What Chargers and Testers Should You Buy For Building Lifepo4 Batteries? This Is What I Use.
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ก.พ. 2022
- This video is about the testers and power supply units that I have accumulated for building my lifepo4 batteries. There is a discussion of top balancing strategies and calculations along with costs of the various units.
I misspoke once about the large Wamptek unit. I said it was 0-5 volts and 0-60 amps but it is actually a 0-15 volt charger at 0-60 amps.
I also often used the word tester to describe a power supply unit. Sorry if this caused confusion.
That was really helpful and informative in a lot of different ways so much that I am happy to feel a bit foolish now. Wow I had no idea you did all that to EACH battery! It makes sense and a great way to check your batteries. I need to spend the $ and get some tester/chargers/resistance like yours as I can see a lot of good coming from it and my future plans. Great video, right to the point, explained well, in a patience way and at a level I could understand. Thanks for showing me that. I have better ideas now than my current (was ground breaking) top balancing of… 30 days... weeks.. years? Lol I forget just how much these batteries can hold compared to mobile ones. I like the idea of being able to discharge to test capacity outside of the system itself. I’ve been tinkering with solar now for several years. Mainly small setups, mobile units etc. but took the bigger plunge this fall ($$) into a full system that considerably bigger, with the idea of even more later (dependent on $ resources). No one I know, knows anything about solar so I’ve had to teach myself by watching a lot of U-Tube over the years. Not the best (I do have almost 40 years in construction) but working 60 hour weeks with limited time, it’s easier on me. I only believe so much of what I see on U-Tube as everyone now days is selling something. I only start to believe it if I hear it a lot and form several different sources. With that in mind, I think you are one of the most honest, knowledgeable and actually trying to help others U-tuber that I’ve come across in a while! I’m planning to buy some land in the mountains very soon and start building a completely off-grid self-sufficient home (and cost efficient) to retire in (only 3 years left!) so I’m experimenting on solar on my current house with hopes of gaining the knowledge and equipment when I get there. My trust is hard to earn but you have earned it. Looking forward to seeing more of your videos and supporting you channel. For now, my batteries are compressed (learned and built the same as yours), in parallel and charging… ok on a 10amp charger that is only charging at 3 amp now (it’s all I got for now! I’m learning!) Talk to you in … 30 days…weeks… lol don’t take me too seriously! Sorry this was long but trying to Thank you. Thanks Ray!
Hi Sir.Can I have your email?
Thanks for the content mate. Your channel saved me a bunch of time figuring out a charger to top charge my 8x280ah cells. I didn't realize my existing chargers were a drop in the pond for this purpose and would have taken weeks to do the job. Got the EBC-A40L and it's working like a charm.
Thanks Ray. Your helping many of us learn what it takes and how to do it. I'm brand new to your channel, but I've subscribed and will continue to dig into your content.😃
Hi Ray once again a very useful video giving an unbiased report on what chargers and PSU’S are good in a DIYers tool kit. Thanks again stay safe.
Thanks Ray for another great video! My wife really enjoys listening too. I set the playback speed to 2X - it makes your videos very informative AND entertaining! Mahalo nui!
😂😂😂thanks
I like the construction videos also! I learn from all your videos. Thank you!
Good stuff Ray❤ I'm a beginner and about to live off grid and still got a lot to learn but it excites me. Thank you for your contribution 🙏🏻
I got my EBC-A40L Finally and I can't wait to see what is going on with my batteries! Got it up and running, love the computer graphing and this will help me understand my batteries better. As always, love all your videos and thanks for staying true!
Hi Ray, well I tested Jenny Wu batteries with the EBC-A40L and they all tested 280 Ah plus after almost a year working so I'm pretty happy with Jenny. I also tested my other batteries I got from "MEIBrandauthorized Store" before I knew about Jenny and they tested at less than 230Ah.... a big difference and now it's over a year ago. Very disappointed in those batteries. I got robbed... Glad I got this new tester now to test my new batteries because I ordering 16 more from Jenny. Thought you might like to know. Thanks for all your help Ray!
Awesome! I'm building a 200ah 24v lifepo4 pack for my wheelchair giving me 70+ miles one charge. I'll be using the iCharger 4010duo 70amps. I'm using your assembly video for putting it together with mg chemicals conductive paste you used.
I don't mind the battery and construction projects. Lots of good explaining, have to watch all your older footage now.
Thanks for your information and intentions. I truly appreciate both. I only have a small charger for top balancing. Even with that your statement about how long it takes to top balance is a couple of weeks too long. There is a different way to do it. I've used it successfully a number times and it works well. With 16 cells wired in series, charge the battery up to around 54.4 or 3.4 per cell. Check with a multimeter to make sure one cell isn't going crazy compared to the rest. You don't want to burn out a cell. Once you're at 54.4 or so disassemble the cells and wire four of them in parallel and top balance them. Yes, it does take more than a couple of hours, more like a day total time. Move the charger from one group of four cells to the next until they are all charged to the same level. Then combine 8 cells and top balance those. If you've done the four-cell groups this also takes about a day. When both sets of 8 are charged to the same level then combine all 16 cells in series to make the battery. According to the BMS the delta high and low on initial assembly was .029. In two days of charging from solar panels and discharging at night the delta was .008. I don't know if you're running your chargers on solar or from the grid. I'm totally off grid so have no choice except from solar. That's why I had to use this protocol. Doing it this way takes about a week, not three weeks.
Thank you kind sir
Thank you very much for taking the time to explain everything.
My boyfriend is into the same stuff, Ray, and your videos are the only ones that he shows me that I understand 🤣. Thanks for sharing
Thank you for your sharing with me. God bless
Thanks for explaining. Got a similar setup here with 2 little EBC-A20 (some buying accident) but have been thinking about the EBC-40L as well, because with my crappy 135Ah Aliexpress cells it also took about 24h+ to initially load or top balance. Just getting into PV and Lifepo4 batteries starting of with a battery for my camper. Looking forward to install PV and Lifepo4 batteries at my office and at home here in Germany and building up a tool pool.
I also do like your construction videos, because they give a different perspective compared to how buildings are normally constructed here in my region of northern Germany (mostly double wall solid stone with roof tiles). I like preserving the look of the wood inside and insulating outside :).
This is a great way for sure you’re getting an equal amount of SOC in all of the cells . The big blue charger that you and Andy of “ off grid garage “ uses is by far the best unit to use with all the features and amps . I am looking to get one in the future .
Thank you. Appreciate you sharing your knowledge and experience.
Thanks Ray, very informative. Very kind of you to share. Sharing is caring. I may not kill myself building my battery now.
Thanks for sharing! Good bit of information
Just found your channel. Nice battery build!
Thank you for your fine content. As a long time scuba diver, I appreciate your lovely fill station.
I have built dpv ,diver propulsion vehicle or underwater scooter, batteries and batteries for my dive lights and heater packs. Currently I am researching a build for a house battery for a friends’ sailboat. Your content has been most helpful!
Did you see my scuba content?
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff I have not! I shall look for that. FYI, I have boosters etc and have been diving a rebreather since 2010. I am just finishing a reno in my basement shop and my modest fill station is undergoing a makeover. Your painted storage tanks make me feel like my plan to paint mine is reasonable. Lol, my wife thinks that I am nuts. Cheers!
@@peternorris5614 I made a video last year that shows how I gear up for side mount including my use of a black tip. DPV. I have another channel called Ray does cool stuff. There are a few scuba videos on there, including a moray attacking a dive master, with a lionfish, a couple of mating, turtles, and a beautiful, spotted eagle ray.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff cool! I started using a version of sidemount in 1988 as I am a cave explorer. Todays sidemount is much slicker!
That is so great.
great videos Ray
Looking great. Just about ready for my Sol-Ark start up. Totally off-grid! Yeah!
Nice brother thanks for sharing. I see all your videos. Love the one's on building. That rubber membrane is smart. I am going to do that for now on. Thanks for all the grate videos. God Bless.
Love the vids thanks for the info working and panning to build a 50 kWh for our home
I think that this was a great clear video with great video. I hope that you are all right and keep up the great work.
Thanks so much and I’m doing great!! I just have to be patient with myself because when you spend decades managing the labor of dozens of people and then start doing it all by yourself then the lower production rate takes getting used to.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff that would be normal I think. You’re doing great.
You’re answering my questions now thanks ! And I can use more then 1 charger thanks !
For the little bench power supplies, my favorite switching supply is the Hanmatek HM310 (0-10A, 0-30V). About $100. Digital controls, no way to accidentally bump them (requires button press to activate), decently efficient, and has two lock features. You can lock the voltage and current control. And you can also lock the default state at power-up (on or off).
The only issue with this PSU is that it isn't calibrated well so the output voltage can be off by up to 0.1V from what the display says. But that isn't an issue, just get the open-circuit output voltage to the desired value using a multi-meter for fine-tuning.
Word of warning on power supplies though... not all of them can be ganged together. In fact, most cannot, at least not safely. Check the output characteristics when the power supply is turned off. To be safe, when ganging supplies, or even when just charging a battery, it is best to run the output through a Shottky Diode. A big whopping one with a heat sink. Its a big safety issue. In free air the typical power diodes can handle around 5A without a heat sink, beyond that though you need a heat sink.
The dedicated battery testers / chargers already incorporate such diodes, or pairs of FETs to perform the same duty. Most bench power supplies do not. In anycase, the diode has around a 0.3V drop so getting the voltage dialed in is more difficult with a discrete diode in the loop (the voltage drop changes depending on temperature and current). But its really important as a safety mechanism when using bench supplies. Without them, if you get a power failure and the supply goes to ground, or the supply is turned off while it is still connected to the battery, it can short out the battery or cause a fire. I usually put an inline fuse in the loop too. Just one of those simple inline car fuses.
Valuable comment, hope people read it. At any rate, thanks for posting it.
Nice job on teaching me to use my bench top charger. I am about to charge up a 206 ah SOK battery. I will set voltage at 14.6v and current at 3A. Unknown soc since no device to track. Not sure you explained how you know the SOC on your batteries. This battery is normally in my boat in summer. Have Victron multiplus 2000 and BT shunt. Just did not want to pull it all out.
Thank you for that info. We need a charger with 100a in the market surprises now one made that yet.
Oh, can you share your battery box schematics? They look awesome. Also feel guilty not being subscribed to you been watching your videos all a long 🤦🏽♂️. Subscribed
Very helpful. Thank you!
Love the journey thx ray
I have the same 60V PSU (different label) which died too. It just kept blowing fuses. When I looked inside the switching transistors were dead short and the rectifier too. Got a better one now.
Thanks for showing and explaining your battery gear.
If you screw the charger leads with ringterminals down to batteries post you can get more amps for charging, because of lowering the contact resistance.
I thought so too and was surprised to discover that it isn't confirmed by testing. Increasing the torque value on a ring terminal does improve the charge rate to a point. Moving the small clips closer to the terminal does improve the charge rate and they can be improved slightly by changing to ring terminals. The big clamps seem to work as well as the ring terminals. I will probably replace the ring terminals on the Riden unit with large clamps for the convenience and to reduce the number of times I tighten and loosen the terminals.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Thanks for your reply. Me myself got an increase by almost 40-50% of the amps going into the cell using ring lugs instead of the tiny crocodile clamps. The BIG clamps seem to work better as you said.
Have a nice day.
In the video you can see the 60v, 5A charger with the tiny crocodile clamps is inputing 5.15A+-. The 30v 10A with the ring terminals and 10awg wire is only imputing about 5A also. It puts in close to 10A on a low SOC cell. Unexpected but there it is.
If you change the wires with wires from multimeter and put ringterminals you will increase 100% the amperage. When i try this it went from 4A to 8A
Morning Ray, from downunder.
Thanks for the share Ray! Would you consider editing your Description by adding the name and model number of each of the PSU and the source/s you used to purchase these different units? Thanks!
If you pause the video the model numbers on each unit are visible and all were purchased from aliexpress except the EBC-A40L and I think they are all available on amazon.
Just found you today. Sure am glad that I did! Yes, I subscribed and liked. The info here is a REAL eye opener. What amp rating do you have for the wiring into your workshop?
Do you mean the main feed?
I can charge 5120wh/400ah of 12v LifePO4 batteries in 3 hours flat. Save on generator run time, Days of charging would mean I'm out of propane for my generator and my camper. I installed 4 terminal bus bars that i wired 4 separate 35 amp chargers to, totaling 140 amps when charging together. Now because the programming is the same they essentially function as one with identical charging curves. Before i came up with this, Generator charging was simply out of the question for me. Now its a real solution to my off-grid needs. Each LifePO4 battery has a 200amp BMS so charge rate is not only safe but only slightly above the recommended charge rate of 30% of your overall batteries capacity. In my case officially 120 amps is recommended but because of the charging curve as you pointed out I will only be getting close to 140 amps depending on the charging stage and state of battery discharge.
I have two 230ah LiTime bats that came 1/2 charged.I have a 60 amp Li charge controller in my rv.I’ll charge them separately with charge controller and then join the two bats together.What do you think about that method of charging? I don’t have a stand alone li charger.
NJ USA great video thank you
Ray I have tried to follow your process but still it’s a little bit confusing. Maybe it is possible to visualise on kind of step by step diagram. I really impressed by your technical expertise 👍
Great stuff, thanks and G’day from downunder 🇦🇺
Comment for your algorithm of course. 😆
Thanks grate wideo 👍👍👍
Thanks Ray
If you want your power supply to push full amperage you have to switch it from constant voltage (cv) to constant current (cc) mode for the majority of the bulk charge.
Thanks man!
Love the channel and the honesty. I wonder if you can give me some advice. I have to replace my battery pack on my solar setup. What would be a good replacement for 48v 400ah lead acid. I plan to contact Jenny but need to get everything lined up. My Midnite classic 150 will charge the batteries thru the BMS I hope you can recommend. I'm thinking something like 48v 200/280 ah as I only discharged the LA set to 85% on most days but want to get a lot more run time on a new set as my needs increased it will be powered by 4k array. Please add any items I might need to make this happen other then BMS batteries with BB and a charger like this video
I hope you find time to watch the videos I have made that answer all your questions. I try to give comprehensive information in the videos that contain far more complete answers than I can give here. Best of luck on your project.
Thank ~ You for sharing you’re Wisdom , I have a similar battery banks 3.2v 280A x 15 “ my Question is if you could be so kind to help me “ I have my banks changed up to 3.35v my 3.2v to keep the longest life what they say 3.2v for longest life ! My batteries have never been charged up 3.6v although I charge them at 3.65v about 14.33A at 15A my charger after a minute will black out what’s the best Voltage ?
Thanks Ray for the information. Top balancing the batteries takes a long time. Why not hook them up with a BMS and have the MPPTs charge them then, once one of the cells reaches the max voltage, disconnect the battery, connect the cells in parallel and continue top balancing them in parallel?
In a time crunch, that is what I would do but I have time and I avoid the additional reconfiguring of the cells.
One more educational videos, Thank You 🙏 Btw, you never mention the model of your milliamps resistance tester, the focus was out for us to read. I think we will all need to have one if we want to assemble our own batteries. Hope you can comment on this
Thanks man
Hi Ray grettings from South Africa off grid.... I have just purchased what I see you have replaced from Amazon a WANPTEK DPS series DC power supply 30 V 0-10A with Encoder Coarse & Fine Adjustments Knob, Beach Power Supply with USB & Type-C Quick-Charge Interface. I have 4 x 3.2v105ah EVE batteries I am trying to charge in parrallel (tried individually as well) with charger set to 3v which jumps to 10.45amps with no voltage showing when I connect then the negative starts getting very hot and starts to smoke so I disconnect. Tried both Voltage and Current Regulation settings, which screams when using it? Batteries were all 3v exept one was 2v tested individually.
I like your channel above all for your wonderful hair; ) jokes aside..
It's good that someone has finally tested all the scam sellers from China who claim that they sell gold, but the product you as a customer get delivered is sometimes crap. and when building big batteries, cells that have a capacity way below what you paid for are nothing but SHIT at least for the customer who bought them.. so keep up the good work i'll follow you as soon as i have some spare time...
Hey Ray! Thanks for doing this video! I have been struggling with top balancing a 16 bat set... Giving us links is not about making money off us.. its about helping people to find the charger you use.. thing is I see you using it and id rather use something that I know works than buying one and finding out it wont work... for example I have so far searched Amazon, Ebay and Aliexpress and I am just not locating anything called Wamptek
I also considered buying this thing: ALITOVE 5V 60A 300W Power Supply Transformer Adapter Converter AC110V/220V .. got no clue if it would work as its primarily an LED driver.. but the numbers seem to make sense..
When I go to google and type in wamptek and amazon the options jump off the page at me and the same with aliexpress. The images are of the same power supplies that I show in my video. Those links really are about making money. I don't see any links on youtube that aren't affiliated links. The links must be maintained as they break and change. I always prefer to help people find things rather than offer step by step direction. I want to teach skills and understanding. If you tell me what you need and why you need it, I will help you find it. I made this video because someone was having a hard time figuring out what seemed like a problem. I hope to share understanding. Isn't that better than posting links? I want people to understand what they need. Maybe that's the wrong approach but it's what I've done for 40 years.
That's Wanptek
@@aldroidmann4869 Ahh! Wanptek.. Thank you
Ah yes that's true but google will fix it for you. lol
Thank you for your time and insight. Your videos have helped inspire me to make my own batteries. I’ve recently been looking at chargers like this, to top balance a 280 amp hour 48V battery. After watching this video it makes me wonder if I’m able to use power supply designed for ham radio to bulk charge my battery, in reference to top balancing. It is adjustable, and I could confirm the voltage with a multi meter. Do you feel I could safely use that to top balance? It’s a MFJ-4230MVP 30mm problem switching power supply. Thank you for your time and any input is welcome!
I can't answer your question without researching your power supply. I can't take the time to do that. Sorry
Hi Eric, I have my general ham license and I don't think that charger is rated for 48 Volts and I'm not sure how you would be accurate with a needle meter if that's the one you are talking about. Not sure that would work well. Just my thoughts.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Thanks for taking the time to reply, no worries you’re a busy person! It is a DC power supply and well regulated. The multimeter showed it can adjust to 3.65v. So I’ll do some more research and will report back the result if I give it a shot.
@@LivingFree4All I was going to parallel the set of cells for the top balance at 3.6-3.65v. The benefit of the MFJ is it can push 30amps vs the 10a versions. It could make a difference for the 13.4kwh battery. Thanks for your reply! More research in tinkering. 73
Did you measure the efficiency of the bench power supplies?
Great video. I am left wondering what I actually need. If money is no factor, what do I buy to build and test these batteries 12v, 24v and 48v?
I haven't researched the options available if money is no object but I know they are in the range of 10,000 USD.
I have to return the 5 amp PSU to microcenter but I had to top balance 12 200 ah cells took a couple days to get them to 3.7 v I followed will prowse advice about it
Great video! I have a question about how you reorganize the cells after top balancing them. It looks like in the wooden battery box you have them all lined up so that you can put bus bars between all the positives and negatives for top balancing. But then in the final assembly you switch every other cell so that a bus bar goes from a positive terminal to a negative terminal is that correct? If that's the case, do you take the cells out of the fixture while they are fully charged? I've seen some people say that the only time to unfixture a cell is when it's at a lower state of charge, but it would seem like that would be very difficult to flip all the cells around after they are top balanced. Do you find that you only need to fixture them during a charge cycle so it's okay to move them around after they are top balanced?
Yep, swap every other one end for end. Watch my “Let’s build a battery “ video.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff oh sweet! I had just watched all of your battery videos posted in the last year or so, I hadn't scrolled back far enough to see the ones from 2 plus years ago yet! Guess I have more catching up to do!
I noticed you wired #10 with a reverse return. The others you're test simple parallel. I was taught:
Simple parallel charges each cell slightly less as the distance from your connection increases.
Reverse return parallel charges more evenly by keeping the current path nearly equal to all of the cells.
Is this correct?
I'm not sure I understand what you are saying. I don't test in parallel. Is that a typo? Here is a video that shows how I top balance while using the energy in a newly completed and fully charged 58v battery(from the top balance at 3.65v). th-cam.com/video/FH7xQmKIE8g/w-d-xo.html Let me know if this clears things up. I hope the video is understandable. Thanks for supporting the channel.
Great video, Ray. Would it be possible to use a cheap +12VDC 50A switching supply (like the Meishile S-600-12 for $56.99 on Amazon), adjust the output as low as it'll go (-5% to +11.4VDC) and tie three batteries in series to charge them? (Of course, you'd have to build clamp jumpers to crisscross terminals for the series connection.) Assuming the 280wH batteries are half charged, that would mean I'd have to charge 140wH x 3 = 420wH total. Which with a 50A supply would take 8.4 hours to charge. If this would work, there's another, more basic question I have. Is there an issue with these cells - charging them over the 3.65V? After all, the 11.4V supply divided by three batteries is 3.8V.
OK so you have now edited your question. I can answer your question but please don't edit your question after I answer because then my answer makes no sense. Just reply with a new comment. To answer this question. no
The problem is twofold. You never want to put these cells in series without a BMS. You will make a mistake and damage the cells. You can charge at an elevated voltage but it is a really bad idea because the flat charge curve makes it very difficult to know your state of charge and when you get near the top the voltage spikes and unless you are constantly monitoring each individual cell with a BMS then the first to reach a high SOC will spike to damaging high levels. Let's say you charge at 11.4v and two of the cells are at 3.3v and one is at 100% SOC. That cell will go to 4.8 volts and it will be permanently damaged. It simply isn't worth the risk. Power supplies are expensive but trashing your cells is more expensive. Sorry, there is no shortcut that isn't too risky. Many have tried and failed on the forum.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Thanks Ray. Very much appreciated.
Thanks for your insights.
If you have most cells at 3,2998 V and last testet cell at 3,2829, difference Voltage is at 0,0169 V.
If resistance of copper busbar is about 0,05 milli Ohm that is 0,00005 Ohm. 0,0169 V differnce between testet cell and others divided by 0,00005 Ohm if the connecting busbar is about 338 Amps at least at the first moment. So that is no low amperage.
In the middle of the curve with about 3,3 V lowest differences of voltages mean biggest differences of capacity, so biggest amounts of energy traveling between cells, so longest time of traveling and heating at high amps.
Woudn't it be better to go at high voltage after testing? Trying to hit a difference of 0,01 V there? Where amounts of energy between 0,01 V is less, time of traveling is shorter, Voltage differences come closer faster, high amps and heating is shorter? Or do you definetly know, that that method lasts much longer? And if yes, why?
Of course, it lasts longer to bring one cell to high voltage after discharge test, but you could add your strongest chargers together to accelerate and it lasts shorter to top balance it at the end. The amount of energy is the same with both methods.
But nevertheless one method might last longer all together than the other because the amount of chargers works different at different voltage levels and amps for loading might be tapering down faster for one of both methods.
I found a charger that charges 0 - 15 V at 60 A. And Amps are tapering down slowly. I get 60 A when setting 3,5 V at 3,3 V cell. For about 115 €.
Excellent video! Hey does your 40 amp tester really charge at 40amps? I have 3 of them ...I'm pretty sure they only discharge with 40 amps and maximum charge rate is 20 amps. I'm not home now to check forsure but I think that's all mine are.Am I wrong?
Yes, this model does charge at 40 amps. There is a 20 amp model.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff that's great I never did actually try to charge with more than 20 amps with my units.
Heya! I noticed those tanks ou have in the background , not to be too nosy,but what are they used for?
I blend gasses for scuba diving. They store 32% oxygen blend for diving.
There is a nifty trick that the EV industry uses when charging lithium cells of any type and that is to raise the charging target voltage above that of a fully charged pack but only for that flat main power band of the cells, the chargers take a look at the delta V change over time and can detect when they are in that flat power band and then using a constant current mode the target voltage is raised to maintain the 10Amps or 100Amps or whatever the charge amperage target is, then when the charger detects the delta V increasing more rapidly the system drops the target voltage down to that of a fully charged pack so you only spend a very tiny amount of time relatively in that Ohms law low(ish) charge power mid ground.
I love your work and your unnest and humble attitude, for me as Christian it says much 😀. I bought also bad cells 200 amps but after problems whit balancing , bought a power supply and find out that they give 182, 180, 177, and 150 amps ! What can I do to stil use al this cells. (I wanted to use them for a electro outboard motor)
Your battery will be limited to less than 150AH.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff is it possible to make 2 battery packs ; 1 of 177 amps and 1 of 150 amps maybe whit cels that are a little higher in amperage?
@@ernestlageman1553 you could replace the 150AH cell with a better one and have a 177AH pack. Would that be worth buying another cell? To me it would not make sense unless I had to have the additional capacity because the cost of the replacement cell would be more than the value of the improvement.
Now that you are receiving grade A cells, why capacity test each cell? That takes a long time and uses a lot of energy. I would think spot testing a couple of cells per battery would give you enough confidence you've got a good batch. I use the Zketech to bring each cell up to 3.65V @40A with a cutoff @15A. That's taking me about 5 hours for each cell. My EVE LF304's came at ~66% SOC. If I capacity tested each cell, that would take me 22 hours for each cell finishing with a charge using the Zketech alone. Then, I top balance by connecting all 16 cells in parallel and charging to 3.6V @40A with a cutoff @1A to ensure absorption.
I have a spread sheet that records all test values of each cell and each tested battery. I then group the strongest and weakest cells together. When I build a battery I compare the weakest performing cell to the values in my spread sheet. I then try to learn from what I see. I am happy to have the data for the future. A portion of the energy is created by discharging completed batteries during the battery capacity tests. I made a video about that. Finally, I'm not concerned about waste heat created as it is winter so while it only has a COP of one, it isn't going to waste. I would not discourage someone from taking the path you are suggesting. It isn't my path for the reasons stated.
Many people think that top balancing isn't necessary and that active balancers will eventually get the job done. You and I choose to top balance. Horses for courses.
And I thought I was particular (my wife calls it something else) 😊. I keep a spreadsheet as well for each cell including order date, date received, box tracking number, production date, serial number, nominal & measure voltage, internal resistance, date charged, etc. I also keep the outputs from the Zketech, data, curves, etc. for each cell. So far all my cells have been almost identical. Any chance of publishing drawings for your battery boxes? I need to do that next. I'll put them into SolidWorks for you if you are interested and have some sketches.
hi you spoke about the power supply you built yourself which unit is that and have you s link whwre to buy it from its the unit on the bottom of the 2 x stack chargers
That’s a Riden RD6018. Shop around for current best deals as they change. I saved by getting it shipped from China. You need the case, power supply and the faceplate/control panel. I had to replace the cooling fan with a ball bearing version for 5$. I have a couple of videos about that. I recommend you go ahead and do that rather than go through the warranty process should it fail.
Ray
Did you get your panels from your connection at alibaba?
No, my existing panels I have had for 6 years and they were supplied and installed by a local contractor.
Is that a cell internal resistance tester?
Ray , I think you have made it worse you see I’m a complete novice. I stumbled on the A40 L and the manual was totally in Chinese and s,far I haven’t been able to find a manual. You’ve helped a lot so far but to make all connections would help a lot. I’ve already went the 5 A route
And waited weeks changing a16 cell 250 per cell battery and decided it was futile so I bought 40 but alas no manual. I am patient but…
Thanks for your help so far.🙂
Did you ever find out what the fan problem was with the RIDEN power head? Really would like to know. Thanks!
i did a followup video where I showed that it was a defective cooling fan. They sent me 5$ and I ordered a replacement from amazon. It was an easy swap out. No problems since.
i just purchased WANPTEK 0-30 volts @ 10 Amps with Wattage display. I bought this for an experiment i wanted to do with my Bluetti EB3A Solar Generator. When there isnt any sun i can run the power supply into the EB3As solar input. I can get very close to the max wattage which is 200 watts i got about 190 something, id have to get back and look at the video i made for the exact wattage. It works perfect. The power supply did get a little warn not hot just a little warm to the touch .I only did a short test i have no idea if the power supply will crap out after hours of being pushes close to the max output?
I have the Valence batteries it seems a little simpler and less time consuming than all those individual batteries. Balancing, plus adding a BMS, to me that's a nightmare i don't want to visit, yikes! Sometimes ill watch Off-Grid Garage he cracks me up with how annexed he gets when the batteries are out of balance.
Hello Ray, Riden PC software has "Battery Charging" column where it shows you "Output Ah, Output Wh". So I am wondering if it can be used for capacity testing a battery in charge mode instead of ZKTECH 40L?
Nope, you’ll need a four wire tester.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff wait, we need four wires to ensure the accurate voltage reading on the battery terminals. I guess for a discharge test when we need to set the cutoff voltage that would be important. Or if you're interested in those graphs. But if all I want to know is how much current was fed into the battery, I think that can be measured at the supply output, right So technically, does this "Output Ah" column shows you the capacity, or is it for something different?
i did subscribed
Bonjour Ray, je suis française. J'aimerai comprendre ce que vous expliquez sur le ZKETECH A40L, mais l'anglais "parlé" m'est difficilement accessible. Pouvez vous dans votre montage sur TH-cam studio ajouter les sous titres . Je vous en remercie par avance. Ce sujet en France n'est pas abordé et expliqué de manière aussi pointue. J'ai investi dans cet appareil et suis en train de monter ma première batterie de 16 cellules LiFePo4 Lf280K de chez Basen. L'équilibrage de départ étant important pour la durée de vie de celles ci, tout comme la compression. Bonne continuation. Marine
I have 8 304 AH cells for my van arriving tomorrow. I am setting them up as 2 separate 12V batteries 2 BMS & active balancers. Do I need to bother top balancing them or can I just put them in service & run them through a few cycles & let the active balancer do it?
Depending on the relative state of charge and the balancing current capacity of your active balancer, relying on the active balancer could take a very long time. Another method is to let the BMS charge the battery to cutoff and then use a small power supply to top of the low cells one by one while monitoring. Top balancing is easier and/or safer.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Ok, thank you very much.
I know this is completely off topic but: What is the purpose of the bank of high pressure cylinders in the background? Is the green thing on the wall a nitrogen membrane? The mystery has been driving me crazy!
Banks of EAN32 for scuba The green thing is a nitrox stick that allows me to precisely continuous blend 32% nitrox with my high pressure compressor. I can also blend any blend of trimix with my booster.
Hello, I have the same EBC A40L, it's a very good tool, but I found that my EBC A40L was not safe, the metal box was not connected to the ground. Could you check your ?
I just checked and found no continuity between the case and ground.
Mine neither 😭
This is the most professional box yet! Do you have plans for the box you would be willing to share?
What are these plans that you speak of?
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff The super awesome 16s 280ah battery box! Sorry if I posted beneath the wrong video.
@@rodneyhrytsak3407 I figured that. Have you seen the videos I made about building them?
I found my cut sheet if that would help but seriously I don't work from plans. I mostly do little hand doodles that get my ideas on paper but I don't spend enough time on them for them to make sense to other people. Even I sometimes don't understand them if I find them a few years later. Would you like the cut sheet for the box parts?
Yes I have seen the videos you sure do nice work! Cut sheet would be great also what is the amp rating on the Anderson connectors you used?
ATTENTION: 16:50 I had the same 10 A dying most likely a LW or longwej made or the 5A version. The pre corona boom prices just 1 year ago were 60$ or € but that has changed, therefore the new black successor has a higher price.
You simply got the successor. If your next one might dy which they do sooner or later then have a look at the eev blog youtub channel or the forum, which is the biggest for such electronics cause there you find support, schematics for even exotic chinese parts and pieces.
Dave Jones runs the channel for 12 years or so and the forum, so a huge foundation about electronics knowledge, where to look, what to check how to repair and the warning when it would be in vain.
i know about that cause I had to search a solution for my LW 305E and saw the successor, that black beauty , while i found the schematics for mine and the programmable software and manual, cause I need to understand the RS485 communication.
BTW: great construction videos before, the roof and insulation ones.
Hi Ray. Love your videos. Very impressed with your integrity. Wife and I retired and live in a very rural area of Yucca Arizona. We are completely off grid. We are on solar and using lead acid cells currently. We purchased 32 cells of LiFePO4 batteries a while back with plans the replace the lead acid batteries. We were lucky and got some good cells after a long wait. We would like to buy another set of 16 cells but am troubled with what is going on internationally. We don’t mind the wait in shipping. It’s just now the concern is being able to get them at all. I think I remember you mentioning that you can get these batteries through a Texas warehouse. Do you make the arrangements with Jenny to do this or is there a separate link to contact them? Also, do you pay more for the batteries from the Texas warehouse then coming direct from China? We don’t mind paying a little more, at this time the main concern is being able to get them. Thanks for taking your time to explain a lot of things Ray. I’m still in the learning phase. Looking forward to seeing more of your videos.
Contact Jenny Wu and she can get you sorted on the price and time differences. Her email is jennywu896@gmail.com. Good luck with your off grid expansion.
I got 16 280ah eve lifepo4 cells beautiful brand new condition for 2500$ after tax through Docan power each cell was 147$e w free shipping I got them yesterday and ordered the day before you posted this comment
I pointed that one out to another channel. Pop the battery out of the laptop if it doesn't work, Ray. Still will work.
Laptop batteries are cheaper to replace now.
Old batteries bulge. Better to remove them before they damage the laptop.
@restfulplace3273 Depends on what country you are from in that respect. Plus, the bmses are normally the problem in the cheaper replacement battery packs, too.
What about putting charge from Solar inverter setting max voltage 54 with 60A
That is the approach that many take.
what you sell those for ?
For those looking for the chargers and testers in the video. Hope this helps. Comment with any corrections if anything is incorrect.
Wanptek KPS3010DF - PS
ZKETECH EBC-A40L - PS
WanpteK KPS1566D - PS
RIDEN - Many button PS
Wanptek DPS305U - Black PS
LeTkingok YR1035 - tester
Watched the video quite a few times and it is a really good video.
👍👍👍
what's with all the gas bottles in the background ?
Cheers Dave
Scuba
If you could put the names and model numbers of the power supplies that you use in the description, that would be so helpful. Not links, just names. I've watched this video like 5 separate times everytime I go to research power supplies. lol
Amazon and eBay show a couple of models with the same number; are there models for LiFePO4 and models for regular batteries?
The ones I use are battery chemistry agnostic.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff There are several models with the same model number; which model did you buy? A link would be more than great.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff You can't be serious. I'm getting ready to pull the trigger; I want the 40A charger and I want it to graph. Do all of those models do that? Where did you obtain you 40A charger?
8 x 280 Ah is just 2240 Ah and 5 Ah is not much, even SOC 50% would meand that each day making 120 Ah at max due to the low voltage.
but still 1220 Ah by 120 Ah /d ends in 10 days and even more due to the fact that the 5A can not be fully used always.
And that is before building packages and checking the capacity.
Long way to go with small chargers.
I can verify that, day 14 charging my 8 280ah batteries and on cell #7 now lol. Mainly because as you get it topped off the amps drops to 2a, 1a and even less so it really slows down. I'm charging one cell at a time because I'm cheap and waiting for it to come from china but it's finally very slowly working with this 10 amp charger (really 2-1amp and less) . Once I get the last 2 charged another a few days, then I can connect in parallel and .... spend another week or more actually top balancing them finally. lol By the time I finish I should get my EBC-40 from China LOLOL.
Hi Ray have you found a reliable supplier or are you still getting ripped of.Thanks
Supplier for what?
what's up with the blur box
I also was surprised how long it take. And it stays at one value and do not change at all. So I also bought the EBC. Now wait to get it from china.
Hello, I want you to map bms 16S / 51V / 3,2V 32 batteries / 230Ah Thank you
Great video Ray and I must ask why so many batteries?.
Cloudy days.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Excellent.
@@sh839c have you seen the latest video?
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Yes sir I have been catching up as well. Great stuff.
I wondered why I can't find one cell for sale in the U.S. Gasoline generators are looking good again. Compression is good, compression is bad. Buy this and you definitely need that. Where does anyone get the money for that many batteries? I appreciate your knowledge about the device but did this just come on the market? Wish I'd heard about about it before I sent China $69 bucks for a 10A charger. Do I really need 40A's for a 16 cell battery?
How are you dumping power from one battery bank to another?
There is a specific video about that
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Do you have a video title or approximate time when that was released. I couldn't find it. I thought I watched all the videos.
Top Balancing DIY Lifepo4 Cells and Using Multiple Power Supplies!!
Hi, I really love and appreciate your content, is it possible to get your contacts? I just have a few questions.
🤙
What are the tanks for... batteries?
I fill my own scuba tanks. Those tanks store a mixture that is 32% oxygen.
So as long as I have a BMS on lets say 4 280Ah batteries in series, I can use my 50 amp, 12 volt power supply?? It's not really a charger, it's used with my Ham Radio equipment ....Astron 50 amp power supply..... Thanks for educating us!
What voltage does it put out?
4 in series would give me a 12 volt battery....@@RayBuildsCoolStuff
Hi Ray, It's a 12 volt power supply.....@@RayBuildsCoolStuff
Well, from what I've read, I should use a LiFepo4 battery charger......simple as that....
If you can set it to put out 14volts and reduce the current to zero as that voltage is reached then it will work fine.