Thanks for all the tests dude! This will definitely help me expose S-Cinetone outside. Inside I think I prefer to use s-log. You're my go to resource when it comes to the FX30 man! Keep it up!
Good stuff my guy! I like S-Cinetone on my A7 IV because it's pretty easy but I also like to give it a slight adjustment in post with some more contrast and saturation but it's much easier to start with than S-LOG 3, especially if there's no need for maximum dynamic range.
hey i watched this video, took your advice and im exposing waaaayyy better w this picture profile than any other . i can do s log 3 but why when i can have it almost perfect. thank you so much i seriously appreciate you.
I appreciate this video, I have been a long time Sony photography shooter and am just now getting into video. So it really is a completely different world. Especially since the After Adobe dust up I’m learning multiple new programs including Resolve. This video was immensely helpful. Your teaching style is straight forward thanks.
Great! I always use Slog 3 on the A7 IV and the results are amazing, but when i try to use S-Cinetone i have blown highlights on the skintone. And it's unusable but with your tests i understood that i have to underexpose! So thank you very much. The exposure here it's like the opposite of the log profiles. It's difficult for my mind to accept that i have to underexpose while i always overexpose for the S log 😂😂
@@contentm3893 on the A7IV there isn't Cine EI. Moreover at 0EV the skintones are too bright and with the highlights slider i can't recover it. For me S-log is on another level.
Very helpful as always, Phillip! Like how you take things slow and explain things with great examples without getting so technical in jargon that it becomes uninteligible googly gop. As a fairly new FX3 owner, I appreciate these! New to shooting in SLOG3 and s-Cinetone. It's a scary world out there. 😅
Thanks this was easy to understand. I'm primarily a R709 camcorder user with 70 for skintone but was having issues with the FX30. Now I can clearly see I was over exposing sCinetone. Still playing around with sLog which is confusingly the opposite needing to overexposed by 2 stops. And Luts can make it even more confusing to get the right exposure with Leeming Luts ETTR.
Cine EI can make it easier to expose S-Log 3 if you have the time to figure out the work flow. I have a video on that, too! I also have an S-Log 3 exposure cheat sheet in the description of that video if you want to see recommended values for highlights, skin tones, and middle gray with and without a monitor LUT
@@PhillipRPeck I'll have to check that out. I'm still trying to decide whether using a LUT to make the grading easier or using slog as PP and Gamma Display Assist. Any thoughts on Leeming LUT? So far I've found the histogram is easiest way to get a rough understanding of the exposure.
@@petercofrancesco9812 I haven't used Leeming LUT since I had it for the GH5s so I'm not really sure how much it differs from the built in S709 LUT as far as exposure. I would imagine they're pretty close so I think if you follow best practices for exposing S-Log3 with Sony's monitor LUTS (S709/Gamma Display Assist), you'll undoubtedly be in the ballpark for exposing Leeming LUT
@@PhillipRPeck Seems strange but there is a big difference between using exposures even if shooting in Slog when you use different LUTs. Here I created a 2 minute video showing the differences all shot in Slog. th-cam.com/video/2JAaHu97lgs/w-d-xo.html
Thank you Phillip for this video, i will run some tests today on my Sony A7IV and with ev-1. I plan to shoot a short comedy film next week on s-cinetone, do you think it’s safer to shoot it on s-log3 to avoid being unable to save highlight clippings and underexposure issues? I am new to using exposure on cameras as usually someone else does it for me but this time i’ll be on my own. Btw, Slog3 seems even more complicated according to what i have read so far.
It might be easier to stick with S-Cinetone. Just remember that what you see is what you get, so if it looks overexposed on the LCD then that's what it's going to be. And I wouldn't call it an underexposure issue, I think S-Cinetone looks better a little bit underexposed. That's where you get the most contrast and saturation.
Interesting video! I'm gonna experiment more with underexposing s-cinetone. I shot a short film using s-cinetone (for experimentation) and no grading just SOC. I kept the multi-meter at 0 while shooting and some shots look pretty overexposed which I chugged up thinking it's just the profile's lack of dynamic range (in comparison with Slog3). So I'm gonna give it another go, thank you for your video and bringing up your testings!
That was really helpful, thank you! What settings would you use to shoot a long outdoor fitness type video (with naturally changing light conditions). Adjusting an ND would not be an option. S Cinetone, SLOG 3, or an automatic profile? Thanks again!
Thank you! I'm always a big proponent of S-Log 3. I think it's the most flexible and forgiving. You could set the exposure for middle grey or skin tones and let the highlights in the sky go. Or you could make sure that the highlights don't clip (around 94 IRE in S-Log 3) and possibly raise the exposure on the subject in post if it got too dark
Hello Philip. I need a little help if you could. I have the A6700 with sony18-105 F4 glass. I film mostly. I make films on my motorcyle so it is quite dinamic the usage. I get off, take my camera and film my buddies, or me, I move a lot. For the life of me I can't figure out what is the best to use. Manual or Aperture priority and my footage seems a lot underexposed. When I am static yes I can find the best exposure but when I move and obviosly the light changes, it is almost always underexposed. Could you give me some tips ? Thank you.
When you're in aperture priority you can use exposure compensation to bias the exposure. There is a function button already set to exposure compensation, you can see it on the bottom of the scroll wheel--the little plus and minus symbol. You could also program it to the dial on the top right which is typically where the exposure compensation is found on bigger Sony camera bodies. If you're in a really bright scene or maybe the sky is very prevalent, you might want to set the exposure compensation to even (0) or maybe under by a stop (-1) or 2 (-2). If you're in a shadowy scene, or the exposure just looks too dark to you on the LCD, then bump the exposure comp to +1 or whatever looks good to you. That would be the easiest way if you want to stay in aperture priority but still retain quick and easy control over your exposure. Just ride the exposure compensation dial (it's basically keeping your aperture at the value that you set, then adjusting the shutter and ISO based on your exposure comp choice) I hope that helps, let me know
Phillip! Quick question while seeing you’re video! Please, how do you move the image at 2:57 while zooming in davjnci? I’ve tried everything for like a year and can’t do it hahahaha
If you're using a mouse with a middle mouse button/wheel, just click and hold the middle button and drag around. If you're using a trackpad, it should just be a two finger drag. If you don't have a middle mouse button/wheel on your mouse, I'd recommend getting one because there is a lot of useful functionality in Resolve using that feature. I even made a video about it
Please clarify something for me. The a6700 has dual base iso, 125 and 400? That's not even 2 stops and seems hardly worth it. I thought the high end was ISO 2000. Your thoughts? Thanks for the video.
Good question. The 125 and 400 pair is for picture profiles not named S-Log. For S-Log 3 the base ISO pair is 800 and 2500. There are the same number of stops between 125 and 400 and 800 and 2500, but I guess the numbers ramp up almost like a log curve the higher you go so it seems like there's a bigger gap in the higher base pair. But this lack of distance between the high base and low base is a legitimate concern when compared to the a7SIII/FX3/FX6/ZV-E1 sensor which goes from 100 to 2000 non S-Log and 640 or 800 all the way to 12800 in S-Log 3
Great tips ! Really enjoy your tutorials ! Question: I may be wrong here, but - it seems to me the footage from my FX30 come out a bit soft, flat, with low contrast. To give you example: looking at your clip, at @8.34 it also seems to be a bit soft and flat. However, in the talking head section, you sitting inside studio, footage looks sharp and has nice colors with minimal contrast to it. Any tips you could offer on this subject ? Thank you !
Thanks. Yeah, it's kinda weird like that. In general, like I explained in the video, you get more contrast and saturation in the middle and under-exposed areas which is why I suggest aiming for a -1EV exposure using the meter. But sometimes, it just seems to be a little flat and less contrasty than it should; so I guess in those cases, add in contrast and saturation in post
You over expose log footage in the sunlight, not at night, because it's logarithmic curve and you can push your blacks into the noise. It's complicated if you don't understand calculus. Under studio lights in log/SLog-3 you want to under expose by one stop, and in sunlight you over expose 1.667 stops.
Hmm... well you can set the zebras to 109 in camera but I think I'd err on the side of caution and set it a bit lower. You can always stretch it out if you find that highlights aren't as bright as you'd like. I'm not sure if that higher clipping point would mean that skin tones need to be exposed brighter so I think I'll have to do some testing to confirm
@@PhillipRPeck I get that but it would be nice to see if it shoves this problem. To be honest it looks like the highlight skin level s can be brought down in resolve. A simple LUMA adjustment will do it.
I find that S-Cinetone gives me yellow skin tones. I'm using the A7R5. Even after correcting white balance and playing with exposure I still get yellow skin. Why is that?
I'm not sure. I've never used the a7RV, but have you tried setting a manual white balance using the kelvin option and then adjusting the color balance? You can shift away from yellow a little bit.
@@PhillipRPeck I adjusted the Kelvin but not while I was in s cinetone. Just seems very unnatural that I should have to go to that much trouble to get good skin tones
I always shoot 10-bit 422 but if you shoot 10-bit 420, you'll still have a lot more color information than if you shoot 8-bit. I think the much bigger difference is 8-bit versus 10-bit as opposed to 4:2:2 vs 4:2:0
I'm not seeing what you mean... I did stick some film grain on one of the clips when I was doing a live stream, but I removed it for the final render and upload. I don't see anything at the time stamp you reference
@@lch7145 Hey, I'm not trying to be defensive, but I'm not seeing it. I put it on a 48" 4K TV and got real close and I'm not seeing anything except the YT compression blocks
This is not universal; this assumes all people your shooting is not olive or dark skin. What if the individual is dark skin like me or brown? 50 ire won't cut it
The whole purpose of this videos is to teach people who genuinely want to learn! I don’t disagree that mistakes make good lessons but why not help people from the mistake we have all made in the past😂
Thanks for all the tests dude! This will definitely help me expose S-Cinetone outside. Inside I think I prefer to use s-log. You're my go to resource when it comes to the FX30 man! Keep it up!
Good stuff my guy! I like S-Cinetone on my A7 IV because it's pretty easy but I also like to give it a slight adjustment in post with some more contrast and saturation but it's much easier to start with than S-LOG 3, especially if there's no need for maximum dynamic range.
Appreciate the tips, I'll be trying S-Cinetone on my new a6700.
This is good stuff. Mark Bennett says S-CINETONE makes everyone look like a vampire, this explains it so well.
He must be exposing it too bright! Thanks
@@PhillipRPeck yes, exactly what you have explained here! Totally makes sense.
hey i watched this video, took your advice and im exposing waaaayyy better w this picture profile than any other . i can do s log 3 but why when i can have it almost perfect. thank you so much i seriously appreciate you.
I appreciate this video, I have been a long time Sony photography shooter and am just now getting into video. So it really is a completely different world. Especially since the After Adobe dust up I’m learning multiple new programs including Resolve. This video was immensely helpful. Your teaching style is straight forward thanks.
Thank you so much!
Merci ! vos explication sont parmi les plus claires que j'ai pu trouver sur TH-cam !
Yeah, I think Zebra set to 65ish is quite good for the skin tone for both S-Cinetone and Slog3.
Great!
I always use Slog 3 on the A7 IV and the results are amazing, but when i try to use S-Cinetone i have blown highlights on the skintone. And it's unusable but with your tests i understood that i have to underexpose! So thank you very much.
The exposure here it's like the opposite of the log profiles.
It's difficult for my mind to accept that i have to underexpose while i always overexpose for the S log 😂😂
You need to use Cine EI and slide the dynamic range to the highlights or shadows.
@@contentm3893 on the A7IV there isn't Cine EI. Moreover at 0EV the skintones are too bright and with the highlights slider i can't recover it. For me S-log is on another level.
@@ASVideo Ok. Can you do a test with Cine EI and see how it handles the same scene set up?
@@contentm3893 in the Sony A7 IV (the model that i own) i can't select/use Cine EI 😅
@ASVideo lol. You can still use S-Log3 which you’re locked with CineEI
Very helpful as always, Phillip! Like how you take things slow and explain things with great examples without getting so technical in jargon that it becomes uninteligible googly gop. As a fairly new FX3 owner, I appreciate these! New to shooting in SLOG3 and s-Cinetone. It's a scary world out there. 😅
Lol, thanks. Glad it made sense. Good luck with the FX3, awesome camera!
Thanks this was easy to understand. I'm primarily a R709 camcorder user with 70 for skintone but was having issues with the FX30. Now I can clearly see I was over exposing sCinetone. Still playing around with sLog which is confusingly the opposite needing to overexposed by 2 stops. And Luts can make it even more confusing to get the right exposure with Leeming Luts ETTR.
Cine EI can make it easier to expose S-Log 3 if you have the time to figure out the work flow. I have a video on that, too! I also have an S-Log 3 exposure cheat sheet in the description of that video if you want to see recommended values for highlights, skin tones, and middle gray with and without a monitor LUT
@@PhillipRPeck I'll have to check that out. I'm still trying to decide whether using a LUT to make the grading easier or using slog as PP and Gamma Display Assist. Any thoughts on Leeming LUT? So far I've found the histogram is easiest way to get a rough understanding of the exposure.
@@petercofrancesco9812 I haven't used Leeming LUT since I had it for the GH5s so I'm not really sure how much it differs from the built in S709 LUT as far as exposure. I would imagine they're pretty close so I think if you follow best practices for exposing S-Log3 with Sony's monitor LUTS (S709/Gamma Display Assist), you'll undoubtedly be in the ballpark for exposing Leeming LUT
@@PhillipRPeck Seems strange but there is a big difference between using exposures even if shooting in Slog when you use different LUTs. Here I created a 2 minute video showing the differences all shot in Slog. th-cam.com/video/2JAaHu97lgs/w-d-xo.html
Thanks for this video! Got to say, the video itself looks incredible.
Thank you!
Thank you Phillip for this video, i will run some tests today on my Sony A7IV and with ev-1. I plan to shoot a short comedy film next week on s-cinetone, do you think it’s safer to shoot it on s-log3 to avoid being unable to save highlight clippings and underexposure issues? I am new to using exposure on cameras as usually someone else does it for me but this time i’ll be on my own. Btw, Slog3 seems even more complicated according to what i have read so far.
It might be easier to stick with S-Cinetone. Just remember that what you see is what you get, so if it looks overexposed on the LCD then that's what it's going to be. And I wouldn't call it an underexposure issue, I think S-Cinetone looks better a little bit underexposed. That's where you get the most contrast and saturation.
@ Thank you Phillip for the advice!
I really appreciate your videos on FX30
Thank you!
Nice dive into the s cine tone
It’s such a good pp when the exposure is nailed
Thank you. Yeah, it can look pretty good!
Genial!!! Llevo buscando este video por mucho tiempo sobre el s cineton. Muchas gracias
De nada
Very good information, just what I was looking for with my A6700👍
Interesting video! I'm gonna experiment more with underexposing s-cinetone. I shot a short film using s-cinetone (for experimentation) and no grading just SOC. I kept the multi-meter at 0 while shooting and some shots look pretty overexposed which I chugged up thinking it's just the profile's lack of dynamic range (in comparison with Slog3). So I'm gonna give it another go, thank you for your video and bringing up your testings!
Use Cine EI to move the dynamic range to protect the highlights or open up the shadows.
its ridiculous how effective you are at teaching.
Wow, thank you
But he's wrong about this. He needs to use Cine EI and slide the dynamic range to protect the highlights.
Very good Video and explanation
Great explantion!
That was really helpful, thank you!
What settings would you use to shoot a long outdoor fitness type video (with naturally changing light conditions). Adjusting an ND would not be an option.
S Cinetone, SLOG 3, or an automatic profile?
Thanks again!
Thank you! I'm always a big proponent of S-Log 3. I think it's the most flexible and forgiving. You could set the exposure for middle grey or skin tones and let the highlights in the sky go. Or you could make sure that the highlights don't clip (around 94 IRE in S-Log 3) and possibly raise the exposure on the subject in post if it got too dark
Hi Phillip. Maybe a silly question but in the fx30, when you say to target a 40 ire, do I set it up as std+40 +-1? Still learning th fx30. Thanks.
Yes. Sorry, I should have clarified that in the video
Hello Philip. I need a little help if you could. I have the A6700 with sony18-105 F4 glass. I film mostly. I make films on my motorcyle so it is quite dinamic the usage. I get off, take my camera and film my buddies, or me, I move a lot. For the life of me I can't figure out what is the best to use. Manual or Aperture priority and my footage seems a lot underexposed. When I am static yes I can find the best exposure but when I move and obviosly the light changes, it is almost always underexposed. Could you give me some tips ? Thank you.
When you're in aperture priority you can use exposure compensation to bias the exposure. There is a function button already set to exposure compensation, you can see it on the bottom of the scroll wheel--the little plus and minus symbol. You could also program it to the dial on the top right which is typically where the exposure compensation is found on bigger Sony camera bodies.
If you're in a really bright scene or maybe the sky is very prevalent, you might want to set the exposure compensation to even (0) or maybe under by a stop (-1) or 2 (-2). If you're in a shadowy scene, or the exposure just looks too dark to you on the LCD, then bump the exposure comp to +1 or whatever looks good to you.
That would be the easiest way if you want to stay in aperture priority but still retain quick and easy control over your exposure. Just ride the exposure compensation dial (it's basically keeping your aperture at the value that you set, then adjusting the shutter and ISO based on your exposure comp choice)
I hope that helps, let me know
@@PhillipRPeckThank you ! I will test and get back
Great video! Does it apply to sony a7iv too?
Yes, for sure
Very good video 👍 alot of good information, i have a question, what are the base iso values on s-cinetone on the a6700?
Thank you! I think it's 125 and 400
I've seen a lot saying it's 800 and 2500?? @@PhillipRPeck
Phillip! Quick question while seeing you’re video!
Please, how do you move the image at 2:57 while zooming in davjnci? I’ve tried everything for like a year and can’t do it hahahaha
And THANKS for this video!!!!
If you're using a mouse with a middle mouse button/wheel, just click and hold the middle button and drag around. If you're using a trackpad, it should just be a two finger drag. If you don't have a middle mouse button/wheel on your mouse, I'd recommend getting one because there is a lot of useful functionality in Resolve using that feature. I even made a video about it
@@PhillipRPeckwill try! I have a Logitech anywhere 3s, I’ll try!!! Thanks
th-cam.com/video/--R8aS6CWkI/w-d-xo.html
@@PhillipRPeck yes! Watched and now it’s working!
You saved my life 🙏🏻
Please clarify something for me. The a6700 has dual base iso, 125 and 400? That's not even 2 stops and seems hardly worth it. I thought the high end was ISO 2000. Your thoughts? Thanks for the video.
Good question. The 125 and 400 pair is for picture profiles not named S-Log. For S-Log 3 the base ISO pair is 800 and 2500. There are the same number of stops between 125 and 400 and 800 and 2500, but I guess the numbers ramp up almost like a log curve the higher you go so it seems like there's a bigger gap in the higher base pair. But this lack of distance between the high base and low base is a legitimate concern when compared to the a7SIII/FX3/FX6/ZV-E1 sensor which goes from 100 to 2000 non S-Log and 640 or 800 all the way to 12800 in S-Log 3
@@PhillipRPeckthanks very much for your quick reply
Great tips ! Really enjoy your tutorials ! Question: I may be wrong here, but - it seems to me the footage from my FX30 come out a bit soft, flat, with low contrast. To give you example: looking at your clip, at @8.34 it also seems to be a bit soft and flat. However, in the talking head section, you sitting inside studio, footage looks sharp and has nice colors with minimal contrast to it. Any tips you could offer on this subject ? Thank you !
Thanks. Yeah, it's kinda weird like that. In general, like I explained in the video, you get more contrast and saturation in the middle and under-exposed areas which is why I suggest aiming for a -1EV exposure using the meter. But sometimes, it just seems to be a little flat and less contrasty than it should; so I guess in those cases, add in contrast and saturation in post
You over expose log footage in the sunlight, not at night, because it's logarithmic curve and you can push your blacks into the noise. It's complicated if you don't understand calculus. Under studio lights in log/SLog-3 you want to under expose by one stop, and in sunlight you over expose 1.667 stops.
🤔
So does this mean if you want 50 you se your fx30 zebras to 50?
Yes. Or an external monitor
What is the base iso on S-Cinetone?
Depends on the camera but a6700/FX30 is 125/400
For fx3 cinetone clipping is 109. How would you shoot that clipping point?
Hmm... well you can set the zebras to 109 in camera but I think I'd err on the side of caution and set it a bit lower. You can always stretch it out if you find that highlights aren't as bright as you'd like. I'm not sure if that higher clipping point would mean that skin tones need to be exposed brighter so I think I'll have to do some testing to confirm
@@PhillipRPeck thanks!
@@PhillipRPeck Do you use Cine EI at all?
@@contentm3893 I have multiple videos about Cine EI on my channel
@@PhillipRPeck I get that but it would be nice to see if it shoves this problem. To be honest it looks like the highlight skin level s can be brought down in resolve. A simple LUMA adjustment will do it.
I find that S-Cinetone gives me yellow skin tones. I'm using the A7R5. Even after correcting white balance and playing with exposure I still get yellow skin. Why is that?
I'm not sure. I've never used the a7RV, but have you tried setting a manual white balance using the kelvin option and then adjusting the color balance? You can shift away from yellow a little bit.
@@PhillipRPeck I adjusted the Kelvin but not while I was in s cinetone. Just seems very unnatural that I should have to go to that much trouble to get good skin tones
Did you shoot in 10 bit or 8? If im not using slog3 Id probably shoot 420...but then are you limited in post?
I always shoot 10-bit 422 but if you shoot 10-bit 420, you'll still have a lot more color information than if you shoot 8-bit. I think the much bigger difference is 8-bit versus 10-bit as opposed to 4:2:2 vs 4:2:0
@PhillipRPeck didn't know you could do 10 bit at 4:2;0
Yes indeed
What mode do you have your Multimeter?
Multi
It makes sense😅
Im getting used to all this new names!
Amazing video, very clear to understand❤️
Why do you have so much grains in your shoot ? 0:36
I'm not seeing what you mean... I did stick some film grain on one of the clips when I was doing a live stream, but I removed it for the final render and upload. I don't see anything at the time stamp you reference
maybe look above the other camera, just next to your right arm, under the light @@PhillipRPeck
this section is the only where there is a very bad digital grains, maybe youtube compression not doing good here...
@@lch7145 Hey, I'm not trying to be defensive, but I'm not seeing it. I put it on a 48" 4K TV and got real close and I'm not seeing anything except the YT compression blocks
@@PhillipRPeck Yeah that is what I thought maybe I need to change the device to not see compression in this shot
Great….Thank you for your time ❤
Thank you!. Very helpful.
I’m not seeing any zebras🤓 I do like when your cats show up!
Amazing video
Great video! Thanks
You bet!
Are you excited for the sigma 10-18 f2.8?!
I already have the Sony 10-20mm f/4 PZ, so... not really. But, I'm sure it's a great lens!
This is not universal; this assumes all people your shooting is not olive or dark skin. What if the individual is dark skin like me or brown? 50 ire won't cut it
I provided a range, 45-65 IRE for skin. Also, the most important point is to protect the highlights because the clipping point is pretty low
you should overexpose .
Why?
@@PhillipRPeck so they f up, and thats the way of learning
The whole purpose of this videos is to teach people who genuinely want to learn! I don’t disagree that mistakes make good lessons but why not help people from the mistake we have all made in the past😂