8 years no contact for me. The first 3 were incredibly difficult. I went through all the stages of grief. Now I simply say to people, ‘I don’t have any family’ or ‘my family aren’t very nice’ and I’ve never received any pushback at all. I now have an amazing new family, my friends treat me with kindness and they genuinely care about me. My friends have shown me things that my own mother never has such as compassion!! Now I’m healed and well, I attract other people who are well and now I can be my authentic self, I attract authentic people and I’m well regarded by the lovely people I now know. Being degraded by family means you end up degrading yourself, and allowing others to do the same. When you heal and become healthy you will find others like you. Heal Thy Self - healthy self!! ❤
This is so spot-on, when people hear you're no contact with a parent, they assume it's your fault. Then I try to explain, to get them to understand, so the overexplaining definitely happens.
Hi 👋 one of the things I had to learn was boundaries (I was in my 40’s) Narc mothers do not allow boundaries. So when you develop them, people actually don’t challenge you. I’ve stopped over sharing and I realised a while ago, my no is no and I don’t even have to give a reason for it ❤
I don't explain myself anymore as it is a waste of time, I just tell them go live with my narcissistic mother for a few years and then you will know!!!! 🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️
The concept of handing back the backpack of shame was an aha moment for me. It's been so damn heavy! I've tried to leave it on trail sides, kick it off a mountain...but really, it needs to go back to the ones who treated me with such disrespect, unawareness, and meanness. Thanks for that visual.
I shared a bit of my family estrangement reasons with some people on different occasions whom I thought would empathize with me just to realize they already prejudgmed my situation. They accused me of being heartless and ungrateful to my family of origin. To them, I had no valid reasons. Since the last instance, I have appreciated the value of privacy more and always asked myself if it's necessary to share sensitive information every time someone asks. However, the positive side of it was finding out they were fake friends fishing information.
Yes...There should be a thing called a "Nobel Survival Prize" for those who have freed themselves from toxic relationships and made their own sanity and health the priority it should be! ....and a lot of us couldn't do it without the help of those who have traveled that road. Thank you so much for your wonderful contribution to that end! 💜
Mary you are a superhero.. For so so many years I believed I was the problem.. I now know I was never the problem.. I was my family's answer to THERE PROBLEM...
Being no contact is an absolute blessing!! When I see the Fear Obligation & Guilt of others ‘having’ to do Christmas with their families who aren’t very nice people, I feel bad for them.
Right. I've often wondered why people even bother to go to family get togethers if their family isn't very nice? Why bother? Why put yourself through that during the holidays?
@@brynne77because they want to desperately love and be loved...they think that maybe their family will see that they "good" and will finally see how rude they've been and change, etc. No contact is very difficult.. but once it is done, it gets so much better as time goes on.
I've gotten some horrendous reactions from well meaning friends when I disclose I'm no contact with family. "What if they die before you repair the relationship?" or "I'm sure they still love you, I fixed my issues with my mom and now we're closer than ever!" 🤦♀🤦♀🤦♀ I am so ready to heal the shame and doubt. I don't want to internalize other people's ignorance as my own shortcoming anymore.
It was my siblings that turned our mother against me with negativity behind my back, so much so that my mother disinherited me in her will with everything going to my siblings. Not only had I lost my mother, but my siblings as well for their all around cruelty.
Your sister didn't turn your mother against you, your mother disliked you from the start. I recently learned that people who listen to the bad people, are usually bad themselves. My narcissist golden child sister would fill my narcissist mother with negative ideas about me but the fact that my narcissist mother chose to entertain those idea's, means that she didn't like me in the first place.
@@brynne77 Thanks for your concern. I do have many adult children that surround me, together ready to help each other as a family should be and with a righteous heart to guide us without labels. After a year of heartache, my heart disassociated from my sister and brother as they already did decades ago so we are finally on the same page.
Before I adopted a policy of never talking about them I noticed that the peopke who would push me, then judge me were always people who had trouble in their own families. They were getting a passive-aggressive charge out of trying to shame me. The oeople who truly didn’t judge me, who were truly sympathetic, were people who came from healthier families. Nobody should be asking you much until and unless you offer it. Therefore to those pushers & judgers I simply lie. “They’re dead now.” Both parents? “Yes, they died in an airplane crash together.” What about your siblings? “I was an only child.” When did they die? “This is a subject that I normally don’t discuss. I’m sure you can understand that.”
I had a crewmate who when I asked her a question about how she broke her leg, she would say, "Pick A) B) C) or D)." LOL! And she would say she rescued a cat, or something like that. I suppose it can be done for questions about one's family as well....... :)
I know what you mean. My mom actually said a while ago about a lady at the church (laughably she’s massively into the church) who’s daughter didn’t talk to her anymore. My mother said to me “well it tells you all you need to know about the daughter, what sort of daughter doesn’t talk to their own mother!” … like of course the daughter was the toxic one. No thought that maybe tue mother was the issue. It’s very telling to me
A saying I heard that sticks with me "Those who think the worst of you don't deserve the best of you." Five years on the other side of NC and I'm seeing for the first time, just what I really never had to lose in the first place. I was brainwashed to think we were a "family." So the grieving has been for the "family" the abusers created. Sad. Great content. Thank You.
I had a lot of trouble with "other people's opinions about me are none of my business" because, for me, that sounds like being closed or oblivious to feedback, an arrogant "I'm always right" attitude (not a trait I value). Eventually I came to understand that what I hadn't learned as a child was how to distinguish valid from invalid criticism or how to stand firmly in truth rather than hysterically trying to convince an insane person that I am not, in fact, a checkered kangaroo (or whatever other nonsense they may assert). A corollary to that is learning that I do not require others permission, approval, or agreement to make decisions that are best for my well-being. That stops my oversharing or arguing with a mere acquaintance prodding me with "but they're your FAMILY!" Further, I got it through my head that it's not my job to educate or enlighten anyone. It's shocking how enabling of abuse people with non-abusive families can be! The simple truth is that they DON'T understand; the behaviour resulting from that ignorance is harmful. Knowing that, I just don't go there, as I have no interest in being harmed. Asked directly, I don't lie, but I can say something honest and vague like, "Not this year" or "They're far away," then steer the conversation elsewhere.
"how to stand firmly in truth rather than hysterically trying to convince an insane person that I am not, in fact, a checkered kangaroo (or whatever other nonsense they may assert)."
I find myself wanting to talk about it because I need support. It is all so fresh and I am so angry with my parents and siblings. I just want validation.
Knowing and owning your truth can provide some release. Explaining it to others can be confronting to them and completely beyond their reality. Smile, maintain your power and change the subject:-)
Thank you, your video is very helpful. I also went no contact in 2018, after a life of sadness, confusion and hope that they would understand and change. But had to accept reality and leave. My problem is that I live in a small place where I know many people. Many of them believe in the Hollywood side of my family of origin. Initially shame and fear of being hurt were a terrible burden, now I avoid people and mostly live on my own, leading a sort of solitary lifestyle. It's so sad, it's like being punished for having said "Enough" to abuse.
I hope you find some wise people who get it. I have made some very good friends in the Al-Anon group as they understand that alcoholism and any related mental illnesses affects the whole family and sometimes it’s best to step away from them.
What you said about the family portraying itself like a Hollywood movie really resonates with me. On social media my family treats me like gold, but behind the scenes it’s an entirely different reality.
I went to Stand Alone to embrace it and talk about being estranged. And somebody asked me what I was doing at Christmas. I did the same. I said nothing much. I don't really have any family. He told me he was on his own as well. I said it's alright. It's nowhere near as bad as you think it is.
Thank you, Mary. You are so accurate & concise in describing the heavy burdens a scapegoat needs to learn to shed. Wishing you a peaceful & positive 2023 💚
Thank you, Mary. It is wonderful to know that after a couple of years of working through so many issues from dysfunctional family members, scapegoats are not crazy. We're really quite wonderful people! I love the changes in me. Thanks again.
I had a distant cousin tell me to "go and see my mother" because apparently she was crying on this person's shoulder telling her they just wanted to see me. She said this as I was going into a church service! She told me she knew I was "having issues" with my mother but "God will tell me anyway." my reply was "He already has!" BUT during the service my mind was whirring and I actually ended up crying because of what she had said. My mother is super controlling. I was the scapegoat in the family. She doesn't want to see me. This is a manipulative ploy to get me back to be scapegoated again because she has lost her scapegoat! I couldn't say anything other than that above phrase to this woman but I felt really angry with her because she did know I wasn't in contact with my mother and the reasons behind it. It obviously felt uncomfortable to HER that I am no contact with mother. But it is none of her business as to what I do because it isn't her relationship with mother that is the same as my relationship with mother. This is what people forget, that each relationship is different and that people can act differently with different people.
@@scapegoatchildrecovery I have limited contact with her since that day, even on social media. I used to feel the need to justify but not anymore. We do have to protect ourselves. I have learned that I am very good at the one word phrase!
Thank you I actually come from a Family of 10. I have been in Therapy going on 6 years. I went no contact and I appreciate your insight on this matter.
I made the mistake of trying to open up to a friend about my narcissistic mother and sadly got gaslit, she said “are you sure she meant it like that?”, “she wouldn’t mean to hurt you have you tried talking to her” , I know it’s not safe to explain the situation to these people. I guess if you have a kind and loving family you cannot begin to understand what it’s like to be bullied and ostracised your whole life by your own family. I’m starting my recovery, low contact it is. The trauma response I have from even setting eyes on my mother is horrific. So many of us must have PTSD, I nearly had a fully blown panic attack when I last saw her. She’s there at mass every day, you would think she was mother Theresa but she’s utterly vile to me behind closed doors, but her public persona is of a wonderful woman who does volunteer work in the community. Why has nobody seen she’s wearing a mask…
Very helpful. To be honest, it took me ages to even know when I was triggered, as I was so used to living my entire life in such a state of extreme anxiety. First I had to go no contact for more than 6 months before that first layer started subsiding enough to know the difference be tween normal and triggered!! 😰
I went NC for 6 months, then my mom hoovered me back because she needed place to live and to control me. When I got stronger and set my boundaries, she started abusing me again every 2 weeks and now more often, telling/doing all that triggers me most…so I’m trying to go NC again
All families are dysfunction at various degrees. Therefore most people have suffered abuse. Mental, physical, emotional, sexual or spiritual. Basically most people are in a trance. The family will not want to wake up and look at themselves so don’t bother trying to wake them up. Go no contact and work on yourself. By going no contact you stop feeding your toxic trauma bond. It then starts to break down. I was the scapegoat of a scapegoat. Not much has been mentioned of how a scapegoat in the family can offload their stuff to another sibling or even outsider. So certain scapegoats can end up narcissists. Causing turmoil in relationship, work and life. The bullies. So it’s not as straightforward as how it’s being made out. Have gone no contact 16 days ago on Christmas Eve with my sister I am healing my toxic trauma bond which is breaking down. So much is repressed. Feeling your sensations is key to healing. Each day I do progressive deep relaxation to help the body relax. It’s amazing the secrets the body and mind keep from us. The trauma will not come up at once as the nervous system can only handle so much. You have to look after yourself during this process. Awarness meditation is also beneficial.There some excellent book on trauma out there. I will not discuss in any detail my decision with sleeping family members. Luckily I rarely see them, even less now. An excellent way to aid recovery is to write a daily journal plus keeping a dream diary.
Oh goodness this is my story exactly! Thank you for sharing; I thought I was the only one with this unique situation of the childhood scapegoat (my sister) turning into a narcissist to scapegoat me (younger sibling) I also went no contact over the holidays with her, and now live in an apartment by myself I think that was part of why I put up with her for so long, because I knew we both came from the same abusive family situation. BUT, I never thought for a second that SHE would end up abusing ME. I felt doubly betrayed by her behavior, because she knew exactly what I went through, and chose to be abusive and manipulative anyway.
Thank you so much! Did you find those meditations on YT? My mom is a scapegoat and she became a narcissist…along with my father that is somehow switching from codependent to a narcissist, as well as narc or sociopathic sister. It is so hard. Is it possible to build my own walls, my own family, get love if I didn’t really get any stable love/relationship from FOO?
You are wonderful and strong Mary. My heart goes out to you for dealing with all the family scapegoating thoughout the years like myself. Although we don't have to explain to people, I sure hope that there is someone you can confine in as we all need that one person at the very least. My fiance never had this problem with her own family but has witnissed my struggles with my own family head on and has even been accused on occassion by them too before I went no contact 3-4 years ago. She always stands by me and my choice to be free of the family of origin. I hope you find / have found a partner who either has experienced the same or at the very least understands you and your choices to go no contact with your own family.
@@matilda4406 thank you but i do mean everything i say. We scapegoats have and continue to go through so many struggles even after no contact but we are so strong and capable beyond belief. From personal experience, i believe the hardest thing we struggle with is loneliness and over explaining our situation but so long as we can find at least one person out there who love, cherishes, and respects us for who we are, its all worth it.
I'm fine with strangers and acquaintances, but I am dreading running in to wider family. My mother has smeared me. Even though she does classic DARVO when I asked her to stop, gives me the silent treatment and smears me, all the relatives have been told I'm mad, bad and unhappy. I will not defend myself. What is the point. I'm watching how Prince Harry thought his side would change how people felt and it has not. It has cemented it. I dont think he is a typical scapegoat btw. But when I meet cousins who think I'm mad, bad n sad, all I can do is try not to freeze. I will not start giving my side.
I moved very far away so I would never, ever run into ANYONE. I also changed my name, legally, so I couldn’t be found should they look. I didn’t want to live in the world where my abusers name was attached to me. I was and am deadly serious about not having that ish in my life. I’m old enough now that I just tell people they’re dead. If you keep hanging around all you’ll get is more oain. If you think it’s going to stop some day - I promise you it won’t. Ever.
I know how you feel Susan. I went NC with my NPD mother 10 years ago and was hoping I could reconnect with a few relatives on that side. She has totally smeared me tho and the other relatives are either her flying monkeys or they don't care and/or may have some level of narcissism themselves. So I've this year decided finally that it's actually not worth it. On my Dad's side I have family whom I love yet I know they won't understand. So if asked I just say that she and I aren't close and my brother is more involved and says she's doing fine. Take care. The struggle comes and goes for a while I think. I'm there too!
Thank you so much Mary! Spot on content. I just called police on my neighbors because they were screaming threats and throwing things and a child started crying. Police came and all quiet now but I still feel sick and noticed I felt scared and guilty for calling police! So useful to come back to these resources and work through triggers.
I am such an empath just reading your comment hurts my heart. It is so hard managing consciousness as an adult, imagine the suffering of that child. I wish every child was born into the arms of loving parents.
I've had many insights about this through the 6+ years I gradually ceased contact with my family of origin ("FOO"). It's been my experience that things "land" in us when we're ready (ie, sufficiently healed), and sometimes the same insight revisits us to sink in deeper and be integrated. That is likely a lifelong process, which can feel hopeless and daunting if you think of it as a "karmic wheel" you're just circling and circling, getting no where. It's helped me a lot to think of it as "spiraling upward," so I can remind myself when I encounter an unpleasantly familiar thing that I'm viewing it from a higher perspective than I did the last time, having learned lessons and acquired tools that I can apply. That boosts my courage, confidence, self esteem, resolve, and curiosity. The more I heal, grow, and change, the smaller and less significant the trigger will be in my next turn around the winding staircase.
Just tell the person, that sometimes, some families need a scapegoat. This family thought they would make me their scapegoat and I wasn't having it, so I have decided to go "no contact".
Thanks Mary, your videos are great and so helpful. I went on a first date before Christmas and he asked me if I got on with my mum after talking about his for a while. I said 'no, not really - we haven't spoken for many months.' He then grabbed his coat and stormed out, mumbling an excuse I couldn't decipher. An issue I'm noticing on online dating advice videos is that dating gurus often advise that a major red flag is dating someone who doesn't have a good relationship with their family, so I wonder if people are picking up on comments like this and not giving us a chance!
Scapegoat here, also someone who's been married almost 40 years. With Mary's confirmation that we are rock stars....if someone runs from you, they weren't ready to date a rockstar ;)
If somebody should have asked me that - told them - I´ve been an orphan - bc once you start explaining the truth ....they will not believe you anyway.....always put the blaime on the ex-scapegoat -
i've noticed this year that i haven't been asked at all where and how i spend my christmas, with or without my family. Has been really hard for years, especially since i tend to spend my christmas alone. It's not like i've always spent christmas with my family my whole life. i'm 50, but i would say, in the last few years it's definitely been under the no contact heading. Last year i had an outlier because the parents and my sister were really unwell. it was okay, but i don't see any reason to go there on Christmas Eve and when my mother asked me the other day and we have rather low contact it came shooting out of me that there was no way i was coming on Christmas Eve. and that's not a disaster at all. at least she doesn't say anything more about it. but i'm going there on Boxing Day and having dinner with them. so it's not quite like not doing something with the family. but i just found it interesting that i wasn't asked anymore and i think that's because i'm really more or less okay with it. even if I listen to these videos now at Christmas, but I remember years when I would have really crawled under my carpet out of sheer shame, but that was also a time when it became clear to me how serious all this emotional abuse was and today I see myself more as someone who can be proud of the fact that I stand by myself.
I’ve been the scapegoat of my family, after my mother passed away. I was only 21. I’ve always been sensitive, and my father and TWIN sister made fun of me. To make matters worse, all through High School, and beyond, my sister started telling her friends, mutual friends, and my father that I was weird. She’d make up horrible stories about me. I lost so many friends, and my father saying I was weird, too sensitive. My mother was so supportive of me, that I didn’t feel isolated. After she died, the smear campaign got to bad. So much so that I started to believe it. I started having panic attacks, 1 year of agoraphobia, and depressed. Thank God I found a very good psychotherapist, who was a great help. I cut ties with my sister and my father. Now my father is 89. He’s very healthy, but I’m having guilt and shame about when he passes away. Of course I love my father, but I couldn’t be a part of his life. Now I’m getting anxiety again about when he passes. Any advice ?
Lenore Marie, in childhood that is the time age is of relevance. Please don’t think anything of the number beside his age- he abused you. He never changed. It is an awful thing. I’m glad you got a good psychotherapist they are hard to find. My advice would be if they are still working to go back to them. This is a new area for work. His advancing age and you have done very good work so far. There are all sorts of people who are psychotherapists - you had a good one- I hope they are still there. And also it is not you regressing. It is you progressing a new question has arisen that is very serious for your well-being.
@@melliecrann-gaoth4789 Thank you for your insightful advice. I’m still seeing my therapist. She says only I can make that decision when my father passes away. Also to think beyond that, when my father is gone, but my sister is still alive. We live across the country, I’ll never have to deal with her again. Nothing has happened yet so I’m amping up my mindfulness practices, to stay in the here and now. I really appreciate you answering my comment.
Such helpful advice as always, Mary. I always end up in tears, lol, but it's all part of the healing process I think. Not having to explain myself is something I've been working on and with the gradual healing I haven't felt the need to either, which is so freeing. My family of origin have all passed on now anyway, apart from one of my sisters who's in a care home with dementia. My birthday's just coming up and it's always been a stressful time for me but I feel quite calm about it this year. I usually want to do something really special to compensate, but my plans always fall through, so this year I haven't made any - apart from making a nice meal for tea and having some wine in the evening. I haven't even felt the need to buy myself a present this year either. If it's a nice day I might go for a walk with my camera and if it isn't I could have a trawl around the charity shops for goodies or just do something creative at home. Thank you, Mary. :)
Super video Mary thank you . I agree with you ...people can think whatever they want to ..that is their business . .in any other category of abuse , physical or sexual , ..people would be patting the back of the person who left their abusers behind . ...this subject is relatively new but people will eventually see it for what it is ..Abuse.... thank you so much ❤️
I'm so glad I stumbled upon you on TH-cam! I am a psychotherapist in private practice and I listen to a lot of online talks about relevant ideas. Yours are excellent. I like also that you don't use profanity, which many podcasters do in their talks. When I encounter that, I immediately turn it of. So thanks again Mary!
I was told " YOU ARE UNWORTHY OF HUMAN INTERACTION". by three generations in my entire family ( this phrase was finally spoken to me, out loud, by a sibling )........ this... is the unraveling lie...that i am dealing with. now.. ( successfully i believe ).
Thanks for the wonderful paradigm of how to navigate ourselves when someone asks us unwanted and intimidating questions about our parents and siblings with not in contact …. This will be helpful in ripping of the shame in scapegoat like us which is devastating and disgusting.🙏
'...If it wasn't for us, everybody else would be absolutely fine...' That was the attitude of all of my extended family. Not Mom. Mom and I were very close, were best friends and were both the family scapegoat together to the extended family. Which wasn't even a big family. They literally told me at every holiday gathering that I was ruining the holiday for everybody. There were many times I did not go because of that. So then they said I ruined the holiday by not going. Every year, no matter what, I either ruin their holiday by going, or ruin their holiday by not going. And they refused to get together at any other time than on a holiday. They did the same thing to Mom. Sometimes one or the other of us said I'm not going through that abuse this year, and stayed home. Sometimes we both went. When I lost my Mom and they were all on very bad terms with Mom, I never had anything to do with them again. And never will. My beautiful, dear Mom is gone. I hold to her love and her memories and will not have that tainted by those who treated her cruelly and hatefully.
I feel that I've been the sacrificial lamb for any and all unpleasantness experienced by anyone in my family. I don't know when I first heard the phrase "taking a hit for the home team". It was not from the mouths of anyone in my family.. but as soon as I heard it I thought "YES. This is my place in my mother's mind". If my family were of the culture that had Sin Eaters... that would also be part of my role. NC has been a lifesaver for me. I wish I'd had the balls to do it 60 years ago. I am not spending another moment of my life in that place.
My faith has been a great refuge for me. I have a Father who loves me with an everlasting love. When I pray about my loneliness, I feel His presence. When I sing His praises, I feel joy! When I read the Bible, it reinforces my decision to go no contact. Forgive yes, but shake the dust off your feet and leave people that refuse to change. Take good care, friends.
My faith is different, but I relate to this concept. I was finally able to be thankful to my birth mother for bringing me to life, yet I honour the true Mother, Mother Earth, for fulfilling my needs and being my place of comfort.
Wow Mary! I don’t know why the algorithm decided to help me today but this was a video I really needed. Thank you for making this and talking about the reality of healing while also dealing with people who are not understanding.
Fantastic Mary, thankyou. I found your looking behind the motives of our explaining really helpful as Id never thought that through before. Your work is very healing. I am the only person I know in this position. I've been no contact for many years, even therapists have not really understood that i'm simply trying to make myself a life in which I can LIVE and thrive without having others try and destroy me. Thankyou for airing this and promoting further my self compassion and self acceptance. I am slowly learning to trust people again though it is not easy that is my next path. To create new, deeper relationships with people who are worthy of what I have to offer. So glad I found your channel and your community. T C.
those words! selfish, mean, manipulative. literally word for word what they call me and their reason for treating me like shit. i can’t wait to never see or speak to them agajn
I've been known to say that my family are 'not around' - and leave people to assume they're all dead. Any further questions can be dealt with by saying one doesn't wish to talk about it.
The other part that bothers me is how some people seem to get swallowed up into that funnel as soon as they realize that was my role. They either disappear or start trying to abuse me in similar ways.
I always listen to this song when I think about moving on in life from toxic family.... th-cam.com/video/Pa2CuK3W17E/w-d-xo.html It may just be from a Sonic game, but the lyrics are powerful and meaningful. Also, if you happen to read all the lyrics, please do not get confused with the part that says.... "Do not let go!"... I don't mean that about family, I mean that about Do not let go of your one true self and Live Life to the fullest without them.
Thank you, Mary, for confirming what happened, that no contact was a sound decision. When I was very young, the beatings and gaslighting our mother committed were often followed by her apology, "I'm sorry but [it's all your fault]." Extreme grief was my reaction to being labeled "a horrible child", and the pit of my stomach and middle of my throat would ache. As an adult I would share my accomplishments with Mom and Dad, some of them very significant for our home state. Mom's reaction was to be oppositional, to insist I was dead wrong, and to exclaim, "Well, did you make any MONEY off of it?!" I would react with frustration accompanied by the same physical pain experienced with my childhood grief: I thought they taught me to put principles before wealth, but it was really a concept I imagined. For me, the walking-away point came when I took Mom on a weekend journey to her ancestors' homesteads and cemeteries, because I had broken down the "brick walls" in our genealogy. I thought the trip would help her confirm hunches on who they really were, how they tied into our family. Several days later, I went to the local biker bar to visit her (over the previous 20 years, she had never casually called, never visited my home), and I walked in to hear her telling the crowd, "That [son of mine] is a weirdo who likes to hang out in cemeteries!" It finally dawned on me that I wasn't the problem. I went home and told my wife that I was officially leaving it up to my mother to reach out: if she wanted a relationship, then she had to try, because all my effort was met with nothing but contempt and, ultimately, betrayal. She never reached out. My wife's varied and many invitations for her to join us for supper, or to visit with us, were all met with deferment or a solid "No", but she would tell her friends and whoever else might listen, that I had abandoned her. Dealing with her was such an absurd ordeal!
I think because we were called liars all of our lives. I mean I could do something nice for somebody and they would accuse me of being manipulative or I could buy someone a gift and I would be accused of just sucking up for an inheritance even though I was maybe only like 15 at the time. The things that they accuse you of are so shocking that they instill this desperate need to just spew truth 24/7 and try to prove that we aren’t this horrible human being that they accuse us of being. Their accusations make your stomach churn and your blood race and your adrenaline spike, and to live in that kind of stress from the time you’re three years old and you don’t even understand what’s happening and they accuse you of being too sensitive and you start to believe well it must be true and decades later you find out later that they were horrible abusers And then you just want to tell everybody what happened because your reputation has been smeared from here to kingdom come throughout the years, but by then it’s too late because it all went on behind your back and you didn’t even know what was happening! I hope someday it is a criminal offense and can be retroactive. They destroy lives they steal people’s inheritance through gossip and slander from the siblings. It’s just unbelievable the things they do. Evil, evil beings isn’t it funny how they all die off or have miserable lives. Maybe there is karma for them.
Not all of them get karma, some of these evil people actually go on to live great lives...Bad things also happen to good people,does that mean that this is their karma too? I think not. Cut the high conflict thinking,heal and move on....
I wouldn't want no contact with my cousins. They're not in the same bracket as siblings. Unfortunately my eldest cousin died of cancer and another lives interstate. They're relatives but not aggravating ones. My father, my only friend in the family is also gone. I don't want to say I feel unlucky but I do.
I’ve been made to feel uncomfortable for years by people that ask that question. I always used to just say that we’ve been estranged for 20 years. But it always felt horrible having to explain that. I wish right from the start I had just said that I don’t have other family (apart from my child). I just always felt like this would be a lie and couldn’t do it, but now that I’m older I know it’s not a lie at all. Those people have never been family, family is not meant to abuse you and scapegoat you .
Every video tells the story of my life and my relationship with my siblings and my mother. Though I know I am not capable of leaving and stop contacting them. I am mentally too destroyed. I am not capable of dealing with trauma and fear of leaving. This channel helped me to understand that I don't have mental disease. Thank you.
I wouldn't waste my time on dealing with guilt unless I was actually guilty. My hurdle involved letting go of the resentment and actually forgiving. The forgiveness doesn't really feel complete due to the fact that they will not change and no contact was the only viable option for me. I must be content in just being satisfied with that and not holding on to that unhealthy anger that comes due to the lack of an apology. The only thing I would recommend as opposed to writing a journal is to get yourself one of those mini tape recorders and voice out your thoughts on the subject at the end of the day and then take a listen before you do it again the next time and then continue on from there. I most definitely wouldn't do it at the start of my day though. Harping on the past is no way to start a day. Good luck.
Mary, your videos are so good. I love how you talk, your cadence, your in depth knowledge and your emotional tone. Even the visual background because nothing distracts from you talking. Thank you for what you do . 18:12
Totally appreciate your teaching Mary and others' comments here. I've been coming to terms with this all my adult life, 40 years. I feel a connection here that's giving me connectivity! Ty all for this. Interesting side note, I'm seeing parallels to Harry's very public separation from his family too...his reality v their collective reality. Just interesting
Yes, I wondered about Harry too. He reminds me of the truth teller having his reality scorned because he had the temerity to speak out loud. Sadly, it doesn't work as most people just don't get it, which is why it's so important we work on healing ourselves I reckon, and not trying to make others understand.
I am 65 and having flashbacks. My siblings used to gang up on me. They called me names in front of my friends. I can’t forgive my sister. When my brother began to have a nervous breakdown because of his bullying of me and the rape of my sisters friends BFF. He got exposed. She said she apologized. But I remember her saying “ have you forgiven mom and I?”. Well, it was an easy question. I love my mom. She was never unkind to me. But the question allows her to dodge. Mom never initiated the bullying like she.. Her crime and mom’s crime are not the same. Dodge dodge dodge. I have to cut off completely. Thank you.
I was raised by verbally abusive mother and aunt..But currently I am still dealing with my evil mother ...Their own mother, I feel, was also abusive.... Hope to have my peace of mind in the future ..
For unknown reason, YT recommended your video to me, and here you are, giving solutions to very specific problems I'm dealing with at the moment. I somehow feel a bit less alone. Thank you.
I appreciate you helping us. I'm very proud of you for doing your work and helping others. I am going no contact more and more. It's mutual for us all. I was the scapegoat that fought back. Uh oh! We're Muslims and Christians. Islam is self correcting. It seems that most of us are changing for the better. I've been healing for a while. It's best to leave so we all can maximize on our healing. I know I deserve a chance without family/community dynamics that are being facillitated to trigger me. Allah tests us all already. I'm interested in the natural environment that life comes at me. My situation is very different than the typical one. I'm seeking the blessings of the Lord by relying on him to deliver us from the hardships of being related. God sees us, hears us, and is witnessing us all. Pray for everyone and ask God to have mercy on us all. When a calamity befalls a Believer and we're drawn closer to our Allah, that is actually a blessing. When a blessing is bestowed upon a Believer and it takes him further from his Lord, that is actually a calamity - Islam
this came up in a discussion, and have heard survivors pose this and say, as a response: "I have no family left unfortunately" What are survivors thoughts on this response?
In my family of origin I suppose I was the performer, the oldest .... but when I got married I became the scapegoat. My husband is the only son and treated like some sort of "treasure" within the family. Yes, my husband is special, but his 5 sisters smother him and it drives both of us crazy. Been married 35 years and his sisters still smother him. Been working with a therapist and we finally made some progress *today* with one of his sisters where my husband wrote a letter to the sister who's the most obsessive and told her he wants to go "no contact" because of how she treats ME. She is vicious to me. Hopefully she is out of our lives or at least we can establish low contact with her at some point. She is so obsessed with her brother and she's very toxic to me. Love your channel!!
All the years I told my collegues at work that ohh I have had a wonderful Christmas with my sister (my only family member left) and the worst narcissist of them all. But I thought it was so wrong that two søsters could not get along. So I invited and tried and tried amd tried. I did not see how much she hate and Envy me and my life. I wanted to include her but she never ever did other than yell at me telling my how stupid and bad behaviord I was. Me ?! Now after years of trying to separate it was so Hard I cried everytime I had visited her… so when I tolk courage to set bounderies she Got so mad at me. Maybe it was that that tipped the balance so that I could finally chose myself In Peace and not In Fear. Now I want to recovery and heal I am the empath In the family. And I am not wrong og bad. ❤️🇩🇰💖🐬🌷🌸🌼🦋💞🥰
Extraordinarily compassionate, invaluable and insightful wisdom... As EVER... THANK YOU FOR SHARING, Mary (and all others via comments)... May the road rise up to meet you... God bless, y'all (all the way from New Zealand) - Here's to creating, sustaining and enhancing positive momentum - on ALL fronts - AND enabling others to do so themselves... 🙏
The elders issue out the shame but no one realizes that they don't seek resolution. For example, my mom says I'm crazy, but if I am, why didn't she try to get me help? When I was sick and needed surgery, she told people she didn't know I was sick...but wasn't I on her insurance when I was diagnosed by a specialist....and after she found out about the surgery, wouldn't a good mother try to see for herself that her child was ok? She told people, without verification, that she just knew I was OK. 🤔
Has anyone else reacted by being horrible and obnoxious back to our family? I've felt that I've been told so often how bad I am that I may as well be bad and say what I truly think.
I have found not discussing family when I meet people is best. Typically I talk my kids and partner. As for addressing my family of origin, I do say both my parents are deceased (true) but I don’t really mention my siblings. My no contact situation is different than for most and because it’s so complicated, I find it easier to not say anything. What others don’t know about my life won’t change their world in knowing about mine. It’s easier to not say anything.
I appreciate this talk, I really do. But I am looking for practical answers when family is asked of me. I know where the shame comes from and I am doing the work, but what do I reply in the meantime when asked about my family?
I just say ‘Blood is not thicker than peace of mind’ People not sure what to say in response and change the subject. I walked away from my family 8yrs ago and have never looked back.
if you feel like answering the nosy person....you can say....oh yeah....gotta get there soon! thank you! or....yes .....thanks ....i hope "you" also get to enjoy a nice visit with my family soon.....all spoken with a soft smile and kind demeanor.....no defensiveness....its hard but practice it in front of the mirror....
You are so brave! Congratulations for taking care of yourself! Thanks for the psychological techniques, to get rid of the triggers. Thank you for sharing.
ps.....you can add....oh yes....thank you! ...(so and so)....is a perfectly lovely person....i hope "you" get to spend a lot of quality time with (him or her).....
It's not a raw nerve for me, it's more that most people cannot fathom it. It's so far beyond people's understanding (if they don't have toxic family dynamics that they're aware of). Being no contact/low contact is very isolating to begin with, and if you tell people sometimes you risk them also pushing you away so as to possibly avoid facing uncomfortable truths about some of their connections.
![How do I live with the hurt? [of family rejection & contempt]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/TfssvVeL2_A/mqdefault.jpg)
“Other people’s opinion of me is NONE of my business.” My new mantra!
WE ARE YOUR FAMILY!!!!!!!! We your fellow scapegoats are here. We are nothing but strong and warriors.
Heart react
8 years no contact for me. The first 3 were incredibly difficult. I went through all the stages of grief. Now I simply say to people, ‘I don’t have any family’ or ‘my family aren’t very nice’ and I’ve never received any pushback at all. I now have an amazing new family, my friends treat me with kindness and they genuinely care about me. My friends have shown me things that my own mother never has such as compassion!! Now I’m healed and well, I attract other people who are well and now I can be my authentic self, I attract authentic people and I’m well regarded by the lovely people I now know. Being degraded by family means you end up degrading yourself, and allowing others to do the same. When you heal and become healthy you will find others like you. Heal Thy Self - healthy self!! ❤
This is so spot-on, when people hear you're no contact with a parent, they assume it's your fault. Then I try to explain, to get them to understand, so the overexplaining definitely happens.
Hi 👋 one of the things I had to learn was boundaries (I was in my 40’s) Narc mothers do not allow boundaries. So when you develop them, people actually don’t challenge you. I’ve stopped over sharing and I realised a while ago, my no is no and I don’t even have to give a reason for it ❤
@@simpletruths5322 " 'No' is a complete sentence "
I don't explain myself anymore as it is a waste of time, I just tell them go live with my narcissistic mother for a few years and then you will know!!!! 🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️🏃♀️
The concept of handing back the backpack of shame was an aha moment for me. It's been so damn heavy! I've tried to leave it on trail sides, kick it off a mountain...but really, it needs to go back to the ones who treated me with such disrespect, unawareness, and meanness. Thanks for that visual.
The reply of: "That's an interesting question. Why do you ask?" It ends that conversation quickly.
That's an excellent response, which could be used to rebuff many intrusive personal questions.
Or shorter versions of that like "Why'd you like to know?", simply just the last part "Why do you ask?" or "Why do you care?".
Oh my god that line …… everything would really be fine in the family if I wasn’t mental , sensitive and reactive 😂😂😂
Arguing my innocence.
That feels familiar.
I shared a bit of my family estrangement reasons with some people on different occasions whom I thought would empathize with me just to realize they already prejudgmed my situation. They accused me of being heartless and ungrateful to my family of origin. To them, I had no valid reasons. Since the last instance, I have appreciated the value of privacy more and always asked myself if it's necessary to share sensitive information every time someone asks. However, the positive side of it was finding out they were fake friends fishing information.
Yes...There should be a thing called a "Nobel Survival Prize" for those who have freed themselves from toxic relationships and made their own sanity and health the priority it should be!
....and a lot of us couldn't do it without the help of those who have traveled that road.
Thank you so much for your wonderful contribution to that end! 💜
Yea thank you.. nobody ever gets us is the worst part
Sadly this survival prize usually does not comes on Earth
Mary you are a superhero.. For so so many years I believed I was the problem.. I now know I was never the problem.. I was my family's answer to THERE PROBLEM...
I'd love to start a scapegoat/black sheep club where we could celebrate Christmas together! Healthy Boundaries on the dinner menu! :-)
Being no contact is an absolute blessing!! When I see the Fear Obligation & Guilt of others ‘having’ to do Christmas with their families who aren’t very nice people, I feel bad for them.
Right. I've often wondered why people even bother to go to family get togethers if their family isn't very nice? Why bother? Why put yourself through that during the holidays?
@@brynne77because they want to desperately love and be loved...they think that maybe their family will see that they "good" and will finally see how rude they've been and change, etc. No contact is very difficult.. but once it is done, it gets so much better as time goes on.
Love that mic drop. Other people's opinion of me is none of my business. 💘 So good to stop that insidious people pleasing.
I've gotten some horrendous reactions from well meaning friends when I disclose I'm no contact with family. "What if they die before you repair the relationship?" or "I'm sure they still love you, I fixed my issues with my mom and now we're closer than ever!" 🤦♀🤦♀🤦♀ I am so ready to heal the shame and doubt. I don't want to internalize other people's ignorance as my own shortcoming anymore.
It was my siblings that turned our mother against me with negativity behind my back, so much so that my mother disinherited me in her will with everything going to my siblings. Not only had I lost my mother, but my siblings as well for their all around cruelty.
Your sister didn't turn your mother against you, your mother disliked you from the start.
I recently learned that people who listen to the bad people, are usually bad themselves.
My narcissist golden child sister would fill my narcissist mother with negative ideas about me but the fact that my narcissist mother chose to entertain those idea's, means that she didn't like me in the first place.
Wow, very sorry to hear this. How are you doing now?
@@brynne77 Thanks for your concern. I do have many adult children that surround me, together ready to help each other as a family should be and with a righteous heart to guide us without labels. After a year of heartache, my heart disassociated from my sister and brother as they already did decades ago so we are finally on the same page.
Before I adopted a policy of never talking about them I noticed that the peopke who would push me, then judge me were always people who had trouble in their own families. They were getting a passive-aggressive charge out of trying to shame me. The oeople who truly didn’t judge me, who were truly sympathetic, were people who came from healthier families. Nobody should be asking you much until and unless you offer it. Therefore to those pushers & judgers I simply lie. “They’re dead now.” Both parents? “Yes, they died in an airplane crash together.” What about your siblings? “I was an only child.” When did they die? “This is a subject that I normally don’t discuss. I’m sure you can understand that.”
I use they're all dead cover story too. Europeans dislike death talk.
@@bobbysgirl8365 😂
I had a crewmate who when I asked her a question about how she broke her leg, she would say, "Pick A) B) C) or D)." LOL! And she would say she rescued a cat, or something like that. I suppose it can be done for questions about one's family as well....... :)
I know what you mean. My mom actually said a while ago about a lady at the church (laughably she’s massively into the church) who’s daughter didn’t talk to her anymore. My mother said to me “well it tells you all you need to know about the daughter, what sort of daughter doesn’t talk to their own mother!” … like of course the daughter was the toxic one. No thought that maybe tue mother was the issue. It’s very telling to me
A saying I heard that sticks with me "Those who think the worst of you don't deserve the best of you."
Five years on the other side of NC and I'm seeing for the first time, just what I really never had to lose in the first place. I was brainwashed to think we were a "family." So the grieving has been for the "family" the abusers created. Sad.
Great content. Thank You.
This!
I had a lot of trouble with "other people's opinions about me are none of my business" because, for me, that sounds like being closed or oblivious to feedback, an arrogant "I'm always right" attitude (not a trait I value).
Eventually I came to understand that what I hadn't learned as a child was how to distinguish valid from invalid criticism or how to stand firmly in truth rather than hysterically trying to convince an insane person that I am not, in fact, a checkered kangaroo (or whatever other nonsense they may assert).
A corollary to that is learning that I do not require others permission, approval, or agreement to make decisions that are best for my well-being. That stops my oversharing or arguing with a mere acquaintance prodding me with "but they're your FAMILY!"
Further, I got it through my head that it's not my job to educate or enlighten anyone. It's shocking how enabling of abuse people with non-abusive families can be! The simple truth is that they DON'T understand; the behaviour resulting from that ignorance is harmful. Knowing that, I just don't go there, as I have no interest in being harmed. Asked directly, I don't lie, but I can say something honest and vague like, "Not this year" or "They're far away," then steer the conversation elsewhere.
Very well said!
"how to stand firmly in truth rather than hysterically trying to convince an insane person that I am not, in fact, a checkered kangaroo (or whatever other nonsense they may assert)."
I find myself wanting to talk about it because I need support. It is all so fresh and I am so angry with my parents and siblings. I just want validation.
Knowing and owning your truth can provide some release. Explaining it to others can be confronting to them and completely beyond their reality. Smile, maintain your power and change the subject:-)
Thank you, your video is very helpful. I also went no contact in 2018, after a life of sadness, confusion and hope that they would understand and change. But had to accept reality and leave. My problem is that I live in a small place where I know many people. Many of them believe in the Hollywood side of my family of origin. Initially shame and fear of being hurt were a terrible burden, now I avoid people and mostly live on my own, leading a sort of solitary lifestyle. It's so sad, it's like being punished for having said "Enough" to abuse.
I hope you find some wise people who get it. I have made some very good friends in the Al-Anon group as they understand that alcoholism and any related mental illnesses affects the whole family and sometimes it’s best to step away from them.
What you said about the family portraying itself like a Hollywood movie really resonates with me. On social media my family treats me like gold, but behind the scenes it’s an entirely different reality.
I'm sorry to hear this. 💐
I went to Stand Alone to embrace it and talk about being estranged. And somebody asked me what I was doing at Christmas. I did the same. I said nothing much. I don't really have any family. He told me he was on his own as well. I said it's alright. It's nowhere near as bad as you think it is.
I used to host orphan's lunches on Christmas Day. They were very popular.
Mary thank you. Please consider a video about rumination and how to stop. X
Thank you, Mary. You are so accurate & concise in describing the heavy burdens a scapegoat needs to learn to shed.
Wishing you a peaceful & positive 2023 💚
Thank you ☺️
Thank you, Mary. It is wonderful to know that after a couple of years of working through so many issues from dysfunctional family members, scapegoats are not crazy. We're really quite wonderful people! I love the changes in me. Thanks again.
the whole family system conspires to survive...God Bless ye for escaping the very subtle net !
I had a distant cousin tell me to "go and see my mother" because apparently she was crying on this person's shoulder telling her they just wanted to see me. She said this as I was going into a church service! She told me she knew I was "having issues" with my mother but "God will tell me anyway." my reply was "He already has!" BUT during the service my mind was whirring and I actually ended up crying because of what she had said. My mother is super controlling. I was the scapegoat in the family. She doesn't want to see me. This is a manipulative ploy to get me back to be scapegoated again because she has lost her scapegoat! I couldn't say anything other than that above phrase to this woman but I felt really angry with her because she did know I wasn't in contact with my mother and the reasons behind it. It obviously felt uncomfortable to HER that I am no contact with mother. But it is none of her business as to what I do because it isn't her relationship with mother that is the same as my relationship with mother. This is what people forget, that each relationship is different and that people can act differently with different people.
yes, it's important for us to protect ourselves from these flying monkeys
@@scapegoatchildrecovery I have limited contact with her since that day, even on social media. I used to feel the need to justify but not anymore. We do have to protect ourselves. I have learned that I am very good at the one word phrase!
It really wasn't her place to stick her nose in YOUR business.
Mary how do we ever get close to anyone if we have to be so guarded all the time? (This is what plagues me)
Thank you for the support! Here’s to more getting free in ‘23 🥰🙏🏾✨❤️
High Five to that
Thank you I actually come from a Family of 10. I have been in Therapy going on 6 years. I went no contact and I appreciate your insight on this matter.
Mary......i laughed at the "NO_BULL PEACE PRIZE" 🤣🤣
😂😂😂
I made the mistake of trying to open up to a friend about my narcissistic mother and sadly got gaslit, she said “are you sure she meant it like that?”, “she wouldn’t mean to hurt you have you tried talking to her” , I know it’s not safe to explain the situation to these people. I guess if you have a kind and loving family you cannot begin to understand what it’s like to be bullied and ostracised your whole life by your own family. I’m starting my recovery, low contact it is. The trauma response I have from even setting eyes on my mother is horrific. So many of us must have PTSD, I nearly had a fully blown panic attack when I last saw her. She’s there at mass every day, you would think she was mother Theresa but she’s utterly vile to me behind closed doors, but her public persona is of a wonderful woman who does volunteer work in the community. Why has nobody seen she’s wearing a mask…
They are experts at pretending to be wonderful people to everyone else.
Very helpful. To be honest, it took me ages to even know when I was triggered, as I was so used to living my entire life in such a state of extreme anxiety. First I had to go no contact for more than 6 months before that first layer started subsiding enough to know the difference be tween normal and triggered!! 😰
I went NC for 6 months, then my mom hoovered me back because she needed place to live and to control me. When I got stronger and set my boundaries, she started abusing me again every 2 weeks and now more often, telling/doing all that triggers me most…so I’m trying to go NC again
All families are dysfunction at various degrees. Therefore most people have suffered abuse. Mental, physical, emotional, sexual or spiritual. Basically most people are in a trance. The family will not want to wake up and look at themselves so don’t bother trying to wake them up. Go no contact and work on yourself. By going no contact you stop feeding your toxic trauma bond. It then starts to break down. I was the scapegoat of a scapegoat. Not much has been mentioned of how a scapegoat in the family can offload their stuff to another sibling or even outsider.
So certain scapegoats can end up narcissists. Causing turmoil in relationship, work and life. The bullies.
So it’s not as straightforward as how it’s being made out.
Have gone no contact 16 days ago on Christmas Eve with my sister I am healing my toxic trauma bond which is breaking down. So much is repressed.
Feeling your sensations is key to healing.
Each day I do progressive deep relaxation to help the body relax.
It’s amazing the secrets the body and mind keep from us.
The trauma will not come up at once as the nervous system can only handle so much.
You have to look after yourself during this process.
Awarness meditation is also beneficial.There some excellent book on trauma out there. I will not discuss in any detail my decision with sleeping family members. Luckily I rarely see them, even less now.
An excellent way to aid recovery is to write a daily journal plus keeping a dream diary.
Oh goodness this is my story exactly! Thank you for sharing; I thought I was the only one with this unique situation of the childhood scapegoat (my sister) turning into a narcissist to scapegoat me (younger sibling) I also went no contact over the holidays with her, and now live in an apartment by myself
I think that was part of why I put up with her for so long, because I knew we both came from the same abusive family situation. BUT, I never thought for a second that SHE would end up abusing ME. I felt doubly betrayed by her behavior, because she knew exactly what I went through, and chose to be abusive and manipulative anyway.
Thank you so much! Did you find those meditations on YT? My mom is a scapegoat and she became a narcissist…along with my father that is somehow switching from codependent to a narcissist, as well as narc or sociopathic sister. It is so hard. Is it possible to build my own walls, my own family, get love if I didn’t really get any stable love/relationship from FOO?
@@ptlovelight2971how are you doing now living alone?
@@ptlovelight2971 horrible
You are wonderful and strong Mary. My heart goes out to you for dealing with all the family scapegoating thoughout the years like myself. Although we don't have to explain to people, I sure hope that there is someone you can confine in as we all need that one person at the very least. My fiance never had this problem with her own family but has witnissed my struggles with my own family head on and has even been accused on occassion by them too before I went no contact 3-4 years ago. She always stands by me and my choice to be free of the family of origin. I hope you find / have found a partner who either has experienced the same or at the very least understands you and your choices to go no contact with your own family.
They are such kind words Charlie
@@matilda4406 thank you but i do mean everything i say. We scapegoats have and continue to go through so many struggles even after no contact but we are so strong and capable beyond belief. From personal experience, i believe the hardest thing we struggle with is loneliness and over explaining our situation but so long as we can find at least one person out there who love, cherishes, and respects us for who we are, its all worth it.
@@wonderfulwardy agree 100% ! Someone with whom we can share our love.
I'm fine with strangers and acquaintances, but I am dreading running in to wider family. My mother has smeared me. Even though she does classic DARVO when I asked her to stop, gives me the silent treatment and smears me, all the relatives have been told I'm mad, bad and unhappy. I will not defend myself. What is the point. I'm watching how Prince Harry thought his side would change how people felt and it has not. It has cemented it. I dont think he is a typical scapegoat btw. But when I meet cousins who think I'm mad, bad n sad, all I can do is try not to freeze. I will not start giving my side.
I moved very far away so I would never, ever run into ANYONE. I also changed my name, legally, so I couldn’t be found should they look. I didn’t want to live in the world where my abusers name was attached to me. I was and am deadly serious about not having that ish in my life. I’m old enough now that I just tell people they’re dead. If you keep hanging around all you’ll get is more oain. If you think it’s going to stop some day - I promise you it won’t. Ever.
I know how you feel Susan. I went NC with my NPD mother 10 years ago and was hoping I could reconnect with a few relatives on that side. She has totally smeared me tho and the other relatives are either her flying monkeys or they don't care and/or may have some level of narcissism themselves. So I've this year decided finally that it's actually not worth it. On my Dad's side I have family whom I love yet I know they won't understand. So if asked I just say that she and I aren't close and my brother is more involved and says she's doing fine. Take care. The struggle comes and goes for a while I think. I'm there too!
@@rs5570 I thought of changing my name actually. Good for you for taking your self protection and care seriously.
@@BarbzSA I just did that this year. 🎉
As you heal your trauma bond a new your emerges. Stronger and wiser.
Thank you so much Mary! Spot on content. I just called police on my neighbors because they were screaming threats and throwing things and a child started crying. Police came and all quiet now but I still feel sick and noticed I felt scared and guilty for calling police! So useful to come back to these resources and work through triggers.
I am such an empath just reading your comment hurts my heart. It is so hard managing consciousness as an adult, imagine the suffering of that child. I wish every child was born into the arms of loving parents.
@@JerseyLynne me too.. take care of yourself so that you can keep shining.
I've had many insights about this through the 6+ years I gradually ceased contact with my family of origin ("FOO"). It's been my experience that things "land" in us when we're ready (ie, sufficiently healed), and sometimes the same insight revisits us to sink in deeper and be integrated.
That is likely a lifelong process, which can feel hopeless and daunting if you think of it as a "karmic wheel" you're just circling and circling, getting no where. It's helped me a lot to think of it as "spiraling upward," so I can remind myself when I encounter an unpleasantly familiar thing that I'm viewing it from a higher perspective than I did the last time, having learned lessons and acquired tools that I can apply. That boosts my courage, confidence, self esteem, resolve, and curiosity. The more I heal, grow, and change, the smaller and less significant the trigger will be in my next turn around the winding staircase.
Exactly 👏
I love this analogy. It's true. We see things from a "higher" perspective the next time around.....
Just tell the person, that sometimes, some families need a scapegoat. This family thought they would make me their scapegoat and I wasn't having it, so I have decided to go "no contact".
Thanks Mary, your videos are great and so helpful. I went on a first date before Christmas and he asked me if I got on with my mum after talking about his for a while. I said 'no, not really - we haven't spoken for many months.' He then grabbed his coat and stormed out, mumbling an excuse I couldn't decipher. An issue I'm noticing on online dating advice videos is that dating gurus often advise that a major red flag is dating someone who doesn't have a good relationship with their family, so I wonder if people are picking up on comments like this and not giving us a chance!
YES. It's a major red flag.Never date anyone who NEVER get along with their mother or even least try.Mary should giv some feedbk here plz
Scapegoat here, also someone who's been married almost 40 years. With Mary's confirmation that we are rock stars....if someone runs from you, they weren't ready to date a rockstar ;)
@@maureengallant5066 spot on!
Sounds like he was a weak man. I’m glad he didn’t waste anymore of your time! Best wishes on finding the right one!
@@dnk4559 maybe he ran home to tell his Mammy 🧐
If somebody should have asked me that - told them - I´ve been an orphan - bc once you start explaining the truth ....they will not believe you anyway.....always put the blaime on the ex-scapegoat -
Mainstream Mental Health seems just as ignorant as mainstream society.. At least here in the US. My therapist was clueless. Very damaging.
i've noticed this year that i haven't been asked at all where and how i spend my christmas, with or without my family.
Has been really hard for years, especially since i tend to spend my christmas alone. It's not like i've always spent christmas with my family my whole life. i'm 50, but i would say, in the last few years it's definitely been under the no contact heading. Last year i had an outlier because the parents and my sister were really unwell. it was okay, but i don't see any reason to go there on Christmas Eve and when my mother asked me the other day and we have rather low contact it came shooting out of me that there was no way i was coming on Christmas Eve. and that's not a disaster at all. at least she doesn't say anything more about it. but i'm going there on Boxing Day and having dinner with them. so it's not quite like not doing something with the family. but i just found it interesting that i wasn't asked anymore and i think that's because i'm really more or less okay with it. even if I listen to these videos now at Christmas, but I remember years when I would have really crawled under my carpet out of sheer shame, but that was also a time when it became clear to me how serious all this emotional abuse was and today I see myself more as someone who can be proud of the fact that I stand by myself.
You’re a badass ❤ love it! Thanks Mary and you’re right, we all deserve a medal and not a backpack of shame.
I love you. Courageous, smart, determined. You are awesome!
Thank you ☺️
Exactly, I feel the same! So happy I found your channel. It's unbelievable that your parents can not love such a good person.
I’ve been the scapegoat of my family, after my mother passed away. I was only 21. I’ve always been sensitive, and my father and TWIN sister made fun of me. To make matters worse, all through High School, and beyond, my sister started telling her friends, mutual friends, and my father that I was weird. She’d make up horrible stories about me. I lost so many friends, and my father saying I was weird, too sensitive. My mother was so supportive of me, that I didn’t feel isolated. After she died, the smear campaign got to bad. So much so that I started to believe it. I started having panic attacks, 1 year of agoraphobia, and depressed. Thank God I found a very good psychotherapist, who was a great help. I cut ties with my sister and my father. Now my father is 89. He’s very healthy, but I’m having guilt and shame about when he passes away. Of course I love my father, but I couldn’t be a part of his life. Now I’m getting anxiety again about when he passes. Any advice ?
He was mocking you and wasn’t there for you. What is a father’s responsibility…
Lenore Marie, in childhood that is the time age is of relevance. Please don’t think anything of the number beside his age- he abused you. He never changed. It is an awful thing. I’m glad you got a good psychotherapist they are hard to find. My advice would be if they are still working to go back to them. This is a new area for work. His advancing age and you have done very good work so far. There are all sorts of people who are psychotherapists - you had a good one- I hope they are still there. And also it is not you regressing. It is you progressing a new question has arisen that is very serious for your well-being.
@@melliecrann-gaoth4789 Thank you for your insightful advice. I’m still seeing my therapist. She says only I can make that decision when my father passes away. Also to think beyond that, when my father is gone, but my sister is still alive. We live across the country, I’ll never have to deal with her again. Nothing has happened yet so I’m amping up my mindfulness practices, to stay in the here and now. I really appreciate you answering my comment.
Such helpful advice as always, Mary. I always end up in tears, lol, but it's all part of the healing process I think. Not having to explain myself is something I've been working on and with the gradual healing I haven't felt the need to either, which is so freeing. My family of origin have all passed on now anyway, apart from one of my sisters who's in a care home with dementia. My birthday's just coming up and it's always been a stressful time for me but I feel quite calm about it this year. I usually want to do something really special to compensate, but my plans always fall through, so this year I haven't made any - apart from making a nice meal for tea and having some wine in the evening. I haven't even felt the need to buy myself a present this year either. If it's a nice day I might go for a walk with my camera and if it isn't I could have a trawl around the charity shops for goodies or just do something creative at home. Thank you, Mary. :)
♥️♥️♥️
Super video Mary thank you . I agree with you ...people can think whatever they want to ..that is their business . .in any other category of abuse , physical or sexual , ..people would be patting the back of the person who left their abusers behind . ...this subject is relatively new but people will eventually see it for what it is ..Abuse.... thank you so much ❤️
I'm so glad I stumbled upon you on TH-cam! I am a psychotherapist in private practice and I listen to a lot of online talks about relevant ideas. Yours are excellent. I like also that you don't use profanity, which many podcasters do in their talks. When I encounter that, I immediately turn it of. So thanks again Mary!
I was told " YOU ARE UNWORTHY OF HUMAN INTERACTION". by three generations in my entire family ( this phrase was finally spoken to me, out loud, by a sibling )........ this... is the unraveling lie...that i am dealing with. now.. ( successfully i believe ).
Thanks for the wonderful paradigm of how to navigate ourselves when someone asks us unwanted and intimidating questions about our parents and siblings with not in contact …. This will be helpful in ripping of the shame in scapegoat like us which is devastating and disgusting.🙏
How wonderful you are to use your wisdom from personal experience to help others like us 😊
'...If it wasn't for us, everybody else would be absolutely fine...'
That was the attitude of all of my extended family. Not Mom. Mom and I were very close, were best friends and were both the family scapegoat together to the extended family. Which wasn't even a big family.
They literally told me at every holiday gathering that I was ruining the holiday for everybody. There were many times I did not go because of that. So then they said I ruined the holiday by not going.
Every year, no matter what, I either ruin their holiday by going, or ruin their holiday by not going. And they refused to get together at any other time than on a holiday. They did the same thing to Mom. Sometimes one or the other of us said I'm not going through that abuse this year, and stayed home. Sometimes we both went.
When I lost my Mom and they were all on very bad terms with Mom, I never had anything to do with them again. And never will. My beautiful, dear Mom is gone. I hold to her love and her memories and will not have that tainted by those who treated her cruelly and hatefully.
I feel that I've been the sacrificial lamb for any and all unpleasantness experienced by anyone in my family. I don't know when I first heard the phrase "taking a hit for the home team". It was not from the mouths of anyone in my family.. but as soon as I heard it I thought "YES. This is my place in my mother's mind". If my family were of the culture that had Sin Eaters... that would also be part of my role. NC has been a lifesaver for me. I wish I'd had the balls to do it 60 years ago. I am not spending another moment of my life in that place.
My faith has been a great refuge for me. I have a Father who loves me with an everlasting love. When I pray about my loneliness, I feel His presence. When I sing His praises, I feel joy! When I read the Bible, it reinforces my decision to go no contact. Forgive yes, but shake the dust off your feet and leave people that refuse to change. Take good care, friends.
Yes! He loves us and does not forsake us!
❤ this❣👍🏼🤗 finding this out as wellllll🥰🥰
My faith is different, but I relate to this concept. I was finally able to be thankful to my birth mother for bringing me to life, yet I honour the true Mother, Mother Earth, for fulfilling my needs and being my place of comfort.
Perfect!
All glory to our Lord who cares for us!
Wow Mary! I don’t know why the algorithm decided to help me today but this was a video I really needed. Thank you for making this and talking about the reality of healing while also dealing with people who are not understanding.
Fantastic Mary, thankyou. I found your looking behind the motives of our explaining really helpful as Id never thought that through before.
Your work is very healing. I am the only person I know in this position. I've been no contact for many years, even therapists have not really understood that i'm simply trying to make myself a life in which I can LIVE and thrive without having others try and destroy me.
Thankyou for airing this and promoting further my self compassion and self acceptance.
I am slowly learning to trust people again though it is not easy that is my next path. To create new, deeper relationships with people who are worthy of what I have to offer.
So glad I found your channel and your community. T C.
those words! selfish, mean, manipulative. literally word for word what they call me and their reason for treating me like shit. i can’t wait to never see or speak to them agajn
I've been known to say that my family are 'not around' - and leave people to assume they're all dead. Any further questions can be dealt with by saying one doesn't wish to talk about it.
I’m so glad videos like this are accessible to people. When I originally went no contact I didn’t have any resources. Thank you for this 🙏
The other part that bothers me is how some people seem to get swallowed up into that funnel as soon as they realize that was my role. They either disappear or start trying to abuse me in similar ways.
I always listen to this song when I think about moving on in life from toxic family....
th-cam.com/video/Pa2CuK3W17E/w-d-xo.html
It may just be from a Sonic game, but the lyrics are powerful and meaningful.
Also, if you happen to read all the lyrics, please do not get confused with the part that says.... "Do not let go!"... I don't mean that about family, I mean that about Do not let go of your one true self and Live Life to the fullest without them.
Thank you, Mary, for confirming what happened, that no contact was a sound decision.
When I was very young, the beatings and gaslighting our mother committed were often followed by her apology, "I'm sorry but [it's all your fault]." Extreme grief was my reaction to being labeled "a horrible child", and the pit of my stomach and middle of my throat would ache.
As an adult I would share my accomplishments with Mom and Dad, some of them very significant for our home state. Mom's reaction was to be oppositional, to insist I was dead wrong, and to exclaim, "Well, did you make any MONEY off of it?!" I would react with frustration accompanied by the same physical pain experienced with my childhood grief: I thought they taught me to put principles before wealth, but it was really a concept I imagined.
For me, the walking-away point came when I took Mom on a weekend journey to her ancestors' homesteads and cemeteries, because I had broken down the "brick walls" in our genealogy. I thought the trip would help her confirm hunches on who they really were, how they tied into our family. Several days later, I went to the local biker bar to visit her (over the previous 20 years, she had never casually called, never visited my home), and I walked in to hear her telling the crowd, "That [son of mine] is a weirdo who likes to hang out in cemeteries!" It finally dawned on me that I wasn't the problem. I went home and told my wife that I was officially leaving it up to my mother to reach out: if she wanted a relationship, then she had to try, because all my effort was met with nothing but contempt and, ultimately, betrayal.
She never reached out. My wife's varied and many invitations for her to join us for supper, or to visit with us, were all met with deferment or a solid "No", but she would tell her friends and whoever else might listen, that I had abandoned her. Dealing with her was such an absurd ordeal!
That is heartbreaking. Thank you for sharing. ♥
I’m so sorry you’ve been through this. You deserve so much better. Some people are incapable of any love
Thank you, Mary.
I think because we were called liars all of our lives. I mean I could do something nice for somebody and they would accuse me of being manipulative or I could buy someone a gift and I would be accused of just sucking up for an inheritance even though I was maybe only like 15 at the time. The things that they accuse you of are so shocking that they instill this desperate need to just spew truth 24/7 and try to prove that we aren’t this horrible human being that they accuse us of being. Their accusations make your stomach churn and your blood race and your adrenaline spike, and to live in that kind of stress from the time you’re three years old and you don’t even understand what’s happening and they accuse you of being too sensitive and you start to believe well it must be true and decades later you find out later that they were horrible abusers And then you just want to tell everybody what happened because your reputation has been smeared from here to kingdom come throughout the years, but by then it’s too late because it all went on behind your back and you didn’t even know what was happening! I hope someday it is a criminal offense and can be retroactive. They destroy lives they steal people’s inheritance through gossip and slander from the siblings. It’s just unbelievable the things they do. Evil, evil beings isn’t it funny how they all die off or have miserable lives. Maybe there is karma for them.
Not all of them get karma, some of these evil people actually go on to live great lives...Bad things also happen to good people,does that mean that this is their karma too? I think not. Cut the high conflict thinking,heal and move on....
@@incognito3599 yes absolutely in my experience
I wouldn't want no contact with my cousins. They're not in the same bracket as siblings. Unfortunately my eldest cousin died of cancer and another lives interstate. They're relatives but not aggravating ones. My father, my only friend in the family is also gone. I don't want to say I feel unlucky but I do.
I’ve been made to feel uncomfortable for years by people that ask that question. I always used to just say that we’ve been estranged for 20 years. But it always felt horrible having to explain that. I wish right from the start I had just said that I don’t have other family (apart from my child). I just always felt like this would be a lie and couldn’t do it, but now that I’m older I know it’s not a lie at all. Those people have never been family, family is not meant to abuse you and scapegoat you .
Every video tells the story of my life and my relationship with my siblings and my mother. Though I know I am not capable of leaving and stop contacting them. I am mentally too destroyed. I am not capable of dealing with trauma and fear of leaving. This channel helped me to understand that I don't have mental disease. Thank you.
I wouldn't waste my time on dealing with guilt unless I was actually guilty. My hurdle involved letting go of the resentment and actually forgiving. The forgiveness doesn't really feel complete due to the fact that they will not change and no contact was the only viable option for me. I must be content in just being satisfied with that and not holding on to that unhealthy anger that comes due to the lack of an apology. The only thing I would recommend as opposed to writing a journal is to get yourself one of those mini tape recorders and voice out your thoughts on the subject at the end of the day and then take a listen before you do it again the next time and then continue on from there. I most definitely wouldn't do it at the start of my day though. Harping on the past is no way to start a day. Good luck.
Your videos are so helpful thank you 🙏🙏
Mary, your videos are so good. I love how you talk, your cadence, your in depth knowledge and your emotional tone. Even the visual background because nothing distracts from you talking. Thank you for what you do . 18:12
aww thanks so much Brenda. I love educating via these videos and currently working on creating more... thanks again 😊
Totally appreciate your teaching Mary and others' comments here. I've been coming to terms with this all my adult life, 40 years. I feel a connection here that's giving me connectivity! Ty all for this. Interesting side note, I'm seeing parallels to Harry's very public separation from his family too...his reality v their collective reality. Just interesting
I thought that too. I could feel his pain
Yes, I wondered about Harry too. He reminds me of the truth teller having his reality scorned because he had the temerity to speak out loud. Sadly, it doesn't work as most people just don't get it, which is why it's so important we work on healing ourselves I reckon, and not trying to make others understand.
@@DevonExplorerI need to watch that interview ☺️
I am 65 and having flashbacks. My siblings used to gang up on me. They called me names in front of my friends. I can’t forgive my sister. When my brother began to have a nervous breakdown because of his bullying of me and the rape of my sisters friends BFF. He got exposed. She said she apologized. But I remember her saying “ have you forgiven mom and I?”. Well, it was an easy question. I love my mom. She was never unkind to me. But the question allows her to dodge. Mom never initiated the bullying like she.. Her crime and mom’s crime are not the same. Dodge dodge dodge. I have to cut off completely. Thank you.
Thank you thank you thank you.
❤ mary, mirchi family is responsible for my texas and florida family missing and replaced
I was raised by verbally abusive mother and aunt..But currently I am still dealing with my evil mother ...Their own mother, I feel, was also abusive....
Hope to have my peace of mind in the future ..
For unknown reason, YT recommended your video to me, and here you are, giving solutions to very specific problems I'm dealing with at the moment. I somehow feel a bit less alone. Thank you.
I appreciate you helping us. I'm very proud of you for doing your work and helping others. I am going no contact more and more. It's mutual for us all. I was the scapegoat that fought back. Uh oh! We're Muslims and Christians. Islam is self correcting. It seems that most of us are changing for the better. I've been healing for a while. It's best to leave so we all can maximize on our healing. I know I deserve a chance without family/community dynamics that are being facillitated to trigger me. Allah tests us all already. I'm interested in the natural environment that life comes at me. My situation is very different than the typical one. I'm seeking the blessings of the Lord by relying on him to deliver us from the hardships of being related. God sees us, hears us, and is witnessing us all. Pray for everyone and ask God to have mercy on us all. When a calamity befalls a Believer and we're drawn closer to our Allah, that is actually a blessing. When a blessing is bestowed upon a Believer and it takes him further from his Lord, that is actually a calamity - Islam
this came up in a discussion, and have heard survivors pose this and say, as a response: "I have no family left unfortunately" What are survivors thoughts on this response?
In my family of origin I suppose I was the performer, the oldest .... but when I got married I became the scapegoat. My husband is the only son and treated like some sort of "treasure" within the family. Yes, my husband is special, but his 5 sisters smother him and it drives both of us crazy. Been married 35 years and his sisters still smother him. Been working with a therapist and we finally made some progress *today* with one of his sisters where my husband wrote a letter to the sister who's the most obsessive and told her he wants to go "no contact" because of how she treats ME. She is vicious to me. Hopefully she is out of our lives or at least we can establish low contact with her at some point. She is so obsessed with her brother and she's very toxic to me. Love your channel!!
Thank you for sharing and massive well done for implementing those necessary healthy boundaries 💕
I tell people when asked about my family that "I let them go their way".
All the years I told my collegues at work that ohh I have had a wonderful Christmas with my sister (my only family member left) and the worst narcissist of them all. But I thought it was so wrong that two søsters could not get along. So I invited and tried and tried amd tried. I did not see how much she hate and Envy me and my life. I wanted to include her but she never ever did other than yell at me telling my how stupid and bad behaviord I was. Me ?! Now after years of trying to separate it was so Hard I cried everytime I had visited her… so when I tolk courage to set bounderies she Got so mad at me. Maybe it was that that tipped the balance so that I could finally chose myself In Peace and not In Fear. Now I want to recovery and heal I am the empath In the family. And I am not wrong og bad. ❤️🇩🇰💖🐬🌷🌸🌼🦋💞🥰
I found this so so helpful Mary thank you 😺🧚♀💓
Wow this is good stuff and hard at the same time to get to the crux of the matter.
Extraordinarily compassionate, invaluable and insightful wisdom... As EVER... THANK YOU FOR SHARING, Mary (and all others via comments)... May the road rise up to meet you... God bless, y'all (all the way from New Zealand) - Here's to creating, sustaining and enhancing positive momentum - on ALL fronts - AND enabling others to do so themselves... 🙏
The elders issue out the shame but no one realizes that they don't seek resolution. For example, my mom says I'm crazy, but if I am, why didn't she try to get me help? When I was sick and needed surgery, she told people she didn't know I was sick...but wasn't I on her insurance when I was diagnosed by a specialist....and after she found out about the surgery, wouldn't a good mother try to see for herself that her child was ok? She told people, without verification, that she just knew I was OK. 🤔
This resonates. So sorry you went through this.
Has anyone else reacted by being horrible and obnoxious back to our family? I've felt that I've been told so often how bad I am that I may as well be bad and say what I truly think.
I have found not discussing family when I meet people is best. Typically I talk my kids and partner. As for addressing my family of origin, I do say both my parents are deceased (true) but I don’t really mention my siblings. My no contact situation is different than for most and because it’s so complicated, I find it easier to not say anything. What others don’t know about my life won’t change their world in knowing about mine. It’s easier to not say anything.
I have no contact with my family. Now that I won’t talk to my mother she’s being manipulative, again I’m the bad person.
I appreciate this talk, I really do. But I am looking for practical answers when family is asked of me. I know where the shame comes from and I am doing the work, but what do I reply in the meantime when asked about my family?
Something like ‘I haven’t seen them in a while’ and swiftly deflect - start asking them about THEIR family.
@@scapegoatchildrecovery I truly thank you, Mary.
This was fantastic. Thank you
I just say ‘Blood is not thicker than peace of mind’
People not sure what to say in response and change the subject. I walked away from my family 8yrs ago and have never looked back.
Hi Mary. Your videos are super helpful. I would like to know how to join our coaching group. Thanks, Kathy.
Only the brave are free - Seneca
if you feel like answering the nosy person....you can say....oh yeah....gotta get there soon! thank you! or....yes .....thanks ....i hope "you" also get to enjoy a nice visit with my family soon.....all spoken with a soft smile and kind demeanor.....no defensiveness....its hard but practice it in front of the mirror....
You are so brave! Congratulations for taking care of yourself! Thanks for the psychological techniques, to get rid of the triggers. Thank you for sharing.
ps.....you can add....oh yes....thank you! ...(so and so)....is a perfectly lovely person....i hope "you" get to spend a lot of quality time with (him or her).....
It's not a raw nerve for me, it's more that most people cannot fathom it. It's so far beyond people's understanding (if they don't have toxic family dynamics that they're aware of). Being no contact/low contact is very isolating to begin with, and if you tell people sometimes you risk them also pushing you away so as to possibly avoid facing uncomfortable truths about some of their connections.