I have had one for 4 years now. When people ask, I simply state the obvious: I bought an engine, but it came with a car. This thing is fantastic. Like you said, as a second summer only car, I simply don't know what else I could get that would make me smile this much. Thanks a lot for the video ! (and knocking on wood, so far mine hasn't cost me a fortune !)
5 year owner here, absolutely agree. I've been daily driving mine the whole time though and I still feel the same way. It's not nearly as bad as most make it out to be. I for one like the SMG, I think it fits the personality of the car completely. And I've done enough S6 redline shifts (where it feels like the transmission is going to fall out) to know that it can absolutely take the punishment. It's a blast giving someone a ride for the first time and getting their reaction to the full throttle shifts. It's a violent affair, but it's built for it. I will say though if you drive it in automatic mode you are going to think it's terrible. The auto mode sucks, manual mode and S5 or S6 only for me and it's a pleasure to drive.
@@Camride Oh yeah, I agree, mine's an SMG as well, and it took me about ~2 month to stop hating it. But whoever did the coding for the auto mode at BMW should be fired, the rest of it isn't as bad as it seems at first. I would love to try a manual as well to see how it behaves, unfortunately for me, manuals were nowhere to be seen when I decided to go for it. In Canada they are even rarer than the states.
@@julienlardy5961 I test drove a manual and honestly it just didn't feel right to me. It didn't feel like it fit the car. The SMG feels right, even with its faults. Now if I could take out the SMG hydraulics and put in a clutch pedal... that'd be incredible. Maybe a project for the future when it's no longer my only mode of transportation. :)
You have to realize that this is the only time, since the dawn of the universe till the end of time, you'll be able to buy an NA V10 supercar for 15k $. what a time to be alive.
That after market exhaust sounded amazing on that M5. Sad that it has so many mechanical problems, I loved the old M series BMW'S way more than the new ones.
Im a BMW mechanic, cant tell you how many of these rolled in the door that someone had just purchased and it already had thousands of dollars in repairs. The Vanos oil line that runs from the pump to the actuators likes to burst and bleed off oil pressure, the throttle actuators in the valley of the motor fail a lot, the oil cooler behind the front bumper leaks for no reason, hell I even had one that hydro locked itself because one bank of injectors were spraying with the engine off. Buyer beware.
Totally reminds me why my neighbor that had a 550i eventually dumped the car because of small issues that would never stop cropping up especially the VANOS. Meanwhile my 14 year old GS430 like Straightpipes runs flawless with only major repair I’ve done is timing belt and valve cover gasket.
I have indeed seen a little old lady driving an e60 m5. I was pulling up to give a thumbs up and she was hunched over the steering wheel. It was adorable.
A wave of irony just crashed over me as I’m sitting here thinking to myself ‘why would anyone buy a car that they know is going to break’ Then my phone rings and it’s the Ford service department telling me that my upper radiator hose isn’t covered by the $3500 B to B warranty I bought and they want $500 to replace it. Perspective...heh...
Yeah dude that's just car ownership in general. You just try to pick the one that's going to give you the least amount of headaches and the biggest amount of smiles.
Insanely far from accurate. You can tell neither of them know much about M’s nor this car in general as it appears they googled “common e60 m5 issues” and then proceeded to waste our time making a generic review bashing an amazing car.
So many people misunderstand this car. They compare it with a Lexus when it should be compared to a Lambo. It's not intended as a long term practical every day car, although in many cased it has been very successfully used as one. It's a car you get into for an experience, not just to get from A to B. Same thing for the SMG beating. People judge it by the wrong rules. Driving slowly around town it does feel sluggish, but it also has character and you need to drive it, you are aware of every gear change. NEVER put it in auto mode, the marketing knob who insisted on including that should have been fired. It's a disaster because this isn't an auto gearbox and wasn't intended to be. On a twisty open road the SMG is just bliss. Two hands on the wheel, fast changes and down-changes to make you tingle every time. The cost of ownership is distorted too. I've heard of people having the entire gearbox replaced because the "SMG failed". Most people don't know that the gearbox itself is a rock solid 7 speed manual designed specifically for this V10 monster, just with some hydraulic bits bolted onto the side of it. The most common failure is electrical solenoids that are cheap if you know how to diagnose them properly. I've literally NEVER heard of an actual gearbox that's failed in any way. Even crazy supercharged modded cars with high mileage run the 7 speed with zero failures related to strength. Still the internet is convinced they are blowing up at every traffic light just because you adjusted the radio volume. I have an SMG M5 and a manual E46 M3. I've owned about ten other manual road and race cars in my life, and have only ever had one automatic (Audi S4 B6, which I love). The SMG is perfect for the M5 and there is no way I would swap it for a manual. In my mind it would ruin what the car is and was meant to be. This was the vision of the BMW engineers at the time. High revving V10, 7 speed close ratio gearbox, 60 millisecond shift times, perfect downshifts every time. They would have cried when the marketing people insisted that the old manual had to go in it, and for good reason. If you are a car guy and can afford one of these as a second or third car, find a good one and go for it. Drive it occasionally for pure enjoyment. Keep it properly and it will be better than money in the bank. Will be a seriously collectible car in a few years when most of them have been completely ruined by people that think they are a Lexus or a Civic.
Amen !!! Finally someone who actually knows what he is talking about. It amazes me why anyone lucky enough to get to drive one of these will not take their time to learn to drive it properly. Most car enthusiasts will at least have heard of the quirkiness of a Porsche CGT, a car unfortunately most of us may never get to drive let alone own. Notice how those lucky folks carefully accustom themselves to the unique clutch/gearbox? Frankly, BMW did petrol heads the world over a huge favor when did put this incredible engine into production, in a family car !!! 6 years into a E61 M5 ownership ( Touring ), and each time I drive it is like the same excitement I felt the first time I drove it home from purchase. It has been the most reliable of all the performance cars I have ever owned, and I have had a few. It is no garage queen, I drive it hard like it is meant to. But then, I have taken very good care of it above the maintenance schedule that even BMW/ I-drive recommends. Apart from my few dream cars ( Ferrari GTO, CGT, LFA ), there just isn’t any modern cars out there that appeal to me, and so I will be keeping this icon indefinitely...
@@orlandobello1638 yeeessss!!! I thought I was reading a comment I wrote previously when reading your comment! Im 7 years into an 09 e61 love affair too, Ill be buried in it. Chose to add a Manhart CF airbox and complete Supersprint exhaust to heighten the theatrics in a tasteful manner. 2 x 2 week Euro roadtrips have been a trouble free delight.
Dude, you're living in your own reality if you think the cost of ownership is distorted. They are absolutely expensive to own and operate. This platform is beyond finicky and problematic. Don't make excuses for a dud that was made by a company that can't build something even remotely reliable. I can level with you on the fun/enjoyment factor, but there are plenty of other enjoyable driver focused cars out there that make much better sense than this. These M cars are too often over-hyped. I won't even get into the fact that you think this should be compared to a Lamborghini... smh.
{Motor Mafia} obviously it’s for stocking the necessary condom supply required for the amount of times this guy fucks. I’m sure his lady passengers leak more fluids than the car does when he downshifts.
I have my M5 now for about a year now. It’s a 2008 6-Speed Manual with only 100k on the odometer with 2 previous owners. I bought this last Nov 2017. Every time I drove the car. I have a big smile on my face. I got the rod bearings and replaced all 10 spark plugs and coils. No problems so far. Now I can enjoy the car without fearing that the engine will seize. I got lucky with this one. Great video my friend.
Don't do any updates on this car, these people can't afford it. I have one and I spend 5k every year on maintenance and it makes me happy to have this great car and for you McDonalds eaters stop looking at these cars you can't even afford in your dreams.
I've been daily driving my 2008 M5 for 5 years now, bought it with 70k miles and have 130k miles now. Yes there are some common problems (VANOS, throttle actuators, etc) but the car gets a much worse rep than it deserves. The majority of the time if the car was maintained properly and not hooned with cold oil they hold up really well. I'm still on the original rod bearings, I've had each oil change sent to Blackstone and have no increase in metals over the 60k miles I've had it. Mine has never been on a tow truck and never left me stranded. Sure it's had some expensive repairs, but I knew that going in and was prepared for it. The cost to me is totally worth it, I've never owned a car that has put this kind of smile on my face every time I get in it. I never plan on selling mine, I love it too much. The SMG is also not nearly as terrible as is made out to be in this video. It takes some getting used to, but I can drive the car smoothly without issue. Original clutch lasted to 80k miles, current clutch has 50k miles and is holding up perfectly well. My SMG has had literally zero issues. If they're maintained properly they hold up well (except for the early ones, but that was fixed in late 2006).
I'm looking to buy one early next year, however videos like these really scare me. I am just so in love with the S85 I can't seem to resist. If you could give me any tips when looking for one that would be great.
@@SFBayPhotographer The main thing is to buy from an individual that has good service records if possible. I believe a lot of the rod bearing issues are directly tied to the engines being beat on before they are warmed up. And a lot of that is likely from the original owner. Since most new M5's get leased I think there's a probability that the original owner wasn't an enthusiast as much as they're just looking for the most baller car to impress others. Those people don't understand the importance of warm-ups and they will likely follow the oil change interval that BMW set originally at 15k miles. Beyond that make sure to get a PPI of the car and if possible get an oil sample and send it to Blackstone Labs, they can measure the metal content in the oil. It's not a gaurantee that the rod bearings are good, but it could give you an indication if they're toast (high lead/tin/copper). Also the later the model the better chance you'll have with over maintenance and things breaking. If you can get an extended warranty, even if just for a year or two, absolutely get it. I bought a 2yr/24k mile warranty on mine for $2900 and it paid out over $6k in repairs (mainly VANOS, throttle actuator and some smaller stuff like a diff leak and thermostat). Since my warranty ended very few things have gone wrong with mine, it's been extremely reliable. It's never left me stranded and it's never been on a tow truck. My TH-cam channel has my email address under the About page so shoot me an email if you need any more help.
@@Camride I appreciate the reply. I will definitely take your advice into consideration. I will also email you if I have any further questions. Also, sorry to hear about the accident. Hope you can find another one!
Really surprised the economy wasn't brought up. It's a system shock if you haven't experienced anything like it before. I mean, I drive mostly city and average like 9-10mpg. And the tank is too small for this! Like 200 miles to a tank in mixed driving. And of course that will maybe go up to 12 on long highway drives because of course you want to be low-key cruising at a buck twenty. Premium gas too. Try to think about the smiles per gallon though.
@@ryan94mustang I average 13-14mpg with mixed driving, 19mpg all highway and single digits on track days. I've put about 60k miles in 5 years and I've never once regretted my decision. The smallish tank and less than stellar fuel economy are 100% worth it to me. And I have a wife and 2 young kids! It's an awesome family vehicle.
@@kingprone7846 It´s not a racetrack right. There is no problem with driving 280kph on the autobahn. the only limit with this car is by the traffic density.
LFA is quite possibly the best sounding car. Most call it, one of the greatest engine/car combo ever made. F1 V10 at 9500 rpm and 72 degree bank angles (as in F1 racing car). You have to hear it in real life to truly believe how amazing it is. LFA V10 alone cost more than all of the M5 brand new. M5 has a 90 degree bank angle just like all other V10s and revs a lot lower. LFA sounds like a pure F1 racing car while this sounds like a high revving V10 like Lambo, Audi etc
This is the Lexus LFA of sedans. Both are my absolute dream cars. One is dirt cheap, and horrifically unreliable, the other is the exact opposite. Reliable and damn expensive
So sick of people bashing this car! I've owned mine for 4 years now and it is the most reliable car I've ever owned. 40k miles and going strong and I drive it hard! Puts a smile on your face everytime!
@@fantomg100 Still $0 spent on repairs fuckface boy and still smilling. 5 years going strong! Own/owned benzes , vettes and others that are far more unreliable
I had an e92 that after 6 years of absolute love and affection at the level of "I'm keeping this car until gasoline is illegal", It threw a rod bearing on me without warning, in the middle of a cross country trip 3 states from my home. It will take me the better part of a decade to get back the money I lost to that car, I will never trust bmw with my money again. I also had brand new GS and R nine T motorcycles from them, their dealers are awful, BMW NA is awful, it's sad since I used to be "the beemer guy" but I was betrayed and I'm going by the fool me once mantra. The fact that the E46 blew motors, and every s85 s65 from the launch in 2005 to the end of production in 2013 had these problems is what makes me so bitter. BMW doesn't care, they knew they would last till 50k and after that they couldn't care less, you are on your own, have fun buying a new engine from us for 25k is their attitude. Before that car I had an '08 VR6 Audi TT and I tracked the hell out of it at least once a month for 2 years and not a single thing, down to plastic bodywork rivets ever broke on that car. Cars can be made right, BMW opts out of that idea.
Reliability of the v10...Find a Lamborghini v10 with 100,000+ miles, and tell me the amount of money needed to keep that v10 on the road for 100,000+ miles. Let me rewind, at the time, as enthusiast, we clamored for BMW a return (e28 and e34) to a bespoke ///M engine, instead of a modified off-the-shelf engine, which came in the e39. Motorsport gave us an F1 “inspired” engine. Warranty or not, you still need disposable income or FU money or whatever you want to call it. There is a saying in my industry, scared money never makes good money. Scared owners never make good owners. If something breaks, fix it. If you can’t afford it, well this car is not for you. I have 300,000+ miles of experience owning different generations of m5s. With my e60 6 speed m5, I have 130,000+ miles of DD, road tripping, and tracking experience. My e60 m5 and e28 m5 are not leaving my stable anytime soon. There are only handful of original/second e60 owners still out there. The good e60 examples are hard to find and rarely trade hands, leaving the used market saturated with less-than-stellar examples. Regarding reliability, these cars are only as reliable as the owner’s bank account. Zero catastrophic failures. Replaced RBs @80k & @150k, VANOS @150k, TBs are original. Clutch replaced by previous owner @18K just before I bought it - meaning I have 130k+ on clutch, with trackdays, airstrips, and DDing. These cars are only as reliable as the owners’ commitment to maintenance and resources.
I have 130k on my 08 and car has been solid. Replaced TBs at 93k. RBs are original, no knocking oil study came back clean. I don’t track it but I do drove in M mode 90% of the time.
I'm somewhat jealous of you E60 and E28! Your comments are spot on. Issues I had with my E36 325is were a lack of maintenance from previous owners. The engine was a gem when I sold it had 180K miles and still pulled beautifully. With Bilstein shocks it cornered beautifully and stopped well. They are great cars, but with M cars in particular need maintenance like exotic cars. Keep trucking.
I remember like 10 years ago I was waiting for the bus in NYC. A straight piped e60 M5 pulled hard on the intersection and to this day it is still the best sounding car i had ever heard in my life.
Great video, I reviewed a white E60 last year. In the U.S. the E60 M5 was sold in model years 2006-2010. The manual transmission was available model years 2007-2010. 2006 are SMG only. The manual was only available in the U.S. and Canada. The rest of the world including Germany, the car was only available In SMG. Production numbers in North America were 9,491 cars of which 1,364 cars were built with a manual transmission. As of this writing none are available at CarMax, probably because they don’t want to warranty it and any aftermarket warranty will be extremely expensive. The car I reviewed last year was an SMG and had over 70k miles and still on its second owner, he bought it certified pre-owned from a BMW dealer and it has been highly maintained its entire life and he has had no problems with it. I know another with a 2010 manual, original owner with over 80k miles and no problems. I think the moral of the story is you need a highly maintained car with 10 years of service records. Make mine a manual, it was great car for open roads where you can unleash the V10 to 8,200 rpms. SMG cars are cheap at $15-25k. A manual will run $25k high mileage to $35k and up for lower mileage. Consider an M6 as well if you don’t need a back seat, basically the same car and much rarer in production numbers 3,887 produced during the same time period and only 323 with a manual trans
I miss the Bangle design. He was pushing the envelope for sure, sometimes it failed but sometimes he'd come up with something like this e60 that is completely timeless.
He was a genious, but people will apreciate him even more over time. This e60 is just amazing, nowadays BMW are playing it too safe, they make them for the majority to like them
Looks are obviously completely subjective. The E60's, in general, are still hideous. However, because the M5 E60 has a V-10 lurking under its hood, it does give it more of an internalized beauty (especially with same tasteful aftermarket add-ons). For me, the E39 was the pinnacle M5 because it had an extraordinary engine and looks for its time. On the other hand, the E60 was the pinnacle in engine layout (it upped the E39's engine in massive way). The F10 and F90 are far more beautiful and elegant but they don't have that special feeling because it doesn't have anything really spectacular. Of course, the performance of the F-series M cars are nothing short of visceral monsters. But now that you're having to create synthetic sounds, for the exhaust, BMW has practically neutered the M-5 on Prozac. BMW needs to get Yamaha to design the sounds of the next M-cars. Then again, what would I know. I would never own a car that breaks all the time.
@@ErwinSchrodinger64 Obviously looks are subjective, but what I meant is that around this time BMW and Chris Bangle weren't afraid to try out something interesting with their design. The F10 looked more contemporary when it came out, but it looks old already. And the Gwhateveritis looked dated half a year after its release IMO. They were both playing it so safe compared to this. Meanwhile its been ~15 years since the E60/61 was designed, and it still has some timeless beauty to it. Again, as subjective as these matters are, I know I'm not alone with my opinion.
I think everything he did was hideous - this particular car is even worse because of that stupidly over-sized roof box that looks like it belongs on a Jeep Cherokee.
The SMG has to be tamed. Just lift off the throttle slightly before upshifting in the hardest mode and it’s buttery smooth - the timing is not hard to get.
This. You have to learn how to drive SMG, theres a certain way it behaves, if anyone has driven SMG and have controlled the throttle/shifts perfectly it's such a unique experience.
@@dankim3950 definitely mastered the smg super quickly. No issues and other than being slow to shift, it was great fun. Wife hated the car so I has to go other end of the spectrum, e63 with air suspension. By far the most comfortable 500hp car I've ever driven.
I'd probably get a Lexus GS F and put a high quality aftermarket exhaust on it. It may not have a screaming V10 like the E60 M5, but its free revving naturally aspirated V8 is also a dying breed. God bless high performance naturally aspirated engines.
I’ve had my 08 M6 three years,new tires, new brakes,replaced ignition coil,no major issues yet..knock on wood..plus my brother is a great mechanic..Love my M6
Savage, I know this is a lot of money, but for those who are *REALLY* into the e60, I recommend the CarBahn Autoworks engine rebuild (7k for the kit, 20k for a 5.2 complete rebuild). It solves all of the reliability issues with the engine, and gives you added performance + headroom for more power (if you want it).
Idk dude. The only really bad thing about the engine its the rod bearings. BMW just drops the oil plate at the bottom and can change it from there. The RM of the place i work at told me it was around 400$ total.
Yeah just looked it up. All you get is new valve springs pistons and rod bearings. No way. Smh. And the 22hp isnt worth the price. Ive never heard of the springs and pistons not being up to snuff always just the rod bearing. Which a company has been contracted to make new bearings to fix the issue since BMW lost the class action. Id rather pay and send my trans to shepp or jacks to get redundancy and tuning done.
@@followthegrow108 That's not all of the components, but whatever since I guess little/no value is given to the tensioner/chains/etc. You're getting 10 custom (CP or Carillo? Forgot which) forged pistons, and custom valve springs as well. Clevite bearings are the world's most durable (I know this isn't shown on the page, but they are the bearing manufacture CarBahn is using). Not too bad for 7k, given the class of car/engine you have to be expecting to pay a lot for low-volume custom components. Not to mention there are custom rods available, stroker kit, sleeves, etc. Once again, it costs exorbitant amounts of money, but so do mods for expensive cars in general (especially custom engine components man).
So reading between the lines.... Get an IS-F instead. Proven to go over 300k miles with no big issues. Not the same V10 soundtrack, no doubt... But so much easier to live with and that 5 Liter V8 is no slouch!
@@person.w9780 The fact that IS-F is more expensive exactly reflects my point. A good example is under $20k. I know because I've been looking. They aren't that expensive. And while the M5 is "cooler" (I agree with you), are you willing to take the pain for that coolness? I'm not. I couldn't enjoy the driving experience knowing there's a ticking time bomb under me. Too much paranoia.
Yeah, I was going to say, you're not going to find an IS F for $15K, mabe if it has 200K miles on it... But yeah, that Lexus V8 is a sweet piece. Might not sound like this v10, but it still sounds mean AF with some headers and pipes!
@@BarnStangz Agreed. In your example, that 200k miles IS-F is still a safer bet than this M5 with only 77k on it and the owner has replaced countless items and it STILL has malfunctions. There's a documented case of a member on the Lexus forum with over 330k miles on his IS-F with no problems, leaks or failures. I value reliability over a money pit. Just depends on what you value more. Get what you like!
You'll never understand the E60 M5 till you own one. You can hate on it as much as you want but till you own one you'll never know. Yeah it costs a packet to maintain and in gas but it's well worth it
I owned one of these for a year and replaced it with a Jaguar XFR (supercharged V8) I must admit looking back the M5 was a far better performer, I was amazed how that car pulled all the way to 8000rpm, I’ve never owned anything quite like it. Amazing motor that every car enthusiast musthave a go in, Unfortunately my DSC became faulty and with a worry of mounting costs I let her go cheap. I would’ve kept this car if I could go back in time but never mind, at least I got to experience it’s sheer performance. Currently in the market for C43.... I need something with a little more MPG nowadays
Great video Mark, hope to see more of these reviews of older generation sporty/sportscars. In UK/Europe, we have a rare Touring model (wagon) which I think is a very appealing prospect to me - a V10 hauler. Unfortunately, the US (as Jack mentions) was the only market to have a manual version so to source a manual transmission from a 545i would be tricky to do a conversion and apart from BMW producing the one-off M5 CSL prototype, I don't know of anyone else who has done a DCT swap from the E9x M3 - but that could be a good alternative too if you can find a salvaged E9x M3. Its unfortunate that most of these owners don't let their M3/M5/M6s warm up after starting the engine because that is (as you say) where most of the rod bearing issues come from. Throttle actuators are a bitch as both of them need to be replaced when one of them fails in a relatively short mileage interval. If you can find an aftermarket exhaust that produces that typical high-pitched/howling sound that a V10 F1 car offers, you're winning in life.
I owned a low mileage 50k miles 2010 m6 3 pedal manual for 7 months,drove the whole pacific coast with it,0 issues after i fixed 2 control arms,always warmed up the oil before i steped on it,sold it for more than i bought it for and i wouldnt buy a manual again
I really, really, really love how insightful and balanced your reviews are. Also, beautiful production value. Thank you so much to you and your team for all your efforts and hard work!
I love this car so much. I had an 06' it put me in a financial debacle when I was a college student. Traded it in for a used Civic Si, and lost a lot of $$. Now I'm back in the hunt for another one fully understanding what this car is and will be owning one (maintenance wise). Hopefully I'll find one soon, can't wait!!
I bought an '09 M6 Convertible and love the car, but it is NOT cheap to own. I'm the third owner and have every service record - from both previous owners - going all the way back to its first oil change. Every service was completed by a BMW dealership. It had 54000 miles on the clock when I got it. And I STILL just thousands in repairs. (Throttle actuator... bank 2 was bad, but I replaced them both. New alternator. New battery. A few other odds and ends.) I also have to keep it on a battery tender. That said, it is AMAZING. I rarely turn on the radio because the V10 sounds that good. I love it. Still and all, I say a little prayer before I hit the start button. ;) Great video!
Fantastic review. I’m fortunate (I think) to have one of the 1,364 E60 M5s with a manual trans as my daily driver. A joy to drive for all of the reasons Goose mentions. As a relatively large naturally aspirated car, it has a Jekyll and Hyde quality to it, as it can feel sluggish and heavy at low revs in normal driving mode, then like a wild animal once you open it up in 500S. As to the much-bemoaned maintenance and repair costs, I think they’re priced in at this point. I purchased this decade-old supercar for $25k and within a few months dropped another $8k or so on a thermostat, rod bearings and other repairs/preventative maintenance. (Some people think the bearing issue is inflated, but some of mine were well into the copper before 60k.) For this level of enjoyment, though, I consider $33k to be money well spent. But that doesn’t mean I don’t drive in fear for all of the reasons Goose mentions, even with none of the big ticket SMG/bearing problems to worry about. The thing is the automotive version of the sword of Damocles. Love it or leave it.
I bought a manual M6 with the same intention. Sure, I have to spend a bunch of money on preventative maintenance to sleep at night, but then again there's not another manual V10 remotely as attainable as this one. Money well spent in my eyes.
After 4 years do you still own the M5 Brian? If so, that's a long time. Man it's my dream car the V10 M5, so i had to bought the 530d 3.0L im in love with it. As you said, you used your M5 as a daily drive?
@@Viso2K I sold the E60 after a couple years and bought an F10. The repeated big ticket maintenance issues just wore me down, the last being idle control valves which put the motor into limp mode and required me to take the whole intake off. It would have been $5k+ at Dinan so I did it myself along with updating the throttle body actuators, all for $1500. Even though it was kind of fun, after that the bloom was off the rose for me. There’s seemingly no end to the expensive things that can go wrong with the E60 and I needed something more reliable for a daily. That aligns with everything you hear about these things, but for a while the fun outweighed all of that. The F10 is faster, smoother and more modern, but also less visceral. It has had very few maintenance issues despite what you might hear from savagegeese. Best of luck with the 530d - those diesel engines have their own issues with carbon and everything but imagine they’re less of a ticking time bomb than the mighty V10.
I had 2 M5 E60 V10, first a May 2005 model, then a facelift May 2008 model. Perfect daily driver, some minor electric problems on the 2005 model, no problem at ALL on the facelifted. In total 90000 km on the first M5, and 200000 km on the second. No new clutch, no mechanical problems, no anything wrong. To mention that the second one is not just a facelift, after picking it up from the dealership, i thought i am driving an Audi A8. The difference between my MK1 M5 and MK 2 M5 was big, in the drivetrain and suspension, sound. Longest trips from south italy to north sweden, with snow, ice and -20 C temperatures. No problem. I made all the km with the 400 PS setting, and all other settings on comfort. Only in few cases, push the M (MAN) button on the steering wheel and you will run a crazy horse with 507 PS.... just like in a race car. By the way don't do it on a parking space or close to any obstacle: the car will jump forward if you press the pedal...If you want to get an M5, i would consider the MK2. If you like it raw, then an MK1. Enjoy the last real M5 of history (the new one is for me a kind of boosted 550i).
the europrans have almost all the performance cars, what seems to be a problem over there is making anything that's not a sporty or track car reliably.
@@behindthen0thing Before you get into a fight with prof. stein you two should agree on the europrans vs. eurpeans issue... I think you've each managed to mangle one cylinder.
In my opinion, you buy these for two reasons, 1. exhaust note, 2. to be different. I have an e63 M6 (same engine) and absolutely love it. I don't take it out often (4 other cars that I drive over it daily) but when crank it up, smiles all the time. That roof rack is sweet in the video!
The more I watch these videos down the line the more I appreciate my father getting the e60 550i m pack. Looks like an m5 without all the issues in the tranny and rod bearings. Just a fat v8 and an auto. Just doesn’t sound like one but it doesn’t have a factory tuned exhaust so startups have a nice explosive v8 boom. And that v8 rumble at idle
FishFind3000 That V8 had its own issues. Pretty much every engine in the E60 did, though the issues got worse as the cylinder count rose. A shame as that chassis was incredible
I’ve got one in a 6-speed manual. It’s the only way to buy the car. It’s night and day different. Reliability isn’t good, but it’s not bad. Car has to fully warm up before you push it whatsoever but once it’s ready to go you gotta drive it like you stole it to keep it healthy. It’s an amazing car and if you can find a low mileage 2008-2010 example it’s worth getting.
tbh i like the idea of having a sporty car (not an m5, there you have space already, but say a 911) and putting a roof rack for extra cargo on when you actually need the extra space. but only "because" is as stupid as ugly camo wraps
I used to have this exact car. Had some fun moments in it, but overall it was a bad experience. I took great care of it but so many things went wrong. My heart would stop when I heard the chime in the dash. You never knew what kind of malfunction it would surprise you with. Engine power reduced, steering wheel lock error (won't unlock), emission control malfunction, transmission yellow cog, transmission red cog, misfire detected, engine malfunction, computer failure, and so many more errors. I finally sold it with only 45K miles on it. When it gets low on gas it makes the same chime sound as when there is a malfunction. Such an incredible sigh of relief to look down and see that it's just the gas getting low...
Thank you for putting this together! As it happens, I own a 2008 M5 with the manual gearbox. I’ve had it for 4+ years now, and my brother had it for 4 years before that, and I suppose we’ve both been pretty lucky.It’s definitely pricey to maintain, but it - like you say - has its redeeming qualities. Thanks again for doing this. It was very informative and well-told, as are all your vids.
Jack H Ha! Thanks, man. Yep - that’s right. My brother searched far and wide to get the gearbox, color, and year. I looked into it and found BMW made ~20,000 E60 M5s, and only around 1,350 were manuals.
My advice for potential buyers; look for the obvious 1 owner, low mileage, no accident cars. Beyond the obvious; try to find a 6 speed manual because trust me, you don't want the SMG. When the pumps & clutch goes, it can cost upwards of $4500 depending on where you bring it (hopefully a reputable shop). And it sucks when driving around town or traffic situations. Throttle actuators; there are two (bank 1 &2) which usually start to go around 75K to 85K. When 1 goes, it's wise to do both. They're each around $1200 from the dealer new. They do make rebuild kits now that replace the worn nylon gears inside with stainless steel ones for around $600. Last but not least, rod bearings. If you don't have a good tech to bring your car, you can spend upwards of $8500.
Seriously, what the fuck is the deal with roof racks? It used to just be JDM fuckwits, but now it's everywhere. You've added weight and ruined the aero for what? I've never seen anyone put anything in them.
And it's SO FUCKING HUGE! Seriously, they don't belong on M5's to start off with, but putting one on that looks like it would look to big on a Landcruiser... what the actual fuck?!
I agree with your opinion on the SMG, there is a specific technique you have to use when driving it. It’s way more refined than the SMG 2 though. They are really cool cars if you can find one in decent shape and have the coin for regular maintenance. There’s something about these early to mid 2000s M cars that feel special, none of the mechanical “feelings” are hidden or muffled like the newer ones.
Bought one, spent $15k restoring it, done 50,000 km since. Best car i have ever owned, from 150-250km/h it would take a supercar to keep up. This is a racecar engine and needs to be treated as such. Glorious machine, there are looked after examples with over 400,000 km, its as simple as letting it warm up and changing oil regularly
nah... ive had one for two years. replaced the alternator , battery, (and oil cooler replaced under warranty). i spent about 800 altogether plus a 3 oil changes.
I bought a 2008 m6 e63 in 2017.... things I had to replace: 1) thermostat =$500 2) throttle body actuator = $900 3)fuel filters = $600 4) oil cooler =$800 (my fault cuz it went a little airborne over railway tracks) 5) control arm bushings =$400 Prices are in Canadian dollars. Overall opinion after 3 years: worth it, I live a stressful life and have a stressful job, but every time I get in the m6 and drive from A to B, I’m all smiles for the ride and my stress is gone, the car makes me so happy.
Its the same thing like with the Audi RS6 (C5). On paper they sound awesome, you get a very luxurious, insanely fast german upper class daily autobahn hammer with a 4.2 liter twin-turbo v8 and all wheel drive. But in reality you get a fairly old, outdated car where you have to remove the whole engine and transmission every time you want to do even just the most basic of maintenance. And to be perfectly honest, something like a Mk7 Golf GTI would probably be quicker in most situations.
Remains my favorite car that I’ve owned. Yes it’s an expensive relationship...you can go faster for cheaper, but few would make you smile more....in an F10 M5 now and it doesn’t make me smile nearly as much.
No issues with mine in over 30k miles. Just replaced my bearings at 115k and had zero lines of copper showing, and minimal wear on 5 of them. It’s been a great car, I suggest buying a stock 2008+ and one already having the smg pump replaced like I did.
I think your videos were helpful/inspirational when I was gearing up to buy mine. Curious as to why you didn't just do the Blackstone analysis with your oil changes to keep an eye out for copper/lead bearing material? instead of preventative replacement?
Glad I was happy to help in some way, I appreciate that. I did two oil analysis tests and they both came back clean, but some people were saying that even though they may be clean they could still be worn and then I got paranoid. A lot of people were talking crap about my mileage and being on stock bearings and I was afraid to drive the car hard at that point so I did it just to be safe.
I know two guys who bought these second hand, the one guy kept trying to convince me that its a good buy and all his BMWs were rock solid blah blah. Both guys cars failed within a few months, one the trans failed, the other both the diff and trans failed. Last i recall both cars were both left parked off since neither owner was willing to pay the money to get them running again.
I watched this video when it came out in November of '18. January of '19, I went and bought a 6spd manual 2008 E60 M5, WITH A WARRANTY in Portland, OR. Honestly, your guys' video bolstered me to buy one. Sure these cars are royal pains to live with, but when you're revving that S85 out to 8200RPM, all the throttle/idle actuators, rod bearings, and various other "wear items" become worthwhile. I bought mine at 92,000 (highest mileage one in the US with a warranty and a manual at the time, wanted a high mile one as I was gonna drive it) and as of a few days ago, it's at 110,000. 0 breakdowns, 0 tow trucks, 1 CEL due to increased emissions (bad gas) and over a dozen 500+ mile days of enjoying the car later, I still do not think that there is a better driver's sport sedan this side of $50,000.
I've always liked that M5 and I feel comfortable owning one now. I wouldn't trust it for more than some spirited driving but that's what this car is for. Same as an E92 M3 with that wonderful V8. (:
As a current owner of an E46 M3 and someone who has driver the E60 M on a fairly regular basis... I can tell you that the SMG trans can be a total sweet heart if driven properly!!! Just sayin'...
I agree that be awesome if SavageGeese / Mark would review an ISF but at least have it be FBO to do the car justice like mine if he wants to fly out to Denver😉
it would be a downgrade and then he will talk about how regrets getting rid of the e92 even more and the m5 a little. Maybe he should have walked up the latter and got ISF first.
I saw an ISF on autotrader a few months back with 268k on it that said it had no issues and I don’t doubt it. It’s a way better buy although they’ve held their value very well.
S85 and S65 are the best production engines BMW produced. Can not wait to add an E60 and stroke to 5.5 or 6.0l NA. Removing the primary cats transforms the engine and wakes them right up.
I get it that it's fast, one of a kind, end of a generation, etc, but to tell someone to pay ~$20k to start, then have an additional $10k set aside just for repairs (over what term?) is nuts. Your average Joe who likes performance really shouldn't be buying this. At that cash outlay, you may be better simply leasing a new M550i (which is already encroaching on what this thing cost when it was new). After a year with modest depreciation and all those repairs, you've spent over $10k just to drive a 10 year old car. At least with the newer one you get better the performance with something that will be much more reliable over your ownership term. You'll probably wind up paying LESS money to drive the newer, shinier car. Unless I had F**k you money, I wouldn't even look at something like this. There are so many performance options to be had for much less money that won't bankrupt you.
I will add to this if anybody watches this video. I own a 2006 with an SMG. I've had it for five years. In that time I have only seen the check engine light one time for a throttle actuator. I replaced them both from MPower out of Michigan for $360 each with a lifetime warranty. I also changed the alternator due to its slow failure. it gave me plenty of warning it was failing. The car has never left me stranded. I change engine oil every 3K miles with Bmw oil. I change all fluids every two years. And I mean all fluids.. I have a very good private shop that does all the work for me. It is very reasonable. they also perform an adaptation on the transmission and clutch with each major service. you really do get used to the SMG. When I ride in a car with a DCT it just doesn't have the same soul. I also never exceed 4.5 Krpm until engine oil is up to temp. I know this is long winded but the cars were and are great. They are not a budget car though. Be prepared to spend money wisely on it.
My buddy had one of these and yes, the SMG took a crap. I think the dealership wanted $14K to fix it. He dumped it for an M3 after that. I fully agree with all the points by Goose and Jack. 1. Best as second car 2. Not a track car 3. Better as a manual 4. Have $15K to rain at the shop 5. Be a mechanic.
My cousin bought a 525d wite with the m pack on it. It looked exactly like this, beautiful sedan but my god he had reliability issues with it, everything cost a fortune to repair in this car. I think this looks better than the new gen especially with the m package
I bought a 2008 Monaco Blue E60 M5, and I am the 3rd owner. I know the other two owners, and I realize why I am so lucky. I bought it with 74,000 miles.....the first owner bought it and sent it to BMW whenever it needed anything done and didn't think twice about the cost. The second owner owned it for 6 years and babied it and never spared a penny when it came to repairs. I've put 16,000 miles on it in 2 years and I even drove mine from NY to San Francisco. I've only done the alternator, battery, thermostat, and belts. I plan to do RB's within the next year or so. I can expect the throttle actuators to be done the next year too. I am ok with the investment. It doesn't make financial sense but when I am winding the V10 to redline through the canyons I don't care.
Unreliable v10. But still a v10, still has that legendary sound. When it's properly up and running, it's a badass car BMW needs to throw an NA v10 in one of their new cars and do it right this time
They will not do it. Not in a large public model. Please note that Europe and the rest of the world is going for emission reduction. You, in the US, you can go your fuel for 3 dollars a gallon. Rest of Europe has between 6 and 8$ a gallon.
@@boboutelama5748 With hybrids now being phased into high-performance vehicles, it's a bollocks argument to say that fuel economy/emissions are what's stopping them from making another. What's stopping them is quite simply the fact that no one buys them.
Owned a 2006, best car to drive I have ever owned, sold it because I was spending $1000 per month on fixing something. Surprisingly the SMG and engine never gave me any problems.
God in Heaven, that is one of the best V10 engine notes ever created in a road car! Obviously the Carrera GT and the LFA are at the very top, but for a 4-door sedan its hard to argue that anything else sounds that good...
My dream car has been E39 M5. Ever since I played Need For Speed Hot Pursuit 2 in 2004 I fell in love with this car: looks, engine sound, styling, etc. etc. To me it's THE PERFECT car. So I can relate the sentiment of someone lusting over E60 M5. I finally fulfilled my dream of buying a 2000 E39 M5 last year, but as was suggested in the video it's my weekend car, I have another much more reliable daily driver. What I did before I bought the car is a huge amount of research, and that's what you have to do with a lot of German high performance cars. I searched through forums on what people are complaining about the most, what's the weakest points in the engine, what to watch out for. Luckily E39 M5 came ONLY in manual. I also searched through what's the most requested DIY on the forums. Once I found the car I liked I did a PPI (pre-purchase inspection) on it to make sure there's nothing surprising or alarming underneath. Luckily again I found a very clean 93000 mile example (I already put about 4000 miles this year) that was well-maintained. And as was said before, I calculated what's the biggest repair I could be faced with and set aside approximately 2.5 times that amount before I bought my car. They are great cars, but again if you plan on daily driving them you either need to know how to fix almost everything yourself or you need to have deep pockets. I have neither so as a weekend car it'll do. Worst case if it breaks down I can have some time spent on planning how to address the issues while still being able to drive around in my daily driver. Speaking on addressing issues, finally after a year of driving got a few misfiring codes on start up and a failed purge valve, oh boy here we go haha.
I lucked out and found a manual one for a killer deal after looking for 4 years. I love the thing and would throw money at it if needed. So far I have had to bring it back from despair but nothing too major. My transmission blew and I had to find an E92 M3 transmission to swap into it. I think I am the only person to put an E92 trans into an E60 M but hey it works.
The E60 M5: for the man who wants to spend more money than a w211 e55 to go slower in less comfort while spending a fortune on upkeep and still not have the handling of a true sports car. Seriously though, they do sound amazing and I respect the passion it takes to own one.
itsmillertime1999 I agree entirely but even in this connected age the masses aren’t that smart! I know younger people who appear way more tech savvy than I am and they ask me questions I don’t have answers for. I ask have you googled it? And get stupid looks. They have more money than they know what to do with so don’t think twice about paying less?
I own this car and I totally love it! Its an awesome car! I have the aftermarket support to keep it running. This is what BMW M needs to do with their cars today. Go nuts with their engineering than the run of the mill boring crap they are producing now.
I’ve heard if you can work on it yourself it’s not to bad. I work on all my cars (including my E46). Have you put on better rod bearings or are you using a different viscosity oil? I’ve heard the biggest contributor to the rod bearings are people not letting the car warm up enough for the oil to get in.
One of the last true driver's car with 4 doors. That generation of M5 marks the end of an era for sure. Great review as always. Love the audio and video footage taken of this car.
I own an e63 m6 in manual for 2 years now, it's a second car for me aswell. The sound that this car makes and being able to row the gears myself is just unbeatable to me at this price. Had to recently change a throttle actuator and baterry. There is good aftermarket support for these cars now , so if you stay away from the stealerships it won't cost you an arm and a leg!
That is not a 15 year old iDrive at all. That's a CIC system from a very late E60 which carried over into the F10. The original 15 year old CCC system is absolutely f**king terrible, if you had that, you would not be saying how modern and responsive it is :)
I have had one for 4 years now. When people ask, I simply state the obvious: I bought an engine, but it came with a car. This thing is fantastic. Like you said, as a second summer only car, I simply don't know what else I could get that would make me smile this much. Thanks a lot for the video ! (and knocking on wood, so far mine hasn't cost me a fortune !)
Great comment, I pinned it for others to see.
5 year owner here, absolutely agree. I've been daily driving mine the whole time though and I still feel the same way. It's not nearly as bad as most make it out to be. I for one like the SMG, I think it fits the personality of the car completely. And I've done enough S6 redline shifts (where it feels like the transmission is going to fall out) to know that it can absolutely take the punishment. It's a blast giving someone a ride for the first time and getting their reaction to the full throttle shifts. It's a violent affair, but it's built for it.
I will say though if you drive it in automatic mode you are going to think it's terrible. The auto mode sucks, manual mode and S5 or S6 only for me and it's a pleasure to drive.
@@Camride Oh yeah, I agree, mine's an SMG as well, and it took me about ~2 month to stop hating it. But whoever did the coding for the auto mode at BMW should be fired, the rest of it isn't as bad as it seems at first. I would love to try a manual as well to see how it behaves, unfortunately for me, manuals were nowhere to be seen when I decided to go for it. In Canada they are even rarer than the states.
@@julienlardy5961 I test drove a manual and honestly it just didn't feel right to me. It didn't feel like it fit the car. The SMG feels right, even with its faults. Now if I could take out the SMG hydraulics and put in a clutch pedal... that'd be incredible. Maybe a project for the future when it's no longer my only mode of transportation. :)
@@Camride how would that work? like, using the clutch to get going but not to shift gears?
You have to realize that this is the only time, since the dawn of the universe till the end of time, you'll be able to buy an NA V10 supercar for 15k $. what a time to be alive.
M Napoletano Audi S6?
@@YouArentSlick That too. But that's it.
Vw phaelon
idk where you got supercar from. Super sedan maybe. But its no super car
Good luck rebuilding the bearings of a v10, rebuilding the transmission and all the shit that comes with this lemon
So sad that we won't have anything that ever sounds like this again 😔
Truth
You might
TheStraightPipes we just drove a lambo like 2 weeks ago jakub.
That after market exhaust sounded amazing on that M5. Sad that it has so many mechanical problems, I loved the old M series BMW'S way more than the new ones.
LFA
The engine makes the same sound you’ll make when you get your first repair bill.
Alex lol so true!!
Yup every BMW
😂😂😂😂😂😂
"Whehhhhhhh!"
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Im a BMW mechanic, cant tell you how many of these rolled in the door that someone had just purchased and it already had thousands of dollars in repairs. The Vanos oil line that runs from the pump to the actuators likes to burst and bleed off oil pressure, the throttle actuators in the valley of the motor fail a lot, the oil cooler behind the front bumper leaks for no reason, hell I even had one that hydro locked itself because one bank of injectors were spraying with the engine off. Buyer beware.
And when you tell a lot of people that they just shrug you off as a hater.
Vanos; the Thanos of BMW.
Totally reminds me why my neighbor that had a 550i eventually dumped the car because of small issues that would never stop cropping up especially the VANOS.
Meanwhile my 14 year old GS430 like Straightpipes runs flawless with only major repair I’ve done is timing belt and valve cover gasket.
Whats the corporate philosophy behind manufacturing vehicles that are not reliable?
@@iheartgs400 yes, but you're still ultimately driving a coffin.
I have indeed seen a little old lady driving an e60 m5. I was pulling up to give a thumbs up and she was hunched over the steering wheel. It was adorable.
A wave of irony just crashed over me as I’m sitting here thinking to myself ‘why would anyone buy a car that they know is going to break’ Then my phone rings and it’s the Ford service department telling me that my upper radiator hose isn’t covered by the $3500 B to B warranty I bought and they want $500 to replace it. Perspective...heh...
Yeah dude that's just car ownership in general. You just try to pick the one that's going to give you the least amount of headaches and the biggest amount of smiles.
Yeah maybe car ownership in general if you buy into the cuck lifestyle car manufactures sell you
High key this is actually a super in-depth and accurate review of the e60 m5. Dare I say, the best review on all of TH-cam on this car 🤔😏
Insanely far from accurate. You can tell neither of them know much about M’s nor this car in general as it appears they googled “common e60 m5 issues” and then proceeded to waste our time making a generic review bashing an amazing car.
So many people misunderstand this car. They compare it with a Lexus when it should be compared to a Lambo. It's not intended as a long term practical every day car, although in many cased it has been very successfully used as one. It's a car you get into for an experience, not just to get from A to B.
Same thing for the SMG beating. People judge it by the wrong rules. Driving slowly around town it does feel sluggish, but it also has character and you need to drive it, you are aware of every gear change. NEVER put it in auto mode, the marketing knob who insisted on including that should have been fired. It's a disaster because this isn't an auto gearbox and wasn't intended to be. On a twisty open road the SMG is just bliss. Two hands on the wheel, fast changes and down-changes to make you tingle every time.
The cost of ownership is distorted too. I've heard of people having the entire gearbox replaced because the "SMG failed". Most people don't know that the gearbox itself is a rock solid 7 speed manual designed specifically for this V10 monster, just with some hydraulic bits bolted onto the side of it. The most common failure is electrical solenoids that are cheap if you know how to diagnose them properly. I've literally NEVER heard of an actual gearbox that's failed in any way. Even crazy supercharged modded cars with high mileage run the 7 speed with zero failures related to strength. Still the internet is convinced they are blowing up at every traffic light just because you adjusted the radio volume.
I have an SMG M5 and a manual E46 M3. I've owned about ten other manual road and race cars in my life, and have only ever had one automatic (Audi S4 B6, which I love). The SMG is perfect for the M5 and there is no way I would swap it for a manual. In my mind it would ruin what the car is and was meant to be. This was the vision of the BMW engineers at the time. High revving V10, 7 speed close ratio gearbox, 60 millisecond shift times, perfect downshifts every time. They would have cried when the marketing people insisted that the old manual had to go in it, and for good reason.
If you are a car guy and can afford one of these as a second or third car, find a good one and go for it. Drive it occasionally for pure enjoyment. Keep it properly and it will be better than money in the bank. Will be a seriously collectible car in a few years when most of them have been completely ruined by people that think they are a Lexus or a Civic.
Amen !!! Finally someone who actually knows what he is talking about. It amazes me why anyone lucky enough to get to drive one of these will not take their time to learn to drive it properly. Most car enthusiasts will at least have heard of the quirkiness of a Porsche CGT, a car unfortunately most of us may never get to drive let alone own. Notice how those lucky folks carefully accustom themselves to the unique clutch/gearbox? Frankly, BMW did petrol heads the world over a huge favor when did put this incredible engine into production, in a family car !!! 6 years into a E61 M5 ownership ( Touring ), and each time I drive it is like the same excitement I felt the first time I drove it home from purchase. It has been the most reliable of all the performance cars I have ever owned, and I have had a few. It is no garage queen, I drive it hard like it is meant to. But then, I have taken very good care of it above the maintenance schedule that even BMW/ I-drive recommends. Apart from my few dream cars ( Ferrari GTO, CGT, LFA ), there just isn’t any modern cars out there that appeal to me, and so I will be keeping this icon indefinitely...
@@orlandobello1638 yeeessss!!! I thought I was reading a comment I wrote previously when reading your comment! Im 7 years into an 09 e61 love affair too, Ill be buried in it. Chose to add a Manhart CF airbox and complete Supersprint exhaust to heighten the theatrics in a tasteful manner. 2 x 2 week Euro roadtrips have been a trouble free delight.
Dude, you're living in your own reality if you think the cost of ownership is distorted. They are absolutely expensive to own and operate. This platform is beyond finicky and problematic. Don't make excuses for a dud that was made by a company that can't build something even remotely reliable. I can level with you on the fun/enjoyment factor, but there are plenty of other enjoyable driver focused cars out there that make much better sense than this. These M cars are too often over-hyped. I won't even get into the fact that you think this should be compared to a Lamborghini... smh.
Lambo???? Lmfaooooo...
Kyungri Goes to show you how much you know! Lmao.
The E60 generation has aged absolutely beautifully. All models of this generation look fantastic and fantastically minimalist.
Exactly, that's why i had to buy one of these... not the M5 (i wish) but the 530d M57 engine does the job done.
Cargo carrier.....spare parts
{Motor Mafia} obviously it’s for stocking the necessary condom supply required for the amount of times this guy fucks. I’m sure his lady passengers leak more fluids than the car does when he downshifts.
@@iPhoneAppReviewer this comes from nowhere
I have my M5 now for about a year now. It’s a 2008 6-Speed Manual with only 100k on the odometer with 2 previous owners. I bought this last Nov 2017.
Every time I drove the car. I have a big smile on my face.
I got the rod bearings and replaced all 10 spark plugs and coils. No problems so far.
Now I can enjoy the car without fearing that the engine will seize. I got lucky with this one. Great video my friend.
And how is it today?
GTthreefifty R on junk yard
Update on the vehicle?
Don't do any updates on this car, these people can't afford it. I have one and I spend 5k every year on maintenance and it makes me happy to have this great car and for you McDonalds eaters stop looking at these cars you can't even afford in your dreams.
Chris Big too late, bought one already.
Why'd you put that coffin on top?
Where else is he gonna put the bodies?
spare parts
After that BMW break he have to put it in coffin and Barry it
Tools and parts in case it breaks down on the side of the road.
@@yermailmain206 hey watch till the end to see who's getting moist about it ;)
I've been daily driving my 2008 M5 for 5 years now, bought it with 70k miles and have 130k miles now. Yes there are some common problems (VANOS, throttle actuators, etc) but the car gets a much worse rep than it deserves. The majority of the time if the car was maintained properly and not hooned with cold oil they hold up really well. I'm still on the original rod bearings, I've had each oil change sent to Blackstone and have no increase in metals over the 60k miles I've had it. Mine has never been on a tow truck and never left me stranded. Sure it's had some expensive repairs, but I knew that going in and was prepared for it. The cost to me is totally worth it, I've never owned a car that has put this kind of smile on my face every time I get in it. I never plan on selling mine, I love it too much.
The SMG is also not nearly as terrible as is made out to be in this video. It takes some getting used to, but I can drive the car smoothly without issue. Original clutch lasted to 80k miles, current clutch has 50k miles and is holding up perfectly well. My SMG has had literally zero issues. If they're maintained properly they hold up well (except for the early ones, but that was fixed in late 2006).
I'm looking to buy one early next year, however videos like these really scare me. I am just so in love with the S85 I can't seem to resist. If you could give me any tips when looking for one that would be great.
@@SFBayPhotographer The main thing is to buy from an individual that has good service records if possible. I believe a lot of the rod bearing issues are directly tied to the engines being beat on before they are warmed up. And a lot of that is likely from the original owner. Since most new M5's get leased I think there's a probability that the original owner wasn't an enthusiast as much as they're just looking for the most baller car to impress others. Those people don't understand the importance of warm-ups and they will likely follow the oil change interval that BMW set originally at 15k miles.
Beyond that make sure to get a PPI of the car and if possible get an oil sample and send it to Blackstone Labs, they can measure the metal content in the oil. It's not a gaurantee that the rod bearings are good, but it could give you an indication if they're toast (high lead/tin/copper). Also the later the model the better chance you'll have with over maintenance and things breaking. If you can get an extended warranty, even if just for a year or two, absolutely get it. I bought a 2yr/24k mile warranty on mine for $2900 and it paid out over $6k in repairs (mainly VANOS, throttle actuator and some smaller stuff like a diff leak and thermostat). Since my warranty ended very few things have gone wrong with mine, it's been extremely reliable. It's never left me stranded and it's never been on a tow truck.
My TH-cam channel has my email address under the About page so shoot me an email if you need any more help.
Buy a lotto ticket. You are the luckiest person in the world.
@@maxxweber4336 Not anymore, just got t-boned by a red light runner last night.... :(
@@Camride I appreciate the reply. I will definitely take your advice into consideration. I will also email you if I have any further questions. Also, sorry to hear about the accident. Hope you can find another one!
I cant believe your almost at 200k!! Hard work does not go unnoticed.
19:01 - 9.6 MPG! Well worth it for that noise though
I average 13mpg in mine. I can get up to 19 mpg on the highway. And yes, it's absolutely worth it to me. I love my M5 and will likely keep it forever.
Really surprised the economy wasn't brought up. It's a system shock if you haven't experienced anything like it before. I mean, I drive mostly city and average like 9-10mpg. And the tank is too small for this! Like 200 miles to a tank in mixed driving. And of course that will maybe go up to 12 on long highway drives because of course you want to be low-key cruising at a buck twenty. Premium gas too. Try to think about the smiles per gallon though.
@@ryan94mustang I average 13-14mpg with mixed driving, 19mpg all highway and single digits on track days. I've put about 60k miles in 5 years and I've never once regretted my decision. The smallish tank and less than stellar fuel economy are 100% worth it to me. And I have a wife and 2 young kids! It's an awesome family vehicle.
@@Camride Family vehicle is right. Fits car seats much better than my B5 S4. Might have as much useable space as my wife's '17 X3.
7.8 mpg was the most amusing I got....ran 0w-40 in the winter and could hit 20 mpg on the hi way
It’s an autobahn cruiser not a track toy.
FishFind3000 - hell yeah, bring on a take it up to 280km/h or so and see it purr
even more sad that we germans didnt get the manual
@@GiantPoopingMonkey this is not how it works. Autobahn is not a racetrack even if you americans seem to think it is.
@@kingprone7846 It´s not a racetrack right. There is no problem with driving 280kph on the autobahn. the only limit with this car is by the traffic density.
@@kingprone7846 most Americans would have put mph. Not sure that's an american there buddy
I think it's just me but I think it sounds like a Lexus LFA and I freaking love it!
Sounds like a Lamborghini v10
The LFA wishes it sounded like an S-85 powered M-car!
104thDIVTimberwolf no, the LFA sounds like what M division would like the s85 to sound if they could make a $100k engine.
LFA is quite possibly the best sounding car. Most call it, one of the greatest engine/car combo ever made. F1 V10 at 9500 rpm and 72 degree bank angles (as in F1 racing car). You have to hear it in real life to truly believe how amazing it is. LFA V10 alone cost more than all of the M5 brand new. M5 has a 90 degree bank angle just like all other V10s and revs a lot lower. LFA sounds like a pure F1 racing car while this sounds like a high revving V10 like Lambo, Audi etc
This is the Lexus LFA of sedans. Both are my absolute dream cars. One is dirt cheap, and horrifically unreliable, the other is the exact opposite. Reliable and damn expensive
So sick of people bashing this car! I've owned mine for 4 years now and it is the most reliable car I've ever owned. 40k miles and going strong and I drive it hard! Puts a smile on your face everytime!
bullshit bmw fan boy you will have a huge fucking smile on ur stupid face once u start spending thousands on every fucking repair lol
@@fantomg100 Still $0 spent on repairs fuckface boy and still smilling. 5 years going strong! Own/owned benzes , vettes and others that are far more unreliable
@@Pkpkpk78 look in the mirror bitch worthless piece of shit you and ur gay car loooooollllllllll
I had an e92 that after 6 years of absolute love and affection at the level of "I'm keeping this car until gasoline is illegal", It threw a rod bearing on me without warning, in the middle of a cross country trip 3 states from my home. It will take me the better part of a decade to get back the money I lost to that car, I will never trust bmw with my money again. I also had brand new GS and R nine T motorcycles from them, their dealers are awful, BMW NA is awful, it's sad since I used to be "the beemer guy" but I was betrayed and I'm going by the fool me once mantra. The fact that the E46 blew motors, and every s85 s65 from the launch in 2005 to the end of production in 2013 had these problems is what makes me so bitter. BMW doesn't care, they knew they would last till 50k and after that they couldn't care less, you are on your own, have fun buying a new engine from us for 25k is their attitude. Before that car I had an '08 VR6 Audi TT and I tracked the hell out of it at least once a month for 2 years and not a single thing, down to plastic bodywork rivets ever broke on that car. Cars can be made right, BMW opts out of that idea.
If you can't afford a new one, you definitely can't afford a used one.
Reliability of the v10...Find a Lamborghini v10 with 100,000+ miles, and tell me the amount of money needed to keep that v10 on the road for 100,000+ miles. Let me rewind, at the time, as enthusiast, we clamored for BMW a return (e28 and e34) to a bespoke ///M engine, instead of a modified off-the-shelf engine, which came in the e39. Motorsport gave us an F1 “inspired” engine. Warranty or not, you still need disposable income or FU money or whatever you want to call it. There is a saying in my industry, scared money never makes good money. Scared owners never make good owners. If something breaks, fix it. If you can’t afford it, well this car is not for you.
I have 300,000+ miles of experience owning different generations of m5s. With my e60 6 speed m5, I have 130,000+ miles of DD, road tripping, and tracking experience. My e60 m5 and e28 m5 are not leaving my stable anytime soon. There are only handful of original/second e60 owners still out there. The good e60 examples are hard to find and rarely trade hands, leaving the used market saturated with less-than-stellar examples. Regarding reliability, these cars are only as reliable as the owner’s bank account. Zero catastrophic failures. Replaced RBs @80k & @150k, VANOS @150k, TBs are original. Clutch replaced by previous owner @18K just before I bought it - meaning I have 130k+ on clutch, with trackdays, airstrips, and DDing.
These cars are only as reliable as the owners’ commitment to maintenance and resources.
"Scared owners never make good owners." Perfect!!
I have 130k on my 08 and car has been solid. Replaced TBs at 93k. RBs are original, no knocking oil study came back clean. I don’t track it but I do drove in M mode 90% of the time.
I remember an S6 and S8 using a V10 detuned Lamborghini engine. Were those also massive money pits?
I'm somewhat jealous of you E60 and E28! Your comments are spot on. Issues I had with my E36 325is were a lack of maintenance from previous owners. The engine was a gem when I sold it had 180K miles and still pulled beautifully. With Bilstein shocks it cornered beautifully and stopped well. They are great cars, but with M cars in particular need maintenance like exotic cars. Keep trucking.
God Damn Right!!! Well said!!! I'm keeping mine and I don't give a fuck. I love it!!!
I remember like 10 years ago I was waiting for the bus in NYC. A straight piped e60 M5 pulled hard on the intersection and to this day it is still the best sounding car i had ever heard in my life.
Great video, I reviewed a white E60 last year. In the U.S. the E60 M5 was sold in model years 2006-2010. The manual transmission was available model years 2007-2010. 2006 are SMG only. The manual was only available in the U.S. and Canada. The rest of the world including Germany, the car was only available In SMG. Production numbers in North America were 9,491 cars of which 1,364 cars were built with a manual transmission. As of this writing none are available at CarMax, probably because they don’t want to warranty it and any aftermarket warranty will be extremely expensive. The car I reviewed last year was an SMG and had over 70k miles and still on its second owner, he bought it certified pre-owned from a BMW dealer and it has been highly maintained its entire life and he has had no problems with it. I know another with a 2010 manual, original owner with over 80k miles and no problems. I think the moral of the story is you need a highly maintained car with 10 years of service records. Make mine a manual, it was great car for open roads where you can unleash the V10 to 8,200 rpms. SMG cars are cheap at $15-25k. A manual will run $25k high mileage to $35k and up for lower mileage. Consider an M6 as well if you don’t need a back seat, basically the same car and much rarer in production numbers 3,887 produced during the same time period and only 323 with a manual trans
19:00 Why this car is totally worth it.
It sound so amazing. It has such soul and it feels so alive. It's like it's singing "you'll miss me when I'm gone..."
@@memememine1 its singing GET REAAADYYYYYY $$$$$$$$$$$$$
tmanepic With closed captioning on it simply says "music" during that run and it couldn't be more accurate.
GT500 is far better
I've been waiting for a long, long time for this one. Mr. Goose reviews an E60 M5... I didn't even know it was Christmas.
I miss the Bangle design. He was pushing the envelope for sure, sometimes it failed but sometimes he'd come up with something like this e60 that is completely timeless.
He was a genious, but people will apreciate him even more over time. This e60 is just amazing, nowadays BMW are playing it too safe, they make them for the majority to like them
Looks are obviously completely subjective. The E60's, in general, are still hideous. However, because the M5 E60 has a V-10 lurking under its hood, it does give it more of an internalized beauty (especially with same tasteful aftermarket add-ons). For me, the E39 was the pinnacle M5 because it had an extraordinary engine and looks for its time. On the other hand, the E60 was the pinnacle in engine layout (it upped the E39's engine in massive way). The F10 and F90 are far more beautiful and elegant but they don't have that special feeling because it doesn't have anything really spectacular. Of course, the performance of the F-series M cars are nothing short of visceral monsters. But now that you're having to create synthetic sounds, for the exhaust, BMW has practically neutered the M-5 on Prozac. BMW needs to get Yamaha to design the sounds of the next M-cars.
Then again, what would I know. I would never own a car that breaks all the time.
@@ErwinSchrodinger64 Obviously looks are subjective, but what I meant is that around this time BMW and Chris Bangle weren't afraid to try out something interesting with their design. The F10 looked more contemporary when it came out, but it looks old already. And the Gwhateveritis looked dated half a year after its release IMO. They were both playing it so safe compared to this. Meanwhile its been ~15 years since the E60/61 was designed, and it still has some timeless beauty to it. Again, as subjective as these matters are, I know I'm not alone with my opinion.
I think everything he did was hideous - this particular car is even worse because of that stupidly over-sized roof box that looks like it belongs on a Jeep Cherokee.
Idk, the E60 really doesn't suit my taste, especially the rear.
The SMG has to be tamed. Just lift off the throttle slightly before upshifting in the hardest mode and it’s buttery smooth - the timing is not hard to get.
I totally agree, too many people try to drive this like a automatic
moham1287 This car is pure magic!
it is never butterly smooth for the passengers. for the driver, sure .
This. You have to learn how to drive SMG, theres a certain way it behaves, if anyone has driven SMG and have controlled the throttle/shifts perfectly it's such a unique experience.
@@dankim3950 definitely mastered the smg super quickly. No issues and other than being slow to shift, it was great fun. Wife hated the car so I has to go other end of the spectrum, e63 with air suspension. By far the most comfortable 500hp car I've ever driven.
I'd probably get a Lexus GS F and put a high quality aftermarket exhaust on it. It may not have a screaming V10 like the E60 M5, but its free revving naturally aspirated V8 is also a dying breed.
God bless high performance naturally aspirated engines.
Amen!
Can't get a manual transmission with the Lexus F cars
Idc about reliability....that is my favorite BMW ever. 2010 E60 M5 is the best looking and sounding BMW ever.
You will when it's doing major damage to your bank balance.
I’ve had my 08 M6 three years,new tires, new brakes,replaced ignition coil,no major issues yet..knock on wood..plus my brother is a great mechanic..Love my M6
Prob blown up now 😂
Savage, I know this is a lot of money, but for those who are *REALLY* into the e60, I recommend the CarBahn Autoworks engine rebuild (7k for the kit, 20k for a 5.2 complete rebuild). It solves all of the reliability issues with the engine, and gives you added performance + headroom for more power (if you want it).
aiGeis 20k better spent on another car to use while the E60 is in the shop 🤣
Idk dude. The only really bad thing about the engine its the rod bearings. BMW just drops the oil plate at the bottom and can change it from there. The RM of the place i work at told me it was around 400$ total.
Yeah just looked it up. All you get is new valve springs pistons and rod bearings. No way. Smh. And the 22hp isnt worth the price. Ive never heard of the springs and pistons not being up to snuff always just the rod bearing. Which a company has been contracted to make new bearings to fix the issue since BMW lost the class action. Id rather pay and send my trans to shepp or jacks to get redundancy and tuning done.
@@followthegrow108 That's not all of the components, but whatever since I guess little/no value is given to the tensioner/chains/etc. You're getting 10 custom (CP or Carillo? Forgot which) forged pistons, and custom valve springs as well. Clevite bearings are the world's most durable (I know this isn't shown on the page, but they are the bearing manufacture CarBahn is using). Not too bad for 7k, given the class of car/engine you have to be expecting to pay a lot for low-volume custom components.
Not to mention there are custom rods available, stroker kit, sleeves, etc. Once again, it costs exorbitant amounts of money, but so do mods for expensive cars in general (especially custom engine components man).
So reading between the lines.... Get an IS-F instead. Proven to go over 300k miles with no big issues. Not the same V10 soundtrack, no doubt... But so much easier to live with and that 5 Liter V8 is no slouch!
All the IS-Fs I've found this have been at least $10k more than the M5. As much as I like the IS-F, the M5 is so much cooler to me.
@@person.w9780 The fact that IS-F is more expensive exactly reflects my point. A good example is under $20k. I know because I've been looking. They aren't that expensive. And while the M5 is "cooler" (I agree with you), are you willing to take the pain for that coolness? I'm not. I couldn't enjoy the driving experience knowing there's a ticking time bomb under me. Too much paranoia.
Yeah, I was going to say, you're not going to find an IS F for $15K, mabe if it has 200K miles on it... But yeah, that Lexus V8 is a sweet piece. Might not sound like this v10, but it still sounds mean AF with some headers and pipes!
You ger this car for the sound track. Want a v8 there are "hundreds" of other cars. The lexus is quite low on that list
@@BarnStangz Agreed. In your example, that 200k miles IS-F is still a safer bet than this M5 with only 77k on it and the owner has replaced countless items and it STILL has malfunctions. There's a documented case of a member on the Lexus forum with over 330k miles on his IS-F with no problems, leaks or failures. I value reliability over a money pit. Just depends on what you value more. Get what you like!
Millennial 1A package LOL
First time I've been profiled as a millennial that it's been spot on. How does he know we like huge racks?
So stupid, how about actually take your car to the outdoors instead of projecting that you do with a roof rack.
@@apodski dude my car LIVES outdoors. I hardly ever bring it in the house.
@@apodski millennial hating chump. they'll be here when you're a pile of bones
I have no love for BMWs, but that V10 engine sound... My heart was instantly captured.
You'll never understand the E60 M5 till you own one. You can hate on it as much as you want but till you own one you'll never know. Yeah it costs a packet to maintain and in gas but it's well worth it
hard to kill
I owned one of these for a year and replaced it with a Jaguar XFR (supercharged V8)
I must admit looking back the M5 was a far better performer, I was amazed how that car pulled all the way to 8000rpm,
I’ve never owned anything quite like it.
Amazing motor that every car enthusiast musthave a go in,
Unfortunately my DSC became faulty and with a worry of mounting costs I let her go cheap.
I would’ve kept this car if I could go back in time but never mind, at least I got to experience it’s sheer performance.
Currently in the market for C43.... I need something with a little more MPG nowadays
Great video Mark, hope to see more of these reviews of older generation sporty/sportscars. In UK/Europe, we have a rare Touring model (wagon) which I think is a very appealing prospect to me - a V10 hauler. Unfortunately, the US (as Jack mentions) was the only market to have a manual version so to source a manual transmission from a 545i would be tricky to do a conversion and apart from BMW producing the one-off M5 CSL prototype, I don't know of anyone else who has done a DCT swap from the E9x M3 - but that could be a good alternative too if you can find a salvaged E9x M3. Its unfortunate that most of these owners don't let their M3/M5/M6s warm up after starting the engine because that is (as you say) where most of the rod bearing issues come from. Throttle actuators are a bitch as both of them need to be replaced when one of them fails in a relatively short mileage interval. If you can find an aftermarket exhaust that produces that typical high-pitched/howling sound that a V10 F1 car offers, you're winning in life.
My first thought after hearing it rev was that it sounds like an F1 car and it's incredible
I owned a low mileage 50k miles 2010 m6 3 pedal manual for 7 months,drove the whole pacific coast with it,0 issues after i fixed 2 control arms,always warmed up the oil before i steped on it,sold it for more than i bought it for and i wouldnt buy a manual again
I really, really, really love how insightful and balanced your reviews are. Also, beautiful production value. Thank you so much to you and your team for all your efforts and hard work!
I love this car so much. I had an 06' it put me in a financial debacle when I was a college student. Traded it in for a used Civic Si, and lost a lot of $$. Now I'm back in the hunt for another one fully understanding what this car is and will be owning one (maintenance wise). Hopefully I'll find one soon, can't wait!!
Savagegeese > Doug demuro
David M All day every day
I always skip the "Ddddeeees is the..." 😂
Doug puts about the same level of effort in his videos as a 10 year old, and doesn't know that much about cars either.
Doug DeMuro is cancer
Well duh
I had a 2009 and loved it, hated the Bangel E60 styling but car had soul and was raw. BMW M is going in a different direction now
Nicki minaj reference i wasn't expecting that
I bought an '09 M6 Convertible and love the car, but it is NOT cheap to own. I'm the third owner and have every service record - from both previous owners - going all the way back to its first oil change. Every service was completed by a BMW dealership. It had 54000 miles on the clock when I got it. And I STILL just thousands in repairs. (Throttle actuator... bank 2 was bad, but I replaced them both. New alternator. New battery. A few other odds and ends.) I also have to keep it on a battery tender. That said, it is AMAZING. I rarely turn on the radio because the V10 sounds that good. I love it. Still and all, I say a little prayer before I hit the start button. ;) Great video!
Fantastic review. I’m fortunate (I think) to have one of the 1,364 E60 M5s with a manual trans as my daily driver. A joy to drive for all of the reasons Goose mentions. As a relatively large naturally aspirated car, it has a Jekyll and Hyde quality to it, as it can feel sluggish and heavy at low revs in normal driving mode, then like a wild animal once you open it up in 500S.
As to the much-bemoaned maintenance and repair costs, I think they’re priced in at this point. I purchased this decade-old supercar for $25k and within a few months dropped another $8k or so on a thermostat, rod bearings and other repairs/preventative maintenance. (Some people think the bearing issue is inflated, but some of mine were well into the copper before 60k.) For this level of enjoyment, though, I consider $33k to be money well spent.
But that doesn’t mean I don’t drive in fear for all of the reasons Goose mentions, even with none of the big ticket SMG/bearing problems to worry about. The thing is the automotive version of the sword of Damocles. Love it or leave it.
I bought a manual M6 with the same intention. Sure, I have to spend a bunch of money on preventative maintenance to sleep at night, but then again there's not another manual V10 remotely as attainable as this one. Money well spent in my eyes.
After 4 years do you still own the M5 Brian? If so, that's a long time. Man it's my dream car the V10 M5, so i had to bought the 530d 3.0L im in love with it.
As you said, you used your M5 as a daily drive?
@@Viso2K I sold the E60 after a couple years and bought an F10. The repeated big ticket maintenance issues just wore me down, the last being idle control valves which put the motor into limp mode and required me to take the whole intake off. It would have been $5k+ at Dinan so I did it myself along with updating the throttle body actuators, all for $1500. Even though it was kind of fun, after that the bloom was off the rose for me. There’s seemingly no end to the expensive things that can go wrong with the E60 and I needed something more reliable for a daily. That aligns with everything you hear about these things, but for a while the fun outweighed all of that. The F10 is faster, smoother and more modern, but also less visceral. It has had very few maintenance issues despite what you might hear from savagegeese. Best of luck with the 530d - those diesel engines have their own issues with carbon and everything but imagine they’re less of a ticking time bomb than the mighty V10.
I had 2 M5 E60 V10, first a May 2005 model, then a facelift May 2008 model. Perfect daily driver, some minor electric problems on the 2005 model, no problem at ALL on the facelifted. In total 90000 km on the first M5, and 200000 km on the second. No new clutch, no mechanical problems, no anything wrong. To mention that the second one is not just a facelift, after picking it up from the dealership, i thought i am driving an Audi A8. The difference between my MK1 M5 and MK 2 M5 was big, in the drivetrain and suspension, sound. Longest trips from south italy to north sweden, with snow, ice and -20 C temperatures. No problem. I made all the km with the 400 PS setting, and all other settings on comfort. Only in few cases, push the M (MAN) button on the steering wheel and you will run a crazy horse with 507 PS.... just like in a race car. By the way don't do it on a parking space or close to any obstacle: the car will jump forward if you press the pedal...If you want to get an M5, i would consider the MK2. If you like it raw, then an MK1. Enjoy the last real M5 of history (the new one is for me a kind of boosted 550i).
I'm not a European car guy but man this is a beastly sound car
Eurpeans have a hard time making a good car. Don't be so hard on yourself
the europrans have almost all the performance cars, what seems to be a problem over there is making anything that's not a sporty or track car reliably.
@@profstein-bq2tc the majority of cars in europe are crap. Slow 50 hp crap. The select few can afford decent sports cars.
@@behindthen0thing Before you get into a fight with prof. stein
you two should agree on the europrans vs. eurpeans issue...
I think you've each managed to mangle one cylinder.
@@profstein-bq2tc no its just americans have no idea how to drive and maintain cars
In my opinion, you buy these for two reasons, 1. exhaust note, 2. to be different. I have an e63 M6 (same engine) and absolutely love it. I don't take it out often (4 other cars that I drive over it daily) but when crank it up, smiles all the time. That roof rack is sweet in the video!
The more I watch these videos down the line the more I appreciate my father getting the e60 550i m pack. Looks like an m5 without all the issues in the tranny and rod bearings. Just a fat v8 and an auto. Just doesn’t sound like one but it doesn’t have a factory tuned exhaust so startups have a nice explosive v8 boom. And that v8 rumble at idle
FishFind3000 That V8 had its own issues. Pretty much every engine in the E60 did, though the issues got worse as the cylinder count rose. A shame as that chassis was incredible
True, the most reliable petrol engine in the E60 was the M54 engine. That's because it was the earlier engine from the E39 and E46.
My cousin also has an E60 550i m pack but in a 6 speed. He had to go across the country to get it.
I’ve got one in a 6-speed manual. It’s the only way to buy the car. It’s night and day different.
Reliability isn’t good, but it’s not bad. Car has to fully warm up before you push it whatsoever but once it’s ready to go you gotta drive it like you stole it to keep it healthy.
It’s an amazing car and if you can find a low mileage 2008-2010 example it’s worth getting.
I don't understand the "Roof rack" trend. I assume it's supposed to symbolize "Utility" and hence brake with the sporty character of the car?
Better than a WANG.
"To hold your bike clearly"
tbh i like the idea of having a sporty car (not an m5, there you have space already, but say a 911) and putting a roof rack for extra cargo on when you actually need the extra space. but only "because" is as stupid as ugly camo wraps
Jesus is this really an actual trend? Putting a huge fucking SUV sized roof box on a mid sized sports saloon just for fashion? Fuck humanity.
@@thatebutuoyguy788lmao exactly what i was thinking
I used to have this exact car. Had some fun moments in it, but overall it was a bad experience. I took great care of it but so many things went wrong. My heart would stop when I heard the chime in the dash. You never knew what kind of malfunction it would surprise you with. Engine power reduced, steering wheel lock error (won't unlock), emission control malfunction, transmission yellow cog, transmission red cog, misfire detected, engine malfunction, computer failure, and so many more errors. I finally sold it with only 45K miles on it. When it gets low on gas it makes the same chime sound as when there is a malfunction. Such an incredible sigh of relief to look down and see that it's just the gas getting low...
Thank you for putting this together! As it happens, I own a 2008 M5 with the manual gearbox. I’ve had it for 4+ years now, and my brother had it for 4 years before that, and I suppose we’ve both been pretty lucky.It’s definitely pricey to maintain, but it - like you say - has its redeeming qualities. Thanks again for doing this. It was very informative and well-told, as are all your vids.
Brent Campbell I’m glad you liked the video. You and your brother really do own a unicorn(manual m5). Was your brother the second owner before you?
Jack H Ha! Thanks, man. Yep - that’s right. My brother searched far and wide to get the gearbox, color, and year. I looked into it and found BMW made ~20,000 E60 M5s, and only around 1,350 were manuals.
My advice for potential buyers; look for the obvious 1 owner, low mileage, no accident cars. Beyond the obvious; try to find a 6 speed manual because trust me, you don't want the SMG. When the pumps & clutch goes, it can cost upwards of $4500 depending on where you bring it (hopefully a reputable shop). And it sucks when driving around town or traffic situations. Throttle actuators; there are two (bank 1 &2) which usually start to go around 75K to 85K. When 1 goes, it's wise to do both. They're each around $1200 from the dealer new. They do make rebuild kits now that replace the worn nylon gears inside with stainless steel ones for around $600. Last but not least, rod bearings. If you don't have a good tech to bring your car, you can spend upwards of $8500.
Fucking roof rack.
Yeah you hate roof racks alright.
Seriously, what the fuck is the deal with roof racks? It used to just be JDM fuckwits, but now it's everywhere. You've added weight and ruined the aero for what? I've never seen anyone put anything in them.
And it's SO FUCKING HUGE! Seriously, they don't belong on M5's to start off with, but putting one on that looks like it would look to big on a Landcruiser... what the actual fuck?!
It's like a supermodel with a Maggie Simpson wig.
Is fucking bad ass
I agree with your opinion on the SMG, there is a specific technique you have to use when driving it. It’s way more refined than the SMG 2 though. They are really cool cars if you can find one in decent shape and have the coin for regular maintenance. There’s something about these early to mid 2000s M cars that feel special, none of the mechanical “feelings” are hidden or muffled like the newer ones.
I think I felt some PTSD from seeing these warning codes as a former BMW owner.
Bought one, spent $15k restoring it, done 50,000 km since. Best car i have ever owned, from 150-250km/h it would take a supercar to keep up. This is a racecar engine and needs to be treated as such. Glorious machine, there are looked after examples with over 400,000 km, its as simple as letting it warm up and changing oil regularly
You will ultimately spend more on repairs than what you bought the car for with this generation
Ultimately?
*Annually* sounds more realistic...
To be fair, that applies to almost any German car.
nah... ive had one for two years. replaced the alternator , battery, (and oil cooler replaced under warranty). i spent about 800 altogether plus a 3 oil changes.
@@aygwm To be fair that applies to almost ANY car.
With a lemon yeah. Speaking for the entire lineup just sounds soo ignorant.
I bought a 2008 m6 e63 in 2017.... things I had to replace:
1) thermostat =$500
2) throttle body actuator = $900
3)fuel filters = $600
4) oil cooler =$800 (my fault cuz it went a little airborne over railway tracks)
5) control arm bushings =$400
Prices are in Canadian dollars.
Overall opinion after 3 years: worth it, I live a stressful life and have a stressful job, but every time I get in the m6 and drive from A to B, I’m all smiles for the ride and my stress is gone, the car makes me so happy.
Its the same thing like with the Audi RS6 (C5). On paper they sound awesome, you get a very luxurious, insanely fast german upper class daily autobahn hammer with a 4.2 liter twin-turbo v8 and all wheel drive. But in reality you get a fairly old, outdated car where you have to remove the whole engine and transmission every time you want to do even just the most basic of maintenance. And to be perfectly honest, something like a Mk7 Golf GTI would probably be quicker in most situations.
Remains my favorite car that I’ve owned. Yes it’s an expensive relationship...you can go faster for cheaper, but few would make you smile more....in an F10 M5 now and it doesn’t make me smile nearly as much.
No issues with mine in over 30k miles. Just replaced my bearings at 115k and had zero lines of copper showing, and minimal wear on 5 of them. It’s been a great car, I suggest buying a stock 2008+ and one already having the smg pump replaced like I did.
I think your videos were helpful/inspirational when I was gearing up to buy mine.
Curious as to why you didn't just do the Blackstone analysis with your oil changes to keep an eye out for copper/lead bearing material? instead of preventative replacement?
Glad I was happy to help in some way, I appreciate that. I did two oil analysis tests and they both came back clean, but some people were saying that even though they may be clean they could still be worn and then I got paranoid. A lot of people were talking crap about my mileage and being on stock bearings and I was afraid to drive the car hard at that point so I did it just to be safe.
I owned one for 11 years now. It's worth every penny. LOVE IT💙💙💙💙💙💙💙
I know two guys who bought these second hand, the one guy kept trying to convince me that its a good buy and all his BMWs were rock solid blah blah. Both guys cars failed within a few months, one the trans failed, the other both the diff and trans failed. Last i recall both cars were both left parked off since neither owner was willing to pay the money to get them running again.
I had a 5.0 liter v10 M5 with a modestly priced cat back and it was the best sounding car I ever heard let alone owned. Even getting 9 mpg.
I miss high revving naturally aspirated engines and 5 & 10 cylinder engines. Hardly any of the 3 around anymore
I watched this video when it came out in November of '18. January of '19, I went and bought a 6spd manual 2008 E60 M5, WITH A WARRANTY in Portland, OR. Honestly, your guys' video bolstered me to buy one. Sure these cars are royal pains to live with, but when you're revving that S85 out to 8200RPM, all the throttle/idle actuators, rod bearings, and various other "wear items" become worthwhile.
I bought mine at 92,000 (highest mileage one in the US with a warranty and a manual at the time, wanted a high mile one as I was gonna drive it) and as of a few days ago, it's at 110,000. 0 breakdowns, 0 tow trucks, 1 CEL due to increased emissions (bad gas) and over a dozen 500+ mile days of enjoying the car later, I still do not think that there is a better driver's sport sedan this side of $50,000.
I've always liked that M5 and I feel comfortable owning one now. I wouldn't trust it for more than some spirited driving but that's what this car is for. Same as an E92 M3 with that wonderful V8. (:
As a current owner of an E46 M3 and someone who has driver the E60 M on a fairly regular basis... I can tell you that the SMG trans can be a total sweet heart if driven properly!!! Just sayin'...
LEXUS ISF next on the channel 👍
talking about great sound V10, would be amazing the LFA
I thought about this too ! A milestone and a benchmark in the same.
I agree that be awesome if SavageGeese / Mark would review an ISF but at least have it be FBO to do the car justice like mine if he wants to fly out to Denver😉
it would be a downgrade and then he will talk about how regrets getting rid of the e92 even more and the m5 a little. Maybe he should have walked up the latter and got ISF first.
I saw an ISF on autotrader a few months back with 268k on it that said it had no issues and I don’t doubt it. It’s a way better buy although they’ve held their value very well.
S85 and S65 are the best production engines BMW produced. Can not wait to add an E60 and stroke to 5.5 or 6.0l NA. Removing the primary cats transforms the engine and wakes them right up.
I get it that it's fast, one of a kind, end of a generation, etc, but to tell someone to pay ~$20k to start, then have an additional $10k set aside just for repairs (over what term?) is nuts. Your average Joe who likes performance really shouldn't be buying this. At that cash outlay, you may be better simply leasing a new M550i (which is already encroaching on what this thing cost when it was new). After a year with modest depreciation and all those repairs, you've spent over $10k just to drive a 10 year old car. At least with the newer one you get better the performance with something that will be much more reliable over your ownership term. You'll probably wind up paying LESS money to drive the newer, shinier car.
Unless I had F**k you money, I wouldn't even look at something like this. There are so many performance options to be had for much less money that won't bankrupt you.
TheHvk exactly hell even a 5 Series 550/545/535 are massive money pits once out of warranty.
I will add to this if anybody watches this video. I own a 2006 with an SMG. I've had it for five years. In that time I have only seen the check engine light one time for a throttle actuator. I replaced them both from MPower out of Michigan for $360 each with a lifetime warranty. I also changed the alternator due to its slow failure. it gave me plenty of warning it was failing. The car has never left me stranded. I change engine oil every 3K miles with Bmw oil. I change all fluids every two years. And I mean all fluids.. I have a very good private shop that does all the work for me. It is very reasonable. they also perform an adaptation on the transmission and clutch with each major service. you really do get used to the SMG. When I ride in a car with a DCT it just doesn't have the same soul. I also never exceed 4.5 Krpm until engine oil is up to temp. I know this is long winded but the cars were and are great. They are not a budget car though. Be prepared to spend money wisely on it.
My buddy had one of these and yes, the SMG took a crap. I think the dealership wanted $14K to fix it. He dumped it for an M3 after that.
I fully agree with all the points by Goose and Jack.
1. Best as second car
2. Not a track car
3. Better as a manual
4. Have $15K to rain at the shop
5. Be a mechanic.
*Blinkers are also not included*
*yawn*
only for the hazards when you get into limp mode
The best E60 review on the internet.
Nice review, well gone guys ;-)
My cousin bought a 525d wite with the m pack on it. It looked exactly like this, beautiful sedan but my god he had reliability issues with it, everything cost a fortune to repair in this car. I think this looks better than the new gen especially with the m package
"It's got the classic stuck cup holder on one side" - I felt that..
I bought a 2008 Monaco Blue E60 M5, and I am the 3rd owner. I know the other two owners, and I realize why I am so lucky. I bought it with 74,000 miles.....the first owner bought it and sent it to BMW whenever it needed anything done and didn't think twice about the cost. The second owner owned it for 6 years and babied it and never spared a penny when it came to repairs. I've put 16,000 miles on it in 2 years and I even drove mine from NY to San Francisco. I've only done the alternator, battery, thermostat, and belts. I plan to do RB's within the next year or so. I can expect the throttle actuators to be done the next year too. I am ok with the investment. It doesn't make financial sense but when I am winding the V10 to redline through the canyons I don't care.
Unreliable v10. But still a v10, still has that legendary sound. When it's properly up and running, it's a badass car
BMW needs to throw an NA v10 in one of their new cars and do it right this time
no chance. They lost their chance to build a V10 M1 supercar back when Audi and Merc were rolling out shit like the SLR, R8, SLS...
They will not do it. Not in a large public model. Please note that Europe and the rest of the world is going for emission reduction. You, in the US, you can go your fuel for 3 dollars a gallon. Rest of Europe has between 6 and 8$ a gallon.
MaxSpeed lol wishful thinking
@@boboutelama5748 With hybrids now being phased into high-performance vehicles, it's a bollocks argument to say that fuel economy/emissions are what's stopping them from making another. What's stopping them is quite simply the fact that no one buys them.
Owned a 2006, best car to drive I have ever owned, sold it because I was spending $1000 per month on fixing something. Surprisingly the SMG and engine never gave me any problems.
Exactly I had a bmw not even an M5 I was paying 800 bucks a month on maintenance. Something was always going off.
Still cool but even cooler if it was the manual (which was surprisingly only offered in the US!)
God in Heaven, that is one of the best V10 engine notes ever created in a road car! Obviously the Carrera GT and the LFA are at the very top, but for a 4-door sedan its hard to argue that anything else sounds that good...
12:19 you can see the fuel gage drop lol 😂
@vwsaiphone My 65 Impala does that 🤣
Jay Russell now that’s a fresh car
My dream car has been E39 M5. Ever since I played Need For Speed Hot Pursuit 2 in 2004 I fell in love with this car: looks, engine sound, styling, etc. etc. To me it's THE PERFECT car. So I can relate the sentiment of someone lusting over E60 M5. I finally fulfilled my dream of buying a 2000 E39 M5 last year, but as was suggested in the video it's my weekend car, I have another much more reliable daily driver. What I did before I bought the car is a huge amount of research, and that's what you have to do with a lot of German high performance cars. I searched through forums on what people are complaining about the most, what's the weakest points in the engine, what to watch out for. Luckily E39 M5 came ONLY in manual. I also searched through what's the most requested DIY on the forums. Once I found the car I liked I did a PPI (pre-purchase inspection) on it to make sure there's nothing surprising or alarming underneath. Luckily again I found a very clean 93000 mile example (I already put about 4000 miles this year) that was well-maintained. And as was said before, I calculated what's the biggest repair I could be faced with and set aside approximately 2.5 times that amount before I bought my car. They are great cars, but again if you plan on daily driving them you either need to know how to fix almost everything yourself or you need to have deep pockets. I have neither so as a weekend car it'll do. Worst case if it breaks down I can have some time spent on planning how to address the issues while still being able to drive around in my daily driver. Speaking on addressing issues, finally after a year of driving got a few misfiring codes on start up and a failed purge valve, oh boy here we go haha.
Love this channel. Need you guys to review an E46 M3.
I lucked out and found a manual one for a killer deal after looking for 4 years. I love the thing and would throw money at it if needed. So far I have had to bring it back from despair but nothing too major. My transmission blew and I had to find an E92 M3 transmission to swap into it. I think I am the only person to put an E92 trans into an E60 M but hey it works.
“When you have the car in S6 mode it feels like the transmission is about to fall out of the car” that is because it is about to fall out lmao
The E60 M5: for the man who wants to spend more money than a w211 e55 to go slower in less comfort while spending a fortune on upkeep and still not have the handling of a true sports car. Seriously though, they do sound amazing and I respect the passion it takes to own one.
What's this, the AWACS on road?
Yes, it scans for service shops on your route.
Bwahhahaha
That engine 😍 what a noise. That is something really special
Friend picked up a very rare manual 6 series M V10 for $22k, nice car but he has Vanos issues new part $6500
that INSTANTLY makes it a waste of money Lol
@itsmillertime1999 for real people are paying all that money when in reality you can find it cheaper online lol 6500 for vanos that's insane
itsmillertime1999
I agree entirely but even in this connected age the masses aren’t that smart!
I know younger people who appear way more tech savvy than I am and they ask me questions I don’t have answers for. I ask have you googled it? And get stupid looks.
They have more money than they know what to do with so don’t think twice about paying less?
I own this car and I totally love it! Its an awesome car! I have the aftermarket support to keep it running. This is what BMW M needs to do with their cars today. Go nuts with their engineering than the run of the mill boring crap they are producing now.
I’ve heard if you can work on it yourself it’s not to bad. I work on all my cars (including my E46).
Have you put on better rod bearings or are you using a different viscosity oil? I’ve heard the biggest contributor to the rod bearings are people not letting the car warm up enough for the oil to get in.
Dr Goose and Mr Singapore are a match made in heaven!
One of the last true driver's car with 4 doors. That generation of M5 marks the end of an era for sure.
Great review as always. Love the audio and video footage taken of this car.
4 door driver's car still exists mate.
Needs eisemann race exhaust.
Nah, gotta go with klasenpunkt setup.
Eisemann race exhaust doesn’t sound any better than the setup that’s already on it.
Gray Arctic Fox come again
@@TranceFur yes they do they have a high pitched sound to them
Eisemman or akrapovic
I own an e63 m6 in manual for 2 years now, it's a second car for me aswell. The sound that this car makes and being able to row the gears myself is just unbeatable to me at this price. Had to recently change a throttle actuator and baterry. There is good aftermarket support for these cars now , so if you stay away from the stealerships it won't cost you an arm and a leg!
Danny Boudreau at what miles did u change yr throttle ?
Giray Kharizzma At around 116 K Km , so around 72k miles
That is not a 15 year old iDrive at all. That's a CIC system from a very late E60 which carried over into the F10. The original 15 year old CCC system is absolutely f**king terrible, if you had that, you would not be saying how modern and responsive it is :)