A better test would be 10 shot groups to get a better average. There’s too much ammo variability in rimfire ammo to only shoot 3 shot groups. And once you have your setting you should test even more against more control data
3 shots gets you in the ball park more quickly. Ideally you then go back and shoot 5 shot groups (which he did) near the sweet spots to see what your groups are really like. 10 shot groups are prone to actually add more variation. 5 is plenty unless you're trying to figure out what causes a statistical flyer which is a whole other story.
I love my EC Tuner because I can get a setting for each type of factory ammo I have and it simplifies load development because I just have to find the lowest ES and SD at my target velocity with a chrono and then tune the rifle to it. No more ladders, seating depth adjustments, trying different powders, what have you. Saves time, components, and ammunition to get the best groups you and your rifle are capable of!
Spend the time finding what ammo the rifle likes first without the Tuner on . That way you know your chamber/bore etc is matched to the ammo . Put the Tuner on and shrink those good groups down even more . Trust me Tuners don’t make bad ammo great . Watch for horizontal or vertical stringing no mater how small , you want round groups and I’ll choose a setting that gives me consistent round groups even if the average group size is bigger than the stringing ones . Rimfire will drive you nuts after a while , no matter how good the rifle/ ammo combo is you will still get the odd flyer , its just the nature of the game .
Wrong shoot the gun as it is shot in competition. I've been to the test center twice and they always want the gun with the tuner on if you're using one. The problem is most of you if not all of you don't know how to tune or what the tuner is actually for. You think you can tune the ammo for the barrel and that is definitely 100% wrong. Br shooters tune the barrel not the ammo. Then the tuner is rarely ever touched , it's a matter of finding that great lot of ammo after the gun is properly tuned. Good luck chasing your tell
I've owned a number of Anshcutz rifles over the years that I bought both new and used and both 64 and 54 actions. I never thought they shot like some of the Annie afficianados brag about, but I think using a tuner will get the best out of them. Great video.
Running an EC tuner on a Christensen Arms MPR .308. Makes an accurate weapon even more accurate, less than 1/4 inch MOA at 100 yards. On some loads, in the same hole. Usually, if I run factory ammo, the length and weight changes the setting dramatically, by a few thousands of an inch (+/-).
Tuners have been around in .22 Olympic and bench rest shooting for a very very long time, I have a Walther KK300 and I am an ex-3 Positional and prone shooter. 9 years ago I purchased a Starik carbon tube tuner for my .22LR and have been using it ever since. I tested different batches of ammunition without the tuner to see what provided me with the best results and settled on Lapua centre X, then used the tuner to tighten up the group further, the rifle consistently shoots 1 hole groups with centre x at 50 metres. This rifle has won many competitions and I am certain it would not have been possible without the addition of the tuner. People should also just be realistic about what their rifles are capable of, a tuner won't make an average rifle or bad ammo shoot well. If you want to see what the most accurate .22LR rifles in the world look like, look at the Walther KK500, Bleiker Challenger II and the Grunig and Elmiger R3 Racer.
Unlike center fire, as you mention, get the best quality 22 ammo that has consistency. Then tune it. If you have the consistency in ammo the tuner will not require much adjustment. Speed is the only variable at this point. A little adjustment will be needed as the faster loads will create a slightly different harmony. Love my EC on my vudoo.
Have you tested the: Adaptive Tuning System (ATS) The ATS is the first tuner available that uses your existing muzzle threads while still allowing the use of your muzzle brake or suppressor of choice. Best Chris
At our shooting range we have an ancient anschütz 22lr single shot bolt action that is lent to everyone who wants to shoot it. Heavy barrel, never cleaned in 20 years, shoots on a coin any day at 105 yards... Everyone loves it... But man is that barrel dirty😂
I'm using a tuner break on my anschutz 1761 my settings are as follows SK long range match 1.5 Rws r50 2. Both these rounds and pretty much identical in my rifle for mussel velocity standard deviation and extreme spread Another two that have been identical as far as I could tell midus+ and SK standard plus. Both 4.5 on the tuner And what iv found any ammo with a low SD can be tuned to get the best out of your rifle
I use a Starik tuner on my Anschutz. The quickest (and cheapest ) way to dial it in is to buy a box of RWS R50 and a box of R100 (which is faster). Fire two shots, one of each box at the target. The R100 will shoot higher as it’s faster. Then turn the tuner and repeat. As the turner is wound in/out you’ll notice the rounds coming closer to the same point of impact until eventually you’ll get them going through the same hole. Remember a tuner only compensates for variations in speed. For ultimate accuracy you’ll then need to batch test to get the tightest groups. My best batch achieved a 40 shot group of 14.5mm with the best 10 shot group of 10.9mm (edge to edge).
What I have noticed is when you find the ammo your rifle likes you can usually tune that 1/2 by size , ex. .50 moa to ..25 moa with tuner etc… we use a EC tuner, and homemade ones Eric’s sure is faster to set 😁. Also seems to help smaller barrels .75 much better then like 1.25 barrels, great rabbit hole forsure
I have a Harrels tuner on my Christensen Ranger. I was able to dial in well under MOA with FEDERAL Bulk box. I have 200 rounds of fresh CCI SV on the way and I'm definitely going to play with that. From the Federal bulk box setting, I shoot Center-X and Lapua biathlon in .2 and .3 range at 50 yards. Your mileage will vary!
My 1710 refuses to shoot SK ammo and I think yours does as well. Try RWS Special Match or better. After some lot testing I couldn't tell a performance difference in Special Match, R50 and R100. The way the matches are setup is a shooter shoots at a .22 diameter dot at 50 yards. One or two shooters will completely take it out every round so if I'm 1/8" off I'm finished.
First of all there should have been at least 25 rounds, five - five shot groups, without the tuner to establish a base line to use as comparison with the groups fired with the tuner. One three shot group is not close to being a large enough sample size to give any indication of group size for a particular tuner setting. There should be at least 20 to 25 shots at each tuner setting to establish performance. In this video one three shot group was much tighter than the rest. But when three - five shot groups were fired at that setting they were as big as many of the three shot groups in the initial string of tuner settings. Bryan Litz of Applied Ballistics tested a tuner firing over 800 rounds of Sk Long Range Match and found no setting the showed a statistically significant improvement.
I have a German RWS/GECCO 22. My suppressor is my tuner! It works perfectly shooting RWS/GECCO riffle match ammo. The suppressor is the "El cheapo" SAK ... 🖖🏻🇫🇷😎🇫🇷😎🇫🇷🖖🏻
At times I use a Harrell's Precision Tuner on my Anschutz 2013 rimfire rifle. I prefer to shoot Lapua C-X ammo. My setting always seems to be in the same general vicinity (a couple of small clicks up or down) regardless of the lot I shoot and/or use Lapua Midas+. I have not taken the time to experiment with other ammunitions such as SK or Eley with my Tuner. Without the tuner, I have tried those other ammunitions (up and down the varieties offered) but my rifle likes the Lapus C-X best.
My CZ457 shoots one hole 5 shot groups 50/100yds w/SK MATCH. Sometimes you`re lucky to buy a good shooter, sometimes, not. I can surely see this tuner might be able to help some guns though. Back 50+ years ago, i used a piece of a heater hose, and a small spring wrapped around it to keep it on the barrel.
My little girl loves my GA Precision so i got her a Ruger Precision with the same surefire break as my rifle so she can run it suppressed. The SK long range ammo shoots better at 100 yards than most peoples centerfire rifles lol. Nothing but fun.
Knowing that different muzzle breaks would affect the harmonics of my rifle, I experimented with different muzzle breaks that I had laying around, and found one that gave excellent results. It’s a JP muzzle brake for an A.R. 10, and it’s on my 10/22. The 1022 out shoots my Bergara for now until I get that Bergara dialed in.
I have a CZ 457 Premium and run Remington Targets as bulk "for fun" shooting, and Eley Match for when I'm seriously testing my groups. I ran the full spectrum on the EC Tuner for both brands of ammo so I know what settings on the tuner work best for each brand. I think it's important to run the full spectrum on a new brand of ammo, cause like you said, the tuning process looks bad at the start, then it gets better, then bad again, then better again. Where I'm from,, it just got cold last week, and so far my groups haven't changed much at all, but when it continues to get colder, and my groups change, I think ill run another full spectrum test just to be sure.
To have the best result, I find the batch and type of ammo the gun likes first then tune , seems to work best for me . My annie likes that sk match as well .
Great reviews help in deciding which gun setup to purchase. One key question for Annie - what has been your experience with the ejection of spent rounds? This is the one thing that stops me in my tracks when it comes to completing a purchase vs. Vudoo, Rim-X, etc.
Used the EC Tuner on both my Browning competition rimfire T-Bolt and the comp-tuner on my 308 BLASER R93. Didn't see much improvement on my BLASER's already sub MOA accuracy, but I did see my groups shrink 40-50% on my 22LR Browning T-Bolt though. If I can get a hold of better quality match ammo, it'll likely shrink much more. But of course my Cooper M57 22LR came already as a one holer at 50 yards from the factory with no tuner.
1- If you shoot different distances do you need to change the tuner settings and 2- if you do need different ammo's for different distances' do you to need to recalculate your tuner?.
Great video! In the 90’s there was a push to use tuners on all size hunting rifles. Think it was Browning? There was no videos to train the average consumer on what a tuner was. With awareness through TH-cam I can see tuners being the most practical device for accuracy in all rifle platforms using reloads and commercial ammo. The EC Tuners and Brakes look good too.
The tuner came about a ling time before browning ever thought about them. Benchrest shooters were the creators actually a gunsmith. Bill Calfee came up with his 30 years ago. Ron hoen designed one that is now the Harrells tuner. If you want premium accuracy don't ever ever ever thread a 22 barrel for a tuner.
I've found that with all .22 ammo the inconsistency is real. Even the supposedly match ammo it's a cramp shoot and is frustrating. But that is the nature of the beast and something we have learned to deal with especially in today's world. It's funny that some manufacturers say they are building their rifles to work with certain ammo and then you test that ammo and the rifle hates that ammo? Tuners are something I haven't tried yet but I do believe that they help there is just to much data to not think they don't work yet there is people that think the earth is flat!! Not sure I would go with a fancy tuner the economical way is more in my price range and I can go to just about any store and get Orings Literally.. The limb saver would be my second choice for cost effectiveness.
I may have read it wrong , I was thinking about one for my cz 457 mtr vpt as well as my Bergara but where I’m confused is it’s looks to be purchase the tuner as well as an adapter for both rifles, Am I missing something here, one guy says for the .22lr you don’t have to buy adapter. The other guy says I do lol.
I shoot now for more than 40 year's 22.lr in championship national and international at 50 and 100 Meters. With this caliber, its essential, that a ammunition must be compatible to your barrel. There is no other way....... to put your rifle system in a "shooting machine" and check different series of different ammo. In the result, you find the compatible ammo to your rifle barrel, and its not always the match grade ammo of the "good expensive" brands. We match shooters buy sometimes a complete production lot of ammo, if we found the perfect ammunition for our rifle. We tested it several times, ammunition that shoot in one rifle perfect groups, shoot in other rifles not precise and vice-versa. Consistency of 22.lr ammo depends at the consistency amount of primer in the rim, and this is sometimes the most common problem. 3 lots of the same brand and type of ammo, and every lot have a completely different precision. But thats not a new understanding, thats what the oldtimers of the shooting scene 40 year's ago(some international and national masters) gave me, some of their knowledge, when they thought i was it worth. Sorry, if my words are difficult to read/understand, English is not my mothers tongue.
Thank you for sharing, I appreciate your perspective from all of the experience that you have. Yes, it seems rimfire ammunition has its own unique challenges compared to centerfire in terms of finding the right combination of ammunition and rifle. We hope to do more testing on different types of rimfire ammunition time moving forward.
UR always puts out great videos. The 1710 should shoot much better than the targets I seen…and to see it done with a tuner is even more surprising. Maybe it was conditions etc. But definitely not what it should be at 50 yards. Regardless I will always watch UR videos.
@@JohnSmith-jh1iy the last targets shown are at 50 yards once the tuner was set. Might want to rewatch it. So I paused it and was able to see the 50 yard notes wrote on target and it was 15mph winds which definitely explains the groups. That gun with no wind should shoot hole for hole nearly with a tuner. Definitely would like to see them test more with no wind
@@dcs27006 they don't know what they're doing with the tuner. Every centerfire guy thinks they can just grab a 22 and make it shoot. Lmao couldn't be further from the truth. Most centerfire guys don't do well at all in rimfire. They think they know it all. Rimfire is a different animal and tuners don't work on harmonics
@@samw2768 I don’t disagree. The wind definitely played a fact here I think. They need to retest with no wind. Rimfire is very demanding and lots of little things can create issues that I haven’t seen in centerfire
@Travis Fox I watched every single video of his (including the Barndo channel)...I will have to research it out more but that particular aspect of his tuners isn't highlighted anywhere as far as I know.
I had the EC Tuner Brake on my AR in 6mm ARC. The tension screws would not remain tight even after using a little lock-tite and tightening the screws down enough that I would probably loosen the whole brake if trying to adjust it out. Also the method in which it is secured to the barrel is a poor design in my opinion. The thread pitch on the barrel and the brake and lock nut are very close and could pull threads if not careful, and doesn't give a positive jam/lock. It would have been better if there were provisions on the jam nut for a wrench to lock it down. With all that I didn't trust it on the end of my barrel and removed it. I never saw much of an improvement in groups either, but to be fair I got tired of screwing with it before I went through all adjustments. This is just my experience and your results may vary.
Thankfully I’ve had the exact opposite results in the 6 rifles I’ve got EC TunerBrakes mounted on. They’ve all worked flawless, dialed in great, and tension screws remained tight with no threadlockers needed. Have you reached out to them and asked about your issues?
@@jimhans1 Yes, I sent an email some time ago and never heard back. It may there's some extra vibration in my gas gun that didn't mix well. I may try it on a bolt gun and machine some flats unto the jam nut to properly tighten it.
The new ec tuners con with a jam nut locking screw. That tells me the Cortina had heard this before enough to modify his production of the new jam nuts. By the way, I have 8 tuners on multiple calibers. They really work. Repeatable results....
If you want to try a tuner and not have to thread the barrel, look up the Harrell's Precision tuner; harrellsprec.com/index.php/products/harrell-rimfire-tuners-403
Good review! Question - did you try shooting everything again on another day, and if so did the same setting give the best result? I found on my CZ 457 LRP that I did not always get as good a group, so I had to change the tuner to a different setting. Could that possibly be due to atmospheric conditions? Temperature and humidity especially?
This whole video is pointless if you don't show the groups without the tuner installed, I feel silly having to type that because it's so obvious. How is the viewer supposed to draw any meaningful conclusions? If the video is just meant to show off the product then please state that in the intro, because that's all this is.
@Travis Fox I watched the video, show me the non tuner groups shot on the same day with the same ammo. You say you shot a baseline group but don't show it. If you're asking me to draw a comparison in groups between this video and a previous one (different day, different ammo), that's a pointless comparison. Can we at least agree on that point?
Lamo so funny to watch you clowns mess with tuners and misunderstand what they actually do. If it was based on harmonics it would be simple to figure out the formula needed for a tuner. They don't work by harmonics though lmfao
![⭐️( ลอยกระทง 2024 ) Ver. แดนซ์ Remix BY [ ดีเจกิต รีมิกซ์ ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/rMWOLhgXUHc/mqdefault.jpg)
Nice groups and review! Thank you.
We are loving these tuners!
A better test would be 10 shot groups to get a better average. There’s too much ammo variability in rimfire ammo to only shoot 3 shot groups. And once you have your setting you should test even more against more control data
3 shots gets you in the ball park more quickly. Ideally you then go back and shoot 5 shot groups (which he did) near the sweet spots to see what your groups are really like. 10 shot groups are prone to actually add more variation. 5 is plenty unless you're trying to figure out what causes a statistical flyer which is a whole other story.
@@nospam3409 👈+1
@allenclayton and @johnsmith
😛Perhaps you should demonstrate the correct technique, on video please!
I love my EC Tuner because I can get a setting for each type of factory ammo I have and it simplifies load development because I just have to find the lowest ES and SD at my target velocity with a chrono and then tune the rifle to it. No more ladders, seating depth adjustments, trying different powders, what have you. Saves time, components, and ammunition to get the best groups you and your rifle are capable of!
Spend the time finding what ammo the rifle likes first without the Tuner on .
That way you know your chamber/bore etc is matched to the ammo .
Put the Tuner on and shrink those good groups down even more .
Trust me Tuners don’t make bad ammo great .
Watch for horizontal or vertical stringing no mater how small , you want round groups and I’ll choose a setting that gives me consistent round groups even if the average group size is bigger than the stringing ones .
Rimfire will drive you nuts after a while , no matter how good the rifle/ ammo combo is you will still get the odd flyer , its just the nature of the game .
Wrong shoot the gun as it is shot in competition. I've been to the test center twice and they always want the gun with the tuner on if you're using one. The problem is most of you if not all of you don't know how to tune or what the tuner is actually for. You think you can tune the ammo for the barrel and that is definitely 100% wrong. Br shooters tune the barrel not the ammo. Then the tuner is rarely ever touched , it's a matter of finding that great lot of ammo after the gun is properly tuned. Good luck chasing your tell
@@samw2768 that’s not what I understand from listening to Erik . He also mentions the tune changes with temp change.
I've owned a number of Anshcutz rifles over the years that I bought both new and used and both 64 and 54 actions. I never thought they shot like some of the Annie afficianados brag about, but I think using a tuner will get the best out of them. Great video.
Running an EC tuner on a Christensen Arms MPR .308. Makes an accurate weapon even more accurate, less than 1/4 inch MOA at 100 yards. On some loads, in the same hole. Usually, if I run factory ammo, the length and weight changes the setting dramatically, by a few thousands of an inch (+/-).
Well stated, a tuner cannot correct fundamental rifle or ammunition problems but it can certainly enhance your results!
Tuners have been around in .22 Olympic and bench rest shooting for a very very long time, I have a Walther KK300 and I am an ex-3 Positional and prone shooter. 9 years ago I purchased a Starik carbon tube tuner for my .22LR and have been using it ever since. I tested different batches of ammunition without the tuner to see what provided me with the best results and settled on Lapua centre X, then used the tuner to tighten up the group further, the rifle consistently shoots 1 hole groups with centre x at 50 metres. This rifle has won many competitions and I am certain it would not have been possible without the addition of the tuner. People should also just be realistic about what their rifles are capable of, a tuner won't make an average rifle or bad ammo shoot well. If you want to see what the most accurate .22LR rifles in the world look like, look at the Walther KK500, Bleiker Challenger II and the Grunig and Elmiger R3 Racer.
Unlike center fire, as you mention, get the best quality 22 ammo that has consistency. Then tune it. If you have the consistency in ammo the tuner will not require much adjustment. Speed is the only variable at this point. A little adjustment will be needed as the faster loads will create a slightly different harmony. Love my EC on my vudoo.
Have you tested the: Adaptive Tuning System (ATS)
The ATS is the first tuner available that uses your existing muzzle threads while still allowing the use of your muzzle brake or suppressor of choice.
Best
Chris
Appreciate all that you guys do. Where are the results of the other 2 “tuners”? The O-rings and the Limbsaver?
I'd like to see that too.
At our shooting range we have an ancient anschütz 22lr single shot bolt action that is lent to everyone who wants to shoot it.
Heavy barrel, never cleaned in 20 years, shoots on a coin any day at 105 yards...
Everyone loves it... But man is that barrel dirty😂
If you clean, you are going to destroy the gun’s accuracy 😅
I have 4 different lots(speed/fps) of Center-X and 2 different lots of SK rifle match and they all require a different tune, to answer your question.
Man this .22 stuff was a way to get into prs/practice prs "on the cheap"
We've all been lied to 🤣🤣🤣
I know right 22elr and prs is a sickness 😂
I'm using a tuner break on my anschutz 1761 my settings are as follows SK long range match 1.5
Rws r50 2. Both these rounds and pretty much identical in my rifle for mussel velocity standard deviation and extreme spread
Another two that have been identical as far as I could tell midus+ and SK standard plus. Both 4.5 on the tuner
And what iv found any ammo with a low SD can be tuned to get the best out of your rifle
I use a Starik tuner on my Anschutz. The quickest (and cheapest ) way to dial it in is to buy a box of RWS R50 and a box of R100 (which is faster). Fire two shots, one of each box at the target. The R100 will shoot higher as it’s faster. Then turn the tuner and repeat. As the turner is wound in/out you’ll notice the rounds coming closer to the same point of impact until eventually you’ll get them going through the same hole. Remember a tuner only compensates for variations in speed. For ultimate accuracy you’ll then need to batch test to get the tightest groups. My best batch achieved a 40 shot group of 14.5mm with the best 10 shot group of 10.9mm (edge to edge).
Finally get it set up and the next day the temp drops and you gotta start over
What I have noticed is when you find the ammo your rifle likes you can usually tune that 1/2 by size , ex. .50 moa to ..25 moa with tuner etc… we use a EC tuner, and homemade ones Eric’s sure is faster to set 😁. Also seems to help smaller barrels .75 much better then like 1.25 barrels, great rabbit hole forsure
Very interesting, was not aware of these stick on improvements
No tuner here however I am thinking about the O ring idea.
I have a Harrels tuner on my Christensen Ranger. I was able to dial in well under MOA with FEDERAL Bulk box. I have 200 rounds of fresh CCI SV on the way and I'm definitely going to play with that. From the Federal bulk box setting, I shoot Center-X and Lapua biathlon in .2 and .3 range at 50 yards. Your mileage will vary!
Run a Manael tuner on a B14R steel, .3 moa gun, change the tuner setting only when velocity changes significantly.
th-cam.com/video/ySP3f0VHxws/w-d-xo.html
My 1710 refuses to shoot SK ammo and I think yours does as well. Try RWS Special Match or better. After some lot testing I couldn't tell a performance difference in Special Match, R50 and R100. The way the matches are setup is a shooter shoots at a .22 diameter dot at 50 yards. One or two shooters will completely take it out every round so if I'm 1/8" off I'm finished.
First of all there should have been at least 25 rounds, five - five shot groups, without the tuner to establish a base line to use as comparison with the groups fired with the tuner.
One three shot group is not close to being a large enough sample size to give any indication of group size for a particular tuner setting. There should be at least 20 to 25 shots at each tuner setting to establish performance.
In this video one three shot group was much tighter than the rest. But when three - five shot groups were fired at that setting they were as big as many of the three shot groups in the initial string of tuner settings.
Bryan Litz of Applied Ballistics tested a tuner firing over 800 rounds of Sk Long Range Match and found no setting the showed a statistically significant improvement.
Would love to see more shots, a 0.1” is a lucky group even with the best benchrest 6ppc
I have a German RWS/GECCO 22. My suppressor is my tuner! It works perfectly shooting RWS/GECCO riffle match ammo. The suppressor is the "El cheapo" SAK ...
🖖🏻🇫🇷😎🇫🇷😎🇫🇷🖖🏻
At times I use a Harrell's Precision Tuner on my Anschutz 2013 rimfire rifle. I prefer to shoot Lapua C-X ammo. My setting always seems to be in the same general vicinity (a couple of small clicks up or down) regardless of the lot I shoot and/or use Lapua Midas+. I have not taken the time to experiment with other ammunitions such as SK or Eley with my Tuner. Without the tuner, I have tried those other ammunitions (up and down the varieties offered) but my rifle likes the Lapus C-X best.
My CZ457 shoots one hole 5 shot groups 50/100yds w/SK MATCH. Sometimes you`re lucky to buy a good shooter, sometimes, not.
I can surely see this tuner might be able to help some guns though. Back 50+ years ago, i used a piece of a heater hose, and a small spring wrapped around it to keep it on the barrel.
Both Winchester and Browning had the Boss system long ago I have 2 Winchester in my collection
My little girl loves my GA Precision so i got her a Ruger Precision with the same surefire break as my rifle so she can run it suppressed. The SK long range ammo shoots better at 100 yards than most peoples centerfire rifles lol. Nothing but fun.
You guys are the best, keep it up.
Very interesting! I have been thinking about getting a tuner!
Knowing that different muzzle breaks would affect the harmonics of my rifle, I experimented with different muzzle breaks that I had laying around, and found one that gave excellent results. It’s a JP muzzle brake for an A.R. 10, and it’s on my 10/22. The 1022 out shoots my Bergara for now until I get that Bergara dialed in.
All JP muzzle devices have excellent harmonics.
Comment for the algorithm 👍 I love this stuff!
What was the conclusion about the EC tuner vs the others? Could you get the same results with the cheapo tuning techniques?
I have a CZ 457 Premium and run Remington Targets as bulk "for fun" shooting, and Eley Match for when I'm seriously testing my groups.
I ran the full spectrum on the EC Tuner for both brands of ammo so I know what settings on the tuner work best for each brand. I think it's important to run the full spectrum on a new brand of ammo, cause like you said, the tuning process looks bad at the start, then it gets better, then bad again, then better again.
Where I'm from,, it just got cold last week, and so far my groups haven't changed much at all, but when it continues to get colder, and my groups change, I think ill run another full spectrum test just to be sure.
I was interested in shooting NRL22 matches, but there are none in the Houston area. The nearest is almost 200 miles away, near Longview.
When you say two ticks adjustment, what does that mean? Alway great videos by the way
No tuner. Kidd 20" heavy SS Barrel getting really good groups with a few ammos that I have had a chance to shoot so far. Really like SK Standard Plus.
To have the best result, I find the batch and type of ammo the gun likes first then tune , seems to work best for me . My annie likes that sk match as well .
Great reviews help in deciding which gun setup to purchase. One key question for Annie - what has been your experience with the ejection of spent rounds? This is the one thing that stops me in my tracks when it comes to completing a purchase vs. Vudoo, Rim-X, etc.
Used the EC Tuner on both my Browning competition rimfire T-Bolt and the comp-tuner on my 308 BLASER R93. Didn't see much improvement on my BLASER's already sub MOA accuracy, but I did see my groups shrink 40-50% on my 22LR Browning T-Bolt though. If I can get a hold of better quality match ammo, it'll likely shrink much more. But of course my Cooper M57 22LR came already as a one holer at 50 yards from the factory with no tuner.
Very cool ideas.
1- If you shoot different distances do you need to change the tuner settings and 2- if you do need different ammo's for different distances' do you to need to recalculate your tuner?.
Great video! In the 90’s there was a push to use tuners on all size hunting rifles. Think it was Browning? There was no videos to train the average consumer on what a tuner was. With awareness through TH-cam I can see tuners being the most practical device for accuracy in all rifle platforms using reloads and commercial ammo. The EC Tuners and Brakes look good too.
Yes, it was Browning's B.O.S.S. system. I owned one in 300 Win Mag. The tuner improved groups for me.
The tuner came about a ling time before browning ever thought about them. Benchrest shooters were the creators actually a gunsmith. Bill Calfee came up with his 30 years ago. Ron hoen designed one that is now the Harrells tuner. If you want premium accuracy don't ever ever ever thread a 22 barrel for a tuner.
I've found that with all .22 ammo the inconsistency is real. Even the supposedly match ammo it's a cramp shoot and is frustrating. But that is the nature of the beast and something we have learned to deal with especially in today's world. It's funny that some manufacturers say they are building their rifles to work with certain ammo and then you test that ammo and the rifle hates that ammo? Tuners are something I haven't tried yet but I do believe that they help there is just to much data to not think they don't work yet there is people that think the earth is flat!! Not sure I would go with a fancy tuner the economical way is more in my price range and I can go to just about any store and get Orings Literally.. The limb saver would be my second choice for cost effectiveness.
@gavintoobe can you explore rim thickness next?
I may have read it wrong , I was thinking about one for my cz 457 mtr vpt as well as my Bergara but where I’m confused is it’s looks to be purchase the tuner as well as an adapter for both rifles, Am I missing something here, one guy says for the .22lr you don’t have to buy adapter. The other guy says I do lol.
I shoot now for more than 40 year's 22.lr in championship national and international at 50 and 100 Meters.
With this caliber, its essential, that a ammunition must be compatible to your barrel.
There is no other way....... to put your rifle system in a "shooting machine" and check different series of different ammo.
In the result, you find the compatible ammo to your rifle barrel, and its not always the match grade ammo of the "good expensive" brands. We match shooters buy sometimes a complete production lot of ammo, if we found the perfect ammunition for our rifle.
We tested it several times, ammunition that shoot in one rifle perfect groups, shoot in other rifles not precise and vice-versa.
Consistency of 22.lr ammo depends at the consistency amount of primer in the rim, and this is sometimes the most common problem. 3 lots of the same brand and type of ammo, and every lot have a completely different precision.
But thats not a new understanding, thats what the oldtimers of the shooting scene 40 year's ago(some international and national masters) gave me, some of their knowledge, when they thought i was it worth.
Sorry, if my words are difficult to read/understand, English is not my mothers tongue.
Thank you for sharing, I appreciate your perspective from all of the experience that you have. Yes, it seems rimfire ammunition has its own unique challenges compared to centerfire in terms of finding the right combination of ammunition and rifle. We hope to do more testing on different types of rimfire ammunition time moving forward.
good video
Hello, do you know which year was the XL650 released? Thanks!
I just got my EC Tuner and have not had a chance to shoot with it on my 6.5 CM.
I got one for my ARMALITE AR10T chambered in 260 REM, but still waiting for a machinest friend of mine to adapt the barrel to it.
Почему оптика стоит так высоко❓☝️
Do you have to retune for different yardage?
Try using better target stock.
UR always puts out great videos. The 1710 should shoot much better than the targets I seen…and to see it done with a tuner is even more surprising. Maybe it was conditions etc. But definitely not what it should be at 50 yards. Regardless I will always watch UR videos.
It was 100 yards
@@JohnSmith-jh1iy the last targets shown are at 50 yards once the tuner was set. Might want to rewatch it. So I paused it and was able to see the 50 yard notes wrote on target and it was 15mph winds which definitely explains the groups. That gun with no wind should shoot hole for hole nearly with a tuner. Definitely would like to see them test more with no wind
@@dcs27006 they don't know what they're doing with the tuner. Every centerfire guy thinks they can just grab a 22 and make it shoot. Lmao couldn't be further from the truth. Most centerfire guys don't do well at all in rimfire. They think they know it all. Rimfire is a different animal and tuners don't work on harmonics
@@samw2768 I don’t disagree. The wind definitely played a fact here I think. They need to retest with no wind. Rimfire is very demanding and lots of little things can create issues that I haven’t seen in centerfire
What about the two other turners?
I've been looking at these tuners for a while now. What I hope to see some day is a tuner that allows suppressor use.
Kinetic security solutions makes one, I own one works fairly well with CCI SV, have yet to test in with Eley or SK. RPR .22
@@bennettdavid904 thanks man. I've never heard of them before. I will check it out for sure.
Manael does.
@Travis Fox My barrel is already threaded. Hopefully you don't mean threaded some more.
@Travis Fox I watched every single video of his (including the Barndo channel)...I will have to research it out more but that particular aspect of his tuners isn't highlighted anywhere as far as I know.
I had the EC Tuner Brake on my AR in 6mm ARC. The tension screws would not remain tight even after using a little lock-tite and tightening the screws down enough that I would probably loosen the whole brake if trying to adjust it out. Also the method in which it is secured to the barrel is a poor design in my opinion. The thread pitch on the barrel and the brake and lock nut are very close and could pull threads if not careful, and doesn't give a positive jam/lock. It would have been better if there were provisions on the jam nut for a wrench to lock it down. With all that I didn't trust it on the end of my barrel and removed it. I never saw much of an improvement in groups either, but to be fair I got tired of screwing with it before I went through all adjustments. This is just my experience and your results may vary.
Thankfully I’ve had the exact opposite results in the 6 rifles I’ve got EC TunerBrakes mounted on. They’ve all worked flawless, dialed in great, and tension screws remained tight with no threadlockers needed. Have you reached out to them and asked about your issues?
@@jimhans1 Yes, I sent an email some time ago and never heard back. It may there's some extra vibration in my gas gun that didn't mix well. I may try it on a bolt gun and machine some flats unto the jam nut to properly tighten it.
The new ec tuners con with a jam nut locking screw. That tells me the Cortina had heard this before enough to modify his production of the new jam nuts. By the way, I have 8 tuners on multiple calibers. They really work. Repeatable results....
Seeing as both my Anshutz are non-threaded barrels, I wonder if it would be worth the expense to have them threaded to use a tuner?
If you want to try a tuner and not have to thread the barrel, look up the Harrell's Precision tuner; harrellsprec.com/index.php/products/harrell-rimfire-tuners-403
Where can I find one of those tuners
What rear bag are you using please ?
Who’s bench rest is that?
Interesting
great video and information provided. Can you tell me what Vortex you are using on this set up
And what specific ERC tuner are you using ?
Good review! Question - did you try shooting everything again on another day, and if so did the same setting give the best result? I found on my CZ 457 LRP that I did not always get as good a group, so I had to change the tuner to a different setting. Could that possibly be due to atmospheric conditions? Temperature and humidity especially?
I've had the same results, but with one tuner in particular. What tuner are you running?
@@redrooster527 I run a Tuna Can, made by Paul Barrette from Quebec.
I'm curious as to how much that rimfire rifle/scope combo cost.
3-5k
@@danielmastrangelo3778 Holy crap! Several of the vehicles I've owned didn't cost that much.
@@handcannon1388 my vudoo is currently at 7k aud and it only has a strike eagle at the moment
Anschutz.
This whole video is pointless if you don't show the groups without the tuner installed, I feel silly having to type that because it's so obvious. How is the viewer supposed to draw any meaningful conclusions? If the video is just meant to show off the product then please state that in the intro, because that's all this is.
@Travis Fox I watched the video, show me the non tuner groups shot on the same day with the same ammo. You say you shot a baseline group but don't show it. If you're asking me to draw a comparison in groups between this video and a previous one (different day, different ammo), that's a pointless comparison. Can we at least agree on that point?
Bla, Bla, Bla!!!!!!!!!!
No thanks 👎
Lamo so funny to watch you clowns mess with tuners and misunderstand what they actually do. If it was based on harmonics it would be simple to figure out the formula needed for a tuner. They don't work by harmonics though lmfao