Strong work. My thinking after seeing all your work, is to put the ultracaps where the stock battery is, and the run a small gauge wire to the lithium battery in the rear. The caps can handle the heat and cold in the engine bay, while the lithium enjoys the more moderate temp of the cabin. The lithium maybe able to be hidden under the dash
On Ebay there is a vendor selling 5 piece strings of "protection boards" at 3.0v; I'm getting them for my supercap battery project. Thanks for posting the update
I tried using this exact battery and similar caps, and the caps kept my car running but the battery's integrated BMS seemed to be preventing it from charging the supercaps or being charged by the alternator. I did leave out the part restricting current between the caps and battery, because I hadn't seen any of your videos before trying this. I wonder if that's enough to have screwed it up.
Hello sir, my scooter has 12v 10ah battery. Im planning to replace that batt to 6 supercaps( series) and put 4 18650(series) lithium ion batt. Then i am going to connect those caps and 18650 into parallel. Is it possible?
OMG! It has a HAMI in it..NICE! So cool...that it instantly cranks...no drag or lugging...just power hammer starts that engine I so need to build me one for my V6 Ford Ranger...down here in TX...batterys last usually about 5 years due to the heat
What about the 1/10 Ohm - 25W resistor. Won't it get hot? I am about to install such a system on my motorcycle gel battery. My motorcycle battery is 12V-7Ah. And I have installed LED lights, whereby the factory charging system won't keep the battery up.
wow, amazing. what about charging the battery and supercapacitors with a 240-watt solar panel and solar panel with MPPT. what size solar panel would charge the supercapacitors quicker.
that is if your actually using them starting a 4 banger is like peddling a bicycle.. come back when you start a diesel engine with it for a few years he only has 240F with that generic bank Divided by the square root x2 in parallel = 240F
@@punker4Real the capacitance of the pack is irrelevant, as it is used for power rather than energy. The supercaps are more powerful than a lead acid battery, the Maxwells that I used can safely deliver several thousand amps without experiencing wear, and orders of magnitude more amperage than a lead acid if shorted. The lithium is used to store energy.
Hello. Waiting for your last report 2021. Thanks!!! Regards from Costa Rica. Hola. Esperando el reporte de este año. Gracias por compartir. Saludos desde Costa Rica.
Tk ! I had connected UCAp Maxwell parallel with battery. (500F 16.2v) I don’t start about 2wweek , went a start, It up to 15.09v and down to 12.6v What is it? And why? Tk
I did not find much in your amazon store. I was wondering if you could tell me or maybe do a video on the battery chargers you use and a suggestion on a recommended premium charger and a budget friendly one. I’m wanting to build a super capacitor battery for my dirt bike and can be used on a ride on lawnmower. These two things are seasonal and I hate having to replace batteries for them.
I have a couple of questions. Maybe you have already answered them in your video series but I watched it a year back for I might have forgotten. Anyway, how much roughly for the cost of building the pack as of 2020? Does it work on cars using EFB batteries that require start/stop function? Also, thanks for such a great project. Waiting for your next year update.
So could you build something like this to replace the batteries in a Hybrid car? Or better yet an electric car. The whole set up would be lighter wouldn't it? I would love to sit down and have a discussion about this. I have been wondering about battery capacitor hybrids for a long time now.
Maybe. These supercapacitors have less than one tenth of the Wh capacity of Lithium batteries of same size. So the vehicle's range would be reduced to 25-30 miles approx. But the supercaps can charge ten times faster too then the lithium batteries.
If it's diesel: totally different story. Not sure about your truck but some have periodic glow plugs and other fancy crap to keep the engine starting in cold temps.
@@xTinBenderX amp clamp it, of it's only a few hundred watts: might be OK. Your alternator should power it without issue. Worse case: build a 4 parallel bank of supercaps and that should do the trick. Judging by your comment and picture: you live somewhere the water is almost always above freezing: so you should be good :D.
I suggest a small capacitor bank .. of at lest 6000F (12volt 2x 3000f )you will still need a small battery buffer like this but i though most diesel run off of 24 volts?
Is it worth it to run the inrush charging through a resistor to slow it (bias a diode to only route charging through the resistor)? Or maybe a buck converter that’s rated for a lower power output?
Just curious about LiPoFE temperature limitations - about every spec I have read claims battery damage when discharged below freezing. Since on one of vids I saw about starting 2-3A battery draw what issues you have had, if any. Likewise for charging at low temps. Why even use a Lithium wouldn't a SLA be as good, less costly, and avoid the temperature issues? Thanks in advance - this was a cool project.
Mad Electron Engineering I'm confused about that configuration tbh. If I understand correctly, the resistor is in series with the battery. Doesn't it get to a "voltage divider" scenario. Assuming an internal resistance of 0.2mOhm, I'd imagine the battery only gets 9.3V out of 14V charging voltage, since 4.7V went to the resistor. Thanks, awesome project though!
I am starting to think this might be a good idea for me. The battery on my 2l Diesel is taking a hit during the lockdown from being idle. I have two spare 14.4v 3.5Ah RC batteries and a spare low Ohms resistor which could do the job of sustaining the car. I have seen some interesting supercap packaged packs on Aliexpress/BangGood.
The author did a video where he reviewed supercaps from China (presumably from AliExpress and the like), the tldr is you need to buy a little more pieces than you need, and test each capacitors for leakage/drain, and capacitance itself, because some of them don't perform like how they're advertised (bad QC).
I've been following this series since the first episode, thank you so much for another update! Big thumbs up! I do have two questions if you care to respond. 1) If I'm using a diesel boat engine, can I, in essence, upscale the LiFePO4 battery to say a 100Ah, and would I need to increase the Super Capacitors capacity to? I.e. a system to ensure you can try and re-start an engine many times over when "stranded" out at sea. As you can imagine, out at sea you need as much capacity as possible to fault find and repair, and that might require many re-starts. 2) Solar power. Could a person reverse engineer this design concept? I.e. have the Super Capacitors IN FRONT of your LiFePO4 battery banks? I.e could you FAST charge the CAPS with the solar panels (Controler/ Charger) equipment, and I guess with a DC to DC converter then trickle charge your LiFePO4 batteries e.g. as the sun dies down for the day, or when you have a break in the cloud cover, potentially expanding the life cycle of your batteries and equipment. Again, thanks for the great content and follow up on your project!
Not the author 1. Technically, you need only need supercaps for cranking. If the cranking fails, you will need to wait for a few seconds/minutes for the supercaps to recharge from the battery, and then you can start cranking again. The way it works is very similar to the "batteryless jump starter" on the market. Larger supercaps would allow you to crank several times without waiting, but it is not necessary. That being said, diesel needs more power to crank, and I'm not able to give you the numbers, unfortunately.
2. Very possible. But I'm not sure the effect when both the solar panel and the alternator are charging the caps/battery. Probably best to have some sort of switch that disconnects the solar panel before starting the engine.
Maybe drains a tiny bit. I left the light on once before I added deep cycles and just had the super caps. At 7 volts, it still started my van, can't do that with lead acid. Van barely cranked, none of the dashboard lights or chime came on, van ran really rough(probably weak spark and low fuel pressure at 7volts). Over the next 30 seconds, the alternator charged the supercaps, the lights started coming on, the idle smoothed out, and the radio powered on. You could literally charge them enough with a 9volt alkaline to jump the engine off
@@theMekanik me too but you can;t even buy them anymore but I found some that are HIGH number of fared for 60$ these are legit big brand name I can't say where or the brand because I don't want others to find out and buy them causing the price to increase significantly :( but i do plan to release the name and how to get them after i buy a few units for my self first
Hi I'm a new subscriber...it's ok sir lithium posphate battery combine with supercaps...it did not burn for how many months you use it,..cause my friend hi burn his alternator...thank you for understanding...hope you reply
You've probably been asked this before, but why didn't you parallel each pair of (side-by-side) caps? That should result in less variation, since you are then averaging two caps. It would make discharge current sharing better too. Using the full resolution of your meter, the initial "at rest" measurements were: Delta-V of top row: 0.049V Delta-V of bottom row: 0.052V If side-by-side caps were paralleled (then in series), the Delta-V would be less than 0.046V In the "while charging" test, they were: Delta-V of top row: 0.041V Delta-V of bottom row: 0.050V If paralleled: less than 0.0405V (to get the "paralleled" results, I averaged side-by-side cap voltages to find the "theoretical" Delta-V. The actual results would be "less than" the results I gave, because they would be constantly paralleled, sharing load and charge all the time... not just "after the fact" like in this math)
I thought about doing this but only stopped since I don't have a viable way to solder or spot weld between the two bus bars of each cap. If you have any ideas I'm all ears.
If I remember, the welded bars are pretty thick, right? Make a set of four alum. cross-bars with 2-3 small holes at each end, use them as drill guides, then use short self-tapping or thread-rolling machine screws. These do not have to be extremely thick plates or large screws (#8-#10 or 4-5mm) since the majority of the current flows through the series connections, not these individual parallel connections.
On another note. How long are you going to keep this setup? As long as it will start your car? I'm curious about this from a cost savings standpoint - decent lead/acid batteries have gotten so expensive, you can't hardly buy one for less than $100 anymore. A really nice one like an AGM is more in the 150-250 range depending on brand. I guess I need to go back and see the multiple videos you put together on the initial build of the hybrid unit. 3rd thing - I see from your plates that you live in Oregon. I was born and raised in Oregon, in the Willamette Valley, it's a pretty mild climate. I've been living in Texas for a while now, and the heat is brutal on car batteries. They definitely don't last as long as I was used to before I moved down here. The heat does the damage and then the first time it gets cold in the fall, you get the click click click when the battery flatlines. I'm wondering how well the capacitors and the battery you use would hold up. I'm sure sitting in traffic with the AC on and 100+ temps, the underhood temperatures in the typical car get pretty high.
Not the author, but I think it would be a good idea to add a fan if you're using it in hotter climates, and a heater in colder climates. You could use a temperature-controlled circuit (plenty of TH-cam videos for that), or go brute-force with powering the fan/heater with the ACC signal of the car. That being said, LiFePO4 is extremely safe (but expensive, and the voltage is lower), unlike the cells that sometimes bloat on laptops and phones.
Couple reasons, one is that lead acid batteries have spectacularly boring failure modes, the other is that liFePO4 batteries cant be charged below freezing which complicates things
it can be done srs but unless your solar bank is low voltage you would need a crap load to get the right voltage , unless you can find them stupid cheap it is not viable . cost wise.. could use it as a buffer to prevent surges to the battery,, like a 12v or 24v setup most solar setups are 48volts you would need a bank of them to get any good results it would cost 5 figures or more ...
Punker4Real I agree with you, trying to use capacitors as batteries is not very cost effective - not sure why people keep thinking they are a simple interchangeable part. Yes theMekanik, you can store equivalent amounts of energy in either, however, cost is going to be a major factor in the decision as 'Punker pointed out. Capacitors are great for short duration, high current demand, fast recovery applications; Batteries are great for long duration lower demand situations regarding overall material cost. Don't be faked out by Car starting applications using Capacitors - know and understand what a Kilowatt Hour actually represents - Volts*Amps*Time. Let's take a very simple example - I only *need* an average of 100Watts, not much right - so lets multiply that by 12 Hours - holy crap - that's 1.2KW capacity!! I can barely get that out of a 12V 100Ah LiPoFE battery (1.2KWH ie. 12V*100A*12h) and only if I ignore the 10-20% reserve (to get a large number of charge cycles) and don't include inverter power loss (the very best are only 85-90% efficient). Where is my free lunch!!/??!! I can start my car on 30 or so SC's, so what's up?? What's missing is time; the ignition key turned for only 3-4 seconds... bummer. Here is where the free lunch gets expensive very quickly: As far as "front-ending" for the batteries, which I assume the goal is to capture every solar coulomb, the effectiveness depends where the capacitors reside in the circuit - before the charger, or on the battery side. Scenario A: If it is the battery side then it doesn't matter because the solar charger either passes every electron available or it doesn't - in either case the capacitor isn't doing anything essential to capture energy (yes it will buffer the demand peaks on the battery, but can only pass what it has already stored which is what the battery has already stored, it isn't creating energy and only adds minimal additional capacity). And don't forget how many SC's you will need per the battery bank voltage. Scenario B: 1) Responsiveness to fluctuations of the solar charger (requires research between various models, if it is fast the capacitors don't get you anything because it has already passed what can be passed, if it is slow then a decision needs to be made about how this slowness affects the system charging), Then addressing what your max solar array output voltage will be as this is highly variable depending on clouds passing over vs daylight strength / incident angle, etc. to properly size the capacitor string max voltage. This dramatically affects cost because a high voltage (~60V) (the video used 30 SC's for ~14V), 60V would require 5 times more capacitors or 150+. Lower voltage arrays are ~18V so you still need 7 strips (35) and associated boards and parts cost. Either Solar Scenario array could be 1KW, but it is still Amps * Voltage and most installations actually use 48V batteries requiring 60-70V solar array wiring (this is to reduce wire cost, voltage drop / system power loss). Using capacitors for a solar application is likely to get you nothing more than unnecessary system complexity, cost, and ultimately lower reliability. If you want to power a transistor radio from a small solar array it might make sense from a weight point of view, but if your are talking about continuous power delivery requirements for non daylight durations (100-200 watts aka 1-2KWH for overnight) batteries are the way to go. Will Prowse, or I don't have anything against SC's but just as with batteries and voltage choices they do require in depth consideration where it makes sense and can be justified, not because one way works and the other doesn't, or lacks some cool factor.
punker4Real I am talking about using them as a buffer for high current draw “peaks” when you turn your welder on to do a small fix, or a micro wave over that you only run for let’s say 5 mins, or an on demand water heater. Use a transfer switch to transfer between batteries 🔋and super caps so there isn’t any losses for trying to store the power in them for longer that a 24 hour period. From what I understand there is a 10-20% charge loss every 24 hours. Like I said let the batteries do the Storage and let the Super Capacitors take the heavy cycles, and Surges in power. The amp draw on a car battery starting with super capacitors is only 2.4 to 3 amps while turning the engine over, the super capacitors are taking the majority of the work.
I have a quick question regarding how you chose the current limiting resistor: 1) How did you come to the value of 0.1 Ohms? Did you use V = I * R? (V = 14.6 volts , I = max current ) I am trying to build a similar setup using a 6 A*hr lifepo4 with a max discharge current of 6 amps. (www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07Q7FY8CC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1). Would the resistor spec'd be 14.6 volts / 6 amp = 2.43 Ohms? Thanks.
The calculation is a little complicated but still basic. Max battery current is 6 A. For capacitors, the crank V drop is about 12.5-11.5= 1 V. 1V/6A=0.17 Ohm (battery to capacitor). The pulse current is 20 A, Thus any resistor about 0.2 Ohm is safe for a 12V Li battery-cap combination. Yet the bigger of the resistor, the prolonged life for the battery. As a consequence, the more time for the generator to charge up the capacitors (battery or generator). In case of failed crank (no recharging from the engine), multiple attempts must be considered. The crank time is 1-3s, mostly 1.5-2.5S. One crank for a 4 cylinder car consumes 0.8-1.4 kJ. An 83.3 F serial capacitor is about 3-5 cranks( the voltage of cap may as low as 9.5 volt). In order to restore the energy in a short time (say 5 min), the resistor must be as less as possible. V drop is 12.5 - 9.5 =3V, whole process averagely 1.5V. 1400 J *3 crank/ 5min/60s/1.5V= 9.3 A >6A. Thus 0.17Ohm is not small enough. Because multi-cranks is not often, one 0.1 or 0.2 Ohm resistor is a good choice both for battery life or multiple cranks. With resistance, max current, the resistor is 0.1 Ohm, * 20 A = 2 W.
Breeze li I'm also confused that he configured the battery and the resistor in series. Don't you get the "voltage divider" scenario? Assuming the battery internal resistance of around 0.2mOhm, the battery would only get 9.3V out of 14V charging voltage, since 4.7V went to the resistor?
Breeze li my car is a six-cylinder that needs 7 cranks to start (7 "reek" sounds), does that mean I'd need double the capacitor amount? Also I see that he has 2 strings of capacitors, so I'd imagine he would have around 150-200F?
Plenty of aftermarket "voltage stabilizer" consist of a series of capacitors, but they're usually around 0.01 to 0.1F, so they barely help at all when cranking. Their purpose is more of a "running" or "smoothing" capacitors for sudden load.
@@madelectronengineering I'm sure it does, I'm on my 3rd Korean car and my current one makes more noise than yours on a cold morning. It's a 2012 Sonata. The 1 year review, yours seemed unusually quiet.
Strong work. My thinking after seeing all your work, is to put the ultracaps where the stock battery is, and the run a small gauge wire to the lithium battery in the rear. The caps can handle the heat and cold in the engine bay, while the lithium enjoys the more moderate temp of the cabin. The lithium maybe able to be hidden under the dash
Thanks for the efforts and Time on keeping us updated with your project... Long live
On Ebay there is a vendor selling 5 piece strings of "protection boards" at 3.0v; I'm getting them for my supercap battery project. Thanks for posting the update
Just make sure your supercaps you attach to the protection board are also rated for 3v per cap.
Love it, planning to a little brother hybrid battery for an EV. Your work is incredibly valuable to reference, thanks for sharing
I tried using this exact battery and similar caps, and the caps kept my car running but the battery's integrated BMS seemed to be preventing it from charging the supercaps or being charged by the alternator. I did leave out the part restricting current between the caps and battery, because I hadn't seen any of your videos before trying this. I wonder if that's enough to have screwed it up.
Hello sir, my scooter has 12v 10ah battery. Im planning to replace that batt to 6 supercaps( series) and put 4 18650(series) lithium ion batt.
Then i am going to connect those caps and 18650 into parallel. Is it possible?
Happy new year! Great update on your awesome project.
OMG! It has a HAMI in it..NICE!
So cool...that it instantly cranks...no drag or lugging...just power hammer starts that engine
I so need to build me one for my V6 Ford Ranger...down here in TX...batterys last usually about 5 years due to the heat
What about the 1/10 Ohm - 25W resistor. Won't it get hot? I am about to install such a system on my motorcycle gel battery. My motorcycle battery is 12V-7Ah. And I have installed LED lights, whereby the factory charging system won't keep the battery up.
wow, amazing.
what about charging the battery and supercapacitors with a 240-watt solar panel and solar panel with MPPT. what size solar panel would charge the supercapacitors quicker.
The datasheet on the Maxwell's is 20% capacity degredation after 10 years at 80°C and 1,000,000 duty cycles, IIRC. Should out-last the car
that is if your actually using them starting a 4 banger is like peddling a bicycle..
come back when you start a diesel engine with it for a few years he only has 240F with that generic bank
Divided by the square root x2 in parallel = 240F
@@punker4Real the capacitance of the pack is irrelevant, as it is used for power rather than energy.
The supercaps are more powerful than a lead acid battery, the Maxwells that I used can safely deliver several thousand amps without experiencing wear, and orders of magnitude more amperage than a lead acid if shorted.
The lithium is used to store energy.
these are NOT maxwells silly they are from "amazon"
@@punker4Real Maxwell has a start battery for Class 8 trucks. It costs around $900. The principles are the same at a larger scale.
Hello. Waiting for your last report 2021. Thanks!!! Regards from Costa Rica. Hola. Esperando el reporte de este año. Gracias por compartir. Saludos desde Costa Rica.
I'll do an update to the battery setup in a few weeks, got a lot going on right now.
You win the Best DIY on this one.
Thank you for doing a follow up. Can you not drill a few drain holes at the bottom to keep it dry?
If the 10ah 12v lifepo4 was flat, how many amps would it pull from the car's ~14.4v supply?
Tk !
I had connected UCAp Maxwell parallel with battery. (500F 16.2v)
I don’t start about 2wweek , went a start, It up to 15.09v and down to 12.6v
What is it? And why?
Tk
I have a V8 engine I can put it in if you want to do a test and evaluation?
Looks the alternator is disconnected from the battery so that no charging activity is performed while driving. Is that correct?
I did not find much in your amazon store. I was wondering if you could tell me or maybe do a video on the battery chargers you use and a suggestion on a recommended premium charger and a budget friendly one. I’m wanting to build a super capacitor battery for my dirt bike and can be used on a ride on lawnmower. These two things are seasonal and I hate having to replace batteries for them.
I have a couple of questions. Maybe you have already answered them in your video series but I watched it a year back for I might have forgotten. Anyway, how much roughly for the cost of building the pack as of 2020? Does it work on cars using EFB batteries that require start/stop function? Also, thanks for such a great project. Waiting for your next year update.
It was a great lesson, thanks from Rome
So could you build something like this to replace the batteries in a Hybrid car? Or better yet an electric car. The whole set up would be lighter wouldn't it? I would love to sit down and have a discussion about this. I have been wondering about battery capacitor hybrids for a long time now.
Maybe. These supercapacitors have less than one tenth of the Wh capacity of Lithium batteries of same size. So the vehicle's range would be reduced to 25-30 miles approx. But the supercaps can charge ten times faster too then the lithium batteries.
Hi there, any update for Dec 2020. Also how many CCA is this setup capable of. Also with the battery low AH how long can you listen to the radio.
It's is a great project. I am just wondering if there is a way to some supercap and add on to my existing lead acid battery to lengthen its lifespan?
Hello, sir, Please share the 3rd year test Please share the review
It's already up, check my channel.
Wanna make one of these for my 2004.5 Cummins powered Ram, but have no idea where to start. I think it needs 700 amps to crank though?
If it's diesel: totally different story. Not sure about your truck but some have periodic glow plugs and other fancy crap to keep the engine starting in cold temps.
@@jamess1787 Good point. No glow plugs, but it does have a grid heater that has a pretty big draw. Not how how much though.
@@xTinBenderX amp clamp it, of it's only a few hundred watts: might be OK. Your alternator should power it without issue. Worse case: build a 4 parallel bank of supercaps and that should do the trick. Judging by your comment and picture: you live somewhere the water is almost always above freezing: so you should be good :D.
I suggest a small capacitor bank .. of at lest 6000F (12volt 2x 3000f )you will still need a small battery buffer like this but i though most diesel run off of 24 volts?
punker4Real how much capacitance do I need for a 3L petrol car? Would be amazing if you also include the calculation. Thanks!
Is it worth it to run the inrush charging through a resistor to slow it (bias a diode to only route charging through the resistor)? Or maybe a buck converter that’s rated for a lower power output?
Just curious about LiPoFE temperature limitations - about every spec I have read claims battery damage when discharged below freezing. Since on one of vids I saw about starting 2-3A battery draw what issues you have had, if any. Likewise for charging at low temps. Why even use a Lithium wouldn't a SLA be as good, less costly, and avoid the temperature issues? Thanks in advance - this was a cool project.
Great follow up !
Looks great, how is the resistor hooked up to the lithium battery and capacitor bank? I see that the lithium battery has a BMS for some protection.
Resistor is hooked in on the positive side between the supercaps and the battery.
@@madelectronengineering does it matter if its on the positive or negative side?
Mad Electron Engineering I'm confused about that configuration tbh. If I understand correctly, the resistor is in series with the battery. Doesn't it get to a "voltage divider" scenario. Assuming an internal resistance of 0.2mOhm, I'd imagine the battery only gets 9.3V out of 14V charging voltage, since 4.7V went to the resistor. Thanks, awesome project though!
im waiting for new information about this
I am starting to think this might be a good idea for me. The battery on my 2l Diesel is taking a hit during the lockdown from being idle.
I have two spare 14.4v 3.5Ah RC batteries and a spare low Ohms resistor which could do the job of sustaining the car.
I have seen some interesting supercap packaged packs on Aliexpress/BangGood.
The author did a video where he reviewed supercaps from China (presumably from AliExpress and the like), the tldr is you need to buy a little more pieces than you need, and test each capacitors for leakage/drain, and capacitance itself, because some of them don't perform like how they're advertised (bad QC).
wow amazing, can i buy one from you, i am too lazy to build one ?
I've been following this series since the first episode, thank you so much for another update! Big thumbs up!
I do have two questions if you care to respond.
1) If I'm using a diesel boat engine, can I, in essence, upscale the LiFePO4 battery to say a 100Ah, and would I need to increase the Super Capacitors capacity to? I.e. a system to ensure you can try and re-start an engine many times over when "stranded" out at sea. As you can imagine, out at sea you need as much capacity as possible to fault find and repair, and that might require many re-starts.
2) Solar power. Could a person reverse engineer this design concept? I.e. have the Super Capacitors IN FRONT of your LiFePO4 battery banks? I.e could you FAST charge the CAPS with the solar panels (Controler/ Charger) equipment, and I guess with a DC to DC converter then trickle charge your LiFePO4 batteries e.g. as the sun dies down for the day, or when you have a break in the cloud cover, potentially expanding the life cycle of your batteries and equipment.
Again, thanks for the great content and follow up on your project!
Not the author
1. Technically, you need only need supercaps for cranking. If the cranking fails, you will need to wait for a few seconds/minutes for the supercaps to recharge from the battery, and then you can start cranking again. The way it works is very similar to the "batteryless jump starter" on the market. Larger supercaps would allow you to crank several times without waiting, but it is not necessary. That being said, diesel needs more power to crank, and I'm not able to give you the numbers, unfortunately.
2. Very possible. But I'm not sure the effect when both the solar panel and the alternator are charging the caps/battery. Probably best to have some sort of switch that disconnects the solar panel before starting the engine.
from Thailand love your videos
What would happen if you leave it sit for 1 month without charging???
Maybe drains a tiny bit. I left the light on once before I added deep cycles and just had the super caps. At 7 volts, it still started my van, can't do that with lead acid. Van barely cranked, none of the dashboard lights or chime came on, van ran really rough(probably weak spark and low fuel pressure at 7volts).
Over the next 30 seconds, the alternator charged the supercaps, the lights started coming on, the idle smoothed out, and the radio powered on.
You could literally charge them enough with a 9volt alkaline to jump the engine off
Special EDy nice I would like to to put one in my 🚗
@@theMekanik me too but you can;t even buy them anymore but I found some that are HIGH number of fared for 60$ these are legit big brand name I can't say where or the brand because I don't want others to find out and buy them causing the price to increase significantly :( but i do plan to release the name and how to get them after i buy a few units for my self first
Hi I'm a new subscriber...it's ok sir lithium posphate battery combine with supercaps...it did not burn for how many months you use it,..cause my friend hi burn his alternator...thank you for understanding...hope you reply
Do you have a address I can ask some questions?
If the car alternator failed, how far the car can go become coming to a complete stop?
it would go until the petrol ran out with no battery attached.
@ how it will get the spark ?
less far than with a classic car battery if my logic is correct
You've probably been asked this before, but why didn't you parallel each pair of (side-by-side) caps? That should result in less variation, since you are then averaging two caps. It would make discharge current sharing better too.
Using the full resolution of your meter, the initial "at rest" measurements were:
Delta-V of top row: 0.049V
Delta-V of bottom row: 0.052V
If side-by-side caps were paralleled (then in series), the Delta-V would be less than 0.046V
In the "while charging" test, they were:
Delta-V of top row: 0.041V
Delta-V of bottom row: 0.050V
If paralleled: less than 0.0405V
(to get the "paralleled" results, I averaged side-by-side cap voltages to find the "theoretical" Delta-V. The actual results would be "less than" the results I gave, because they would be constantly paralleled, sharing load and charge all the time... not just "after the fact" like in this math)
I thought about doing this but only stopped since I don't have a viable way to solder or spot weld between the two bus bars of each cap. If you have any ideas I'm all ears.
If I remember, the welded bars are pretty thick, right? Make a set of four alum. cross-bars with 2-3 small holes at each end, use them as drill guides, then use short self-tapping or thread-rolling machine screws. These do not have to be extremely thick plates or large screws (#8-#10 or 4-5mm) since the majority of the current flows through the series connections, not these individual parallel connections.
Thank you for the idea.
How has this effect the mileage any improvements or decrease?
Neither.
Hi friend, did you have any balancing problems with the super capacitors?
On another note. How long are you going to keep this setup? As long as it will start your car? I'm curious about this from a cost savings standpoint - decent lead/acid batteries have gotten so expensive, you can't hardly buy one for less than $100 anymore. A really nice one like an AGM is more in the 150-250 range depending on brand. I guess I need to go back and see the multiple videos you put together on the initial build of the hybrid unit.
3rd thing - I see from your plates that you live in Oregon. I was born and raised in Oregon, in the Willamette Valley, it's a pretty mild climate. I've been living in Texas for a while now, and the heat is brutal on car batteries. They definitely don't last as long as I was used to before I moved down here. The heat does the damage and then the first time it gets cold in the fall, you get the click click click when the battery flatlines. I'm wondering how well the capacitors and the battery you use would hold up. I'm sure sitting in traffic with the AC on and 100+ temps, the underhood temperatures in the typical car get pretty high.
Not the author, but I think it would be a good idea to add a fan if you're using it in hotter climates, and a heater in colder climates. You could use a temperature-controlled circuit (plenty of TH-cam videos for that), or go brute-force with powering the fan/heater with the ACC signal of the car.
That being said, LiFePO4 is extremely safe (but expensive, and the voltage is lower), unlike the cells that sometimes bloat on laptops and phones.
Great work
Hi Mark, good day. May I know how much would it cost me to build this kind of brilliant work? Thanks in advance. I'm from Philippines.
So.... Why are car manufacturers not installing these in vehicles?
Couple reasons, one is that lead acid batteries have spectacularly boring failure modes, the other is that liFePO4 batteries cant be charged below freezing which complicates things
Super 👍
🤗 another big LIKE 👍 Thank you 🥳
Put a 10 watt solar panel on car to keep up voltage for ever.
Would be nice if #WillProwse would put these in his Solar Setups some how.
it can be done srs but unless your solar bank is low voltage you would need a crap load to get the right voltage , unless you can find them stupid cheap it is not viable . cost wise.. could use it as a buffer to prevent surges to the battery,, like a 12v or 24v setup most solar setups are 48volts you would need a bank of them to get any good results it would cost 5 figures or more ...
Punker4Real I agree with you, trying to use capacitors as batteries is not very cost effective - not sure why people keep thinking they are a simple interchangeable part. Yes theMekanik, you can store equivalent amounts of energy in either, however, cost is going to be a major factor in the decision as 'Punker pointed out. Capacitors are great for short duration, high current demand, fast recovery applications; Batteries are great for long duration lower demand situations regarding overall material cost.
Don't be faked out by Car starting applications using Capacitors - know and understand what a Kilowatt Hour actually represents - Volts*Amps*Time. Let's take a very simple example - I only *need* an average of 100Watts, not much right - so lets multiply that by 12 Hours - holy crap - that's 1.2KW capacity!! I can barely get that out of a 12V 100Ah LiPoFE battery (1.2KWH ie. 12V*100A*12h) and only if I ignore the 10-20% reserve (to get a large number of charge cycles) and don't include inverter power loss (the very best are only 85-90% efficient).
Where is my free lunch!!/??!! I can start my car on 30 or so SC's, so what's up?? What's missing is time; the ignition key turned for only 3-4 seconds... bummer.
Here is where the free lunch gets expensive very quickly:
As far as "front-ending" for the batteries, which I assume the goal is to capture every solar coulomb, the effectiveness depends where the capacitors reside in the circuit - before the charger, or on the battery side.
Scenario A:
If it is the battery side then it doesn't matter because the solar charger either passes every electron available or it doesn't - in either case the capacitor isn't doing anything essential to capture energy (yes it will buffer the demand peaks on the battery, but can only pass what it has already stored which is what the battery has already stored, it isn't creating energy and only adds minimal additional capacity). And don't forget how many SC's you will need per the battery bank voltage.
Scenario B:
1) Responsiveness to fluctuations of the solar charger (requires research between various models, if it is fast the capacitors don't get you anything because it has already passed what can be passed, if it is slow then a decision needs to be made about how this slowness affects the system charging), Then addressing what your max solar array output voltage will be as this is highly variable depending on clouds passing over vs daylight strength / incident angle, etc. to properly size the capacitor string max voltage. This dramatically affects cost because a high voltage (~60V) (the video used 30 SC's for ~14V), 60V would require 5 times more capacitors or 150+. Lower voltage arrays are ~18V so you still need 7 strips (35) and associated boards and parts cost.
Either Solar Scenario array could be 1KW, but it is still Amps * Voltage and most installations actually use 48V batteries requiring 60-70V solar array wiring (this is to reduce wire cost, voltage drop / system power loss). Using capacitors for a solar application is likely to get you nothing more than unnecessary system complexity, cost, and ultimately lower reliability.
If you want to power a transistor radio from a small solar array it might make sense from a weight point of view, but if your are talking about continuous power delivery requirements for non daylight durations (100-200 watts aka 1-2KWH for overnight) batteries are the way to go.
Will Prowse, or I don't have anything against SC's but just as with batteries and voltage choices they do require in depth consideration where it makes sense and can be justified, not because one way works and the other doesn't, or lacks some cool factor.
punker4Real I am talking about using them as a buffer for high current draw “peaks” when you turn your welder on to do a small fix, or a micro wave over that you only run for let’s say 5 mins, or an on demand water heater. Use a transfer switch to transfer between batteries 🔋and super caps so there isn’t any losses for trying to store the power in them for longer that a 24 hour period. From what I understand there is a 10-20% charge loss every 24 hours. Like I said let the batteries do the Storage and let the Super Capacitors take the heavy cycles, and Surges in power. The amp draw on a car battery starting with super capacitors is only 2.4 to 3 amps while turning the engine over, the super capacitors are taking the majority of the work.
I have a quick question regarding how you chose the current limiting resistor:
1) How did you come to the value of 0.1 Ohms? Did you use V = I * R? (V = 14.6 volts , I = max current )
I am trying to build a similar setup using a 6 A*hr lifepo4 with a max discharge current of 6 amps. (www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07Q7FY8CC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1).
Would the resistor spec'd be 14.6 volts / 6 amp = 2.43 Ohms? Thanks.
The calculation is a little complicated but still basic. Max battery current is 6 A. For capacitors, the crank V drop is about 12.5-11.5= 1 V. 1V/6A=0.17 Ohm (battery to capacitor). The pulse current is 20 A, Thus any resistor about 0.2 Ohm is safe for a 12V Li battery-cap combination. Yet the bigger of the resistor, the prolonged life for the battery. As a consequence, the more time for the generator to charge up the capacitors (battery or generator). In case of failed crank (no recharging from the engine), multiple attempts must be considered. The crank time is 1-3s, mostly 1.5-2.5S. One crank for a 4 cylinder car consumes 0.8-1.4 kJ. An 83.3 F serial capacitor is about 3-5 cranks( the voltage of cap may as low as 9.5 volt). In order to restore the energy in a short time (say 5 min), the resistor must be as less as possible. V drop is 12.5 - 9.5 =3V, whole process averagely 1.5V. 1400 J *3 crank/ 5min/60s/1.5V= 9.3 A >6A. Thus 0.17Ohm is not small enough. Because multi-cranks is not often, one 0.1 or 0.2 Ohm resistor is a good choice both for battery life or multiple cranks. With resistance, max current, the resistor is 0.1 Ohm, * 20 A = 2 W.
Breeze li I'm also confused that he configured the battery and the resistor in series. Don't you get the "voltage divider" scenario? Assuming the battery internal resistance of around 0.2mOhm, the battery would only get 9.3V out of 14V charging voltage, since 4.7V went to the resistor?
Breeze li my car is a six-cylinder that needs 7 cranks to start (7 "reek" sounds), does that mean I'd need double the capacitor amount? Also I see that he has 2 strings of capacitors, so I'd imagine he would have around 150-200F?
thank youuuuuu 👍
Great videos!
Could one bank of SuperCaps be used in parallel with leadAcid Battery, just to aid the cold starts?
Thank you.
yeah sure the more cranking amps the better the starts
I think it would prolong the life of the lead acid battery
@@jimbo5635 You can increase the life of the battery for 400%
Plenty of aftermarket "voltage stabilizer" consist of a series of capacitors, but they're usually around 0.01 to 0.1F, so they barely help at all when cranking. Their purpose is more of a "running" or "smoothing" capacitors for sudden load.
The engine is clicking more now than it did last year. It was quiet last time.
It goes away after a few minutes of idling.
@@madelectronengineering I'm sure it does, I'm on my 3rd Korean car and my current one makes more noise than yours on a cold morning. It's a 2012 Sonata. The 1 year review, yours seemed unusually quiet.
Super Caps!!!!!
Finalllyyyyy!!!!!
Please do a 5 year test video next month. 😂
battery manufacturers should hate him
First!!! 🤘🏻😎🤘🏻