Tom, As a former DPE and FAA Inspector (now retired), let me say that the conduct of the Examiner was abominable. To say that her actions were “unprofessional” is a gross understatement. It appears she didn’t even follow the ACS or have a plan of action for the check ride. Many of her questions seemed inappropriate for an Instrument practical test. The St. Augustine vs. Augusta situation was laughable. The reason she didn’t want you to mention her name to the local FSDo is because THEY KNOW she is a problem. She’s most likely had complaints before by other applicants. I strongly urge you to contact the FSDO Operations Supervisor or the FSDO who has oversight of the DPE’s and recount your story either in writing or in person. If the office has any integrity, they will take action to either surveil this DPE while administering checks or take steps to get rid of her (yes, it’s tough, but it can be done. While being the overseeing inspector of the DPE’s at LAX FSDO, I got rid of two substandard examiners.). In interacting with the FSDO, have your facts together, tell the truth, and be confident in knowing that what you’re doing is the right thing. We can’t have these types of DPE’s out there. Oh, I think that as soon she heard of your contacting the FSDO and mentioning her name, failing you was her intent. She stole your $900. Tom, don’t let this stand. Tell the FAA what happened.
is there a way to get this fraudulent failure removed from record? i personally wouldn’t give up until either the faa removed the failure or they threw me in jail for nagging too much😂
Tom, as someone who has been a military flight instructor and evaluator (and now flies for fun), the FSDO absolutely needs to be informed of this DPE. Her mindset, as you described her, is the complete wrong fit for the task before her. And yes, how many other people is she essentially taking money from and never letting them get to the flight phase? Something is incredibly wrong here!
@FullSendPrecision my thoughts, too. But like anything in life, if you're not documenting it, it didn't happen. And contacting the FSDO may just be adding to their documentation for revocation of her DPE status.
Theres something terribly wrong with this DPE mentally, I think she's not only unprofessional but a danger to aviation in all aspects considering her pos ition with the FAA. I hope you truly consider reporting her to your FSDO or higher. It's frightening to think she's not only a DPE but a pilot to boot. FAA needs to evaluate this person asap. Like you said , how many other people has she failed for no justifiable reason. I live in SC and am currently a student pilot working towards my PPL. I hope she's dealt with before my check ride !! Lol....thanks Tom, love your channel, sorry this happened to a stand up guy like yourself.
Also people with this mentality often will pass people they click with when they are not qualified. That is my biggest concern. Hopefully the FAA is notified about this person. I am certain she already has had FAA action taken against her, hence why she was upset about her name being mentioned to the FAA
Joey Roger's in Florence and Timothy Mitchell in Lexington are both amazing DPEs. You'll absolutely need to know your stuff but they'll give you a good and fair ride at fair prices
She was upset by you before you guys even started, and was like "all right I'm just gunna take this kids money and fail him". Knowing she was already determined to do just that, she stretched the time out with you, taking breaks, talking to other people, and throwing you curve balls, until she decided it was time to give you the bad news she pre-determined was gunna happen as soon as she took your money. What a damn shame. I'm glad you were able to finish your ride with a different DPE.
Tom, I really enjoy your honesty and your videos. I have been a pilot for over fifty years and a large airplane check airman for thirty or so years. The world is filled with all manner of pilots, and DPEs. Some good and some really poor. Some gracious, and some vindictive. I remember a piece of advice given me as a new DC First Officer after I had botched an arrival into Dubai. I made the go around did the landing, and we were on the taxi in. The Captain turns and asks me if I learned anything, to which I replied YES!!!! He replied…good. Next he gave me a good piece of advice. The most important landing you’re ever going to do is the next one. The last approach, the last landing is already in the bag, so learn from it then forget about it. But the most important advice Capt Bernie Williams, World Airways, gave me was this; if you think something is wrong, it probably is. If that is the case, don’t hesitate, do something about it sooner rather than later. Good flying, you will do well.
You absolutely need to notify the FSDO about this. This is a major problem in our society today. No one has the courage to stand up and do the right thing because they’re too afraid of the backlash. Of course you are not the only one having this experience. This needs to be stopped.
Best comment Frank...about standing up for yourself! I let people push me around all my life instead of fighting back. Memphis, TN. 1979. Two FAA inspectors find me $12,000 for having my worthless Cessna 404 2 hours overdue for overhaul on one motor. I had two money-making runs for Emery Air Freight & night charters for Federal Express. I closed the doors instead of fighting it lower. Stupid decision!
I have been a Comm/Inst/Multi pilot & worked for FAA for 30 years. Your experience is absolutely abhorrent. It is not you that needed to have a stain on record, but she needed to be disciplined or sanctioned by the FAA. Check rides are very stressful. Professionalism, continuity, & an examiner that is looking for fundamental Instrument skills is critical. I still remember my Inst check ride. Totally stressed out in a hot summer cockpit. I passed , but thought otherwise after a multitude of IFR scenarios. At the end my examiner said something I never forget. “Son….this is your license to learn. Just don’t kill your self doing it.” For the sake of all her potential “failed” pilots….PLEASE REPORT HER‼️
I had this DPE for a check ride last December. I had a very similar experience like you did. Threw off my program by more than six months and I just passed my check ride do- over today. You should report her ASAP.
Tom, did you report this DPE??? This is ridiculous, and I hope she never does this to any other pilot. Congratulations on passing your instrument rating.... thanks for sharing your story
Wow, that sounds like a horrendous experience, more emotionally than physically. Well done for passing, I know from your posts that you have put your heart, soul and passion into your flying.
You handled yourself very professionally and you did everyone watching this a great service by showing them the importance of vetting your DPE and not to rushing your training. I could see myself doing the same thing had I not watched your video. I had no Idea there were DPE’s out there like this woman.
This story is terrifying! I remember my interment check ride and I was already a nervious wreck. I can't imagine having to deal with this on top of that. Please contact the FSDO about this. Your probably not the first and will only be helping rid the sky's of this crap! Like you mentioned about your FSDO they are there to help and I found that with mine as well. Some of the most understanding and professional FAA employees I've ever met. Congrats by the way of overcoming this and passing!
I'm glad I had the myth that by default "they want you to pass" smashed into a million pieces by a certain DPE. Tough but valuable lesson to learn. They are people that are financially incentivized to fail you due to their little re-test fees.
A couple other takeaways from this - 1) Read the Advisory Circulars. Not saying that a deep dive into BasicMed is common (or fair) on instrument rides, but anyone considering pursuing aviation as a career, including becoming a CFI, will be doing themselves a favor by briefing (or reading) the ACs. What's not in the regs is often in the ACs. You don't want to be reading hundreds of pages of ACs the week before your CFI ride, so at least be aware of the ones that are there. They're out there for weather, wake turbulence, taxiing/runway incursions, etc. I have a binder where every time I find a relevant one, I print out the AC and put it in, and having that on hand during checkrides has served me well. You're not expected to memorize every AC, but telling a DPE (or at least a normal one) "oh, there's an advisory circular about that, I forget the number off the top of my head but here it is." Anyone going for commercial or CFI should be well-versed in at least what the topics are, and CFI should have read over them. 2) I know it's a huge bummer, but a failed checkride isn't the black stain on the aviation career everyone seems to think it is. Not trying to minimize the disappointment anyone feels, but everyone has a bad day, even DPEs. And everyone knows checkrides are stress inducing and don't bring out the best in pilots. So for anyone reading this that maybe has failed a ride, don't let it derail your ambition. Keep your head up and get back at it. You'll pass. 3) The FSDO is your friend. Always, always reach out to them if you have any questions. Tom totally did the right thing here. They are honestly pretty happy that pilots are reaching out to them for clarification and not trying to figure it out either in the air, or during a checkride when they'll have to go back and do a bunch of paperwork to revoke a rating or something like that. Especially in the world from instrument to commercial where people often try and "double dip" - i.e., use complex training to build cross country time, etc...not every DPE looks at the regs the same way. When in doubt, call the FSDO. And if you can get some documentation saying you talked to them, and they approved an XC, a lot of DPEs will appreciate the fact that they have a different opinion, but you tried. And if they're a GOOD DPE, they have a relationship with the FSDO and will reach out themselves for clarification and go from there. 4) TRSAs are stupid.
The FAA is NOT your friend. They are a government agency that will burn you to the ground in a heartbeat. As a taxpayer and airspace user, the faa is your employee essentially. The fsdo is a resource no more no less.
To possibly save future pilots from going through what you did, I’d consider making a phone call. She may already be on the FAA’s radar. Sounds to me like she failed you but was more than happy to give you a second chance for some extra cash of course.
She most certainly is on the FAA's radar in my opinion. This is why she freaked out when he mentioned her to the FAA when he asked for clarification on the 3 different qualifying landing rule change .
I won’t pile on to everyone else’s “report her to FSDO” comments (even though I completely agree), but the statement at 21:56: “You’re supposed to encounter people like this, and you’re supposed to overcome it”…that’s a life-lesson right there man. Keep your head where it’s at; you’re gonna have a great career.
This needs to go to the FSDO to be reviewed. There is no hiding or flying under the radar in this business; FAA knows who you are, ESPECIALLY if you’re their DPE. You’re doing a real disservice if you don’t take her head-on.
My PPL checkride was $1000 + $700. 4 hour oral on day 1 and by the time they wanted to fly (after a 1hr lunch) the weather shifted. I didn’t know DPEs charged so much to reschedule lol. Definitely going to do more research on my DPE for the instrument check and be more specific about who I’m paying. I’m not looking for an easy check ride just want it to make sense financially and objectively. Thanks for sharing
You’re a good man. Sorry about the check-ride but being so concerned about what it cost you and what you could’ve given your family is the best part of the video. I’m glad I watched it. I never had a family of my own but my father was the same way and I’m so grateful for him. I’m glad I realized how much he gave his family before he passed away. He was an airline pilot for Northwest Airlines when he retired. I hope your family watched the video but I’m sure they know. Thanks for sharing. It made my day. Godspeed
I’m from Charleston as well, I know who you are talking about. You’re not the only one that experienced this, unfortunately. I luckily canceled my checkride with said person because of weather then heard what people had to say so I went with someone else
Thank you for sharing this story. We all have stories, good and bad. It's an essential part of our aviation education and safety. I got the instrument rating 10 years ago and my DPE was very tough but fair. He slaughtered me on weather knowledge, then in the flight phase after I got everything set up for the first approach (an ILS) he distracted me with irrelevant conversation, stirred up all the radios and caught me on failing to restore one frequency. However, he kindly advised me to practice some very specific things and agreed to retest only the flying in one week for 200 and that went well. The most embarrassing part of that fail day was arriving home to see paper airplanes everywhere and walking in to a surprise "congratulations" party that my wife set up with ~30+ neighbors and friends. Yes, trying to rattle and distract you are standard, but this DPE as you describe her went too far and displayed poor knowledge and judgement. You absolutely should give her a review with the FSDO.
I almost had her as my DPE two weeks ago. There was an accident that happened on her watch and my ride was canceled along with y’all my classmates at my flight school. I was pissed, but looking back… it’s a blessing in disguise. Thank GOD
@@Tommyflies I’m in Dallas. Apparently she was on a commercial checkride and they landed short of the runway in the grass at one of the airports on the east side of the Bravo not sure which one. But we lost one of our planes unfortunately. Another DPE told me they sent her away and that she’s not a DPE anymore. I heard she was nice to my classmate and my classmate had nothing but good to say about her, maybe she likes my flight school because she was a regular DPE. I was told not to refuse any food she offers either. There are certainly people that liked her at my school and she seemed like a nice person every time I saw her. Very quirky for sure. I even got her McDonald’s because I really wanted to be on her good side… but she never showed up.
You mentioned she stepped away to call the fsdo. Do you think she possibly failed you on purpose because she realized she didn't have her credentials up to date in order to sign off on your check ride? Her behavior sounds strange and that she was trying to fail you on purpose while still collecting money for her time. She sounds like a scam artist and maybe she's been in trouble before.
I had a similar experience with my instrument checkride, but not as bad. DPE was condescending from the very beginning and immediately put me on edge. Kept referring to me sarcastically as “captain” and was doing his best to not just stump me, but make me feel stupid and anxious too. Oral portion was going good, I had some gaps for sure but overall I felt I was doing good. Near the end of the oral, we pulled out an instrument approach plate and went over it, I knew all of it and described it to him. He then asked, “What’s a TAA?” And I said, “Honestly, I’m not familiar with what that is.” We had just gone over an approach plate, by the way, and I explained all of it to his satisfaction, including what learned later was a TAA. For those who don’t know, a TAA is very similar to an MSA on an approach plate, and is easily interpreted the same way as an MSA is. I explained what it meant on the plate he showed me, without telling him what it was called. So then when he asked me what a TAA was, and I didn’t know it, he made a very big deal of it. “I can’t believe you don’t know what a TAA is, that’s a crucial piece of information, this is a serious gap in your knowledge,” and similar statements. I’m feeling like shit at this point. And he knew I knew what it looked like on the plate, and what it meant, because I had just described it to him! I just didn’t know the name! Finally he goes, “Well, I have to tell you…” and I think, “oh shit, checkride is over before we get to the plane.” Then he says, “You’ve barely got the knowledge I consider a minimum. So we’re going to go fly, but you’re really at a C- grade knowledge wise, it’s really barely” and I was at that point so on edge that I almost just wanted it to be over because I was sick to my stomach about getting into the plane with this guy. We go out to the plane, quick preflight, hop in. I managed to get my stress under control at this point. We’re taxiing out, and he sees that my GPS map is in north up, not heading up. (We’re in a G1000 equipped plane for this.) He goes, “You really need to have your map in heading up for approaches. North up is going to confuse you and cost you situational awareness.” I’m thinking, “ok that’s kind of weird,” neither of my previous instructors had said anything about north up being an issue, and anyway, every approach plate is north up when you look at it, so what does it matter? If you can’t read a map north up, what business do you have flying! So while I’m thinking this, he goes to change it to north up mode! And I stop him and said, “I understand what you’re getting at, but it’s my aircraft and this is what I’ve trained with and am used to, so I’d prefer to leave it north up.” He tuts a little but lets it go. We take off, and the checkride goes very well up until partial panel. I nailed both of my previous approaches, and I think at this point he was looking for a way to fail me because he was unhappy with my oral. He starts covering my panel up, and as soon as he’s done, I go to put the panel in revisionary mode like I had practiced and trained with. He goes, “don’t touch that damn button. You’re not allowed to use it.” So I shit myself a little bit, but I had done partial panel stuff without using the revisionary mode before, but I knew it was a weaker point for me. I manage to get set up on an ILS, flew the approach, and ended up passing the checkride. But man it was stressful. I talked to my instructor and a few other pilots after the checkride, and none of them knew what a TAA was right off the top of their head either, despite thousands of hours of experience. But I showed them each a plate that had it, and they were all able to interpret it. Not sure why the DPE was so fixated on being able to name it on a plate. Who cares what it’s called as long as you can interpret it safely and correctly on the plate?
I was one of the pilots that had my certificate pulled after several years of flying because my DPE came under suspicion. I was upset with the FAA. I tried to fight them from taking my certificate. In the end, they told me that I had done nothing wrong, but that to them, it was unsafe for me to keep flying without another checkride. The checkride had to be with the FAA, not another DPE. I had just sold my plane and walked away from flying for a good number of years. I am now preparing for my IFR ( They did stipulate that I could use any DPE for IFR, but not VFR). It is clear to me today that they were right. I was not a safe pilot even though I had 400 takeoff and landings. The old saying that you don’t know what you don’t know could not have been truer. I am writing this because if the DPE isn’t fit for the job, the FAA had to know. You need to tell them your experience and let them investigate.
This, unfortunately happens a lot. I had "retrained" qualified pilots to retake checkrides they had completed years ago. They have been flying hundreds of hours safely and with zero infractions, until the FAA finds one bad DPE. They should handle this very differently than they do, it is not the pilots fault, but the DPE in question. The FAA takes the stance that if one person craps themselves, everyone has to wear diapers.
I really hope you recorded the check ride. Let the FAA know sooner than later! And maybe there is a way to get that removed from your record, especially if she had or has a history of this.
Hey Tom, I want to sincerely thank you for sharing your story. Throughout my flight training at the university aviation flight program, as well as my experience flying in the Civil Air Patrol. I have never encountered anything like what you described with the DPE or check ride examiner. I agree with the comments that describe this as an anomaly, and I hope you reported this incident to the local FAA FSDO. What she did was appalling, and I personally know a few DPEs who conduct check rides based on the specific rating the applicant is seeking. For example, if it's a private pilot check ride, they focus solely on private pilot questions. This DPE's behavior goes beyond what is acceptable, and I believe she should not have the privilege of being a DPE based on your experience alone. If you haven't already, I strongly encourage you to report her to the local FSDO. It seems from your post that she might have been under their radar already due to your earlier contact. I understand that DPEs are humans and might not remember all the regulations, but there's nothing wrong with seeking clarification from the FSDO when needed. However, her response to you was completely unacceptable. Considering the severity of the situation, it might be wise to consult with an aviation lawyer or someone experienced in handling defamation cases, just in case she decides to take legal action against you. Your and your family's protection is important, and having professional legal advice can be crucial if things escalate. In conclusion, I love your videos, Tom, and I hope you keep up the good work. Your courage in speaking out about this incident is commendable, and I hope it leads to a positive change in the system.
I flew an extra hour and a half to avoid a DPE that I had heard a little too much about locally. Couldn't have been happier with my choice and ended up doing my instrument check-ride with him too. Just a regular guy, no arrogance and no BS. You're 100% right, it pays to vet your DPE.
@@kimskislalom I spoke to many of the more advanced students I knew and met. Other instructors are a great resource too, particularly the ones that work with lots of students. In the end, it's a bit of an educated guess, but get as much info ahead of time as you can. Good luck!
Sorry for your experience but a good lesson to learn that it is YOUR checkride and you can discontinue or cancel if it’s not going well, if the DPE is being strange, your tired, etc.
TELL the FAA!!! This is the kind of crap we shouldn't have to put up with from DPE. Sadly yours is not an isolated incident. Many DPE's have issues that they have no problem taking out on people to whom they owe honor.
Please notify your FSDO about your experience. Allow them to investigate because like you say in your video, if this is how she handles all of her checkrides, imagine how many other pilots perhaps she has failed and perhaps those new aviators never get back into aviation again. Great job sticking with it!
This is absolutely not any sort of "stain" on your aviation career... this was a learning experience that you will never forget,. However, it will soon be insignificant.
This quite the horror story. I am planning on getting my PPL this October and eventually IFR but man that story, feel bad for ya bud. I a glad you got it in the end. Good job and keep up the hard work!
Hey Tom - I had a similar experience on one of mine. Thankfully, I was able to push through, though the debrief was awkward. I’d suggest reaching out to the FSDO. Aviation is in a bit of a spot with a shortage of many things, not the least of which are DPEs. All the same, the risk is potentially higher if we have this sort of thing going on unchecked. Aviation is small, indeed, but in cases like these, there are probably a few people out there to have your back. Appreciate you sharing your experience. Completely unreasonable in my opinion.
We have a shortage of GOOD DPEs. FSDOs are hesitant to qualify more because they don't want to have more than they can manage. Shit canning a DPE like this would make way for another fair DPE.
Wish I could have shared this with my daughter. Hers is today and she had a rough go with the company already. I’ll share this after her checkered this morning. Following your channel now
Oh man, I feel for you after hearing this. I can't believe that! I had a bad experience with my instrument check ride too, but I did pass thankfully. I almost wanted to do it again just to feel better about it.
Im 10 minutes into this and Im thinking its time to call the FSDO back and let them know how this went. Totally unacceptable. Turn her ass in. In fact let the world know who this person is so others don't have to go through the same thing. Im totally pissed for you.
@10:00 If anyone talked to me like I was 10 years old I don't think I'd have them in my airplane. I might for sure trust them to be PIC and fly me somewhere. But if I'm PIC and they talk to me like I'm a child then why the hell would they want to be in my airplane?! Hmm.. ripping people off might be one reason she's trying to stay off of the FAA's radar. @18:00 Wow She's actively promoting herself and focusing on networking her business instead of focusing on her customer. And she tried to gaslight you?!?! Whiskey Tango Foxtrot!? @22:00 Wow. Talk about level headedness. Awesome attitude. I'd sure love to fly with you man! But I'd bet you're absolutely right she's doing this to other people.
I hope that after you calmed down that you did call in your experience. I had to leave school because I didn’t have the money to continue IFR and was paired with a non teaching instructor. I did have a great PPL DPE though. But the school was just taking my money I didn’t have. I feel it’s my obligation to help other not fall into that same trap. Congrats on you second check! So awesome! Thanks for sharing your experience as well. Sorry for your lousy experience and airway robbery. Take care and fly safe!
My examiner for my PPL charged me $100 less than the $900. The biggest difference here is that she took the effort to fail you, rather mine did everything possible to make me pass while making a sort of flight lesson out of it. Now I'm off to instrument training and this encouraged me to stick with the same dpe (He's awesome anyways). Also quick note. It seems like she just scammed you out of that $900 before you even took a step into the checkride judging how she was even annoyed to interact with you during the phone calls. The networking she was doing with that CFI DURING the checkride is also a clear give away as she sells herself off while showing to the student she doesn't value the checkride taking place. No doubt in my mind she fails students simply to grab that extra cash to afford luxury trips to st.augustine. AND to top it off with telling everyone you failed? She's simply narcissistic. In all honesty I would be dumbfounded and end up with that failing mark if in the same situation.
I still don't understand why he failed the oral portion of his check ride. He said he was glazed over and wasn't listening at that point. The DPE would've had to note something other than called FSDO for clarification.
As someone who is preparing for my instrument check ride, I would hate to have an experience like this from my DPE. We spend so much time, money, and energy to make this a reality in our lives. Her behavior, if actually as described, is highly unprofessional and needs to be reported to the FAA. Makes me wonder how many other pilots she’s scammed, failed, or otherwise mentally compromised prior to a check ride. Please don’t let this go.
My first DPE was verbally abusing me the entire time we were in the oral, I botched a few questions and he took it upon himself to insult me by stating "do you have kids? Even they would know the answer to that question"... after that he just went full psychotic in his mental abuse of me that it threw off the entire exam for me. I passed the oral but should have just stopped before the checkride and called it a day. It carried over to the plane and even while we were doing maneuvers his comments were degrading and throwing me off my game. He was yelling at me over the mic, I was trying to navigate a busy airspace and he kept interjecting insults and side comments that had nothing to do with the exam but towards me personally. On a short field landing attempt I was frazzled by his reactions and hit the pavement hard, plane was fine but at that point he gave me the thumbs down and the checkride was over. He gave me the option to continue or go back and without hesitation I said go back and didn't say a word to him on the return trip. Got to the debrief and I gave him the silent treatment. Instructor asked me what happened afterwards and I spilled the beans on the experience and safe to say the instructor was taken back at what I experienced. Fast forward to six weeks later and I had a new checkride scheduled with a different DPE, no issues, most accommodating individual i've met from an examiner experience and passed without issue. Had just a few areas to improve upon. Night and day experience. Some people should just not be in a position of authority.
She failed you so she could collect another $450 from you. She should absolutely be reported. I’m also guessing, she’s had prior complaints and that’s why she freaked out you mentioned her name.
Probably the most unprofessional DPE I’ve ever heard of. The fact she’s even still a DPE is beyond me. She’s obviously got something to hide and she needs to be investigated
Here’s another vote for ABSOLUTELY notifying the FAA /FSDO. I train on a shoestring and a DPE like this could throw my program way off… One check ride is expensive and stressful enough… I don’t know if I could afford to fail two and with one opportunity wasted needlessly, I would probably feel the need to train relentlessly before I attempted the second one. She can go check groceries… Aviation doesn’t need people like her.
Sorry you had to go through that. I failed my first instrument checkride due to a misunderstanding. Everything seemed to go well until doing the final NDB approach into my home runway. But the DPE said, "OK....take the hood off. Can you make it straight in from here?" I was used to steep slips and rapid descents in the Super Decathalon, so I said, "Sure." and started down. He grabbed the yoke and pulled us up to begin a circling to land. He failed me for "poor judgement." on the NDB approach whereas I thought he was challenging me to end a good checkride with a steep slip to landing. I told him that, but it didn't matter. That was 1979. I am currently preparing for my IPC to get back to KOSH again.
@@JustinHuff_EOinDixie We're talking 1979. Everything was cheap by today's standards. I think I paid $75 for th DPE. I recall the Piper Archer was $28/hr. I started flying in 1973 paying $12/hour for a Cessna 150 and $3/hour for the instructor. Yes! $15/hr dual. I was earning $1.75/hr back then. It's all relative.
Thanks for posting this video. I'm honestly shocked the DPE in question would ever take the position that she didn't want to be "on the radar" of the FSDO. That's really odd. Every DPE takes checkrides with local inspectors to maintain their examining authority. In my past, I've always seen my local DPEs have a cordial relationship with the FSDO and their inspectors. It's just one of those things; you can't be a DPE and be anonymous to your FSDO at the same time. I think it would behoove you to write a letter to the FSDO and follow up on this experience. As someone who has been in the game for over 20 years, it is painful to watch fellow professional pilots mistreat folks who are just getting started in aviation.
Absolutely bring this up to the FAA so it doesn't happen to someone else. i know of plenty of classmates of mine that scrape pennies out of couches just to take their checkrides, and if this sort of thing happened to one of them it would be robbery at that point. doesnt matter if it happened yesterday or three months ago, the FSDO should be notified of any unsatisfactory performance by the DPE.
Very sorry that happened. You really should have talked to FAA about this case, and I think you were the victim of fraud. Thanks for sharing this with us.
Where was your CFII in this process? At my school we do background checks and interview new DPEs before allowing them to do a checkride with one of our students. Most DPEs I know are great pilots, professionals and want the checkride to be an awesome experience for the candidate. There are DPEs not so, as you may have encountered. I say "may", because this lady may have mental health issues. She seemed to be functioning from a skewed reality or at least struggling with remembering and sequencing events. I wasn't there, but something wrong. You really owe it to the aviation community to discuss this with the FSDO. This could be a safety issue that needs attention. It's not about hurting somebody, but putting safety first and doing it from the right attitude, which you seem to have.
The calming music and peanuts made me think of Nurse Ratched. At first I was like, "You know, yes, if you're flying to Augusta which is a TRSA you should have known it right off the bat everything about it even as an IFR just because you never know if you wanted to divert and go VFR for that diversion or whatever." But then as soon as she thought you were going to St. Augustine which ISN'T a TRSA, what you had told her should've sufficed. You knew TRSAs exist. The big keyword you made was it was voluntary to call ATC. You don't even need a transponder if you're not contacting the controller. But I had to laugh at how twice in your experience she complained that someone was taking up all her time when she was conducting the conversation. Both with you when she called you on the phone and with the guy who walked in for some water. She's a nut. It's quite evident why she wants to go under the FAA's radar.
Glad to hear you passed it after all! It's a very hard rating to get, but it makes flying so much easier and powerful once you have it. I struggled a lot when I learned to fly IFR manually, and I hated it. Now I fly XC IFR (on AP) all the time regardless of WX, and I love it :)
Unpopular Opinion: Anyone who took a checkride with her knows exactly who this is. In her defense, she followed the ACS line by line and was extremely professional with some of the personality you described.The ride I took with her was more than fair. She was extremely detailed and expected you to know the material. Most people are use to taking cakewalk rides. She's by the book. Just as fair in the plane. The items you missed are in the ACS AOI 1.Task C. Airspace is something you sort of need to know in avaiton(page 4). AOI 1. IR.I.A.K3 (Basic Med)(page 2). You didn't make it past the 4th page of the ACS before you started to struggle. She probably noticed that and started to dig. She hits Basic med hard. All you had to do was pull up the AC which is allowed to do. I honestly don't think you have a leg to stand on. For future and current aviatiors. In life, especially with DPEs, the first impression is the only impression. Why tell her you called the FSDO if you flew what she wanted. All you had to say was. Hey, I wanted you to know I flew the "250 nm" cross country last night to meet the IFR requirements. It might have helped you. But it felt like you were trying to one up her, then tell her she's wrong but you did what she wanted anyway. It wasn't necessary. As an outsider looking in, you may have come off as unintentionally arrogant. She may have felt like you were challenging her. I know it sounds. Pilots are A types. Sometimes saying Yes Sir or Mam. Is more important than being technically correct, especially if they are the gate keepers. Do what you need to do to pass the ride and talk about it AFTER. This was NOTHING compared to South Florida. Try 2k for a ride. And everyone knows Bob will dress you down in the oral and in the plane. Do what you tried with her, with him, and you will have a bad day and the entire building will hear it. You talk about professionalism. Why post this ? This is a really, really small community. Everyone will know who you are. just own it and move on. You're doing yourself a disservice by posting this. EVERYONE KNOWS who this. I bet she's seen it. Will your future employer want to be outted and blasted on TH-cam, which could cause lawsuits. You're playing with fire, man. Not trying to be your dad but trying to help. Live your life. The info on the DPE is real. I didn't have any on her. I went in blind and did fine. My ride was FAR from perfect. Some DPEs are different. But I knew who was going to pass or fail with her before they even walked in the room. Come over prepared to every checkride.
I haven't flown in years but I'll never forget my check ride for my PPL. The DPE actually yelled at me for doing something on the checklist (carb heat or pitot heat) and then complained that I was descending too slow, took the controls and pushed the airspeed into the yellow to descend faster. I passed, but lost a ton of confidence.
Thank you for sharing this experience, I have learned to listen to my inner voice more. In the past, I have pushed on like you and have been burned. I totally, I get the pressure to muscle through things-UGH!
Hey brotha, I have been flying professionally for 40+ years and can tell you that bought back a memory of a very similiar experience I had many years ago. I’ve had a smooth career . Passed multiple checkrides thru ATP, passed multiple 135/121 , type rides, currency rides, Orals etc. But there is that one “unsat” that haunts me. You seem to have it wired and got it together. Good job keeping your cool! Love your Mooney BTW
Hey Tom, sorry to hear about your experience. No checkride is a joyride but your was definitely something to be rattle by. You mentioned you are working on your commercial - so do I, in my M20E. Let's see who passes first, I'd love your take on the power off 180 in the Mooney, I'm struggling a lot with this.
At least it’s not hard for people to figure out who this DPE is, definitely needs to be on the FAA’s radar. Also put a stop to her cash cow of $900 for a IFR Checkride.
Wow! I would have immediately cancelled, after she was already having an attitude. Sorry to hear this happened to you man. Your video is very informative. I have flown with some horrible instructors, and DPE’s as well. I’m currently training for my IR also. By the way, I’m jealous of your Mooney; I am in the process of restoring mine. 😎👍
Wow, crazy story.. I'd Call FAA, like you said who's dream has she crushed and put a stain on their record just looking for more money. Sounds like someone who would fail someone just to pocket an extra $500 from retake! Just sucks doing a checkrides with DPE's is so random and almost 50/50 outcome sometimes.. Good advise and I'll be vetting hard before any of mine in the future. Thanks
She's mad you mentioned her name to the FSDO because they've been firing DPEs for less things than what she did and she's worried you've put the spotlight on her. She can control the narrative when she reaches out to the FSDO first. Follow up with the FSDO, many both good and bad DPEs have been fired recently and we need to make sure that they get the right ones.
After explaining the part about the person coming to get a drink, I began to think about get-there-itis. You wanted to finish the checkride regardless, and perseverance is a good character trait…usually. Thank you for relaying your story. I had a crazy experience with a CFI and in hindsight should have also discontinued, but I didn’t and it cost more than I wanted.
SOUNDS like that DPE was a problem. My private and instrument check rides each at some point involved trying to get me distracted about stuff not related to the flight. I cannot imagine trying to do a youtube video while flying and airplane. It is bad enough when people do it while driving a car.
One of the things I hate is when the DPE does things differently than the way you were taught to do it or the way you normally do it, and insists that you do things their way. I failed my first commercial helicopter check ride after I came up about 4 miles off from my destination airport. I have always flown with my sectional chart in a "north up" orientation on my knee board, or in the NORMAL orientation so that you can read all of the text. Apparently the examiner had a habit of turning his sectional charts in a "track up" orientation, and insisted that I do the same. I told him it was confusing, but he didn't care. Of course I Borderline got lost, and failed my check ride.
I went to Knoxville downtown for my ppl check ride and took it with this 86 yr old named Bob Davidson. He farted the whole time and screamed at me during the flying portion but he passed me lol.
Sorry to hear about that man. You took this way better than me I would have spazzed out on her. I’m glad to hear you aced your 2nd attempt with a normal DPE.
Ok this sounds like a DPE in our area who failed like 8 of 10 students. He charges $1000 per checkride. The CFIs at our school stopped booking students with him because he seemed to be looking to fail students.
I don't know about it now but back in the day it was not uncommon for DPEs to have issues with the FAA if too many applicants pass. Like quotas traffic cops may have each day.
You need to notify the FAA about this person . In fact just send the FAA this video and let them hear what you have to say about it. This examiner needs to be removed from being able to give an flight exam. Also, it’s amazing she price gouged you of $900
sorry you had a crappy experience with a DPE, best of luck on your commercial! i’m in the middle of my instrument and excited to get past this checkride as well, totally agree with what you said “a stupid bump in an otherwise smooth ride.” safe flying man!
Sorry to hear this story! She was definitely not dialed in! Very unfortunate to be unprofessional for such an important flight test! Things will catch up with her eventually!
Sounds like on the contrary she would pass an applicant on a check ride perhaps if they stroked her ego rather than based on pilot skill. Dangerous DPE.
I would say some of her actions like offering Starbucks could be seen as stress reducing for the candidate but the rest is a bit BS espEcially breaching your privacy.
$600 for a checkride!? Where I train out of (San Diego) the lowest I’ve heard of is $800… most charge $900 and that was for my private, instrument, commerical, CFII and my CFI was $1600
My instrument checkride DPE left me and several others hanging. After the oral exam (I passed easily), turned out there was a minor mechanical issue with the airplane that wasn't present the day before. It had to be grounded, so we discontinued. Once it was back on the flight line a few days later, I started calling and texting that DPE to schedule the practical exam. No response. 60 days came and went, now I have to re-do the oral exam. There are so few DPEs in my area, and all are busy flying commercially and don't return calls or texts. So 60 days went by. Even my CFII has been trying to get a DPE for me and his other students. That same DPE who left me hanging did the same to several other students in my flight school, some had discontinued, one or two needed a re-test. We're all walking around shell-shocked. I considered contacting the local FSDO however I believe the FAA will not revoke that DPE's privileges (or Tom's first DPE's privileges) because no FARs were violated. They just behaved extremely unprofessionally, which is not illegal. Meanwhile I'm flying every Saturday with my CFII, and continually going over the oral exam knowledge. It's been a nightmare. Suggestions are welcomed.
I failed my instrument check ride too. But, my experience was WAAAAY different. During all of my training, I used NOS charts. The night before my check ride, my Jeppesen charts arrived, leather binder and all. I was soooooo juiced. I flew several approaches really well, and then the VOR into somewhere (hell, it's been a while). I flew a nearly perfect approach to DME minima, but the aircraft didn't have DME installed. The examiner asked if the aircraft had DME and I said no. Note: NOS charts list the minimums without DME first, and then with DME (cause if you use NOS charts you are poor?). Jeppesen charts list the minimums with DME first, and then without (cause if you use Jeppesen, you are rich and fly well equipped aircraft). Long story short, I had to do it over. The re-fly was pretty easy, because the examiner knew I'd flunked before for "new charts". In fact, he even said "I've never flunked anyone for new charts before!", But damn! You went through the wringer. Luckily, I think I gave John Green about $200 each, for Private, Commercial and Instrument - but it was the 1980s. Glad you found someone else for #2!
I had a somewhat similar thing happened at the Airlines. I taped the debrief and wrote down the whole experience. Then reported the guy to the union. Sucks but you’ve got to keep these folks accountable.
"Maybe she's out there doing this to other people..." Bingo. Given her earlier comments, I'd bet she is. Please, help the community and take a few minutes to share your experience with the FSDO. Her behavior was grossly unprofessional and nobody who's putting in the kind of time/money/effort required to get their certificate/rating should be subjected to that kind of experience.
I’m not going to comment on the DPE, she has received more attention than she needs or deserves. Good on you for dealing with the failure, resetting and passing. Some people would have given up, you kept it going and now educating others. You are truly PIC…Cheers to yeah 🍺🍺🍺🍺.
Think about how you're going to frame this checkride horror story during your interview(s) for future positions. You have an UnSat on your record. It's going to come up during interviews. You've got to frame your answer in a way that you take full responsibility for it, and you learned from it. So sorry that you had this crazy experience. Keep on flying and enjoy the rest of your training! BTW, jealous of your E Model. Everyone's Mooney is somehow faster than my '69 F.
Sorry for the HORRIBLE audio! Every plane is different. Still trying to figure this one out.
nice video, random question, how do you make enough money to fly?
I got a headache from this is the most unprofessional dpe
Tom I think you should help other people by reporting it imagine it happenes to someone else it could be me
I'm 10 mins. 30 secs. in and it's just fine, sir.
Can you get that unsat expunged from your record if that DPE is held accountable for her actions?
You have a responsibility to notify the FAA of this DPE.
Good one! 👍
But she said not to!
REPORT!!!
Agree that you owe this to everybody else that is going through a check ride. Guaranteed that this is happening to most folks
Totally agree. Report her to the FAA. That behavior is completely unacceptable.
Tom,
As a former DPE and FAA Inspector (now retired), let me say that the conduct of the Examiner was abominable. To say that her actions were “unprofessional” is a gross understatement. It appears she didn’t even follow the ACS or have a plan of action for the check ride. Many of her questions seemed inappropriate for an Instrument practical test. The St. Augustine vs. Augusta situation was laughable.
The reason she didn’t want you to mention her name to the local FSDo is because THEY KNOW she is a problem. She’s most likely had complaints before by other applicants. I strongly urge you to contact the FSDO Operations Supervisor or the FSDO who has oversight of the DPE’s and recount your story either in writing or in person. If the office has any integrity, they will take action to either surveil this DPE while administering checks or take steps to get rid of her (yes, it’s tough, but it can be done. While being the overseeing inspector of the DPE’s at LAX FSDO, I got rid of two substandard examiners.). In interacting with the FSDO, have your facts together, tell the truth, and be confident in knowing that what you’re doing is the right thing.
We can’t have these types of DPE’s out there. Oh, I think that as soon she heard of your contacting the FSDO and mentioning her name, failing you was her intent. She stole your $900. Tom, don’t let this stand. Tell the FAA what happened.
I agree. After she yelled at me, I would never of given her any more and said we are done.
She’s basically a GTA5 npc
Well said
@@kimskislalom so wait you took a checkride with her
is there a way to get this fraudulent failure removed from record? i personally wouldn’t give up until either the faa removed the failure or they threw me in jail for nagging too much😂
Tom, as someone who has been a military flight instructor and evaluator (and now flies for fun), the FSDO absolutely needs to be informed of this DPE. Her mindset, as you described her, is the complete wrong fit for the task before her. And yes, how many other people is she essentially taking money from and never letting them get to the flight phase? Something is incredibly wrong here!
It sounds like they already know about her... or she wouldn't have popped an o-ring when she found out he mentioned her name to the FSDO
@FullSendPrecision my thoughts, too. But like anything in life, if you're not documenting it, it didn't happen. And contacting the FSDO may just be adding to their documentation for revocation of her DPE status.
@@FullSendPrecision "she wouldn't have popped an o-ring" Lv this. Would you mind if I added to my repertoire ?
🛫📖🛬
D I T T O👍
@@DiniM hahah go for it
You need to notify the FAA about this DPE. FAA has to investigate this DPE to prevent other pilots making the same mistakes meeting her.
There's 2 sides to every story
@@mattbasford6299 Yup. Which is why the FAA needs to investigate, which they won't do if OP doesn't report his experience.
There is only one female DPE that I know of in SC, she has a very poor reputation.
This DPE was mad that you called the FAA because she IS on the FAA radar!
Theres something terribly wrong with this DPE mentally, I think she's not only unprofessional but a danger to aviation in all aspects considering her pos ition with the FAA. I hope you truly consider reporting her to your FSDO or higher. It's frightening to think she's not only a DPE but a pilot to boot. FAA needs to evaluate this person asap. Like you said , how many other people has she failed for no justifiable reason. I live in SC and am currently a student pilot working towards my PPL. I hope she's dealt with before my check ride !! Lol....thanks Tom, love your channel, sorry this happened to a stand up guy like yourself.
Also people with this mentality often will pass people they click with when they are not qualified. That is my biggest concern.
Hopefully the FAA is notified about this person. I am certain she already has had FAA action taken against her, hence why she was upset about her name being mentioned to the FAA
Joey Roger's in Florence and Timothy Mitchell in Lexington are both amazing DPEs. You'll absolutely need to know your stuff but they'll give you a good and fair ride at fair prices
The DPE is suffering with Batshit Crazy Syndrome. Seems to be a epidemic currently...
She was upset by you before you guys even started, and was like "all right I'm just gunna take this kids money and fail him".
Knowing she was already determined to do just that, she stretched the time out with you, taking breaks, talking to other people, and throwing you curve balls, until she decided it was time to give you the bad news she pre-determined was gunna happen as soon as she took your money.
What a damn shame.
I'm glad you were able to finish your ride with a different DPE.
Yikes, I sure do not want a DPE like this one. Going to get my Private Pilot check-ride soon.
In the voice of Yoda... "Dick, she is."
I guess she thinks ms13 can't find out where she lives..no need to call the FAA
I did a checkride with her passing on my first try, and she left the room multiple times to talk to anyone who walked by.
I've had a DPE like that
Tom, I really enjoy your honesty and your videos. I have been a pilot for over fifty years and a large airplane check airman for thirty or so years. The world is filled with all manner of pilots, and DPEs. Some good and some really poor. Some gracious, and some vindictive.
I remember a piece of advice given me as a new DC First Officer after I had botched an arrival into Dubai. I made the go around did the landing, and we were on the taxi in. The Captain turns and asks me if I learned anything, to which I replied YES!!!! He replied…good.
Next he gave me a good piece of advice. The most important landing you’re ever going to do is the next one. The last approach, the last landing is already in the bag, so learn from it then forget about it. But the most important advice Capt Bernie Williams, World Airways, gave me was this; if you think something is wrong, it probably is. If that is the case, don’t hesitate, do something about it sooner rather than later. Good flying, you will do well.
🙏
You absolutely need to notify the FSDO about this. This is a major problem in our society today. No one has the courage to stand up and do the right thing because they’re too afraid of the backlash. Of course you are not the only one having this experience. This needs to be stopped.
Best comment Frank...about standing up for yourself! I let people push me around all my life instead of fighting back. Memphis, TN. 1979. Two FAA inspectors find me $12,000 for having my worthless Cessna 404 2 hours overdue for overhaul on one motor. I had two money-making runs for Emery Air Freight & night charters for Federal Express. I closed the doors instead of fighting it lower. Stupid decision!
I have been a Comm/Inst/Multi pilot & worked for FAA for 30 years. Your experience is absolutely abhorrent. It is not you that needed to have a stain on record, but she needed to be disciplined or sanctioned by the FAA. Check rides are very stressful. Professionalism, continuity, & an examiner that is looking for fundamental Instrument skills is critical. I still remember my Inst check ride. Totally stressed out in a hot summer cockpit. I passed , but thought otherwise after a multitude of IFR scenarios. At the end my examiner said something I never forget. “Son….this is your license to learn. Just don’t kill your self doing it.” For the sake of all her potential “failed” pilots….PLEASE REPORT HER‼️
Agree.
I failed my PPL check ride. I found out later he failed everyone who didn't want to become a chopper pilot. I turned him into the FAA.
I had this DPE for a check ride last December. I had a very similar experience like you did. Threw off my program by more than six months and I just passed my check ride do- over today. You should report her ASAP.
Tom, did you report this DPE??? This is ridiculous, and I hope she never does this to any other pilot. Congratulations on passing your instrument rating.... thanks for sharing your story
Wow, that sounds like a horrendous experience, more emotionally than physically. Well done for passing, I know from your posts that you have put your heart, soul and passion into your flying.
You handled yourself very professionally and you did everyone watching this a great service by showing them the importance of vetting your DPE and not to rushing your training. I could see myself doing the same thing had I not watched your video. I had no Idea there were DPE’s out there like this woman.
This story is terrifying! I remember my interment check ride and I was already a nervious wreck. I can't imagine having to deal with this on top of that. Please contact the FSDO about this. Your probably not the first and will only be helping rid the sky's of this crap! Like you mentioned about your FSDO they are there to help and I found that with mine as well. Some of the most understanding and professional FAA employees I've ever met. Congrats by the way of overcoming this and passing!
I'm glad I had the myth that by default "they want you to pass" smashed into a million pieces by a certain DPE. Tough but valuable lesson to learn. They are people that are financially incentivized to fail you due to their little re-test fees.
A couple other takeaways from this -
1) Read the Advisory Circulars. Not saying that a deep dive into BasicMed is common (or fair) on instrument rides, but anyone considering pursuing aviation as a career, including becoming a CFI, will be doing themselves a favor by briefing (or reading) the ACs. What's not in the regs is often in the ACs. You don't want to be reading hundreds of pages of ACs the week before your CFI ride, so at least be aware of the ones that are there. They're out there for weather, wake turbulence, taxiing/runway incursions, etc. I have a binder where every time I find a relevant one, I print out the AC and put it in, and having that on hand during checkrides has served me well. You're not expected to memorize every AC, but telling a DPE (or at least a normal one) "oh, there's an advisory circular about that, I forget the number off the top of my head but here it is." Anyone going for commercial or CFI should be well-versed in at least what the topics are, and CFI should have read over them.
2) I know it's a huge bummer, but a failed checkride isn't the black stain on the aviation career everyone seems to think it is. Not trying to minimize the disappointment anyone feels, but everyone has a bad day, even DPEs. And everyone knows checkrides are stress inducing and don't bring out the best in pilots. So for anyone reading this that maybe has failed a ride, don't let it derail your ambition. Keep your head up and get back at it. You'll pass.
3) The FSDO is your friend. Always, always reach out to them if you have any questions. Tom totally did the right thing here. They are honestly pretty happy that pilots are reaching out to them for clarification and not trying to figure it out either in the air, or during a checkride when they'll have to go back and do a bunch of paperwork to revoke a rating or something like that. Especially in the world from instrument to commercial where people often try and "double dip" - i.e., use complex training to build cross country time, etc...not every DPE looks at the regs the same way. When in doubt, call the FSDO. And if you can get some documentation saying you talked to them, and they approved an XC, a lot of DPEs will appreciate the fact that they have a different opinion, but you tried. And if they're a GOOD DPE, they have a relationship with the FSDO and will reach out themselves for clarification and go from there.
4) TRSAs are stupid.
“TRSAs are stupid” 😂
The FAA is NOT your friend. They are a government agency that will burn you to the ground in a heartbeat.
As a taxpayer and airspace user, the faa is your employee essentially.
The fsdo is a resource no more no less.
To possibly save future pilots from going through what you did, I’d consider making a phone call. She may already be on the FAA’s radar. Sounds to me like she failed you but was more than happy to give you a second chance for some extra cash of course.
She most certainly is on the FAA's radar in my opinion. This is why she freaked out when he mentioned her to the FAA when he asked for clarification on the 3 different qualifying landing rule change .
Indeed. This woman is a thief and unethical. Report her.
I won’t pile on to everyone else’s “report her to FSDO” comments (even though I completely agree), but the statement at 21:56: “You’re supposed to encounter people like this, and you’re supposed to overcome it”…that’s a life-lesson right there man.
Keep your head where it’s at; you’re gonna have a great career.
This needs to go to the FSDO to be reviewed. There is no hiding or flying under the radar in this business; FAA knows who you are, ESPECIALLY if you’re their DPE. You’re doing a real disservice if you don’t take her head-on.
Little did he know he accidently transmitted this entire thing over the UHF 💀
My PPL checkride was $1000 + $700. 4 hour oral on day 1 and by the time they wanted to fly (after a 1hr lunch) the weather shifted. I didn’t know DPEs charged so much to reschedule lol.
Definitely going to do more research on my DPE for the instrument check and be more specific about who I’m paying. I’m not looking for an easy check ride just want it to make sense financially and objectively.
Thanks for sharing
You’re a good man. Sorry about the check-ride but being so concerned about what it cost you and what you could’ve given your family is the best part of the video. I’m glad I watched it. I never had a family of my own but my father was the same way and I’m so grateful for him. I’m glad I realized how much he gave his family before he passed away. He was an airline pilot for Northwest Airlines when he retired. I hope your family watched the video but I’m sure they know. Thanks for sharing. It made my day. Godspeed
I’m from Charleston as well, I know who you are talking about. You’re not the only one that experienced this, unfortunately. I luckily canceled my checkride with said person because of weather then heard what people had to say so I went with someone else
Who was it? Any chance it was the lady from Anderson? Cynthia
Thank you for sharing this story. We all have stories, good and bad. It's an essential part of our aviation education and safety. I got the instrument rating 10 years ago and my DPE was very tough but fair. He slaughtered me on weather knowledge, then in the flight phase after I got everything set up for the first approach (an ILS) he distracted me with irrelevant conversation, stirred up all the radios and caught me on failing to restore one frequency. However, he kindly advised me to practice some very specific things and agreed to retest only the flying in one week for 200 and that went well. The most embarrassing part of that fail day was arriving home to see paper airplanes everywhere and walking in to a surprise "congratulations" party that my wife set up with ~30+ neighbors and friends.
Yes, trying to rattle and distract you are standard, but this DPE as you describe her went too far and displayed poor knowledge and judgement. You absolutely should give her a review with the FSDO.
I almost had her as my DPE two weeks ago. There was an accident that happened on her watch and my ride was canceled along with y’all my classmates at my flight school. I was pissed, but looking back… it’s a blessing in disguise. Thank GOD
Where you located?
@@Tommyflies I’m in Dallas. Apparently she was on a commercial checkride and they landed short of the runway in the grass at one of the airports on the east side of the Bravo not sure which one. But we lost one of our planes unfortunately. Another DPE told me they sent her away and that she’s not a DPE anymore. I heard she was nice to my classmate and my classmate had nothing but good to say about her, maybe she likes my flight school because she was a regular DPE. I was told not to refuse any food she offers either. There are certainly people that liked her at my school and she seemed like a nice person every time I saw her. Very quirky for sure. I even got her McDonald’s because I really wanted to be on her good side… but she never showed up.
@@khaledalchahrour8113 interesting. Wondering if it the same person… hit me up on IG if you want to. I’d be interested to know.
You mentioned she stepped away to call the fsdo. Do you think she possibly failed you on purpose because she realized she didn't have her credentials up to date in order to sign off on your check ride? Her behavior sounds strange and that she was trying to fail you on purpose while still collecting money for her time. She sounds like a scam artist and maybe she's been in trouble before.
I had a similar experience with my instrument checkride, but not as bad. DPE was condescending from the very beginning and immediately put me on edge. Kept referring to me sarcastically as “captain” and was doing his best to not just stump me, but make me feel stupid and anxious too. Oral portion was going good, I had some gaps for sure but overall I felt I was doing good. Near the end of the oral, we pulled out an instrument approach plate and went over it, I knew all of it and described it to him. He then asked, “What’s a TAA?” And I said, “Honestly, I’m not familiar with what that is.” We had just gone over an approach plate, by the way, and I explained all of it to his satisfaction, including what learned later was a TAA. For those who don’t know, a TAA is very similar to an MSA on an approach plate, and is easily interpreted the same way as an MSA is. I explained what it meant on the plate he showed me, without telling him what it was called. So then when he asked me what a TAA was, and I didn’t know it, he made a very big deal of it. “I can’t believe you don’t know what a TAA is, that’s a crucial piece of information, this is a serious gap in your knowledge,” and similar statements. I’m feeling like shit at this point. And he knew I knew what it looked like on the plate, and what it meant, because I had just described it to him! I just didn’t know the name!
Finally he goes, “Well, I have to tell you…” and I think, “oh shit, checkride is over before we get to the plane.” Then he says, “You’ve barely got the knowledge I consider a minimum. So we’re going to go fly, but you’re really at a C- grade knowledge wise, it’s really barely” and I was at that point so on edge that I almost just wanted it to be over because I was sick to my stomach about getting into the plane with this guy.
We go out to the plane, quick preflight, hop in. I managed to get my stress under control at this point. We’re taxiing out, and he sees that my GPS map is in north up, not heading up. (We’re in a G1000 equipped plane for this.) He goes, “You really need to have your map in heading up for approaches. North up is going to confuse you and cost you situational awareness.” I’m thinking, “ok that’s kind of weird,” neither of my previous instructors had said anything about north up being an issue, and anyway, every approach plate is north up when you look at it, so what does it matter? If you can’t read a map north up, what business do you have flying! So while I’m thinking this, he goes to change it to north up mode! And I stop him and said, “I understand what you’re getting at, but it’s my aircraft and this is what I’ve trained with and am used to, so I’d prefer to leave it north up.” He tuts a little but lets it go.
We take off, and the checkride goes very well up until partial panel. I nailed both of my previous approaches, and I think at this point he was looking for a way to fail me because he was unhappy with my oral. He starts covering my panel up, and as soon as he’s done, I go to put the panel in revisionary mode like I had practiced and trained with. He goes, “don’t touch that damn button. You’re not allowed to use it.” So I shit myself a little bit, but I had done partial panel stuff without using the revisionary mode before, but I knew it was a weaker point for me. I manage to get set up on an ILS, flew the approach, and ended up passing the checkride. But man it was stressful.
I talked to my instructor and a few other pilots after the checkride, and none of them knew what a TAA was right off the top of their head either, despite thousands of hours of experience. But I showed them each a plate that had it, and they were all able to interpret it. Not sure why the DPE was so fixated on being able to name it on a plate. Who cares what it’s called as long as you can interpret it safely and correctly on the plate?
Where did this happen, in what state?
I was one of the pilots that had my certificate pulled after several years of flying because my DPE came under suspicion.
I was upset with the FAA. I tried to fight them from taking my certificate.
In the end, they told me that I had done nothing wrong, but that to them, it was unsafe for me to keep flying without another checkride. The checkride had to be with the FAA, not another DPE.
I had just sold my plane and walked away from flying for a good number of years.
I am now preparing for my IFR ( They did stipulate that I could use any DPE for IFR, but not VFR).
It is clear to me today that they were right. I was not a safe pilot even though I had 400 takeoff and landings.
The old saying that you don’t know what you don’t know could not have been truer.
I am writing this because if the DPE isn’t fit for the job, the FAA had to know.
You need to tell them your experience and let them investigate.
This, unfortunately happens a lot. I had "retrained" qualified pilots to retake checkrides they had completed years ago. They have been flying hundreds of hours safely and with zero infractions, until the FAA finds one bad DPE. They should handle this very differently than they do, it is not the pilots fault, but the DPE in question. The FAA takes the stance that if one person craps themselves, everyone has to wear diapers.
You never deserve to fail brother! Don’t think you fail like you said just a bump. Keep going and I am right behind following you!
I really hope you recorded the check ride. Let the FAA know sooner than later! And maybe there is a way to get that removed from your record, especially if she had or has a history of this.
Hey Tom,
I want to sincerely thank you for sharing your story. Throughout my flight training at the university aviation flight program, as well as my experience flying in the Civil Air Patrol. I have never encountered anything like what you described with the DPE or check ride examiner.
I agree with the comments that describe this as an anomaly, and I hope you reported this incident to the local FAA FSDO. What she did was appalling, and I personally know a few DPEs who conduct check rides based on the specific rating the applicant is seeking. For example, if it's a private pilot check ride, they focus solely on private pilot questions. This DPE's behavior goes beyond what is acceptable, and I believe she should not have the privilege of being a DPE based on your experience alone.
If you haven't already, I strongly encourage you to report her to the local FSDO. It seems from your post that she might have been under their radar already due to your earlier contact. I understand that DPEs are humans and might not remember all the regulations, but there's nothing wrong with seeking clarification from the FSDO when needed. However, her response to you was completely unacceptable.
Considering the severity of the situation, it might be wise to consult with an aviation lawyer or someone experienced in handling defamation cases, just in case she decides to take legal action against you. Your and your family's protection is important, and having professional legal advice can be crucial if things escalate.
In conclusion, I love your videos, Tom, and I hope you keep up the good work. Your courage in speaking out about this incident is commendable, and I hope it leads to a positive change in the system.
I flew an extra hour and a half to avoid a DPE that I had heard a little too much about locally. Couldn't have been happier with my choice and ended up doing my instrument check-ride with him too. Just a regular guy, no arrogance and no BS. You're 100% right, it pays to vet your DPE.
How do you vet you DPE. I do not want a nasty one.
@@kimskislalom I spoke to many of the more advanced students I knew and met. Other instructors are a great resource too, particularly the ones that work with lots of students. In the end, it's a bit of an educated guess, but get as much info ahead of time as you can. Good luck!
@@KC2DZB PS getting everything perfect as I can get it and doing dry run check rides with another instructor before I get the checkride with the DPE.
@@kimskislalom sounds like you're doing all the right things. Best of luck on your check ride!
Sorry for your experience but a good lesson to learn that it is YOUR checkride and you can discontinue or cancel if it’s not going well, if the DPE is being strange, your tired, etc.
TELL the FAA!!! This is the kind of crap we shouldn't have to put up with from DPE. Sadly yours is not an isolated incident. Many DPE's have issues that they have no problem taking out on people to whom they owe honor.
Please notify your FSDO about your experience. Allow them to investigate because like you say in your video, if this is how she handles all of her checkrides, imagine how many other pilots perhaps she has failed and perhaps those new aviators never get back into aviation again. Great job sticking with it!
This is absolutely not any sort of "stain" on your aviation career... this was a learning experience that you will never forget,. However, it will soon be insignificant.
This quite the horror story. I am planning on getting my PPL this October and eventually IFR but man that story, feel bad for ya bud. I a glad you got it in the end. Good job and keep up the hard work!
Hey Tom - I had a similar experience on one of mine. Thankfully, I was able to push through, though the debrief was awkward. I’d suggest reaching out to the FSDO. Aviation is in a bit of a spot with a shortage of many things, not the least of which are DPEs. All the same, the risk is potentially higher if we have this sort of thing going on unchecked. Aviation is small, indeed, but in cases like these, there are probably a few people out there to have your back. Appreciate you sharing your experience. Completely unreasonable in my opinion.
We have a shortage of GOOD DPEs. FSDOs are hesitant to qualify more because they don't want to have more than they can manage. Shit canning a DPE like this would make way for another fair DPE.
Thanks for sharing your experience. Glad you ended up reporting this DPE. As a new student pilot content like this is super informative.
Wish I could have shared this with my daughter. Hers is today and she had a rough go with the company already. I’ll share this after her checkered this morning. Following your channel now
Oh man, I feel for you after hearing this. I can't believe that! I had a bad experience with my instrument check ride too, but I did pass thankfully. I almost wanted to do it again just to feel better about it.
Im 10 minutes into this and Im thinking its time to call the FSDO back and let them know how this went. Totally unacceptable. Turn her ass in. In fact let the world know who this person is so others don't have to go through the same thing. Im totally pissed for you.
@10:00 If anyone talked to me like I was 10 years old I don't think I'd have them in my airplane. I might for sure trust them to be PIC and fly me somewhere. But if I'm PIC and they talk to me like I'm a child then why the hell would they want to be in my airplane?! Hmm.. ripping people off might be one reason she's trying to stay off of the FAA's radar. @18:00 Wow She's actively promoting herself and focusing on networking her business instead of focusing on her customer.
And she tried to gaslight you?!?! Whiskey Tango Foxtrot!?
@22:00 Wow. Talk about level headedness. Awesome attitude. I'd sure love to fly with you man!
But I'd bet you're absolutely right she's doing this to other people.
I hope that after you calmed down that you did call in your experience. I had to leave school because I didn’t have the money to continue IFR and was paired with a non teaching instructor. I did have a great PPL DPE though. But the school was just taking my money I didn’t have. I feel it’s my obligation to help other not fall into that same trap. Congrats on you second check! So awesome! Thanks for sharing your experience as well. Sorry for your lousy experience and airway robbery. Take care and fly safe!
My examiner for my PPL charged me $100 less than the $900. The biggest difference here is that she took the effort to fail you, rather mine did everything possible to make me pass while making a sort of flight lesson out of it. Now I'm off to instrument training and this encouraged me to stick with the same dpe (He's awesome anyways).
Also quick note. It seems like she just scammed you out of that $900 before you even took a step into the checkride judging how she was even annoyed to interact with you during the phone calls. The networking she was doing with that CFI DURING the checkride is also a clear give away as she sells herself off while showing to the student she doesn't value the checkride taking place. No doubt in my mind she fails students simply to grab that extra cash to afford luxury trips to st.augustine. AND to top it off with telling everyone you failed? She's simply narcissistic. In all honesty I would be dumbfounded and end up with that failing mark if in the same situation.
Instrument Checkride tomorrow down in Venice - when on a budget for training the scariest part of failing a checkride is having to pay another $700
Hopefully you have Toby! He’s awesome.
Good luck you got this.👍🛩
I still don't understand why he failed the oral portion of his check ride. He said he was glazed over and wasn't listening at that point. The DPE would've had to note something other than called FSDO for clarification.
As someone who is preparing for my instrument check ride, I would hate to have an experience like this from my DPE. We spend so much time, money, and energy to make this a reality in our lives. Her behavior, if actually as described, is highly unprofessional and needs to be reported to the FAA. Makes me wonder how many other pilots she’s scammed, failed, or otherwise mentally compromised prior to a check ride. Please don’t let this go.
Bruh you absolutely need to follow up with the FAA… and truthfully o really wish I knew the name to avoid this DPE
Thank you for sharing your story. Stories like this a great learning tools, because all of us can see how it can happen to any one of us.
Please call the FAA and tell them your story…She doesn’t deserve to be a DPE.
My first DPE was verbally abusing me the entire time we were in the oral, I botched a few questions and he took it upon himself to insult me by stating "do you have kids? Even they would know the answer to that question"... after that he just went full psychotic in his mental abuse of me that it threw off the entire exam for me. I passed the oral but should have just stopped before the checkride and called it a day. It carried over to the plane and even while we were doing maneuvers his comments were degrading and throwing me off my game. He was yelling at me over the mic, I was trying to navigate a busy airspace and he kept interjecting insults and side comments that had nothing to do with the exam but towards me personally. On a short field landing attempt I was frazzled by his reactions and hit the pavement hard, plane was fine but at that point he gave me the thumbs down and the checkride was over. He gave me the option to continue or go back and without hesitation I said go back and didn't say a word to him on the return trip. Got to the debrief and I gave him the silent treatment. Instructor asked me what happened afterwards and I spilled the beans on the experience and safe to say the instructor was taken back at what I experienced.
Fast forward to six weeks later and I had a new checkride scheduled with a different DPE, no issues, most accommodating individual i've met from an examiner experience and passed without issue. Had just a few areas to improve upon. Night and day experience.
Some people should just not be in a position of authority.
She failed you so she could collect another $450 from you. She should absolutely be reported. I’m also guessing, she’s had prior complaints and that’s why she freaked out you mentioned her name.
Probably the most unprofessional DPE I’ve ever heard of. The fact she’s even still a DPE is beyond me. She’s obviously got something to hide and she needs to be investigated
Here’s another vote for ABSOLUTELY notifying the FAA /FSDO.
I train on a shoestring and a DPE like this could throw my program way off… One check ride is expensive and stressful enough… I don’t know if I could afford to fail two and with one opportunity wasted needlessly, I would probably feel the need to train relentlessly before I attempted the second one.
She can go check groceries… Aviation doesn’t need people like her.
Sorry you had to go through that. I failed my first instrument checkride due to a misunderstanding. Everything seemed to go well until doing the final NDB approach into my home runway. But the DPE said, "OK....take the hood off. Can you make it straight in from here?" I was used to steep slips and rapid descents in the Super Decathalon, so I said, "Sure." and started down. He grabbed the yoke and pulled us up to begin a circling to land. He failed me for "poor judgement." on the NDB approach whereas I thought he was challenging me to end a good checkride with a steep slip to landing. I told him that, but it didn't matter. That was 1979. I am currently preparing for my IPC to get back to KOSH again.
How much did it cost you?
@@JustinHuff_EOinDixie We're talking 1979. Everything was cheap by today's standards. I think I paid $75 for th DPE. I recall the Piper Archer was $28/hr. I started flying in 1973 paying $12/hour for a Cessna 150 and $3/hour for the instructor. Yes! $15/hr dual. I was earning $1.75/hr back then. It's all relative.
Thanks for posting this video. I'm honestly shocked the DPE in question would ever take the position that she didn't want to be "on the radar" of the FSDO. That's really odd. Every DPE takes checkrides with local inspectors to maintain their examining authority. In my past, I've always seen my local DPEs have a cordial relationship with the FSDO and their inspectors. It's just one of those things; you can't be a DPE and be anonymous to your FSDO at the same time. I think it would behoove you to write a letter to the FSDO and follow up on this experience. As someone who has been in the game for over 20 years, it is painful to watch fellow professional pilots mistreat folks who are just getting started in aviation.
Absolutely bring this up to the FAA so it doesn't happen to someone else. i know of plenty of classmates of mine that scrape pennies out of couches just to take their checkrides, and if this sort of thing happened to one of them it would be robbery at that point. doesnt matter if it happened yesterday or three months ago, the FSDO should be notified of any unsatisfactory performance by the DPE.
Way to stay tactful, dude. That sounded terrible. Love your mindset. Respect.
Very sorry that happened. You really should have talked to FAA about this case, and I think you were the victim of fraud. Thanks for sharing this with us.
Where was your CFII in this process? At my school we do background checks and interview new DPEs before allowing them to do a checkride with one of our students. Most DPEs I know are great pilots, professionals and want the checkride to be an awesome experience for the candidate. There are DPEs not so, as you may have encountered. I say "may", because this lady may have mental health issues. She seemed to be functioning from a skewed reality or at least struggling with remembering and sequencing events. I wasn't there, but something wrong. You really owe it to the aviation community to discuss this with the FSDO. This could be a safety issue that needs attention. It's not about hurting somebody, but putting safety first and doing it from the right attitude, which you seem to have.
The calming music and peanuts made me think of Nurse Ratched.
At first I was like, "You know, yes, if you're flying to Augusta which is a TRSA you should have known it right off the bat everything about it even as an IFR just because you never know if you wanted to divert and go VFR for that diversion or whatever." But then as soon as she thought you were going to St. Augustine which ISN'T a TRSA, what you had told her should've sufficed. You knew TRSAs exist. The big keyword you made was it was voluntary to call ATC. You don't even need a transponder if you're not contacting the controller.
But I had to laugh at how twice in your experience she complained that someone was taking up all her time when she was conducting the conversation. Both with you when she called you on the phone and with the guy who walked in for some water. She's a nut. It's quite evident why she wants to go under the FAA's radar.
if this is a certain dpe from the upstate area, then i am sorry to hear. Have heard some not so good things and have heard of tons of people failing.
Glad to hear you passed it after all! It's a very hard rating to get, but it makes flying so much easier and powerful once you have it. I struggled a lot when I learned to fly IFR manually, and I hated it. Now I fly XC IFR (on AP) all the time regardless of WX, and I love it :)
Unpopular Opinion: Anyone who took a checkride with her knows exactly who this is. In her defense, she followed the ACS line by line and was extremely professional with some of the personality you described.The ride I took with her was more than fair. She was extremely detailed and expected you to know the material. Most people are use to taking cakewalk rides. She's by the book. Just as fair in the plane. The items you missed are in the ACS AOI 1.Task C. Airspace is something you sort of need to know in avaiton(page 4). AOI 1. IR.I.A.K3 (Basic Med)(page 2). You didn't make it past the 4th page of the ACS before you started to struggle. She probably noticed that and started to dig. She hits Basic med hard. All you had to do was pull up the AC which is allowed to do. I honestly don't think you have a leg to stand on.
For future and current aviatiors. In life, especially with DPEs, the first impression is the only impression. Why tell her you called the FSDO if you flew what she wanted. All you had to say was. Hey, I wanted you to know I flew the "250 nm" cross country last night to meet the IFR requirements. It might have helped you. But it felt like you were trying to one up her, then tell her she's wrong but you did what she wanted anyway. It wasn't necessary.
As an outsider looking in, you may have come off as unintentionally arrogant. She may have felt like you were challenging her. I know it sounds. Pilots are A types. Sometimes saying Yes Sir or Mam. Is more important than being technically correct, especially if they are the gate keepers. Do what you need to do to pass the ride and talk about it AFTER.
This was NOTHING compared to South Florida. Try 2k for a ride. And everyone knows Bob will dress you down in the oral and in the plane. Do what you tried with her, with him, and you will have a bad day and the entire building will hear it.
You talk about professionalism. Why post this ? This is a really, really small community. Everyone will know who you are. just own it and move on. You're doing yourself a disservice by posting this. EVERYONE KNOWS who this. I bet she's seen it. Will your future employer want to be outted and blasted on TH-cam, which could cause lawsuits. You're playing with fire, man. Not trying to be your dad but trying to help. Live your life.
The info on the DPE is real. I didn't have any on her. I went in blind and did fine. My ride was FAR from perfect. Some DPEs are different. But I knew who was going to pass or fail with her before they even walked in the room.
Come over prepared to every checkride.
I haven't flown in years but I'll never forget my check ride for my PPL. The DPE actually yelled at me for doing something on the checklist (carb heat or pitot heat) and then complained that I was descending too slow, took the controls and pushed the airspeed into the yellow to descend faster. I passed, but lost a ton of confidence.
Thank you for sharing this experience, I have learned to listen to my inner voice more. In the past, I have pushed on like you and have been burned. I totally, I get the pressure to muscle through things-UGH!
I love this guy’s attitude and transparency. “Annoying speed bump in an otherwise smooth ride”
Hey brotha, I have been flying professionally for 40+ years and can tell you that bought back a memory of a very similiar experience I had many years ago. I’ve had a smooth career . Passed multiple checkrides thru ATP, passed multiple 135/121 , type rides, currency rides, Orals etc. But there is that one “unsat” that haunts me. You seem to have it wired and got it together. Good job keeping your cool! Love your Mooney BTW
Hey Tom, sorry to hear about your experience. No checkride is a joyride but your was definitely something to be rattle by. You mentioned you are working on your commercial - so do I, in my M20E. Let's see who passes first, I'd love your take on the power off 180 in the Mooney, I'm struggling a lot with this.
At least it’s not hard for people to figure out who this DPE is, definitely needs to be on the FAA’s radar. Also put a stop to her cash cow of $900 for a IFR Checkride.
Any chance she also has a YT channel?
Wow! I would have immediately cancelled, after she was already having an attitude. Sorry to hear this happened to you man. Your video is very informative. I have flown with some horrible instructors, and DPE’s as well. I’m currently training for my IR also. By the way, I’m jealous of your Mooney; I am in the process of restoring mine. 😎👍
Wow, crazy story.. I'd Call FAA, like you said who's dream has she crushed and put a stain on their record just looking for more money. Sounds like someone who would fail someone just to pocket an extra $500 from retake! Just sucks doing a checkrides with DPE's is so random and almost 50/50 outcome sometimes.. Good advise and I'll be vetting hard before any of mine in the future. Thanks
She's mad you mentioned her name to the FSDO because they've been firing DPEs for less things than what she did and she's worried you've put the spotlight on her. She can control the narrative when she reaches out to the FSDO first. Follow up with the FSDO, many both good and bad DPEs have been fired recently and we need to make sure that they get the right ones.
Man, did not know you fly planes. Your videos were awesome, pre-modern and bs internet.
After explaining the part about the person coming to get a drink, I began to think about get-there-itis. You wanted to finish the checkride regardless, and perseverance is a good character trait…usually.
Thank you for relaying your story. I had a crazy experience with a CFI and in hindsight should have also discontinued, but I didn’t and it cost more than I wanted.
SOUNDS like that DPE was a problem. My private and instrument check rides each at some point involved trying to get me distracted about stuff not related to the flight.
I cannot imagine trying to do a youtube video while flying and airplane. It is bad enough when people do it while driving a car.
One of the things I hate is when the DPE does things differently than the way you were taught to do it or the way you normally do it, and insists that you do things their way. I failed my first commercial helicopter check ride after I came up about 4 miles off from my destination airport. I have always flown with my sectional chart in a "north up" orientation on my knee board, or in the NORMAL orientation so that you can read all of the text. Apparently the examiner had a habit of turning his sectional charts in a "track up" orientation, and insisted that I do the same. I told him it was confusing, but he didn't care. Of course I Borderline got lost, and failed my check ride.
I’m going to support the previous comments and support reporting this DPE.
Very informative, and equally entertaining...❤❤❤❤ keep up the good work
I went to Knoxville downtown for my ppl check ride and took it with this 86 yr old named Bob Davidson. He farted the whole time and screamed at me during the flying portion but he passed me lol.
Sorry to hear about that man. You took this way better than me I would have spazzed out on her. I’m glad to hear you aced your 2nd attempt with a normal DPE.
Ok this sounds like a DPE in our area who failed like 8 of 10 students. He charges $1000 per checkride. The CFIs at our school stopped booking students with him because he seemed to be looking to fail students.
I don't know about it now but back in the day it was not uncommon for DPEs to have issues with the FAA if too many applicants pass. Like quotas traffic cops may have each day.
You need to notify the FAA about this person . In fact just send the FAA this video and let them hear what you have to say about it. This examiner needs to be removed from being able to give an flight exam. Also, it’s amazing she price gouged you of $900
sorry you had a crappy experience with a DPE, best of luck on your commercial! i’m in the middle of my instrument and excited to get past this checkride as well, totally agree with what you said “a stupid bump in an otherwise smooth ride.” safe flying man!
Sorry to hear this story! She was definitely not dialed in! Very unfortunate to be unprofessional for such an important flight test! Things will catch up with her eventually!
Yes, please do aviation a favor and let the FSDO know what happened with this DPE. That was insane.
Sounds like on the contrary she would pass an applicant on a check ride perhaps if they stroked her ego rather than based on pilot skill. Dangerous DPE.
I would say some of her actions like offering Starbucks could be seen as stress reducing for the candidate but the rest is a bit BS espEcially breaching your privacy.
$600 for a checkride!? Where I train out of (San Diego) the lowest I’ve heard of is $800… most charge $900 and that was for my private, instrument, commerical, CFII and my CFI was $1600
My instrument checkride DPE left me and several others hanging. After the oral exam (I passed easily), turned out there was a minor mechanical issue with the airplane that wasn't present the day before. It had to be grounded, so we discontinued. Once it was back on the flight line a few days later, I started calling and texting that DPE to schedule the practical exam. No response. 60 days came and went, now I have to re-do the oral exam. There are so few DPEs in my area, and all are busy flying commercially and don't return calls or texts. So 60 days went by. Even my CFII has been trying to get a DPE for me and his other students. That same DPE who left me hanging did the same to several other students in my flight school, some had discontinued, one or two needed a re-test. We're all walking around shell-shocked.
I considered contacting the local FSDO however I believe the FAA will not revoke that DPE's privileges (or Tom's first DPE's privileges) because no FARs were violated. They just behaved extremely unprofessionally, which is not illegal.
Meanwhile I'm flying every Saturday with my CFII, and continually going over the oral exam knowledge. It's been a nightmare. Suggestions are welcomed.
I failed my instrument check ride too. But, my experience was WAAAAY different. During all of my training, I used NOS charts. The night before my check ride, my Jeppesen charts arrived, leather binder and all. I was soooooo juiced.
I flew several approaches really well, and then the VOR into somewhere (hell, it's been a while). I flew a nearly perfect approach to DME minima, but the aircraft didn't have DME installed. The examiner asked if the aircraft had DME and I said no.
Note: NOS charts list the minimums without DME first, and then with DME (cause if you use NOS charts you are poor?).
Jeppesen charts list the minimums with DME first, and then without (cause if you use Jeppesen, you are rich and fly well equipped aircraft).
Long story short, I had to do it over. The re-fly was pretty easy, because the examiner knew I'd flunked before for "new charts". In fact, he even said "I've never flunked anyone for new charts before!", But damn! You went through the wringer. Luckily, I think I gave John Green about $200 each, for Private, Commercial and Instrument - but it was the 1980s.
Glad you found someone else for #2!
I had a somewhat similar thing happened at the Airlines. I taped the debrief and wrote down the whole experience. Then reported the guy to the union. Sucks but you’ve got to keep these folks accountable.
"Maybe she's out there doing this to other people..." Bingo. Given her earlier comments, I'd bet she is.
Please, help the community and take a few minutes to share your experience with the FSDO.
Her behavior was grossly unprofessional and nobody who's putting in the kind of time/money/effort required to get their certificate/rating should be subjected to that kind of experience.
I’m not going to comment on the DPE, she has received more attention than she needs or deserves. Good on you for dealing with the failure, resetting and passing. Some people would have given up, you kept it going and now educating others. You are truly PIC…Cheers to yeah 🍺🍺🍺🍺.
Tom man you have to report this DPE this is outrageous brother
I did 🙂
Think about how you're going to frame this checkride horror story during your interview(s) for future positions. You have an UnSat on your record. It's going to come up during interviews. You've got to frame your answer in a way that you take full responsibility for it, and you learned from it. So sorry that you had this crazy experience. Keep on flying and enjoy the rest of your training! BTW, jealous of your E Model. Everyone's Mooney is somehow faster than my '69 F.