Thanks for the video. You can buy about 3 of the cheap 500/300 farad caps and end up with 900F for the same price as the Eaton 500/400F. I think that judging/identifying capacitor quality based on their terminal style is a bit unreliable. The terminals don't determine who made it or the quality of that particular series of capacitors. Would have been nice to see the more common Maxwells in the lineup.
Some information you may want to add to your video. Green-Cap is a Korean company. They do not make a 500F in that D cell size. What is happening is Chinese counterfeit companies are dumpster diving old/test failed Green-Cap 400F capacitors. They then put a shiny new 500F label on them so consumers think they are getting more than if a buy a Maxwell or Eaton. One of the tail tail signs is the green 500Fs discharge VERY quickly (not up to specs for even real new Green-Cap) compared to the Eaton and Maxwell. Maxwell is my favorite (all around great quality and good vibration resistance). Eaton is good too and I've used some high quality Nesscap. Take with a grain of salt and be careful where you buy as China is making fake Maxwell and Eatons now too. I made a video using Maxwells to replace a car battery. They are very good capacitors.
Love the video and just subscribed. I have been doing a little testing with the Samwha 500F supercaps and figured most of the same theories you presented. I was planning on doing a similar video one day in the future. I suspect an actual sub-par factory somewhere cranking these out though since there seems to be an unlimited amount available. Anyways, I figure if you learn to make things work using the worst components, then you can maximize your results with the best lol.
Nice Video! Mabye you can blend in a table with the specs and measurements you read from your sheet. That would make it much easier to follow the comparison. Have a nice week :)
Nice video. I made the same mistake and tried to buy those cheap ones. I ran into the same problems you did. Somewhere kind of okay and other ones were totally junk.
Perhaps that cap with the screw terminals had a built in discharge resistor. Did you consider that? Because if they do, then of course, they are not junk. Did they all have a similar self-discharge rate of around 45mA? My guess is that they are good and have discharge resistors built in.
I have a project that requires three 100-120F ELDC supercaps. I'm buying AVX supercaps from Mouser since I can get a reliable, well-documented source chain on parts and the AVX supercaps are all testing within spec. Eaton's supercaps are also solid in terms of getting what you're paying for.
I got the two pin (non screw) 500f capacitors at about 4$ each. Got scratched up and damaged from shipping, so I asked for an exchange. I ended up getting them for free. The balance board (also china made) blew a resistor and doesn't work. Main point: dont expect quality from chinese made super caps and balance boards
Those cheap china ebay caps are junk I have received 12 of them and they were all bad some would lose their voltage in just minutes only 2 of them would hold 50% of its charge after 12 hours
At last a quality comparison video about super cap . I only have Maxwell caps by now but I'm interested in those Eatons.. Also nice to find out that some oriental brands are doing some decent ones. BTW, can you make a direct comparison between Eaton and Maxwell supercaps?
+polik971 thank you for the kind words. I have not played with any maxwell supercaps as of yet but I would surmise they are as good or even slightly better then the Eaton brand.
Thanks for the video. Could you explain how you did the ESR measurement for your capacitors? I have a bunch of those Eaton 400F Caps and they have a DC ESR of around 3.2mOhms which I tested and is the same as on their datasheet. I havent tested at 1kHz though. Those samwha/greencap knockoffs I have a bunch of too but, like you say, are probably the failed 300F versions and they have a DC esr normally above 5 mOhms some much higher. The reason I ask is because the esr is normally much better on those Eaton Supercaps than the Greencaps and hence you get a much higher peak output current etc. Cheers
Very good review! I totally agree: most of the "500F" Supercaps from China, you can buy for around 4 Eur are junk. They are rejected, thrown-out from the 300 or 360F production of Samwha. They only produce one 500F type with snap-in mounting but which is rated at 2.8 nominal voltage - probably much more expansive. They really do cheat a lot, these chinese sellers! I will give mine back and reclaim my money - otherwise you encourage them to do business like this! The smaller capacity isn't the worst in the deal - its that the specs are so much off - you just dont know what you get, but you can be sure, you cant use them in a 6S-pack, because they run out of balance quickly and damage the whole project!
so don't buy the expensive USA made caps buy two and a half times as many China made caps so you have some low quality caps to tinker with. And maybe support a shame resale company because heh let's save a few bucks. Question, did either company warranty there product
Did u able to check what kind electrode (current collector, activated carbon, graphite powder & glue) and ionic liquid the Chinese or Korean used? Thank u.
If I need to buy 10 to get 5 and they only have 3/4 the capacity then they cost the same as the $12 ones, $9 per usable unit for 3/4 the capacity or $12 equivalent for the same capacity.
Can you tear apart that screw terminal one? i have heard sometimes they put smaller caps in larger cans just wondering if that was the case with that one.
DAOKI sells 500F capacitors. I have hand-built them (and it looks so terrible.. worst solder job i've ever done) and yet they work amazing. Tey're $30 for 3x, so $60 + $30 balancing board =
Great video...I honestly value your observations. Any chance u can review Qinfen 3000f supercaps offered on ebay. ? The seller fails to provide any real metrics...only that these caps " are rigorously tested prior to shipment" ... I don't trust unbranded and unreviewed electronics. Thoughts?
I have that exact same question. I actually got one of those and it felt as if the content inside was loose and moving around. So haven't even tested it yet but it could be a poor sample and other units might be acceptable. I may open up the canister and see how it looks on the inside. Not eager to do it, however, if there is something unhappy substance.
Thanks for this. Awesome.Exactly what I was wanting. I just sent an email to Samwha asking about these "not on the catalog" 500F Caps just before I found your video.. Really Samwha are trashing their name by selling(?) their rejects. I was looking at the Eaton's before I looked on Ebay and will probably go with them.
Thanks for the test, I had my suspicions especially after evaluating Chinese lithium batteries. One test that we can't do is cycle life and the other is shelf life. I'm using Maxwells but will be testing the Eatons. Rob
One simple question, why this arrogance in US engineering? BTW, you compare Prosche and a VW Beatle, guess you know the prize differnece? You can do a compare, but you have todo it very very differnt as you did.
Thanks for the video. These 350/400F supercaps are around for quite a long time. I thought the last several years they will double the capacity like 1000F for the same form factor - but no further development :( Only Maxwell reached 3V per cell, and that is the only breakthrough. I did some test myself in the past. I couln't quite measure the capacity, but I bought some cheap blue samwha supercaps 500F (they were labeled "low leakege"), and they behave strange - when you charge them for the first time they drain quite fast, but if you trickle charge them for several days, they drop to ~2V and stay like that for many months. Perhaps I was lucky. For comparisson, I am developing a USB power bank based on 6 (2x3) D size supercaps like yours. If they are really 500F each, I should be getting 2.8wh if charged to 2.6V each. I measured 1.7wh :) I can try with EATON but the project cost will go sky high :)
hmm i read some myth about capacitor "reforming" like in vintage electronics where if you avoid all load currents and just keep a device powered on for an extended period of time the voltage difference can allow for oxygen to diffuse in and around a little bit better and reform the passivation layer of aluminum oxide over where they are leaking current due to micro ablations/holes/spot welds between mylar coated aluminum layers. I mean super caps are quite different than the self healing mains 110-220v potted OG caps you used to get across the wall supply in on old electornics like VCR's, but still I imagine most caps can self heal to some degree. I think its a sign that those originally high leak caps are fragile and will probably not last as many cycles, but with some applications where they might be kept at resting 2+volts without temp swings and kept dry, should be okay. thanks for the heads up. I have a bunch of the screw caps comming from china... wish i saw this video first but I think I am going to have to try what you said. hopefully this batch i get 6 years after this video is different. probably wont be.
tenminutetokyo Yes... true... except... you're leaving out the part where US CEOs sent their production facilities to china so the shareholders would be happy... all the chinese people did is provide space for factories and cheap labor... the factories were often built with US capital... and since there is no free lunch the chinese are paying with environmental and health problems... economics are complicated...
Homemade DIY 660Wp SunTracer Solar Tracker ➡️ th-cam.com/video/X0lmYFwOq3U/w-d-xo.html
Powercap Supercaps 36× 500F Accu Battery 2,7V Farad ➡️ th-cam.com/video/ihSc7Bj_oQk/w-d-xo.html
Thanks for the video.
You can buy about 3 of the cheap 500/300 farad caps and end up with 900F for the same price as the Eaton 500/400F.
I think that judging/identifying capacitor quality based on their terminal style is a bit unreliable. The terminals don't determine who made it or the quality of that particular series of capacitors.
Would have been nice to see the more common Maxwells in the lineup.
Some information you may want to add to your video. Green-Cap is a
Korean company. They do not make a 500F in that D cell size. What is
happening is Chinese counterfeit companies are dumpster diving old/test
failed Green-Cap 400F capacitors. They then put a shiny new 500F label
on them so consumers think they are getting more than if a buy a Maxwell
or Eaton. One of the tail tail signs is the green 500Fs discharge VERY
quickly (not up to specs for even real new Green-Cap) compared to the
Eaton and Maxwell. Maxwell is my favorite (all around great quality and
good vibration resistance). Eaton is good too and I've used some high
quality Nesscap. Take with a grain of salt and be careful where you buy
as China is making fake Maxwell and Eatons now too.
I made a video using Maxwells to replace a car battery. They are very good capacitors.
+Gene Angel wow, thanks for putting everything I said in this video into writing (no sarcasm intended).
Correct me if I'm wrong, but all indications are Eaton caps are made by Nesscap. (and Nesscap is now owned by Maxwell)
best comment, thanks ;)
Movies And Entertainments, Latest try Digi - Key
A couple of charts would be a lot better than stuttered verbal descriptions.
Mate, learn some manners. Write down what he said and make your own charts. I hope you've grown up over the last 2 years lol.
Love the video and just subscribed. I have been doing a little testing with the Samwha 500F supercaps and figured most of the same theories you presented. I was planning on doing a similar video one day in the future. I suspect an actual sub-par factory somewhere cranking these out though since there seems to be an unlimited amount available. Anyways, I figure if you learn to make things work using the worst components, then you can maximize your results with the best lol.
Do a comparison of the Maxwell super-caps and the E-TN'.
Nice Video! Mabye you can blend in a table with the specs and measurements you read from your sheet. That would make it much easier to follow the comparison. Have a nice week :)
Samwha not from China. Samwha from S. Korea.
"So are you Russian or African or Mexican??"
DannyBoyDDD From I'm Laotian hillbilly...HAHA!!.
@@4gauge10 stupid it's Laos
dumb hillbilly
your math ain't right voltages were not right sorry not useful
Nice video. I made the same mistake and tried to buy those cheap ones. I ran into the same problems you did. Somewhere kind of okay and other ones were totally junk.
Sam wha Green Cap EDLC does have data sheet for 2.7 500 F capacitors. ESR, 1kHz 3.2mohm, ESR, DC 3.8mohm, L/C(72hrs) 1.35mA
Perhaps that cap with the screw terminals had a built in discharge resistor.
Did you consider that?
Because if they do, then of course, they are not junk.
Did they all have a similar self-discharge rate of around 45mA?
My guess is that they are good and have discharge resistors built in.
I have a project that requires three 100-120F ELDC supercaps. I'm buying AVX supercaps from Mouser since I can get a reliable, well-documented source chain on parts and the AVX supercaps are all testing within spec. Eaton's supercaps are also solid in terms of getting what you're paying for.
I got the two pin (non screw) 500f capacitors at about 4$ each. Got scratched up and damaged from shipping, so I asked for an exchange. I ended up getting them for free. The balance board (also china made) blew a resistor and doesn't work. Main point: dont expect quality from chinese made super caps and balance boards
Chinese "supercaps" is like buying transistors from China... commonly... junk or "re-badged" crap. (FWIW, Eaton = Bussman?)
Those cheap china ebay caps are junk I have received 12 of them and they were all bad some would lose their voltage in just minutes only 2 of them would hold 50% of its charge after 12 hours
At last a quality comparison video about super cap . I only have Maxwell caps by now but I'm interested in those Eatons.. Also nice to find out that some oriental brands are doing some decent ones. BTW, can you make a direct comparison between Eaton and Maxwell supercaps?
+polik971 thank you for the kind words. I have not played with any maxwell supercaps as of yet but I would surmise they are as good or even slightly better then the Eaton brand.
Thanks for the video. Could you explain how you did the ESR measurement for your capacitors?
I have a bunch of those Eaton 400F Caps and they have a DC ESR of around 3.2mOhms which I tested and is the same as on their datasheet. I havent tested at 1kHz though.
Those samwha/greencap knockoffs I have a bunch of too but, like you say, are probably the failed 300F versions and they have a DC esr normally above 5 mOhms some much higher.
The reason I ask is because the esr is normally much better on those Eaton Supercaps than the Greencaps and hence you get a much higher peak output current etc.
Cheers
Is there a battery charger / power supply you recommend for working through the hybrid battery project? Mine just bit the dust.
Very good review! I totally agree: most of the "500F" Supercaps from China, you can buy for around 4 Eur are junk. They are rejected, thrown-out from the 300 or 360F production of Samwha. They only produce one 500F type with snap-in mounting but which is rated at 2.8 nominal voltage - probably much more expansive. They really do cheat a lot, these chinese sellers! I will give mine back and reclaim my money - otherwise you encourage them to do business like this!
The smaller capacity isn't the worst in the deal - its that the specs are so much off - you just dont know what you get, but you can be sure, you cant use them in a 6S-pack, because they run out of balance quickly and damage the whole project!
so don't buy the expensive USA made caps buy two and a half times as many China made caps so you have some low quality caps to tinker with. And maybe support a shame resale company because heh let's save a few bucks. Question, did either company warranty there product
Did u able to check what kind electrode (current collector, activated carbon, graphite powder & glue) and ionic liquid the Chinese or Korean used? Thank u.
If I need to buy 10 to get 5 and they only have 3/4 the capacity then they cost the same as the $12 ones, $9 per usable unit for 3/4 the capacity or $12 equivalent for the same capacity.
Hi there I was wondering if you've ever tried supercapacitors from tecate. Are they any good?
Can you test Maxwell super caps ??
Great information and advice. Thanks so much
Can you tear apart that screw terminal one? i have heard sometimes they put smaller caps in larger cans just wondering if that was the case with that one.
this is important information ....thankssss...
order from a real supplier like digikey as many components are fake on ebay and aliexpress . if it looks too good!! thanks for the info
but can buy those whit balance board pre weld then are ok price wise ( but good video )
You can show a table, it would be better than reading all the numbers
DAOKI sells 500F capacitors. I have hand-built them (and it looks so terrible.. worst solder job i've ever done) and yet they work amazing. Tey're $30 for 3x, so $60 + $30 balancing board =
+Sin Vraal those are the fake/reject supercapacitors just being resold by DAOKI. Samwha does not make a 500F supercapacitor.
Great video...I honestly value your observations. Any chance u can review Qinfen 3000f supercaps offered on ebay. ? The seller fails to provide any real metrics...only that these caps " are rigorously tested prior to shipment" ... I don't trust unbranded and unreviewed electronics. Thoughts?
I have that exact same question. I actually got one of those and it felt as if the content inside was loose and moving around. So haven't even tested it yet but it could be a poor sample and other units might be acceptable. I may open up the canister and see how it looks on the inside. Not eager to do it, however, if there is something unhappy substance.
Thanks for this. Awesome.Exactly what I was wanting.
I just sent an email to Samwha asking about these "not on the catalog" 500F Caps just before I found your video..
Really Samwha are trashing their name by selling(?) their rejects.
I was looking at the Eaton's before I looked on Ebay and will probably go with them.
I highly doubt that Samwha is directly selling them. More likely someone is dumpster diving and reselling and rewrapping the rejects.
Dude connect a cord to them and plug them in let's watch them smoke!
Thanks for the test, I had my suspicions especially after evaluating Chinese lithium batteries. One test that we can't do is cycle life and the other is shelf life. I'm using Maxwells but will be testing the Eatons.
Rob
2.7 v 500f waht is the farad
good i like it , you might had spent a lot of time to do this micro analysis .
Thank you for your info.
One simple question, why this arrogance in US engineering? BTW, you compare Prosche and a VW Beatle, guess you know the prize differnece? You can do a compare, but you have todo it very very differnt as you did.
nice video
Im not trying to be annoying but i work for Eaton in the hydrolic sector. And its pronounced E-tʌn as in E...1 metric Ton.
Hahaha posted that way to fast got about half way through and couldnt tkae it any more you had it right at 10:32
Americans nearly always mispronounce words.
There seem to be > 40k F capacitor for Bus. Where can we get them ?
Buy enough of the small ones and connect them together. That is also how the ones for the busses are made.
thanks !
WHERE ican find a super capacitor
digi key for eaton 300F and 400F
Thanks for the video. These 350/400F supercaps are around for quite a long time. I thought the last several years they will double the capacity like 1000F for the same form factor - but no further development :( Only Maxwell reached 3V per cell, and that is the only breakthrough. I did some test myself in the past. I couln't quite measure the capacity, but I bought some cheap blue samwha supercaps 500F (they were labeled "low leakege"), and they behave strange - when you charge them for the first time they drain quite fast, but if you trickle charge them for several days, they drop to ~2V and stay like that for many months. Perhaps I was lucky. For comparisson, I am developing a USB power bank based on 6 (2x3) D size supercaps like yours. If they are really 500F each, I should be getting 2.8wh if charged to 2.6V each. I measured 1.7wh :) I can try with EATON but the project cost will go sky high :)
That's the only problem with using quality supercaps instead of Chinese ones, they work much better but cost much more!
FireSword
hmm i read some myth about capacitor "reforming" like in vintage electronics where if you avoid all load currents and just keep a device powered on for an extended period of time the voltage difference can allow for oxygen to diffuse in and around a little bit better and reform the passivation layer of aluminum oxide over where they are leaking current due to micro ablations/holes/spot welds between mylar coated aluminum layers. I mean super caps are quite different than the self healing mains 110-220v potted OG caps you used to get across the wall supply in on old electornics like VCR's, but still I imagine most caps can self heal to some degree. I think its a sign that those originally high leak caps are fragile and will probably not last as many cycles, but with some applications where they might be kept at resting 2+volts without temp swings and kept dry, should be okay.
thanks for the heads up. I have a bunch of the screw caps comming from china... wish i saw this video first but I think I am going to have to try what you said. hopefully this batch i get 6 years after this video is different. probably wont be.
That is the problem with China-made product directly from China, it is not just super conductor.
tenminutetokyo Yes... true... except... you're leaving out the part where US CEOs sent their production facilities to china so the shareholders would be happy... all the chinese people did is provide space for factories and cheap labor... the factories were often built with US capital... and since there is no free lunch the chinese are paying with environmental and health problems... economics are complicated...