I bought a speedloader for my PMR30, improves reliability enormously. Makes a cheap powerful little pistol for a very affordable price, I paid $340 for mine and love it.
Which speedloader did u buy? I bought 1( cant remember where) either tandem cross or mcarbo,hell may have been ebay,thats where i got my cp33 speedloader from. It helps but i have better luck with handloading(slowly)
Since I have owned my pmr30 I had problems with first 300 rounds with 3 mags but after that I've put 1400 rounds through it with all weight light and heavy no problems 99 precent of the time, a happy pmr30 owner now
I learned something recently about the pmr-30. It’s actually an internal hammer-fired Gun. I always wondered how they could get such an amazing trigger pull and break!!! 😊
If you have the RIA like I have it came with a 9mm barrel+spring. It shares the same mag. That was the deal maker for me. If it was 22 TCM only I think I would have passed but having the ability to easily convert to shoot 9mm is a great selling point.
for the price of the RIA i spent barely 200 more for a real handgun 10mm and the PMR30 at the same time both brand new. hmmm thats my selling point lol
Thanks for the comparison. My PMR30(newer version) has been flawless through the first 500 rounds. I also don't have that painful experience of loading the mags.
My PMR 30 is easy to load and has been flawless. I carry it as a backpacking gun and a backup to my EDC. Never had a malfunction because I use the correct ammo. Not a very fair review
At first I wondered what would I use a pmr 30 for. It is always in my head, what is the best all around carry gun. 22mag is a tiny bullet. The pmr carrys 30 of them. Add a extra magazine you have 60 rds. It starts to come together. As a carry gun. Responding to a threat. A placed 22mag hp is a good option. Not the best but good. 8n a active shooter response. I have 30 rds in the gun. Active shooter goes to reload. I can pepper them with 30 rds. Which gives me options to get away. 1 extra magazine and I have 60rds to get away. It's also light. So I started carrying it. It can respond to more gtfu situations then any other handgun.
Also consider the obnoxious muzzle blast. Even worse at night. If some guys come up to you and pose a threat and you open up with that, it's unlikely they are going to hang around long. I suspect, as the string of shots goes on... and on, they will be encouraged to keep running.
I love the concept and the weight but In my experience pmr is unreliable, I experienced rimlock often using proper ammo and tapping the mag back every 3 rounds I loaded. I sold mine down the river and couldn't be happier...
Tap the mag back and down every few rounds while loading. CCI and Federal Game Shock 50 grn works great. I’ve also never had any issues loading the mag to full 30 rd capacity. The mags could get better over time too. I love the pmr 30 it’s about as much fun as you can have shooting a pistol. The .22 Tcm is a cool caliber too.
@@kodyjohnson5496 He admitted to shooting 30 gr ammo - that stuff tends to jam up any sort of WNR semi-auto as it doesn't have enough umph to properly cycle the gun.
I purchased the Kel Tec last year, in the beginning it was impossible for me to load 30. After a couple range seasons a magazine break in I was able to load 25. Now I can load all 30. And the gun does very well. And you are correct, it gets dirty fast. I also in the beginning dumped the rounds in a cup and then added powdered graphite and that also made a good difference on feeding. Fun gun and I've been able to make hits out to 70 yards on a 10 x 8 steel target. Good video thanks and looking forward to seeing more.
One point you touched on but didn't really elaborate on was velocity.... 22 mag is rated @ 1700-1800 fps from a 24" barrel... The TCM is about 2000 fps from a 5" barrel.... Shoot a water jug and I think you understand the difference between the two. Also RIA makes your 1911 in a high cap version (18+1) and it also comes with a 9mm barrel. I own this particular model but have never ran the 22 TCM barrel, only the 9mm. It runs like a champ. Plus, the mags will accommodate OAL of 1.275". So loading heavy 9mm to major levels is safer and easier than weapons using standard 9mm mags. Update: RAI now has a bolt gun (16” barrel) in 22 TCM - Velocity is over 2700 FPS.
I called my KelTec PMR 30 the PMR 28 because with one mag I could only get 28 maximum rounds loaded and 29 in the other magazine. It was most reliable with only 25 or 26 rounds instead of trying to get the maximum the mag would hold. It is fun to shoot, when it isn’t jamming. And it also gets dirty real fast. There’s a lot of unburnt when shooting a 22 magnum in a handgun.
My New 2nd generation, PMR30 has proven to be a Tack Driver, right out of the Box and I now have over 1000 rounds through this gun wit only Two or three failures to load which had to be tapped into the chamber! I have decided to make this gun my main EDC along with my P17 at times! IMO, this gun is the best 22 magnum pistol in the market! NOTE: I purchased an auto loader device, made by "LUDEX" and this makes loading those 30 round magazines Fast & Easy! ANOTHER NOTE: I was able to Load all 30 rounds in my PMR and It Shot Flawless right out of the box! OK, my gun is a 2nd Gen of this Firearm and has a few new parts and is much better than when they first came out!
I have the PMR 30, using CCi 40 gr and keep it oiled. Purchased the speed loader that makes it easy and perfect loading each time. No problems and shoots like a dream. Love it!
Brother In Law was 22 years special ops Carries the Kel-Tec PMR -30 I decided experience is a great teacher and bought one! Awesome gun! using the CCI MAXI MAG 40 grain, Silver Eagle 40 Grain Federal Game Shock 50 Grain and Hornaday Critical Defense 45 grain all shoot perfectly, anything else lots of issues. withthe right Ammo perfect and you have 30 rounds plus one in the chamber! AWESOME!
Many things need a break in period to get smooth. I always rack my pistols 100s of times by hand before firing a shot....some empty some with snap caps of course. As for mags if theyre stiff load em and let em sit. If theyre loose stretch the spring a bit...sometimes the plastic follower may have not been trimmed well 9n factory so alwzys check that on problem mags. Smooth sides glide...rough edges jam it up
probably because he cant follow instructions the PMR-30 manual says 40gr+ ammunition (and suggests CCi Maxi-Mags lots of the people reviewing these pistols have the same issues (with following instructions) also, people have stated, wasting so much video time watching him load the magazines wearing gloves
I have a PMR-30, I did have problems with the first load on each magazine. Maybe 2 jams per magazine, but after that haven't had any issues. All you have to do is make sure the rounds are seated to the rear of the magazine. And a speed loader helps out with the thumb issues. This is a very capable gun if you load the magazine correctly.
What people need to understand is while handguns chambered in .22 TCM are limited, there are many more options chambered in .22 TCM9R such as the RIA MAPP FS and MS series, both are also available in 9mm with the TCM9R barrel available separately. Since the MAPP line of pistols are basically polymer framed clones of the CZ 75B, the TCM9R conversion barrel made for the full size also fits all the EAA versions as well as the original CZ 75B with just a tiny bit of easy fitting! Anyone with a CZ 75B in 9mm or .40S&W can easy have .22 TCM9R as a conversion caliber if they desire. Then there is Glock - Armscor offers conversion barrels for both the 17/22 and 19/23 which puts the power and reliability along with low recoil of the .22 TCM9R in a thoroughly modern, polymer frame "front line" pistol! Armscor also offers complete slide assembly conversions for the 1911 and G17/19! I recently built a pair of Poly80 lowers mated to Armscor factory, dedicated .22 TCM9R complete slide units and the guns cost less than buying a Glock OTC and without the added cost of the conversion barrel as well! As for ammo, most can order ample amounts online for reasonable prices and reloading components are available online. New cases in both brass and nickle are reasonable at around $20/100 and factory style bullets are less than $6/100. Since the case is based on the .223 Remington cut down and reformed, brass can be formed for those with huge stocks of .223 brass on hand. Load data is available from Western Powders.
Roger Hancock honestly I haven't had one since using the speed-loader. I didn't have but a few before the speed loader. I think the biggest issue is in loading the magazines correctly. Maybe the earlier versions have more problems I don't know but I have had mine 5 years without any real issues to speak of.
in my opinion if you're getting a lot of muzzle flash you're wasting a lot of the round's power, much of the powder is still burning as it exits. So, that tells me this might be a better round for a carbine or rifle.
I have never seen a PMR make it through two successive magazines without a failure. That being said... I've heard several say otherwise. They remind me of Saturn brand vehicles of the 90s... if you have a good one, you have a great exception... if you have a bad one, it's the worst in your possession, and there is no in between. If I'm spending that much for a chance, I'm buying lottery tickets. In short... if I want to shoot a PMR, I'm going to the range and renting someone else's liability.
you keep saying that KelTec says to only use one type of ammunition... did you even read the manual? "The PMR-30 pistol functions best with high power ammo, often with bullet weights of 40gr and up. This includes, but is not limited to, the following: -CCI Maxi Mag 40gr -Winchester Super-X 40gr -Remington Premier Magnum 33gr" "To load, fill the magazine by pressing a cartridge downward in the center of the magazine, with the rim situated within the rim window. Then slide the round back all the way before pushing another round down on top of it After loading about 5 rounds lightly tap the back of the magazine against a flat surface, like a table, to help seat the rounds, and keep the rims arranged correctly. " most PMR-30 owners dont have anywhere near the issues you seem to be experiencing
I have to agree with you. I also read the instructions. Because I followed the instructions, I tap the mag as I load it and I haven't had a single failure to feed/fire with fully loaded mags, regardless of the ammo I used. Of course I too follow the guidelines in the manual.
I don't know anyone but I'll send multiple videos where people have had issues with them...BUT it's still I left the amount of videos I've seen with the Glock 40 for screwing up with almost every kind of ammunition you put in it even if you loaded the "correct way"... and I should also mention that I've seen the way more videos with the PMR-30 saying it function fine and had little issues at all then I had seen videos complaining about it that there are some videos out there where it malfunctions so I'm guessing some people just get a "lemon" and/or got a poor-quality version of it somehow or something that made it through quality control without being checked
@@stephenszabo2361 I own a couple of Glocks. They are extremely durable, and reliable, but I think they are butt ugly. They look like something made on a band saw from a block of wood. I can't fault them for anything except that. Growing up my dad carried a Colt 1911. I think it's a work of art compared to a Glock. I still keep it under my pillow and won't part with it for sentimental reasons, but handguns have really came a long way since then!
I also have both guns and like them both. The 22 TCM is more reliable but I do not have the issues with my PMR30 that you do. I have two and both fire pretty much anything but it doesn't like 22 WMR Armscor rounds much. I think its the nickel plating. I shoot fiocchi ammo most but have no issues with CCI, Winchester, and Hornady. I have no issues with 20 rounds in the magazine and 25 is pretty good. 30 is usually an issue, for some reason it wont eject some rounds. Just FYI a guy on amazon sells a 3d printed loader for the PMR 30. It shipped from American speed loader. If you continue to shoot it, it worth every penny. The only thing I do different when loading is after 10 rounds, I tap the magazine on something a few times to seat the rounds. I hope that helps with you. Great video
As an owner of a PMR 30 i have use other ammo types and it functioned just fine.what i found help the most was getting a good Mag loader for your PMR if that mag is not loaded right it will give you problems the mag loader i found that works well for it is Maglula Lula Magazine Speed Loader and Unloader for Kel-Tec PMR-30
The maglula is the finest speed loader for these mags, actually since buying the one for the PMR I will be buying one for each of our magazine fed firearms
I didn't find this comparison helpful. I have both of these pistols, and love the PMR. I have about 1000 rounds through mine and 4 total malfunctions and all during the first 100 rounds (all FTF). I can load the mags fine right up to 30, with and without my speedloader. Also, it is hammer fired pistol, not striker fired (take it apart sometime!). I like the RIA too.
I have a PMR as well and I love it. People nowadays are after instant gratification and the PMR is something you have to work for. If you want something that works and mostly looks like a gun go buy a Glock. If you want something with style innovation and a conversation piece every time you it out and kel tech PMR and CMR yes it comes in a rifle as well!!! Lol he owns a rim fire gun put 100 rounds in it and didn't clean it? Well, my dad taught me better than that.
I only have the PMR but I’m very happy with mine. I only have about 200 rounds through mine with no failures. Loading the mags are a pain though. But the trigger is outstanding IMO.
@@butchglancy3850 hey they sell a loader for those PMR mags. I have both pistol and carbine, and that thing can slap in 25 rounds without chewing your fingers
recently picked up a pmr for my wife to use for home defense and haven't had an issue with feeding at all. I've ran the cci maxi mag ammo and I've ran hornady critical defense through it.
My recent manufacture PMR30 (2 years) operates flawlessly. The specified 40 grain ammo is not totally necessary. I bought 500 rounds of CCI 30 grain TNT HP and it is operating without a hiccup. High velocity matters. Lower pressure ammo like Winchester or Armscor will not cycle the action. There aren't many options currently for 22 TCM ammo. That and the price are a disadvantage. Try the Maglula speed loader for the PMR30. It will make life easier if you want to load 30. 22WMR will be here long after 22TCM fades away.
Pmr 30 is my first gun. After I loaded the magazine a few times it ran great and I was able to get 30 rounds in. It was used, maybe because it was broke in already I didn't have many issues. I love not having to reload so much at the range!
I have put about 600 rounds through my PMR 30 and I have found that the Hornady 45 grain Critical Defense and the Aguila 40 grain Silver Eagle also work exceptionally well. I typically only load 20 rounds at a time and tap the back of the magazine during loading after every 3-4 rounds. Same solid results with my CMR 30 as well. Love this combo!
I have a Rock Island double stick magazine. It holds 17 rounds and have never once had a malfunction with either .22 TCM or 9 mm configurations. I have over 500 rounds through it with both configurations. I love it and I carry it with the 9 mm configuration. The pistol is very flexible.
Like we were always told loading the magazine for the old army 1911 45acp, make sure the rounds are all the way back in the mag. Tap the back of the mag against your hand or leg during loading. I ensure the rounds are loaded properly and do not have issues. Yes it is more difficult to load 30 rounds but done properly they work without problems. That is with 40gr especially. Some 36gr may give occasional problem.
Muzzle flash is wasted powder. Same reason why short mag rounds suck. The back pressure of the brass neck simply doesn't allow the powder to burn and create pressure before you loose seal. Furthermore, the turbulence causes the cartridge to blow raw powder down the barrel. Great capture, by the way! Great vid!
I recently got a CMR 30 for $400 even, Haven't had any problems. I usually load 25 rounds at a time (because boxes come with 50) and I've had zero issues out of 300 rounds. It was also pretty easy to load and I was hitting oranges pretty consistently at about ~40 feet. It seems most of the issues with this firearm were either fixed with more recent versions, or with its carbine-length sibling. Also great video, never heard of 22 TCM, nice to know how it performs.
It was clearly visible when you loaded the PMR30 mag that you got the rounds crossed up twice and didn’t correct it. You also didn’t show tapping the mag like is recommended. Two very important things to do for correct mag function in this case.
Sorry - I don't fall for that. If your product requires that I hold my tongue just right and ensure that the sun is over my left shoulder or it won't work... your product sucks.
Justin Opinion Well if you want a handgun with a 30 round capacity and all the benefits that the PMR30 offers then you need to be willing to treat it exactly the way the manufacturer stipulates. If you’re not willing to do that then get a Glock like everybody else. But don’t treat a PMR30 the same as a Glock and then complain that it’s not a Glock. That’s just silly. And btw- there is a big difference between holding your tongue just right and correctly loading a mag. And I would never load a mag with gloves on like you do in your video. Those cartridges are small and not easy to grasp even in perfect circumstances. Why make it harder?
FYI, if you tap the mag on it's edge every 3-4 rounds you will have a lot fewer failure to feed issues with the PMR30! I have 4 mags, and have them all filled with 30 rounds each. I have put 300 or so rounds through my pistol with little to no issues. I can EASILY carry 120 rounds with me, and if I need more than that, I was screwed anyway. The PMR does put out a pretty large muzzle flare with the Hornady rounds I use with it. I was told to AVOID the CCI ammo you are using, by the way. My brother bought the carbine version, the CMR-30, still 22 magnum rimfire, same 30 round mag. That thing is a GREAT varmint gun! He nailed a HUGE rat the other night (about 1.5x the length of a dollar bill WITHOUT the tail! And FAT!) that was stealing chicken feed out of the feeder. He nailed it right behind it's ear from about 50ft away...since he was using Winchester sub-sonic ammo, he didn't even bother the neighbors!
The reason there is a manufacturer suggested ammunition is, that's what it was designed to shoot. In this case, you have a blowback operated handgun and need a 40 grain or higher to cycle the operation. Otherwise you will have feeding and ejecting issues.
On the PMR mags... load them with 30 rounds... and let them sit for a few weeks. It will help break in the springs, and make them easier to load. Also, just like for any mag, you can get speed loaders which help once you get used to using them.
We did the “2x4” test on 22mag for penetration. We bought every brand of 22 mag we could find, like 8 different bullets. For whatever it’s worth, the Rem PSP out performed every other bullet in penetration by a long shot! We were shooting them out of a rifle but was interesting to see. ✌️
A friend of mine had an itch to get the kel-tek and like you had constant feed issues with it I think he settled on no more than 18 rounds as the most to load. I have heard other say they had the same feed issues. From what I experienced shooting it as well as others we all agree its spring pressure causing the issue. I think the Kel-Tek is a good shooter limiting load capacity. I have a GSG 1911-22 that shoots great and as I want to add a 9mm 1911 to my stash I intend to get the RIA 22TCM/9mm. Since I still think the Kel-Tek is a good gun I might just buy one at a later date. That later date will be after the purchase of a decent quality .223 for up to 400 yard shooting and high quality 6.5 Creedmoor fore up to one mile shooting. I am having to recover from theft of firearms and other stuff from my home when I was out of state.
Very interesting video. Viewers should not hastily announce their opinions on what you think one way or another about a product. You do great job on it all, keep up the good work. We can all learn from one another by sharing our thoughts and experiences. The PMR-30 probably was leaving the factory too fast early on. That we understand is pretty much a thing of the past. If a gun has problems Kel Tec is a great US based company and they stand behind their entire lineup of firearms. That’s what counts.
Love my 10mm RIA 1911 (Tac II Ultra or something... with the full rail). I'd love to find a 22TCM/9mm combo gun at a good price and I'd definitely take the RIA over the Keltec.
My PMR-30 has had a few malfunctions in approx 1K rounds, and those were clearly due to some shit .22 WMR ammo I had laying around for years prior to purchasing the gun. I used up the rest of the box of that old stuff and since then I have only run that Hornady V-MAX ammo through it and it’s been 100% reliable with that stuff. When I picked up the gun from the FFL, I grabbed myself an Uplula mag loader for it and it has saved me so many headaches and sore thumbs!! Those things are truly an indispensable piece of kit for the range!! One tip that I heard Kel-Tec recommends for loading the PMR-30 mags is that every 5-10 rounds you are supposed to smack the mag into your palm with the back side of the magazine, kind of like you would pack a pack of cigarettes..
Amazon has a speed loader for under $20 and it completely changes the PMR30. Most issues around the PMR 30 are in the 30 round mag. After the first 15 you end up denting rounds trying to cram in the last 15. That causes all kinds of feeding and ejecting issues. The speed loader resolves 99% of the issues! LOVE MY PMR AND CMR 30 after getting the loader.
I got a loader for the PMR-30 on Ebay. Made loading the magazine a LOT easier. Best $25 I've spent on it. But between it being rimfire and such a low kinetic energy, I prefer the TCM. I have the newer double-stack with 17 rounds, and the recoil is next to nothing, and I find that I TRUST it more because it's centerfire.
There's a company that makes a stainless steel feed ramp, a stronger recoil spring, along with a modified magazine release that not only makes it harder to accidentally release the magazine but also raises the magazine up a little closer to the feed ramp and when you combine all of those together you can shoot any 22wrm manufactured including flat tipped rounds.
Some guys say locktite the screws, and double check all screws. Other issue was fluted barrel caused feeding issues and overpressure issues, so if its fluted don't use it and get the barrel changed.
Nice comparison / review. I also have a pm30 and suspect it's a 3rd gen, purchased from a pawn shop. I've only had feeding issues with anything over 25 rounds and hollow points. Might have been 28 loaded, the last 2 - 3 rounds is painful to load and potentially damages the wmr case. I am using the extended barrel with accompanied attachment and notice no muzzle flash. When loading hollow points the tip catches on the feed lip. Close examination alludes to it being incorrectly aligned. I suspect
As much as I want the Pmr I don’t want all it’s issues and there notoriously bad when it comes to the feed ramp so the only way I would buy it is if it comes with all the parts that need to be changed so it runs the way it’s supposed to at no extra cost. I don’t know what they dont upgrade the gun in factory before hand then sell you a good gun. I’ll go with the .22 smith and Wesson and I don’t really care about the money it will cost as long as it’s not a lemon.
USClight That's the only thing holding me back. I can't believe this round hasn't became more popular. It's awesome! It's .223 power, in a handgun. Crazy!!!!!!
Sounded like you were hitting better with the PMR, or was it just me? I don't have the TCM yet but as with my PMR I load 25 in the mags (which splits the 50 round box nicely) and rarely have a problem. Don't forget to tap the back of the mag every 5 rounds or so. I've always done this with my AR 15 mags anyway so no biggie there.
TCM is higher velocity, could be that the mic isn’t adjusting compression fast enough to get back to a compression you can hear the steel ring vs the gun blast
@@calebnation7797 I would like to see real world chronographs on that velocity, I would be willing to bet that it's a higher velocity out of a 12-14" barrel than a 5" barrel and the box will not reflect that, they just tell you a speed and your happy with it. But the size of the fireball tells me that it's loosing half it's power. Looking more in to it you Might be able to find the mathmatic equation to figure it out. But I would say that the 2 rounds, although greatly different in powder charge, are running about the same velocity, the overcharge and fireball out of the tcm round can also greatly affect the accuracy negatively
My PMR 30 shot low and to the left when I got it. I adjusted the front sight to be right on horizontally but the back sight was not adjustable for elelvation. So, I made a peep sight for the back that was was a little higher than the orange optical dots and have yet to try it. it does look good with the Crimson Trace green dot that was sighted in at last use.
The PMR 30 just needs break in of the mags. Plus you easy damage with a little dent the case of the .22 mag round if you don't load it correctly which is the cause of malfunction. After I learned how to load and used them a couple of times all 6 mags shoot 30 rounds every time.
Ammunition matters bc of the polymer frame. I had the same issues you experience and I had a gunsmith tell me "it just needs a heavier load and it'll shoot fine." Lol so .... 50 grain federal n you will have a great gun with a fully functional 30 round magazine. I run 30 consistently with 0 issues. Also I have the first gen. But I will say there is a break in range. But after getting 50 grain ammo along with breaking it in. I'd trust my life with it now. Edc!
Of course you are gonna crap on a firearm at less than half the price of that ria, but quite honestly, putting 30 rounds in your hands in a single mag using the proper ammo is far better than a 10 round mag. Then getting in to firearm weight, that 1911 copy weighs more as just a slide than the keltec fully loaded. The keltec also has the fiberoptic sights all around. As far as it goes the keltec is a much better option in my opinion for home and self defense after proper break in. It's also a very fine lightweight hunting sidearm. Keltec also has a great support team, and there are many performance upgrades that can be had still well under the cost of the ria model, as well as ammo availability and price! 40gr plus weight only!
The Gen 1 PMR-30 gave me nothing but problems failure to feed failure to eject got rid of it gave it another chance with the gen2 it's been reliable ,fun and accurate definitely one of my favorites 👍
I put MCARBO parts in my pmr30. Steel feed ramp and their mag release. Mine hasn't jammed or had the dreaded issues they're know for. I shoot 40 grain ammo in mine.
@@MaxHeadspace9mm sorry probably worded it wrong.I watched a Paul Harrell video were he chronos a tcm 22 out of a 1911 getting over 2000 fps. I have chrono 22 mag out of 6 inch barrel and got around 1100 fps .sorry about that
@@tjsspyder ok, I haven't bought any in a long time. Figured it was more. Thanks. I load all my centerfire, lost track of loaded ammo prices through the years.
I have 8 pmr mags and they are not that hard to load. When i first bought the pmr i didnt read the manual and had a bunch of failure to feed problems. Took it home and read the manual and watched keltecs video on loading the mags. After that no more problems. Ive shot about 2000 rounds of armscor 40 grain with no problems. This last weekend i bought the cp33 and i will tell you first thing i did was read the manual. Now those cp33 mags are hard to load. But using the right ammo it will not give you any malfunctions. I tried remington golden bullet and had a bunch of failures. But then i tried federal match 40 grain and both mags fed reliably.
My friend the mags is more likes for 38sup, You can also conversation the pistol in 4 calibers 9mm, 22TCM, 38sup, and believe or not also in 7.62x25 tokarev, I have. The only problem is that the 7.62 ammo you can only put 7 rounds in the single stack And on the double stack you can put around 14 to 15 rounds
I just want to say after i field stripped it and put a coating of Hoppe’s oil on it and on the inside of the mags, it ran like a Singer Sewing machine with any ammunition i fed through it 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸😊…
I've always wanted a 22TCM. It's designed for short barrels where the 22mag is not. Thank you for comparing these two. You may have some bad PMR-30 mags or it just may be a break in issue. Keltec guns and mags sometimes need 200 - 300 rounds before they work reliably. I routinely load mine with 25rds because it is exactly half a box of ammo (try that the the TCM, lol) and therefore makes for a consistent loading and shooting experience. I and I dare say most PMR owners enjoy good reliability. I
i will say as a guy who has had quite a few rds through my pmr you do need to give it a thorough break in period. once they are good and used you can confidently load and fire with very little problem 20-25 rds but after 15 you do need to tap them every rd to make sure they seat correctly. i dont think its a good gun for defense because of how finicky they can be. you can run them very well but the fact is there are alot of things you do need to learn and that makes it not a good gun for anything but the range. i will also say that my first one blew up in my hand and keltec was extremely quick in replacing and apologizing, they gave me a call had a gunsmith walk me through some of the quirks and since then its a dream... fun to shoot accurate easy to shoot. i would say its great for a beginner on a count of how disciplined you need to be to shoot it correctly. for example, it can teach really good behaviors like having a tight grip while managing the small recoil. if you have a loose grip it will jam. if you dont load and seat the ammo correctly it will jam. if you run cheap ammo, it will jam. it recommends cci maxi mag but i find that any high quality high velocity ammunition is good in it. i have ran federal and a few other brands that are just pricey and as long as i didnt run low velocity ammo, or dirty ammo it ran very well.
Yeah thats what I was saying to myself before when he saying that the RIA is almost $900 but its still the better gun obviously anyone who i know who has the PMR has told me that they are trash.. and what I have seen tells me they are garbage on the other hand RIA 1911's are great with any caliber you pick...
I've both calibers 9mm 22tcm, and a 22magnum in rock island arms . Each has their own uses . I'm thinking about getting the 22magnum like you have there, 2 full magazines per hunting trip . My 5.7x28 has its use also
The only downside to the pmr 30 is you cannot reload your brass. Great gun!! I was frustrated at first too until I learned how to properly load it. Great gun!!!
You were not loading the magazine for the pmr30 correctly. Should be taping the every 3-4 cartridges to assure the back of the bullet touches tge back of the loading. The pmr 30 is very reliable. If you have the patience to load it correctly.
I have both the 22 tcm and the pmr. The ria 22 tcm needs to be well lubricated, if well lubricated it runs like a rolex. The only time i had any problem was because it was not lubricated. The pmr 30, have not had a single issue, i only use cci maxi. At first i tried loading 30 rounds and started denting cases so backed off to 25 until the mag spring gets broke in.
I have the polymer MAPP R.I. version of the TCM22. The ammo is a bit different for both versions and the 1911 ammo will not work in the MAPP version. Fireballs are the same. I had somebody at the indoor range get a bit irate because he couldn't believe I was shooting just a 22 and though I was lying to him. No worries about a specific ammo for the TCM as there's only one available and it works. You can get the polymer TCM for cheaper than the PMR-30. I thought I wanted the Kel-Tec until I held/shot it, no thanks. It's one of my favorite pistols and every one loves shooting it.
Do you have the TCM9R then? Ive been trying to find info on it, but there doesn't seem to be much out there. I was going to try the Glock 19 conversion barrel to that caliber.
I have over 1000 rounds through my PMR 30 and have had 2 malfunctions. I have used numerous brands of ammunition with no difficulty, however, the recommended CCI brand has worked best. The two malfunctions which occurred I attribute to operator error, specifically the loading of the magazines. Kel-Tec recommends tapping the magazine after every 5 rounds or so, which I do, and have no issues. Possibly you have a lemon or your magazine loading technique is causing the problem. I have enjoyed my PMR 30 immensely and have no issues in recommending it to others. Now, the CMR 30 operates much closer to your description and I am not as happy with it as I am with the PMR.
You did put out some very good quality content on these 2 pieces. I also own both and will agree with you that the Keltec PMR 30 is a lot o5th6f fun and though it comes with a 30 round mag it's almost impossible to put all 30 rounds in the mag and it's going to malfunction 95% of the time if you put more than 15. The 30 round magazine really gives the Keltec a bad name. If they wouldn't have focused on volume of rounds and would've went with half the amount 15 rounds they would've hit the bullseye 🎯. Still a very fun piece but not recommended for self defense because of lack of reliability. The Rock Island is a chunk of weight but made out of good steel not plastic. Yes the price is doubled but you have to realize that you are really getting 2 firearms in one, a 22tcm and a 9mm. Same size round but cannot judge them putting them on paper. The 22tcm will penitrate 1/4" steel like it's been drilled with a drill bit. Beautiful holes all day long through steel. The Keltec won't do that. The velocity is so much faster with the 22tcm. As for rounds, my Rock Island came with a 15 round magazine so it'll hold a total of 16 rounds so that's not bad. Please do a review on the FN 5.7x28 vs the Keltec PMR 30. I own one and the weight of the 5.7 matches the pmr 30. The 5.7 also comes with 3-20 round mags but I purchased a 30 round mag to go with it and it doesn't stick out the mag well. The magazine has the handle material built on it and fits beautifully with the 5.7 pistol. Now you are comparing 30 rounds against 30 rounds and the bullets are close to the same in diameter. I think it would be an awesome review. Thanks again for your educational videos one can learn a lot from watching the wonderful job that you do.
I bought a speedloader for my PMR30, improves reliability enormously. Makes a cheap powerful little pistol for a very affordable price, I paid $340 for mine and love it.
Wow. Great price. I gave 400 for my second gen pmr
Which speedloader did u buy? I bought 1( cant remember where) either tandem cross or mcarbo,hell may have been ebay,thats where i got my cp33 speedloader from. It helps but i have better luck with handloading(slowly)
Wow where did you get it that price ?
@@foxhoundra6444 a new pmr 30 runs about $439 he prob bought it second hand .
@@davenstorm7271 Look at the dates
Since I have owned my pmr30 I had problems with first 300 rounds with 3 mags but after that I've put 1400 rounds through it with all weight light and heavy no problems 99 precent of the time, a happy pmr30 owner now
And to note all 3 of my mags load easy to 28 but 30 is possible and run well loaded fully , so Justin don't know what to tell you
I learned something recently about the pmr-30. It’s actually an internal hammer-fired Gun. I always wondered how they could get such an amazing trigger pull and break!!! 😊
If you have the RIA like I have it came with a 9mm barrel+spring. It shares the same mag. That was the deal maker for me. If it was 22 TCM only I think I would have passed but having the ability to easily convert to shoot 9mm is a great selling point.
for the price of the RIA i spent barely 200 more for a real handgun 10mm and the PMR30 at the same time both brand new. hmmm thats my selling point lol
exellent pos. point unique to very few guns NICE TO KNOW!
2 exceptionally available Calibres in 1 gun. interchangable ? A MUST HAVE
I did not know that!
at the first of the vid, he said he received both barrels.
Thanks for the comparison.
My PMR30(newer version) has been flawless through the first 500 rounds. I also don't have that painful experience of loading the mags.
Mines flawless, loading isn't painful.
how do you make sure you get the newer version
My PMR 30 is easy to load and has been flawless. I carry it as a backpacking gun and a backup to my EDC. Never had a malfunction because I use the correct ammo. Not a very fair review
I have a speed loader for my PMR-30 . Makes loading a whole lot easier on us old folks . These speed loaders are available on ebay .
My PMR has been nearly flawless in over 3000 rounds. I don’t use junk ammo.
At first I wondered what would I use a pmr 30 for. It is always in my head, what is the best all around carry gun.
22mag is a tiny bullet.
The pmr carrys 30 of them. Add a extra magazine you have 60 rds. It starts to come together.
As a carry gun. Responding to a threat. A placed 22mag hp is a good option. Not the best but good.
8n a active shooter response. I have 30 rds in the gun. Active shooter goes to reload. I can pepper them with 30 rds. Which gives me options to get away. 1 extra magazine and I have 60rds to get away.
It's also light.
So I started carrying it. It can respond to more gtfu situations then any other handgun.
I like your logic and agree with you!
Also consider the obnoxious muzzle blast. Even worse at night. If some guys come up to you and pose a threat and you open up with that, it's unlikely they are going to hang around long. I suspect, as the string of shots goes on... and on, they will be encouraged to keep running.
Ted Eng
Yes. That's why I carried a snub 357 before. The blast and noise will scare anyone away.
I love the concept and the weight but In my experience pmr is unreliable, I experienced rimlock often using proper ammo and tapping the mag back every 3 rounds I loaded. I sold mine down the river and couldn't be happier...
Fire 6-7 rounds then wait for them to think you're reloading and stick their head up....POP!
Tap the mag back and down every few rounds while loading. CCI and Federal Game Shock 50 grn works great. I’ve also never had any issues loading the mag to full 30 rd capacity. The mags could get better over time too. I love the pmr 30 it’s about as much fun as you can have shooting a pistol. The .22 Tcm is a cool caliber too.
With the pmr I don’t think he oiled the slide on his first video that he said he was having problems with my pmr 30 will shoot any 22 mag
He just wanted to talk bad about the pmr, maybe because of the low end price but that don’t matter! Just look at the g3 great gun and great price!
@@kodyjohnson5496 He admitted to shooting 30 gr ammo - that stuff tends to jam up any sort of WNR semi-auto as it doesn't have enough umph to properly cycle the gun.
I purchased the Kel Tec last year, in the beginning it was impossible for me to load 30. After a couple range seasons a magazine break in I was able to load 25. Now I can load all 30. And the gun does very well. And you are correct, it gets dirty fast. I also in the beginning dumped the rounds in a cup and then added powdered graphite and that also made a good difference on feeding.
Fun gun and I've been able to make hits out to 70 yards on a 10 x 8 steel target. Good video thanks and looking forward to seeing more.
One point you touched on but didn't really elaborate on was velocity.... 22 mag is rated @ 1700-1800 fps from a 24" barrel... The TCM is about 2000 fps from a 5" barrel.... Shoot a water jug and I think you understand the difference between the two. Also RIA makes your 1911 in a high cap version (18+1) and it also comes with a 9mm barrel. I own this particular model but have never ran the 22 TCM barrel, only the 9mm. It runs like a champ. Plus, the mags will accommodate OAL of 1.275". So loading heavy 9mm to major levels is safer and easier than weapons using standard 9mm mags.
Update: RAI now has a bolt gun (16” barrel) in 22 TCM - Velocity is over 2700 FPS.
I called my KelTec PMR 30 the PMR 28 because with one mag I could only get 28 maximum rounds loaded and 29 in the other magazine. It was most reliable with only 25 or 26 rounds instead of trying to get the maximum the mag would hold. It is fun to shoot, when it isn’t jamming. And it also gets dirty real fast. There’s a lot of unburnt when shooting a 22 magnum in a handgun.
Load mine at 30 all the time have had no trouble after first 200rds. Gun runs great. Kel-Tec 30 is a fun gun, very accurate!
I love mine , very fun .
Love mine too
Same!
Its a pos
Like my PMR-30, runs good.
I run 30 rounds through both of my mags when I shoot with no problems as long as I load the mags right.
@Michael Stellar that’s good idea only loading 25 rounds keeps spring compression down and helps with reliable feeding
My New 2nd generation, PMR30 has proven to be a Tack Driver, right out of the Box and I now have over 1000 rounds through this gun wit only Two or three failures to load which had to be tapped into the chamber! I have decided to make this gun my main EDC along with my P17 at times! IMO, this gun is the best 22 magnum pistol in the market! NOTE: I purchased an auto loader device, made by "LUDEX" and this makes loading those 30 round magazines Fast & Easy! ANOTHER NOTE: I was able to Load all 30 rounds in my PMR and It Shot Flawless right out of the box! OK, my gun is a 2nd Gen of this Firearm and has a few new parts and is much better than when they first came out!
I have the PMR 30, using CCi 40 gr and keep it oiled. Purchased the speed loader that makes it easy and perfect loading each time. No problems and shoots like a dream. Love it!
Brother In Law was 22 years special ops Carries the Kel-Tec PMR -30 I decided experience is a great teacher and bought one! Awesome gun! using the CCI MAXI MAG 40 grain, Silver Eagle 40 Grain Federal Game Shock 50 Grain and Hornaday Critical Defense 45 grain all shoot perfectly, anything else lots of issues. withthe right Ammo perfect and you have 30 rounds plus one in the chamber! AWESOME!
Try putting some powder graphite in the mag it will aid greatly in reducing binding as well as polish the mag internals and help breakin.
Keltec says use 40+ grain bullets. It also has a very specific loading procedure. Following their recommendations it run great loaded to 30 rounds.
I am just finding your video. I enjoyed watching someone that like me takes time to learn your tools and how to run them most efficiently.
Many things need a break in period to get smooth. I always rack my pistols 100s of times by hand before firing a shot....some empty some with snap caps of course.
As for mags if theyre stiff load em and let em sit. If theyre loose stretch the spring a bit...sometimes the plastic follower may have not been trimmed well 9n factory so alwzys check that on problem mags. Smooth sides glide...rough edges jam it up
How does this channel not have more subscribers??? Awesome video, keep it up!!
Aw, thanks mom!!
Because he wastes our time showing us the entire magazine loading procedure; seriously, that's probably why. Otherwise, great vid and channel.
He is slow
fine. subbed! *smirk*
probably because he cant follow instructions
the PMR-30 manual says 40gr+ ammunition (and suggests CCi Maxi-Mags
lots of the people reviewing these pistols have the same issues (with following instructions)
also,
people have stated, wasting so much video time watching him load the magazines wearing gloves
I have a PMR 30 with over 1000 rounds out of it and it has never once hung up on me. I’ve put it through the ringer and it still shoots like a dream.
I have a PMR-30, I did have problems with the first load on each magazine. Maybe 2 jams per magazine, but after that haven't had any issues. All you have to do is make sure the rounds are seated to the rear of the magazine. And a speed loader helps out with the thumb issues. This is a very capable gun if you load the magazine correctly.
What people need to understand is while handguns chambered in .22 TCM are limited, there are many more options chambered in .22 TCM9R such as the RIA MAPP FS and MS series, both are also available in 9mm with the TCM9R barrel available separately. Since the MAPP line of pistols are basically polymer framed clones of the CZ 75B, the TCM9R conversion barrel made for the full size also fits all the EAA versions as well as the original CZ 75B with just a tiny bit of easy fitting! Anyone with a CZ 75B in 9mm or .40S&W can easy have .22 TCM9R as a conversion caliber if they desire. Then there is Glock - Armscor offers conversion barrels for both the 17/22 and 19/23 which puts the power and reliability along with low recoil of the .22 TCM9R in a thoroughly modern, polymer frame "front line" pistol! Armscor also offers complete slide assembly conversions for the 1911 and G17/19! I recently built a pair of Poly80 lowers mated to Armscor factory, dedicated .22 TCM9R complete slide units and the guns cost less than buying a Glock OTC and without the added cost of the conversion barrel as well!
As for ammo, most can order ample amounts online for reasonable prices and reloading components are available online. New cases in both brass and nickle are reasonable at around $20/100 and factory style bullets are less than $6/100. Since the case is based on the .223 Remington cut down and reformed, brass can be formed for those with huge stocks of .223 brass on hand. Load data is available from Western Powders.
I load both my PMR mags to capacity and rarely have a faire to fire. I use a speed loader made specifically for the PMR mags and it's fantastic !
They may be rare but still apparently you have them.
Roger Hancock honestly I haven't had one since using the speed-loader. I didn't have but a few before the speed loader. I think the biggest issue is in loading the magazines correctly. Maybe the earlier versions have more problems I don't know but I have had mine 5 years without any real issues to speak of.
My pmr30 I usually split a box of 50 between the two magazines. So 25 each works really well so far
Can knock the balls off a knat at 10 yards.
in my opinion if you're getting a lot of muzzle flash you're wasting a lot of the round's power, much of the powder is still burning as it exits. So, that tells me this might be a better round for a carbine or rifle.
No offense, but did you read the PMR manual? Load 5, then rap the back of the magazine on a firm surface.
i own the PMR 30 and i load 30 rounds no stops no taps and i have no problems.
@@christopherbaker2632 How did it act during the first 500rds "break-in" period?
My cousin has one and it took a lot of shooting before it starting acting right! Sucked at first! ✌️
@@RU2AIM I have put well over 1000 rounds out of it and the only hiccup I had was the optical sights coming loose.
I have never seen a PMR make it through two successive magazines without a failure. That being said... I've heard several say otherwise. They remind me of Saturn brand vehicles of the 90s... if you have a good one, you have a great exception... if you have a bad one, it's the worst in your possession, and there is no in between.
If I'm spending that much for a chance, I'm buying lottery tickets. In short... if I want to shoot a PMR, I'm going to the range and renting someone else's liability.
you keep saying that KelTec says to only use one type of ammunition...
did you even read the manual?
"The PMR-30 pistol functions best with high power ammo, often with bullet weights of 40gr
and up. This includes, but is not limited to, the following:
-CCI Maxi Mag 40gr
-Winchester Super-X 40gr
-Remington Premier Magnum 33gr"
"To load, fill the magazine by pressing a cartridge downward in the
center of the magazine, with the rim situated within the rim window. Then slide the round
back all the way before pushing another round down on top of it
After loading about 5 rounds lightly tap the back of the magazine against a flat surface,
like a table, to help seat the rounds, and keep the rims arranged correctly. "
most PMR-30 owners dont have anywhere near the issues you seem to be experiencing
I have to agree with you. I also read the instructions. Because I followed the instructions, I tap the mag as I load it and I haven't had a single failure to feed/fire with fully loaded mags, regardless of the ammo I used. Of course I too follow the guidelines in the manual.
I exclusively use gold dot hornady and cci
Pmr 30 is too damn finicky...I do like keltec though ..I will keep my beretta and glock
I don't know anyone but I'll send multiple videos where people have had issues with them...BUT it's still I left the amount of videos I've seen with the Glock 40 for screwing up with almost every kind of ammunition you put in it even if you loaded the "correct way"... and I should also mention that I've seen the way more videos with the PMR-30 saying it function fine and had little issues at all then I had seen videos complaining about it that there are some videos out there where it malfunctions so I'm guessing some people just get a "lemon" and/or got a poor-quality version of it somehow or something that made it through quality control without being checked
@@stephenszabo2361 I own a couple of Glocks. They are extremely durable, and reliable, but I think they are butt ugly. They look like something made on a band saw from a block of wood. I can't fault them for anything except that.
Growing up my dad carried a Colt 1911. I think it's a work of art compared to a Glock. I still keep it under my pillow and won't part with it for sentimental reasons, but handguns have really came a long way since then!
I also have both guns and like them both. The 22 TCM is more reliable but I do not have the issues with my PMR30 that you do. I have two and both fire pretty much anything but it doesn't like 22 WMR Armscor rounds much. I think its the nickel plating. I shoot fiocchi ammo most but have no issues with CCI, Winchester, and Hornady.
I have no issues with 20 rounds in the magazine and 25 is pretty good. 30 is usually an issue, for some reason it wont eject some rounds. Just FYI a guy on amazon sells a 3d printed loader for the PMR 30. It shipped from American speed loader. If you continue to shoot it, it worth every penny. The only thing I do different when loading is after 10 rounds, I tap the magazine on something a few times to seat the rounds. I hope that helps with you. Great video
As an owner of a PMR 30 i have use other ammo types and it functioned just fine.what i found help the most was getting a good Mag loader for your PMR if that mag is not loaded right it will give you problems the mag loader i found that works well for it is Maglula Lula Magazine Speed Loader and Unloader for Kel-Tec PMR-30
The maglula is the finest speed loader for these mags, actually since buying the one for the PMR I will be buying one for each of our magazine fed firearms
I didn't find this comparison helpful. I have both of these pistols, and love the PMR. I have about 1000 rounds through mine and 4 total malfunctions and all during the first 100 rounds (all FTF). I can load the mags fine right up to 30, with and without my speedloader. Also, it is hammer fired pistol, not striker fired (take it apart sometime!). I like the RIA too.
I have a PMR as well and I love it. People nowadays are after instant gratification and the PMR is something you have to work for. If you want something that works and mostly looks like a gun go buy a Glock. If you want something with style innovation and a conversation piece every time you it out and kel tech PMR and CMR yes it comes in a rifle as well!!! Lol he owns a rim fire gun put 100 rounds in it and didn't clean it? Well, my dad taught me better than that.
@@mandarb23 yes, apparently he had a libtarded dad.
I only have the PMR but I’m very happy with mine. I only have about 200 rounds through mine with no failures. Loading the mags are a pain though. But the trigger is outstanding IMO.
off. Amazon has them as well as the gun stores
@@butchglancy3850 hey they sell a loader for those PMR mags. I have both pistol and carbine, and that thing can slap in 25 rounds without chewing your fingers
recently picked up a pmr for my wife to use for home defense and haven't had an issue with feeding at all. I've ran the cci maxi mag ammo and I've ran hornady critical defense through it.
The TCM has almost 75% more ftlbs. and watching your body motion and the the handgun with each shot, it's obvious the 22TCM has more recoil.
My recent manufacture PMR30 (2 years) operates flawlessly. The specified 40 grain ammo is not totally necessary. I bought 500 rounds of CCI 30 grain TNT HP and it is operating without a hiccup. High velocity matters. Lower pressure ammo like Winchester or Armscor will not cycle the action. There aren't many options currently for 22 TCM ammo. That and the price are a disadvantage. Try the Maglula speed loader for the PMR30. It will make life easier if you want to load 30. 22WMR will be here long after 22TCM fades away.
What is the difference between 22WMR and 22TCM I'm young so trying to learn thank you!
Pmr 30 can be upgraded fully from mcarbo and reliability goes way up with their complete kit! Definitely try it out it’s worth the money
Pmr 30 is my first gun. After I loaded the magazine a few times it ran great and I was able to get 30 rounds in. It was used, maybe because it was broke in already I didn't have many issues. I love not having to reload so much at the range!
Just bought this same RIA 1911 22TCM pistol; can't wait to try it at the range!
I have put about 600 rounds through my PMR 30 and I have found that the Hornady 45 grain Critical Defense and the Aguila 40 grain Silver Eagle also work exceptionally well. I typically only load 20 rounds at a time and tap the back of the magazine during loading after every 3-4 rounds. Same solid results with my CMR 30 as well. Love this combo!
Aguilla makes great ammo. One of my favorite manufacturers.
Good comparison review. 22TCM is fun 👍
I have a Rock Island double stick magazine. It holds 17 rounds and have never once had a malfunction with either .22 TCM or 9 mm configurations. I have over 500 rounds through it with both configurations. I love it and I carry it with the 9 mm configuration. The pistol is very flexible.
RIA has done something pretty amazing with that pistol.
Very good video / comparison. I like the addition of the fast movement through the shooting to get to your details and thoughts.
With the pmr30,it all ckmes down to how ya load the magazine. Load it wrong screws up all day long,load it right,its sweet n tight.
Like we were always told loading the magazine for the old army 1911 45acp, make sure the rounds are all the way back in the mag. Tap the back of the mag against your hand or leg during loading. I ensure the rounds are loaded properly and do not have issues. Yes it is more difficult to load 30 rounds but done properly they work without problems. That is with 40gr especially. Some 36gr may give occasional problem.
Muzzle flash is wasted powder. Same reason why short mag rounds suck. The back pressure of the brass neck simply doesn't allow the powder to burn and create pressure before you loose seal. Furthermore, the turbulence causes the cartridge to blow raw powder down the barrel.
Great capture, by the way! Great vid!
I recently got a CMR 30 for $400 even, Haven't had any problems. I usually load 25 rounds at a time (because boxes come with 50) and I've had zero issues out of 300 rounds. It was also pretty easy to load and I was hitting oranges pretty consistently at about ~40 feet. It seems most of the issues with this firearm were either fixed with more recent versions, or with its carbine-length sibling. Also great video, never heard of 22 TCM, nice to know how it performs.
It was clearly visible when you loaded the PMR30 mag that you got the rounds crossed up twice and didn’t correct it. You also didn’t show tapping the mag like is recommended. Two very important things to do for correct mag function in this case.
Sorry - I don't fall for that. If your product requires that I hold my tongue just right and ensure that the sun is over my left shoulder or it won't work... your product sucks.
Justin Opinion
Well if you want a handgun with a 30 round capacity and all the benefits that the PMR30 offers then you need to be willing to treat it exactly the way the manufacturer stipulates. If you’re not willing to do that then get a Glock like everybody else. But don’t treat a PMR30 the same as a Glock and then complain that it’s not a Glock. That’s just silly.
And btw- there is a big difference between holding your tongue just right and correctly loading a mag. And I would never load a mag with gloves on like you do in your video. Those cartridges are small and not easy to grasp even in perfect circumstances. Why make it harder?
FYI, if you tap the mag on it's edge every 3-4 rounds you will have a lot fewer failure to feed issues with the PMR30! I have 4 mags, and have them all filled with 30 rounds each. I have put 300 or so rounds through my pistol with little to no issues. I can EASILY carry 120 rounds with me, and if I need more than that, I was screwed anyway. The PMR does put out a pretty large muzzle flare with the Hornady rounds I use with it. I was told to AVOID the CCI ammo you are using, by the way. My brother bought the carbine version, the CMR-30, still 22 magnum rimfire, same 30 round mag. That thing is a GREAT varmint gun! He nailed a HUGE rat the other night (about 1.5x the length of a dollar bill WITHOUT the tail! And FAT!) that was stealing chicken feed out of the feeder. He nailed it right behind it's ear from about 50ft away...since he was using Winchester sub-sonic ammo, he didn't even bother the neighbors!
The reason there is a manufacturer suggested ammunition is, that's what it was designed to shoot. In this case, you have a blowback operated handgun and need a 40 grain or higher to cycle the operation. Otherwise you will have feeding and ejecting issues.
On the PMR mags... load them with 30 rounds... and let them sit for a few weeks. It will help break in the springs, and make them easier to load. Also, just like for any mag, you can get speed loaders which help once you get used to using them.
WHAT KIND OF 22'S DO YOU USE IN YOURS
CCI makes the best rimfire ammo. PERIOD.
Truth
We did the “2x4” test on 22mag for penetration. We bought every brand of 22 mag we could find, like 8 different bullets. For whatever it’s worth, the Rem PSP out performed every other bullet in penetration by a long shot! We were shooting them out of a rifle but was interesting to see. ✌️
Yup CCI or American Eagle Federal
@@chrishenicke2052 Seen cci PSP in Buds yesterday. Be interesting to see the 2x4 test with those.
@@chrishenicke2052 interesting. Thank you for sharing.
A friend of mine had an itch to get the kel-tek and like you had constant feed issues with it I think he settled on no more than 18 rounds as the most to load. I have heard other say they had the same feed issues. From what I experienced shooting it as well as others we all agree its spring pressure causing the issue. I think the Kel-Tek is a good shooter limiting load capacity. I have a GSG 1911-22 that shoots great and as I want to add a 9mm 1911 to my stash I intend to get the RIA 22TCM/9mm. Since I still think the Kel-Tek is a good gun I might just buy one at a later date. That later date will be after the purchase of a decent quality .223 for up to 400 yard shooting and high quality 6.5 Creedmoor fore up to one mile shooting. I am having to recover from theft of firearms and other stuff from my home when I was out of state.
Great Video, very informative. Thank you! Keep up the great work!!
Very interesting video. Viewers should not hastily announce their opinions on what you think one way or another about a product. You do great job on it all, keep up the good work. We can all learn from one another by sharing our thoughts and experiences. The PMR-30 probably was leaving the factory too fast early on. That we understand is pretty much a thing of the past. If a gun has problems Kel Tec is a great US based company and they stand behind their entire lineup of firearms. That’s what counts.
I own the carbine version. I have yet to have a misfeed with either the two provided or the ones I bought to continue the fun.
Love my 10mm RIA 1911 (Tac II Ultra or something... with the full rail). I'd love to find a 22TCM/9mm combo gun at a good price and I'd definitely take the RIA over the Keltec.
You just need an MCARBO upgrade for your pmr-30. Get the steel feeding ramp, POLISH IT WHEN YOU GET IT, and it’ll shoot without a single hiccup🤙🏼
My PMR-30 has had a few malfunctions in approx 1K rounds, and those were clearly due to some shit .22 WMR ammo I had laying around for years prior to purchasing the gun. I used up the rest of the box of that old stuff and since then I have only run that Hornady V-MAX ammo through it and it’s been 100% reliable with that stuff. When I picked up the gun from the FFL, I grabbed myself an Uplula mag loader for it and it has saved me so many headaches and sore thumbs!! Those things are truly an indispensable piece of kit for the range!! One tip that I heard Kel-Tec recommends for loading the PMR-30 mags is that every 5-10 rounds you are supposed to smack the mag into your palm with the back side of the magazine, kind of like you would pack a pack of cigarettes..
Amazon has a speed loader for under $20 and it completely changes the PMR30. Most issues around the PMR 30 are in the 30 round mag. After the first 15 you end up denting rounds trying to cram in the last 15. That causes all kinds of feeding and ejecting issues. The speed loader resolves 99% of the issues! LOVE MY PMR AND CMR 30 after getting the loader.
Thanks Justin so far mine has been great I like the pmr 30 don’t have a rock island
Will be picking up a RIA 22TCM/9mm in several days. After seeing this video I will also take my PMR30 to the range!
I think all us gun people need a RIA 22TCM just for the muzzle flash. LOL
Love the PMR 30. Lusting the 22TCM!
I got a loader for the PMR-30 on Ebay. Made loading the magazine a LOT easier. Best $25 I've spent on it. But between it being rimfire and such a low kinetic energy, I prefer the TCM. I have the newer double-stack with 17 rounds, and the recoil is next to nothing, and I find that I TRUST it more because it's centerfire.
If you take the gloves off you could load the mags "More Gooder"
There's a company that makes a stainless steel feed ramp, a stronger recoil spring, along with a modified magazine release that not only makes it harder to accidentally release the magazine but also raises the magazine up a little closer to the feed ramp and when you combine all of those together you can shoot any 22wrm manufactured including flat tipped rounds.
I got the mcarbo kit and it still runs like shit.
Some guys say locktite the screws, and double check all screws. Other issue was fluted barrel caused feeding issues and overpressure issues, so if its fluted don't use it and get the barrel changed.
Nice comparison / review.
I also have a pm30 and suspect it's a 3rd gen, purchased from a pawn shop. I've only had feeding issues with anything over 25 rounds and hollow points. Might have been 28 loaded, the last 2 - 3 rounds is painful to load and potentially damages the wmr case.
I am using the extended barrel with accompanied attachment and notice no muzzle flash.
When loading hollow points the tip catches on the feed lip. Close examination alludes to it being incorrectly aligned. I suspect
As much as I want the Pmr I don’t want all it’s issues and there notoriously bad when it comes to the feed ramp so the only way I would buy it is if it comes with all the parts that need to be changed so it runs the way it’s supposed to at no extra cost.
I don’t know what they dont upgrade the gun in factory before hand then sell you a good gun.
I’ll go with the .22 smith and Wesson and I don’t really care about the money it will cost as long as it’s not a lemon.
I'd like to see a review on the RIA 22 magnum..
I'm a big fan of 22 TCM. Just wish it was more readily available.
USClight That's the only thing holding me back. I can't believe this round hasn't became more popular. It's awesome! It's .223 power, in a handgun. Crazy!!!!!!
I just heard of this tcm 22. And the speed of this bullet-seems to me this would make a good defense gun
I had a kel tec with a failure to feed issue and for me the feed ramp had some machining marks that I polished out and flawless afterwards
Sounded like you were hitting better with the PMR, or was it just me? I don't have the TCM yet but as with my PMR I load 25 in the mags (which splits the 50 round box nicely) and rarely have a problem. Don't forget to tap the back of the mag every 5 rounds or so. I've always done this with my AR 15 mags anyway so no biggie there.
TCM is higher velocity, could be that the mic isn’t adjusting compression fast enough to get back to a compression you can hear the steel ring vs the gun blast
@@calebnation7797 I would like to see real world chronographs on that velocity, I would be willing to bet that it's a higher velocity out of a 12-14" barrel than a 5" barrel and the box will not reflect that, they just tell you a speed and your happy with it.
But the size of the fireball tells me that it's loosing half it's power.
Looking more in to it you Might be able to find the mathmatic equation to figure it out. But I would say that the 2 rounds, although greatly different in powder charge, are running about the same velocity, the overcharge and fireball out of the tcm round can also greatly affect the accuracy negatively
My PMR 30 shot low and to the left when I got it. I adjusted the front sight to be right on horizontally but the back sight was not adjustable for elelvation. So, I made a peep sight for the back that was was a little higher than the orange optical dots and have yet to try it. it does look good with the Crimson Trace green dot that was sighted in at last use.
The PMR 30 just needs break in of the mags. Plus you easy damage with a little dent the case of the .22 mag round if you don't load it correctly which is the cause of malfunction. After I learned how to load and used them
a couple of times all 6 mags shoot 30 rounds every time.
There's a new loading tool for the PMR (my friend owns one) and it worked amazingly.
Ammunition matters bc of the polymer frame. I had the same issues you experience and I had a gunsmith tell me "it just needs a heavier load and it'll shoot fine." Lol so .... 50 grain federal n you will have a great gun with a fully functional 30 round magazine. I run 30 consistently with 0 issues. Also I have the first gen. But I will say there is a break in range. But after getting 50 grain ammo along with breaking it in. I'd trust my life with it now. Edc!
Of course you are gonna crap on a firearm at less than half the price of that ria, but quite honestly, putting 30 rounds in your hands in a single mag using the proper ammo is far better than a 10 round mag.
Then getting in to firearm weight, that 1911 copy weighs more as just a slide than the keltec fully loaded.
The keltec also has the fiberoptic sights all around.
As far as it goes the keltec is a much better option in my opinion for home and self defense after proper break in. It's also a very fine lightweight hunting sidearm.
Keltec also has a great support team, and there are many performance upgrades that can be had still well under the cost of the ria model, as well as ammo availability and price! 40gr plus weight only!
The Gen 1 PMR-30 gave me nothing but problems failure to feed failure to eject got rid of it gave it another chance with the gen2 it's been reliable ,fun and accurate definitely one of my favorites 👍
I put MCARBO parts in my pmr30. Steel feed ramp and their mag release. Mine hasn't jammed or had the dreaded issues they're know for. I shoot 40 grain ammo in mine.
I would love to see a chrono reading on the 22 TCM. Probably no faster velocity out of that short barrel.
22 mag 1875 fps out of a rifle. 22 tcm probably close to that or more out of the pistol
james ferguson
Why would it be faster out if a shorter barrel? All that powder has no dwell time to burn.
@@MaxHeadspace9mm sorry probably worded it wrong.I watched a Paul Harrell video were he chronos a tcm 22 out of a 1911 getting over 2000 fps. I have chrono 22 mag out of 6 inch barrel and got around 1100 fps .sorry about that
james ferguson
Ah! Thanks for the info!
Average 2050 out of the 5" barrel.
what about price, and the price of the ammo?
20.00 for 50 tcm's last I checked
@@independentthinker8930 exactly its only $8-$13 for 22wmr
@@tjsspyder ok, I haven't bought any in a long time. Figured it was more. Thanks. I load all my centerfire, lost track of loaded ammo prices through the years.
@@independentthinker8930 sorry man that wasnt meant to be directed specifically at you or negative. have a wonderful pew pew day lol
@@tjsspyder hey, no problem, didn't take it that way
America baby !!! Those fireballs were HUGE
Pmr mags just need broken in after about 6 mags runs pretty flawless.
I have had zero problems loading and firing all 30 rounds out of my PMR30
I have had one for a few years now shot different brands of ammo no problems ever
@@Ed-ev7xc would you ccw it? Im considering
CC everyday and leave the Croatian hammer in the truck or in the bag if needed for some horrid situation 🤔
I don't believe that unless you managed to get a good one.
I have 8 pmr mags and they are not that hard to load. When i first bought the pmr i didnt read the manual and had a bunch of failure to feed problems. Took it home and read the manual and watched keltecs video on loading the mags. After that no more problems. Ive shot about 2000 rounds of armscor 40 grain with no problems. This last weekend i bought the cp33 and i will tell you first thing i did was read the manual. Now those cp33 mags are hard to load. But using the right ammo it will not give you any malfunctions. I tried remington golden bullet and had a bunch of failures. But then i tried federal match 40 grain and both mags fed reliably.
My friend the mags is more likes for 38sup,
You can also conversation the pistol in 4 calibers
9mm, 22TCM, 38sup, and believe or not also in 7.62x25 tokarev,
I have.
The only problem is that the 7.62 ammo you can only put 7 rounds in the single stack
And on the double stack you can put around 14 to 15 rounds
I just want to say after i field stripped it and put a coating of Hoppe’s oil on it and on the inside of the mags, it ran like a Singer Sewing machine with any ammunition i fed through it 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸😊…
I've always wanted a 22TCM. It's designed for short barrels where the 22mag is not. Thank you for comparing these two. You may have some bad PMR-30 mags or it just may be a break in issue. Keltec guns and mags sometimes need 200 - 300 rounds before they work reliably. I routinely load mine with 25rds because it is exactly half a box of ammo (try that the the TCM, lol) and therefore makes for a consistent loading and shooting experience. I and I dare say most PMR owners enjoy good reliability.
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i will say as a guy who has had quite a few rds through my pmr you do need to give it a thorough break in period. once they are good and used you can confidently load and fire with very little problem 20-25 rds but after 15 you do need to tap them every rd to make sure they seat correctly. i dont think its a good gun for defense because of how finicky they can be. you can run them very well but the fact is there are alot of things you do need to learn and that makes it not a good gun for anything but the range. i will also say that my first one blew up in my hand and keltec was extremely quick in replacing and apologizing, they gave me a call had a gunsmith walk me through some of the quirks and since then its a dream... fun to shoot accurate easy to shoot. i would say its great for a beginner on a count of how disciplined you need to be to shoot it correctly. for example, it can teach really good behaviors like having a tight grip while managing the small recoil. if you have a loose grip it will jam. if you dont load and seat the ammo correctly it will jam. if you run cheap ammo, it will jam. it recommends cci maxi mag but i find that any high quality high velocity ammunition is good in it. i have ran federal and a few other brands that are just pricey and as long as i didnt run low velocity ammo, or dirty ammo it ran very well.
does the TCM come with the 9mm barrel ..2 guns for one
Yeah thats what I was saying to myself before when he saying that the RIA is almost $900 but its still the better gun obviously anyone who i know who has the PMR has told me that they are trash.. and what I have seen tells me they are garbage on the other hand RIA 1911's are great with any caliber you pick...
I bought the 22tcm paid 680.00 with the 9mm barrel and spring
@@jbro427 that sounds more like it
I've both calibers 9mm 22tcm, and a 22magnum in rock island arms . Each has their own uses . I'm thinking about getting the 22magnum like you have there, 2 full magazines per hunting trip . My 5.7x28 has its use also
The only downside to the pmr 30 is you cannot reload your brass. Great gun!! I was frustrated at first too until I learned how to properly load it. Great gun!!!
You were not loading the magazine for the pmr30 correctly. Should be taping the every 3-4 cartridges to assure the back of the bullet touches tge back of the loading. The pmr 30 is very reliable. If you have the patience to load it correctly.
I have both the 22 tcm and the pmr. The ria 22 tcm needs to be well lubricated, if well lubricated it runs like a rolex. The only time i had any problem was because it was not lubricated.
The pmr 30, have not had a single issue, i only use cci maxi. At first i tried loading 30 rounds and started denting cases so backed off to 25 until the mag spring gets broke in.
If you had to choose between the 22TCM vs PMR 30 vs PSA 5.7 vs Ruger 57, which would you choose? Why?
That's the first thing I do before I buy handgun has asked the guy it doesn't have a big muzzle flash
I have the polymer MAPP R.I. version of the TCM22. The ammo is a bit different for both versions and the 1911 ammo will not work in the MAPP version. Fireballs are the same. I had somebody at the indoor range get a bit irate because he couldn't believe I was shooting just a 22 and though I was lying to him. No worries about a specific ammo for the TCM as there's only one available and it works. You can get the polymer TCM for cheaper than the PMR-30. I thought I wanted the Kel-Tec until I held/shot it, no thanks. It's one of my favorite pistols and every one loves shooting it.
Do you have the TCM9R then? Ive been trying to find info on it, but there doesn't seem to be much out there. I was going to try the Glock 19 conversion barrel to that caliber.
rcwck I've been looking at that MAPP. I was just worried about reliability. You got me thinking... Hmmm
I have over 1000 rounds through my PMR 30 and have had 2 malfunctions. I have used numerous brands of ammunition with no difficulty, however, the recommended CCI brand has worked best. The two malfunctions which occurred I attribute to operator error, specifically the loading of the magazines. Kel-Tec recommends tapping the magazine after every 5 rounds or so, which I do, and have no issues. Possibly you have a lemon or your magazine loading technique is causing the problem. I have enjoyed my PMR 30 immensely and have no issues in recommending it to others. Now, the CMR 30 operates much closer to your description and I am not as happy with it as I am with the PMR.
You did put out some very good quality content on these 2 pieces. I also own both and will agree with you that the Keltec PMR 30 is a lot o5th6f fun and though it comes with a 30 round mag it's almost impossible to put all 30 rounds in the mag and it's going to malfunction 95% of the time if you put more than 15. The 30 round magazine really gives the Keltec a bad name. If they wouldn't have focused on volume of rounds and would've went with half the amount 15 rounds they would've hit the bullseye 🎯. Still a very fun piece but not recommended for self defense because of lack of reliability. The Rock Island is a chunk of weight but made out of good steel not plastic. Yes the price is doubled but you have to realize that you are really getting 2 firearms in one, a 22tcm and a 9mm. Same size round but cannot judge them putting them on paper. The 22tcm will penitrate 1/4" steel like it's been drilled with a drill bit. Beautiful holes all day long through steel. The Keltec won't do that. The velocity is so much faster with the 22tcm. As for rounds, my Rock Island came with a 15 round magazine so it'll hold a total of 16 rounds so that's not bad. Please do a review on the FN 5.7x28 vs the Keltec PMR 30. I own one and the weight of the 5.7 matches the pmr 30. The 5.7 also comes with 3-20 round mags but I purchased a 30 round mag to go with it and it doesn't stick out the mag well. The magazine has the handle material built on it and fits beautifully with the 5.7 pistol. Now you are comparing 30 rounds against 30 rounds and the bullets are close to the same in diameter. I think it would be an awesome review. Thanks again for your educational videos one can learn a lot from watching the wonderful job that you do.
I usually split a box of 50 between the two magazines for an easy-to-load outcome with the PMR-30.