Volkswagen ID.4 Test Results | Talking Cars
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 มิ.ย. 2024
- On this episode, we share our test results of the all-electric Volkswagen ID.4. Find out how this all-new EV stacks up against competing models from Tesla and why we think the ID.4’s redesigned controls have more flash than function. We also answer an audience question on regenerative braking and how it works on the ID.4.
SHOW NOTES:
0:00 - Volkswagen ID.4 Test results
12:46 - Question: How does regenerative braking work on the VW ID.4?
LINKS:
Volkswagen ID4: www.consumerreports.org/cars/...
First Drive: 2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5 Can Play in the Big League: www.consumerreports.org/hybri...
Automakers Are Adding Electric Vehicles to Their Lineups. Here’s What’s Coming: www.consumerreports.org/hybri...
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ID4 and Model Y are not direct competitors! There is a huge price difference.
Exactly... major price difference and totally not direct competitors. I opted for the ID 4 and completely disagree with this panel.
The ID4 is the only real SUV of all so-called-SUV EVs. It has the best ground clearance out of the bunch. The ride is light-year ahead of tesla model Y. Despite being softer, it still handles very well as a daily driver. Not everyone want to trade assembly quality, ride comfort, capability to get out of trouble, for a split second faster acceleration.
There are some tried-too-hard German-engineering things on the inside, such as the center screen, window and defrost control. But you will get used to them being an owner. More importantly, I'd rather have a proper vehicle with good built quality and maybe some lack on software that can be solved thru OTA update. Other than having a fast iPad with crappy build quality and squeaky interior even on a brand new Tesla.
Seat heater has a shortcut, all you need is double tap the temperature slider to activate it. I was kinda shocked that NONE of you know that. Also for the accusation of home button and shifter, you have the gear clearly displayed on the small screen, why do you need to look over the steering wheel to "see what it's doing"? And the home button is just too obvious to me. I know what it is right away. Haven't you ever used any old iphone? Its the same sign on those physical home button of an iPhone.
I'm so sick of fanboy comments here. Go to a VW forum if you wanna spout this crap. The controls on this thing have been universally hated.
being a potential EV buyer in the next 6 months and recently tested a bunch of EVs, I would say VW is infotainment design is OK. Some of the features are really quirky for first timer. For me since I watched a few TH-cam reviews and had expectations on it, so no surprise at all. I agree that some of the CR critics are actually pointless, like cannot see the gear selector blocked by the steering wheel. Come one, do you see a physical gear selector on a tesla? or even for most new ICE cars, do you have to watch the electronic gear knob or lever or whatever to see which gear you are in? These kind of nonsense critics only hurt CR's reputation. Ride quality is good and AWD is powerful enough. Acceleration is more like a 300hp turbo ICE SUV but not a electric one. I would say with $7500 federal tax rebate and some state rebate, it is a good alternative to a ICE compact SUV. Think about how much you have to pay now days to get a mainstream brand ICE compact SUV with 300hp and all the features of ID.4. What bothers me is the processing hardware power of the infortainment system seems already behind, this cannot be fixed through future OTA upgrade. But for the price VW asked for, I can live with it. Also the rear drum brake weakness Motoman brought out in his youtube concerns me a little bit. I think those reviews to ID.4 are more fair and professional than CR's.
@@victreebel170 shiiiiiieeet having counter points on a video makes you a fanboy. Rip, they even said it's not a great design but you get used to it, and that build quality is more important to them. They didn't say that the controls are amazing.
Come on. Comparing the range of the id.4 to the Tesla Y is kind of ridiculous, especially when one considers the HUGE price difference between the two vehicles. The id.4 also still qualifies for many more tax incentives that the Y does not.
I did all the numbers over two years of research and got the ID.4.
But if I was doing it all over again today I would take a look at the Ioniq 5. Main point being the fast charge speed.
I can summarize why I don't like Tesla: right to repai issues, minimalist interior, FSD false advertising, price, no tax credit.
Exactly. Yes, Model Y is more efficient especially in winter. But, there is no way you’ll get 320+ miles on highway. It is more like a 260-280 miles of range on Model Y. Whereas it is possible to get 240miles EPA range on ID4.
Both vehicle has 82kwh battery and ID4 has 77kwh usable. So, in theory VW can unlock 16 miles of additional range. In real world the difference is more like a 20-40 miles of range instead of 80miles or something.
A B - VW still NEEDS incentives to sell its cars.
TESLA does NOT need any INCENTIVES to sell EVERY car PRODUCED.
iD4 is a FUCKKING joke.
Tesla Fan boys drinking the cool aid for sure...
@@kronosaurelius I agree. The Ioniq 5 is the car to beat at the moment if price matters. This is coming from a current owner of a 2015 Tesla Model S. It will be my last Tesla for the reasons you describe. My dream car at the moment is the Mercedes EQS, even though it is ugly. It combines the best features of Tesla and then adds a giant layer of silence, quality and luxury ride.
Driven the ID4 from DC to Florida and back several times with no issues. Free 140kw charging for 3 years. Better turn radius and more interior room of higher quality and comfort than the Tesla model Y and $30k less expensive. VW is the much better value.
Yup mine is on order..These 3 are obviously fan boys....drinking the Elon cool aid....
I cancelled my Model Y order after test driving the ID4 last weekend! Immediately ordered the AWD ID4, its perfect for what I need, AND it has Sirrus radio AND Apple CarPlay and Android Auto!
I can’t believe how ridiculous you guys have been getting lately to any changes…Turning the volume down with slightly wet fingers???? REALLY?? You’re the driver! Why are you using the dashboard capacitive touch controls? You should be using the buttons on the steering wheel. That’s what they are there for! The other buttons are for the passenger…not sure why may car reviewers never talk about that…And the blue square??? Really??? You’re showing your age, although I’m 53 and I immediately saw that and said, hey! A home button! Come on guys….there are plenty of quirky things that should be criticized but you guys are getting over the top to the point of being irrelevant. The gear shifter? Again, everyone is trying to get it off the center area to open up space. I drove the ID4 and it took all of a couple of times to figure it out and it was fine…The ONLY real weird, unnecessary issue on the car is the rear window button…should be buttons for them. Other than that, you drive the car for more than 5 minutes and everything is fine….
THANK YOU!👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾 As person in the their 40's I have to give them an "Ok Boomer." LoL Wet fingers give me a break so on any car made after 2019 he would look past the steering wheel for Vol. craziness. I test drive the car only thing I can say I like to change immediately is put lighting behind the sliders for at night that's what I was expecting them to say. Everything else no problems. I love the window switches I hope VW keeps them they keep me from letting the window down in the back behind my head. Ugh!
Well said!
VW wasn’t going for the Model Y ($27k more expensive). The target was making an electric RAV4 or CR-V, and in that they succeeded.
I really think VW is aiming at pretty much everyone other than Tesla.
That's right! I'm surprised they said "direct competitor" to model Y, Tesla's aim is directed to Audi, VW is more towards toyota, kia or huyndai crossovers
Most people cant spend 65K on any car.... VW CEO said they will make EV's for the millions not just the millionaires....The ID6 will be coming soon too...
Wow. I can't believe Consumer Reports is okay with these guys "unbiased" comments. I used to have respect for CR, but over the years they've really lost their way. This is pure fanboy reporting. Not a mention of the price difference, the inflated (not achieveable) range of Teslas, the fact that Tesla broke ALL the rules with their single eyes-off-the-road screen that is just patently unsafe. They'd rather niggle over a 0-60 time that's better than most ICE cars, but not as fast as a Tesla. And oh, those damn buttons that are so hard to use! Funny, but they seem to work pretty well on my ID.4. And btw...you can turn the seat heater on with a two finger tap on the temp. slider. It just makes you look foolish when you do a review without any knowledge of the car.
one has to wonder how many of these CR fanboys being "unbiased" as they claimed to be actually own TSLA stocks. ;)
LOL you noticed too....The Tesla fan boys are so apparent. I test dove many Tesla before making my decision to buy the ID4 Pro. 1. Price, $41K, 2. build quality, 3. 3 years free charging 4, $7500 tax credit, excellent ride and comfortable. No gap panels to worry about, paint issues, interior panels lose, no thanks.. keep your Tesla and your cool aid too...My $ is going to VW
The moment he said Model Y is a direct competitor… oh ok. ID4 starting at $40k is targeted at CRVs and RAV4s of the world NOT the model Y which is about $15-20k more.
Dealship markups are a thing so in reality most people will pay about 5-7k less for this car which directly puts the Tesla in the same category.
@@TayoAAdetola I bought my ID4 with no markups. I paid what I signed up at VW..
No comparison. This is a bargain compared to any Tesla. Bad comparison.
@@TayoAAdetola whaaaaat this just isn't true at all. First off, dealers seem to be pretty much selling these at MSRP. They have no play up or down really on price. I went to 6 VW dealers in my area and they all were selling it at MSRP plus like 1k of added dealership fees at most.
But even with that, it doesn't bring Tesla's down nearly far enough to compete with these, especially if you want an awd vehicle.... They're leagues away in price, especially if where you're from still has ev rebates, because teslas don't fall under the rebate limit anymore in most places
Anyone who did an ID.4 reservation gets it at MSRP. I took delivery of my AWD ID.4 after a year+ on the reservation list just last month, at MSRP. I don't envy anyone trying to buy a vehicle today (by any vendor) without a reservation and set price. Not that people would have necessarily known a whole year ago that a reservation would be so valuable now. There are some people turning their reserved (delivered) vehicles very quickly for a profit because of the insane markups. But not me.... I love the car. The UI complaints are pretty seriously overblown. Like adults in diapers overblown. Is that a feature of younger generations? It isn't very endearing.
-Matt
Model Y is not a “direct” competitor. Look at the price difference even before incentives. I think the RAV4 Prime or Ionic 5 is a better comparison to the ID.4. BTW there is a short cut to seat heater controls but you do have to read the manual. Apparently no one does that anymore.
TESLA is OUTSELLING both the RAV4 and IONIQ 5, the VW iD4 is a piece of SHIT.
even the Mach-e and EV6 are Better cars than iD4.
Yes, I priced an ID.4 Pro S AWD and compared to Model Y Long Range, and the price difference is $18K after the federal tax credit.
Why should you have to read the manual for basic functions that have been easily accomplished for decades with dials and switches? Putting design and cost cutting ahead of function has gone way too far. A prime example is the single set of door controls. VW did that for no reason other than to save a few pennies.
@@markplott4820 please watch your language and i tested a ton of suvs and i ended up buying the ID4 and it is not a crappy car
@@Noah_E I actually really like the new window controls on the ID 4! Basically the only time I ever use the back window is when I accidentally use it instead of the front window. Plus you get the ability to open all four windows at once! Makes it simpler and cleaner, so for me it works great. Some people use the back windows a lot more than I do, but just showing you that there are definitely people that prefer this
Did anyone else get the sense that these guys have a certain idea of what an EV should be and if it doesn't fit their mold then they trash the vehicle?
Having lived with this car for three months, I can say that this review really misses the mark. I love this car. For example, they do not even know how to easily turn on and off the heated seats. A couple of taps and its done. They should really learn about the cars they review before they critique them. Bad review. Check other TH-cam videos before dismissing this car. Extremely disappointing review!
The Model Y is not a competitor. It costs a lot more.
ID4 has a better ride than any Tesla...I test drove them all and the ride is horrible in the 3 and the Y.. VW isn't perfect but for my hard earned $$$$ I will go with a auto maker who has been building cars for decades....You can drive coast to coast on EA with no issues... Their argument is cool aid driven .....Zero facts.. Tesla are the first but not the best....YUP I SAID IT!
How can you really compare this to the MUCH more expensive model Y? They are not direct competitors.
Tesla Fan Boys....You will never win any argument with a Tesla owner...They worship at the feet of Elon.....lol..
7.1 seconds 0-60 is sluggish….wow
I guess I don’t understand why 240 miles for ~$45k is “disappointing” when the Model Y is $15k more expensive
Because all EV range values are still disappointing. Until the range approximates ICE cars and the recharge time approximates filling a gas tank, EVs will be disappointing. Generally, new products are better than prior products in all aspects. Unfortunately, that isn’t true with EVs. They are better in some ways, but much worse in others, which is why adoption is still fairly slow.
I agree, the Model Y was originally available as RWD with a standard range of 244 miles for about $40K (which would be comparable to the VW ID.4). However, Tesla no longer offers that package; the cheapest version Model Y is now the long range AWD starting at about $55K. Very few people will be cross shopping an ID.4 with a Model Y. Due to the federal tax credit situation, the VW can be over $20K cheaper (but if someone can afford a Model Y I think that it is a no brainer to pick the Tesla).
The ever increasing model Y price premium is primarily because Tesla demand is so high - not that it is in a completely different class. When Sandy Munro took apart the ID.4 he identified many areas where opportunity was lost to make a better car and to eliminate waste and cost. Waste was one of the reasons why Volkswagen didn't have enough room left to have a front trunk. Still, at least VW has taken the transition to EVs more seriously than most and should be well positioned to compete going forward.
Depends on one’s overall perceived value of the difference. Personally I want to see close to a 1000 mile range and/or a charger at every gas station. Mostly for battery degradation over 10+ years.
Compared to the IONIQ 5 for the same price, yeah, it's disappointing.
Love the content from these podcasts! I just wish they were longer like previous episodes with more questions and car news.
Anytime a manufacturer ditches the physical volume knob, I immediately know they're going in the wrong direction. Haptic controls are terrible.
I do like the haptics but wish that they were all back lit. For the volume controls I'd prefer a knob.
When you call a vehicle that has a consumer cost 50% lower than a Model Y competitor you are losing half of the audience, regardless of how spot on and accurate the rest of your review and commentary is.
They don't care....When you insult any Tesla your insulting their GOD Elon...lol....The Cool Aid is powerful...
Others have said this as well but the price difference between the ID-4 and the Model Y is substantial, about $20k plus the ID-4 qualifies for the $7500 federal tax rebate so the price difference is more like $27k. Not really fair to try to compare them as if they are direct competition, they aren't. I would expect more power and range for my $27k. And perhaps this is simply personal preference but I couldn't be happier with the zip, handling and braking of my ID-4. It's not a race car but it's plenty quick and turns on a rail. I read an article back when I was trying to pick an EV that said the ID-4 wasn't the best EV on the market but that it might be the best for the money. Not everyone has $70k plus to buy a Tesla.
I test drove an ID.4 home back in August so my wife could see it. She's 5 feet tall and heavyset and was unable to reach the pedals without the steering wheel digging into her stomach. I gave up on PHEV and pure electric due to no inventory and wound up buying a Toyota Venza Hybrid. My wife can drive that just fine, and I like all the tech on the limited package.
I was OK with the way the ID.4 drove, but the interior was underwhelming. They withheld too many features that are being saved for the Audi version.
But that's what keeps it much cheaper than the Audi version. Toyota does something similar compared to the Lexus.
Great review - throughly enjoyed it. Much better than reviews about boop noodles.
Jake's audio quality is top notch. Kudos to him. 👍
That's one of my biggest pet peeves with newer cars. Sandy Munro calls it "old man stuff", but I think having things where you expect them to be, and operating in an intuitively obvious manner is just good and practical UI design (and by extension, a safer way to operate a vehicle.) And this includes hard controls for the things you use the most. Not everything crammed into a modal touchscreen.
Subaru Solterra coming this year has a range of 250 miles, only 10 miles more than the VW. That is not a reason to complain about the range. It is the range of many EV AWD cars except Tesla right now - which the Model Y costs $55,000 starting price. This car, starts at $40,000 and a after the tax credit is $33,000. So a $22,000 difference right now and yet CR wants to compare it to the Tesla. With this logic you can compare a Subaru Legacy to a BMW 3 series - because the price difference there is about the same.
Soultera is CRAP , built on a CHINESE BYD platform for Toyota and Subaru.
its a FAIL for Subaru, because they dont have their OWN EV platform.
For me it would be the software mess with the ID4. Though living in the north means that the 240 miles matters, too! Can’t wait to see big range gains in the next 2-5 years, with Tesla getting even better than their current range specs as soon as the 4680 is in production perhaps by mid year!
Yes the model Y comparison struck me as odd as well - apples and oranges
Ask any Tesla owner what kind of range they actually get in real-world driving. Then do the same comparison for ID4 or any other EV. Then you can compare.
ITs a car get in and drive....LOL
But if you actually drive an ID4 and a model y convoy style in identical conditions over a long distance - you'll probably actually get 230-240 range out of the id.4 and 270 in the model Y. The model Y has a larger advantage at low speeds, but people don't tend to worry about range all that much when you're going
What was VW thinking putting those controls on the iD.4 (and Golf/GTI)? Capacitive touch controls didn’t work for Ford, Lincoln, Honda, Toyota, Cadillac and Mercedes Benz.
Likewise, whoever at VW decided to give the driver only 2 window switches and an unresponsive button for the rear window controls should be fired.
VW is using the parts bin to keep the price down. Everything is slightly compromised because of that.
@@fatboy19831 Not quite. The iD.4 and Golf are the first VW’s to use the new controls, whereas other VW’s like the Taos, Atlas and Arteon still use the older, much easier to use system.
There was no reason for touch controls (other than to usher in THE FUTURE), especially since they came out long after other automakers realized they’re a pain and went back to physical controls. VW should have known better.
Nice show. Great question about the brakes.
I would never buy another VW, owned 2, one lasted a year and started falling apart, traded it in for a Consumer Reports recommended model, it was a death trap. It rarely rains in Southern California, but when it rained the electrical Gremlins came alive, sunroof opened and wouldn't close among other items. Why would I trust an all electric vehicle from VW, they were the worst and never honored their warranty. I was lucky I wasn't killed because it would just shut down in traffic! Nice to see Jake has slowed down.
You guys are starting to be like the old cranky guys on the muppets…complaining for complaining’s sake…the volume button with wet fingers was hard to use? You’re the driver. Why aren’t you using the buttons on the steering wheel? The center console is for the passenger. The gear shifter? Clearly they are moving it to get away from the center stack. Once you use it once or twice, you shouldn’t need to see it. Can’t remember the last time I actually looked at any gear shifter I’ve used (manual or auto)…You can see the letters lit up on the dash board. Do you guys look down at the center console when you are shifting an tranny (auto or manual)? The only real complaint about the ID4 is the window switch for the back windows…not worth the pennies they saved to get rid of two buttons. Put it back. Everything else is fine once you ride the car for 5 minutes.
I love the shifter, same style works perfectly in my i3. It annoys me when modern vehicles needlessly use space on the center console.
TESLA DELETED the Shifter in the Model 3/Y.
@@markplott4820 good for them
To Keith's point about wet or moist fingers and the inability to use the touchscreen controls, what about a gloved hand? Like you CR folks I live where part of the year I wear gloves to drive because it's cold. Would I need to remove gloves to work these controls? This is a question for any manufacturer of touchscreen dashboards.
A lot of German companies are putting regen on the brake pedal, which compromises brake feel as indicated. Tesla's regen when you lift the throttle, therefore maintaining consistent feel when you use the regular brakes. I also believe that Tesla uses regen on the front and rear motor if you have a dual motor version. Rear lock up for regen is actually a function of the traction control, as opposed to ABS. Regen on the rear brakes only, will be more likely to limit regen in slippery conditions, due to weight shift on braking. Agree that Hyundai Ioniq 5 looks like a real winner in this class.
Looking forward to your ionic5 review. Hope its a good one. Can they not update the software? After purchase I meant.
VW does have over-the-air update capability, and some of the UI issues could theoretically be addressed; whether they actually do that is another matter. The capacitive controls, the locations of some controls, and that stupid "rear" thing for the rear windows are baked into the design and won't change until if and when VW makes design changes...and I hope they do.
Thanks for an informative and entertaining review. I look forward to your reviews of the upcoming EV's from Hyundai and Kia. These should be good comparisons to the VW ID4. So far after 6 months of ownership, I am super pleased with my 2020 Hyundai Ioniq EV. Although it is rated for only 170 miles, I can regularly get over 200 on a charge. Yes, it is garaged and is used as an urban car. There was almost no learning curve to use the controls and the infotainment center.
About ev braking and Regen, I'm a mechanic and owner a Ioniq 2017 in cold Québec province of Canada, my experience on icy road with the Regen braking is the Regen is reduce once the electronic have identify that one or two wheel slip on ice and then rapidly reduce the regen current and act as abs in first step, the abs come in second once you remove your feet from the power(gas) pedal and brake with the actual pedal. In my opinion, this is how all ev car should work when they're not higher class and expensif car.
On the other hand it's unfortunate that this video is all criticism about infotainment and not on product built quality and ride.
Thanks for your.. Keeping the good job..
Monti owns 20 helmets! Wow!!!
I see the KIA version of the Ionic 5 electric in my garage in 2 years.
Thank you
Does it not have volume buttons on the steering wheel?
It does. The CR idiots didn't find it.
My problem with the Ioniq 5 is the exterior/interior styling. Really like the ID4 styling. Hope they fix the issues you have addressed as well as add LFP batteries, 800v charging, 275+ mile range as well as have available heat pump in their next iteration.
A neighbor has an ID.4 and it isn't impressive. There are clear signs of cost cutting everywhere you see and feel inside it.
Seat heaters do have a shortcut to adjust without going to Clima screen by using 2 fingers at once to tap on the climate adjust settings for the side you want to adjust.
Worst aspect of the car for me is the lack of 4 window buttons on driver side.
I've written to you by email to ask for clarification of the Drive system reliability problem reports for the 2021 Id.4 as noted in the expectation of poor reliability for the 2022 Id.4. which you gave an overall score of 59. I gather the electronics in the early ID.4's would freeze. Is that the basis of the poor reliability rating of the 2021 Id.4, or was there more to it than that. I appreciate that you have huge issues with the design of the driver interface of the electronics but I see that as different than a reliability issue. Ah, when I think about it I recall you noting details like being unable to control volume with a wet finger. That's reliability to my mind. And then there's the "sometimes" operation of the toggle touch to allow you to control either front or rear side windows. That's reliability too. maybe I'm answering my own question. Is there more I'm missing?
Another thing to consider. If you don't live in the USA, the price difference is unreal. I`m buying and ID.4 cause its seems to do everything I need it to do at a price I can afford.
I hope VW can make a nice EV microbus, but I hope they put simple easy to use controls into it.
The new VW controls have been universally panned in all the reviews I have seen or read. Hopefully VW are scrambling to fix the problem.
15 minutes to tell us they don’t like the controls. No info on luggage capacity head light performance or cost to maintain. Where is the real CR?
Edmunds or their own site can give you specs. CR exist to go beyond basic specs
To turn the radio down and off, use the controls on the steering wheel.
@8:45 "there's gotta be a better way..." seriously, there's also volume controls on the steering wheel. and I rarely use the touch volume control. lol
Your concern over the rear window control doesn't ring accurate with me. I'm forever mistakenly opening the rear windows on our Venza, which I've owned for 10 years. If I had a front/rear button I'd be in heaven. However, we've ordered a Model 3. If your going to get new tech ie electric drive, get the best, with long range, efficient baattery and comfort...
This car it’s amazing for me. The ID.4 was the top choice for me. I drove a Tesla Model Y and was not impressed.
Dont drink the cool aid man....lol
VW engineers and product planners should all be shamed and terminated.
Ok you REALLY lost me at "Why would you make another EV suv? Why would you try to replicate the model Y? only the model Y is the model Y?"
Guys, there are only like 5 or 6 full BEV SUVs on the market, and there are a lot of reasons people DON'T want a tesla. The more variety we have, the closer to an ideal product everybody can buy. VW themselves said they're NOT competing with tesla, they're trying to get people out of rav4s and CRVs.
I get it - i think its ridiculous that BMW, a company known for its sports sedans, now sells something like 7 or 8 models of SUV and thats silly, but right now there are fewer model-y-like-cars on the market than there are SUVs in BMW's line up. There is in fact room for other manufacturers to improve on what tesla sucks at and for tesla to beat what traditional automakers suck at.
That you think there isn't is the most shortsighted thing I've heard all day.
I can’t believe you said the ID4 is a direct competitor to the model Y, which is almost $20k more expensive! And you criticize VW for making an electric compact SUV? I am thrilled they did, because this is one of the most popular vehicle segments around the world. Most of your complaints are ridiculous. You even found a way to complain about 3 years of free Electrify America charging! Yes, haptic controls are unfortunate, but they made a great, affordable EV in a size people want. Well done VW.
Mike Monticello must be the Imelda Marcos of motorcycle helmets (plus a large collection of mountain bikes)!!
Guess the pay must be pretty good at CR.....
To me the changes they made to the controls was to save money. Makes it cheaper and simpler to make.
Yes, it is cheaper to code a function into the control architecture than add a switch (or 2, 4?) and its needed wiring harness
Wow, even when they liked something on the ID.4 they tempered their commentary. I also disagree with comparing this to Model Y. That was not a consideration when I purchsed my ID.4. Yes I love it. Does it have some quirks. Yes.
Capacitive controls in cars are ridiculous. Any capacitive touch control will require you to look at what/where you have to press/touch, at least some of the time (or majority of the time), taking your eyes off the road. No matter how used to them you are, you're probably going to have to look from time to time. Physical controls you can find and manipulate by touch alone, keeping your eyes on the road, always.
I've always been a VW fan, and their ergonomics have always been top notch, but all of these capacitive controls are a huge miss and really turn me off.
I think I speak for everyone in saying that Mike M. needs a few more helmets! Seriously though, I would love to hear an honest conversation between CR and an automotive designer to talk about the ergonomic horrors they have inflicted upon us. I'd also like to hear a projection when greatest hit songs such as, "Piano Black: Scratched and Smudged and Full of Dust on Day 1" and "Capacitive Touch: Wait, what did I just do?" will go away forever. I assume that due to product planning and supply chain issues, we've got a few more years at least of this nonsense.
I can't even finish the video. They're comparing two completely different cars because they're both EVs.
That's like saying a Corolla is shit compared to a Bugatti because they both run on gasoline.
The ID4 is within inches within of a RAV 4 and CRV. The ID4 was designed to be people's first introduction to EVs, and it feels as normal of a car as most EVs.
And 8 seconds isn't "slow" compared to all the other cars on the road. This isn't a performance SUV.
Really, I bailed out about 6 minutes in, very shabby!
I hope someone at VW is watching your channel. I guess making a BEV is not as easy as it looks. Tesla is not without some flaws but I love my Model 3. V11 update needs some tweaking and I know Tesla will take care of it via another update.
I have just taken delivery of an AWD id.4, and also have a Mach-e. My view is that the UI in the id.4 is better. The softer ride in the id.4 is actually superior to the Mach-e. Go back and drive a Mach-e on a real city street.
Keith has the best rant in all of automotive media history about a missing volume knob (TS 8:15) . And he is absolutely right about "Different" being dumb in many ways in this vehicle.
Really!!! You fail to mention, the Tesla quality issues, the ride is horrible, more expensive, no tax credits, the list to to long... ID4 ordered....
I came here to watch the test results but all I got is an endless rant of the control system with no car testing results. Save yourself some time and just start watching at 12:46 where they answered someone's question that gives you some new information.
I like the ID4. Drives fine, comfortable interior and loads of space. The only thing I agree with is the display controls and interface are not intuitive. What is odd is VW is known for simple and user friendly knobs and controls, but not on this model. Don't understand your comments about the Tesla being a competitor.
Not a direct competitor with the Tesla Model Y. VW ID.4 price starts at $40,760. Tesla Model Y price starts at $58,990. Even the top of the line VW ID.4 Pro S with Gradient starts at $46,760, far below the cheapest Tesla Model Y. All prices from USA versions of the two companies' respective websites.
This was not a review of the id4, this was a review of the instrument cluster
There is a shortcut for the seatheaters on ID4. Press the cold&hot capacitive buttons at the same time with your two fingers and your seat heaters will be on.
Defrost is way simple with voice control or thru the climate button.
TESLA has Superior AUTOMATIC seat Heaters.
@@markplott4820 The ID.4 has automatic seat heaters too, by the way.
Look behinds the shifter to see selector. The guy in the middle is weird
I have to disagree with point about Tesla being a direct competitor. They aren't. VW made ID.4 for someone like me who has a compact SUV and is looking to transition.
I simply do not know why some auto journalists compare the ID for with a Tesla anything. This is not competition for the model y or the model 3 for that matter. The ID.4 was described by VW as being competition for the Toyota RAV4 and Honda CRV shoppers who may be considering getting into the electric vehicle segment. There's at least a $10,000 price disparity between the VW ID.4 and a Tesla model Y.
As far as performance is concerned, the power of the all-wheel drive id.4 is more than sufficient. Just because one EV can do zero to 60 mph in 3 seconds doesn't mean they all should. Some auto journalists are losing touch with reality. They need to stop conveying a message that this vehicle is underpowered or barely capable of performing everyday tasks with some sort of composure. MotorWeek said this thing corners like a Porsche Taycan and the stopping performance was very commendable.
I agree with them on the capacitive touch, haptic feedback buttons, they have to go away. They are okay for the screen because it's a screen but there needs to be physical buttons everywhere else. The power window button situation wouldn't bother me too much because I'm always hitting the rear window buttons by accident in our current vehicle. The heated seat buttons look like they could be fixed with a software update, in fact, a lot of stuff could be fixed with the software update.
Been driving an id4 for a few months. I like it quite a bit. I do agree with you on the controls but I think you are making too big a deal over it. Also, you say you’ve been praising Tesla for the goofy iPad stuck on the dash. Why wouldn’t the other car makers try to emulate them then? I’ve driven the car on a few road trips and it does fine. It has plenty of range.
Question for Mike. What is the optimal number of bikes? Answer: One more.
The same goes with guitars!
ID 4 and the Ionic 5 are more direct competitors than the ID 4 and Tesla Y where a large price difference exists!
Remember when plastic cladding we're becoming more 10 20 years ago... The haters we're plenty lol... It would be funny if more brands started doing 2 window switches. Of course they will compare this to a Tesla. Lol
ID4 and Model Y are not competitors. And, try talking to any Tesla owner and ask them what their real work range is. I own a model 3 and have never gotten the rated EPA range.
It's awesome for me @25k
Don't rely on EPA range
I’m a VW fan. I’ve owned 6 or 7 of them. Never any real issues. That being said, if VW doesn’t make some necessary changes (the ones these guys are talking about) I will be looking elsewhere in 3 years when my Cross Sport lease is up. Plain and simple. I want an EV next, but not the VW in its current state.
You are comparing - real world range of the ID.4 (240 miles) with the Tesla claimed range of 326 miles for the Y. Why is that? the Model Y only has about 10 miles range advantage in the wild.
4:55 pretty simple, they needed to understand the market, and 5 years ago (when all these cars were being laid out) the only EV having any success was Tesla. So, they did what everyone else does who's entering a segment, copy the leader first. in a few years time you'll see a more sensible VW EV, but they need to understand what that means first.
Best example I can think of is the Hyundai sonata. When they first entered the market, they weren't trying to be different to the accord, they were just trying to catch it, and up to the second generation that's what they were doing. Gen 3 rolls around and Hyundai goes it's own way with its amazing interior.
Based on what I've seen, the entire industry is in the 2.5 generation Sonata area right now. which means the next crop of updates is going to be really exciting.
12:20 a good chunk of it is also cost cutting. one good screen can cost less than dozens of buttons. Also, Remember Tesla doesn't want outside suppliers (good luck with that), so to keep things "manageable" they have to reduce their part count as much as possible. Hence why the turn stalks went away in favor of buttons on steering wheel.
But what's good for the company, isn't always good for the consumer. While it does take time, that attitude will eventually catch up to any automaker too admit about it (90's GM and 2000's Mercedes, anyone?), and given the timing of the product line, this could easily kill Tesla if it comes at the wrong time.
That's actually good news for the legacy automakers because they know how this story ends, and they are being careful about what to change.
I find electric cars very boring. I can't get excited about them. Maybe one day. Are there any full electric convertibles?
Why would you compare any new EV to Tesla when their price point is so much higher than more modestly priced EVs?
Good points called in this debate. Seems most of the problems were solved by Skoda Enyaq over here in Europe. :)
VW has a huge hit with that Bus. They refuse to build it.
A number of points. Up in Canada the ID4 AWD is 53k with a rebate. The Model Y is 77k. How can these 2 be competitors?
Re: brake feel, the Model Y and 3 brake feel is like steeping on a tree stump. Non existent.
Tesla interface. It’s beyond too much. It’s stupid. Opening your glove box in a menu? Change air direction? Menus? Why did VW try to copy stupid? No pano roof shade on the Teslas?
Anyways, I’ve driven a Model 3 and Y and it’s certainly fast but my god the build quality was terrible and the interior was very cheap looking.
I’m looking forward to seeing the VW but I’m now thinking the Ioniq will win my purchase.
“Klima” is climate in German… not cute to make fun about that.
Instead of buttons, you just can tell ID to turn up/down heat etc etc etc.
Volkswagen CLEARLY distanced itself from wanting to be like Tesla. They are not trying to compete with Tesla… they want to attract the ICE drivers in the category crossover/SUV.
There are so many more points that were talked about here that I don’t agree with. Interior and controls are a taste thing 🤷🏻♀️.
this group picked a Dodge Truck as number 1 LOL
Please go back to your longer format!
Until there are more charging stations, I refuse to spend an extra $10,000 for an EV. Even my Hyundai dealer cannot "give away" the Kona EV. I prefer my 2022 Kona Limited gas engine. I didn't have to pay $600 for an electrician to install an EV Charging station in my house's garage where I park my Kona.
It's really a bunch of Tesla fan boys...
What useless conversation. I am tending more towards the id.4 compared to model 3/y is the soft/quiet ride. Less use of alimunium for reasonable ibsyrance rates. And better quality control compared to tesla.
I love hearing about tech from a guy with a computer from the 80's in the background. Nope.
Nothing’s perfect. We can nit pick any car.
These people are total shills. The vw id4 is awesome.
Wow... I just subscribed to CR and I'm thinking I made a mistake after watching this video. You are comparing apples to a dog... VW did not build this vehicle to complete with model Y and that is absolutely obvious to anyone except you guys apparently lol
If you bought an ID.4, why are you the way that you are?
VW did a lot of changes for the sake of change; these guys did a lot of complaining for the sake of complaining. Looking for the hair in the soup distracts from justified critique.
But they were change for the sake of change. Everything they did that inconveniences or confuses consumers was done to save money. They took cost cutting to the extreme and it shows everywhere throughout the ID.4
I believe CR has replaced their over zealous ways of Toyota with Tesla. And it shows.
Great video. I feel the EVs only have a city appeal. These cars can never be your roadtrip car unless one has the time to charge it evey 240 miles. I would only buy a EV if it had a 5000 mile range but i guess it will take many years to build a battery like that!
I road trip a fair amount with my family and Hyundai's Ioniq5 charges to 80% in around 18 minutes. That's officially just quick enough for me that I will now consider this or similarly designed/featured EVs for my next vehicle.
Mmm.... I guess you guys need something to talk about, but I think the criticism is pretty seriously overblown. Almost comically overblown to be perfectly frank. Its basically kindergarten complaining. As an owner I just don't have any of these issues. My only real complaint is that the UI is a little too slow responding, and the brake blending could be a little better. But it doesn't make the car any less enjoyable to drive.
I mean... really? Complaining about the gear selector? Really? There are only two gears (D and B), the vehicle always starts in D when you get in, and once you are moving forward getting them mixed up in your head is impossible... you feel the difference instantly in the accelerator pedal. And complaining that you can't turn off the radio because your finger is wet? Jeeze. The radio slider is one of the UI features that actually works really well! The windows aren't that big a deal either... it's not as though you spend your entire day messing with the window controls. Some people might legitimately complain about the lack of one-pedal driving, but I personally love VW's light-regen in D mode and getting more with the brake. VW's light regen in D (the computer actually adjusts it according to conditions, very lightly) is what I want most of the time.
There are lots of things VW could clean up in a software update. I'm not unaware of the issues... its just that they aren't really even remotely showstoppers. None of those things really affect driving enjoyment.
This is my experience: I approach the car. I open the door. I get in, put on my seat-belt, and the car is on its way literally just 2 seconds later. I don't have to touch the keys in the my pocket even once. I don't have to take my phone out of my pocket or even turn it on. By the time I get to the end of the first block, the UI is fully operational and Apple Car Play has thrown its map up. The radio starts playing the instant I get in the car in the last state I left it in, and if I want it off it takes literally 1 second to swipe the volume and its off. Handling on the road is excellent. On a cold day, the car turns the heated seats (etc) on by itself. And when I don't want the main display on, I just hit the off button (because... what exactly do I need the display for? To look at pretty blinking numbers or something?). Getting out of the car is just as easy. Happy camper.
Sure, I'd like VW to fix various niggling little issues. But... they are all pretty damn minor. The car is great, and I'm really a bit miffed to see grown men whining. It brings to mind a scene near the end of Don't Look Up :-(.
-Matt