Debunking the Pros: Can WAGO Lever Nuts Handle Heavy Electrical Loads?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 เม.ย. 2023
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I setup a test to find out if WAGO 221 lever nuts can handle heavy electrical loads. I will test wire nuts vs WAGO 221 and take temperature measurements while running 23 Amps at 120 Volts through each connector for 20 minutes. At the end we will compared the results and confirm or deny the concern of many Pros that WAGO lever nuts can't handle heavy electrical loads and will fail.
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The wago lever nuts are tested to European and German standards, and they are good standards for safety. While it may have slightly higher resistance due to the busbar arrangement, it is far less likely to experience user error and a poor connection in a DIY situation. The locations I use these most are for light fixtures, which have low draw. Good demonstration and good data. That was a well designed experiment. Thanks for putting it out there!
They've also been using them over there for decades
@@feelingtardy make that "a bunch of decades". The lever connectors may be newer, but we have used their predecessors for ages. I used the first one when my parents built their house in the early 80s. Wire nuts are legal here, but nobody even considers them for anything beyond low voltage / low current applications. They may have one or two advantages, but they have far too many disadvantages.
So your afraid of using them for high amp draw? Great product then. Your fears are correct.
Would be nice if they sold a version with a beefier busbar for less resistance. I can see how this could cause issues if run in series over 10± recepticles. That last one might have significant voltage drop to harm sensitive electronics.
@@aaronlandry3947 there is no reason for this. The voltage drop is within code requirements and far smaller than the allowable fluctuations in power lines, and right now I can think of no electrical device that is THAT kind of sensitive to the voltage of its power supply.
I want to clarify something Scott keeps saying which is a little misleading (and that is Wago's fault): Wago 221 lever nuts are a FAMILY of products with different current ratings and gauges of wire. The ones Scott is using are the 221-41X side of the family which are rated at 20A/300V. The X represents the number of conductors, so 221-415 is a 5-wire Wago. Now the misleading part: there are different Wago 221s for higher current applications up to 30A/300V and supporting conductors from 20-10 AWG. If you need Wagos for higher current circuits then those are what you need, and they are available in 221-612, 613, and 615 sizes. Sadly, no inline splice connector in the higher range yet.
You are correct. They would be required here in Europe for the load that was applied in the test.
We use the Ideal connector on our projects everyday we are using them to run low wattage AC motors around 60 watt each. With hundreds of installations we have not had any issues yet!! God willing I hope it stays that way!!
You are only partly correct. 20A rating is only for Japan (PSE JET) only. In europe and north it is rated at 32A (ENEC & cULus).
@@shopart1488This Wago connector is rated at 32A. His info is a bit misleading.
No 4 hole Wagos at all. They would be very useful when needing to put 4 wires together, but there's only 2, 3, and 5 hole versions.
I'm a licensed electrician. I've been working for 25 years. I've used Wagos for most of that time. We've used them in residential, commercial and industrial conditions. Lighting retrofits, new home construction, remodels, and pretty much everything including high amp loads. I've been back to some of those jobs months or years later for various reasons and been back inside some of the boxes with the Wagos installed. None were melted. All were perfectly fine. I've never had to go back to a job because of a problem with the Wagos.
They have been used in Europe for decades. They are tested to German standards. They are UL approved. And this test also shows that fears of Wagos being unsafe are unfounded. They are just fine. They are not a problem at all. I understand why some are skeptical but Wagos are perfectly safe. I have them in my home wiring.
Wagos are also clear so you can see how the wires are seated inside the device. You can't do that with wire nuts. You can't see inside to verify the wires are correctly seated. Wagos are also easier for a DIY to get right.
I've had wirenuts melt on me, mostly because the twisting mechanism on an old wire to a new wire can result in the old wire being damaged and cause arcing / higher resistance. In the instance where the wirenut melted on me before, a wago nut more than likely would have prevented it because it would of been less likely to damage the old wiring.
Your another one who thinks everytime those things fail your going to get a phone call. Ive seen melted down ones and intermittent connections and wires falling out of them. The levers open when you push them into a box or with vibration over time.Burned and black. If wirenuts are applied properly and wires twisted right they never fail. If wagos are applied properly they do fail. Nothings better than a copper to copper mechanical connection . Not a double spring contact resistor where the conductors dont even meet.
@@RadioRich100 I use the push on Wagos, not the lever ones. They are just as safe as wirenuts and you can see into them and tell if the connection is good. I've seen far more melted wirenuts.
finally an Aamerican electrician who isn't retarded. My home is 1972, metal boxes, no leeway with wire lings, twisted wires are f***ing nightmare in remodels. Anyone still twisting wires loves bud light.
I had a gas furnace blower fan that used traditional wire nuts. The unit would blow a slow blow fuse about once a year since the day it was new. Then one day the slow blow fuse blew instantly. After some examination, found 2 of the traditional wire nuts that had been installed new with the furnace in 2010, (which by that time was 2017 so only 7 years old) had melted completely through each other and they were shorting/making contact with each other and it was black/charred and the plastic was melted away. Carefully wired it with traditional wire nuts 6 years ago and have not needed any more fuses, but I was very diligent about separating each of the wire nuts so they were not making contact with each other in the box. I was very disappointed in the insulating capability of the original wire nuts but now seeing this video I wonder if it was a heat problem all along. So I wonder that if a traditional wire nut can melt in that application, I would be reluctant to go with a WAGO knowing that it's just a little bit more sensitive to melting. Edit: maybe not more sensitive to melting but rather seems to cause the connection to run just a tad hotter.
I’ve seen some shotty work done on home electrical components. It’s not uncommon to see a wire nut hanging on by a thread. I’d say if you know what you’re doing as an electrician you will get similar results from using either option (some prefer the ease of the WAGOs sure, but I mean in terms of function). But a poorly installed wire nut could actually be a bigger threat posed compared to the higher resistance of the WAGO connections.
That is pretty much exactly my stance as well.
@@EverydayHomeRepairs May I pimp a video from several years ago, done by a friend of mine in the uk... I am the eponymous chipmunk who sent him the connector 'string' th-cam.com/video/2uYD8e7idnY/w-d-xo.html
Thats because this guy probably did it.
@@RadioRich100 who?
Shotty work is the person doing it. A shotty product fails no matter who does it.
2:41 I have the same IR camera and something you should be aware of is the the surface material you’re measuring will definitely affect the temperature value shown. The factor is called emissivity and needs to be taken into account. Shiny or polished surfaces have very different values than dull or matte ones. You should be aware of this when comparing temperatures. Tables are available and a common trick is to use a piece of electrical tape where you want to measure to ensure each test point has the same emissivity.
I was going to mention as much
Great observation. I used to work with blackbodies, which had super high (absorbed most energy) emissivity ratings.
Was thinking the exact same, can't tell you how many times my eyes have rolled at videos with people trying to compare surface temperatures who have no understanding of emissivity. I've also personally found different angles to cause different readings on any surface so good luck getting the exact readings on surfaces that bend and meander.
2:23 Yes, covering it up with a white plastic faceplate may end up throwing things off more than they help.
Ideally, using a thermocouple for the actual measurement would be more accurate than the IR camera, though the camera can help to determine where the localized hot spots are.
@@dubmob151maybe more precise, not necessarily more accurate. I doubt that using a thermocouple would show a huge delta in the results, if anything, they would all change together and my hypothesis is that they will still be will below the safety margin.
I can only say one thing:
If it is UL CSA CCA EU.... approved, you can use it without any worries, as long as it is used as intended.
I have been working with those standards on an industrial base for almost 50 years now and trust me,
you can rely on them. Also, spring terminals have been approved for industrial use for many years now!
exactly
Thank you for your experience, especially with the standards you cited. I understand and I completely agree with you. I think what Scott is doing is giving the do-it-yourself’r, without the understanding of those standards, some confidence In the technology.
They also approved aluminum wiring. Nothing more needs to be said.
@@RadioRich100 anything used wrong or installed badly will be a problem. Sort of like old houses with knob and tube. Used as is, likely fine. But many touched it poorly and added loads not intended for the circuit size.
@@RadioRich100 BINGO!
I have an older model mobile home, and if you have ever seen the nightmare of those plug-in receptacles, where there maybe 3 Romex wires at 1 receptacle, it will get a little spooky as to solve the issue of a replacement. So I came to TH-cam to learn how to make my own repairs, and is where I learned about the WAGO Lever Nuts. So I went to Amazon, I ordered a small bag of them. The day they arrived I fixed my first receptacle, and before I went to sleep, went back to Amazon and ordered the BIG variety box of them. I did this 2 or 3 years back and have not had any issues so far, and will purchase them again if they are needed! I have rheumatoid arthritis, and these are so much easier to use than wire nuts! Peace and love and stay safe everyone, and remember to turn off your main breaker, before you begin your work!
For the comparative testing, it's simpler to just measure the voltage drop rather than doing all the temperature measuring, because the heat generated is basically that voltage drop times the current. That calculation is the amount of power being dissipated in the box, and easily compared between each other as well as the baseline.
So true. Also what's missing in the "experiment" is doing multiple cycles. One cycle is not a valid experiment. Do 100 cycles to give the normal heat/cool cycles and then measure the resistance after that. Of course to do that you need a labratory grade ohm meter, which he doen't have.
Using an ammeter and a standard DMM could do the measurement fairly accurately, if the heater draws about 12 to15A, measure that with an ammeter, and then measure the voltage across the connector terminals with a DMM in the millivolt range. Divide the voltage by the current and it can read the milliohms of the connector.
The specialized meters for milliohms usually just apply about a 1A current and read the voltage to get the calculated readings.
@@davepompea if you need to have a laboratory ohm meter then its insignificant to its application.
That would make for a rather boring video though.
I have been replacing my ceiling lights with integrated LED fixtures and exclusively used Wagos since the current draw is so much lower and is so much easier for me to install. No more hoping the stranded and solid wires will twist together.
There is no issue for a skilled worker to splice solid to stranded with wire nuts.
@@barfy4751 Emphasis on "skilled". You could make the same statement about using solder connections instead of wire nuts. Why don't we go back to that? Wagos are harder to install incorrectly and make it more likely to get a secure solid to stranded connection. They are the next step forward. Their only downside is price.
@@driatrogenesis I’ve never heard that claim before. Could you please elaborate?
@@driatrogenesis While LEDs can be more intense than light bulbs, have you ever looked at an LED? An LED spot has 10-30 small LED cells over the entire light area, meaning that it emits the same light as the thin, point-like incandescent light bulb wire over the massive area of the light bulb. Similarly, outside spot lights, standalone LED light bulbs might have 3-8 strands of LED wire in them, emitting much more spread out and less intense light than an equivalent light bulb with a single strand of high-energy wire.
LEDs are bluer, but this is blue at around 465 nm. Dangerous blue light (ultraviolet radiation) only starts at 124 or so nm. Unlike incandescent light bulbs, which emit most of their light as entirely invisible IR radiation, LEDs usually emit zero UV and zero IR, meaning all of their light is visible. As there is no UV in a white LED, the waves emitted are far too long to cause damage to cells. A white incandescent light bulb on the other hand *must* always emit a dangerous amount of invisible UV light, which white LEDs are incapable of, causing possibly serious damage akin to looking directly at the sun. The blue light from LEDs is pure, it has no UV, but the muddier light from incandescent light bulbs must *always* include UV to some extent and this increases the whiter the colour temperature - a 2200 K has less UV than a 3500 or a 4000 К bulb. UV does cause irreversible damage, and the fact that a white incandescent bulb needs to be more blue than an equivalent LED bulb, that is, it emits more dangerous high-energy radiation than an equivalent LED is a good case for switching to LEDs outside the energy concerns.
I am glad that you put in the max temp on the graph. It really put into perspective.
💯
You read my mind. After seeing you recommend Wago numerous times in your videos, I still hesitated when it came to my projects. “But the resistance is higher with the Wago; it’s safer to stick to wire nuts,” I told my self. Well, not any more! Thanks to your well-planned and well-run demonstration, I no longer have any hesitation. This is what I love most about your channel: you don’t just reach conclusions about different methods or parts, you take the time and effort to break them down and test them. Excellent work, yet again.
You need to reevaluate that. This guy is just a handyman. He knows nothing of what he talks about. Your fist opinion was correct.
@@RadioRich100 I've employed my share of tradespeople for work on a few homes over the decades. To say that handymen know nothing is wrong. Though they may have less experience in 1 specific field, a good handyman can often do a better overall job if they have experience in many different trades. I've found that a person who only focuses on 1 field, say an electrician, can often be a bit timid about making changes to plumbing, a heat duct, or drywall that might be in the way. Sure, if I want an electrical service change then I'll call an electrician. But, if I want to widen a closet door that might involve changes to framing, drywall, a receptacle, and a water pipe then I'd rather hire 1 good handyman than 3 specific tradespeople. And the end result would likely be better.
@@JasonEDragon ??? What the heck does that have to do with providing research on wagos that hes not qualified to give?
@@RadioRich100 Although I've seen videos from some very knowledgeable electricians (such as Mike Holt in the USA and John Ward in the UK), I've also seen seen electricians make videos with dubious comments about Wago connectors as well. This was just one short video and I thought that it was well done. And it is not as if electricians are designing these products at companies such as Ideal and Wago. I expect that instead they mostly employ people such as material scientists, electrical engineers, mechanical engineers, test engineers, statisticians, physicists and the like. If you are suggesting that only an electrician with several years experience should comment on these topics then I don't accept that.
I expect that over the coming years there will be a lot more smart devices being integrated into our electrical systems, which electricians will be ill prepared to handle only by themselves. So, more people can be expected to be tinkering with electricity and we will need devices that can better accommodate people whose area of experience varies.
@Jason Dragon these things are not smart or better or just as good. There faster and will cause points of failure as time goes on. Why do think wagos are banned in so many places?
My experience with wire nuts is that they can be a bit tricky to get right, especially if you mix wire types. The Wago do allow you to transit between just about any wire types without risk of an unreliable connection.
If you say wirenuts are tricky u shouldnt be doing the work in the first place.
@@RadioRich100 If they were not tricky, then licensed electricians would not get them wrong so often.
@@buggsy5 There not getting them wrong, theirs bad contractors everywhere. So now you have bad contractors using inferior products so they can get out of there faster. Pushing the wires back in the box and the wago levers are popping open for one.
Stranded and solid just don’t get along all the time. Ive had a wire nut melt but it took 5 years. Wago is a no brainer when using different wire
@@RadioRich100 rather do it myself. not going to pay you $250 to come in and put in 1 light switch. sorry.
There is another TH-cam video that tests Wago. They slowly cranked the amps up until the wires were smoking, but the Wago was not smoking. I love Wago. Much easier to use than wire nuts. You also have visual confirmation of the wire contacts. Wago is made in Germany and they have been in use in Europe for 20 years with no problems. Back in 1968 when I was studying to be an electrician we learned how to make solder splices like they did in the 1940s. After applying solder then wrap with rubber tape and then friction tape. I have run across old solder splices but I have never had to make one.
How about a test with wires connected with the two types of connectors in series, and then used to jump start a car with a peak draw over 600A, or using a carbon pile load tester?
It'd be like a tug of war; see if either of them have any problems at 20x spec current. Two DMMs across each connector to see the voltage drop will objectively determine resistance relative to each other.
Great move plotting the limit temp to scale the three connection options properly. I may be a mechanical engineer, not an EE, but a good experiment is a good experiment. I go Wago from here on out. I'll take a few degrees delta T at max load over an non-robust connection any day of the week.
Well done, I suspected the WAGO would be slightly more resistive (heat) however, it still works quite well and makes the jobs much easier. Cheers
I just did the math in a sub thread. 1 wago is ~ 2 WNs on solid, ~ 4 WNs on stranded (not sure, but I think those #s came from awg 14)
Wagos are junk and fail frequently.
Awesome experiment. I started using the WAGOs after watching Everyday Home Repairs. I'm 70 years old and cannot put as much strength into wire twisting as I used to. I'm a home DIYer and really appreciate you and your channel. You are my "go to" electrical TH-cam channel. Thanks for all you do. BTW, I know that wiring outlets in parallel has been done by many TH-cam electrical folks, but I'd love to see your teaching on how-to for those circuits. Have a happy Thanksgiving and God Bless You!
Sounds to me like you need someone who knows what he doing since you cant do it right.
Very informative! Maybe, do another video measuring voltage drop under load comparing 10 wire nuts in series to 10 Wagos in series. I suggest comparing using both a heat gun, then a typical load, like an HDTV, fridge, or fan.
Your average meter will struggle to read the difference. At full rated load, 20A, and 120V, that's 2400W going to the load. The Wago will dissipate 2W, absolute worst case. So 20W dissipated in 10 Wagos, 2380W still arriving at the load. Instead of 120V, the meter may read 119V.
I agree. We do not know if the temperature difference is due to the increase in waste heat due to voltage drop, less copper-copper sinking, or radiative properties of the connector. For example, a really good heat sink might look much hotter on a FLIR for the same heat source as a less good heat sink.
Honestly, in my opinion, these results are so close together that they perform identically. You might even get the same results as the WAGO using another wire nut from the same package.
@@DonaldZiems , When I make coffee, the voltage at the outlet drops from 122 to about 119. In most circuits, there are a few connections, so I'm wondering how they add up. Personally, I'd twist and use a wire nut, except where replacement is likely, like a light fixture or ceiling fan.
@@DonaldZiems i don't think a voltmeter would have trouble directly measuring the voltage drop though--measuring across the series of connections.
@@randypittman279, my point was that so little power is dissipated in the connections that you'd need a reasonably good meter to notice the lost tenths of a Volt. I think I once ran the numbers that a Wago's resistance is roughly the same as 10' of 14 AWG wire.
I am a DIYer, not an electrician. I have used Wago connectors and will continue to do so. After seeing your test, I feel more confident using them. Great test! I have learned so much watching your videos. Keep up the GREAT work.
your just lazy or cant manage the wirenuts. So maybe you shouldnt be doing the work.
Even better are the tests pumping 60 amps through a wire nut and a Wago, both rated for 20. Wire nut *melts*. Wago heats up but stays intact.
I have a house built in 1900. Most of the wiring has been replaced but there are still a couple of runs that haven't been done yet, I have to go with my budget so a little at a time. Now the 2 wires left were very busted up in the breaker panel so i ran new romex from the breaker out to a junction box where i spliced the old and new wires together. I used wago connectors since the old wires were paper coated, not pvc, i was able to keep them from fraying. Sorry for the long post. They really helped in my situation.
Very interesting. Your graphs show me exactly what I would expect. No surprises, no concerns. Great video!
First, thank you for taking the time to run this test and create this content. Very original and to the point. I REALLY appreciate it. I'll add, no one on any electrical channel or reddit ever seems to have an appreciation for how over-designed everything actually is. That means, you should use the approved connector, per it's instructions, that personally gives you the highest confidence. I can sweat copper and connect PEX. Both have good applications. But on a daily basis, I'm using PEX. However, on a DYI electrical, I use wire nuts because I think they are cheap and fine. I'd have zero problem with a wago too, if it came with a device.
I rewiring my basement with these (no choice, there was cloth wire and no grounds in original wiring). The first J-box on the largest circuit goes 5 ways with a Wago 221.
That circuit hits 10-12A quite a bit (Yes, I'm going to split that up after I get the fuse panel replaced)(Yes,, Fuse.. Not breaker)
I was feeling for heat when I put in the Wago, and it barely gets above room temperature when at full load for that circuit for several hours.
Wago's are awesome.
Yes they are 👍
Thank you for covering this subject. Very informative. I did not have that question in mind,since I have been amazed with these Wago lever nuts ever since I’ve been watching some of these electrical channels using them in some of the examples I needed at the time - including yours. Heat max performance never crossed my mind, but I’m glad you addressed it.
I am a remodeling contractor, formerly an electrician once. I use the Wagos all the time on 15 amp circuits but was always not sure how they would hold up on a 20 amp kitchen line. This was fantastic video. Great job! I am confident to use them on 20 now. Sweet! Thank you!
They have different ratings. Just like wire nuts. Just make sure you use one that is rated for the size circuit you are working on, and you are fine with either.
As someone that uses these in the HVAC trade for making connections to fans, compressors and solenoids, I have a high respect for them in their uses. I have found using wire nuts in high moisture environments like the cooled boxes of walk-in coolers/freezers and reach-in boxes they perform better. The wire nuts have rusted on me and I have to cut wire back and re-terminate with a new device VS the WAGO I can lift the lever pull the old device out and connect the new one without having a rust issue and loosing wire length. I still have my questions about them in high vibration environments and therefor will use either a wire nut or a termination block. Thank you for the insight into the temperature issues that people voice and prove they are still a better option for DIYers to use since strand to solid wire is not easy for the novice to do. I do use them at home in automotive too but in low current applications.
I've seen other videos of testing the 221 lever nuts. They don't begin to melt until around the 80 Amp mark.
And that is on a connector with a 32A rating...
This is pretty interesting and thank you for going the extra mile and using a high amperage load and examining it with an IR camera. You make really good points with regards the heat capacity. I have seen plenty of failures from loose lugs, bug nuts, stab in outlets, improper use of outlets as splice points, and you make a good argument for a way to splice wires easily, consistently and reliably.
What is attractive about the Wago product is its' ability to handle stranded wires as well as solid in a very straightforward and fuss-free manner. My house is done in wire nuts for the most part but any time work on a lighting fixture everything gets changed to Wago...
Best most comprehensive test I've seen yet. And, yes.... I do agree with other commenters on the pitfalls of wire nuts. It really doesn't take much giggling around for them to come loose if not done properlty (continue the twist 3 or 4 turns on the wires coming out on the wire nuts). Great job. I too was skeptical but certainly that was conclusive enough for me.)
I'm neither a teacher nor an electrician, but I'd show this to middle school kids as a demonstration of the scientific method in a real world scenario. You get a solid A for experiment design. Scottish-Canadian electrician W. P Marr patented the wire nut we know today in the 1930s. I'll betcha a hot pastrami and swiss on rye, a big-ass kosher dill pickle, and a cold beer that, if TH-cam had been around then, the guys who were married to solder-&-tape connections were making these same arguments.
I'll add that I find it 'way easier to get Wagu 211s to lay flat in a box that even the smallest wire nut.
Id rather a Genos Cheesesteak from Philly
Your analogy is nonsense, its the track record of wirenuts which lasts the life of the house. Wagos are questionable at best. They like them because there quick-no other advantage and not even just as good. They put resistance between conductors. With wire nuts connections between conductors are direct. Wagos are resistors with flip levers. No lab can tell you what happens in the field overtime. Remember aluminum wiring - its cheaper! They thought that was ok too. Hundreds of homes burned to the ground. And its still happening. Take your wagos and put one on your hot pastrami sandwich and eat it.
@@RadioRich100 Sorry if I offended your religion, but I'm an infidel. It's also too bad you don't know what an analogy is.
@@neilmarsh1904 Apparently you have never googled anything.
@@RadioRich100 . . .ha ha ha 😀😳😱😨🤣 pastrami sandwich - omfg thats hilarious !!
Great information.
What was the best, is when you trued up your graph. Using statistics and graphs to mislead is almost the oldest profession.
In your graph using 5 degree increments, you get a much different message, deceiving message.
Then you added the approved upper limit and the data dictates 20 degree increments and the truth really comes into focus.
As several have mentioned, getting wire nuts "right" is a learned skill. I have seen experienced electricians get it wrong sometimes.
For ease of use and very high probability of making the best connection, I say the safest choice is the WAGO lever nut.
I appreciate you going through this demo. I eases my mind a lot. This is easy more info than DIY people usually have..
Excellent video! The results are what I would expect- Wagos have more resistance but not enough to be an issue. Not even close. My personal belief is the issues that people have had with Wagos comes from not having the wire inserted straight and flat. If re-stripped prior to inserting all should be fine.
Great perspective against the design max temperature. That view puts the Wago in clear perspective. I’m staying with my Wagos. Thanks.
Excellent video! Really appreciate the quality of your research here. Thank you for doing such a good job collecting data and displaying it.
Thanks for this info. Great job on the test setup and data. I like that you get right to the point too
I switched to Wagos a couple of years ago and haven't looked back. They're better than wire nuts for many applications. like connecting stranded and solid wires, or connecting more than three conductors. You can visually check that all wires are fully inserted and it is easier to get everything in the box. Five 12 AWG wires in a blue wire nut with two full twists outside the nut (per code) is very difficult to stuff in a double gang or 4 square box. Wagos just make life easier.
Amen!
Good video. I believe long term results will show the true durability of the Wago lever nuts on high amperage loads, especially those loads that cycle on and off frequently. I think long term testing of the effects of the heating and cooling cycles of the spring mechanism of the Wago lever nut will be the true test for it. For example, look at the results of the backstab connections "which is basically a spring loaded connection" that a lot of people thought 30 or 40 years ago "or longer" was such a good ideal. Then look at the failure rate of those. I think Wago lever nuts are great for low amperage loads such as lighting circuits where the heat swings are less drastic. in 50 plus years of electrical work I have never seen a properly installed wire nut failure, that was "pre-twisted" regardless of what the manufacture's directions say". So I am staying with old school tried and tested methods,. P.S. I have seen a lot of non pre-twisted wire nut failures also in those 50 plus years, but that is just my opinion and you know what they say about those.
Don't forget to consider the insulation on the conductors. Table 310.16 shows that the temperature rating of TW conductors is 60 degrees Celcius (140 Fahrenheit). I'm sure that many DIY'ers in your audience will encounter Romex using conductors with this temperature rating that was in use before the 1984 NEC required upgrade to 90 degree C for this cable, without realizing its lower temperature rating. Your video title "Debunking the Pros", in my opinion, actually VALIDATES the pros, because you've demonstrated that the lever connectors that you tested are significantly hotter. The pros also know that having hot connections leads to problems. One example of this is that the insulation on the conductors becomes brittle. TH-camr GreatScott! also tested, and found that the resistance of your Wago 221 connectors was 14 times higher than wire nuts (2.2mo vs 0.15mo). So, yeah, you validated the pros. They know that what meets minimum legal requirements and what is advisable can be different things. The number of comments speaks to the fact that we really appreciate actual performance tests - please keep up the great work!!
I am a fan of them over the last five years.. I like how I can disconnect the load without messing with the Hot conductor. They can be a bit pricey, but I use them in certain applications for convenience, such as light fixtures, certain motors pieces of equipment I may have to revisit. General pipe and wire I stick to wire nuts and yes, there should be a class on wire nuts because they’re quite often miss used.
Hats off to Scott for a good test. However, my dad was an industrial electrician. He taught me to always scrap the wire ends, carefully twist the conductors, trim, then add the wire nut. I will continue to do so, but may use Wagos in really tight spots. Thanks again.
Its a stupid test. The problem will appear after they have been out there for years. Not testing them just after there installed. Aluminum wiring took several years before houses started burning down.
Great job giving real world test results. I feel that the Wago is superior. Your channel is presenting info for DIY users. For those of us who have done a lot of wiring over the years, a common failure point is using a standard wire nut incorrectly. The Wago is so difficult to use improperly that it greatly lowers any issues with connecting wires inside of boxes. There is still a gigantic safety margin in using Wago connectors and they are faster to install.
For being totally very old school, I would have liked to see the temp comparison for joining the wires by twisting, soldering, and taping. I think it would be an even better result. For those who say wire nuts are safer so I am using them, then why aren’t they soldering them. Yes, way too slow.
I feel that after making 500 joints, the number of poor joints with wire nuts will be much higher than joints made with Wagos. Wagos cost more but I feel are worth it.
I don't really understand the cost problem, a Wago is less than a dollar. I completely rewired my flat two years ago, it cost me around $2500, out of which the Wagos were far less than 10%. And even that wouldn't have been too much for the added safety and durability of their spring action.
The use of the wago itself is improper. Why would you use a connector u know heats up?
Thank you for the informative demo
I like the Wago & will continue to use as they are so easy to use & reuse
Excellent presentation. I know space heaters running on high generally cause their plugs to be too hot to touch so I only run them on high for a short period of time. If I need more heat, I use multiple heaters on low or medium.
For my own projects, saving room in the right junction box I have used the Wago 221, I would agree to keep it for 15 amp circuits, so many lighting applications are led using much less current! German standards for electrical engineering appear to be very well tested!
Like others that have commented, I was skeptical about the wago lever nuts. The test you just performed eased all of my concerns. Thanks for all the useful content you create. As a DIYer, it great to have a video or two to fall back on when I have a question.
Dont let it ease your concerns. You were right to be skeptical.
People are pushing these things because they save time- and are considered "good enough" for certain limited situations- like a single light fixture with plenty of room in the work box. However spring loaded connections are prone to failure in the real world where many connections get crammed into a tiny work space. That's when the wires pop out and things start tripping and melting.
Hi Scott,
I always appreciate seeing people testing devices to see how they perform in real life situations. It is not like every breaker always will trip at the rated capacity... there have certainly been some that have been tested that were considerably over their stated trip point, which lends to the credibility of your testing above the rated limits.
Wouldn't it be a disappointment if these created a dangerous situation after being certified by multiple regulatory authorities? One of the benefits of the Wago is it will be much harder for a non-professional to install them incorrectly. When my sister asked me to help her with a few things at her relatively new house I opened a light up and a wire pulled right out of the wire nut with next to no force on it. Very shoddy workmanship on the part of the professionals who installed it. I doubt the inspectors would check every single connection in a new build but more likely rely on randomly inspecting a certain number of connections and believe they are representative of the remaining work. Lucky for her this was a light that saw short runs rather than constant use.
Great info, research and use case demonstration for each of the connectors. Well done!
Excellent demonstration! This was under extreme conditions (i.e. higher than rated for the circuit being protected by a breaker) which tells me that under normal household use, you likely would not see those temps even with that slightly higher resistance. I'm not an electrician, but I do understand wire gauge, resistance, loads, etc.
Really, the only limiting factor for the WAGO's is the price compared to traditional wire nuts or your baseline installation.
You may understand wire gauge, resistance, loads etc, but what about real world applications where 12 different wires are connected in tiny work boxes and high levels of stress are put on these connectors? Do you have any idea how many times I've seen wires pop out of these things, causing shorts and sometimes fires? The most limiting factor for all DIYers is lack of experience ;)
@@Rick-the-Swiftif the wires pop out then you are using knockoffs, i’ve used Wagos in tight spaces and never had wires pop out
I'd love to see a test of connectors that reviews the error rate. So
-maybe 20 people, from middling DIYers to experienced electricians
-each making a bunch of connections
-including easy (two 14g wires) to more difficult ones (two solid and a stranded, or 5 solid)
-with some in typical non-ideal conditions (overhead, semi-dark, short wires)
-including some previously twisted and disconnected wires
-and without extra instructions for the DIYers. Let them make it up as they see fit, or reading as much instructions as they decide.
-then stuff back into a box, where some say the Wagos may have problems.
Then see how many of the connections are reliable (wiggle and pull tests, maybe).
That would be a really good test! I'd watch it.
I started using Wago terminals in the early 90's. After thousands of terminations (if not over a million at this point) not a single failure attributed to design. A handful of failures due to damaged or improper use only. Wago is one of the brands I place full confidence in. When they went residential, i couldn't have been happier as now i use them in my home. If your scared to use them, stay home and lock your doors, you are too afraid of everything.
Great video! Thank you! I thought the only reason folks didn't use more wago's was cost. But I did always wonder about this issue.
Awesome Test. WAGO will be my go to for now.
Nice 👊
Great video. I have switch to wago, like stated from others I have seen twist type come off or loosen over time. Like you stated the breaker will trip well before wago tolerance is meet.
They don't 'come off or loosen' if done properly in the first place. Way too many DIY'ers and hack electricians doing electrical work these days.
Thank you for doing this video! I, too, have seen numerous videos saying that the wago's are dangerous/unsafe and was curious because I started using them per your recommendation. I am a relatively new diy'er and as such revisited my electrical projects and was surprised to find that the wire nuts, although wrapped with electrical tape, were not secured very well. I'm thankful I found your video for more reasons than one!
Don't use wire nuts if you are a DIY'er.
Good morning Scott,
That was an EXCELLENT test you did.
That just really proves just how good these 221 Wago`s are. I just love these little things.
You have wonderful and helpful videos. Keep up the great work.
Until they have been there a few years
@@RadioRich100 The Europeans are not having any problems, and they have been using them for decades.
IMO the Wagos give me more confidence that my connections will stay together, especially when connecting 3+ wires, and in many cases make tidying boxes easier. I'll never go back to wirenuts where I can help it.
I completely agree 💯
I echo that. I just redid a junction box that had 3 and 4 wire gangs, though I used the push-in type. I felt very sure of the connections, unlike when I was using wire nuts. The bonus was that it was way easier to stuff those wires back in the box.
Thanks for doing this, I'll keep using the Wago's
I’d like to see this done with the Wago “Wall Nuts” and Ideal “In-Sure” push-in style connectors. I’ve used the Ideal version for a few years now, and just discovered Wago has a similar product. Never had a problem with them. They’re also half the price of the lever nuts, so that’s a big plus. UL approved, by the looks of it too.
🇨🇦/🇺🇸... A couple things. 1/ I would automatically tend toward using mechanically simpler mechanisms. 2/ Traditional wire nuts have some size overlap and so you can often ADD a circuit without changing to... hunting through your parts drawer... a new size. (not an issue for the pro who keeps an inventory on hand but sometimes an issue for the homeowner/handyman) 3/ Are a package of WAGO more expensive. (some people won't care... some will)
Hey Scott, great video and great test. I’ve been a bit concerned with the lower contact area in the Wagos and stopped using them after reading some reviews. Your test is a good way to debunk the myths. I’m going to start using the Wagos after seeing this test. Thanks.
NEVER trust any review, kinda like gov. agencies and media (controlled by gov)
I am regularly using WAGO 221 and have not had any problems so far. Takes less space and makes me more confident about the connection.
Amen to that 👊
There is only 1 problem with it, sometimes the lever opens up by pushing it in the j box! Have to tape it around. I'm using it mostly for connecting light fixtures with smaller stranded gauge wires. For this application is it perfect❗️
Excellent test! Pretty much what I expected from the resistance tests I have seen other TH-camrs do- Wago runs slightly hotter, but not much. I'd personally still use wire nuts with pre twisted connections for high amperage circuits such as part of a pigtail on a receptacle circuit, but I'd have no problem at all using Wago connectors for loads of a few amps or less like a ceiling fan or light fixture. That's just my preference though, obviously both are completely viable choices.
Just use the WAGO 221-6xx series.
Most people forget, that there is an XL version which accepts larger diameters and has a bigger busbar and clamp surface.
Modern electrics in Europe is >90% push-in or lever clamps, starting with push-in connection for RCDs, from there to WAGO or PTI installation clamps on DIN rails in the distribution box, WAGO push-in or lever clamps in the room and push-in mechanisms for socket & light switches.
Only thick cables >6mm2 are still on screew terminals most of the time.
It actually has lead to less accidents, because it is way more „idiot-proof“ than some old fashioned mechanical connections like wire nuts, which were abandoned here over 50y ago…
Thanks for sharing this test!
Great comparison and test. Thank's for doing.
I will continue to use the Wago's.
Excellent test! I think more temperature testing videos would be great content. Maybe try different connectors like the Ideal push in or test the difference in temperature between things like pre twisting wire nut connections or screw terminals vs back stab terminals. Measuring the voltage drop across the connectors while loaded would give us another great data point too.
It would be interesting to try compare solid wire to same gauge stranded, which will flatten against the bus bar, increasing the contact area.
Thanks for sharing your findings. Gives me more confidence when using wagos.
I am licensed home inspector with 50 years of experience and training. After seeing your other videos on Wago connectors, doing some research and using them myself, I recommended Wagos especially for splices combining multi strand and solid conductors. Multi-strand and solid wire splices are the splices most often loose and/or where the multi-strand conductors pull out of the splice. We often inspect houses that are more than 50 years old. NFPA has identified these houses as containing circuits with deteriorated wire insulation and corroded loose splices and terminations. Deteriorated conductor insulation and loose connections create a higher risk of arc faults (a primary cause of electrical fires). insulation and increases the risk of arc faultstral circuits might have different results.
Thanks for the feedback Larry 👍
Good video, but what was the Voltage drop across the Wago vs the Screw nut at that High currents? That will also give a good idea whats happening too
A very useful video. I would say balancing out the slightly higher temps encountered with the Wago, you have a greater assurance the connection was made in an approved manner with the Wago. I would suspect there are more wire nuts where the workmanship of the connection is sub-standard, resulting in a hotter connection when in use. I would suggest to the Wago people that they consider coming out with an "industrial" line where they make the part out of heavier materials and maybe they could match or even improve on the performance of the wire nut.
Again, great job!
Whats the balance when the wago catches fire?
Bravo! Excellent study; well done. Thank you.
You bet!
Thanks for the info. I just started trying out the Wago and it's nice to know I'm not making a huge mistake.
An electric heater in the style you are using is a great device to use for creating heat in the wire run. I would like to see this test replicated on a 30 amp outlet with a wire welder or some higher amperage device. Just to see if the higher amperage changes the variance in this test and what percentage increase in temperature occurs in the wire nut vs WAGO. Keep up the good work!
I have used Wago for years and love them. They are especially useful when wiring a box with a lot of wires. The space savings, while not part of the max conduit calc, makes a huge difference. Those wire nuts take a lot more space and Wago just looks better. The one caveat though is to make sure you don't accidently push a lever up when pushing the wires into the box. I had this happen once and it was a huge pain tracking it down.
Tape them
Good info, answering questions I am sure many of us were wondering about
Where I am a bug fan of the Wago lever nuts is for the final connection from the solid house wiring to the multi stranded wiring of lights. The ease of connecting these two types sold me on them.
Form most circuits, Wago is the best solution. For a really high amp circuit ( 30+ ) I prefer split bolt connectors. But they take up a lot of space and need insulation. LED lights have really helped to cut down circuit loads, so Wago is great.
For solid core copper wires, the Wago 221 are not the best choice. Wago 2273 are the best to use. 221s if you need to add stranded wire to the connection.
👍 Well done! And well needed. Showing a comparison of improperly installed WAGOs and wire nuts would be interesting to know for a full risk assessment. Thanks for details.
These are great. UL Listed safe and millions are in use right now.
Aluminum wiring was UL approved too.
@@RadioRich100 Wago's have been in use for years. Can you reference any house fire, anywhere, that was directly caused by a faulty Wago? These aren't just some new technology hitting the market. Development of their products began in the 50's.
so was aluminum wiring until about 7 years later when houses burned down left and right. Do to connections going bad. All was approved and accepted. Just like wagos. Why do you think there banned in so many places?
@@RadioRich100 Just because some jurisdictions may modify the NEC to ban WAGOs does not mean anything is wrong with the connectors.
I have not seen any electrical fire investigations where the cause was put down to a WAGO connector - although I have seen quite a few where a wire nut was blamed.
I recently switched from wire nuts to Wago 221. The Wago is much easier to use and reuse. I feel more confident in the Wago than the wire nut. Two thumbs up for Wago.
I salute you for actually doing the experiment. It would be interesting to see a fourth group, with the wire nut with a pre-twist.
Thanks for the demonstration! Very thorough.
As a HVAC tech I've been using WAGO for years. Wire nuts work fine and yes, you have to install them correctly. But I will tell you contrary to what all the WAGO naysayer "ELECTRICIANS" are trying to claim, the touting the supposed superiority of wirenuts. I can say, over decades of years of service, many times I have come across weak connections by "ELECTRICIANS" losing connections, particularly in multiple neutrals bundled. Also many older wire nuts I've seen with a hole burnt right through the end by heat.Usually caused by "ELECTRICIANS" poor connection technique or wrong size wire nut selection. So they are not with out their faults. I find the WAGO are fantastic for control wiring work, because you can join hard copper and stranded wires without the worry of a weak joint. Plus up to 5 wires joined together without worry of poor twisting technique. And they are removable Both work great BUT BOTH need to be installed correctly, and like all tools, each have their strength in a particular installation. The Naysayers seem to be the closed minded types.
As with any type of connection. Poor install will render it ineffective. It comes down to preference in my opinion. Both are a good connection and it does seem the Wago is more user friendly. I like wirenuts because I like wirenuts, it’s what I’m used to.
Control wiring is low current /voltage and is not house wiring. Bad workmanship is the person not the method.
If Wago would be so dangerous some is trying to claim there would be burning buildings all over Europe. I have in my life come across to melted 221, both where due to bad installation where the wire had not been striped good enough and the wago griped on to shield instead of copper. One was in one of our projects, a 90 000m2 factory, where everything is connected with wago. There are if I remember correctly for example 33 000 lights installed, a lot connected with 221 style.
I can with 100% certain say that the failure rate would be much higher with wire nuts
@@Iceeeen I dont agree. Circuits that carry high current especially motors will over time melt wagos. Lights probably wont, but lazy electricians will use them for everything. It only takes 1 wago to burn a house. Properly installed wirenuts will last forever. Properly installed wagos are a fire waiting to happen.
@@RadioRich100 Well my experience says something else. I have come across 2 melted wagos over allt the service jobs I done. Both with the same miss, badly stripped cable.
I have to ask the project department on Monday just for fun if they could how check how many wagos are used on a bigger project. We have a office that was handed over last week with 15000m2, would be perfect to get som perspective of the failure rate.
But on the other hand I can't remember the last time I was on a service with wire nuts (for any type of work) They are mostly gone.
Then again. The only thing that actually pulls any crazy amp for consider amount of time today is EV chargers and that has to be run on an own circuit from the central so no connections on the field.
HVAC is either smaller EC fans and bigger units is run with frequency drive. Mostly anything else around here with big power draw cycles and never really builds up heat anymore.
All of these devices are listed (usually by UL here in the USA). As such they go through LOTS of testing to make sure they aren't hazardous, or are prone to do nasty things (like start fires!). Also note that the NEC is a FIRE code (sponsored by the NFPA!), so their main concern is making sure things don't start fires. So, these items are all safe when used "properly" (follow the instructions!).
They also approved aluminum wiring back in the late 60's. Wanna talk about fires? Those so called approvals can be bought. I guess the labs didnt know what dissimilar metals were.
I have used some Wago lever nuts to install some basement LED surface mount lights and for some bathroom fan timers. I really like them and as others have said I like the fact that I can see through them to confirm that the connections are good. Thank you for this video.
It would be interesting to measure the resistance difference between these using a 4-wire probe (that takes out the resistance of the probe itself). The assumed higher resistance and hence heat will be caused by I^2R losses. So, in Europe which is mainly 240 VAC, their current for a given circuit is half of what it is in the USA, and therefore half the amount of heat from any higher resistance. In general, it looks like 10% higher heat than a wire nut, but still roughly 50% of the design maximum. I'm not sure the answer, but I do know trying to connect 4 12-2 wires in a 2 gang metal box to two plugs and ground the box can be tricky - at least for me.
This is a really great test! Could you do another video comparing heat from cheap receptacle backstabs vs. screw terminals? Also, I think you should repeat your Wago vs. Wirenut test with multiple splices in series to see if there are compounding effects from increased Wago resistance over the course of an entire electrical circuit. The difference was only a few degrees F with one splice, but does it get dangerous with 6 or 12?
Don't backstab outlets, please.
It's just not a good idea, connector is different from Wago.
This like when plumbers were confronted with PEX and shark bites. “The world is going to come to an end”. I have used the stab ins for years and now the lever types and they work great.
Nice work sir. Thanks for sharing that data.
Extremely helpful, detailed and objective. Thanks!
Great video. Yeah the WAGO is a bit hotter, but it is still well within design parameters, and perfectly safe. And the ease of use is amazing on the connectors, helping get a better connection and setup.
A bit? 10% hotter isn't a bit. A bit is more like 2%.
what design parameters? Heat and resistance is ok!! Why so you can save 30 seconds putting it in? Twisted joints dont get hot. The wago is in series with the load the wire nut is not. U just put a double resistor in series with the load. One going in one going out. Their another point of failure.
The difference between 105 degrees and 115 degrees is not enough to worry about. More importantly, that 10 degree difference was in a circuit that was overloaded with unrealistic current flows. It would be interesting to see how the Wago connector performs in a 15-amp circuit.
It is enough to worry about,it indicates resistance is high when there new. What happens a few years down the road when the spring loses some of its tension. Wire nuts work forever.
Wago 221s are approaching 10 years on the market and no problems so far. Compare that to the numerous instances I’ve run across where wire nuts became loose.
@@glasshalffull2930 When somthing goes wrong with a wago they dont come tell you about it.
I have heard numerous people tell me they had problems with them burning.
@@RadioRich100 A picture is worth a thousand words. Never seen a failed Wago image. I’m sure if they were failing, the images would be all over the internet.
Interesting information. I have wondered the same for some time. I now have more to consider in the future.
Great video with good info! Have heard people talking about higher resistance of WAGO.
It may not be higher. All we know from this experiment is that the temperature of the WAGO was only slightly higher, so the resistive difference is tiny.
I think the question is how they will hold up over time. Will the spring lose tension with heating and cooling cycles and gradually increase the resistance of the connection? I installed some on a well pump circuit for a stress test and so far after almost 6 months they are holding up quite well. I've been waiting to do a review video until the results are in but I tend to agree that they may be a good option especially for the DIYer. I'm an electrician by the way with 38 years of experience. I don't like the quick connects connections on devices because of the high failure rate and I though that the WAGO's may have a similar long term result but now I'm not so sure I was correct.
The ONLY disadvantage of Wago is the price of the device. They are in any other respect a far superior splicing device. Also, many have made very sound arguments justifying the price of Wago with their efficiency of installation which saves on labor costs.
Labor costs are irrelevant for DIYers, also not all labor cost savings are necessarily passed to customer
@@dmitripogosian5084 Absolutely agree
I’m in Australia and we don’t use wire nuts. It’s a screwed connector. Twist the wire first and put it in the connector and do up the screw. These work with all types of wires and I think they are safer than a wire nut. Since I found the Wago connectors I’ve been using them a lot of the time. Awesome for fault finding. It does have limitations if you want to put a few wires into one connector and have limited space. Most of my work is with fire alarm systems and the Wago are the best as the current and voltages are low and unless you do a really crap job of the install there wouldn’t be many connections along the circuit to cause an issue
In all of the discussions that have been going on about electrical connections there is one extremely important factor that no one has addressed and that is a gas-tight joint. In order to prevent degradation of the connection over time the contacting surfaces must not admit 'air' or oxidation will occur and the resistance will increase. Yes, copper oxidizes! Less than aluminum or brass but it does. A gas tight joint means: clean surfaces, enough joint pressure to maintain the tight fit, and enough compliance in the joint to keep the pressure when temperatures change. On crimped terminals the terminal barrel and the conductor must be squeezed so tightly that they essentially become one piece and no gas can penetrate the contacting surfaces. This is easily done with screw terminals and crimping. But point contacts and pressures insufficient to cold form the contacts into gas tight joints cannot make gas tight joints. The components just can't deliver the needed pressure over the required area, over time, to make and maintain a gas tight joint. The connection will run hotter and oxidize faster than a large area gas tight joint.
If conductors are twisted tightly at least two whole turns then 'clamped' with a proper wire nut, then the joint will have enough area and pressure to not present an increased joint resistance. Same with screw clamped terminals with lots of contact area and pressure to maintain a copper-crushing tight joint.
All this applies whether large conductors are involved or small, solid or stranded. Industry has for decades worked to create the hardware and methods and tools to create gas tight joints that are reliable for high and low voltages and currents. Look at all the wiring in aircraft. It's gas tight. NASA certifies components, tools and operators to assure this reliability.
Why would anyone use any device that can't make or maintain such a connection? Cheap and easy and good enough is why. But for reliability that's not good enough. Push-in connections have shown this problem and many devices have failed with some causing fires. Why the heck would one want to use a device that truly isn't fit for use!!!
I want zero possibility of such a joint failing with the resulting damage.
Pete
The Wago are well within spec and the chance of a DYIer messing up the wire nut connecting is way greater. If the connection for the wire nuts is not secure then you will get way more heat.
What spec? The ones the manufacturer came up with to sell them? If your a diyer and have to use wagos then you probably shouldnt be doing the work in the first place.
@@RadioRich100 electrical equipment has to be certified for the country that is used in like UL or CSA.
@@craven3190 You can't debate with RR - I think he still uses a horse and buggy, rather than one of those fancy Stanley Steamers.
@@buggsy5 😂