Are HLG test results wrong? HLG 350R led grow light PAR test
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 พ.ย. 2021
- horticulturelightinggroup.com...
Independent test of the HLG 350R (integrated sphere test): cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/153...
I test the HLG 350R and compare my test results to HLGs independent integrated sphere test and they are not the same. Which test is accurate?
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Shane, I've been watching on and off for 2.5 years. You're an incredible asset to us all. I can't say thank you enough. Keep it up, please!
I second that sentiment
If anyone wants to thank him enough,
Buy his damn light
Shane, you do an outstanding job, no need to invite criticism, keep doing what you do my good man and we'll keep watching 😉
I knew you were dedicated but it wasn't until I saw the predator heat vision that I knew you were that hard core. Well done!
Clear explanation about the differences between measurement types. And I actually think the one you use is more useful and closer to real life performance. Though it's not wrong to use the ideal conditions type because it's even more neutral (even less variance between measurement setups).
It's pretty misleading to use an integrated sphere and advertise the efficiency as that result. No one is growing in an integrated sphere so, as we see from Shane's test, there's a big difference between HLG's advertising and what you're getting.
Wow all y’all HLG haters saying the light sucks when the guy you are following literally says in the video it’s the second highest he has ever tested! Only behind the chilled which costs wayy more. He literally says “for the money this the best grow light in the market” so you follow him and listen to him but then disagree all while saying and respecting him as the authority😂
Listen tho I woulda liked to see it at a different height the par map didn’t look good but at 15” I get burned leaves. For me is best 18” to 24” away in a 2.5 x 5 feet tent. Great coverage wall to wall. The actual recommended hanging height is 15-24 inches. He didn’t test the other ranges I guess for the sake of hitting 1000 in the center but I don’t see a need for 1000 ppf. If you get 700 all over then your tent will pack out. Vs focusing on 1000 in the center and leaving the sides to suffer.
Another super informative video!Shane has become a scientist of par reading each video he increases descriptive priorities for consumer to receive the highest and most energy efficient grow light on the market.Thanks!
Thanks for making all the theory behind testing grow light seem so simple.
Great in depth review, you just keep knocking it out the park.
Thank you Shane! Always a pleasure to watch your tests and learn something (I didn't know about the integrated sphere).
I have 2 of the 350rs and they have been perfect for my 5x5. By having the extra 50 watts compared to the 650 watt lights I can raise my lights a little higher and get better spread over the canopy. I use a Par meter to set the height and away we grow. Also If I have a couple plants that stretch, I can adjust 1 light higher. You cant do that with the big 650 watt lights. Plus they are about $400 cheaper than the Scorpion with 50 more watts if you buy 2. Thanks for the great work Shane! 👍
Makes alot of sense 👌
I got this light and it's freaking powerful! To anyone new to this light be careful not to roast your girls!
Don't get me wrong it's worthe every penny for sure!
Yeah QBs tend to have pretty bad hotspots.
@@HAPPYHERBS1 I literally had it at 50=percent and 20" away and leaves were curling and loosing chlorophyll. Strain dependant I'm sure, I have it in an open room set-up at the moment. I am thinking of putting it in the 3x5 tent. Instead
love mine also. I have 4 in a 4x8. They go hard
@@Prairie_Plant_Daddy nice set-up. I'm all over the place with lights at the moment. Optic led is my primary lights, but I had such good results with the 100 watt v2 rspec that I went and bought this light to try. are you intrested in getting another one? As much as I like the light I want the 650s from Optic.
@@HAPPYHERBS1 have it in a 5x5 and it's powerful. Had to raise it up more and I only run it at about 60 percent. It's alot warmer than I expected, wished I could put the driver outside the tent.
Great video Shane I asked you about this specific light and you definitely delivered deserves a thumbs up and a cheers thank you!
Allways thank you.
Love & peace 🙏
Great review 👏 I own one of these and they're outstanding. I appreciate the information. Also, I ordered one of your UVB 310 supplement lights and I can't wait to add it to my tent, thanks!
Another factor to consider is, not all drivers are created equal. Your could have a +/-5% output from one driver to another.
I have noticed with HLG some of there tests with meanwell drivers had increased efficiency over the inventronics drivers.
thank you. I'm glad we can see hlg now
Always great info 👍 definitely appreciate these reviews.
Simple explanation, and as always a great presentation.
U are very knowledgeable thanks for ur videos
Superb explanation Shane.....
Thanks for the real world review.
This is a great light. It performs well. Beyond my expectations. I paired it with 3 -100 watt Mammoth Led bars on each side. All I can say is wow!!!!
Cheers Shane. Nice review as usual.
Love my 350r. Gonna buy another which would make it a scorpion.
I love watching your reviews cause you always find the good LED and the bad i mean you always find the them out 😂 great job love it
Good analogy for car guys. Ppf is like flywheel horse power and the integrated sphere is like an engine dyno, these are the numbers HLG are using. Shane has basically shown us the same engine in a car on a chassis dyno. Ppfd is like power to the driven wheels after driveline power losses.
Nice. That's an awesome analogy you got there and I ain't even much of a car guy
First off, I enjoy all of your reviews. I'm constantly waiting for your new reviews, even for lights that I'm not interested in buying. So thanks for all of your hard work and honest reviews. I do have a question for you. How could someone tell if they have the new version or the old version of the 350r based just on the light and information on the back of the unit?
great vid. thanks again!
both are accurate but your test methodology has a more practical take from the results gathered, which apply directly to growing in tents .we are growing in tents not dyson spheres all though it would be cool af. thanks once again for the awesome review
100percent in regards to us growing In tents and not that round sphere. His calculations are more practical
Very impressive test and explanation...would love to see a review of the Electric Sky V3 300 (330w)from the Green sunshine Company in one of your future tests. Thank you Shane.
I have been dreaming of a comparison of this hlg 350r vs the electric sky es 300. They both draw about 330 watts from wall. So it’s perfect comparison.
Another great video shane, keep up the amazing work my friend 💯👊 . I hate how LED brands use Sphere tests to come up with they're efficiency numbers, who the Fk grows in a sphere 🤣🤦♂️ IMO its misleading when brands do so, cause reputable guys like yourself will test the lights and it just makes them look bad and like theyre numbers aren't legitamate .
Keep up the great work shane, love seeing you test new lights . Your videos help countless people make the right choice when it comes to purchasing new lights 🌱🤘🏻💯
Because it’s an industry standard test. In a lab. With no variables.
I agree though that it’s sort of a dumb test for grow lights to be tested in a sphere, but it’s also dumb that everyone tests lights in boxes with silver lined walls. White reflects light much better, and would yield better test results.
@@tombryant4518 you so right 👍🏽
@@tombryant4518 White does NOT reflect better than smooth or textured mylar. You're dead wrong. Shane himself had proven this.
@@MrE1981 Sure bud. There’s all kinds of scientific proof out there that says I’m correct.
I have the 350R and it’s great in my 2x4 tent. I mean ok some numbers may not add up but it’s a bad ass light. I don’t regret buying it.
When you were talking about reflectance losses I thought it would be a fun experiment to try out White 2.0 or "THE WORLD'S BRIGHTEST WHITE PAINT" and see how that stacks up against normal white paint, and reflective mylar etc
I like your testing, it's real world.
I can see where the desire is to get the bigger advertisable number for the stats chasers though. No one I know of grows in a test sphere :) all reflected light is a loss.
Just shows me that no matter who you are buying from, look for real world test results you can apply to your area.
You dont grow in a sphere man ? Its 2021 dammit! 😂
Shane You are definitely the go-to man for lights opinions, tests and reviews I definitely have Alot of respect for you
Excellent video and info this is why I watch your videos. Thanks for the knowledge.
hi... great videos can i ask what are you using to show the individual light umol outputs on your phone? thank you....
Have you ever calculated the error introduced by the pixelation used to measure the PPFD map? It will probably be way lower than 15% and it can also overestimate. But that could be interesting.
Thank you shane. Is this comparable to you Pro 4?
Im leaning towards yours because of the shape of my closet(and I'd like to support you).
Even so i like to see your side by side numbers if available✌
Christmas present to my self. 😉
Merry Christmas to you and yours Shane
Criticism ? I’m afraid I can’t offer any lol love the videos I watch a lot of light reviews I’m always looking for information, your videos are full of information keep doing what your doing shane if it’s not broke don’t fix it lol keep it up buddy 💯
Hi Shane, can you suggest what was the room temperature when you did the thermal imaging of the light.
Wow great review Shane!!
Did the give any info on controls switch and changes per click?
The sphere test numbers sound like they're using Samsung LM301H Diodes which were sphere tested at around 3.10 umouls/Watt.
I still have 2-240W Quantum type Samsung boards w/Meanwell Drivers, as well as having very nice black heatsinks, rather than just an aluminum board.
From eBay, almost a year ago. A DIY which just required me to attach a few wires with a Wago connector. Super easy! Paid less than $1(US) per Watt, so under $250 each then. I believe from 412-LED(eBay seems down right now..? Great seller. Helped me out!).
These days I've been trying some array type fixtures with long bars. Shane's Array fixtures weren't out yet, so I'm jealous, lol. Shane and Migro have always had the top tiers of lighting fixtures, and this is no surprise, at all!
I think HLG may be stuck in a time machine?(still great lights, but using cheaper components then previously, it seems..?).
Great review and explanation of spheres vs actual canopy light! Thanks again Shane!👍✌️
what the hell are you smoking
HLG stuck in a time machine? They are the original “quantum board”. Fluence and HLG are the original high ppfd led manufacturers of grow lights. There were a few other guys but they really started the Samsung Osram craze. HLG uses some of the best products on the market. They also have hands down some of the best customer service ever. You know when you buy them you are getting real Samsung diodes. I bought a knock off “quantum board” and they aren’t Samsung diodes at all.
@@ModifiedTacoYes. They even patented the term Quantum Board. Definitely one of the original high ppfd LED companies. Fluence, as well. First "bar" light I saw at the Hydro store. "There from a local manufacturer", I was told. They are from the Austin, TX, area, but were never really "pushed" here, at all..?! IDK if they're still here..?!
I forgot I watched this, and commented, lol. "HLG stuck in a time machine" wasn't meant as an insult, just that Quantum Boards haven't changed much. No Meanwell Driver above, if at all anymore (Still Great drivers. I think Meanwell were just one of the first made for grow lights..?!)🤔.
The newer Diablo fixtures got me thinking Quantum Boards aren't the future, and the "bar lights" had a better light spread around the canopy, even though the corners are still low.
Then GML comes out with their Tarantula. "A Diablo copy", my first reaction. Until seeing Shane's latest videos testing it. 8 quantum type boards, instead of 6, like HLG's..?!
Best efficiency and canopy spread he's ever tested, even in the corners! HLG could have designed these, as they're based on their Diablo, but didn't, sadly.
I would have loved it if HLG had figured out this simple change in design. They've always had excellent customer service, especially if there's any problems, which are rare.
I know someone with their newest 350W fixture, like above. The driver failed. They immediately sent him a new driver, overnight, then asked for the failed driver to be sent back.
Usually, a company would want the old driver first, then try to repair it, etc. HLG has always been tops in this area!👍💯✌️
@@jacobstanfill9538"The Devil's lettuce", of course. Hellfire!😄😄
Question. Did you set the light up on 120v or 240v ? What is your heat output from your setup? Is there a difference in the heat output between 120v or 240v?
Can you do a 2x4 update. I don’t think anyone would really run this at a 3x5.
Best lights
Yeah, apart from like 5 other companies, best light 👌
Would you recommend this over the Chilled Growcraft X3?
i like it
Thanks for clearing this up for me I watched the guys from hlg on a DGC podcast and they claimed like 3.3 ppfd awhile ago which was an unbelievable amount at that time coming from a quantum board IMO
those diablo boards are fire
In other words PPF is the total amount of light coming from the fixture. This is used to measure the efficiency of the LEDs. PPFD is the practical application of that light onto a surface.
When you do your mapping it would be nice if you would go down a few inches and up a few inches. If this curve is linear we can then nominalize the data and come up with our own PPFD at different heights. You should also let us know the minimum height where the data starts to shift because the two boards are separated. That would definitely tell us are minimal distance for a reasonable drop off.
Can u test an optic bar light like there 320 or 500 slim series
Shane, Do you have anyone in the US that sells your lights? Wanting a couple of your uvb lights for my 5x5 tents.
You ae the fucking man at this. Always glad I'm subbed
I wanna see a test on their black wing
What’s your fav 2x4 light ? Hlg360r sp3000 ???
i would say that with your test that a small amount of light will escape from the top because its not sealed at the top and most ppl use these in grow tents when are sealed at the top also as other have said the meanwell drivers are prob more efficient as well
Do you leave one of the sides without a mylar covered wall when you do the tests as we see, or is it just removed for the video?
you can see him measuring whit 4 sides in other vids so just removed for the video i guess
Yes all four mylar walls were in place for the test
Excellent review. Makes me wish vendors had two PPFD standard numbers: 1) ideal 2) in grow room at a minimum, we should know how they tested to get their number.
sphere testing is industry standard
What is the app youre using ?
I would have preferred to see this light reviewed in a 2x4' tent.
You should test a Kingbrite light against a HLG.
Also, the spot-on quantum sensor is rated to measure 400-700nm, right? Wouldn't the photons outside the measured bands result in a smaller PAR reading and therefore a smaller PPFD as well?
Also Par meters are not nearly 100% accurate as they do not measure all wavelengths in the 400-700 range 100% accurately.
What about new lumatek Zeus pro 2.9 Shane ?
Great review I also would like to say that HLG needs to add coating to their boards to protect the LEDS. I have had 3 lights fail and the spot it happens is exactly where plants touched.. My fault but the 3 times it happened it was in exact spot plants touched. Go ahead and do a test it might take a few weeks or months before it fails but it will fail exactly where the plants touch so don't ever let it happen..
Lmao I mean why the hell would you have your plants touching the light when it’s recommended to keep them 15” to 24” away from the light…
@@ronquando3088 had to leave town for few days. They grew over 18 inches in 4 days. Didn't expect that to happen.
A good explanation I feel. I own two. I bought one when they were still relatively new and bought one recently when HLG changed their box design to something like you'd expect to see in a retail store with graphics, graphs, etc. It's a great light. I use one to veg a 5x5 just fine. It's a jungle in there with all the moms I have. I have one flowering a 4x4, it's produced excellent results. I want to do the 3x5 as it's "supposed" to handle. With 2 already if I buy 2 more at a good price, I guess I could technically flower the 6x10 open space I have with 4 lights. I want to go that route but keep hesitating. I don't know why, I think I'm just stuck with how "controlled" a tent is and seems with how modular it is. My spaces don't have the best of conditions either but the tent keeps things just right.
I know some people than can crush a 4x4 or a 4x8 tent that are crushing it better than they could with a room twice as big. You’re right about the tent having advantages sometimes depending on your environment.
What do u do for hanging height?
Yeah dunno what we are supposed to criticize, you explain why you do everything, you use he space they suggest and your results would be closer to real life usage👌so I guess jus thanks 💚
im interested in the hlg 200 rspec but the build seem cheap. not many options for 2x3 tent
This will do it, you will get an average PAR of 1,000µmols in a 2x3: migrolight.com/collections/all/products/migro-aray-3-270w
What was the application you used on your cell phone that showed the ppfd and color spectrum?
Its the Asensetek Passport Spectradiometer with SGAL app
Have you done a scorpion diabolo 650 review ?
It's coming soon. I have the new one here ready for testing.
SHANE: No criticism. I understand why you test in the manufacturers' recommended areas. However, I took one look at the chart in this video, and found myself wondering... If you had tested that in a 2'x4' space, would you have observed an evenly high (775+) set of readings across the entire area?
Yes exactly. Even if he raised the light here instead of focusing on 1000 in the center he could have raised it until it hit 800 in the center and that would have improved the overall coverage where you could actually flower the edges.
Are the h.l.g. LED Diodes protected
I suggest you manufacture your lights with hot swappable LEDs. I bet you would grab marketshare with a repairable board. The reason I am reluctant to switch completly over to LED is because the fixture always have individual lights burn out long before their 100,000 hour rating, or they drop in intensity within a few years.
I have over 10+ fixtures, some of wich are 4 years old. Only one lil cluster has fried out of all those and it was a group of 6 on my lumatek attis.
Intensity drop is nothing like how fast a HPS will degrades, plus it's a higher quality spectrum, maybe look in to them more.
@@HAPPYHERBS1 are you happy with Lumatek? I am about to order The Photontek X6000.
That's why you avoid sketchy brands like Viparspectra & Spider Farmer who use cheap Chinese reds & then don't tell their customers what they're buying. As long as the boards use something decent like Osram SSL's or Samsung 351's they're good, reliable chips with higher efficiency than the whites. If they won't tell you what the red LED's are then they're using junk chips, they're the ones that fail.
@@RocketNothing spiderfarmer and viparspectra are using osram reds. Viparspectra makes a version w lesser diodes but its less money too. There are not even that many reds on them anyway.
Would love to see the new hlg blackbird for 4x4
Just watched it
@@cory4419 Were at?
I was under the impression these ran 4000k white and the older hlgs ran 3500 and 4000 but produced the same spectrum? Might wanna check thats 5000k rating .
thats 5000k of white with red spectrum brining the color temp down to 4500k
You cannot really measure the temperature of a highly reflective material with an IR camera. You will also capture reflected IR light. Not IR light generated through black body radiation as a result of the camera.
You could try in a dark room after turning off the light.
HLG is awesome light , but this 3.0 or 3.2 moles it's only possible on a sphere test , the way Shane tested is much more real .
Correct.... But regulatory bodies will not recognize Shane's methods. Integrating sphere testing is the most precise method of measuring light coming from a fixture and is what DLC currently uses to qualify a fixture. Shane's trading is excellent but par meter used , reflecting material efficacy, and measuring standards can and will affect the results. So the industry needs a standardized testing method that no matter where the fixture is sent it is in a lab setting.....
✊🏻🇮🇪👍🏼
You should be called “The Source!”
Why is the fixture flickering 9:01?
All leds have a Flickr just like hps. Just depends if the Camara and fixture happen to sync .....
Yea, but there's 300's and 400's in the corners. How is that a good par map?
it doesnt have Osram leds as far as i know.
I thought this light was for a 4x4 ?
🤪I just realised this is not the 650R , it’s half of one 😂
Nope, nowhere near enough coverage for a 4x4, maybe for a mother and clone tent, defo a 2x4 or 3x3 light tho.
@@HAPPYHERBS1 A really nice 2x4 light. But super expensive!
Then comes the question: 2- 350's or 1 Scorpion R Spec for a 5x5?
I rock a scorpion diablo in a 5x5 and it's perfect.
With 2 - 350s you will be able to spread exactly how you want to spread them. I also believe there may be a slight efficiency bump using multiple smaller drivers instead of 1 big one. Probably a miniscule bump, but a bump nonetheless.
If you run two lights you will have flexibility with hanging height for different strains or phenos.
This only really has good coverage in a 2x4, so 4x4 would be good for 2 but the scorp is made for a 5x5, also its 6 vs 4 boards so will give you much better coverage.
Go with the 350's. I'm rocking 4 in a 4x8 and they are killing it wall to wall
Should be better to dimm it a bit and put it in a 2x4.
That's what I did lol
Why does hps have a 30% loss?
Can it do a 2x5?
yes
They just were on a show claimed 3.2 mmpj. Yea right such B's. I'm rocking chilled grow craft x6 side by side w a diablo the output is bout the same the chilled run way cooler. Like alot cooler. Chilled x6 lights have oversized heat sinks
In your opinion is the chilled light worth the extra 250 dollars? Their new lights are 1600! Wth
@@jhonwayne1003 I think they are I've had em all, grown w em all. hlg ,growers choice ,gavita, all the big names. in actual real world grows the chilled are so over built they run so dam cool it's almost unreal. I won't run nothing but the chilled grow craft x6 now. There built to be commercial grade the heat sinks are insanely over done.
@@smokey-qq6hd I was not prepared when I saw a 1600 dollar price tag for the new ones. So let’s just say im running in a 2x4 closet. Vented to attic pulling cool air from room. Is the older version worth investing in?
@@jhonwayne1003 the x 3 is the one you want for a 2 x 4 closet. U won't be disappointed .
@@jhonwayne1003 get the chilled grow craft x3. That's all you can fit for wattage in a 2x4 . Those are not as expensive
Would somebody send this guy a 3x5 tent please?
6:50 Why don't manufacturers make a reflector on their lights? After all, this can add + 30% to the PPFD.
The price isn’t competitive.
Why do light companies make lights to cover areas that no one grows in. I. E 1.5 x 0.9
300 in the corners and barely over 500 in the 2x5 space. Horrible numbers for that space. Need at least a minimum of 600 PAR for dense flowers.
That could easily be changed by adjusting the hanging height. 15” is too close if you ask me depending on your environment. 18” to 24” away would fix those edges. And still keep the center in good ppf range
i have hlg rspec scoripn they say 5 ft flower more like 4 ft great lights i think they all lie
i find it funny so many new growers focus so much on micromoles of there light,yet buy junk genetics lmfao
What are your favorite genetics out there right now?
@@ocbosco_ Exotic Genetix, Inhouse Genetics, Compound Genetics, Seed Junkies
@@Avation911 I’m only a year in and now really focusing on genetics. Gotta start with champs if u wanna grow champs. Thanks brotha 👊🏼
The best are the ones with TH-cam channels, showing everyone how to grow autos 🤦♂️😂😂
@@ocbosco_ Archive and Prolific Coast.
Hmmmmmm
That ppfd map was trash…….that’s why light bars are the way to go…..solid work Shane as always
I think it was just a little oversized area , in a 4x2 the numbers would be crazy all across
@@GLClarity yeah if you take the outer measurement away it would be better but still nothing on a light bar giving a whole canopy within 50/75 par across the board. Trade of is less light pen but depends how you grow wich is best for you.
@@GLClarity They would be good but I can run two Viperspectra P1500s in a 2x4 for $180 US. Not as quite as good but $370 less money.
@@HAPPYHERBS1 it would be better then just taking away the outer layer the closer walls would reflect the light and give higher numbers across the canopy … not saying its a perfect light or that i would buy it over competitors just that it would do better in a smaller area
@@gregkramer5588 thats true … im not advocating the purchase of the light just saying it was in a oversized test area ( in my opinion) i actually have hlg scorpion diablo and mars hydro bar style and prefer the cheaper bar style but there both good when used in the right footprint . Like you said hlg slightly better but much higher price my comment is only on the space it was tested in
This is a 4x3 or 4x2 light.. just saying..