Celestion Creamback vs Greenback: Two Legends of Tone
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ก.ค. 2024
- Get ready for a real showdown as we compare two legends of tone - the Celestion MCreamback and MGreenback speakers! In this in-depth comparison, we dive into the origins and sonic character of these iconic speakers, exploring their unique qualities and how they shape your guitar tone. From vintage warmth to modern punch, each speaker has it's own story to tell. Join us as we reveal all and discover which is right for you, maybe both?
@johnnathancordy
@tomquayleguitar
@JossAllenGuitar
www.zillacabs.com
Instagram: zillacabs
Facebook: /zillacabs
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Amps:
Marshall JMP
Mesa Boogie Stiletto
Cab Details:
Cab: Studio Pro
Back: Three Piece
Tolex: Black Western
Grill Cloth: Blues Breaker
Piping: Grey
Hardware: Black
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00:00 AB
00:35 Intro
01:13 TNT Crunch
01:45 History and Tone
02:35 Hot to Compare
03:18 Pushed Cleans
04:06 Cab Choice
05:05 Heavy
05:35 Cleans
06:09 Mixing Speakers
08:10 Thanks - เพลง
Which speaker did you think was speaker A or B? Let us know below! Answer in:
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'A' is the M Greenback and 'B' is the M Creeamback
Were you right?
Yep, I had it figured out
Yup, but I have been using Creambacks for 12 years :D
Yeah I got it right, I always associate the Creamback as being darker and smoother.
Yeah any Greenback variation just breathes classic rock in a way others can’t match. The Creamback in comparison just sounded like someone turned a Greenback against a wall.
Interesting... In real life the creams sound more high endy and bright while the greens sound more mid smooth but with a weird sea shell fizz in the background when micd up which is why I chose what I did. Oh well.... Too many variables can skew results on a video compared to being in the room with both.
I've just put 2 creams and 2 v30s in my 4x12. Couldn't be happier. I play 80s hair metal with an Engl Morse! Bloody great.
yeah that's a great mix too, we used to do this a fair bit for people using 4x12s and 6x12s for drop tuning stuff.
@@ZillaCabs I think a lot also has to do with how you eq your amp. Euge Valovitra also did a great hi gain comparison on his channel recently. Worth a watch for sure. 👍
Thanks for the content , prefer the greenback less muffled in the low end compare to the creamback
Always nice to hear the content you put out, nice one Paul 🤘🎸
Thanks mate, appreciate it.
Great version of Isnt she lovely!! And as always great comparison, on of the only comparisons you can trust in general...
Great to see you guys posting again! Been a while!!
Thanks mate, we really appreciate it... we've got loads more coming.
I'd say A is the greenback and B the creamback
We'll be posting it up soon.
Still like the greenbacks best for anything trying to be a marshall sound. I went to a full stack to keep the greens!
A is green and B is cream. The A has much more presence and I prefer it greatly.
Check your answer in the pinned comment...
I get that the Greens are a bit more middy, but I usually hear it the other way, the Creams as being thicker - I love the Cream in isolation, the Green in a mix (where I'm nearly always trying to eq down that extra thickness ). That 2x12 is a work of art by the way.
Hi mate. I think that's a good point there, creams can sound "better" when by themselves but getting them in a mix can be harder, as always with speakers it depends how you use them, and your own ears too... Thanks for watching, and glad you like the 2x12.
BTW, we do not play electric guitar only. We play the whole environment, and everything matters. People change tubes to different manufacturers, but there is way more tone change when changing speakers and cabinets.
People are catching on to it... in fairness I think the cab thing may be because they are physically large and hard to get multiple cabs for space reasons... much easier to get more pedals and learn the difference, but people are getting there with speakers and cabs (I'd like to think). Thanks for watching and great comments.
@ZillaCabs you guys are the rare kind of people who really do know their stuff. It's a shame how much got forgotten and how some new age experts do not know their stuff.
Having a good cabinet makes a huge difference. One could even argue that most of the tone difference between old amplifiers is the difference in cabs and speakers. Everyone knows that JTM45 was based on Bassman, but there are differences in these amplifiers. But if you play them in each other's cabinets, difference sort of melts away, and they start sounding very similar despite tubes difference and iron difference and some tone stack difference and in filtering. Simply pine and redwood open back 2x12 and 4x10 do not sound like closed back Marshall cabinets.
Later on, Marshall made even more differences in the tone stack and topology that increased efficiency and middle range but still play them within their headroom and true the Fender cabinet, and they will sound great clean.
I make point to point boutique amplifiers, and I can vauch for the importance of the cabinets and speakers.
Once, I wanted to demo my best amplifier model to some new players. Younger people. They invited me to their rehearsal.
I thought, why bringing head and the cabinet there will be some cabinet there and my amplifier is going to be heard anyhow.
Boy, was I wrong. I thought I broke my amplifier in the transport. Cabinet was so bad that even my amplifier sounded average and even bad. Only the loudness came over, but all of the details were gone. Came home, and everything was sounding as it should. Checked amplifier, and it was in perfect state.
Cabinets can make or break your whole tone disregarding on any other part of your chain.
Plus, charging a speaker is not that expensive, and it is relatively easy if you have a good cabinet. Most often, speakers are cheaper than good pedals as well.
Cream for Clean, Green for Mean
hahaha I like that.
I like the greenbacks with smaller wattage amps and/or lower volume settings and the creambacks when using higher wattage amps or when pushing more. I try to similate the same ratios from low volume to high volume scenarios.
Brilliant!
Thanks mate.
Even from my phone listening on it's speakers, and after first change I would say A is the Greenback M and B is the Creamback M.
It wouldn't surprise me that Greenback is marked with International and not made in the UK.
Anyhow, Greenback reissues have that top end that Creamback M doesn't have. Some amplifiers like one and yhe others the other one. In a mix They can sound cool but with a bit more middle than what I usually aim for.
In both cases, those are good speakers.
The Greenback reissues are made in the UK now production shifted back to the UK around 4 years ago and they sound the exact same as the older made in China Greenabcks . They are not made like the old ones and this was done intentionally
The reality is that 100 percent accurate clones of vintage models are niche market.
If Celestion wants to sell speakers they have to tweak the vintage style reissues so they have more appeal to the wider market and are better suited to modern amp circuits.
Celestion has ceased full on production of the Heritage line and now only make them for amp Manufacturers like Marshall because they just were not selling . The Heritage line was discontinued in 2020 and retailers and distributors still have back stock of some Heritage models after 4 years. The Heritage G12H30 55 hz Ohm is still in stock everywhere .
Celestion sales of the Creamback M and H along with the standard production Greenback RI were crushing the sales figures for the Heritage line .
When people want clones or the vintage models they usually purchase the Magical fairy dust and mojo on offer from Scumback or weber which don't sound like the originals either no matter how much BS Scumback snake oil Jim tries to peddle on the various forms . Head to head comparisons with the real thing prove this over and over .
@adamwatson6916 you forgot to mention Pulsonic cones and what happened with the factory that was delivering them 😀 One could also talk about Kurt Muller cones and the other used in that period. Explaining why pre Rolla means what it means is important. As well as how the color of the cap changed and what the old Creamback and Blackback speakers are.
Joking aside what my point was that I believe that one we heard was made in China and is at least 5 years old. Again, joking that next to a TH-cam compression, I can still hear that or better said I think that's what I have heard.
Now, disregarding that the formula for the Greenback M hasn't really changed from the time before the production went to China and came back to the UK, my experience is that they are sounding different. 20 Watt Heritage version was sounding quite different than the 25 Watt version as well. Some models were always made in the UK. Some stayed always sounding pretty same. G12 65 was always from the Heritage series, but it didn't sound always the same. V30 changed how it sounded from early days and especially when it went to China production despite that special version offered only to amplifier companies like Mesa and Marshall stayed made in UK and have always sounded different than made in China stuff.
And that is not me saying made in China stuff means worse sounding speakers at all. Some are even sounding better to some people.
My point is that sadly, it is a big mess regarding what and when was made in the case of the Celestion.
My experience and belief is that after the pre Rolla Greenback Pulsonic period , nothing sounded the same. Comparing lead cones with lead cones, that is. I just do not want to start even saying that M and H versions were coming in both 55 and 75 Hz version and that their cones came from different companies.
Again, mess.
Personally, I find all Greenbacks M 25 Watt versions in the last few decades sounding top heavy compared to the original artifacts of unobtainioum. They never nailed that smoother top end of the Pulsonic cone.
That doesn't mean any Greenback is bad, either. They are just different.
No one thwir new products sound as the old Pulsonic pre Rolla Greenback M 25 Watt 75 Hz. Despite the claims and price of some other companies. They made good speakers but not sounding as old once do.
Celestion has made a few models that came close in some parts of the spectrum. Even sometimes, by making some different models, they stumbled on parts that sound very close in some parts of the spectrum. Fir me, funny enough, Fullback cones close in some parts of the spectrum despite being 15 inch speaker. I own a pair G12-35XC, and with their current age, I love them. Not same as magic dust but still great speakers.
Onevthing did stay family line specific Celestion thing that I like. You can almost always hear that typical Celestion middle range. Better said EQ curve or amount of middle compared to low and high range.
That makes them vocal like and musical.
My initial acceptance of the new Creamback series was not the best because I was reading their marketing materials. Since I know better and judge only by listening to them myself and only once they are broken in good.
Also, I accept different than magic speakers. They all fit different amplifiers and different people.
They all should sound different. Why not.
Regarding owning old magic once. It is not practical at all. Lot if them aren't good Amy more and most of them can't be played anywhere close to the power rating. Lots of them became too soft or moisture got to them. To many people enjoyed them fit long time beating them to the edge of the existence.
The funny thing is that even some ordinary speakers that aren't popular nowadays but sold in millions are vintage now, and they sound way better than the same models built today. I have one 4x12 model 1960 from the first series that was repaired by exchanging old blown Greenbacks with G12T75 speakers in 1995. At that time, that was a normal speaker for the 1960 cabinet. Sad story, but that cabinet with those speakers sounds very good nowadays as well. They finally broke in 🤣🤣🤣
@adamwatson6916 btw I just do not get it how, despite that factory and plans has burned down, people working their for years couldn't just know and replicate the process of making the Pulsonic cones. Like they all got amnesia at the same time? No needs working there that were proud of knowing every detail? And that in the time when people were doing their own servicing of their cars and were making their own furniture? So strage all of it.
I have creams and greens. The creams are a little darker as you see here but if u dial in the presence the can get super close to greens.
yeah it's important to note how we all eq an amp different for different speakers, so we can still shape speakers... these tests here are a little rigid but you are right, we can always add a little bit of bite in from a nice amp. Thanks for watching.
Both great. Creamback is Greenback for combo.
I like that description, makes a lot of sense.
Damn that creamback is dark
Ace video, nice guitar ;)
That's just something I linged in the corner ;)
I wish the creams had a bit more high end and mids.
The H Creamback has more highs than the M Creamback. IMO the M Creamback has plenty of mids, they're just more low than high.
That's a good comment below, the H has a similar vibe to the M but has more going on in the top end, that may be worth a shot for you.
I have a Mcreambacks fatboy 212, I'm pretty sure that B is the cream one
We'll we putting up which one it is shortly. Good to hear you've got a FB by the way.
The creambacks sounds more even in FR on a phone speaker, the greenback sounds like it has a couple of dips and peaks. "Readability" of what is being played is better with the creamback - on a phone speaker! I have a 4x12 creamback which I have used live with a full band no problem filling a medium sized venue without miking and sounding great 😊
I went Creamback for my mini-stack.
It's a nice speaker for smaller cabs in particular, it's slightly darker sound help fill the lows. Good to have you on the team by the way ;)
I think they sound the best mixed.
It is a really useful mix of speakers. Thanks for watching.
I prefer the cream back.
It is a cool speaker. Thanks for watching.
Green brighter top and a little more fizz
A is green, b is cream. I love the greens for the cleans, but they break up wrong compared to pre-rola. I paired a creamback with a mojotone bv25m for my mediums and the H are both mojotone at the moment instead of a mojotone bv30h and a greenback h, because I fell in love with the mojotone bv30v and had to sacrifice one or the other, so the green had to go. The midrange bite of the m creamback is awesome, but it lacks highs and the sweetness of the bv25m pairs so beautifully, couldn't recommend this pairing more highly for the next best thing to a vintage pair of 25 watters.
I have both...low power amp get's the greanback or heritage 20w75hz high power amp creamback
That's a decent way of doing it.
A Cream
B Green
Check your answer in the pinned comment...
I like the 2 second intro speaker the best!😂
Can you tell what speaker it is?
Hard to tell from those 2 seconds… To my ears it sounds like a proper broken in V30 (or heavily eq’ed). Such a classic sound. I’d love to know what it is ‘cause it sounds great!
A = Greenback (lower power, breaks up faster)
B = Creamback
Check your answer in the pinned comment...
I tried to get the taste of the greenback, but it didn't work, with my experience I'm in favor of the fact that creambacks fit the pedal platform, and greenbacks with a fit only with plexi amps, ...
I think the greenback will do more than just work with plexi style amps, it can be a nice speaker to blend with other too, but I guess that's the fun thing about sp[eakers, they are so subjective. Thanks for watching.
@@ZillaCabs Greenback is a legend, in a 4x12 box with SLp or 1978, guitar - cable - amp = heaven, ...... I have a problem when Greenbacks are, for example, in a blues breaker and I use it as a pedal platform, hi gain and fuzz pedals have a strange fizz sound,
the creamback is modern not a legend of tone, the greenback is made in china and sounds too bright,it used to be a legend of tone till celestion screwed up the design and sent it to china.. even the greenback heritage 20w which is made in uk sounds too bright and takes forever to break in, the creamback on the other hand is full and mellow on top so it's night and day my conclusion: go for the creamback m,h or the alnico cream
The Greenbakcs are not made in China anymore . Production was shifted back to the U.K 3 or 4 years back.
I guess nobody told you about the Creamback Ms from the mid 70s then ? They are a legend of tone.
I found the UK and Chinese speakers to have little difference between them when A/B tests are done. Thanks for watching.
@@adamwatson6916 the vintage creambacks and blackbacks are basically greenbacks . the new creamback is a new design maybe it will be a legend as well some day.
@@ZillaCabs i find it misleading when a company moves production to china without notice and for the same price, they did the same move with the vintage 30. people should know where their speaker is made and celestion has a good reason to hide it. i have a 1974x +cx cab ,so 2 heritage 20w greenbacks(uk made) one was used for ten years the other i bought new .the old speaker sounds way better less harsh on top. i had a jtm 20 with the creamback m 65 and i loved it, a very sweet sounding speaker.
i also played a jtm 50 from 1967 with original pre rola small magnet greenbacks , nothing modern can touch those. btw i work on live gigs with a hot rod deluxe and i swapped the stock crap for the alnico cream and it's a monster. it's the best modern speaker ive heard. thanks for all the great info!