I owned a 2002 CR250 for 8 years, I found out it likes to be ridden like a 125. High up in rpms. It never liked to be lugged around. It's a blast on mx tracks, not so much trails. Granted, that's what it was designed for.
Yep, a bit disingenuous, an old MX bike compared to a modern enduro. Some suspension work to level the playing field and open trails would give the Honda a chance. Some footage on the pipe would have been nice, too. They really fly with commitment. I'm a bit puzzled about the clutch comments. My 93 CRM is one finger operation and resembles all the comments in the vid.
Actually the 2003 KTMs were not so bad. You did get the hydro clutch but had to deal with PDS which is meh.. The KTMs also had a much more progressive power delivery as the powervalve was actually really good even back then. Could it hang with a CR on the track, no way but IMO better trail bike still.
I think this comparison is about buying a older bike and doing it up or just buying a new bike, because obviously the newer 300 will win hands down its 15 years newer technology lol
No doubt the Ktm will excell in alot more offroad situations. Now consider comparing a 2004 ktm sx to the Honda...or would an 04Sx even be worth reviving!?
I have a 2001 KTM EXC 300 and it is already showing its age. Sure it handles better than my 2017 690 Enduro R on the nasty stuff, but even in 2010 it was showing its age compared to my 2010 exc 300. I just restored it into running condition after 9 years sitting in the garage with some broken seals. Maybe if I restore it really nice (new header+pipe and plastics and a seat cover) in an other 9 years it can be sold as some curiosity :)
If it isnt a KTM is it really worth it.... seems like a channel dedicated to singing the praises of the orange brand. Cant believe two grown men groaned about the cable clutch so much
Got my 2003 kdx 220 a little over a year ago. Bike us in immaculate shape, as it sat mostly all its life. Just got it back saturday, had the top end redone with all oem parts just to freshen it up, and to know how old it is peace of mind kinda thing. Best trail bike ive ever owned/rode
Venerable bike. My Dad has a KDX220SR, Japanese market road legal version. hilarious bit of kit. I have a 93 CRM and a 96 DT230. They will not give up, easy to fix, ride anywhere at different paces and are relatively civilised to ride. The CRM is a bit scary. I had a KDX 250 but someone had their fingers in it and it was a bit mental. Front tyre must have been 20 years old and looked fresh.
Great video Kyle and you're right the Honda is a 15 year old bike and there is a reason why KTM is excelling in off-road racing like The Iron Giant but the Honda was set up as a motocross bike there is a reason why a lot of people don't like 450,s off road as much because they're set up to be a motocross bike. Oh well I am glad you got out on the CR250 I love seeing that like on your Channel.☺👍🚲
Glad to see you on the Honda! I was watching for this everyday since you have been back! I am starting the tear down of my 2001 Cr250r this weekend and I can’t wait until it is ready to ride! Thanks for another great video!
have both 2017 300 and cr 250r 2003, fun factor go to the Honda for me, i appreciate the cr for what it is, snappy, light feel, ergonomic, and start first kick after 15 years of age with stock carb. We all know its not an enduro bike with low end torque and smooth hydraulic clutch. Its an old 2 stroke awesome motocross. Didn't notice a big difference in vibrations. Sound of the cr is music.
Sooooo.......,is the Honda’s suspension still valved for MX? If your running a mx suspension vs a Xc suspension what do you expect. That generation of Honda is known to turn great.
It's all in your set up, I race hara scrambles on my 2003 cr 250 its awesome, but it's set up for that I could not motorcross it the way it is, gearing, suspension but no flywheel weight I like the hit, If its geared right you want be on the clutch have as much, lower your clamps down on your forks 8th of an inch and it will turn
You know... I love your videos and topics and I think their great. I just wanna say that it doesn’t matter what bike you ride. You can take an old idk 85 cr250 and do everything u guys do you know? I completely believe it’s always the rider. Never the bike, car, truck whatever... new KTMs and stuff all they do is make riding trails easier. Don’t mean u can’t do it the same or even faster with an old mx bike... stock or not. Great video tho! Keep it up!🤙🏼
This video is pointless. When you first started on that CR build, I thought you were going to do a proper conversion. You can't just take a stock MX bike and ride it off road and use it to hype the orange Kool-aid. Let me know when you do a flywheel weight, porting work, a full suspension re-valve, and an 18 inch rear wheel. And whining about a cable clutch is just hilarious. This is a total scam
MotoFlightGuy a REAL RIDER would just ride it stock anyway so if u ain’t got nothin positive to say then STFU, get out of the comments and get ur own cr and do “POINTLESS” mods too it instead of putting the time and energy into making yourself a better rider.🤙🏼
@@meks8086 I have ridden AND raced hare scrambles on stock motocross bikes, and in particularly a, CR 250. A REAL RIDER would understand there's a correct tool for the job. I'll be waiting for the day you actually post content to TH-cam, until then I would suggest that YOU stay out of the comments.
I really like your videos and appreciate the time you put in to make them very polished and professional. But I'm seeing a trend here. Anything that isn't KTM pretty much has no chance. If you're going to review something like a 15 year old motocrosser then it should be reviewed on it's own merits - its a solid, reliable bike that can be had for 1/3 the price of a new KTM and you can go out and have a blast on it. It's a bike for somebody that doesn't have the budget for a brand new one and should be compared to similar bikes in this category not the newest $10k wonder. just my $.02
James G you know I I agree and disagree. What I do agree is that Honda’s old/new are bad ass reliable beasts that can do anything. I disagree with u sayin that stuff about saying they have no chance. Because if u look back in the video he does say that IF YOU GET USED TO IT it would be just fine. But... I did used to think that stuff tho but I learned that all he is doing is comparing all types of bikes to what works BETTER for enduro. Like. That you can do anything a Ktm does it’s just that ktm simply is not BETTER. But makes it EASIER for enduro.
Wallace Williford I say invest time and dedication into ur riding skills instead of blowing money on a new bike. A new bike won’t teach u shit only thing it might teach u is how blowing big bucks on a new bike don’t make u faster or a better rider🤙🏼
I have a 2002 Honda CR and I'm glad to hear you say the clutch is heavy on yours I thought I had bad clutch springs and cable and I switched all that stuff out and it was still heavy so I'm glad that it's not just me and I do agree with everything you say with the exception of the low end torque but that's only because my bike has a big bore 282 kit I did not put that on it came with that from the past owner
Great job on the CR! Looks great! Just curious why you didn’t get a bike comparable to an XC if comparing characteristics in an enduro setting was the plan. A 2003 exc perhaps? Any criticisms are kind of a washout if the machine is tested outside of it’s designed intent.
First off, the video is mistitled. This video isn't about "my first minutes," it's an informal shootout between an old Japanese MXer and a current euro-enduro. Given that, it's such a mismatch in bikes that feelings of KTM bias are inevitable among viewers. And I'm not even talking about the age difference as I think that's the variable that you set out to test on. I'm talking about the MX vs enduro aspect, and the level of setup/tuning involved. For example, you have countless minutes of tape on modding and tweaking your KTMs. You've had access to a seemingly endless supply of KTM models -- 250, 300, 2T, 4T, EFI, and several model years. And for the Honda it's "...I set the sag the same as the KTM and put (imperfect) bar risers on it and I can't understand why the front end is heavy...." Really? You guys can do better than this. Properly prep the Honda and then revisit. Or promptly sell it. EDIT: Your desert comparison of these two bikes was done on a more neutral playing field. I had also forgotten that you have $7500+ sunk in the Honda. BTW, the other thought that I had was that Kyle should stay off that Honda until he's fully recovered. He didn't look comfortable so why risk a setback?
I hope you guys work out the couple of things you don't like about the Honda. Everything you're saying so far seems pretty par for the course for that bike, but I just love seeing the old two strokes kept alive. You should try an RM250 next. Legendary handling, and the 06-08 was considered the best engine in its class at the time. Can't wait to see more.
I think a lot of these older Japanese bikes have the same symptoms as your honda. Stiff cable clutches, front wants to plow, challenging to do basic things like log hop, wheelie over obstacles, unstable cornering and low end issues, etc... the KTM, Beta's, Sherco's, etc bikes are just so much more rider friendly.
Very interesting. I would wonder if you need to adjust the suspension more for enduro riding? I ride Utah as well a lot of similar things you do as well. I have a yz450 and cr125. The yz is used for motorcross style riding and I hate it for this style. Where as my cr is setup more for enduro and I love it!
I made a woods weapon out of my 93 yz250. It's quite the tank with a ton of power. You should come up to northern idaho sometime. Hit the races while you're here.
Wheel base on the cr is longer than then the ktm I believe... so I would think more downward force on the front end heavy feeling..won’t lift the front as easy ..it’s a motocross bike ..I had many old bikes.. I am 49 years old ..they are fun no doubt but not the same kinda ride.. my ktm 300 is easy 2 ride ..in most conditions .. great job on the bike man .. glad your up and riding again!!!
OH NO..all this time ive owned my 2001 cr250 i thought it was an awesome bike. Looks cool, sounds cool, powerband ridiculous,so much fun to ride and at least 1/3 the price on a new KTM .Geeze all this time ive been wrong? Time to sell it off and buy an orange?.....I dont think so.LOL ITS A MOTORCROSS BIKE!!
The secret is to not ride the new bikes!! 😁 I just bought my boy a 2018 250 xcw, I’ve got to ride it for about :10 minutes, I had to get off that thing, I had to get back on the ol’ ‘99 cr250. That new one might just spoil a guy! P.S I just myself a new bike, 2002 cr250 for $500
I think you need to compare bikes of the same age. There should be a drastic difference when theres that much of an age difference. Plus one of them is an offroad bike and the other is a MX bike.
@Andrew Howard Exactly. If that "Old" mx Honda is even close to a 2018 ktm woods specific bike. It's a win for Honda bc ktm is suppose to win that debate
I appreciate the comparison to an older bike, but I own a 2018 250 XC and have ridden all my life and I have to seriously disagree with the KTM suspension being balanced. It does everything else so smoothly and so we’ll that it might minimize the stink bug/busy high set rear end, but it is very noticeable and creates instability at high speeds and unpredictability at low speeds in comparison to what it should be for its year. Rumor has it KTM did this on purpose because it’s what Musquin and maybe one of their other sponsored riders like it for some odd reason. Anybody else notice this on their 2017 and newer KTM, and have you been able to fix it?
I've ridden both the 2003 CR 250 (owned for a couple years before my mission), and the 2018 KTM (buddy owned and let me try it out). My personal opinion is that for anything over 20 mph and I much rather be on the Honda, but for slow technical stuff, the KTM was amazing!
I think the point Kyle and Sam are trying to make, and not make, is, this wasn't a drag race to see which bike was better, as much as, do you spend the money restoring an older bike and get about the same amount of money into it and still ride with ancient technology, or buy a later model for the same money or a little more and have more modern technology. And when it comes to bikes, the newer model is your best bet, for the competition is so great, every manufacturer is competing for the technological market. Except for those manufacturer that are still producing heavy out dated machines for some reason.
I have a 2019 tx300, its a better bike then a 03 cr250....but with a little setup its not vastly better. The 03 cr250 had an excellent frame and geometry it turns as good as the euro bikes but also has honda head shake. I loved my 03, still a great bike.
Now put both bikes on a mx track, Honda will do great, KTM will fall flat. Putting a well known mx bike on the trail vs a off-road specific bike makes very little sense.
i have a 2002 yz250 stock i have no problem passaing anyone i do endruo and trails and all of the ktm's riders just ask me how i do that. so its just get ready for that bike so its the rider. but thats what i say so to each there own
Suspension? Ok. Change it. It's just to pipey for trail riding. Motorcross track? Yup. That bike wasn't made for this. Weird you guys didn't know this already. Honda fell away years ago.
Wrong terrain for the CR. Its design for MX track, NOT tight desert riding. Get that CR in the open desert and see how it feels. I have a '03 250 SX and the suspension sucks until I hit the top of 3rd gear then its great and plush. Sucks in slow tight stuff.
I second the guy who said you cant compare the two bikes, were talking about a bike developed in the early 2000's vs a bike that's had almost 20 years to perfect. yall are way too hard on the CR. personally best bike ive ever owned, and not everyone can afford a 10k dollar tuned enduro ktm vs a bike they could get off craiglist for 1500-2000. aka do your own research people don't go off what a few guys say on youtube.
Amen to all of that.... I actually tried one of those out this year at the track where it's meant to be and it was just down right horrid I could not wait to get off. The power was all on or all off and like you said the clutch "ugh" so yea no thanks.......
kyle greer, I ran them in my 2003 CR250 -Woods setup. I never had problems with clutch slip or premature wear for over two years and as far as I know the guy I sold the bike to is still on the same clutch, riding single track. Lighter springs would be an issue on an MX setup as you’re frequently slipping the clutch at greater throttle positions. This was my experience.
You guys and your ktm’s baby the bikes. It’s a dirt bike it’s 2003, it’s how mx should be not with these babies hydro clutches and all the other fancy crap you don’t need.
So you rebuilt this entire bike but didn't set it up for off road? And you are trail riding it and comparing it to an off road bike? I usually like your content but this honda series has been a little conceited.
HAHHAHAHA! All the butthurt Honda fans! I agree that if you took a Honda and KTM from the same era you would want the Honda but that is the biggest problem is Honda stopped caring about dirt bikes. Especially offroad. That's why they haven't won a supercross title in a decade. That's why their offroad offering is garbage. Overweight 4 strokes with motocross suspension. KTM spends millions in R&D to develop offroad bikes and they don't give them hand me downs from the previous gen mx bikes and it's not just Honda its all of the Japanese bikes. If Yamaha made a true competitor to the 300xc I would ride it but they don't. They put lipstick on a pig and say ride this 13-year-old tech.
Theres a lot more to off-road racing than just Supercross. Tim Gajser won mxgp championship on Honda in 2016, in 2015 Honda riders were 2nd and 3rd and Gajser won mx2 etc. Ken Roczen was winning supercross events until crashes ruled him out. Then came back for nationals and got 3rd. To say Honda have given up on dirt bikes Is quite clearly nonsense
@@codenamenel not sure. That was my whole point. You started listing Honda riders have placed MX championships. My first point is Honda. even in the mx/sx world isn't what it was in the 90's. Second, they make two types of bikes track bikes (CRF) and XRs (CRFX). You are right it is clearly nonsense to say they've given up on dirt bikes. I was exaggerating to prove a point. I go back to my original statement. If any Japanese manufacturer would produce a 2 stroke competitor to the KTM 300xc or a 4 stroke that is 280lbs. I would seriously consider it and most likely buy it. I grew up working on Japanese bikes and they just make more sense to me. Anyway, what do you ride?
@@can99006 I was pointing out that there is more to off-road racing than simply the AMA Supercross title. Any current bike in the right hands could probably win any of the Championships. I've had all different makes of mx bikes over the years, but My current bikes - 98 CR250 that I use for MX and other off-road with different configurations, my sons got a KTM 65sx and I've got a Yamaha MT07 road bike
I owned a 2002 CR250 for 8 years, I found out it likes to be ridden like a 125. High up in rpms. It never liked to be lugged around. It's a blast on mx tracks, not so much trails. Granted, that's what it was designed for.
Cant compare a new KTM to an old Honda two stroke. Take a KTM of that era and its not even worth riding. Haha
Yep, a bit disingenuous, an old MX bike compared to a modern enduro. Some suspension work to level the playing field and open trails would give the Honda a chance. Some footage on the pipe would have been nice, too. They really fly with commitment. I'm a bit puzzled about the clutch comments. My 93 CRM is one finger operation and resembles all the comments in the vid.
Just compare MX bike vs Enduro is stupid
So true man, worked at a KTM dealer from 02-09. Had to go buy an 06 CR250 cause my shops bikes were junk.
Actually the 2003 KTMs were not so bad. You did get the hydro clutch but had to deal with PDS which is meh.. The KTMs also had a much more progressive power delivery as the powervalve was actually really good even back then. Could it hang with a CR on the track, no way but IMO better trail bike still.
I think this comparison is about buying a older bike and doing it up or just buying a new bike, because obviously the newer 300 will win hands down its 15 years newer technology lol
No doubt the Ktm will excell in alot more offroad situations. Now consider comparing a 2004 ktm sx to the Honda...or would an 04Sx even be worth reviving!?
I have a 2001 KTM EXC 300 and it is already showing its age. Sure it handles better than my 2017 690 Enduro R on the nasty stuff, but even in 2010 it was showing its age compared to my 2010 exc 300.
I just restored it into running condition after 9 years sitting in the garage with some broken seals.
Maybe if I restore it really nice (new header+pipe and plastics and a seat cover) in an other 9 years it can be sold as some curiosity :)
If it isnt a KTM is it really worth it.... seems like a channel dedicated to singing the praises of the orange brand. Cant believe two grown men groaned about the cable clutch so much
Got my 2003 kdx 220 a little over a year ago. Bike us in immaculate shape, as it sat mostly all its life. Just got it back saturday, had the top end redone with all oem parts just to freshen it up, and to know how old it is peace of mind kinda thing. Best trail bike ive ever owned/rode
KDX has always been a great offroad bike Larry Roseler always did well on kdx's
Venerable bike. My Dad has a KDX220SR, Japanese market road legal version. hilarious bit of kit. I have a 93 CRM and a 96 DT230. They will not give up, easy to fix, ride anywhere at different paces and are relatively civilised to ride. The CRM is a bit scary. I had a KDX 250 but someone had their fingers in it and it was a bit mental. Front tyre must have been 20 years old and looked fresh.
KDX is one of my all time favorite bikes. Never let me down!
Awesome. Always loved CR250’s. They are THA BOYZ of the motorcross 2 strokes.
Till it’s set up for woods it will feel maybe front heavy. It’s made to be on the gas and that’s what keeps the front light.
Might as well change the channel name to “ktm fanpage” lollll
Great video Kyle and you're right the Honda is a 15 year old bike and there is a reason why KTM is excelling in off-road racing like The Iron Giant but the Honda was set up as a motocross bike there is a reason why a lot of people don't like 450,s off road as much because they're set up to be a motocross bike. Oh well I am glad you got out on the CR250 I love seeing that like on your Channel.☺👍🚲
Glad to see you on the Honda! I was watching for this everyday since you have been back! I am starting the tear down of my 2001 Cr250r this weekend and I can’t wait until it is ready to ride! Thanks for another great video!
As I have both a KTM 300 and a CR 250, i will say that they are wrong on almost everything said about the honda!
have both 2017 300 and cr 250r 2003, fun factor go to the Honda for me, i appreciate the cr for what it is, snappy, light feel, ergonomic, and start first kick after 15 years of age with stock carb. We all know its not an enduro bike with low end torque and smooth hydraulic clutch. Its an old 2 stroke awesome motocross. Didn't notice a big difference in vibrations. Sound of the cr is music.
@@cadwarrior ya the cr definitely has the fun factor!
right !!!
These guys are trippin . Talking about hydrologic clutches . Man up ! Shift when needed to be shifted and powerband your way through everything .
Sooooo.......,is the Honda’s suspension still valved for MX? If your running a mx suspension vs a Xc suspension what do you expect. That generation of Honda is known to turn great.
I have my comp all the way out and it’s still too stiff for woods. Getting it ready valved this winter
Have the same year bike. Just received the magura hydraulic clutch in the mail. Gonna try it soon
It's all in your set up, I race hara scrambles on my 2003 cr 250 its awesome, but it's set up for that I could not motorcross it the way it is, gearing, suspension but no flywheel weight I like the hit, If its geared right you want be on the clutch have as much, lower your clamps down on your forks 8th of an inch and it will turn
You know... I love your videos and topics and I think their great. I just wanna say that it doesn’t matter what bike you ride. You can take an old idk 85 cr250 and do everything u guys do you know? I completely believe it’s always the rider. Never the bike, car, truck whatever... new KTMs and stuff all they do is make riding trails easier. Don’t mean u can’t do it the same or even faster with an old mx bike... stock or not. Great video tho! Keep it up!🤙🏼
This video is pointless. When you first started on that CR build, I thought you were going to do a proper conversion. You can't just take a stock MX bike and ride it off road and use it to hype the orange Kool-aid. Let me know when you do a flywheel weight, porting work, a full suspension re-valve, and an 18 inch rear wheel. And whining about a cable clutch is just hilarious. This is a total scam
MotoFlightGuy a REAL RIDER would just ride it stock anyway so if u ain’t got nothin positive to say then STFU, get out of the comments and get ur own cr and do “POINTLESS” mods too it instead of putting the time and energy into making yourself a better rider.🤙🏼
@@meks8086 I have ridden AND raced hare scrambles on stock motocross bikes, and in particularly a, CR 250. A REAL RIDER would understand there's a correct tool for the job. I'll be waiting for the day you actually post content to TH-cam, until then I would suggest that YOU stay out of the comments.
I enjoy the videos but I’m not sure why we are comparing the 03 Honda to a newer KTM. Did I miss something I thought this was a build update.
I really like your videos and appreciate the time you put in to make them very polished and professional. But I'm seeing a trend here. Anything that isn't KTM pretty much has no chance. If you're going to review something like a 15 year old motocrosser then it should be reviewed on it's own merits - its a solid, reliable bike that can be had for 1/3 the price of a new KTM and you can go out and have a blast on it. It's a bike for somebody that doesn't have the budget for a brand new one and should be compared to similar bikes in this category not the newest $10k wonder. just my $.02
James G you know I I agree and disagree. What I do agree is that Honda’s old/new are bad ass reliable beasts that can do anything. I disagree with u sayin that stuff about saying they have no chance. Because if u look back in the video he does say that IF YOU GET USED TO IT it would be just fine. But... I did used to think that stuff tho but I learned that all he is doing is comparing all types of bikes to what works BETTER for enduro. Like. That you can do anything a Ktm does it’s just that ktm simply is not BETTER. But makes it EASIER for enduro.
Wallace Williford I say invest time and dedication into ur riding skills instead of blowing money on a new bike. A new bike won’t teach u shit only thing it might teach u is how blowing big bucks on a new bike don’t make u faster or a better rider🤙🏼
Motocross bikes are built for one thing. By the time you are done taming all that stuff you could just buy a KTM and be satisfied.
Good to see you are back riding again.
A lowering link does make a difference, people change the link on Suzuki's. Did the Lectron carb make much difference
Yeah my 02 cr250 has pretty bad vibration all around but it’s an amazing bike and I love it
I had hard clutch pull on my bike, bought oem cable + asv perch/lever and it is now comparable to ktm hydro clutch pull
Awesome I love that bike!
I have a 2002 Honda CR and I'm glad to hear you say the clutch is heavy on yours I thought I had bad clutch springs and cable and I switched all that stuff out and it was still heavy so I'm glad that it's not just me and I do agree with everything you say with the exception of the low end torque but that's only because my bike has a big bore 282 kit I did not put that on it came with that from the past owner
I’ve had that bike up every hill over every rock and thru every creek in eastern ky
I would try a different pipe I had a 01 250 cr it had nice low end power. I had a fmf fatty and a fmf shorty on it
I thought y'all said the Honda turned great in the last video? Anyways, great video. I was looking forward to it.
Great job on the CR! Looks great! Just curious why you didn’t get a bike comparable to an XC if comparing characteristics in an enduro setting was the plan. A 2003 exc perhaps? Any criticisms are kind of a washout if the machine is tested outside of it’s designed intent.
First off, the video is mistitled. This video isn't about "my first minutes," it's an informal shootout between an old Japanese MXer and a current euro-enduro.
Given that, it's such a mismatch in bikes that feelings of KTM bias are inevitable among viewers. And I'm not even talking about the age difference as I think that's the variable that you set out to test on. I'm talking about the MX vs enduro aspect, and the level of setup/tuning involved. For example, you have countless minutes of tape on modding and tweaking your KTMs. You've had access to a seemingly endless supply of KTM models -- 250, 300, 2T, 4T, EFI, and several model years. And for the Honda it's "...I set the sag the same as the KTM and put (imperfect) bar risers on it and I can't understand why the front end is heavy...." Really?
You guys can do better than this. Properly prep the Honda and then revisit. Or promptly sell it.
EDIT: Your desert comparison of these two bikes was done on a more neutral playing field. I had also forgotten that you have $7500+ sunk in the Honda.
BTW, the other thought that I had was that Kyle should stay off that Honda until he's fully recovered. He didn't look comfortable so why risk a setback?
I hope you guys work out the couple of things you don't like about the Honda. Everything you're saying so far seems pretty par for the course for that bike, but I just love seeing the old two strokes kept alive. You should try an RM250 next. Legendary handling, and the 06-08 was considered the best engine in its class at the time. Can't wait to see more.
The 2018 sx is a beast. And with a 300 kit on it keeping the same moto snap powerband. Oooooweeeee
That thing is badass but it is no Screaming Eagle. It maybe doesn't have all 69 horsepowers.
I think a lot of these older Japanese bikes have the same symptoms as your honda. Stiff cable clutches, front wants to plow, challenging to do basic things like log hop, wheelie over obstacles, unstable cornering and low end issues, etc... the KTM, Beta's, Sherco's, etc bikes are just so much more rider friendly.
cr250r is a beast bike thinking of getting one..rekluse and problem solved
You can get a Hydraulic clutch for a couple of Hundred of your chosen Currency, much cheaper than a rekluse
Another option for the clutch is the Moose Ultimate Lever, as easy as my buddies euro bikes but still a bit different feel than hydraulic.
the aluminum frame honda is a pro level rider bike, made for motocross. if it's hard to ride it might be the rider and trying to lug the powerband.
I have a 1997 Honda cr250r and I love it. But I just got a 2007 ktm 300 xc. Can't wait to get used to it. I do more trail riding than Motocross.
Very interesting. I would wonder if you need to adjust the suspension more for enduro riding? I ride Utah as well a lot of similar things you do as well. I have a yz450 and cr125. The yz is used for motorcross style riding and I hate it for this style. Where as my cr is setup more for enduro and I love it!
Try running your sag at 90mm or 3.5 in that should help with slower speed turning.
How was the lectron working
the cable clutch on my yz is almost to easy to pull.. not sure how the CR's are though.
I made a woods weapon out of my 93 yz250. It's quite the tank with a ton of power. You should come up to northern idaho sometime. Hit the races while you're here.
I put a magura hydraulic clutch on her and it's butter smooth. 13oz steahly it's such an amazing bike
running lean. hear the hanging rpms?
Wheel base on the cr is longer than then the ktm I believe... so I would think more downward force on the front end heavy feeling..won’t lift the front as easy ..it’s a motocross bike ..I had many old bikes.. I am 49 years old ..they are fun no doubt but not the same kinda ride.. my ktm 300 is easy 2 ride ..in most conditions .. great job on the bike man .. glad your up and riding again!!!
Can u please do a review on the new Honda CRF250RX vs the Yamaha yz250fx
Kyle can jou maby review a kdx 200 and give your opinion on the bike
I have the same bike but I set it up for desert racing/ extreme off road
Great looking trail! Where you riding?
Hydro clutch. H20 activated? :)
Japanese machine ❤️
OH NO..all this time ive owned my 2001 cr250 i thought it was an awesome bike. Looks cool, sounds cool, powerband ridiculous,so much fun to ride and at least 1/3 the price on a new KTM .Geeze all this time ive been wrong? Time to sell it off and buy an orange?.....I dont think so.LOL ITS A MOTORCROSS BIKE!!
My girlfriend like our older ktm/gasgas over the new Ktm we have. Says the vibration makes it a more comfortable ride lol.
The secret is to not ride the new bikes!! 😁 I just bought my boy a 2018 250 xcw, I’ve got to ride it for about :10 minutes, I had to get off that thing, I had to get back on the ol’ ‘99 cr250. That new one might just spoil a guy!
P.S I just myself a new bike, 2002 cr250 for $500
I think you need to compare bikes of the same age. There should be a drastic difference when theres that much of an age difference. Plus one of them is an offroad bike and the other is a MX bike.
@@brwi1 no I haven't. I've always been a Honda guy and I've rode quite a few Yamaha's. But I've heard that the older KTM's had alot of vibration.
@Andrew Howard Exactly. If that "Old" mx Honda is even close to a 2018 ktm woods specific bike. It's a win for Honda bc ktm is suppose to win that debate
If you watch the earlier vids he is wanting to compare buying a project bike for cheap vs just buying a new bike.
I appreciate the comparison to an older bike, but I own a 2018 250 XC and have ridden all my life and I have to seriously disagree with the KTM suspension being balanced. It does everything else so smoothly and so we’ll that it might minimize the stink bug/busy high set rear end, but it is very noticeable and creates instability at high speeds and unpredictability at low speeds in comparison to what it should be for its year. Rumor has it KTM did this on purpose because it’s what Musquin and maybe one of their other sponsored riders like it for some odd reason. Anybody else notice this on their 2017 and newer KTM, and have you been able to fix it?
I've ridden both the 2003 CR 250 (owned for a couple years before my mission), and the 2018 KTM (buddy owned and let me try it out). My personal opinion is that for anything over 20 mph and I much rather be on the Honda, but for slow technical stuff, the KTM was amazing!
you need to ride my 03 cr that is set up for woods...
Wow! You can knee down like that already dude! ,I'm so jealous hahaha!! Two weeks ago I torn the mcl sucks!
Where is this
I think the point Kyle and Sam are trying to make, and not make, is, this wasn't a drag race to see which bike was better, as much as, do you spend the money restoring an older bike and get about the same amount of money into it and still ride with ancient technology, or buy a later model for the same money or a little more and have more modern technology.
And when it comes to bikes, the newer model is your best bet, for the competition is so great, every manufacturer is competing for the technological market. Except for those manufacturer that are still producing heavy out dated machines for some reason.
I have a 2019 tx300, its a better bike then a 03 cr250....but with a little setup its not vastly better. The 03 cr250 had an excellent frame and geometry it turns as good as the euro bikes but also has honda head shake. I loved my 03, still a great bike.
love my cr
apples to oranges here....
CR250 ... meh I love my K T M ... Good Review, love watching your videos
Compare them on a motocross track!
This is not an unbiased comparison of an Apple to an orange 🤙🏽😴
Now put both bikes on a mx track, Honda will do great, KTM will fall flat. Putting a well known mx bike on the trail vs a off-road specific bike makes very little sense.
If you’re not runnin’ hydraulics this day and age then forget it! Also, power isn’t everything - not in single-track.
Maxim Racine exactly, suspension and handling is king when it comes to single track.
i have a 2002 yz250 stock i have no problem passaing anyone i do endruo and trails and all of the ktm's riders just ask me how i do that. so its just get ready for that bike so its the rider.
but thats what i say so to each there own
Suspension? Ok. Change it. It's just to pipey for trail riding. Motorcross track? Yup. That bike wasn't made for this. Weird you guys didn't know this already.
Honda fell away years ago.
Wrong terrain for the CR. Its design for MX track, NOT tight desert riding. Get that CR in the open desert and see how it feels. I have a '03 250 SX and the suspension sucks until I hit the top of 3rd gear then its great and plush. Sucks in slow tight stuff.
I second the guy who said you cant compare the two bikes, were talking about a bike developed in the early 2000's vs a bike that's had almost 20 years to perfect. yall are way too hard on the CR. personally best bike ive ever owned, and not everyone can afford a 10k dollar tuned enduro ktm vs a bike they could get off craiglist for 1500-2000. aka do your own research people don't go off what a few guys say on youtube.
Kyle, are you wearing knee braces while riding now?
Take a cr over any ktm or shreco
The Honda will make you a better rider Sam so suck it up bra
haha I am sure it will....
Amen to all of that.... I actually tried one of those out this year at the track where it's meant to be and it was just down right horrid I could not wait to get off. The power was all on or all off and like you said the clutch "ugh" so yea no thanks.......
Kyle, Install 125 clutch springs.
This isn't the solution, just asking for clutch slip and shorter clutch life.
kyle greer, I ran them in my 2003 CR250 -Woods setup. I never had problems with clutch slip or premature wear for over two years and as far as I know the guy I sold the bike to is still on the same clutch, riding single track.
Lighter springs would be an issue on an MX setup as you’re frequently slipping the clutch at greater throttle positions. This was my experience.
You guys and your ktm’s baby the bikes. It’s a dirt bike it’s 2003, it’s how mx should be not with these babies hydro clutches and all the other fancy crap you don’t need.
Ill take my 03 cr250 over any bike... No power in the bottom end cuz its designed to scream... Maybe you should ride a little faster or go get a ktm
Yeah that bike was never meant for that. Get a xr600.
I like the ktm more
So you rebuilt this entire bike but didn't set it up for off road? And you are trail riding it and comparing it to an off road bike? I usually like your content but this honda series has been a little conceited.
Ktm fanboys
All I have to say is RIDE ORANGE, baby!!!
why compare apples to oranges? pointless m8 pointless
HAHHAHAHA! All the butthurt Honda fans! I agree that if you took a Honda and KTM from the same era you would want the Honda but that is the biggest problem is Honda stopped caring about dirt bikes. Especially offroad. That's why they haven't won a supercross title in a decade. That's why their offroad offering is garbage. Overweight 4 strokes with motocross suspension. KTM spends millions in R&D to develop offroad bikes and they don't give them hand me downs from the previous gen mx bikes and it's not just Honda its all of the Japanese bikes. If Yamaha made a true competitor to the 300xc I would ride it but they don't. They put lipstick on a pig and say ride this 13-year-old tech.
Theres a lot more to off-road racing than just Supercross. Tim Gajser won mxgp championship on Honda in 2016, in 2015 Honda riders were 2nd and 3rd and Gajser won mx2 etc. Ken Roczen was winning supercross events until crashes ruled him out. Then came back for nationals and got 3rd.
To say Honda have given up on dirt bikes Is quite clearly nonsense
@@codenamenel should we list the names of KTM riders that have placed in championships since 2012 in Supercross, MX nationals, and MXGP?
@@can99006 what's that got to do with your moronic statement that Honda had given up on dirt bikes?
@@codenamenel not sure. That was my whole point. You started listing Honda riders have placed MX championships. My first point is Honda. even in the mx/sx world isn't what it was in the 90's. Second, they make two types of bikes track bikes (CRF) and XRs (CRFX). You are right it is clearly nonsense to say they've given up on dirt bikes. I was exaggerating to prove a point. I go back to my original statement. If any Japanese manufacturer would produce a 2 stroke competitor to the KTM 300xc or a 4 stroke that is 280lbs. I would seriously consider it and most likely buy it. I grew up working on Japanese bikes and they just make more sense to me. Anyway, what do you ride?
@@can99006 I was pointing out that there is more to off-road racing than simply the AMA Supercross title. Any current bike in the right hands could probably win any of the Championships. I've had all different makes of mx bikes over the years, but My current bikes - 98 CR250 that I use for MX and other off-road with different configurations, my sons got a KTM 65sx and I've got a Yamaha MT07 road bike