Electric Wheelchair Motor Test & Brake Removal by VOGMAN
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ต.ค. 2016
- Electric Wheelchair Motor Test & Brake Removal - Testing a 24v DC Invacare electric wheelchair motor, looking at the wiring, the safety brake and eventual removal of the brake.
Most wheelchair motors have a safety brake that locks the motor in case of power loss. Whilst essential in wheelchair use, when the motor is used for other applications the wiring can be confusing. I bought an Invacare 24 volt motor from eBay but found it had 4 wires rather than the two I initially expected. That's because the brake is electric and needs disabling or powering for safe use of the motor. Hopefully this video will give you all the information you need to achieve either.
I cover this topic briefly on my website here:
www.vegoilguy.co.uk/wheelchair...
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You make electronics look easy to a newbie like myself...you are probably the best explainer in the world...just like darling, probably..lol. I’m a loyal subscriber!
I stumbled across your video by accident, I'm using the same motors for an RC Lawnmower project, thank you for sharing you've saved me hours of research!
Glad it helped 😁
Thanks! I have just been given a whole set up and wish to build a simple Locomotive using them! The brakes are off TOMORROW!!
Lots of Love
David and Lily.
That's great. Enjoy!
: )
You are the best. I am making a radio controlled lawn mower from an old electric wheel chair I got for free, and I couldn't figure out what the other 2 pins were for next to the red and black. I pulled out some bits, and the motors are working great now. Thanks again!
Nice one Matt. Did you ever see my RC Lawnmower? th-cam.com/video/-ezH92dfZqQ/w-d-xo.html
Just what I was looking for! Thanks for sharing! Repurposing a few motors for a RC lawnmower.
Me too. Have you looked into Ardumower?
It was very informative, without this video I would have gotten in a power of trouble. Thanks Jeff.
Glad it helped
Those are Nice motors with over 300lbs of torque!!!
Useful video. I have a couple of these motors and am hoping to use one of them to power a ball mill, the slow speed and power of the motor should be ideal.
Thanks Russell. I'm sure these motors will suit your needs. They have loads of power.
Obviously they are built to drive wheelchairs and as such are generally a high standard. Second hand already they've served a good purpose but still have plenty more to give : )
Good luck with your project.
Geoff
Great Video !!! I am getting ready to repurpose the exact motors for a track robot... Thank you for a great Video !!!!
Glad to help : )
Good luck with your project
thanks man helped me today
Did you by any chance check the amperage draw with and without the brake? Thank you.
Hi VogMan, great video! i'm working on a similar project that uses an electric scooter motor that has an electric brake attached to it. I'm facing some issue with getting the motor to spin. Currently i'm only connecting the motor wires to a motor driver and supplying it with power. However my motor is unable to run. Do i need to connect the electric brake wires even if i do not use it?
Thank you. I'm trying to make a cart for my toolbox and power it with motors of the same brand. I thought the 4 wires were because they are 4 pole motors. I'm trying to figure out how to wire I up myself because it will be used in a different configuration and the electronics are bad.
Extremely helpful. I'm using a pair of similar motors for a project and they weren't working right, but I had no idea there was a brake in them. Removing the brakes first thing in the morning! Thanks for the video.
Glad I could help Jason : )
Hi Geoff, I'm using the motor to raise a lid on a spa , if I wish to keep the brake available is all I need to do is make sure when I put 24v power onto the motor to spin it that I apply 24v to the brake wires and when power is dis-connected the brake is applied, is ths correct. Thank you
Nice bit of information,I have two electric chairs and one three wheel scooter i got for free .the three wheeler I added larger back tires and it is significantly faster .I know that what I did is hard on the brakes and I'm looking for a alternative way to brake.,but if I eliminate the emergency brake will that freak out the on board computer and out it in limp mode .thank you.
Do these have all metal gears inside? No plastic. I am wanting to use one to power a shallow water well sucker rod up and down.
Hello! Thanks for sharing. Very useful. 👍
Glad it was helpful!
What is the stall current for motor like this at 24V?
I’ve got several of these, but the motor armatures are exceptionally short. Without the gearing assembly, it’s near impossible to attach sprockets or gears to them. Suggestions?
its sounds stupidly simple once you know but untill you do this video is a godsend!!!
😁
Great video, but would be greater if you add the voltages, ampereres, watts, horsepower, ohms, etc. Also, make your sideline comments twice bigger to read and leave them on for twice as long. Thank you for the video as i learned a lot from it.
Thanks for the very helpful video.I was going to get some to make a remote control lawn mower i.e. added to a 6hp petrol mower.. Do you think it will it work of 12v only? I was looking at a 24v invacare motor for a mirage - supposedly 4mp and carries 16stone but is only 180w. Most projects seem to use 250w. IfI could use 12v it would save the weight and cost of another battery and make the controllers cheaper
I used two of these motors to power tank tracks, driving an RC lawnmower. th-cam.com/video/-ezH92dfZqQ/w-d-xo.html
These motors are more than powerful enough for that, though I don't think they could power the blade. I left that to a petrol engine.
Amazing! Thank you so much! This was very helpful, as I'm selling one and need to test them? My buyer sent me to you! TY
thanks for your upload - is that the maximum speed the rotor spins around ? i was planning somehow to use a mobility motor to power up a kayak ...
This was a half voltage test so you can bank on it spinning around twice as fast, but I still don't think it sounds right for you. Mobility type motors tend to be slow spinning and high torque. You could gear up to the speed, but by then you'll have lost all real turning force. That's my thinking... but I could be wrong : )
Thank you sir, kindly give information that how to remove the motor from the gearbox, I have one, It is same your model that showing in the video, but I did not see any screws that connecting motor and gearbox,
Thank you sir. Unfortunately I've never tried to dismantle the gearbox so I really don't know.
Thanks very much for posting. If you have data on max RPM and torque, can you please include in your description.
Thanks Marc. I'm sorry to say I don't have that information... pity I know.
Thanks!
Thank you 😁
Thank you
Thanks 😁
I enjoy your video's do you know a way I can get the 24 volts dc to power it for a left to left very havey stuff or is the reduction not good enough to handle 600 pwonds sorry for the bad spelling .
Thanks for the kind comments. Wheelchair motors are very strong. They have to be to carry people around. But one motor moving 600 pounds would be difficult. Even two might struggle.
24 volts is easy enough - car batteries. There are many 24v car batteries available, or you could use two 12 volt batteries.
Depending on would you are doing, you could gear them down further.
Hope this helps : )
Geoff
thankyou
Thank you for the video. I just bought an odd build of electric art vehicle that utilizes a mobility chair motor as a drive motor. I get no response when mains are connected to a 12 volt power source. There are four wires that are high much smaller. I am going to tear into soon and was wondering if knew why this motor has four wires going into the electric brake housing? Any insight is greatly appreciated. This is unfamiliar territory using a converted mobility chair motor.
Four wires MIGHT mean it's a brushless motor...
What motor was this?
Hi Jeff, i just got a couple eletric wheelchair motors for a remote controlled robot project... Do i really have to deactivate the breaks on them, Or can i just use the way they are?
Good videos
Thanks in advance
Hi Flavio. If you do keep the brakes, you'll need to make sure they are correctly powered and working... if you don't do this, you could damage your motors. Personally I would recommend removing these brakes unless you can see an advantage to keeping them. Removal if very simple and it's one less thing to worry about : )
VegOilGuy will do... Thanks a lot!
Hi again Jeff.... Have a question for you, hopefully you gonna be able to help me. I removed the breakers from both motors and test them (they're working just fine), but when i connected everything to the batteries, control module, motors and controler, the motors don't start, just my controler startes beeping and flashing all 9 LED's. I downloaded The manual, and it pointed that "the part breaks have a bad connection" , what do you think i should do? Do you think has something to do with the motor breake?
I am working with a Pride- Jazzy Select 14.
Thanks again sir
Hi Flavio. The last thing I want to do is steer you wrong on a matter I have no knowledge of. A quick search produced this video - th-cam.com/video/59DNyGYkW3A/w-d-xo.html - I admit I haven't watched it, but it's encouraging to know other people are out there doing the same thing as you. If the video doesn't help, maybe you could drop the author a line...?
Hope this helps mate.
I have a similar motor. When I removed the brake and tested it at 12V, it is only consuming 0.1A of power. That seems minimal for the function it provides so I'm leaning toward keeping it.
What I don't understand is why are there separate wires in the connector for brakes? They could've merged the motor and brake wires together. Am I missing something? Are brakes to be powered on 12V and motor on 24V?
I'm wondering if my powerchair would still be able to ship reasonably if I removed the brakes from the motors
so is it correct to say that varying the voltage beneath 24v affects the travel speed? how low of a voltage does it still function at?
I'm surprised that a wheelchair motor consumes under 80 watts. I thought these things are supposed to push a 500lb american up hills.
Wheelchair motors have to be good. They serve a vital function. Low power usage means they can keep doing their job for longer. They tend to be very well geared and sturdily made : )
How much weight can these move
I have a Jazzy 600 power chair and I want to disable the left and right turn ability of the motors. I’m using the electronics to push a heavy cart forward and back. I don’t want to use casters to steer it. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Hi Sam. I'll be honest the chair isn't known to me, so all I have to go on is a quick internet search.
So you only want FORWARD & BACKWARD - so no left or right?
I guess it depends how much of the original chair you want to keep.
It looks from the images I've seen that it's a one-hand joystick control.
To avoid any complexities, whether I was stripping down the chair or not, I think I'd be tempted to keep all the electronics as is. To prevent accidental left / right steer, I think I'd overlay a simple face-plate with a slot in it, which would restrict the directional movement of the joystick. This might not be very high tech, but it's very easy and as neat as you want it to be.
Tapping into an existing circuitboard can often be tricky as manufacturer will generally combine all functions in a very small board. This makes identifying motors controllers, direction controls, etc very tricky. I'm not sure I'd want to try.
And if you're scrapping the manufacturers circuitboard in favour your own circuitry, then a new motor controller is a must.
These videos of mine may help a little :
RC for beginners - th-cam.com/video/qKCFuFdKG_Y/w-d-xo.html
Reverse polarity switching - th-cam.com/video/PoqTNxCDUGg/w-d-xo.html
I hope this helps a little : )
Geoff
Hi just found your site .....fantastic I would like to power a fishing trolley , I'm an engineer but I wary about electrics , I think I can sort out everything except the principle of switches and converters etc I'm probably blowing hot air can you help me ?
Hi Norman. I'm no expert but I managed to persuade these motors to power caterpillar tracks on a RC Lawnmower. If I can help, I will... but I can't make promises : )
What's your issue?
Hi again Norman. I've tried replying to your email a couple of times now and it keeps rejecting. I've just noticed a spelling difference in your name here... I'll give it another go. But if you get nothing, you may need to email me again : )
thanks for this useful video ,can you tell me what is motor name please
Mine are made by Invacare but there's many makes out there : )
I know it is not advisable to remove the brakes from a wheelchair or mobility scooter for obvious safety reasons. However, I would like to use the motors (without brakes), along with the control box and joystick from an old mobility scooter for a DIY project that has no safety concerns. However, I suspect that the scooter controller will sense a fault because the brakes are removed and will not let the motors operate. Is there an easy way to trick the controller into thinking the brakes are there and functioning? Would simply tying the two wires together that go to the brake do the trick? Any suggestions are welcomed. Thanks.
Hi @holmesoutdoors4574, Great question! I am worried about the same issue. Did you manage to find a solution?
hi would the brake cause the wheel chair to run out of juice it only goes about 5 miles before charge
Hi Garry. Firstly if this is about an actual wheelchair then DON'T mess with the brakes... I'd hate to be the cause of any nasty accidents. If you're looking for more mileage on an existing wheelchair your answer could well lie with batteries... battery technology has improved dramatically in the past few years. Different batteries or maybe even additional batteries could dramatically improve things for you.
To answer the question, I never really proved the brake is an electromagnet... I just guessed it was on the basis of a very quick look. Basic electromagnets are very thirsty in terms of power. Ever make one from a nail as a kid? I did. The battery died within a couple of minutes as it's basically just a coil shorting the battery out.
Again I would guess IF it is an electromagnet then it's hopefully a little more sophisticated than that. Indeed the wires that powered mine were pretty slim, suggesting little power consumption.
So all I can do for you, my friend, is speculate. IF it's an electromagnet, I would imagine that this would certainly draw additional power from the batteries.
If not on a wheelchair and not really required, it's safe and easy to cut them away as I did. Otherwise, as I said above, there's safer solutions.
Hope this helps.
Geoff
thanks russell keep upthe great videos
I want to build an electric motor powered cart to haul several hundred pounds. Would one of these motors work well? I am very new to this so can I just attach a sprocket and chain to attach to motor to the axle? Can I email some questions?
Hi John. One of these motors, probably not. Two, very likely, especially if geared down. This would slow the cart to a gentle walking pace but give you more torque. Tracks like these might also help with grip - th-cam.com/video/VRMcSF6l7qE/w-d-xo.html
Of course you can email me questions.... I just can't promise to have all the answers. I'm no expert after all : )
Contact me via my website and we can then exchange emails securely (avoiding spam). www.vegoilguy.co.uk/contact_me.php
Yoo!
So what happens inside wheelchair motors which have levers on them? Got one which allows a "push" mode.
edit: i should probably confirm that it's a big red lever on the back, where the brake it. Not near the gearbox
If it allows a push mode that would mean that when you move the lever it takes the motor out of gear and disengages it. But yeah I'm an electrical engineer not a mechanical so idk what goes on inside.
hi. I bought 2 whellchair motors but they only work with original controller box. If i conncet them without controller, only direct to 24 battery, they are not working normally with 120 rpm. Maybe should I remove the brake?
Are you sure it's not a brushless motor? These are more common now and require a dedicated control box...
@@vogman They are normal wheelchair motors. I just removed the electric brakes and it seems now they are spinning with normal rpms when connecting direct to battery.
hello..! can you tell me where to buy these kind of motors?
Hi Asif. I found mine on eBay. Just look for Wheelchair Motors : )
I have to ask my jazzy right side hesitates to move you think it could be the brake sticking
Sticking? Interesting...
Motors usually either work or the don't, so the sticking suggests something else. It could be the brake, yes. It could also be a loose connection at some point or dirty / old brushes.
Hope this helps : )
Yeah it acteds like it stuck in don't want to go the motor don't get hot it's seems like it's get stuck it some time the light blinks two red lights but when u rock seat it comes back on I checked all the wires what happens if dirt or car hair get by the motor it does seem like the brake is on but I love the level up in,down
my pride gogo traveller elite has new batteries and it can run for hours but get on a steep grade or hill and it becomes such a load that the circuit breaker shuts down the whole scooter and we have to reach down and reset it, and walk the scooter up the hill. very discouraging. what can i do to solve this. if i can replace the motor to solve this it will be simple i think. any
help is appreciated...thanks
Sounds like a torque issue to me, though I'm no expert... it's important you know that.
Right now I'm having a similar issue with a motor I'm using as a hoist. It used to work fine but these days it struggles a little. Everything seems in order with it and on power something less heavy it runs very happily (a bit like you on level ground and then on steep incline).
Two obvious choices come to mind for us both... a new, stronger motor, or gearing.
I'm probably going to go with gearing. Something simple like a 4:1 ratio reduction will quarter the speed but give me four times more torque... so it should pull with greater strength.
I'm not sure that solution would work for you as it would slow you down on the level as well... so you might want to look at a motor with more torque.
Hope this helps.
k...thanks
I was on my way Home from the Market and all the sudden the Motor on the right Side Stoped , Do you Think it's the Brake ?
It look's like it want's to Move
Hi Dennis. It's impossible for me to be sure without being there, but it does sound like the brake.
I believe the default setting for these motors is brakes-on. This is a safety feature... if the power fails on a steep hill, for instance, it's better for a wheelchair to brake than freewheel.
However the brake itself might not be the problem. It could be an electrical connection... as the connection fails, the safety brake does it's job.
Sorry I can't be more helpful.
Yeah I was thinking it was the brake Myself, And VegOilGuy I would Like to Thank You for the Reply Back to me
No problem Dennis. I'm always happy to try and help : )
test the ohms in the break circuit it should read 30-60 ohms
I think that's right but there are videos on testing the break circuit on these motors
just look up wheel chair breaks
👍
: )
I am an inventor I think you got some brilliant ideas why don't you invent something I think you'll be good attic
Thanks Andrew : )
Thank you for writing back to me you are a brainy person I am the inventor who wrote to you you want to do some more videos your videos are very interesting I am doing another invention coul and I was stuck with the invention so I watch your videos and you got me out of the situation I was in and you want to do some inventions you'll be good at