Why Sonic Adventure DX is a Bad Port
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.ย. 2020
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When they said “Director’s Cut”, they didn’t mean it with a possessive apostrophe. The director was cut.
Director's cut? More like Directors cut
why is this comment getting more attention than my comment explaining the “burger” shop statue
Yeah, the lighting director's salary was cut.
Director scut
its because they used the director's cut to make the port duh
He finally remembered his password.
longest recorded attempt of recovering an email and password in human history
He woke up early during hibernation
Legit 🤣🤣
holy shit what if that was actually it
Is that what actually happened?
It really sucks when downgrades like this happen to games because it leads a lot of people into thinking the game was more dated than it actually was.
This is actually what led to the misconception that “Sonic had a rough transition to 3D”
@@ILikeSoda229
You’ll notice most of the complaints that “3D sonic was never good” popped up around the time that the HD ports of SA1 and 2 happened… which just so happened to break a lot of things in JUST subtle enough ways that people who never saw the original wouldn’t realize how bad they got it.
I think another issue is that the higher poly Models of DX clash with the lower poly NPCs and environments. So it looks like a 2003 game with bad NPC models rather than a 1998/99 game with _excellent_ character models
@@ryan_1521It’s true tho
@@ryan_1521 DX was uglier and had more glitches...
@@ryan_1521 They live in an imaginary world. The game ended up inspiring an entire generation of 3D sonic games that were supported by an age group that never knew this debate existed.
I'm rewatching this video after 2 years, and the "you can steal it, but if you are a coward you can ask permission" still gets me xD
Same
Me to
I’ve got a sealed copy of DX coming in the mail!
Hi
Ur vids are great!
“Or, if you are a coward… like me…
As a kid I thought “DX” was just a weird, stylized abbreviation of “Director’s Cut”, like the X stood for cut or something.
i thought this as an adult
Wait, so thats not what it is?!
Same
Director's xut
@@weegyartist DX means “Deluxe”
When they said "Director's cut" they meant the Director himself is cut.
Underrated comment
Rick T nice name
Lol
funny link bro
I thought the Director got a new cut
😔
I agree that lighting can make or break a presentation. If you notice, many indie games combine very simplistic low poly models with modern lighting and they tend to look surprisingly charming. Shadows both give depth to the world and ground things in the world. Without them, objects would appear flat and floaty, since you couldn't tell where they are relative to the ground.
The main benefit is Ambient Occlusion, that alone is what makes it easy to tell when an object is touching another instead of floating in space.
I know, I love classic looking characters on realistic environments, which is why I love gzdoom’s lighting.
One of my favorite examples of this is the boomer shooter subgenre, it allows for the differentiation between enemies and levels without either resorting to mood-killing color pallettes or some of the dithering-esque (idk what it'd be called for 3d) techniques early software rendering techniques used
@@OpossumFan
TF2 and Doom are still probably the golden standard when it comes to recognizable enemies. Even the GBA version, where distant enemies are measured by a handful of pixels, has enemies you can recognize by a glance.
SADX has gaslit people into remembering Sonic Adventure as being worse than it is. I first played it on Dreamcast but I've watched so many people play the DX version on TH-cam that I forgot how the game originally looked. Seeing it side by side is crazy. Glad that we have mods now to make the PC version more like the original.
I think it's because Dreamcast was a shortlived and not very popular console, at least in English speaking countries. So the more common experience of Adventure was the DX port.
@@CreativityNull Its short lifespan also gave people like me more of a chance to get a Dreamcast in 2003. I paid $40 for one at EBGames* in (probably) July of 2003, and I got a copy of S.A. later on that year, my first Sonic game. I think it cost somewhere from $8 to $13, but only the game disc.
* EBGames was sold to Gamestop not too long after that.
I couldn't afford a PS2, Xbox, or Gamecube at first so I went for the previous generation of systems at first (I'm *not* saying that the Dreamcast was previous generation - it's the same generation as PS2, Xbox, and Gamecube, but it died early. I had N64 and then PS1 first, so my previous statement still counts.)
We? I dont remember you contributing anything
@@BagzAndPresident reread it. I clearly meant we as in the Sonic community as a whole have these mods. I didn’t claim that I contributed anything.
@@BagzAndPresident wow... This comment is absolutely terrible.
First, obviously their last sentence is shortening a bit that should be implied of, "Glad that we have mods *AVAILABLE TO US* now..." There is nothing here that would imply that OP was claiming ownership or responsibility for any of the mods of Sonic DX.
Second, in what way are you certain that OP hasn't contributed to the mods? While I don't think they did either, I can't be certain. Even if I knew every GitHub/discord/forum username that did contribute to the mods, the TH-cam username for one of the contributors could easily be different.
Either way, are you okay?
Having only ever played the DX version, most of this video was me saying "wait that's _not_ supposed to look like that??"
same, it sucks how bad the dx version is
I feel like currently MOST of us are in that scenario which is pretty tragic in all honesty
to be fair his examples of dreamcast footage are all clearly footage from an upscaled emulator
@@Jourmand1r could have been the steam version mod betterDX with the Dreamcast texture and lighting
I've since played the game on a Dreamcast emulator, and I gotta say it totally changes the feel. Definitely the definition version I'll play in the future
You've only been gone 3 years. You're 6 years too early.
its been 3 years already?
didn't know mossbag was a cybershell fan!
Time truly goes fast lmao, remember first time finding out about him like it was yesterday
The hollow knight lore master meets the sonic lore master.
Braixlet Technically, 2 years and 10 months, but who’s counting?
This vid got me to play the Steam version with the Dreamcast mod and it was fantastic. Kudos to PkR
As someone who has only played the Dreamcast version of SA1 and 2, looking at DX and battle just makes me glad I had a Dreamcast as a kid
Battle only got some graphical errors. It's otherwise the better version of the game.
@@AkameGaKillfan777 smaller dark Chao garden, no Chao adventure 2
@@dranelemakol Is that really a problem?
@@AkameGaKillfan777 also shittier cutscenes
@@dranelemakol 🥱
When the world needed him most, he vanished.
Until he comes back 3 years later
The port qued him into a coma to silence him
guess that patreon money finally ran out
“I just can’t be bothered explaining what mipmaps are”
Yep, that’s cybershell
"In today's age, people need information mashed up and regurgitated to them like little baby birds"
Yep, that's cybershell
Was curious why I started to see this sentiment around the place. "Death by a thousand cuts" is right. A lot of it does come back around to "the lighting and transparencies aren't good" which is technically only one problem, but at the same time it's a problem that doesn't go away. For whatever reason, the textures in GC just look blurrier - smeared almost. Gives the impression the DC version's dev team just kinda understood their hardware better. DX gives me a "fog removed from Silent Hill 2 HD" vibe.
What I'm more curious about here, though, is stuff that isn't even touched on - how come the DX version has more bugs? TCRF mentions it off-hand, that a lot of the collision is "weakened," but was that on purpose? If so, why, and if not, where did it come from? I wonder if people wouldn't say SA1 aged poorly if they knew the port actually made the game buggier - is it mostly people who played DX saying that?
Fun watch!
Oh yeah about the collision, SADX sins runner on his very dead Twitter pointed out SADX tried importing SA2's collision system and SA1 hated that
Death by a thousand Director's Cuts.
I played both on their original systems in their time, and felt really strongly that the DX models looked way more on-model and true to their artwork and promotional material. I didn't like the face of Dreamcast Sonic even on release. His wide-set eyes and ears felt... Goofy and wrong... Meanwhile, he looked cool and aerodynamic on the box art.
@@WarningStrangerDangerWhich is why their models are better on SA2 DC. They heavily simplified the lighting (which still looks pretty good) in exchange for 60 FPS and higher poly stuff everywhere.
@@vibemasterkorosu2469 the original models felt so janky, and not next-gen, coming from the N64. The DX models felt like real next-gen graphics.
As someone who has never played the Dreamcast original, my god, DX butchered this game HARD.
Me too at least the models looks better in dx to me
@@misterboogcn1288 I actually disagree. While yes, the models have a higher poly count, they don’t match the rest of the games art style.
Amen
@@E-6481 I personally like the new models more, might just be my bias, but the plasticy sheen on them always bothered me.
@@E-6481 The dream cast version had better lighting but the gamecube version has better frame-rate. The game cube can be 60fps for the most part, the dreamcast can not.
When dad comes back after going out to buy cigarettes
or milk
Strange, isn’t it?
LemonadeSnake damm it i was literally about to say that lol 😂
i actually thought he just peaced out
Admiral Bahadurahjit what.
The "DX" doesn't mean "Director's Cut", it's actually an emoticon denoting the port's quality.
don't wooosh me, but that joke doesn't make sense, the dx there stands for deluxe, not director's cut lol
@@angusyoungwannabe1897 Sure, it stands for ”Deluxe version, satisfaction 100% guaranteed or whatever.” My point still totally stands, though.
@@angusyoungwannabe1897 did you even play the port
DeluXe?
I actually thought that DX stood for Director's Cut when I played it in like 2011.
33:05 For this point in particular, although the effect on Dreamcast looks definitely better, the fact that it's broken makes this boss fight more playable for me as someone that suffers from epilepsy
Those flashing lights are really annoying
@@Kimarnic bro chill 💀
@@Kimarnic The game doesn't even have one
@@Kimarnic you have a lot of animosity towards people who have epileptic seizures. And you would have an anime chick as a profile picture.
@@Kimarnic imagine responding to a 9 month old comment with such anger, and to bolster the anger, using incorrect stats to seem intelligent in the anger. It was someone's personal opinion and preference. Well done on getting angry at it I guess?
@@Kimarnic id rather my games not put people at risk of dying
24:15 LOL, I literally thought that square was some sort of grate underneath the ladder when I was younger!
New Title: The Dreamcast was too advanced for its time.
Actually, technically the GameCube version should have done all graphical effects as well or better than the dreamcast version, but that would have taken actual effort, and we know sega and effort cannot be in the same sentence, especially when they created one of the worst video game of all time, sonic 06.
@@deepmind5318 Heck, even the first Xbox has advanced graphics for it's time.
@@deepmind5318 No, a lot of these changes were made because the gamecube literally couldn't do what was needed. Neither could the xbox. It wasn't until we got programmable graphics pipelines with much later hardware that it was possible to replicate what DC did in hardware.
@@deepmind5318 Sonic 06 had so much effort put into it it isn't even funny. So much ambition and love was put in the game, regardless of how likeable the plot was. The only problem is that Sega higher-ups decided to have the developers rush the game to meet a strict deadline, not to mention that the dev team had to split in two to develop both 06 and a Wii exclusive (Sonic and the Secret Rings).
@@sonicdash9652 Heck yeah, have you seen Splinter Cell, those games still hold up in many aspects, but honestly stealth games usually look good years later since they should be meticulously designed to be the best experience possible (Sly Cooper, Metal Gear Solid 2 and 3, Hitman: Silent Assassin).
When playing this game on Steam, I saw how bad it looked and thought "oh it's just an early 3D game, that's not really surprising." They really didn't do the Dreamcast version justice.
Aren't you the guy who did the dreamcast version justice?
Go back to iceberg hell
Holy fuck, I took you as a guy who watched cybershell.
@i blocked ads watching this video. the knuckles apparition
When I first played DX for some reason I remember feeling it...cheap somehow. Like seemed like it ran at a higher frame and the models were very shiny, but it felt super unpolished compared to the DC one. I chalked it off to newer hardware and the original game itself being almost 5 years old when I got to play it. But they definitely cut corners!
Maybe that's why it's called Directors *Cut*
they didn't cut corners they cut off the whole ass wall
@@eltiolavara9 The dream cast version had better lighting but the gamecube version has better frame-rate. The game cube can be 60fps for the most part, the dreamcast can not.
@@eltiolavara9 Should one cut off enough corners from a square and keep on doing it long after it's no longer a square, it becomes a circle. Then where's it gonna roll off to, where's it gonna end up?
The algorithm is INSISTENT on me watching this video, and as a lifelong Dreamcast fan, man I'm happy Google spies on us. In this one scenario anyways. Because opening a video with self depreciation, quickly followed by insulting the audience is literally the best thing i think I've ever seen on TH-cam, and you've instantly earned my sub. I look forward to you regurgitating tasty gaming morcels down my little baby bird like throat.
Cybershell is the only Sonictuber I can trust.
Can we expect a remix featuring CyberShell?
Dumbsvile and Dillin Thomas are Sally simps. Cybershell is where it's at for sonic content
yeah, just not with your money
True Savage How though? He has made mutiple videos making fun of #Rally4Sally
@@MisterGraa Some of his earlier videos where like that.
I was also gonna say Dumbsvile as well but he isn't really a sonic youtuber in the same way Dillin and Cybershell are.
"Director's cut" just means that the new director decided to remove some stuff from the game, as in "The director has cut the lighting engine." for example.
lol
It can also mean it's *his* cut of the game, but then i guess it shouldve been some kind of early version, if that makes sense.
@@myriam7223 r/woooosh
@@BenN64 r/ihavereddit
@@piranhalettuce jokes on you! I don’t have a Reddit account!
I think the team localizing the title probably thought DX meant "Directors Cut" instead of "Deluxe" and/or thought western players would understand the term "Directors Cut" more. It's a common term used for movies and other games. They probably exist but I can't think of other games that use DX/Deluxe (for their western releases) besides recent Nintendo games.
Deluxe, just like in Japan, would've have been better.
I remember playing sonic adventure briefly at a games con on a dreamcast, which was my first time seeing the game in person rather than in TH-cam videos, and I was blown away by how good it looked. I was especially impressed by the fact it clearly uses a lot of real life images for its textures, and how well that worked despite how stylized the sonic world is
Director's Cut meaning that the director cut lighting and textures.
it also means the original director was cut
@@conlia I guess you could say, the director’s cut.
I’ll leave now
Lmao
The real directors cut was the friends we made along the way
Director's cut meaning that they cut the director and employed a new one.
Oh snap, a more intelligent person already said this.
This video really shows how technically advanced Sonic Adventure was on the Dreamcast, some of these lighting features are so cool
The Dreamcast was a very technically advanced system. It's insane how impressive most of its library was for the time.
I'm re-playing sonic adventure these days and it's very impressive how good this game looks and it is 22 old.
@@HOTD108_ If I recall, a company actually used the Dreamcast as the basis for a PS2(?) emulation system and it actually ran the games better than the hardware the games were meant for. The Dreamcast was insanely advanced for its time.
@@cyqry "If I recall, a company actually used the Dreamcast as the basis for a PS2(?) emulation system and it actually ran the games better than the hardware the games were meant for."
Oh yeah I know about this one !
@@FlashbackGuyYT "sucks" is a powerful word. The game is still great
Truly a great example of: “ I’m so happy I grew up with this
And not this”
This explains why I remember it being way better on Dreamcast, I watched game grumps play it and thought my memory of it changed, but the Dreamcast version looks amazing still! I’m probably biased because it makes me nostalgic 😂
Then again, the Game Grumps' playthrough is a bad exemple since they are playing one of the worst versions and playing badly as well.
@@ChiefMedicPururu I was thinking that child me didn’t have as much problems with the game as Arin did 😂
Nostalgia is when you like something JUST because you grew up with it. It's an extremely cynical way to view older media.
@@ainekelly5252 GameGrumps NEVER accurately portray games, and find ways to break them. This is evident by them playing Battle, which IS the better version of SA2, but just going "lol fanfiction," or Unleashed on the Wii, which does have issues(like Unleashed as a whole) but "wtf motion controls" isn't one of them.
@@ainekelly5252Aron is just terrible at sonic games in general
My favorite part is that he doesn't even mention how long he's been gone. He just drops a new video again
EDIT: Relax people, I just thought it was funny. I'm not judging him
Well, would we want him to?
@@kso86. The people who paid for his Patreon might, lol.
I LOVE his content and persona... but still.
he made the videos and he scheduled the uploads but accidentally set it to 2020
I say it’s nobody’s business tbh it’s been like 3 years everyone should get over it let the man do his thing
Thats what the last parody vid is for
For a second I thought I was hallucinating when I saw “Cybershell” on the notification.
I ignored it for a good moment, and had to do a double-take. Certainly caught me off-guatd.
Same
Same
*When I Saw This I Nearly Fainted*
I literally screamed
Cybershell, don’t ever change, even as you grow more subscribers you still act the same way you did when you first started out with your honest and really laid-back personality .
The flaws in the subsequent ports of Sonic Adventure remind me so much of Halo: CE, and the legacy of its broken Gearbox PC port. That port broke so many visual effects and fucked with the atmosphere, and all the bugs just kept being inherited by the CE Anniversary Edition and its own ports to Xbone and PC. Only in the last year or two did 343i manage to squash Gearbox’s old bugs still present in the MCC
Figures that Cybershell only comes back when the world is ending.
I think he woke up from a nightmare where someone made a video that's better than his so he decided to make a new video and also wake up after 3 years
Lol he needs money so he came back after the Patreon dried up.
Cringe the world is not ending
@@senorchewie if he needed money hed do shitty top 10 videos
@@Outta-hz1ej its a joke
holy shit i never realized that sonic adventure was so.... detailed and pretty
Really, even the ports keep some of the effects. it is still very impressive when compared to the competition.
Me either! Playing it on gamecube made me think oh it was an early 3d game, it must've looked just as bland and boring on dreamcast. Apparently, they just did a terrible job on the conversion.
I only played it on dreamcast, and I never suspected that the DX version was so ugly! :O
@@eclipserepeater2466 DC is still the best way to play
@@Remliv
I say the Steam version with the Dreamcast Conversion mod is the best way to play SA1.
This is a great video, seriously, congrats. 👏
But there's one thing a lot of people seem to miss when it comes to SA1 and SADX.
The Dreamcast had 8MB of Video Memory.
The Gamecube only had 3MB.
That was probably THE major reason so many textures and effects needed to be cut.
I mean, they COULD have reprogramed the game to offload that stuff onto the system memory, but they probably didin't have the time to do it.
Ok, I did NOT know that. But I feel they could have done something special like some kind of gamecube patented "cell-shaded" style.
19:25 it goes to show just how used to the dx version I am that my response to this was, “wait there’s suppose to be barriers?!”
I clicked on this video thinking “oh I haven’t seen this one before” and then i saw the time posted, and i gasped.
Lmao
Same
The PC version developers meeting:
- Well, so, how do we program all those lighting effects...
- Don't bother, they will mod it eventually anyways
Isn't that basically Bethesda mentality?
Basically what the one hive mind brain cell of all sonic fans says.
@@ahmadkazan7994 They all rage like no tomorrow over little changes to gameplay.
Accuracy 100
@@shirohimayumikira234 no ones raging its just not the definitive way to play the game.
I'm not really a fan of Sonic Adventure's aesthetics, but this video did give me a better appreciation of its usage of the Dreamcast's graphical capabilities. Transparency effects are still one of the most difficult things to get to run well even on modern graphics cards, so the fact that they were able to pull off so many complex transparency interactions is quite impressive.
Especially in 1998.
Bruh how are you not a fan of
I'm actually really glad you did this because I had a Dreamcast and I remember that darker Green Grass and actually thought that I was just kind of remembering it wrong. They made some changes to the style of the Chao Gardens as well (simplifying them)
dreamcast: upgrade
gamecube: go back
pc: I SAID GO BACK
2004 port is fine. That's why it gets all the mods. Even mods installed on top of Steam version convert it to 2004 port.
PC is the best imo because you can mod it to get the GG roms plus MS roms, and the DC graphics.
SADX Mod Installer on PC: That's better
@@Gnidel nonono, the 2004 port gets mods mostly becuase it's bad
zo0pid some add new characters it’s the best version because of mods so get you’re salty ass out of here
Cybershell: *Uploads a video after not uploading for 3 years without any explainition*
Everyone: *Waiting for an answer*
Cybershell: So, lightning sucks on Sonic Adventure DX
Exactly.
its probably an old video he only recently finished imo
@@Mantis42 Yeah at one point in this the mic quality changes. Most of it was probably done in 2017 and he never edited it
HalfDuck Yeah he asked the guy who made the blog if he could make the video on it back in 2017 or 2018, probably got fairly far and then quit on it.
This video was made with two different mics, suggesting that it was mostly done already a while ago.
The Dreamcast was so ahead of the curve in that generation. It’s a shame the lack of DVD support and ease of piracy killed them. I feel like they could have made some amazing games if they held on longer
And that SEGA was just straight-up greedy
I wonder how future segas consoles would have been if sega was still a first party company
Competition from the PlayStation 2 was also a major part in killing off Sega's console business iirc.
No. They certainly wounded it, but the Dreamcast’s death was signed in 1994, when the 32X was released alongside the new Saturn, forcing SEGA into competition with itself. SEGA continued to torpedo its own market with blunders like this, and no amount of potential upgrades or lucky breaks could have saved the Dreamcast from this point on. As it stood, it was already about in the best situation it could hope to be in, with SEGA’s flagship character in Japan getting his first full 3D game within a month of OoT, and for as incredible as that game is, the graphics are clearly in Adventure’s favor.
I’ve seen it called a small, white, square plastic JFK, because its life was cut short before its full potential could be seen. But beyond even that… much like JFK, when the blow was dealt, there was nothing on earth that could have saved it
@@spindash64comparing the Dreamcast to JFK is crazy ngl 😭😭😭
8:26 and 8:27 are worth going over frame-by-frame. You can see Cream's demon manifesting itself :/
That only happens on both PC and XBox 360/PS3 because she's missing textures. It was fine on GC.
@@ChiefMedicPururu no one said she looked like that on gc so idk why you felt the need to say that
@@gamingtoday1906 ...I just explained why that problem happened.
@@ChiefMedicPururuwhich was already explained in the video, and needed not be repeated??
@@Schnort You say that as if everyone did watch the video. And given some comments, not everyone did.
Gotta love how tails turns into a damn loading wheel when he runs
Where is that *damn* loading wheel?!
When Tails takes to the air, he goes Yah!
Guys, he didn't leave, *this horrible port just qued him into a coma to silence him*
Chill
Cyberchill
It's also worth mentioning that the sound effect for getting rings is pitched down in the DX version for some reason, making it sound like something out of an off-brand Sonic game.
"It doesn't even happen in the DreamCast version."
I guess that explains why people can have fond memories of this game from the original version then. Because bugs like that make the only version I've come across really unfun to play.
That right there alone qualifies DX as a terrible port.
Ya as someone who owned a dreamcast and played that when I was a kid, I got really confused for a long time about people saying the game is super glitchy since I didn't remember falling through floors and stuff all the time. It wasn't until college or something that I learned that the glitches were introduced on gamecube. I didn't realize until this video though how much better the game looks on dreamcast. Definitely gonna use these mods for playing in the future
Should've been called "Sonic Adventure: Performance mode"
Perhaps the texture and lighting downgrades were intentional to squeeze 60FPS without proper optimization, in which case, it is indeed Performance Mode!
Or Sonic Adventure: Degradation. It even sounds radical, man.
@@JoshSonic In a way yes. You can do table lighting, fundamentally like Dreamcast version, using register combiners on Gamecube, but then your odds of hitting 60fps anywhere near consistently are close to zero, and i don't think you can optimise it that much, it's just how it is. Because then you're offloading what would normally be a vertex pipeline workload onto the pixel pipeline. On the other hand, the vertex pipeline on Gamecube is completely rigid and you just can't implement an exotic lighting function there.
Also stencil shadows had to be sacrificed too, but then, anywhere where they're ACTUALLY needed, those few cutscenes, would have been fine at 30. But i guess it just doesn't pay to make exceptions for such special cases.
Which is to say they definitely didn't put nearly enough effort into fixing 60fps related bugs and issues resulting from their chosen lighting system and issues from lack of Dreamcast's order independent transparency, but then, they probably just didn't get nearly enough time allotted by the management. Maybe 60fps was a late decision rained down from above, which messed up the whole plan.
@@JoshSonic texture quality doesn't affect performance at all
it only takes up more VRAM when it's higher quality, but outside of that, there's zero impact on performance
I dunno, I always thought DX was an Acronym for “Director’s Cut”.
Same here, because X and C have similar sounds. And that an X-shape is a common shape for cut-wounds, but that reason is admittedly a little too far-fetched.
Bingles Praise Is it? To me it’d make the most sense, SADX sounds more like short hand, making things a lot easier.
@@keybladersora721 Probably. I'm pretty good at coming up with assumptions.
Director's Xut
Same for me too, glad to see that I'm not the only one.
That mod is a gift from the heavens. I was 7 when the game came out and as said 7 year old I wasn't the most careful with CD-Roms and it extended to Sonic Adventure and Sonic Shuffle. I played through it about three years ago, got to Gamma's fight against Zeta and the game started to chug extremely hard from the scratches, but barely got through, at which point I retired my original copy
Being able to enjoy the cutscene skip, keep the frame rate, and enjoy it without the glitchy/ugly presentation is all I could ask for
this is so infuriating as an artist AND game dev. I played DX and always just thought SA1 looked like total garbage, having no idea just how much of a shell it was. the graphics for the original version of SA1 on the dreamcast were *revolutionary* and would have absolutely blown my mind as a kid with that lighting system. really glad work has been done by modders to restore it all, but god damn, sega.
24:18 I NEVER KNEW THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A LIGHTING EFFECT. I always thought that weird white and black texture was supposed to be some kind of out-of-place floor light! It makes so much more sense as the light from the grate above!
Before i watched this video i knew that was a problem. Well its not that i knew, its just that i thought it was out of place. I was aware it was a sewer so i thought it was either a floor light or not.
I thought that was somehow a weird looking carpet or floor tiling. Now that I know what it's supposed to be it sticks out so much!
When I was younger and played it on pc I thought it was supposed to be some grate on the floor, or a floor light like you said. I never knew it was supposed to be lighting 💀god this port was abysmal
When I was a kid I thought it was some kind of sticky pad for some reason? And that's why Sonic stuck to it for a second and waved his arms around
Same. I figured it was electric in some way because Sonic got stunned when he stepped on it.
I'm really excited to see Cybershell take another nap and return to his channel in 2022
Yes then the cycle will forever continue like that
Nice joke, dude. Real fuckin’ mean.
So
We meet again person who was on every video a few months ago
hi bro
Like we'd last in 2020. He came back cause he knows the world will end
It really pisses me off when people say “Sonic Adventure is so bad, it’s super buggy and looks terrible, blah blah blah,” only to find out they’re talking about SADX. It’s about as annoying as the “Sonic had a rough transition into 3D” shit.
I feel like they added "Director's Cut" because it was a hot marketing term at the time
Maybe the director got a hairCUT
I know it a bad meme
When the world needed him the most, he returned
That's not how avatar went
The blue people never disappeared in the first place
Original Guy haha nice
Yugioh in a nutshell.
They should just remake Sonic Adventure from the ground up and make it look as good as unleashed
Didn't expect to see you here, Bowblax. I guess everyone in existence missed Cyber.
Bowblax Yo what's up Bowblax, love your commentary videos
Preferably better if possible, but I agree with your statement
Next video: Twitter vs cybershell
@@harryman8735 with new gen consoles coming up, of course it's gonna look better... run better too... looking at you, Jungle Joyride...
I suppose it could be because it was the proprietary version, but this video does a great job of showing how the Dreamcast was phenomenally ahead of its time.
maybe the real chaos emeralds were the transparency effects we met along the way
He has Risen.
Oh hi obscure anime man
I cant belive it XD
now that's a crossover I wasn't expecting
will the real sonic lore master please stand up, please stand up, please stand up
minky momo dead
The link to this video literally has the word "SORY" in it. Even TH-cam knows
Yes
That’s a really lucky coincidence
Played sonic adventure new back in the day. Loved it. Loved it so much I later bought this "improved" version on the GameCube when it was released. As sadly the Dreamcast was dead & buried by this point and I had such fond memories. I remember thinking like, is it not as good as I remember? Remember not liking it. Although I noticed some changes which I didn't like. I couldn't quite put my finger on why I didn't like it exactly.
A different time without online comparisons lol. But yes since I've known they hashed quite a lot up. But still not to this extent. I was deceived all those years ago. I remembered it much better.. because it was much better!
Such a shame that such an amazing game and huge memory from my gaming childhood is still very much hashed up and unable to purchase in it's much better form to this date.
Nice video, thanks & have a nice day!
You can fix the Steam version, tho.
@@ChiefMedicPururu yeah that's fine. But lots of people that play it for the first time or similarly wonder if their memory is playing tricks on them won't know this.
When my boyfriend and I met, we discussed games and Sonic Adventure came up as one of our favourite games. The first question that came out of his mouth after that was “Dreamcast or DX?”
My answer was “Dreamcast” and I think I passed that test with flying colours. 🤣
Cybershell? I haven't heard that name in years
You shouldn’t be smoking mr James.
When the world needed him most, he returned
When he needed his fans money the most, he left
That's not what happened in Avatar
the blue man never disappeared in the first place
And he did
@@vintheguy He disappeared after the Genesis era for many years and was replaced with a lookalike.
Yep
It was always so sad how many people said SA1 was such a terrible game because they only played the ports. I remember renting a dreamcast with SA from Hollywood Video for a special promotion before it released. Dreamcast truly felt next gen to me, since I grew up with PC's in my house and Dreamcast was the first time I felt like "Wow my PC can't do this".
Also the DX version feels very much like "We need to port this but don't have any of the original team and we lost the hard drives a bunch of the assets were on." Like they were able to rip some of the assets from the final build of the DC version of the game but others got corrupted or didn't work so they just remade them worse.
Honestly, Sonic Adventure is a game that I feel like some people would not like it even if they played the DC version. SA has not aged well. But, I still love Sonic Adventure, and think it's a fun game despite its flaws.
The director got cut in half with some scissors ✂️
He’s back from his 2,000 year slumber
You
Your finally awake
You were trying to cross the border to go into hiding so you wouldn't have to complete the sonic 3 bonus video
Thats not right do you mean 20,000 years
The Sega Dreamcast has blast transparency and the GameCube doesn’t…
Explains why the transparency is so bad on gamecube but how did they fuck it up even more on pc
@@silverreaps6803 because they made the pc version based off the Gamecube one, then some of the files got fucked up, and they never bothered to change it. The End.
Is blast transparency the sequel to blast processing?
and thats why you need to remember that "sega does what nintendon't"
Dreamcast does what GameCube don't.
This video was super interesting. I had the same experience as you - playing SA1 when it first came out on DC. In 1999, the best looking graphics I had ever seen to that point were the pinnacle of the 5th gen, such as Ocarina of Time and Goldeneye 007. So when I rented a Dreamcast and Sonic Adventure, it was absolutely amazing. Many years later I wanted to replay it but no longer had a Dreamcast, so I got the Gamecube version. I remember having the same feeling of being like (I could've sworn it looked better than this but oh well I guess it's just an old game's graphics not aging well). I also found that it made me motion sick, which could be due to the change in frame rate or it could just be me in my old age unable to handle the primitive camera.
I love how sega constantly fucks up PORTS
They screwed up the gba sonic 1 port already.
@@ShadowPlushGaming Sonic colors
@@ShadowPlushGamingsonic all star racing
He's actually back?! 2020 has something good!?
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
SADX Director's Cut: *disregards touches that made the director's vision more cohesive*
Maybe they called it that because they cut the director out of the game
It was actually supposed to be “director is cut”, but someone mistook the i for an apostrophe
@@robertwyatt3912 I mean, adding the apostrophe still conveys the same meaning, it’s just up to context.
The universal installer for the Dreamcast Conversion mod makes it the definitive of SADX and is now an essential mod for SADX. It has better visual game assets, fixed glitches with the Steam port, better audio, smoother controls, smoother running, extra features including ones originally exclusive to the Dreamcast, proper lighting, better effects, cleaner and upscaled UI, and more. I only encountered one weird glitch and it was from me doing something that most developers and modders would not account for. The PC and GameCube ports are almost completely inferior versions of Sonic Adventure. This actually makes me want to hunt an actual Dreamcast, have it refurbished and hunt down a copy of Sonic Adventure 1 for the Dreamcast.
What was the weird glitch?
@@ChiefMedicPururu Going through Emerald Coast and instead of running down a slope, I was on the side messing around and ended up on the visible underside of it where a Life was or 10 extra rings was.
No clue if someone else mentioned it in the comments but I think the drowning burger shop statue is a reference to an event where some Japanese sports fans threw a Colonel Sanders statue into a canal in celebration of their team's win but ended up having a multi year losing streak afterwards. They did end up fishing it back up so that could be the reference, but I could be wrong.
how do you know that?
cybershell mentioned this in an older video actually, sonic the hedgehog the screensaver
Its funny how he makes a 9/11 joke when this video was also released on 9/11
@@cdfactory Just like 9/11
11/9/20.
@@cdfactory It was an inside job.
He actually finished the video in October 2019, but waited 11 months so the release date could be an easter egg.
this is just so depressing, especially since the dx version was much more widely played by consumers than the dreamcast version. It really makes me think that so much of the criticism of this game couldve been avoided if more people had played it on dreamcast
Or if they focused on the game and not the 'ugli grafix tht r soo baaaaad!!!11!1'
I literally didn't know until now that DX was just a remake of the original... I grew up with the OG Dreamcast version and never understood the complaints, especially stuff about bugs. It all makes so much sense but I never bothered to look it up and find out LMAO
@@sleepythemis
Yeah it’s really sad that the remakes were the more mainstream versions that were never tested or bug fixed as heavily as the Dreamcast versions were. =/
I don’t mind some of the graphical updates (mainly SA2 only) but there are a lot of bugs both visually and gameplay wise. Weird clipping through the levels and problems with collision that I never see happen on the Dreamcast version. The chaos emeralds and transparency in general being screwed up in SA2B (things that are supposed to be transparent or in a background layer actually end up reversed in a lot of instances in the GC version of SA2; see any scene with chaos emeralds or flashing lights like when the Biolizard is summoned; Biolizard appears in front of the explosion of light instead of behind it etc).
Not to mention wtf happened with the SA1 character models? They went from being normal fuzzy animals to being plastic as hell. ._.
Updating the models to appear more anime-like and similar to the official art would have been a great change, but why did they turn them plastic? Also they kept some of the more exaggerated expressions that only worked on the more cartoony versions like when Sonic sees Tails crash or whatever by the pool in Station Square. It doesn’t look weird in the Dreamcast version despite being just as absurd because the art style is more silly looking. The game was made for that art style, and they didn’t bother to adjust it for the new style they went with in DX.
never met anyone who owned a dreamcast
@@NintenBricksFilms yeah it was a failed console, but I was lucky enough to have one and play this game the og way. I was totally blown away by it as a kid
Not owning a Dreamcast and really wanting to play the Sonic Adventure games, I was so excited when they were ported to the Gamecube, seeing this comparison video had me like "This and that aren't supposed to be like that!?!?" I do like the models, except seeing the original Super Sonic model had me like "Wow, that looks so much better" And the lighting was eye opening as well. This was an excellent and educational video!!
24:39 is a perfect demonstration of my issues with putting cartoon characters in "realistic" game environments. It's something I see happen in Japanese games a lot. Wario World had the same problem.
You've taken a cartoon character, a bright, colourful model, and put it in a realistic, desaturated environment. The contrast is too stark. They stand out for all the wrong reasons. The original ice world on the left looks like an ice cavern just fine, but it's also bright enough that the cartoon characters fit with the art style.
I'm seeing the same issue with Sonic Frontier so far. That demo had people saying "This looks like they put a Sonic model into a Unity asset map" because he doesn't look like he belongs in that world. The colour pallets don't match.
I mean cartoon characters can be in realistic enviroments, but only if you stylized them a bit that way they fit in the enviroment.
Well Sonic doesn’t look inherently cartoonish like an actual cartoon character, like, say, SpongeBob. So him being in a world full of rocks and grass fits since that’s basically green hill zone. Take that concept and combine it with PS5 Graphics and I’d say it looks pretty good.
@@ILikeSoda229 Sonic's design is *at least* as cartoonish as Spongebob's, maybe even more. He is a heavily stylized and exaggerated character, and his world needs to carry over at least some of that exaggeration.
Disagree completely. You seem to think its a mistake or something but its the entire point. Sonic in realistic environments provides contrast, conflict, chaos, excitement! Sonic in candyland provides nothing, theres tons of "cartoon mascots in dreamland" games.
Heck, even Nintendo knew it, Mario Odyssey, a game about an exciting new adventure, puts Mario in a realistic New york looking city.
@@KOTEBANAROT If you think New Donk looks realistic, I want to visit the planet you inhabit. It sounds amazing.
It's absolutely baffling that every subsequent release of the game was based on this ancient half-assed port
I think so too. But I imagine it went like this, the developers going "Oh, that's the remake right? Great! Slap some improvements on it and call it a day".
Half-assed? OK idiotic dreamcast purists, playing the dresmcast version PUT ME OFF THE ADVENTURE GAMES, its glitchy, its broken, the lighting is non existent, and the models look like poop
Interesting, it's the first time I hear of the Dreamcast version being glitchy. Can you tell me an example? Also it was literally half-assed, you can see it had little effort put into it when you look into the changes. And I prefer it over the original version lol
@@gmestanley2214 Well, the dreamcast version literally has nonexistent lighting, bland ugly textures and some glitches include dying to the emerald coast whale because I spindashed (which would normally help me), clipping through the boardwalk, because I spindashed, and falling off at the beginning of speed highway, again and again, it isn't very good and while the speed highway glitch is there, I don't remember the other 2 being in sadx, and sorry for calling yall idiotic, I get heated thats all
Heated gaming moment
"People need information regurgitated to them like little baby birds." Man's got a point...
*then why did he make this fucking video?????*
@@tyshco2969 money
@Selim Mašić The site was actually very cool, you should seriously check it out.
@@tyshco2969 to tell us to stop waiting for him to upload and instead do your own research. Take his advice.
@@StafkiGTN Dude, this was just a shitty joke I made seven months ago.
So SADX is basically the Half-Life: Source of the sonic franchise.
I would say it's even worse if that's possible
@OctoOOZ i was talking about adventure
@@ryko1478 It's not. SADX might look bad but at least it's actually playable.
9:50 it should be noted that DX removed the ability to murder your chao
What?!
@fabionoronhazampieri7639 in the dream cast version you could kill your Chao if you threw them at the wall enough times lol
The Dreamcast version seems much more stylized in the level aesthetics as well. I was always baffled by people who said that Sonic Adventure’s visuals aged well, since the DX version goes for a muddier “realistic” look that consistently looks dated by the time the next-gen consoles roll around.
Level themes, yes. Character design, SA2 onwards blows SA1 out of the water.
..I just tried to replay SA2, but man, is it annoying after Stage 1 - I totally forgot about this. xD
Eh...I dunno they don't seem that dated.
@NES The SA1 character models were dated on arrival. Almost nothing about them is round or smooth, and the weird stock animations they came up with that are completely unnatural and often look unfinished do not match their dialogue at all.
@@lupolinar The dream cast version had better lighting but the gamecube version has better framerate. Gamecube can be 60, while Dreamcast is 30.
I'm starting to understanding why 3d Sonic is failing, because it's very hard for Sonic to go too fast without the framerate going down. Thankfully the 2d games don't have this problem.
Me before watching the video: "whaaat, the GameCube version looks better. Just look at those models!"
Me after watching the video: "Sonic, what have they done to you and your world?"
Me before watching this: dx SUCKS
Me after watching this: dx STILL SUCKS
people who prefer DX graphics barely pay attention to anything else than the main character models. Even with better models, I think the Dreamcast ones works better with the cutscene animations, DX models just looks too weird and unfitting for being too "round" and polished, basically, the Uncanny Valley effect.
@@sanglish18 your opinion I like both but the Dx has a better super sonic look if you say one thing to me about being wrong then your angry
@@sanglish18 also I play the xbox 360 version and that one has a little better version of cream so dont yell at me I love to play as metal sonic
@@stormwatch32 YES
Wow the part where you covered lighting...just wow. I only saw the game played by my cousin as a kid on the dream cast, so I shouldn't even remember much. But obviously it left an impression on me, because I tried to play the GameCube version when I got older and I didn't even know why but I felt it I just knew it didn't look this bad...the doors, the auras around sonic or any given characters ability, it all felt...so wrong. And God FUCK bigs underwater levels my eyes...
Edit: also yes, one thing I specifically remember is no clipping through the floor just why Sega...quite the directors cut he cut the game up alright. Lol
The worst part about this is that they tried to pass off the XBOX 360 and PS3 ports of the game as the original by using the original name and logo, when really it's actually just the DX version in all its buggy glory. They even locked the DX content behind DLC, too.
After watching this it genuinely feels like DX is a huge contributor to the common perception that Sonic Adventure is a buggy/bad game and that Sonic games in general are unpolished and bad.
Yep.
That's most likely the case, since the DX version was on way more popular consoles than the Dreamcast, thus most people only played the DX version and assumed the original was the same.
@Rando ?
The only serious bugs I had come across with the Dreamcast version were: Light speed dash broke in Lost World at one point, Zero's theme was more subtle than what you find now, and the notorious Twinkle Park stage for Big that just NEVER WORKED on mine. The only benefit DX gave was the Chao's Black Market in my opinion. :o
Actually - I now agree with this - *especially* after seeing that notorious loop bug on Emerald Coast didn't exist / wasn't nearly as bad on DC.
I just wish DC had skippable cutscenes! Then it would be the ultimate version. :)
This game's stupid title made my kid-self mistakenly think "DX" was actually shorthand for "Director's Cut."
same
It is, DX is a commonly used abbreviation for directors cut
@@spong266 It also means deluxe(the game Is called DX In Japan also).
Same wait huh
I play/watch Kirby. I should've known this. Dang I'm stupid.
Cybershell saw Hbomberguy coming from 3 years away and wisely decided to cite their sources.
Thanks for making this. I've been playing through DX on PC and was getting annoyed at all the bugs and general shittiness.
Was the jungle trail pathing always so bad?
"You should agree that remasters should improve the game or at least not make it any worse"
And i am watching this video after Sonic Colors Ultimate release
Ironic
DX isn't even a remaster. I mean, ignoring the fact that I think "remaster" is a stupid term for video games, it's clearly been changed from the ground up for the GameCube. Remake more like.
@@k-leb4671 No, a remake from the ground up would imply that the game uses new underlying framework and code. Not to mention in almost every case, an entirely new engine. Remaster is more appropriate for games than it is for things it was used on prior like movies or images, because you can be most thorough with a game when it comes to rebuilding the end product entirely.
Unfortunately for our purposes, SADX is indeed a remaster, and that's really it's primary problem. It's a clunky remaster, trying to run code tailor made for a specific system on what were, at the time, a myriad of other very different systems not designed to run this particular game. And in a lot of cases, the systems either didn't know how, or the creators of the remaster didn't know how to translate the functions from the Dreamcast to the new target machines.
And, unfortunately, it has stained the game's legacy phenomenally because this was never rectified with a new remaster or actual ground-up remake when technology advanced and such a thing became easier to do.
Is Sonic Colours Ultimate bad? I haven't played it.
@@HOTD108_ sonic colours ultimate is a good game, its the same as the wii adding better graphics, sonic customization and optional new soundtrack
I’m so happy.
Bruh same
Hey I'm subbed to you, funny to see that we like the same creator
OMG ME TO
@@ZBA1023 yeahm it's really crazy, a major sonic related channel watches videos of another major sonic channel. it's really crazy man, like who would have thought?
I agree
Hearing an American say “What an absolute lad” absolutely threw me.
5:30 missed joke: director's cut means the director *was* cut
Too easy.