a chance that intake tube is off and unfiltered air will be entering the engine
And also check systems with everything contact and working. I would’ve replace the oil sensor at the same time because you don’t know if the programming might not give throttle response due to no oil pressure But that’s just me I fix what I know is wrong as I chase a challenging problems never over look the obvious again great job
Hey Mr Ae. Thanks for watching! How many times does it REALLY end up needing a computer?! Probably one of the most improperly changed components on the car. Great points on checking everything before condemning.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Why is IAT essential to TB motor calibration: if you have noticed in the video, the TB plate never moved during the correct calibration. It did not need to. Based in IAT and MAP sensor, a value would be stored, which is taken from a 2D map. That would be your basic settings. Once the engine is running, corrections are added to this stored value, to match what the rpm command would be.
Another option, seen with other vehicles, on every contact on event, ecu drives the TB from 0 to 100% and back, thus storing the TPS values and calibrating the control range.
Absolutely a great job Mike
Really enjoyed this one as much as all the other vids. I will never overlook the IAT. The key was finding out that the PCM needs the IAT PID for the re-learn. 👍👍
Hey Richard, thanks man! Something so dumb, an IAT input, could have cost big $$$.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Not only the IAT, all the current codes should be looked at first before replacing the ECM
What meant PID?
You Sir are the real deal. You know your story very well.
Thank you very much!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
This was so incredibly informative. Thanks! I'm now subscribed.
Hey Erik, thanks!!! Welcome :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Same here
Excellent explanation and diagnosis of poor drivability for the 2007 Dodge Caliber. Thank you very much for making this video.
Thank you for your proper way of showing it in layman terms, precise, very understandable, thank you!
Hey Mario, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
The iat is self explanatory. It measures the incoming air by temperature.cooler air is denser so there u go.pcm uses this information and throttle position to run the engine properly.so of course the relearn would need the iat plugged up.mitchell.all data. all u need is a wiring schematic.great video mike
Pat, sure IAT is important, but i'm surprised it's needed for the relearn. Lessons learned.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
if it is fly by wire it is the gears that went bad as well as the cam sensors trying to protect the engine. I actually took one apart most of them have plastic gears and tend to break do to heat cycles. go from there and check the cam sensor that follows it because they both tend to try to prevent engine damage
Very professional video and very professional approach to solve the problem. World top auto machanic !!!!!
Hey Nat, thank you very very much!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Yes!! This right here.. This is the mindset all mechanics need and many are missing. Not just throwing parts at a problem and even after parts installed recheck your readings to verify. Amazing video not just for this car/issue.
It was long but informative and Excellent education. Thank you for taking time and making this video for us all. God bless and give you all the return.
I hate to bring this up, because it puts me in a position to defend Identifix and the factory service info. (I despise saying nice things for either.) But what I found is that your answer was already in the factory service info & Identifix. If you have the time to go back into Identifix and pull up the car again, then type the P2119 into the search bar to pull up results. Go down to service manual diagnostics and click on the P2119 code link. When the sub window opens, you first get a factory wiring diagram. Scroll down past that and it gives you a list of the possible causes and the first thing they tell you is "ATTEMPTING TO PROGRAM PCM WHEN ENGINE COOLANT TEMPERATURE OR INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE ARE OUT OF RANGE." I'm not trying to throw mud in your eye, but let's face it. An open from a disconnected IAT sensor is out of range. I get the frustration of trying to find that info though. Often enough, it's just not in there or, in this case, you have no idea where it's hidden. It's still a good video and keep up the good work.
Good call Shaun. I did not see that in Identifix.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Very well done, that was a tricky diag for sure. If it wasn't for Identifix i don't know what i would do. lol
Yeah Direct- Hit rocks
So true! Such a good tool to add to the arsenal!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I learned a lot from this video. A 2010 Caliber owner.
Thank you 😎👍
Good stuff!
I probably wouldve put the test lamp right on the throttle body connector to test PCM control . Would make a suitable substitute for the throttle body before smoke testing the harness
Hey Christine, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Brilliant brilliant brilliant, very well put together video, one of the best on yt, if not the best
Would you look at that! That would’ve been a head scratcher. Having a diagnostic process, following it through and still having issues. What else could it be right!! (Always variables)
As always thanks for sharing Mike
Ugh yeh, it was a bit of a head scratcher Angel. I'm just glad I was able to get it figured out before throwing another PCM at it.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
So after watching this video I tried spark plugs . Didn’t work. I figured it must be the throttle body like this video concludes, so I skipped the coil packs and replaced the $250 throttle body. Still didn’t work even after calibrating the computer by turning ignition to on and pushing gas pedal. What worked for me was the coil packs. My computer diagnostic was cylinder 1 misfire .
Thank you Mike. Good job. Have a blessed and safe week.
Hey Billy, thanks for watching! Have a great weekend.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Wow I didn't see that coming. Just curious what would of happened if you unplugged it as soon as you seen no signal at the throttle body? Before taking everything apart IAT. That would of been my third step. Clear codes Scoped for control clear codes unplug check control then add a substitute (test light just in case the pcm needs a complete circuit) while checking for control. That would of been my method but I would of never thought of the IAT. That's going in my notes because my memory sucks.thanks for sharing.
Even if that method would of worked I'm glad it went this way because I would of never learned something as critical as that. Again thanks for sharing. It truly helps me tremendously. I've gotten far because of guys like you doing amazing detail and explanation.
Thanks for watching. It is a good lesson to add to the notes. I'd be willing to bet it's not just IATs that can cause this issue on relearns. I'm going to look at all sensors next time I see something like this.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Funny that I found this video after I decided to keep this sensor plugged, just because the computer likes to see all sensors working properly, I have always kept this in mind, unfortunately my issue is a little different than in this video but I believe that the PCM is seeing inconsistencies in the signal return that it decides to shut off the engine after it starts briefly. My case is a start only if I cycle the key after 6-8 seconds and if I hear the fuel pump and the weird noise at the engine that was observed in this video. The fuel pump cycles multiple times and this is the first time I see something where the fuel pump cycles multiple times KOEO.
@10:15 you say.. pcm is not sending a signal to TB. But then you test the TB.
Also,.. I would not apply full power to a TB. They are PWM controlled. The noise might be it eating itself.
Good video. Nice to see non parts changer.
After finishing the video.. I see why ecm was changed so many times.
Would of better been said "we have no signal from pcm, but because it has been changed so many times.. let's continue to look elsewhere".
This would have stumped most people. Got the dealer. Lol
Hey man, thanks for watching! PCM's are good for shutting themselves down when a component has failed. That's why I went to testing the TB.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thanks guys! I watched and learned a bit today. Keep making such a classes. Cheers!
Hey, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video Mike, I have replaced about 50 of those throttle bodys, but never unplug the iat for my testing, just roll the hose out of the way, because I hate messing with those red clips on the connector, good info to know for sure, lucked out and never went down that rabbit hole
Thanks Mike! Ugh those stupid red clips!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Very enjoyable, your approach and getting your point of view over to us, perfect!
Thanks a ton Typey1!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank you Master Mike.
Lesson to "learn normalize all systems before relearn procedure"
Hey Mansour, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Had a Jeep Wrangler with the same code the other day and no throttle response. Checked the powers and grounds and found 1.89 k ohm on one of the ground wires for the throttle position sensor. 5 minutes later I found the problem, the engine bay had been detailed and the detailer spent a lot of time concentrating his pressure cleaner on one of the main harness connectors, it was full of water.
About a foot of the main harness need to be cut out and new wiring and pins put in place as the green death had worked it's way back either side of the connector inside the wiring insulation.... Not fun on a connector with 30 odd pins lol
Woah Jake! Sounds brutal. Water in a harness is never any good!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining I think it was probably easier to diag and fix than a disconnected IAT causing a throttle body not to work ;)
PS, the cheap Chinese scan tool I use most frequently will throw a message during ETC relearn that says conditions not met if any current codes are present during the relearn..... Sometimes budget tools work better than the expensive ones 👍
Great video and great information.Ive done several of these.And tested them the same way but didnt know that the iat had that effect,i just happen to always plug it back in , just habit...please keep the videos coming
Hey Yamar, thanks for watching and commenting!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Impressive step taking. Love this - flats rate beast
I'm working on a 2007 with a 2.4L. Owner fired the parts cannon at the car for approximately six months. One item was a new throttle body. Now I'm wondering if the relearn was performed properly. Thanks for your time and sharing your knowledge.
thats amazing , i would have never guessed it needed the iat during the relearn. thanks for the class
Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video Mike! Do not leave your sensors unplugged. Especially the IAT in this case 😁 Lesson learned. Thanks for sharing 👍
Haha for sure Dylan! I'll never attempt a relearn again without verifying everything is functional.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Excellent video Mike. I thought it was going to need a new pcm too. That's crazy.
Hey Jeremy, lesson leaned on this one :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining What does iat stand for again
Great info. I would have made the mistake of putting in another PCM. This is where service information is soooo very valuable. I feel like its sabotage on the manufactures part to sell more parts.
Thanks for watching! Sabotage may be a little far. I think it's them protecting their assets. Tons of R&D goes into that PCM. IF it were easy to know what was going on in there...it would be easy to reverse engineer for other companies to turn a profit on.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great Video, I had a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.6l would not run unless my foot is on gas pedal but when I put it into a gear it shuts off. So won't idle,won't run in gear. And no codes. I get a little back fire. But I believe you solved my problem.
Hey Jeffrey, thanks for watching! Hope this solved it.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Very good video... I have a 2007 caliber that I am working on now with the same issue... Im going to go out right now and check the throttle body..
Your oil pressure switch comments reminded me of some old points ignition VW's they had an ignition kill switch built into the oil switch
Hey Niall, it makes sense why they did it! No oil pressure;engine must not be running.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I was a VW dealer mechanic back in early 60's/70's.....don't recollect -(at least on any air cooled VW's) any ignition kill switch integrated with the 1 wire block mounted oil pressure switch???? Please enlighten/refresh my old brain....
@@johnbeech2192 Haven't seen one either... 10 +years working whit vw.
@@johnbeech2192 probably vanagons, not worked on many, but I kind of recall two switches on them, one closed on low pressure one closed on high pressure and pretty sure it was for the fuel injection pump systems to not run when engine isn't. rusty memory :)
Very well done video and education.. Actually took me back to my Electronic Classes for a moment.. lol.. Good Video.
Hey A Jones, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
My 2008 Caliber has 245,000 miles on it. This issue has popped up a couple times. The car goes into limp mode. Cleaning the throttle body fixed it every time. This car is still running strong. The high miles and still running strong I thank the 5 speed manual trans.
Hey Dan, that's awesome! Glad that works for you.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Was your car not accelerating ?
@@andreaawalker673 Yes, that is what limp mode stands for. It would not accelerate over 1500 rpms.
excellent ... much needed info... this is stuff we never get enough of thanks ...
Thanks for watching Mike!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
First off great video Mike,thank you for posting! Secondly,I'm going to be honest and say I can't believe the first shop didn't figure out the TB is bad! Why? Well,because of the fact that even if you don't know anything about control, it is still a motor that spins one way, reverse polarity and spins the other...simple as that! Just look up the power and ground for that TB on a wiring diagram.
Thirdly,I thought it's common knowledge that PCMs are smart these days and they will shut off that circuit if a problem is found : clear codes and proceed.
Lastly,I didn't know the IAT has to be plugged in, but I do know it is a vital data PID that the computer is using : like passing an EVAP test, perhaps even on starting by comparing the IAT to the ECT...which should be pretty close temperature wise on cold start...etc.
Another example is when you are trying to run certain tests in " special functions " : the PCM will not allow some of them if the temperature(coolant or IAT) is not between certain values...👍
Nick, thanks for watching! Sometimes things just get overlooked in the shop I suppose. Crazy how that little bugger is used for some many things.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video, Mike! The ETC learn routine should return error code "Conditions not met". Either the scanner reports it as "Passed" anyway, or the PCM actually returns "Passed" instead. Either way, there are basic software errors here plaguing not their creators, but unsuspecting technicians. Quite distressing.
Could not agree more Dmitriy!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Common rushed factory progamming
These new systems operate on pure freeking magicl(PFM) I'm glad I bumped into vid save me some hassle down the road.
Ahhh yes, good ole' PFM Gotta love it Jonathan. Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Fantastic content every day's a school day really appreciate it 👍
Thanks D C! Always an opportunity to learn :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This is just what i needed for my car thank you
Thanks for watching Carol!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
At least it has new coils,probably needed new ones anyway,says the last guy.nice catch!
"Maintenance" hahah! Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
KOEO the throttle will not move when you apply the accelerator pedal. You have to first go into "ETC Follower Test" under system tests. Then it'll allow you to control the throttle KOEO.
Really enjoying the new videos, btw. I remember watching the early Wells videos with the army dude ages ago when I was in school. I'm happy you went with videos aimed at more, real world diagnostics.
Hey E Urban, thanks! Yeh the "army dude" needed to go away ;)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Nice work! Great video, as always. I've always thought of the electronic throttle bodies being too sensitive to just hook up power and ground to them to see if they work. Thanks for sharing that.
I can see the IAT sensor thing burning just about anyone. What I can't see is a code for the TB but the shop putting in two PCM's. Any good old parts changer with a code reader may have fixed this car. Throttle body code? Install new throttle body. Put back together and start it up. Fixed. Would have had a high idle and just needed an idle relearn at the end.
Hey, thanks!! Yeh, i'm not exactly sure how two PCM's ended up in there...not the way I would have done things. But, that's probably why it ended up by me in the end.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
It is also important to thoroughly read the factory dtc information. It states the IAT has to be functioning properly when performing the relearn.
"NOTE: Engine coolant temperature must be between 5° C (41° F) and 110° C (230° F), intake air temperature must be greater than 5° C (41° F), and battery voltage must be greater than 10 voltswhen performing the ETC Relearn function. If these parameters are not met during the relearn process, this DTC may set."
Ah hah! You found the information that I overlooked. Nice!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
En français SVP
Great step by step. Best videos out there.
Thanks Mike :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
2009 Dodge Caliber - I have a ETC warning light. My mechanic changed the throttle and programed it - but has not fixed the issue. I will get him to verify the new throttle is opening - check the OHMs of the new throttle and then try a relearn with the IAT. If this fixes my car... I will just be so excited. Goes in tomorrow morning.
Hey Maria, hope it fixes it!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great case study Mike. Keep em coming
Thanks for watching Mark!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thanks alot you saved the day. My friend caliper was not running because ait was off while doing a relearn
Thanks for the video this helped me alot!! Just replaced my ETB, I think there should be a part about manual Throttle leaning for us who dont have the computers!
Thanks for watching Harrison, glad the video helped!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great Video, Mike. Thanks for sharing the information and procedure.
Thank you Jim! I assume there is more than one "Jim Morton" out there. Are you the trainer, Jim? Is this your ignition waveform book I have sitting here on my desk? :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Very meticulas very well professionally done!
Thank you very much Mario!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
IAT is very important when it comes to the density of the air, comparing it to an oil pressure sensor isn't even close. This is why I remove the sensor from the ducting and leave it plugged in. Great video though.
Thanks for this advance diagnostic. Great job.
Well done mike this was a great video. Very interested all the circuits like IAT needs to be connected during relearn programming I would of never guessed that. I’ll keep that in mind now.. good job ... Jay
Hey Jay, thanks!!! Yeh, i'll never forget to check to make sure that dumb IAT is connected!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Absolutely...Great info to know. Wow.!
Thank you so much for putting this out there Mike. That would have been a typical WT? moment. Lol.
Cheers Buddy!
Hey dude, thanks!!! Yeh it was a WTF moment...that's why I thought it beneficial to share with you guys. Have a good week!
Excellent diagnostic process.
Great video Mike, good gut feeling 👍
Great information! Thanks for sharing 👍
Gotta trust the gut!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Amazing videos my man! Keep it up!
Thank you James!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
That was some good diagnosis and very informative even though I don't own one of those cars. Who knows this might be the same procedure on other vehicle with electronic throttle body?
Hey Pete, it's a good lesson to apply to any cars :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Wow man didn't see that coming, So interesting, Thank u very much.
Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
These are notorious for TB and TPS issues, on mine I replaced them both, had a issue with a lightning bolt on dash coming on, replaced TB again, same issue, code that was thrown had to do with the transmission sensor, had dealer look at it and they reset it and that didn’t fix it, after some research and checking ended up being a bad cam sensor so I replaced both and never had any issues after that
Hey Dylan, yeh i've heard that now. Interesting how they can have such a rash of TB issues. Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Another food for thought post to add here: the force the TB return spring makes, it is relatively constant between throttle body rest position and 100%. So the makers could not make a direct relationship between TB motor torque and % opening. Because if that would be the case, you would have seen proportional voltage control. Instead, they relied on fast PWM motor control, which has also the advantage to keep the IGBTs cool, if you actually measure, you will see the PWM in order of kHz, is a constant, between 0% to 100% at steady rpm. You can try this with the bi-directional control of the scan tool. Therefore, the TPS, two of them, are also critical in this application, as they were sitting down in a risk assessment study, usually a HAZID, discussing the design and how many fatalities per mile per year, what is acceptable in the industry and public perception. If you ever have the chance to attend one of these risk assessments sessions, at NGK, go for it, it will be interesting. So coming back to TPS, one of the solutions to the risks identified, was to put 2 TPS, supplied from 2 separate 5V reference voltages. If you try to disconnect both TPS, you will find another ECU strategy, which is kill the engine and store faultcode TB motor control failure - forced engine stop. It is safer to have a stopped engine that an full power running engine.
I will have to see about attending on of those risk assessments. Thanks for commenting!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
The freaking IAT has to be plugged in!?!?! Gee thanks dodge/chrysler, wtf. Gotta love their crap wiring diagrams too. Great vid man, also liked seeing a technican use ohms law, very good stuff.
Hey man, thanks for watching! We all use Ohm's law, many just don't realise they are using it :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
👍Excellent work! Thanks for sharing. Last I checked with my parts guy, that's a high volume part😀. Junk. Seems like it has more spring return in it than necessary. Maybe that's why so many fail?
Hey James, thanks!!! Interesting, sure that may play into it.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
sounds like Snapon needs to add a note to the relearn menu to include something like "Please Reconnect the IAT".
Haha for sure! Or maybe, "ensure IAT is plugged in"
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Yeah right snap-on is also learning they are happy for tech like Mike for helping them enhancing there scantool
I would check first ecm + , - ,signals at the ecm connector than wiring continuity from ecm to throttle connector before taking off throttle assembly.
Ismar, what happens when the PCM doesn't supply power or ground because it's shut itself off? Happens all the time and could lead you astray.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining well Mike I had that situation two times.One on the 99 pathfinder where pcm stuck in to the limp mode due to fried throttle motor control drivers and pcm has been replaced and second on titan with pcm in limp mode due to acc.pedal sensor issue.as soon as I disconnect plug from the sensor pcm come back to function (pcm has separated from affected circuit).in this particular case whoever work on cars professionally should be aware of weak throttle assy escpecially on chrysler,jeep products.every case study and diagnose is separate story with different variables.anyways this was proper diag and i really like your methodical approach to the particular problem.cheers!!!
great info and your step by step on the problem
Hey Gary, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor