My Worst Client Ever (animation)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 มี.ค. 2018
- This is the story of my first and also worst freelance client.
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I heard a tip once: if a client constantly wants changes, give them a day to forget about it and see if they still remember the request. I only heard this second hand, so test it out.
There's this and asking for a rationale for their ideas and having them send you written copies if ad-libed over the phone (especially true for copy edits).
It could sound like this: that's not a problem, I'll just need a receipt of all these changes via email for the record to ensure that all changes are taken care of. (If outside of project scope/billed time) Just to confirm, these revisions will be billed at $X/hr with a separate invoice as it is outside of the initially agreed upon terms and I just wanted to ensure you're comfortable with the additional charge to your account.
This 100%. You never want to igore a client's ideas, but if you make them document it, it does a bunch of great things: it forces them to think about and refine their ideas, it lets them know that change comes with potential costs, and it ensures that the client cares enough about it to bother with the email in the first place. It's a win all around.
Lastly, it's a record of a revision - highly useful when a week later your client contacts you furious about a typo or change they no longer like and don't want to pay for a fix. I prefer to have all my content delivered in writing for this very reason. It's less a throw it in their face sort of thing so much as it is a precaution.
Make them send EMAILS! "But we agreed on something over phone" doesn't do the job. Talking is easy, writing emails is harder. And they can't argue: "But I didn't want it that way, I wanted it this way."
"Is this your email a week ago?"
"Yes"
"The one that you said you wanted it that way?"
No my client remembered that for a week and keep on sending me 10 same messages every day.
Ha, when he wanted a new invoice you should have put 100 hours and then asked him if he thought the old invoice was reasonable 😂
I like when people commission you and expect the artwork to be free.
Lacklustre Lewis on a further note it is also fun to be asked for Disney quality animation for a 5 minutes video with a staff of 4, turnaround 2 weeks. Ha!
I think I would cry
Lacklustre Lewis or they think they overpaid you.
I did ask that once, I was new and a lot of people who do do free stuff sometimes still called it a commission. Yet I asked upfront if the commission was for money, it was, so I bowed out. I didn't do what some people did and constantly ask for free stuff.
Setting a very strict protocol for meetings and calls with your client is very important, some of this clients (most of them) have no respect at all for the artists/designer's personal time, unless you get them in check.
Also, ask for an advancement at the start of the project, and charge for "extra revisions"; The amount of crap i dodged this way has made the experience almost enjoyable...
“He told me “I believe in you”. I don’t think he believed in me.”
LOVE the story!!!! Great animation brad! 💕😍
Thanks Mauz!
Take this from 18+ years of experience ... for first contact clients, ask for at least 50% up front. Also you said you dont do fixed bids ... you should. Though consider dividing the project into stages and ensure payments and deliverable are resolved at each stage. Payment should always be received prior to handing off final assets. Once you've established a good relationship with them, its good practice to expect payment within 30 days of invoice sent. If they dont pay, I do two things, increase the fee by 10% every week its unpaid .. if not paid within 60 days, tell them your accountant will sell the account to a dept collection agency and any work will be sold off. In my case, illustration work etc .. i tell them it will be added to public stock libraries ... this one tends to prompt a response .. especially with logo and branding designs lol
Aspiring graphic designer here!... Should I follow this advice to a T? I could be wrong, but with previous commissions my appeal with clients was my willingness to negotiate price, although I was young enough to not be bound by things like rent. Is there a way to do what you said without (falsely, I know) giving off the impression that you're a dick (and potentially lose the client)?
Are you responding to my comment or the author of the youtube video? Either way i can give you my view. Every freelance project begins with negotiation of the cost and what you charge really depends on my variables; though its important not to sell yourself short, which happens very often. I tend to have different brackets for different types of clients. I get clients that range from large high profile studios to the guy next door with a bright idea. You have to be conscious that the guy next door wont have the budget of a large studio so you have to feel out where your client exists between those two extremes. Typically the max I charge is $350USD per day. This is actually quite low for what I do (environment artist / concept artist - film/TV) the average is around 500 USD (freelance) However I also take on a lot of smaller projects from the guy next door type; in these instances my approach is simply ask what they can realistically afford for the work. More often than not, this prompts an honest figure that fits within the budget of an average household income, at which point, it becomes a question of; is the work interesting, do i need the cash, is the delivery time reasonable. As for larger clients, every producer will aim to get the work done for the lowest cost possible and in my field; quality often takes a back seat for the right price. What you charge really is a big variable depending on many factors such as your cost of living, location of client, urgency of work and so forth however its worth trying to feel out the average price for your specific field and move up or down from there. Back in my early design days, i charged around 40 GBP per hour when i lived in the UK, that was in the early 2000s. Another note; dont charge by hour. charge by half / full days. ie; 1 day 0.5 day .. in the early days i charged by the hour and had many issues with clients picking apart the time; did you spend 29 minutes on this, or 31 minutes etc .. became crazy. Today, the way i see it is this; you're buying X amount of hours of my time, and not the time it takes to create the product. Anyhow thats a few thoughts :)
As a portraitist, I always ask for deposit beforehand. If clients are reluctant to pay, then I am 10000% better off without them: otherwise, they'd be nightmare clients to work for, be constantly asking for changes and putting you through so much drudgery, and before you know it, they'd aggressively haggle down your prices at the end. Deposits beforehand deter worst clients from hell and I cannot stand hagglers, divas, and other wrong types. In reality, your worst clients are parasites unwilling to pay reasonable fees. Ask for deposit up front.
Agree 100%!
Also don't forget about revisions: they should be allowed, but restricted. Assume that major revisions will require almost starting from scratch, and set some maximum number, perhaps 3: past that, each major revision costs extra, and the previous cost has to be paid/put in an escrow account/whatever. The slowly increasing bill will quickly force self restraint down their throats, or they'll outright abandon the contract (at which point you obviously never work with them again), or you'll have a lot of money without spending time to find more jobs.
Remember that _each revision needs to be done to a single written and signed spec_ ; if they want to tweak things separately then you _can_ give them some additional minor revisions allowance, but what counts as minor needs to be specified explicitly in the contract (if you're working on computer, some color changes could fit the bill, while with e.g. some physical piece some clip-art stickers would be about right; and yes, this is probably a bit _too_ minor, I'm just trying to point in the right direction here), with everything else counting as major. Even then, even minor revisions need a signed document, at least the size of a post-it or something, so that you can pull it out and show it as the spec for a minor revision.
And never forget to follow your own standard contract, so that you'll be able to slowly revise it to better match your personal experience and business style. You'll likely need to tweak it in recognition of project quirks (some detail of a contract might cause something that would normally be a major revision to swap places with a minor revision, just as an example), but just being able to say that this is the standard contract that you use instantly makes it harder for the potential client to oppose, and if they do oppose it (or want to meaningfully change it), then that indicates that they're probably a bad match (unless they're just doing something really weird, in which case you should still focus on _adapting_ your standard contract, but with some extra charge for "adjustment to non-standard conditions" or something: it's probably going to take you a while to get the hang of whatever they're asking for).
I've been there - whew. The thing about art and illustration is it also can make everyone enter a weird head space and the longer the time between start and finish the more likely aching dread can creep in. Now, I tell my students to treat their art as a short order cook would treat their orders rolling in - especially important with the storyboarding students. ;-)
I have a client exactly like this... I already told her... "Don't ever ask me again to work on a page layout book for you... EVER! I will finish this one we are doing now, but from now on, get someone else!"
This happened to me a few times on FIVERR. FIVERR, PEOPLE. I GOT USED AND ABUSED ON FIVERR. Once it was a $5 illustration that I redid about 30 times before realizing I was making about 50 cents an hour, and another time it was doing $5 copy editing for an ENTIRE ebook. Glad I learned to say "no."
I relate so much to this that it hurts, lol. One of my first freelance clients out of college was to design and build a site... And I was not fairly compensated in the least. I've been avoiding websites ever since, my degree is in graphic design and web design intrigued me but it's been nearly 2 years and I've avoided those sorts of projects like the plague.
Natimation Studios there's so much in being a successful designer that they cannot teach in school- managing client relationships, setting boundaries, knowing when and how to teach the client, saying no, handling angry clients without letting it get to you...
I work in a different field but I did a ton of free work when I was starting out because I didn't know how to do otherwise, I relate to what you're talking about. I totally did the thing of working 100 hrs and billing 25 out of sheer fear and inexperience.
Yeah, I've definitely found that I was NOT prepared to handle clients after school. I've had to learn from associates at contract positions. I have no problem with working for free if it's for a charity or something, as long as it's reasonable. But I made the mistake of working for "exposure", or as you said working several hours and logging half out of fear of the client. I've even been scammed because I worked without getting a deposit at the start of a job.
Natimation Studios I've known a handful of people in the creative industries who were great artists, but they never really developed their people skills/business skills and they really suffered for it after a few years. Same with the best musician I've ever known, he had jaw dropping talent but couldn't translate that into a career.
The most successful designer I've ever met is good at design (not knock-your-socks-off good, but absolutely reliable), but good lord her people skills and project management was through the roof. She was managing all of her own clients, getting perfect review scores from clients, building long term relationships. She moved from a large company to a smaller firm that's starting up, and she's just killing it.
It really goes a long way. I don't have any talent for that stuff so it took me a fair amount of painful mistakes before I could reach a passing grade.
wolfumz Yeah, I think my biggest saving grace was a few years worth of experience in customer service while I was in college. I feel like I know how to handle clients to an extent. Once it comes down to me having to say "yes" or really have to put my foot down and say "no"... It's been a struggle. I feel I've been getting better lately at politely declining free work or negotiating deadlines. But fresh out of college me from 2 years ago? That's when the website disaster happened. I definitely agree it's important to have good people skills in this business, especially if you're going to try to work for yourself.
I did some freelance work in college, the client was plucked up from the college (the college did that from time to time) and they said to me, 'hay, you're a web developer! Do this thing!' It wasn't web development work, it was graphic design work. I know my way around photoshop, so I took on the job. (Mistake!) The guy gave me a drawing of what he wanted, and I tried to make a 'digital version' of what I saw. The client was not happy, after going back and fixing it the way he wanted he still wasn't happy. He dropped the project and I never saw a penny. So hours of work kind of gone to waste. Really? I should have just focused on my college course, the extra assignment hours would have really come in handy:)
I mean, I don't doubt it's my fault. So not really a 'horrible client' story:P
Nowadays I do a lot of odd jos fixing people's computers, or giving advice about what kind of computer they should buy. It's not terrible, but not exactly a stable income.
Words cannot express how much I love your videos. I'm not even joking 😉
You should put trigger warnings on your videos. Many designers will die of PTSD because of this one.
I know it's I joke, buy I kinda almost cried lol
Gerardo Diaz ikr
I can’t believe I wanted to design my own website
Yup, I made 3 different psychiatrist appointments in the first 5 minutes of listening...😂
I am one of them! Mini anxiety attack over here watching this!
Hahahaha - it's late at night & I think the whole neighbourhood heard me burst up in laughter! :) Young brad is a lot like young me. Although we're from 2 different countries & 2 different cultures, but seems like bad clients are a shared universal truth!
3:40 Hey, there is a JASON in the twelve months. Never realized that before.
I can relate to parts of this story. Fair warning: Wall of text incoming with my own story.
I'm actually still a student myself, but before Christmas, I made a website for the guy who used to be married to my aunt. One would think being family (or at least formerly being family) might make him want to treat me fairly, but no. It's important to realise, this was more than JUST designing the site. I designed and coded everything from scratch, by myself, for the first time. So all in all, it was a lot of work, well over a hundred hours in the end. From the very beginning of the project, I'd told him that I wasn't comfortable making a proper estimate of how long it would take me to create the website, as I simply didn't have the experience to know how long it would take me, but that I'd basically give him a bit of a discount if it dragged on for too long - call it a maximum limit to the amount I would ask him to pay. I also didn't bug him for a contract (although I know, and knew, I should have), as I trusted that as family(ish), he wouldn't screw me over - if nothing else, then for the fact that his daughters, who brought me the project in the first place, would probably give him hell for it.
What he neglected to tell me was that he had never even considered the possibility of an hourly rate, and wanted to do a fixed price thing.... with the price based on the very lowest, cheapest offers he got on a website where he had put a similar project up for a bidding war. Meaning, he got offers from people who would do nothing but pick a WordPress template and shove his pictures in, only to call it a finished website. These people do no work, and only hope to grab projects by being considerably cheaper than the competition. Let's just say, his other project did not turn out very pretty - however, he was pleased, since he didn't have to pay very much for it at all.
When finally the time came to settle on a price for the massive amounts of work I had done, I asked various friends and family members for advice on pricing. Some of those friends have experience with web design and freelance work, while the family members I asked (including my girlfriend's family) have experience with the job market in general, as well as workers' rights in my country. They all gave me roughly the same estimate - 20 thousand of my local currency, based on a very conservative estimate of the workload spent, or an hourly price I could use for my own price estimation... adding up to 20-23 thousand. The same evening, I got a phone call from my client, during which he said something along the lines of "You understand that you can't ask me for ten thousand or something, right?", in a fairly derogatory tone, talking to me as if I were a child. Which kind of sucked, as, out of respect for him and his preferences for payment (infamous in our family), I was going to ask him for exactly ten thousand. The next day, I got back to him via email, and suggested a price of 8000. Which, honestly, is basically slave wager already. I argued in my email that the work I had done, both the finished product and the workload, were worth twenty thousand or more, and that I was giving him a significant, massive discount.
He got back to me reasonably quickly with his reply: "That's too much. You're getting 5000." It was at this point he told me about how he had never intended to pay more than that amount. Looking back, I think the reason he didn't tell me is he was hoping I would ask for even less.
Massive kick to the balls right there. Not only is he devaluing the amount of work I have done, but also the quality of my work, the value of my time, and our relationship as family(ish). I tried arguing for him to pay what I had initially asked, but he would have none of it. In the end, I ended up just accepting his price, because honestly, I think if I didn't, I wouldn't have gotten anything at all. So... there's my "client from hell" story!
Eivind GJ : The thing to understand about such people is that they really _don't_ save it for strangers, they really are like that all the time. I work in a field with people that might be considered "collateral clients", and their relationship with people has nothing to do with proximity or business, but instead only themselves.
Dear Brad, love your "My Worst Cliet Ever" episode. Hope you could create an episode on how designer should handle their freelance project or handle their clients as to not fall into the same mistake and also "spoiling" the design market. Cant wait to see that. Thks !
Don't Logan Paul me.... HAHAHHAAHHHAHA
lol, didn't notice that one...language barrier... xD
oh shit i think he got demonatized lol
"Don't Logan Paul me" You mean end up as #1 Trending with a dead body in your video? d:
And get little to no repercussions.
That was my favorite part of the whole video.
Great story telling. Funny. Enjoyed this thoroughly. I’m definitely a fan.
This was very funny and educational at the same time! You got a new subscriber! :D
Thank you for the video Brad! I’ve had clients like these and you made it funny to think back on them
Dang, this hits close to home. Thanks for sharing bro, great vid.
Another cool vid. I can relate on too many levels. Setting up my studio a few years ago (after years being on someone else's studios payroll), I think it took the first two jobs before I realised I'd go bust or mad... or both.. if I didn't start charging some percentage up front. Some projects (not all) can really get dragged out for a multitude of reasons. Confirming project scope and getting paid something up front definitely helps maintain some form of zen calm... +1 for the Brad side of the Alpha male table.
“But…I BELIEVE in you!!!”
Oh boy. Yeah, just cause you THINK I can do something doesn’t mean that you know my limits better than I do. If I know I can’t do something, it’s not about “believing in myself”, it means I physically do not have the capability to do this work.
Boy did this video hit home!
I have been doing freelance design work exclusively (graphic, logo, web, photography) for over 25 years. I have made good money at it, but there is nothing "easy" about any of it. I have had over 250 clients (mostly small businesses) during this time and virtually 100% have been "repeat" business (some I have invoiced over $1,000/mo. for over 200 consecutive months!). I also have never spent a dime in advertising or self-promotion, EVERYTHING has come via word-of-mouth with clients sending me other clients - I have never solicited anything - don't even do social media. I am not against that, I just have never had to resort to self-promotion (yet).
That said, I would never recommend what I do or they way I have done it to anyone - you would have to be made of steel and willing/able to go through periods of famine perhaps.
I have never done anything fixed-fee - everything is by the hour. New clients pay an up front deposit depending on scope. I send out invoices the last day of every month OR when any invoice reaches $1,000 (which ever comes first). Out of thousands of invoices, I have only had three that went unpaid.
In my case I have 3 rules when it comes to websites:
(1) Never bid fixed-fee, it is not fair to you or the client. A custom website is "custom" so nobody knows up front what it will take to get an end result. Either the client is going to feel screwed when they can't make unlimited revisions or you get screwed making endless revisions for free at some point. My experience with fixed-fee, is you are just asking for an angry, dissatisfied client - you may get the job and may get paid, but your chances of repeat business or referrals will drastically drop. With fixed-fee, 90% of the time one of the two parties involved will be unhappy in the end. For instance, I could bid say a custom "logo design" for a fixed fee under the condition that the client agrees to accept the first thing I send them, but that never happens. Looking at my invoices over the years, I would say that 75% of my total revenue came from "client revisions" - nothing anyone anticipated at the outset. This is getting even worse. First email, then smart-phones and now social-media have made getting a "custom" job completed to where a client is fully satisfied almost impossible as clients rarely can make a decision on anything without taking a national poll. You are no longer designing for your paying client, you are designing to get a 99% thumbs-up on Facebook. Clients have always had a goal of pleasing as many potential customers as possible, but today they get instant feedback from everyone on social media, 99.9% of which will never spend a penny with your client, but all have an "opinion" that in turn affects how your client "feels" about your design work and the money they spend on it. So more and more, you are designing to please everyone in the world - anything short of that and you client feels taken. Most clients really don't know that you cannot please "everyone" - I have had clients call me wanting to redesign their entire website based on one phone call they got from someone who did not even buy anything from them voicing a stupid uniformed opinion about a design feature! I have had this happen several times! What it tells me more than anything, is that client will not be in business much longer if they are that sensitive and over-reactive.
(2) Never "take over" another existing website (it will many times take you longer to figure out what the last guy did than to start over and do it your way).
(3) Never build a website where the client wants to be able to assume control of content management (i.e, you build it and they take it over). This one is tricky as many sites revolve around this concept of you build a custom template and the customer will take over content management. This may work well for "some" sites/clients, but my personal experience after building a couple Wordpress nightmares and Shopify sites for "small" businesses, is they just did not have the skills, staff or expertise to maintain the sites - therefore they became tech-support nightmares and they expect that support for very little or nothing since they think they already paid you for a functioning "template". I think this will be less prevalent moving forward do to all the DIY solutions out there now like WIX, SquareSpace, etc.Truth be told in retrospect 90% of people asking me to build them a website don't even need one. I talk more clients out of one than into one (unless I see how it will end up making them far more money than the cost of development) - maybe that is why I have so many repeat clients! They are not used to dealing with an advocate in their behalf that treats their spending like it was their own money.
I think we all have this one guy as a client at one point.
I actually had to fire mine. He would call me all day, every day and being low key sexist alpha male wanting to show me how it's done. midway through he decided I had to change personnality and become a manga artist for him.
This is SO true!! What sucks even more is working with a "good client" that holds back pertinent information about their brand -- even when you ask them to share all pertinent information -- just so they can see if you really get what their brand is all about.
I feel your pain. I worked in-house for a print and design company for years. We dealt with a lot of these types of clients and we generally did fixed price work. My boss would kill it before it went on for a whole year, but it could get pretty bad before it died.
Oh glob! These kinds of clients xD please remember to ask for payment upfront! I'm glad you learned your lesson from this
Mari Akutsu how do you ask for upfront payment
Ash B just state the price to the client and tell them how much they need to pay. If you already have a terms and services listed, you should remind the client of it. You can even tell if they are really interested with really treating you right if they really read the list
Edit: I forgot to mention -- I usually don't start my commissions unless they pay first
Oh my gosh ! It's so funny and well done ! Bravo !
Love this video can't wait for your next freelance story
I like this change of direction your videos have got lately. :D
Worst thing a client can do is sending those articles and reference photos and ask you “take reference of” aka copy that, when you’ve spent hours creating a few versions for her to choose from. Thanks to this video I find people facing the same kind of frustration that I do.
This is very relatable. Clients often fall victim to the Dunning-Kruger effect and it's *very* annoying. Having a solid contact and sticking to it from beginning to end is key.
At my job I have a client that feels like this. We won't just shut them down because our reputation is hanging in the balance with it. But they have gone completely out of scope and keep demanding for more things...
What about your BEST client? one day I wanna commission an illustrator for a magazine so tips about giving a good brief and money talk would be awesome, thank you
It's really easy to be a good client. You start off with saying "Here's our rough budget for the project. Here's what we want to accomplish with that budget. How reasonable do you think that is?"
And then if they're like 'Ehhh' you ask "What would our budget need to be to cover our goals? What alternatives are there in the budget?"
And then follow with: "Do you forsee any risks (such as sourcing materials, or their incoming production flow)?"
After they answer all of these questions you make notes, tell them that you'll call them back, and ask a few more designers. Hell, see how much a project consultation would be from someone who has been around for a while and is (realistically) out of your pricerange. You really want to hear from /them/ what sort of schedule and budget this needs and why.
You'll often find that the newer people in the field vastly underestimate time and work requirements to complete tasks. You can't assume each designer has the knowledge of what your job will take.
And if you find out that the project isn't feasible or will cost way more? Plan with that in mind even if you go with the greener designers. Share with them what you've found out and temper expectations for everyone involved.
At least you got this nice story out of it.
I love the music you have on your videos
not an illustrator but have done freelance coding and webdesign projects... vid showed up in recommended.. thoroughly enjoyed.
that was brutal. I love the final email though.
I work at a shipyard building ships, I loved this. New sub!
I write custom erotica, so this resonates with me. There's only one thing worse than a client like this, though, and that's the client who won't give you _any_ guidance at all. They won't tell you whether to write in first person or third person, from whose perspective to tell the story, or even the specific details of their (completely unique) fetish. The whole _point_ of paying a premium to commission a professional writer for custom fiction is having control over the details. More often than not you can tell that these clients are disappointed with the result because they had something very different in their head... but expected you to be able to winkle it out telepathically.
Clients like these are a dime a dozen. Wait til a client tries to sue you and you gotta deal with THAT headfuck.
Awesome video. I protect myself from all of these hurdles. Plus I do flat rate and super invoice those who want crazy revisions.
This was way to close to what I experienced. I did two projects like this. The memories are flooding back in!
This is so great to hear and I think describes how I would act doing freelance work. I'm so meek and feel bad if I cant deliver to expectations so I would end up in some awful situation like this at some point
I feel your pain Bro thats why I subscribed!
Thank you so much for this!
I CAN RELATE! especially on the book covers...
I think that everyone needs to have the most "difficult clients" early in any career. As awful as those people are, they are better at teaching young professionals than any textbook, classroom or office project can.
I can look back at laugh about it now, but there had been times when I would sit under my desk in a fetal position and cry. And cry. And cry. Of course, I was new in the biz, wanted to make a name for myself and figured if I was my usual nice self, people would be nice back. For the most part, they were, I still have clients from my first year and they are wonderful people. It's the very few know-it-alls that use, manipulate, and abuse younger pros because they know they can that really sucked the life and soul out of me. There had been times I almost quit, but I didn't want to let my wonderful clients down. In the end, I think the vampires were mad I didn't give up and break under their pressure. Now, when I see them coming, I have a ball dodging their negativity with a huge smile on my face.
This video was hilarious!
"Don't Logan Paul me! These bodies are just a metaphor...for my career" 😂😂😂
You're getting really good with these animations, Brad! You may have a future in this! ;) I would say that the cartoon was funny, except it's all too true. (Personal note: Do not design for Pakistani t-shirt companies!) LOL
U should do more of these animation
I think you touch upon something most if not every beginning freelance is painfully struggling with. A book on this or something would sell like hot cakes.
This is the very reason I got OUT of web design altogether. It’s a NIGHTMARE. We had this realtor client who asked for a particular design for her website....we made it with all the functionality she asked for...but *every single time* she came in to look at it on our server, she wanted tweaks...and would constantly point out the most insignificant things she wanted changed such as a slightly darker burgundy or a white color that she wanted slightly off-white...and then fonts changes, then photos, then order of pages, then her bio...it was a never-ending ordeal that she paid so little money for, but used up WEEKS of our time. It turned into a completely sour relationship, she ran down the owner of the company, she never was satisfied with the site, and she also wanted it to do some function that was not possible in the realtor business online in 2004 or whatever year this was. I did the copy mostly...and she wanted edits that were so insignificant...she redefined the word A-type personality. The experience was so painful that I never did that kind of work again. And I’ll never do projects where I’m hired to draw or design some graphic...not ever. If I do ever design something for someone, it’s done because I offered for FREE...then I can always say it’s the best I can do...or I can’t work on this any longer. Never had one of those blow up in my face. But I will NOT take paid gigs for design work or technical copy...for anybody. D
I had a client who wanted a website, it was for a complicated topic that my brother and I knew nothing about. But, we knew websites and graphic design so we had it. We easily, should have had it. Like Brad, he wanted a big elaborate intro but was low on funds. So, we told him let's focus on the site and add that in later possible. He was told we need the text content for the website, that was beyond us. So either get a writer or create that himself.
After 4 unneeded meetings and the site was done...... The site's structure was all finished. He never, provided the text. So on the 5th meeting we showed up, didn't even bring the laptop to show him since there was nothing to show. We were entirely waiting on him.
He was furious. "you didn't do anything!? What about the animation! (that he couldn't afford)" we insisted he needed to give us the text and we could not complete the site without it. We, are waiting on you, sir.
Never did I see such a regular looking guy get so irrationally angry. He was so pissed off. So were we since we only got the deposit and certainly went out of our way and wasted our time with so many meetings that fixed nothing.
...Not even the worst client.
This was incredibly insightful. I've had two really bad clients and I can almost take anything like weird demands EXCEPT people yelling at me. These two people began to do this. One woman, a fashion designer, was short-statured and had a low voice and had major issues with people listening to her, especially men, and flipped out because I created a background gradient that using a light gray instead of a medium gray. She threatened to fire and not pay. I got the money and gave a month's advance notice of leaving. Another client, an old-fashioned layout designer for magazines, cursed at me because there was too much padding around the burger menu on the mobile version of a website I created. And I just had to walk on eggshells and give the "sorry I found a day job and am moving to Europe" excuse.
I’m experiencing these same things in my outside work right now! Strikingly similar. I’m glad this is acknowledged as a problem, and it’s not me being petty.
Great story man!
I enjoyed this so much, it was so funny. I'm such a Brad.
same here.Bro.Love you.Really a great fan of you.
I can relate SO MUCH to this with a website project I took on. I was told it was going to be "quick and easy and probably take a week or two." Here I am 11 months later and I'm pounding my head on the wall. I feel your pain.
Your worst ever? This is every client I have ever had!
"Nope I want you to do it, I believe in YOU!" 😂 Bwaaha hahahaa...ugh..waaaaaaa...fml..😭😭😭
This was really funny😂💕
I'm not a designer, but a lot of my best friends are, and i have seen them in your situation, lol that was hard on them
I feel you, so hard. I do managed IT services and tried to start my own company a few years ago and this was 2 out of my 5 clients before I realized it wasn't worth it.
Thats your hardest? Man you have a great life, great video btw.
Some client don't respect your time because they think your work is easy. They need to be told it isn't, once, and if it doesn't sink in they need to be let go.
I’ve got a client like that! I charge them by the hour though. I do a lot of animation for a design studio because they don’t have any internal AE guys. The creative director loves to get his fingers in the pie just as we are going for approval from the client. Big project or little, he gets involved and we go round and round and end up back where we started. Only now, the studio has incurred a boatload of extra charges and has a client who is getting testy about deadlines coming and going. The worst thing is, that the “creative director”, has no idea about motion design. Ugh ... I feel your pain.
Remind me of this terrible client i got that said they wanted me to make a 3d model out of a picture, when i give them the follow up they are asking for something completely different, in the end it got cut
This is magnificent. We can’t stop feeling the reality.
okay so I had a client like that on a video job. except my client wanted to have me ditch the invoice and get nothing. yep. he tried to pull the old 'exposure' trick. and I had been nice enough, cause it was supposed to be a 'non profit' to give him half of what I would have charged for an hourly. so I wrote him a new invoice, for the full rate. He paid the original invoice.
This reminds me of this small gig I have, it I got paid in the end, but next time I'm not doing any favors for friends. This particular person is a TH-camr too
Your worst client, but one of your best videos.
It seems my story 😂! I appreciate this.
This was me starting out and sometimes I still get those clients. I’ve learnt to say no though, if red flags go off in my head I’ll refuse the work even if it is good money because at the end of the day the headache won’t be worth it
This is really helpful I have a client like this right now!
Of course now I want to see the book cover. I wonder if there's a way to search Amazon for exploding fruit covers? :)
Yep. Worked with that guy too. Get this after months of looking for payment. Finally get paid, check bounced. luckily the bank knew him and helped me out....
Fruit exploding =IMGUR fruit being shot by every caliber known to man
I work on the side as a heavy duty truck mechanic which is also my day job.
This older women (owned the truck, didnt drive it) once needed a boost. I told her 50 bucks. One thing led to another and we were doing the batteries, then a new fuse and cable eyelet out in the boonies. No problem, I asked for 75 bucks, more interested in the future customer.
I then write her a safety. I was pretty dam lenient on the safety since I knew she had no money. I had to preform 2 repairs after which I sent her the bill with a breakdown of the price. She shows up the next day with a POST DATED CHEQUE in a sealed envelope. She didn't mention anything about the cheque in person and got her driver to grab the truck. Only after she left did I realize it was post dated and not the right amount. To this day I'm still chasing her for the remainder of that money. The original cheque is for April 15th so we will see if it's any good.
You can't trust old people sometimes. Also my fuck up for trusting her so much I guess
Hey Brad, I love your Style! Can you plz make a course or video about lipp sync?
Great video and funny! Hey out of interest, where do you find most of your clients guys?
Haha. Exactly how my old boss sounds. I presented an idea, and she had THOUGHT of a "better" idea, coming out from MY idea. Hahaha
Loved it! 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👍🏾
AWESOME!!!!!!
Brad becomes Domics. Should we expect a new channel? Bradmics? Bramics?
Jokes aside, another good video. Keep up the good work
Thank for this, brad. Guess every freelancer shares the same story. So many this my older ˋme‘ could have told my younger ˋme‘ ... i will share this thing ;)
I noticed and appreciated the David Thorne spider
Oh I wish I could joke about my work like this. hahaha! I work with patients, not clients.
56 seconds in. already subscribed. this video is awesome
Love this animation😍
but how to find them is still a mystery 😂they sometimes come out of nowhere
This is kind of why I got out of the business, that and GoDaddy. I had a really good client and he sold the business, one meeting with the new owner I saw what was coming and told him I'm not interested and walked out. He didn't seem to care because he had his own ideas. All hand written HTML, JavaScript and Perl code, images painstakingly prepared from less than optimal sources, and he only ever used the images.
Web designing is probably one of the worse jobs ever, mostly because of the clients but also because you're competing with mostly incompetent people.
Richard Gates Yes to this a thousand times over. This type of crap is prevalent in graphic design work at this point, too-so many rubes who think you can design a book/adverts/leadsheets/large format in Word that will actually look professional. Ugh.
Omg I’m so lucky it’s upload after upload after upload for me😂😂
I can relate too much, how about the "Oh can we just get the Photoshop files?" So so often I get this!
What program did you use for this cartoons man? Thanks!
The exact same thing happened to me. But you know, experiences like these do pay well in lesson if not money.
wow it happened to me too, my uncle extreme under paid me by 95%, cant stop telling he got his multi millions, ya right he paid me $160 (include technical translator fees) for a $2000 job. And i spend over 120hours just to "i think its your fault for i giving you the wrong info and start over and i think this company catalog is pretty, can you copy this exactly? the same." which i refuse to copy. Come to my workarea and start micromanage my design over 3 to 4 hours everyday and he none stop vapping, today blue, tomorrow grey, the day after red then blue..., sent me reference, 20+ time wrong info major changes and 4 time complete design changes. Gave me low rest 120px photo, i need to edit, to 500 600px, and "this id old model i dont have new picture can you crop this 20px and put it into 1200px picture?"
after 1 and half week, he happy with the final and did final error check, he paid in cash. "you should be grateful, i paid you so you wont be jobless as freelancer".
fuck off.
2 weeks later after final printing version, he called "its your fault, i want you to change the design now because i think i want change back to original logo instead the one i stole oversea company name and logo."
And he wanted me to made him an ecommerce system webpage estimated at least $100,000 for a price of $360. i rejected, he slap my back with full force and said, "ok then i paid you extra 50buck, you should be grateful i paid you more than any other people outside. and fuck your translator friend over charge me 8000+ technical machinery terms from chinese words to english for $75, i could do it myself". he pick up another company catalog and start doing translation, 2 hours later, he said he finished, ya he just copy the title of each page from another english catalog. A catalog with over 200,000 words translated with less than 50words. bs
i refuse free or retake the changes job cause of his rudeness, he starts yelling at me "you not happy im underpaid you isit?" And repeat said that he a good after sales salesman that why hes a millionaire now. And he goes around bad mouth me that i bad at after sales, wont recommemded me to his friend.
ya i could charge him for $4468.53 for my actual charging rate if hes not my relative. excluded my friend actual $1240.80 translation charges for multiple "i think the wrong page".
lucky i ask him sign the page and with his own writting, he cant argue much bout wrong info he gave us.
the rest all the point you said does happen too.
my worst freelance in my life.
I have no idea where to start with freelancing like Ive got a few friends who do it and they make it sound so easy. Im still also working on a portfolio I just wish I was faster at getting projects done Im very nit picky with my artwork.
Omar Gould same here
may start with fiverr or upwork.
My advise is to post your portfolio in as many places as you can. Have a well written resume even if its just school info and art competitions. Keep track of how long it takes you to do your current art pieces so you have a better idea of what to quote. Keep some sort of online blog or tumblr or whatever with current in progress works that you post in at least once a week. Have a sketchbook you're willing to show clients if applicable ( I got asked this a lot even for 3D animation jobs). If you aren't getting work offers do cheap or free projects for a charity you like or look for art contests. Always include amount of alterations as part of the agreement if its flat-rate. Bands are a good place to find work for and are more open to style often but are also very cheap.
Be aware that in a freelance setting you usually don't have time to make the artwork look perfect. There isn't time to nit-pick and the you might have to scrap everything you've done or the client may think you half finished piece is good enough and use it or they may tell you to do something that looks stupid. Many clients care more about speed and expense of the work than quality or expect both equally.