Winston, genji, sig can be annoying, dva, ball, doom, Lucio, reaper, the occasional pharmercy. If she doesn't have a mercy pocket bastion can also be annoying. Going against a hitscan 1shot is annoying but I hope these characters ease ur problems
honestly shes not phenomenal, shes just a wall that allows her team to do what they need to do without a tank in the way because she just denies them into the floor instead of actually doing anything to them. She herself isn't great, and sure as hell fits into c tier when considering solo queue, she loses most 1v1's in the game against dps character due to 90% of her damage stemming from hitting the javelin. She is c tier on her own, but enables her team to do better than the opponent which makes people think she is FAR better than she actually is. (150 hours+ on orisa from season 1-13 btw)
@@baldfelix1841 i play in gold 1 low plat bracket and orisa mostly does decently were when i see a roadhog ik we are fucked as a team and so far there hasnt been a single exception with 120+ games played as dps and support
I agree with Freedo about Mauga in B tier, but for a far different reason. Mauga is FEAST OR FAMINE, and that can heavily fluctuate based on your ability to play him correctly, and adjust to your team comp, as well as the enemy. This is the same case with Widowmaker. Mauga can be easily S-tier, or bottom of the barrel based on the way YOU play him. That can be said for all heroes (sorta) but Mauga is the absolute pinnacle of this. He's a solid pick, but make sure you have proper assistance from your team, or adjust for lack thereof, and you'll skyrocket in the ranks in no time.
I love Mauga but the shorter Cardiac duration really hurt him. It's so easy for a giga tank to block it or for the insane mobility characters to kite it that I wish it went back to being longer for less. He also sucks into Rein ever since they made him unable to ignite shields which sucks
no they just wanted to sell more widow skins, youre not gonna buy a widow skin in that last sombra meta. same when mercy mythic came out and they buffed mirror watch mercy so she got every potg to sell it PLUS remember the phara meta? yeah that was to sell pharmacy
Dunno abt dat tho her healing output is so fucking bad i mean i am a Bapt main and i suffer so much to get shit done with her . But i agree she is unusual to play and her kit need u to really practice your positioning .
Same here. I probably would have quit Overwatch if it wasn't for Juno. She's simply adorable and very fun to play - even in TDM. I'm therefore also not that happy about the season 13 nerfs. But I'm also not sad about Sombra's state atm. Sure, Sombra (or another Widowmaker) is the best answer to a strong Widowmaker. So you don't want her to lose that fight. But fighting Sombra just never felt fun. It's basically a massive cheat mode that would destroy any other game; Complete movement freedom, near-permanent invisibility, a tool to disturb enemy's special skills and health packs + good damage... Sure, a good Tracer is still stronger - but also requires A LOT more skill.
I was in every stream for your push to T500 on tank a few seasons ago, glad to see you finally got there! I remember the day you were one game from masters then dropped to Plat 2 😂 wish you'd stream again!!! The single moms need you
Unfortunately I don't really think he will for awhile after what happen to him after the venture debacle. His chat hounded on him about her identity cuz if what he was referring to her as and he didn't mean it. They attacked him for it and it made me sad to see that. He is genuinely a great guy and doesn't do anything or go out of his way to hurt people in any way shape or form. Feel bad for the guy tbh
@@Doomed2Fail Yes! I saw/read that too on that day. I immediately thought what kind of problem do these people have?? I mean nobody is perfect but if you can't say one thing about Freedo then that he is not open minded and respectful (generally speaking). If that would be the case why he won't stream again man that would be really sad. :-/
@0li-0li28 oh it was 100% an honest mistake and had no idea. He watched the trailer that day and he said or he looks pretty cool. And it was a wrap. He was being bashed for like 3 games in a row about it and had to turn chat off because he was genuinely sad that his chat was calling him a biggot for it and eventually ended stream. He apologized and people didn't let go of it. Truly sad not gonna lie. He didn't deserve it at all but I think they did it with bad intentions in the first place.
@@miguelortiz8350 well i am average player. Im in Plat as tank and i don't agree with him. Most of tanks play DVa or Winston and as Rein you can't do anything to them. They'll just jump or fly to team and kill them. Mercy is definitely too high, she can be killed very easily, Orisa, on the other hand, is definitely too low. I feel like he's playing a completely different game than me...
@@mank0wy rein is a brawl character who plays close to his team??? dva is annoying sure because of matrix but if you catch dva or monkey in your hammer swings they die REALLY REALLY fast if your team is also shooting them. Orisa on the otherhand is a poke character who is survivable because shes a wall thats hard to get past meaning you cant kill her supports as easily, but if you play reinhardt or sigma into orisa you just win, barrier blocks javelin, and her gun does nothing to it and gets 0 value for the time put into shooting the barrier. Orisa is C tier but enables her team to do well, reinhardt is S tier but is heavily dependant on his team playing around him. Both depend on the right team comps, and their "rating" fluctuates heavily based on who else you're playing with.
As someone whos like mained sombra since release, this is probably the most passive she's ever been. The translocator cd is down to 6s so now theres only one second of stealth downtime, but regardless her ability to flank has been severely nerfed. It requires better positioning before during and after the engagement, and stricter timing to align with your translocator cd. Because of that, its much more easy and consistent to play with your team and be anti-dive/anti-agression. increased damage on hacked targets+virus makes her burst damage super scary. In my experience, winston has been a lost less scary. you burn bubble, hack him, and deal massive damage to him. You can still kinda bully rein and do more damage to him now. Enemy flankers have to respect your damage now and will be more likely to use a cooldown to avoid hack. Her main playstyle is definitely different, but not as bad as ppl are saying it is imo. All that being said, i dont think she's as bad flanker either. not the flanker she once was for sure, but still good, and can still do things no one else can do. she can still sneak on a widow and melt her, get the jump on a healer coming from spawn, eats juno for breakfast honestly, and has good verticality. Point is, she still has her strengths and unique abilities, so don't underestimate her too much.
yeah teh difference is she's a character that cant really flank it is the most inconsistent flanker in the game rn theres such little value u get for a flank its better to play her like soldier to get maximum value which makes her boring to play like having a invisible charecter played liek soldier is a waste of a idea u might as well take out her stealth give her a movement abillty at this point its upsetting hpw they ruined her fun play style it was never meta teh only people that say that are gold and below occasionally boosted plat players
@@joshuatucker1464 i dont think its that she cant flank or is so inconsistent, its just more difficult, more strict. it requires more skill, and is much more risky. imo her optimal playstyle is a mix of both fighting with your team, fending off flankers with hack and applying pressure on the frontline, and flanking when the opportunity presents itself. Knowing when to do what is the hard part.
I hated Sombra last season, but those nerfs have been really heavy handed. All we needed was some tweaks to other abilities to counter her. Maybe make anti prevent stealth, or allow Symmetras turrets to target her. Would give more characters more utility, rather then removing a lot of the utility from characters.
@@porcupinezebra648 she has less range than cassidy, and her strength before was being able to speed in her team while healing from range; she cant do that anymore, with 225 health and no self heal outside of support passive and shield (which is why she was strong before because she could play cover from range) she can just get 1 headshot 1 body shot by a cassidy and she dies instantly, no amount of "movement" can stop that. She's definitely fallen down and the only reason she isnt in something as low as C tier is because her ultimate is still disgustingly overpowered. Dunno why they didnt nerf the blatantly op ult instead to the actually intuitive part of her kit being her gun but hey blizz is blizz.
@@producekyro she is she has one of the highest survivabiltty in the game even close up she has bascially two get out buttons does decent consistent damage shes really good with brawl and dive
Seeing Lifeweaver in the same tier as Ana kinda upsets me... He's good, ok, but Ana has so much more utility that the two aren't even on the same league for me
I heavily agree with most if not all of this tier list. Especially with most of the hitscan DPS heros' placements. I've been grinding Widowmaker very hard ever since the Mythic Skin was revealed; I wanted to get good at her by the time I had the skin fully finished. From that perspective, I fully agree with these placements.
Awesome to see Reinhardt not being terrible this season. Never play him personally but I feel like the game is in a much more fun and better state when he’s meta 🙌
Sombra is still fine in GM I’ve played against her a few times so far this season, she’s not extremely oppressive as before but she can definitely put some pressure on you.
I almost think they cooked with sombra changes. I would want to try having her invis after translate be 7 seconds. You could stay invis indefinitely but have to translocate to keep it, and that is a visual and sound cue that she might be around
I brought up months ago how Winston's ult needed something because I felt like it wasn't doing much unless you ult them when they're critical and still.😅 It doesn't need to be a t.p.k ult but it definitely needed something. 7:16
I can see the argument that, if this is a tier list for average players trying to rank up as you say, Orisa should be higher. I agree she isn’t that great overall, but in metal ranks and diamond she gets so much value from players tunnel visioning onto her and, for example, shooting her instead of squishies, shooting her gold and spin, etc.
I’m in plat 2 for tank and I swear I hate a Route 66 team that couldn’t even shoot or kill ball and he stalled the point for basically minutes without dying and I had to stand there and watch my team miss everything and even had a junkrat who couldn’t even trap him on the payload lol. I was Orisa abd hit him with javelin throw and my gun multiple times and still didn’t die because I was the only one doing damage to him
I'd love for them to put a minimal in quick play, at least with the healthpacks on, it would be outrageously helpful for new players. You could see where teammates are and play accordingly.
I think she should be A atleast but tbh yeah Kiriko has been rlly decent these past seasons especially with the rise of more juno/bap/brig + for the average player they can barely get value out of her outside of healbotting and healing focused suzus
this has been a great season so far. I hate sombra so much. The issue is right now on tank role, every other game is against a smurf in eu. Either that or nobody can climb fast enough after ranked resets
She only has to be out of invisibility for 2 secs at a time technically. Idk why everybody is freaking out. Her ability cooldown is 7sec and her cloaking is 5 secs. Not that big of a deal tbf.
@@travisabr1294 it's not about the time to recloak, for me at least... It's the time that cloak lasts. She's still definitely usable, but you have less time to position to engage.
This seems.. somewhat ok? I don't usually go by tierlists because it all depends always more no what YOU can play well, and what your team is playing, rather than just a single character being good or bad. Like if I'm playing Juno and I'm against a monkey, and none of my DPS are even able to kill the monkey or do anything about it, juno is just trash, with your shift you're barely able to leave winston's range before he kills you and then he can just jump at you again 1 second later. You'll spend most of the match and your cooldowns running away rather than healing or hitting anything. As far as DPSs go, I've been getting somewhat rimmed by ashe pretty often, people are insane with her, somehow never miss a shot while I have like a 50% accuracy lol. Playing phara against those ashes really depends on if I'm better than the other DPS enough to just outplay them which is obviously not always the case. Rein super strong for sure. I haven't faced Many sojourns, but I did face a specific one who just slammed my entire team with almost no chance to retaliate, I get the feeling she could be super busted if you're good enough.
@@Vladd0r I scrim 4.5 and play in gm4+ lobbies ana kinda picked every game because Ana Juno is extremely good one of the few counters to Juno ult and kiriko isnt really amazing Me and my team be laughing about this tier list so much. How is it for the average player but brig is s tier bap illari a tier. Its like he combined the opinion of a bronze and gm player In what world is poke supports meta right now it’s so silly.
The Ram changes make Rein so frustrating at low levels. All of Rein's cooldowns come with zero risk anymore. It's frustrating that (like the devs have said) there's zero community outcry when Rein is OP compared to literally any other tank.
It's because at least Rein has to get close to get meaningful impact, unlike other tanks. He also trades offense for defense as he can't attack and shield at the same time, a reason why Sigma is so hated. People would learn to hate Rein as well if he was meta for a few weeks, since tank is just fundamentally broken in 5v5.
I never see brig at Gold and below and if I do they swap off, both my team and enemy team and neither swap back. I’m just not convinced, but it goes to show you that as a content creator your games are Waaaaaay different from us plebeians.
First time watching your video… I liked that you gave a lot of detail at first about each hero but why when it got to dps did you just rush past them? A tier list is usually interesting because you explain the hero’s strengths/weaknesses and why they are good/bad to pick up, but you just added them to list and said practically nothing. Otherwise a good informative video
hog is still the best killer. i play him a lot. i usually play jq but she isn't as lethal. sometimes i need that one shot kill so i switch to hog and it works. jq and dva seems great. ram in general terrible, worst tank imo. if you are a ball player he is pretty good but if you are not a ball player don't play him. orisa is still tanky, ignores cc and has her own interrupting cc to throw frequently so she still has a place and great poke too. doom is fundamentally broken hero so he is always great. mauga buff is bigger than it looks. he is good. My tank tier list: S: rein, jq, dva, winton A: doom and ball if you main these heroes B: sig, zarya, hog, orisa, mauga C: ram my default pick is jq for flat maps, dva for high ground camping maps. if it doesnt work i go mauga to poke or hog to peekaboo one shot kill. sometimes i just pick rein to quickly roll the enemy, he is ridiculously op but not a hero in my pool. ram is ridiculously overrated. you are really handicapping yourself by playing him. his zarya match up is good though. sigma match up can also be good sometimes. there is really no reason to pick ram. play rein or orisa if you wanna have kinda similar but more solid hero. sig should actually be higher if your team know how to play poke. otherwise rein and maybe even ram can roll you so sig is mixed.
Tanking is more miserable than ever IMO. probably just a skill issue though... All of these high damage heroes along with the dps passive makes it incredibly hard to take space, and being forced to counter-swap or get flamed by your team every fight is beyond annoying. also, in low ranks junk-rat still dominates. S tier hero. he still gets random-ish unintentional elims on top of two-shotting most squishies, and makes tanking even more miserable.
Do you find that even if you're popping off, the enemy team still doesn't want to deal with you. "There's a Sombra" "Eh, she got nerfed so she's not my issue"
The best are the ones you like to play and the worst are the ones you don’t like to play. It’s that simple. Those only playing meta heroes, just looking for easy wins are why games like this can be so boring.
Sombra was oppressive AF before. She needs to stay out of meta. The RAM Nerf is uncalled for and makes him like a glass cannon now vs a brawler. Ball needs 15 more bullets in his gun because he's just not viable with some much counterplay.
Solo que as healer made me uninstall last season. Haven’t played in yeaaaars. My brig and Ana were real good, but the second someone dies it’s my fault…. Not the fact that they run into enemy fire alone and I tell them not to
He says multiples times in this video and in ALL his tierlist videos that he ranks for the average tier of play, not the “pros”. And when you say pros I think you just mean T500s/GMs bc the pros literally never play Orisa lol
@@LaiLai-2111You haven’t watched a single pro game for 2 months then. Orisa is on literally every single pro match because of the Juno/Brig backline. On maps without good high ground she’s HARD meta
Bro just gaslighted rein and queen into the top tiers. Queen is really bad now, you get burst down so easily as its a ranged meta. Doom is very good though, you can bypass the dive tanks and the brawly ones like mauga and rein
Honestly, Mirrorwatch Sombra is better by far than this version…. And this silly attitude that it’s okay to gutter some characters is a petty and ridiculous attitude Freedo. If you can’t stomach a variety of kits honestly don’t play Overwatch…
This tear list is a MISS , kiri and ana are both high A, mercy is nowhere near A , bap is S again after the buff, orisa is A idk why shes in C, rein isnt S either especially after the nerf, illari is way off A as well, low B maximum
No. Tanks are too strong. I’m tired of games being determined MOSTLY by who has the better tank. (Keyword…mostly! That doesn’t mean the same thing as totally) Dps as a role is too weak and not impactful enough. Unless you’re a sniper landing one shots. (Which were supposed to be removed from the game…but that’s neither here nor there)
Sombra not being in every game has been great so far
Wait till you get out of gold then you get to play against Widowmaker with no option to counterplay
Now it's widow every game 🤦♂️
Winston, genji, sig can be annoying, dva, ball, doom, Lucio, reaper, the occasional pharmercy.
If she doesn't have a mercy pocket bastion can also be annoying.
Going against a hitscan 1shot is annoying but I hope these characters ease ur problems
OMG its been so refreshing.
You must not play with sound or be below gold
orisa c tier is crazy
Especially when she counters both B tier tanks pretty well
I think that’s correct honestly
honestly shes not phenomenal, shes just a wall that allows her team to do what they need to do without a tank in the way because she just denies them into the floor instead of actually doing anything to them. She herself isn't great, and sure as hell fits into c tier when considering solo queue, she loses most 1v1's in the game against dps character due to 90% of her damage stemming from hitting the javelin. She is c tier on her own, but enables her team to do better than the opponent which makes people think she is FAR better than she actually is. (150 hours+ on orisa from season 1-13 btw)
ignore her and you win every team fight
@@Carrera06GT I need to try this strategy, I'm a doomfist main and I'm currently way under my true rank because I can't play around Orisa
“I make lists for the average player”
*puts Orissa in C*
but like orisa is bad in lower ranks rn lol just not c tier though
@@baldfelix1841 i play in gold 1 low plat bracket and orisa mostly does decently were when i see a roadhog ik we are fucked as a team and so far there hasnt been a single exception with 120+ games played as dps and support
Everything in Sombra's current kit is directly counter to the kit. It's wild. Almost seems as if they didn't play her before rolling out the rework.
Limited 5-second invis tied to Translocator proc just seems...counter-intuitive. I don't know how else to describe it.
Nerfed her into the ground just so people are more inclined to buy the widow mythic
godzilla had a stroke reading this
Love it. A character like Sombra should even exist. I hope they delete her ass.
@@TimelostGamerI think you're the only one having a stroke, buddy. Call your doc.
I agree with Freedo about Mauga in B tier, but for a far different reason.
Mauga is FEAST OR FAMINE, and that can heavily fluctuate based on your ability to play him correctly, and adjust to your team comp, as well as the enemy. This is the same case with Widowmaker. Mauga can be easily S-tier, or bottom of the barrel based on the way YOU play him. That can be said for all heroes (sorta) but Mauga is the absolute pinnacle of this. He's a solid pick, but make sure you have proper assistance from your team, or adjust for lack thereof, and you'll skyrocket in the ranks in no time.
Mauga is one of the few hero’s I never figured out how to play so I put him at F tier lol
I love Mauga but the shorter Cardiac duration really hurt him. It's so easy for a giga tank to block it or for the insane mobility characters to kite it that I wish it went back to being longer for less. He also sucks into Rein ever since they made him unable to ignite shields which sucks
It’s like somebody with a hate boner for Sombra was in charge of the “rework”
it was the bronze intern widow one trick probably lol
It was a mercy or widow main.
no they just wanted to sell more widow skins, youre not gonna buy a widow skin in that last sombra meta. same when mercy mythic came out and they buffed mirror watch mercy so she got every potg to sell it PLUS remember the phara meta? yeah that was to sell pharmacy
Give that employee a raise
Good fuck sombra
Freedo, idk wtf you're smoking but I want some lmao rein in S and orisa in D is a wild hot take
Can’t say for Orisa very much but rein has been EXTREMELY solid. He’s my regular pick if I want to guarantee a good match from myself
Rein is the mercy of tanks. Actually takes 2 brain cells to play
Rein is so strong. Playable into mauga and now beats ram. Juno speed being very common. Clash being dominated by him. All good for rein.
Yeah the Orisa in D is for sure a hot take but that's about it
Rein is good atm, orisa definitely not C tier
Juno is just fun af. My favorite hero they ever released.
Dunno abt dat tho her healing output is so fucking bad i mean i am a Bapt main and i suffer so much to get shit done with her . But i agree she is unusual to play and her kit need u to really practice your positioning .
Same here. I probably would have quit Overwatch if it wasn't for Juno.
She's simply adorable and very fun to play - even in TDM.
I'm therefore also not that happy about the season 13 nerfs.
But I'm also not sad about Sombra's state atm.
Sure, Sombra (or another Widowmaker) is the best answer to a strong Widowmaker.
So you don't want her to lose that fight.
But fighting Sombra just never felt fun.
It's basically a massive cheat mode that would destroy any other game;
Complete movement freedom, near-permanent invisibility, a tool to disturb enemy's special skills and health packs + good damage...
Sure, a good Tracer is still stronger - but also requires A LOT more skill.
I was in every stream for your push to T500 on tank a few seasons ago, glad to see you finally got there! I remember the day you were one game from masters then dropped to Plat 2 😂 wish you'd stream again!!! The single moms need you
Would love to see this streams again! So fun and enjoyable. Freedo is such a great guy!
Unfortunately I don't really think he will for awhile after what happen to him after the venture debacle. His chat hounded on him about her identity cuz if what he was referring to her as and he didn't mean it. They attacked him for it and it made me sad to see that. He is genuinely a great guy and doesn't do anything or go out of his way to hurt people in any way shape or form. Feel bad for the guy tbh
@@Doomed2Fail Yes! I saw/read that too on that day. I immediately thought what kind of problem do these people have?? I mean nobody is perfect but if you can't say one thing about Freedo then that he is not open minded and respectful (generally speaking). If that would be the case why he won't stream again man that would be really sad. :-/
@@Doomed2Failwas it an honest mistake? Bcus if so that’s kinda sad, I kept referring to venture as him before I learned about them being NB
@0li-0li28 oh it was 100% an honest mistake and had no idea. He watched the trailer that day and he said or he looks pretty cool. And it was a wrap. He was being bashed for like 3 games in a row about it and had to turn chat off because he was genuinely sad that his chat was calling him a biggot for it and eventually ended stream. He apologized and people didn't let go of it. Truly sad not gonna lie. He didn't deserve it at all but I think they did it with bad intentions in the first place.
Did you just put Rein in S, Mercy in A over Ana and Kiri, and you put Orisa in C???? WOW! Dude we play diffrent games...
He is rqting for the average player. Which makes sense.
@@miguelortiz8350 well i am average player. Im in Plat as tank and i don't agree with him. Most of tanks play DVa or Winston and as Rein you can't do anything to them. They'll just jump or fly to team and kill them. Mercy is definitely too high, she can be killed very easily, Orisa, on the other hand, is definitely too low. I feel like he's playing a completely different game than me...
@@mank0wysounds like you're out of position a lot
@@mank0wy rein is a brawl character who plays close to his team??? dva is annoying sure because of matrix but if you catch dva or monkey in your hammer swings they die REALLY REALLY fast if your team is also shooting them. Orisa on the otherhand is a poke character who is survivable because shes a wall thats hard to get past meaning you cant kill her supports as easily, but if you play reinhardt or sigma into orisa you just win, barrier blocks javelin, and her gun does nothing to it and gets 0 value for the time put into shooting the barrier. Orisa is C tier but enables her team to do well, reinhardt is S tier but is heavily dependant on his team playing around him. Both depend on the right team comps, and their "rating" fluctuates heavily based on who else you're playing with.
Mercy is throw pick, reporting anyone who plays that
As someone whos like mained sombra since release, this is probably the most passive she's ever been. The translocator cd is down to 6s so now theres only one second of stealth downtime, but regardless her ability to flank has been severely nerfed. It requires better positioning before during and after the engagement, and stricter timing to align with your translocator cd.
Because of that, its much more easy and consistent to play with your team and be anti-dive/anti-agression. increased damage on hacked targets+virus makes her burst damage super scary. In my experience, winston has been a lost less scary. you burn bubble, hack him, and deal massive damage to him. You can still kinda bully rein and do more damage to him now. Enemy flankers have to respect your damage now and will be more likely to use a cooldown to avoid hack. Her main playstyle is definitely different, but not as bad as ppl are saying it is imo.
All that being said, i dont think she's as bad flanker either. not the flanker she once was for sure, but still good, and can still do things no one else can do. she can still sneak on a widow and melt her, get the jump on a healer coming from spawn, eats juno for breakfast honestly, and has good verticality.
Point is, she still has her strengths and unique abilities, so don't underestimate her too much.
yeah teh difference is she's a character that cant really flank it is the most inconsistent flanker in the game rn theres such little value u get for a flank its better to play her like soldier to get maximum value which makes her boring to play like having a invisible charecter played liek soldier is a waste of a idea u might as well take out her stealth give her a movement abillty at this point its upsetting hpw they ruined her fun play style it was never meta teh only people that say that are gold and below occasionally boosted plat players
@@joshuatucker1464 i dont think its that she cant flank or is so inconsistent, its just more difficult, more strict. it requires more skill, and is much more risky. imo her optimal playstyle is a mix of both fighting with your team, fending off flankers with hack and applying pressure on the frontline, and flanking when the opportunity presents itself. Knowing when to do what is the hard part.
Wait they changed her translocator time? When?
Everytime you are support and face a charging rein, use brig and bash his charge. You can also bypass his shield. I love playing brig into Rein. 😊
I skipped to the middle, saw Orisa in C tier and immediately closed it.
Nice video cubehead 👍
I hated Sombra last season, but those nerfs have been really heavy handed. All we needed was some tweaks to other abilities to counter her. Maybe make anti prevent stealth, or allow Symmetras turrets to target her. Would give more characters more utility, rather then removing a lot of the utility from characters.
Idk Juno in S Tier before the fix would work but I think the falloff is horrendous. It makes sense though, lot of people play way back to not die
Shes still S, that fall off doesn't really matter cuz youre not going to be playing at ana ranges
Juno still is good!
@@porcupinezebra648 yeah I don’t know about that
@@porcupinezebra648 she has less range than cassidy, and her strength before was being able to speed in her team while healing from range; she cant do that anymore, with 225 health and no self heal outside of support passive and shield (which is why she was strong before because she could play cover from range) she can just get 1 headshot 1 body shot by a cassidy and she dies instantly, no amount of "movement" can stop that. She's definitely fallen down and the only reason she isnt in something as low as C tier is because her ultimate is still disgustingly overpowered. Dunno why they didnt nerf the blatantly op ult instead to the actually intuitive part of her kit being her gun but hey blizz is blizz.
@@producekyro she is she has one of the highest survivabiltty in the game even close up she has bascially two get out buttons does decent consistent damage shes really good with brawl and dive
Seeing Lifeweaver in the same tier as Ana kinda upsets me... He's good, ok, but Ana has so much more utility that the two aren't even on the same league for me
I heavily agree with most if not all of this tier list. Especially with most of the hitscan DPS heros' placements. I've been grinding Widowmaker very hard ever since the Mythic Skin was revealed; I wanted to get good at her by the time I had the skin fully finished. From that perspective, I fully agree with these placements.
Awesome to see Reinhardt not being terrible this season. Never play him personally but I feel like the game is in a much more fun and better state when he’s meta 🙌
Nobody plays Rein cause he's boring, but everyone loves him in the meta. Go figure
For the most part I agree with but I think Orisa is too low. She's A imo
Sombra is still fine in GM I’ve played against her a few times so far this season, she’s not extremely oppressive as before but she can definitely put some pressure on you.
only if u flank the other team
I almost think they cooked with sombra changes. I would want to try having her invis after translate be 7 seconds. You could stay invis indefinitely but have to translocate to keep it, and that is a visual and sound cue that she might be around
I brought up months ago how Winston's ult needed something because I felt like it wasn't doing much unless you ult them when they're critical and still.😅 It doesn't need to be a t.p.k ult but it definitely needed something. 7:16
I can see the argument that, if this is a tier list for average players trying to rank up as you say, Orisa should be higher. I agree she isn’t that great overall, but in metal ranks and diamond she gets so much value from players tunnel visioning onto her and, for example, shooting her instead of squishies, shooting her gold and spin, etc.
I’m in plat 2 for tank and I swear I hate a Route 66 team that couldn’t even shoot or kill ball and he stalled the point for basically minutes without dying and I had to stand there and watch my team miss everything and even had a junkrat who couldn’t even trap him on the payload lol. I was Orisa abd hit him with javelin throw and my gun multiple times and still didn’t die because I was the only one doing damage to him
what joints are you smoking lad, Orisa with no Damage drop on C tier is nuts
I'd love for them to put a minimal in quick play, at least with the healthpacks on, it would be outrageously helpful for new players. You could see where teammates are and play accordingly.
Everyone and their dog playing Juno right now
Not me, Kiriko forever.
Freedo usually doesn’t miss, but this tier list is interesting fs
Kiri is B tier? She has one of the best ults in the support category and a counter to most enemy ults.
Kunais are still very difficult to hit consistently. And the papers are slow.
@@Shzl47yeah you smokin balls saying the kunai's are hard to hit.
I think she should be A atleast but tbh yeah Kiriko has been rlly decent these past seasons especially with the rise of more juno/bap/brig
+ for the average player they can barely get value out of her outside of healbotting and healing focused suzus
this has been a great season so far. I hate sombra so much. The issue is right now on tank role, every other game is against a smurf in eu. Either that or nobody can climb fast enough after ranked resets
Sombra definitely needed some tweaks because she could be oppressive... But they went way overboard imo
She only has to be out of invisibility for 2 secs at a time technically. Idk why everybody is freaking out. Her ability cooldown is 7sec and her cloaking is 5 secs. Not that big of a deal tbf.
@@travisabr1294 it's not about the time to recloak, for me at least... It's the time that cloak lasts. She's still definitely usable, but you have less time to position to engage.
This seems.. somewhat ok? I don't usually go by tierlists because it all depends always more no what YOU can play well, and what your team is playing, rather than just a single character being good or bad. Like if I'm playing Juno and I'm against a monkey, and none of my DPS are even able to kill the monkey or do anything about it, juno is just trash, with your shift you're barely able to leave winston's range before he kills you and then he can just jump at you again 1 second later. You'll spend most of the match and your cooldowns running away rather than healing or hitting anything.
As far as DPSs go, I've been getting somewhat rimmed by ashe pretty often, people are insane with her, somehow never miss a shot while I have like a 50% accuracy lol. Playing phara against those ashes really depends on if I'm better than the other DPS enough to just outplay them which is obviously not always the case. Rein super strong for sure. I haven't faced Many sojourns, but I did face a specific one who just slammed my entire team with almost no chance to retaliate, I get the feeling she could be super busted if you're good enough.
*Sad Ana main noises*
Same... Ana haven't changed much over the last many seasons, but her impact has become less and less. Time to give her that 3-shot kill back.
@@jonashansen8907 YES! Thank you 🙏
ana is meta... (S tier)
@@baldfelix1841 Have you played Ana vs Queen/Juno lately?
@@Vladd0r I scrim 4.5 and play in gm4+ lobbies ana kinda picked every game because Ana Juno is extremely good one of the few counters to Juno ult and kiriko isnt really amazing
Me and my team be laughing about this tier list so much. How is it for the average player but brig is s tier bap illari a tier. Its like he combined the opinion of a bronze and gm player
In what world is poke supports meta right now it’s so silly.
Sombra should have her stealth trigger on crouch after a second or two, just like baps boots. Oh, and it should be 10 sec, not 5
Orisa definitely should be higher imo
The Ram changes make Rein so frustrating at low levels. All of Rein's cooldowns come with zero risk anymore. It's frustrating that (like the devs have said) there's zero community outcry when Rein is OP compared to literally any other tank.
It’s bc rein is the og tank fun to play but also super vulnerable
It's because at least Rein has to get close to get meaningful impact, unlike other tanks. He also trades offense for defense as he can't attack and shield at the same time, a reason why Sigma is so hated. People would learn to hate Rein as well if he was meta for a few weeks, since tank is just fundamentally broken in 5v5.
Yeah that's crazy you either get a psycho doom fist, or a potato Doom fist, theirs no in between 😂
Same with rein tbh
I never see brig at Gold and below and if I do they swap off, both my team and enemy team and neither swap back. I’m just not convinced, but it goes to show you that as a content creator your games are Waaaaaay different from us plebeians.
Putting ball in c is actually crazy
Rocking a 72% winrate with Juno this season.
gutting sombra for widow mythic is wild & nerfing ram for reinhardt My Hero collab is diabolical
With bring being top tier torb becomes better since his ult counters armor directly. The swapathon continues lol
First time watching your video… I liked that you gave a lot of detail at first about each hero but why when it got to dps did you just rush past them? A tier list is usually interesting because you explain the hero’s strengths/weaknesses and why they are good/bad to pick up, but you just added them to list and said practically nothing. Otherwise a good informative video
Kiriko and Ana in the same tier as LW might be a crime
This season is def one of the better ones since ow2 launch
hog is still the best killer. i play him a lot. i usually play jq but she isn't as lethal. sometimes i need that one shot kill so i switch to hog and it works. jq and dva seems great. ram in general terrible, worst tank imo. if you are a ball player he is pretty good but if you are not a ball player don't play him. orisa is still tanky, ignores cc and has her own interrupting cc to throw frequently so she still has a place and great poke too. doom is fundamentally broken hero so he is always great. mauga buff is bigger than it looks. he is good.
My tank tier list:
S: rein, jq, dva, winton
A: doom and ball if you main these heroes
B: sig, zarya, hog, orisa, mauga
C: ram
my default pick is jq for flat maps, dva for high ground camping maps. if it doesnt work i go mauga to poke or hog to peekaboo one shot kill. sometimes i just pick rein to quickly roll the enemy, he is ridiculously op but not a hero in my pool. ram is ridiculously overrated. you are really handicapping yourself by playing him. his zarya match up is good though. sigma match up can also be good sometimes. there is really no reason to pick ram. play rein or orisa if you wanna have kinda similar but more solid hero. sig should actually be higher if your team know how to play poke. otherwise rein and maybe even ram can roll you so sig is mixed.
Tanking is more miserable than ever IMO. probably just a skill issue though... All of these high damage heroes along with the dps passive makes it incredibly hard to take space, and being forced to counter-swap or get flamed by your team every fight is beyond annoying. also, in low ranks junk-rat still dominates. S tier hero. he still gets random-ish unintentional elims on top of two-shotting most squishies, and makes tanking even more miserable.
Somehow I’ve been killing it as sombra now
Do you find that even if you're popping off, the enemy team still doesn't want to deal with you. "There's a Sombra" "Eh, she got nerfed so she's not my issue"
If you play her like a Cassidy then she’s really good lol
@@MxlexywithaY shes better in the low ranks like gold and below anything higher she flat out sucks since people actually ahve headsets and a monitor
this is the best legit tier list I have seen lmao
Freedo you been hitting the gym? You looking buff bro 🫡💪🏽
Buff Juno’s range by 10 meters… that range nerf was wayyyy too high
Hog and orisa in gold-plat are super strong, most players Don't know how yo use zen and focus on zen targets so they destroy in the nid ranks
Any hero that can't play on the front line or requires a lot of communication and teamwork is bad outside of high tiers.
Where I in Plat, Orissa is an absolute menace.
doing a hero tier list after not even playing the new patch for a day is wild... everything for the clicks i guess.
Orisa in D is kinda crazy tbh put good list
Ram is WAY worse against brig, he used to kill her in 4 punches, now he kills her in 6
The best are the ones you like to play and the worst are the ones you don’t like to play. It’s that simple.
Those only playing meta heroes, just looking for easy wins are why games like this can be so boring.
I’ve been one tricking rein this season and went up two ranks 😮
sombra has an honest kit now
Sombra was oppressive AF before. She needs to stay out of meta. The RAM Nerf is uncalled for and makes him like a glass cannon now vs a brawler. Ball needs 15 more bullets in his gun because he's just not viable with some much counterplay.
Mauga needs to be able to ignite shields, Rein is just braindead power crept
Solo que as healer made me uninstall last season. Haven’t played in yeaaaars. My brig and Ana were real good, but the second someone dies it’s my fault…. Not the fact that they run into enemy fire alone and I tell them not to
Regardless of whether Sombra is good or bad, it's no longer fun.
I've heard from pro's that they're all playing orisa right now, how can freedo put her so low? lmao
He says multiples times in this video and in ALL his tierlist videos that he ranks for the average tier of play, not the “pros”. And when you say pros I think you just mean T500s/GMs bc the pros literally never play Orisa lol
@@LaiLai-2111 One tournament they either only played JQ or Orisa lmao
@@LaiLai-2111You haven’t watched a single pro game for 2 months then. Orisa is on literally every single pro match because of the Juno/Brig backline. On maps without good high ground she’s HARD meta
@@nowun6043 Oh fair enough then
great work as always
I can't speak for everyone, but I sure do miss the Freedo streams!
had to sell widow skins sombra just didnt need perma invis that was really it.
we are legit in an orisa meta rn. How is she in C?
Orisa meta? Maybe in bronze lol, she is definitely the least threatening tank on the roster rn
@@FlyinTools orisa is meta in OWCS. She is THE high rank meta tank
love having my top 6 heroes all below A tier
the tierlist is wrong in like every way dw.
And keep Sombra there forever. She's the most 'no-fun' character.
Didn’t mercy’s win rate go down? I’m a mercy main(not player) and I can barely win on her
In OQ Comp, rein is THE WALL
MERCY A TIER??
I know it's wild. 😅
torb mains where ya’ll at?!!!
ROCK AND STONE BROTHER!
I'd swap Doom and Orisa in your list, Orisa is just too easy to play and too easy to get any value
i mean dooms really good rn im a doom one trick hes a lot better this season prolly cause two big counters are nerfed meaning by cass and sombra
Bro i don't, i play in plat, and for me, orisa is pretty strong, maybe not a S or A tier, but a B at least
i see why u put rein in S tier for the average player, but me trying to play rein in top500 is still terrible (better than last 4 seasons tho)
Orisa is a low A for me. She’s been creeping back up smh
Put Ball at S tier. Not that he's good, but because I hate him and I don't want to have him on my team, go against him, or see him get buffed.
"Fuck it, we Ball"
Why is every tier list I see completely different I don't believe anyone at this point.
Bro just gaslighted rein and queen into the top tiers. Queen is really bad now, you get burst down so easily as its a ranged meta. Doom is very good though, you can bypass the dive tanks and the brawly ones like mauga and rein
What do you mean wrecking ball in C tier?
You forgot Reaper, only reason I clicked on this
He put reaper in A tier but I clicked this for Ashe and he basically talked a ton about support and Tanks and then rushed over dps lol
You have more than half of the heroes in S/A tiers. This a joke?
😅
Glad to see Lifeweaver in B tier.... Buutt for the wrong reason as usual but I digress
I hope blizzard nerf mercy,in low tier mercy is too OP...just make her heal like juno..
Bro looks like the big show
Honestly, Mirrorwatch Sombra is better by far than this version…. And this silly attitude that it’s okay to gutter some characters is a petty and ridiculous attitude Freedo. If you can’t stomach a variety of kits honestly don’t play Overwatch…
Mercy in A tier is crazyyyy lmao her pickrate is the lowest it’s been in a year in GM and she has a negative winrate 💀
😅
Well he said average player not GM....
@@zainyousif7563 shes not good for the average player either lmao. Putting her above Ana and Kiriko is insanity regardless of the rank.
This tear list is a MISS , kiri and ana are both high A, mercy is nowhere near A , bap is S again after the buff, orisa is A idk why shes in C, rein isnt S either especially after the nerf, illari is way off A as well, low B maximum
This tier list is for bronze-plat gameplay only
If you had Orisa down there before today… then OOF 😂 she’s cooked
Yeah this seems about right, but I’ve still been having fun on roadhog with less Anas running around and getting to one shot all these squishies
sym is like A tier ngl
Probably the worst tier least I’ve ever seen. Mercy in A Tier and Orissa in C Tier.
No. Tanks are too strong. I’m tired of games being determined MOSTLY by who has the better tank. (Keyword…mostly! That doesn’t mean the same thing as totally) Dps as a role is too weak and not impactful enough. Unless you’re a sniper landing one shots. (Which were supposed to be removed from the game…but that’s neither here nor there)
Honestly hate the game right now, tanks have too much health and do too much damage. I havnt played this little Overwatch since Overwatch 1.
ORISA IS S TIER
Orisa C tier is crazy
Orisa bro is SS tier