Melee is a Competitive Masterpiece.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ส.ค. 2024
- When it comes to competitive fighting games, there aren't many that can assume the title as a true masterpiece. To say the least, the legacy this game holds is one worthy of an entire lifetime. Today we'll dive into a true masterpiece of competitive gaming with an analysis of the fan-favorite Smash game: Melee for the Nintendo Gamecube. I hope you enjoy!
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- Credit to Geoff Smash Music for the Music at the end of the video:
• The Rest is History
- Credit to David V. Kimball for some of the background footage seen in this video:
• Super Smash Bros. Mele...
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Thanks for watching!!
![[TH] VALORANT Champions Seoul - Grand Final - EDG vs TH](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/WvObMc9VelI/mqdefault.jpg)
Who cares if this isn't the first vid on the topic. No legendary tale is told just once.
Agreed!
Yepp :D
It keeps life flowing through the collective body of Smash.
Best quote I've ever read.. bravo.
H-holy Cr*p
A lot of people don't personally participate in competitive melee, but love spectating it
I watched melee for 6 years before booting up my first game online.
@@FlamingZelda3 Great that you mention that, youtube videos like this one and watching live tournaments are actually what got me started playing melee online 7 years ago.
@@FlamingZelda3 Slippi is probably the most critical factor in extending this game's life for at least another 20 years. Before melee was kinda inaccessible; you needed a CRT (try finding one easily today), a copy of Melee (or just go the pirate route ofc), a Gamecube controller (also hard to find, you can also b0xx if you wanted), a Gamecube/Wii, and most critically you needed to find other weirdos with the same items and who are as interested in playing a 20 year old children's party game as you. Now, your only requisite is having a computer built sometime after the year 2012 and an internet connection.
@@queuedjar4578 or you know ,Wii+gcn controller+game+ go to a local.
@@FlamingZelda3 Still need a CRT, and if you're in a Melee drought region like me, there simply isn't any locals around, so you need to find those weirdos.
The quality of this video is pretty incredible for a channel of this size. This straight up felt like a mini documentary, good work. Also that montage at the end was sick.
thank you so much. hearing such nice comments is absolutely driving me to keep making videos and only practice more. very appreciated!!
The song too!
honestly, I wouldn’t be able to explain why I this game means so much to me so I wouldn’t mind having an updated portfolio of ideas I get to share with people whenever it becomes the talk. Atleast thats the fictional scenario in my head that I dream up, haven’t actually ever been asked about melee and more so overshared out of the blue LMAO either way, I think it’s a worthy pursuit if people add something new to the conversation or even update older ideas and concepts
@@tkyo bro the song was fire!
Nicely done! Really entertaining watch!
thank you walt! I'm very glad it was a good watch for you! :D
Yo, nice video! I'm always glad to see someone making a new Melee intro video. There are a few things I wanted to correct, whether for your own knowledge or anyone just reading the comments:
-Hungrybox and Armada did not play in grand finals of Evo 2014, Mango won that year's tournament over Hungrybox
-Evo 2013 was not actually Nintendo's first time interfering negatively with the competitive Melee scene. They stifled tournament growth as early as the MLG era/golden age.
-Axe has never used Falco as a counterpick for Sheik or Falcon specifically, currently his only real counterpick character is Fox vs Jigglypuff
-Mango is actually quite far from the most technical Melee player. He was known for many years to refuse implementing ledgedash and shield drop into his gameplay
-I have to assume this was written before the Smash World Tour 2022 shutdown that Nintendo just did a few weeks ago because they are absolutely not any more at peace with the competitive scene
That all said, I really do mean it when I say this was a good video. I'd be glad to watch more Melee content from you in the future!
True. Mango technicality isn't the best. He's just the most creative player and that's why people love to watch him play
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849 Melee gameplay is top notch and has much better movement than traditional fighting games :P
@@AlxandreNotavo Nope it's a broken buggy game that is played in the most unfun ways by it's fanbase.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849 That's where u are wrong kiddo. It's one of the most fast paced competitive games out there. Thanks to the gameplay freedom it has It is more related to something like Quake 3 than it is to the borefest that is Street Fighter; see how i don't even mention Ultimate and other smash entries? because they are trash. Only 64 is decent. All the others are way too simple and i don't even know why people play it competitively since nintendo removed all the technicality from them.
Nintendo is not quite yet at peace with melee
Yeah... Nintendo and Blizzard are by far the worst large gaming companies nowadays.
Quality of the video was soo good, i pretty much knew all this info already but amazing recap and awesome video, keep up the great work!!
Will do! thank you for the positive feedback :D
Even if I already know everything about the game, the way you edited your video and was capable of explaning many things in less than 30 min is incredible ! Very good work :) !!
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
Amazing documentary! One small tiny little nitpick is that you mentioned Sheik prefers stages without platforms when talking about stage counter picks. Sheik actually looooves platforms generally and FD is one of the strongest counterpicks agaisnt her. Other than that great video!
Sick video! There can never be enough melee minidocs.
There are a few factual inaccuracies/outdated statements and some subjective things stated as consensus when they are not, but nothing is egregious. Looking forward to more videos like this!
Thank you! I definitely can completely agree with you that some points are a little rough on the edges, but I'm very glad you could still enjoy, thanks for watching ! :D
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849real
@@JohnathanWilliamson849???
@@notreallyabackup Melee players are known for being smelly and for what they do to children.
"New players like aMSa" 😶
went to the comments just for this
Nice video but sheik absolutely does not want stages without platforms in most matchups
Yeah she only wants it in really strong matchups, because she makes some characters completely helpless rofl
It brings a tear to my eye :,) great vid and its been such a great journey this game has been on
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
Great video! You can tell a lot of work was put into this and I love reliving the tale of Melee
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849 weird reply lol. Stop digging around the comments of TH-cam videos to reply to a bunch of people 8 months later.
@@Jayluna98 melee is a dead game for men who think they are women and people who touch kids.
first time I've seen an essay from a channel with under 1k subs who can maintain very clear and distinct line delivery off the bat. fantastic job I will be here for all your future uploads
This means so much to me to hear, thank you so much for your feedback!! :D
It's actually so crazy how Melee just keeps on going and going despite its age and a plethora of hardships. It's this resilience that leads me to believe that the game will continue to prosper for many years to come.
14 likes after 4 months
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849why are you here man? Lol
@@josephbilderback4549 to tell melee fans that the truth.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849 Ok
long live melee :) ever since i started playing the game competitively, i've fallen in love with how deep the tech skill is, the entertaining and satisfying gameplay to both execute and watch, as well as the awesome community behind this amazing game. def my fave video game of all time
Very well done video. Its actually wild to me that a game like Melee even exists to begin with. Its been said to death but it truly is a happy accident and while it does sadden me that Sakurai has changed his views and perspective on how he wants to take the series and lessen the skill gap, regardless of how anyone views the dude, he made an incredibly fun in depth game and an incredible franchise in general. What really keeps me coming back to Melee though is the movememnt options. it just opens up so many possibilities in neutral and combos. It really gives players that freedom of expression you dont quite get in its predecessor or successors.
I did have one disagreement though in your video and that was your view on the tiers. I definitely dont think its universally agreed upon that only 9 characters are unviable. I think if you ask most top players in fact they'd probably say around half the cast or less is potentially competitively viable. There's very few top players at all that are saying Ganon, Dk, and the links are capable of winning majors (Im sure they exist but are definitely the minority I feel). Hell Im sure many would even argue Mario (the character you put in the unviable category) is better than most if not all those characters I mentioned, I know I certainly would. Finally you put Yoshi and Pika in the "potential to win" category but not icies depsite them never winning a major and pika has won one and Yoshi has won two? That seems odd to me, especially since Yoshi is a better character than they are (at least imo). Icies definitely dont deserve to be in the same category as the top/high tiers, not by a long shot.
I also personally dont think peach even deserves to be in the same category as the top 6 (Fox, Marth, Falco, Sheik, Puff, and Falcon). Her matchup spread against the top tiers are pretty iffy. She loses pretty definitively to Fox and Marth, loses slightly to Sheik and Falcon, loses horrendously to Puff (its at least 65-35 puff favored), and maybe goes even With Falco if we're being generous. Even Yoshi has an arguably better matchup spread than she does and thus debatabley a better character than her. He likely goes even with two of the top tiers and doesn't have a matchup worse than 6-4. Honestly though its just a minor thing, didn't ruin the video for me at all but I thought id put my perspective out there.
I can definitely see the case you're makin with everything about the tiers; I mainly put icies up there in the high tier category just because of the results they've seen in the past with some players being able to make it to very high results with them; that was my sort of mindset with the icies tbh which don't get me wrong is definitely up for debate still where they stand. and with the Yoshi, Pika point you bring up too that also makes sense to say, for them I put them in the potentially viable just because I do feel like Yoshi and Pika are carried pretty heavily by a small pool of players making them super good; so that was my mentality for that choice. And when it comes to ganon, dk, and the links I can actually agree with what you said that that's a pretty controversial placement for them; so overall I definitely agree with what you're saying here. Thanks for the input! and thanks for watching too! appreciate the different perspective
@Dragonlope im confused where you're getting this idea that I thought Icies were "way worse". I only said that I thought Yoshi was the better character overall. I think Icies are still a good character, just that I dont think they deserve to be in the same tier as say Fox or Marth. My opinion actually has nothing to do with recency bias. Ive held the position Yoshi is better than ice climbers even before Amsa ever won a major with the character. I just think Icies matchup spread is more iffy and suspect compared to Yoshi's. Ive never held the position though Yoshi is "way better".
Your argument about top level representation also confuses me. Almost none of those top level Icies even play anymore and/or retired. Slug is the only player in the current meta carrying the character on their back to success and most of those other icies mentioned played during the era when Yoshi was considered a bad character and his meta was insanely under developed. Amsa being the sole top level Yoshi doesnt surprise me at all. Hes a very difficult character to play at top level, possibly even the most difficult character to play in melee (yes even more so than the spacies).
Top level representation shouldn't even matter anyways. There's a wide variety of reasons characters are under represented, it doesn't necessarily mean they're "worse". What matters is a characters toolkit and their results. Puff is also under represented but most agree she's top 5.
"I also personally don't think Peach even deserves to be in the same category as the top 6"
That's not ridiculous. That's not ridiculous to say that! Honestly a legit claim, even though I love Peach. Yoshi might take her place tbh
take a shower and stop playing games made for children.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849 your bait is not very impressive
Stumbled on this masterpiece of a video, thank you!
no problem! and thank you for watching! :D
1:00 you say Hbox won Evo 2014 grand finals but Mang0 won Evo 2014
That's a huge mistake lol
28:42 “new players like yoshi main aMSa” ahahaha
Yeah I heard that and was like “hol up…do people not remember Kings of Cali 4?” aMSa has been passing out smoke for almost a decade now.
I thought I heard that wrong at first lol I had to replay it.
I can't wait for more people to find this game. Our community is producing some of the most well made and best informed content i've ever seen. On top of us now having the best online/lag free mp experience of any smash game. I think melee in the coming year has potential to be huge.
This video was amazingly well made. Keep it up dude!
Will do! I’m super glad you enjoyed, thank you very much!
Take a shower
Some nitpicks- character matchups are not super set in stone, just like tier lists, stadium isfrozen mostly because of slippi (it's not a unoversal decision), and Mango being the most technical? That's debatable or sure but great video, was a fun watch!
Absolutely goated vid. I’m just starting to get into the melee scene and this is a perfect intro to the game for newcomers.
I just clicked on the video, but Im already excited because of the Raskulls profile pic. Exquisite taste.
Mang0 and being the most technical are 2 things I never expected to be said in the same sentence
Good vid though ;)
Great video man! Been getting into smash recently and it’s been enjoyable watching videos like these
2:33 "bruh get tf off me I wanna hug this other dude smh"
I absolutely aspire to be able to make content like this. Love it. Keep working man!
thank you! I absolutely will! input like this is insanely appreciated. I'm glad you could enjoy!
@@tkyo of course my friend!
Great video! I started playing because of EVO 2016 and while HBox isn't quite my favorite player anymore, it's nice seeing him play well today.
Well done. This story is worth being told and retold.
Edit: can you credit me please? You used some clips from my videos. 😊
absolutely! apologies for forgetting to do so originally. Thank you very much as well!
@@tkyo you're welcome! Love seeing the use of the HD assets.
Very cool video! The tier list presented is debatable and some argument can be said for pretty much every single fighting game, but still great job!
Great video, yeah the topic has been talked about before but you presented it in a fresh way.
"jigglypuff is notoriously the lightest character in the game"
actually, pichu is the lightest character in the game (55 weight), puff is tied second with game and watch (60 weight)
28:10 didn't age quite so well lmao
The production quality of this video is a masterpiece.
thank you so much! :D
TH-cam algorithm puttin in work. Bringing me here to find this excellent video.
Please continue to make videos that are this high quality! This is in depth, thoughtful, and greatly edited. You've made a great piece of content that will hopefully be watched for as long as Melee has been competitive.
Thank you so much for the kind words, this really means a lot to me!! I most certainly will!
This was a great video! As someone who's been around the scene for 8 years I want to give some of my thoughts.
1. Stages- I don't think other videos that are explaining the appeal of melee to a new audience have focused on stages before. I think it was great you brought it up. When I watch a tournament I'm always excited for certain stages for certain players. For Amsa's Yoshi I look forward to Yoshi’s Story where I can see his platform movement at its best.
2. Technical aspects - Some techniques have had so much more relevance just in the past 4-8 years than ever in the years prior. I'm pretty sure shield dropping was considered just a niche technique until 2018 then I remember some sets with Mang0 and I don't remember who where there was a lot of shield dropping and Mang0 was finding ways to call out when the guy would shield drop and we found it so hype. Now in 2022 that's just normal play.
Characters - No one has won a tournament with Falco in the past 5 years except Mang0. I don't know if that means he isn't top 3, but in modern melee it feels like he's like Jigglypuff where only one player actually has a chance to win a tournament with that character. Compare that to Fox, Sheik (solo or dual main), and Marth where multiple players have won or made Grand Finals with them in the past 5 years.
Man really just re-narrated the smash documentary in a condensed fashion
Great video. Just a couple things I want to mention are that there isn't really an "official" melee tier list. It's all based on community votes, so it isn't at all objective. Same goes for the matchup chart, but I don't think you ever claimed it was official. Also, jigglypuff had rest back in Smash 64 as well, and it was actually an even better move due to how easy it was to combo into it thanks to the insane amount of hitstun in the game and lack of regular DI. Another thing is that AMSA is by no means a new player, he's been a notable player since at least 2013. He has just (relatively) recently seen major success at the highest level. Other than those few things overall a very well-done video.
Was not expecting to hear Geoff at the end, a welcome surprise
Who knew that a mix of glitches and unintentional mechanics would make such a great game
based
A lot of melee tech is actually intended mechanics, they're just used in unintentional ways. L Canceling (or Z canceling) was referred to as "Smooth Landing" in Smash64 guides. Wavelanding/dashing is an intended function of Melee's physics system, in fact Sakurai mentioned coming across it during development and deliberately deciding to keep it in to fans of smash on a forum back in 2001. Being able to jump out of (and thereby cancel) shine was probably just an offhand decision that made sense to the developers. What the developers could not have foresaw, whether they had the time to see it with their constrained development cycle, is how those mechanics would be used, and how they would be combined with each other.
@@queuedjar4578 - Well said! AsumSaus's video about melee vs ultimate calls them exploits, which is a lot more accurate than calling them glitches! Just like you said; the mechanics aren't unintentional, but the intended uses could not all be foreseen.
the timing on this video is hilarious imo
Other than not mentioning the slippi era aka the slippi kids and now the boxx kids coming out (cus these def helped the scene), nice video.
this is essentially a summary or recap of the original smash doc, but it's still a well done and formatted vid
Awesome video, incredibly well done, well earned subscription. Hoping to see more video essays from you.
Thank you I really appreciate that! More videos definitely soon to come :D
I played smash 64 for years and then melee came out and we used to play that all the time, I would’ve never guessed in 2024 there would still be tournaments for melee and even 64.
Commenting for algorithmic reasons! Great video.
As so many others have said, this video was amazing! I'm looking forward to more of the same! Keep it up!!
We all love to see melee recieve the respect it deserves. Even if you don’t cover melee in the future, hope your channel receives recognition. The speed running vid you did was equally impressive.
Melee doesn't deserve respect it's a trash game for pedophiles.
@@JohnathanWilliamson849
you see, the game is actually trash. thats why its lasted so long, and secretly it was actually made for PEDOPHILES
You really can't compare Melee to Ultimate. The amount of control in Melee compared to Ultimate are massively superior. I could take a nap in ultimate after pressing the jump button.
1:00 that was losers finals, Mang0 won grands
Good video!
Good video, for the most part
I keep introducing all of my friends to Melee and I think they are getting annoyed with how much I fawn over this game. I can't help myself! So many things about it just make me so happy.
Right?! It’s honestly a one of a kind game to say the least
Melee is one of a kind. It saddens me that I didn't get into the competitive scene until it was too late. I loved playing casually when it came out and I had a coworker in 2007 invite me to play with her and her friends. They were impressed with how good I was and invited me to attend a competition in Dallas that year. I declined for some reason. Maybe social anxiety I don't know. I didn't have much interest in competitive smash. It wasn't until 2017 that I actually learned about the competitive scene and started playing again. By then it was too late for me to get good and play competitively. I was 30 at the time and just too busy with other things in life. I still watch all major tourneys and often think about what my life could have been if I had just gone to that tournament in 2007. My life could have been filled with way more fun and joy in the community around this awesome game. I think it was an enormous missed opportunity on my part. Now I'm 35 and too old for most of the young people who play and I can't event get good now. My brain and reflexes just aren't what they need to be to fully master this game. :/
I agree with the conclusion of this video. There will never be another game like Melee.
Its literally one of those games that still stands strong no matter what the other new smash games or its other competitive platform fighters say to this community though nintendo tends to stop the entire smash community from having competitive tournaments they will find a way to keep playing. Everyone has their favorites whether it's a new or old game they will have a community that will continue to support it.
I don't see Melee dying ever, it truly is a masterpiece
Sheik actually fits in with yoshi where she needs platforms due to having low aerial drift. She is very dependent on them, and fd/ps are the worst stages for her in most matchups, with battlefield usually being the best.
"New yoshi player amsa" he's been playing the game for years lmaooo, great video tho
Great vid! And great timing too!
Revisiting this video, and I couldn't take my eyes off for even a moment
Once again, another banger vid that didn't disappoint. The thumbnail was the first thing that caught my eye and like usual, learning things I didn't know before. Really hoping this gets out there,more people need to see this. Great job!!
Thanks KK! This was a really fun one to make, and definitely my favorite project so far haha
Jigglypuff alone has made Melee more interesting, change my mind.
It's so weird to think that melee will never fucking die, ever. Like even when you and i will end trying our best to perfect our little lives, Melee: a janky mess literally held together by duct tape and glue is pure perfection and will live forever
The editing in this video is top notch. Great work and keep it up!
Will do! thank you so much for the kind words! :D
Yo... this was an excellent video, Amazing job!
Banger video keep em coming
Keep up the good work!
I will! thank you :D
Really like this thumbnail gives me asum saus vibes 😎
finally something in my recommendations which is not garbage
i would say that mango is the most intuitive melee player, but by no means the most technical.
Say what you want about the actual documentary (which was definitely one of the better ones on Smash), but the references to other Melee content is what kept me watching.
In fact, pretty much all of the first half of the vid kinda felt like a shorter version of empLemon's Hbox doc.
31:06 I was not expecting to see myself here lmao
It was such a sick clip! I saw that and I was like it has to go here haha
cool video really enjoyable (for that title card with the whole tokyo presents part try using a gaussian blur instead of directional, looks better and is also default in premiere)
That's actually funny you mention that because when I was editing that I kept bouncing back and forth from gaussian to directional because I couldn't decide haha, I appreciate the input as well. I will definitely remember that for next time
@@tkyo directional can work stationary but it would need to be in either completely horizontal or vertical directed blur, i just think gaussian is better for stationary stuff
W video broski can't wait to see another one soon
Thanks man!! Super excited to put some more out :D
Damn the algorithm better pick this up. Crazy how this channel has 100 subs
I love this video! keep up the good work and I promise the yt algorithm will take notice
Commenting for the algorithm so hopefully people who don’t know melee find this video, which is quite clearly the intention. Good luck!!!
Damn i think you forgot axe vs silentwolf in the end:) But really impressive video loved every part of it:)
Awesome video bro!!!! Great work. Amazing quality vid💙🎉🎉🎉
Thank you :D I'm glad you enjoyed !!
"but luckily nintendo seems to be a lot more at peace with the idea of melee competitions still taking place"
uh
17:55 yo, how do you include ginger over moky?
Don't wanna be discouraging as you are a small channel and this is high quality content, but I noticed a handful of factual inaccuracies throughout that I think you should watch out for when making future videos. An example is how you explained that Frozen Stadium was implemented into the ruleset by decision of TO's coming together, but that's not true. Frozen Stadium was normalized by the usage of Slippi, which everyone had to use during the pandemic to play melee. The transformations caused desynchs on Slippi so it was frozen as a solution to that, and the community never fully adopted it offline because of oversight from Nintendo and their dislike of mods.
No problem, I completely see where you’re coming from, and thank you for the feedback as well: definitely have tons of work to do! But I will most certainly double check my research moving forward, as it’s very important to keep track of even the small details
Something about melee that makes it so easy to watch is you can watch high level melee without knowing anything about the game but you can see the skill. You watch tekken or street fighter and it doesn't make sense because its just combos the whole time. With melee you will watch 2-4 hit combos but then see them reset. Then there is the commentary which is generally great. It just gets you amped. Melee is sick.
wait wtf, this quality of a video with 600 subs? you just got a new one
Great job! This video was really well made!
if you keep making videos of the same quality as this one, your channel is bound to blow up
this channel will be big
Oh yeah, this channel ticks my boxes. Sexy voice and documentary style breakdowns. Even if your channel doesn't pop off the content is good.
The conclusion was a famous last words moment because of the panda nintendo tournament cancellation fallout
94 subscribers???? how
insane production value
goated video
thank you! definitely my most favorite video I've made, I'm glad it was a good watch!
🔥
Great video, thanks!
This was fucking awesome
this video makes me want to boot up melee, great work👍
Melee is just built different, no other explanation
This a fucking amazing video for someone with see few subscribers, good shit dude
You know exactly how to gain traction, respect dude
Thank you! I really appreciate that! :D