🔌 This week’s Unplugged with the Elac speakers bit.ly/4dk0ERA or amzn.to/3Xu8qSW! Check the description for all the rest! 🔌Questions about the new Elac Debut? Watch the full review here th-cam.com/video/B3JKqEBf91w/w-d-xo.html 😀If you enjoyed this video, please hit the 👍 Like button! Watch every UNPLUGGED here bit.ly/43NnDkT 🙏Please stay on topic & be respectful. ⬆Channel Policies and FTC Disclosures are available in the description box above.
Why haven’t you accepted Danny Richie’s invitation to visit his facility and evaluate his work on our behalf, whether it’s his open baffle designs as well as the crossover upgrades. Don’t be like Gene Della Salla at Audioholics and wimp out with lame excuses. Danny’s upgrades are all about crossover parts quality as well as ensuring driver integration and smooth response
@@stephenyoud6125 If the "invitation" I believe you are referencing is the one he made in that ridiculous video that he and Ron put out suggesting that before he sent out his product for review, you needed to come to his facility to be trained on how to listen to and evaluate his/any product respectfully, that wasn't an invitation; that was nothing more than a man set out to belittle other reviewers. Even if we were to take his invitation as genuine, why would we travel to a facility (on our own dime, no less) to review his product rather than review it in our space like every other product from any other brand? Would you accept such a requirement from another brand, or would you see it as an attempt to influence the review or reviewer? Rather than ask us why we haven't accepted an "invitation," why not ask yourself what makes his product different from any other. Why shouldn't his product be reviewed in the reviewer's space where it will have the opportunity to be tested and compared to its peers and be treated no differently than any other product, especially since he claims to have superior products or offers a fix for? I can tell you that if Elac had told us we had to come wherever they are to listen and review their product, there's no way we would have said yes. And I have a feeling if that had been the requirement, the audience would not have seen it as a gracious invitation to "visit" their facility. To be clear, this is our policy regardless of the brand or product. From our perspective, "reviews" that take place off-site and are controlled by the manufacturer aren't really reviews but rather advertisements for a product. I take no issue with anyone who feels differently, brands that do them, or reviewers that participate in those scenarios. We simply don't do them, and if we ever did, there would be no confusion that it was any but a sponsored project and not a "review." I really hope this helps explain our position.
Please do include comments on speakers or Amps that you found not to work or had issues. Even if its a quality control or firmware requirement cause, its still very important to know about in case your viewers were considering buying them. Even if its tacked on the end of these Unplugged videos as Unhonourable mentions.
This episode is a fantastic episode! The "What do you want from us" rhetorical remark from Kristi was suitable for most any situation, except maybe going through the drive-thru of a fast-food restaurant! And I whole-heartedly agree with Andrew about who cares what is inside the box! If you are questioning that then I advise you to build your own speakers and join a speaker -building website or group. I shall quit while I am still civil before my '70s upbringing comes into play...
People like Andrew Jones and Peter Comeau are 'famous', not only because they are good designers, but also because they are charismatic representatives for their brand.
@@ganck1147 I get it and can’t argue if it sounds good who cares about what kind of parts are used in the crossover. But you know that kind of talk is blasphemy among audiophiles!😂
I have to go part way and agree with Danny on this one. Part way in that you don't need to spend $250-$500 on upgrades to hear the improvements. A $50 investment in better parts for a 2 way speaker like this can help a lot! Why don't the company's just do it and sell them for $75 more and really impress the hell out of everyone? Oh that's right, nobody would upgrade to the $1,200 speakers.
@@johnloupis9344 Personally I’d rather see the manufacturers invest the money in making the cabinets more inert versus upgrading crossover components. I definitely hear cabinet issues long before capacitor type!
So this is kinda why i remember Andrew Jones became famous. This was during the bit of hubub in the early 2010s where rare earth minerals skyrocketed in price and Andrew had moved over to Pioneer Consumer and he made the best speaker he could with the affordable materials he had on hand. Ceramic magnets instead of neodymium and the like. The home theatre speakers ended up winning awards left and right. And that is when he kinda became the champion for high quality audio not needing to cost an arm and a leg.
One of the most enjoyable audiophile episodes I’ve seen till now on YT. As an ELAC debut 6.2 floorstanders, my entire setup (and the room playing a major part) sounds better than most rooms I’ve heard at audio shows.
13 years ago I bought a Sony budget home theater system. The sound wasn't bad and the speakers just held it's own. Then, in 2022 I bought a NAD 701 receiver and connected the Sony SS MSP3000 speakers to it and oh my goodness the sound that came out of those speakers were so good.
Thank you for this episode, it was really needed for some to hear. One of my favorite speaker lines is the NHT super line original designed by Ken Kantor. Silk dome tweeter and a paper cone woofer. The whole line sounds great. All be it basic cabinet finish, still looks good. For the price I don't care what parts NHT used or what crossovers they use, I love the sound and performance. That's after owning speakers from Energy, SVS, definitive technology, and yamaha NS 690ii. I'm not a speaker designer and i dont care to pretend be one. Thank you guys for doing what you do!
Not to state the obvious, but Andrew Jones is the rare engineer who is also a natural born salesman. That's the difference. He goes out and sells whatever he designs. He likes taking to people and he likes talking about his metier. Not your typical engineer. ;)
Chris Brunhaver Is a name worth mentioning for good reason. Listening to the Aspen series of speakers from PS Audio is quite an experience. the sound is nothing short of amazing and IMO a better value, comparable to price points of the top competitors. Just an all-around great sound.
I've seen people take both Xbox and a bluray player on a short range trip, one of those first gen players that took seemingly 3 minutes to load the disc and had unskipable commercials.
If we're vacationing somewhere by car, we take the Beosound A5 or as my partner calls it, "the lunchbox." Really like that it connects to both Bluetooth and wifi and it's super easy to carry to the backyard.
Kevlar is a specifiic formulation of a generall classification of para aramid polymer fibers patented by Dupont . In other words aramid is a type of plastic.. Aramid fiber has an excellent tensile strength to mass ratio due to its long chained molecular structure .
Just wanted to say..... I really appreciate that you put up images for us to see. Adds to my enjoyment seeing the visual that goes with the name. Thank You 😁🙏
Bought a pair of Dynaudio Special 40s last year...best speakers I've ever owned! I only listen to LPs, and these speakers are perfectly designed to reproduce that beautiful vinyl warmth. They're driven by a Yamaha AS-1200 amp...great show, by the way. Always enjoy your content.
A lot of high end speaker companies have what is called a mass loaded speaker. They use sand or concrete and put something heavy on the top. I'm a fan of that design and I make my speaker cabinets tops and bottoms 3" thick and multi layered. My whole cabinet is multi layered.75 MDF flexible industrial adhesive and I cover that with solid hardwood 75" thick. And they are like knocking on concrete . The best portable Bluetooth speaker I have ever heard is a full range 3 way with 2" 4" aluminum reference mids #2 1" titanium tweeters and a 5.5 subwoofer that has 9mm x max with a 8 " passive radiator on the back that goes down to 35 hz. , it's solid oak with the baffle wrapped in leather. I wanted a speaker I could take with me that was full range and sounds beautiful with separation and sound stage and I couldn't find anything that just wasn't a bass box so I designed and built it.
The problem is that people feel entitled to complain thanks to the internet about anything they’ll never touch, look at again, or own in the first place. A lot of people that complain about plasticky construction most like have never seen the speaker in person and never will. Those are not the core audience of this hobby. Just noise. The whole thing with replacing in your speaker internals to make it better is the same a buying a Toyota Corolla base model, adding a supercharger and a turbo to it cause the regular one doesn’t have enough power. How about you buy a car with more power from get go?! Like come on. Put one dollar a jar reminded me of that video: you know how much you’ll have if you put away a dollar a day for a year? Roughly 30 thousand. 😂 I think this speaker hit it out of the park at its price point. You guys always deliver the realistic review and information. People just like to justify anything and everything today, regardless of how good or bad it could be or is. That’s why your channel and your opinions are so good and helpful when people actually start listening and understanding the message you’re trying to convey. Great conversation so far. And I’m still watching. Hope Kristi is feeling much better and you both are having a lovely Friday!
I had a bit in this video talking about cars and adding a supercharger, so it's funny you mentioned the same thing. I touched upon how you can juice the engine all you want, but if the car wasn't designed to handle the power, for example, it can't handle the added torque or corner worth a shit, you just spent money for worse performance. Everyone is good here. Hope all is well on your end!
There is something wrong to think speaker designers are “gods” and their designs can not be improved ! Some people just like to improve any product they buy and get great enjoyment to make improvements. If you don’t have a technical mind and can’t figure out things you shouldn’t look down on people who can !
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Speaking of Goldenear, I don't recall seeing you review one of their products yet. I have always been intrigued by them. Do you have any contacts with Goldenear regarding review product? I have been eyeballing the ForceField 30 subs for future upgrades when I recover from my recent Paradigm and Emotiva upgrade.
Andrew, Your comments about Elac speakers, and budget speaker construction made me smile from ear-to-ear! I had a pair of ENERGY 3 speakers (mid-80s vintage) that simply out performed MANY of my friend's more "bespoke" bookshelf speakers (above 80 hz). Their components lasted about 25 years before having issues. A great (!) investment of mere $250/pair. Thanks for your channel and both of your perspectives.
Andrew, did ever came across Pearl Acoustics Sibelius speakers? Maybe u are able to review them in the future… Harley Lovegrove seems to be a nice guy and will send you a pair 😉
The brofest with Andrew Jones comes down to one word… PRESENTATION. Andrew Jones gives the best presentations by far of any other audio designer. If you’ve never been to one of his presentations then do yourself a favor. Then you’ll understand. By the way, he’s a twin. Most people don’t know that about him.
I always say speakers are very very subjective!! Cost doesnt mean a speaker will be good or not, you expect more from higher end and more costly speakers
Yes Andrew, don’t spend $200 on Modifying a $ 400 speaker, but I there are two examples of successful companies using really cheap parts that Compromise Sound. The two standouts in this category are magnapan and Klipsch. Both use poor Quality crossover parts, and both lack attention to proper bracing for economical reasons. I have modified both the speakers brands for friends that have made a worthwhile improvement. Now, for reference, I have built many loudspeakers. A few were terrible when I started the rest, pretty good to great, but I did come across a pair of Vandersteen fives that I could not improve on.
People are coming for the look of these? Damn, to me they look sleek and very nice to be honest, kind of a mesh between old school design and this futuristic hifi look we are getting more and more nowadays.
I love the Focal Theva . I’d buy the Elac and a sub . When Focal replaces the Theva with a new model I’ll buy the Thevas for half price just like I did with the Choas you showed us . I’m still loving my R700s too . Thank you 🙏 both so much for showing us and sharing with us all these things you both do such a great job with this I hope to follow you to much higher success that you both deserve . Buying the Elacs with 2 REL T5x subs for my mom’s room . 🎉❤
I do have a crush on AJ. However, I don't like guys, but I've had 2 of his designs. Seriously speaking, he's a nice guy who answers when you have a question. For real.
This was a great and fun video! Based on The review and the follow-up, I am probably going to purchase a pair of these! By the way, Andrew, my next speaker after the Elacs, will be a speaker with a crossover made of paper cups! 😅
I hate that guy . He thinks he is always and only the right person on earth to design a speaker electronic component. Just trying to sell his garbage as snake oil or unobtanium or whatever you call it.
i have watched some guys saying, iron core this, air-core that, put a brass nut on the binding post...blah, blah, blah...I say - you should design and sell a speaker yourself. i agree with you guys. if you think you have to buy a set of speakers only to tear them apart and spend more money fixing them, sounds dumb to me. because the people that do it, didn't "fix" anything, they just turned that speaker into something else entirely and if that's what you're after, buy something else to begin with. redundant, but i just had to get that rant out because your justified argument struck a nerve with me as well.
I've had some fun in the speaker rebuilding arena. It is its own hobby, but it's not a cost-effective hobby. However, modding is an accessible hobby, where so much tech in the electronics arena requires considerable skill. Also, most of the changes to a speaker are reversible. It's best to play with older speakers, where who cares, but modding a new speaker is definitely a head scratcher.
Many cannot build a nice cabinet, but can upgrade parts or slopes in crossovers, add bracing, better insulation, add a damping layer, reglue boxes (yes, some companies do this poorly), and it makes sense to start with a modern speaker with fresh drivers… I have fixed a lot of old speakers and also completely rebuilt two pair with new drivers, x-overs, and all - the rebuild can be fantastic… Many of the recent modern retro style speakers prove that people want classic design and current drivers and parts
@@andrewrobinsonreviews ha ha. I wish I could say I do. I've chatted with him at a show, seen so many interviews and it's very clear that he's well dialed into the reviewer scene here and elsewhere for sure. He is aware of all the TH-cam reviewers, he searches for reviews of his stuff. He's not the type that is a hermit buried in a dark lab working on designs 24 hours a day. He's connected to the TH-cam reviewer community, he learns from reviews and comments. He knows you guys, there is no question and has seen the reviews you have done of his designs.
Suitcase question is easy for me, a pair of Morel Biggie Powered Bluetooth speakers with battery power that would be super useful on an island. These speakers sound fantastic from their 7"×7"×4.5" profile. Best of all, a pair is only $600.
You need review the new Danish speaker. Radiant Acoustics Clarity 6.2. Design by the best people from Denmark. Heard them today, driven by Lyngdorf TDAI-3400. Its was fantastic
Andrew & Kristi you are one of those TH-camrs that make me look forward to next ”episode” Awesome! 👍🏼 I would be super duper happy if you could answer this question. I have a high end dedicated home theater. But for my budget tv/2ch system. Which one would YOU choose, Elac Debut 3.0 B6.3 or Klipsch RP-600m ii? Ignore any price difference. I like a dynamic sound with clear dialog. But as i said, which one would you choose? Happy weekend./From Sweden🇸🇪😊
The more dynamic and contrasty of the two speakers, that is, the sensation of greater bass with perhaps "higher" highs is going to be the Klipsch. Will it be more intelligible, that I can't say for certain. The better all-round speaker that is likely to be more agreeable or neutral, that's the ELAC all the way.
I don’t think I had heard of Andrew Jones before he got to Pioneer, and I recall them using his name in product marketing. Few if any other speaker ads/descriptions call out their designer like that.
Since Definitive Technology and Polk are part of the same company, can I mix those 2 brands for my 2 fronts and center. The Reserve line is pretty similar to the current Def Tech line.
I know what is in my speakers because I built and designed and built them and I like them to look like a piece of furniture. I think Andrew Jones is well known because he does interviews and most designers are interverts. My opinion on cones is that I like a paper blend. I paper sounds natural and the blends are lighter and faster. Aluminum and other compounds ring more when they break up. I don't like polypropylene, I think it sounds like Tupperware.
Regarding inefficient budget speakers, I would add that typically budget speakers are smaller bookshelf type speakers, in part to save on cabinet costs. More difficult to get outstanding efficiency from a small two-way, regardless of the price point.
Thank you Andrew and Kristi for all of your hard work. I currently run a 2.1 setup with a Denon X3700 with Polk R600 and a SVS SB-3000. I enjoy my speakers and cannot replace them even if I wanted to. They are grandfathered in (WAF) to our space. If I replace the X3700 with the Marantz M1, would the R600 sound/perform significantly better? Our listening is 70/30 movies/music. Also, please try to review the Denon Home Amp. I, and I’m sure many of your viewers, would love to hear your comparison to the M1. Thank you for your insight.
If you use the X3700's room correction, there's a chance the M1 would sound very different and may lead you to believe it's not as good, or that your speakers sound "different" through it (the M1) versus the Denon. If you don't use Audyssey for room correction, the M1 might sound more controlled and authoritative. But you will give up room correction and that could be the difference maker if you're used to your speakers being better tailored to your room. Thanks for your support!
@@txerapng Life is good! Speaking of the moon, did you see the harvest moon / partial eclipse on Tuesday? I've never seen the moon look so bright and clear. Glad you're well!!
@@KristiWright I haven't seen the moon this week, but some great things have happened to me, that I have not still processed completely, i am really excited. Heard the TV is up in the backyard, its getting closer to finished isn't it?
@@txerapng That's awesome!! Yes, the TV is up. We have some outdoor furniture arriving today. I think the pool is officially done. All that's left is a polish of the tiles to clean them up. The team is doing a second coat of concrete on the privacy wall, so we don't see the cinder blocks. Up next: painting the wall, landscaping and more outdoor furnishings. There's also plans for outdoor audio but it may be a while before that happens.
What makes a good box speaker? It's not a difficult formula. A stout, well braced non resonant box w/ rounded edges. Drivers w/ smooth responses that roll off gently and have little stored energy. Tweeters closely spaced to mid woof to maintain vertical phase alignment. Crossover w/ quality poly caps and air coil inductors and quality resisters designed to blend drivers properly and maintain phase. And no damn ferrous metal anywhere in the signal chain. Paint it w/ truck be liner and sell affordably or wrap in exotic veneer and sell for serious money. but it will sound good.
LOL on the crossover parts, but here's the kicker they matter... Try it yourself, I have. A sand cast resistor on a tweeter is an easy part to change out. The irony is it makes a huge sonic difference. Had a pair of bookshelf polk speakers back in the day and the crossover was the size of the binding post. Never understood why it sounded horrid till I saw that. Of course it was probably the mix of parts and probably didn't measure well either. Still I have a high end diy speaker and didn't think it mattered either till I change a resistor on the tweeter. Just one resistor opened it up sonically in a way I'll never forget. So I moved on and replaced some capacitors on the woofer. Here is the thing I didn't hear a change there and went from clarity caps to mundorfs (expensive change). It didn't make much if any difference to me. So it depends on the network and what is changed. The reality is that everyone builds to a price point. No one has great parts at an amazing price. It just doesn't happen. I have a set of 15k speakers that still have sand cast resistors. They also have steel core inductors as well which hold a magnetic charge. I'm not saying boutique parts make all the difference in the world, but they do matter. The issue is you get to the point of diminishing returns very quick. Maybe one of these days I'll rebuild my bookshelf speaker with junk crossovers and put it up so people can hear the difference.
While parts and overall construction matters, the point is that when the sound is great or what someone desires, then what does it actually matter? If you change parts in your speakers I hope you like them more but that difference doesn't equal better for all. The same applies to cables and measurements
Great episode & I agree 100% about people just wanting to pick apart a product out of context. On that note... It seems that a lot of people are misinformed about these speakers & where they fit into the overall Elac speaker range. During the video when Kristi was talking about past Elac speakers you reviewed, the photo you showed was the Debut Reference 2.0 which is one tier above & $300 more the new entry Debut 3.0. It seems that a lot of people think these are the only speaker Elac makes. They have 4 speaker lines in their "Home" or budget range & 6 speaker lines in their "Premium" range. The home range retail prices top out @ $1199 for a pair of bookshelf's & $1199 each for the floorstand. The premium range tops out @ $3499 for the pair of bookshelf's & $42,999.00 for the Concentro floorstand......... Context really matters!!
I agree and disagree with you. Disagreement: parts do matter and driver differences is all marketing. Good example on the parts front are the Purifi midranges and woofers. These are high excursion, low distortion drivers as in higher excursion with lower distortion than previous drivers have been. These are expensive drivers and I think there are applications where these drivers can make a big difference (like 2-way bookshelf designs). Are they a game changer? No. Drivers like these can simplify the crossover by operating over a bigger frequency range or playing lower into the bass area than other similarly sized drivers. At the end of the day, these drivers are one more option a designer may have, depending on the price point he or she is designing to. I will grant you this, most speaker driver development has been restricted to refinements of well known driver topologies. I don’t see any particular one as necessarily better, more as options for a designer. Where I totally agree is that no one should get caught up on parts, be they drivers or crossover parts. As an audiophile, your concern should be how well whatever is in your speaker has been implemented. And you judge that with your ears. I also agree that upgrades are questionable. You may be unhappy with your speakers, but you may not know why and certainly not how to fix it. The easiest path is either to just live with your speakers or buy a new pair more pleasing to your ears. Instead of parts/materials, audiophiles should focus on basic design configurations, not in terms of sound, but in terms of whether it will work in your listening room. Open baffle speakers are a good example of this. They can sound great, but they need to be out in the room. If you don’t have the space or the SAF to get them out into the room, they won’t work for you because they simply will not sound good placed close to the wall. Rear ported speaker can offer enhanced bass performance due to the bass reinforcement from the back wall, but you need some placement flexibility to find the position where the bass works best in your room. The point is that some designs will work better in your room than others and you need to understand what those designs are. This is overlooked FAR too often.
Youre not gonna get all the efficiency out of those elacs with a wimm amp unless you mono block somehow. I tried the elac unifi ub52 2.0s with a yahama as801 and it didnt work for me.
I have the Carina's and the RZ50 won't run them. They're quite a bit harder to drive than the debut's. It's fine for movies, but stereo listening forget it. I invested in the OSD Nero HTA7200 and 🤌 Magnefiique!
The waveguide on the tweeter for the Elac 3.0s is not as big and deep as the Arendals but I think that type of waveguide is something we will see more of from speaker designers. It just gives so much better off axis performance. I'm a bit turned off by the vertical jewelry on the Elac tweeter waveguide but if Kristi likes it, I love it lol
Based on the title, I know exactly what's inside my speakers. I built two pairs based on the Parts-Express house brand, Dayton Audio. Anyone else heard of D.B. Keele, a speaker designer from way back? My Electro Voice horns were designed by him.
Let me preface this by saying, I love you guys and I'm just playing devils advocate when I say this... When you say "who cares" what the crossover parts are, understand that is an important factor for some people. Some people don't mind spending extra for quality parts even if the return on sound is negligable/incremental. I think this much like how you guys enjoy expensive/quality furniture and probably don't mind spending thousands on say a stone/concrete media console, when a Ikea piece would hold up your equipment just as well. FYI, Id spend the thousands on the nicer piece too, if I had the means :)
I think the point of the "who cares" comment is that these are the base or entry line of passive speaker Elac makes in their "Home" or budget speaker range. @ $450 / pair you're going to spend the same or close to it on the replacement premium parts, plus your time to replace them, & then hope you don't screw something up along the way..... Just move up the the DB Reference or Unifi or Unifi Reference. If those aren't good enough then move up their "Premium" speakers like the Corina, Solano 2.0, Vela 2.0 or Concentro, that top out @ $43K for the floorstand speaker.
@@robinsonmac You understood my point regarding the ELAC Debut 3.0 and its price point. Most speakers getting modded aren't of the thousand-dollar or more variety; it's the budget stuff. For example, a pair of Klipsch 600M MKIIs retail for $649/pair, and a popular crossover kit that "fixes" their response sells for $369, which you have to void your warranty and install yourself. Regardless, the 600M MKIIs are "worth" $649, yet some enthusiasts are now spending $1018 on the same speakers. With a budget of $1,000 for a pair of speakers, one could likely look for a better speaker with a response that is more to their liking or neutral and does not need to be modified.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Thanks for the response. I think maybe people are trying or looking to get the sound of a higher priced speaker for a perceived bargain by upgrading? Like thinking why buy speaker "****" for $1200 when I can buy the Debut 3.0 for $450 upgrade the crossover for $375 & I saved $375. Which in their mind is the ultimate perceived speaker value....... Also, thanks for the Monitor Audio Bronze 100 comparison! The Urban Grey color of the 100's are $450 right now.
Good viewpoints, would it be possible to do a review on the GR Research X-LS Encore bookshelf kit speakers, with the full upgrade, if you contact them I am sure they can send you an already built pair to review, and we can all find out how $900 kit speakers compare in this category of $500-$1200 speakers.
Speaking of Pioneer, there was a pair of PIONEER CS-R780 speakers on the side of my street this week. They are 4 ways! I don’t think I had heard of that before 😮
Well, since you asked “what do you want from us“, here’s my question. The interior architecture of the new Onkyo RZ 70 is completely different in appearance from the RZ 50. I’m wondering if you have any knowledge if this was designed by a new group of peopleto fight the overheating and HDMI issues that Onkyos have had for a while? I’ve been hoping for better quality and higher dependability for a while and I’m wondering if this is the first step? Thanks!
The RZ70 was designed by a new team at Klipsch/Onkyo and is an all-new design for Onkyo, whereas the RZ50 had some carry-over from the previous teams or generations.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Thanks Andrew! Have you heard any feedback or gotten any information about whether the new design is more dependable, more effective, or generally better to make it worth the nearly 3K msrp?
It isn't always "Of course they gonna use the cheapest parts!" Buchardt has used fancy parts for their crossover of the S400 MKII. Andrew Jones uses the cheap yellow and white components for his MoFi speakers.
Even a pretty large bookshelf speaker will fit in a suitcase 😅 Also, crossovers, i once saw a speaker breakdown showing crossovers so huge i thought they would need their own heat sink 😮❤
Hi AR & KW! I was hoping for a Klipsch comparison. I have a friend who wants to set up a small 5.1 system (his first) and was wondering which speaker you would go with on a budget system. Thanks!
Andrew Jones is known for maximizing what a design can do, no matter what the budget for development of a speaker is. When it comes to electronics Schiit heads in a similar direction.
So did I along with their cable risers and cryo-treated cables. I never heard a difference between their stock cables or cryo-cables, and I always thought their "bagged" interconnects were cool, but yeah, they played fast and loose with reality on a few of their tweaks.
![วันเกิดเธอ (TO YOU) - PHUWIN [ OFFICIAL MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/_ROx1Bj3T0Y/mqdefault.jpg)
🔌 This week’s Unplugged with the Elac speakers bit.ly/4dk0ERA or amzn.to/3Xu8qSW! Check the description for all the rest!
🔌Questions about the new Elac Debut? Watch the full review here th-cam.com/video/B3JKqEBf91w/w-d-xo.html
😀If you enjoyed this video, please hit the 👍 Like button! Watch every UNPLUGGED here bit.ly/43NnDkT 🙏Please stay on topic & be respectful.
⬆Channel Policies and FTC Disclosures are available in the description box above.
Why haven’t you accepted Danny Richie’s invitation to visit his facility and evaluate his work on our behalf, whether it’s his open baffle designs as well as the crossover upgrades. Don’t be like Gene Della Salla at Audioholics and wimp out with lame excuses. Danny’s upgrades are all about crossover parts quality as well as ensuring driver integration and smooth response
@@stephenyoud6125 If the "invitation" I believe you are referencing is the one he made in that ridiculous video that he and Ron put out suggesting that before he sent out his product for review, you needed to come to his facility to be trained on how to listen to and evaluate his/any product respectfully, that wasn't an invitation; that was nothing more than a man set out to belittle other reviewers.
Even if we were to take his invitation as genuine, why would we travel to a facility (on our own dime, no less) to review his product rather than review it in our space like every other product from any other brand? Would you accept such a requirement from another brand, or would you see it as an attempt to influence the review or reviewer? Rather than ask us why we haven't accepted an "invitation," why not ask yourself what makes his product different from any other. Why shouldn't his product be reviewed in the reviewer's space where it will have the opportunity to be tested and compared to its peers and be treated no differently than any other product, especially since he claims to have superior products or offers a fix for? I can tell you that if Elac had told us we had to come wherever they are to listen and review their product, there's no way we would have said yes. And I have a feeling if that had been the requirement, the audience would not have seen it as a gracious invitation to "visit" their facility.
To be clear, this is our policy regardless of the brand or product. From our perspective, "reviews" that take place off-site and are controlled by the manufacturer aren't really reviews but rather advertisements for a product. I take no issue with anyone who feels differently, brands that do them, or reviewers that participate in those scenarios. We simply don't do them, and if we ever did, there would be no confusion that it was any but a sponsored project and not a "review." I really hope this helps explain our position.
Please do include comments on speakers or Amps that you found not to work or had issues. Even if its a quality control or firmware requirement cause, its still very important to know about in case your viewers were considering buying them. Even if its tacked on the end of these Unplugged videos as Unhonourable mentions.
"Provided the app works"... LMFAO! Yeah, I have about $10,000 worth of Sonos kit - and that's exactly how I'm feeling at the moment.
Crossover parts? Sounds like some people are watching too many of Danny's videos 🤪
This episode is a fantastic episode! The "What do you want from us" rhetorical remark from Kristi was suitable for most any situation, except maybe going through the drive-thru of a fast-food restaurant! And I whole-heartedly agree with Andrew about who cares what is inside the box! If you are questioning that then I advise you to build your own speakers and join a speaker -building website or group. I shall quit while I am still civil before my '70s upbringing comes into play...
Yes, epic. lol
LMFAO!! "What do you want from us?" 😂 love it. Your new hashtag... hahaha
No kidding. I still laugh about that phrase.
It's fantastic!
That's a good one 😂😂😂
People like Andrew Jones and Peter Comeau are 'famous', not only because they are good designers, but also because they are charismatic representatives for their brand.
That is very true, and that can make a difference. Appreciate you watching!
OMG, you and Danny at GR Research would not see eye to eye with each other on crossover theories!!😂
I do agree with Andrew’s analogy on cars compared to speakers…
@@ganck1147
I get it and can’t argue if it sounds good who cares about what kind of parts are used in the crossover. But you know that kind of talk is blasphemy among audiophiles!😂
I have to go part way and agree with Danny on this one. Part way in that you don't need to spend $250-$500 on upgrades to hear the improvements. A $50 investment in better parts for a 2 way speaker like this can help a lot! Why don't the company's just do it and sell them for $75 more and really impress the hell out of everyone? Oh that's right, nobody would upgrade to the $1,200 speakers.
@@johnloupis9344
Personally I’d rather see the manufacturers invest the money in making the cabinets more inert versus upgrading crossover components.
I definitely hear cabinet issues long before capacitor type!
Andrew’s rants are so hilarious, the crossover one made me laugh so hard 😂
I'll be the first to invest in a startup that creates the first papercup crossover!
So this is kinda why i remember Andrew Jones became famous. This was during the bit of hubub in the early 2010s where rare earth minerals skyrocketed in price and Andrew had moved over to Pioneer Consumer and he made the best speaker he could with the affordable materials he had on hand. Ceramic magnets instead of neodymium and the like. The home theatre speakers ended up winning awards left and right. And that is when he kinda became the champion for high quality audio not needing to cost an arm and a leg.
One of the most enjoyable audiophile episodes I’ve seen till now on YT. As an ELAC debut 6.2 floorstanders, my entire setup (and the room playing a major part) sounds better than most rooms I’ve heard at audio shows.
13 years ago I bought a Sony budget home theater system. The sound wasn't bad and the speakers just held it's own. Then, in 2022 I bought a NAD 701 receiver and connected the Sony SS MSP3000 speakers to it and oh my goodness the sound that came out of those speakers were so good.
People try to pick apart products they've never heard in an attempt to justify the money they spent on something else.
Thank you for this episode, it was really needed for some to hear. One of my favorite speaker lines is the NHT super line original designed by Ken Kantor. Silk dome tweeter and a paper cone woofer. The whole line sounds great. All be it basic cabinet finish, still looks good. For the price I don't care what parts NHT used or what crossovers they use, I love the sound and performance. That's after owning speakers from Energy, SVS, definitive technology, and yamaha NS 690ii. I'm not a speaker designer and i dont care to pretend be one. Thank you guys for doing what you do!
Not to state the obvious, but Andrew Jones is the rare engineer who is also a natural born salesman. That's the difference. He goes out and sells whatever he designs. He likes taking to people and he likes talking about his metier. Not your typical engineer. ;)
Chris Brunhaver Is a name worth mentioning for good reason. Listening to the Aspen series of speakers from PS Audio is quite an experience. the sound is nothing short of amazing and IMO a better value, comparable to price points of the top competitors. Just an all-around great sound.
Taking your speakers when traveling is like taking your Xbox on vacation
Like taking a vacation, he question was meant to be fun.
I've seen people take both Xbox and a bluray player on a short range trip, one of those first gen players that took seemingly 3 minutes to load the disc and had unskipable commercials.
If we're vacationing somewhere by car, we take the Beosound A5 or as my partner calls it, "the lunchbox." Really like that it connects to both Bluetooth and wifi and it's super easy to carry to the backyard.
We call our A5 the lunchbox, too!
I don't know why, but Kristi is always on point. I agree 100 percent with her comments on the ELAC speakers.
Kevlar is a specifiic formulation of a generall classification of para aramid polymer fibers patented by Dupont . In other words aramid is a type of plastic.. Aramid fiber has an excellent tensile strength to mass ratio due to its long chained molecular structure .
I like ur brain space
Just wanted to say..... I really appreciate that you put up images for us to see. Adds to my enjoyment seeing the visual that goes with the name. Thank You 😁🙏
Here's my Friday thought, buy the speaker with the sound you like and be happy.
He's a genius.☝
Bazooka Gum Wrapper! (mic drop).... Love it!
Bought a pair of Dynaudio Special 40s last year...best speakers I've ever owned! I only listen to LPs, and these speakers are perfectly designed to reproduce that beautiful vinyl warmth. They're driven by a Yamaha AS-1200 amp...great show, by the way. Always enjoy your content.
A lot of high end speaker companies have what is called a mass loaded speaker. They use sand or concrete and put something heavy on the top. I'm a fan of that design and I make my speaker cabinets tops and bottoms 3" thick and multi layered. My whole cabinet is multi layered.75 MDF flexible industrial adhesive and I cover that with solid hardwood 75" thick. And they are like knocking on concrete . The best portable Bluetooth speaker I have ever heard is a full range 3 way with 2" 4" aluminum reference mids #2 1" titanium tweeters and a 5.5 subwoofer that has 9mm x max with a 8 " passive radiator on the back that goes down to 35 hz. , it's solid oak with the baffle wrapped in leather. I wanted a speaker I could take with me that was full range and sounds beautiful with separation and sound stage and I couldn't find anything that just wasn't a bass box so I designed and built it.
Loved the 'paper cup crossover' rant. So true.
Hot glued nickel, paperclip, twine and bazooka bubble gum wrapper crossovers are tight!
The problem is that people feel entitled to complain thanks to the internet about anything they’ll never touch, look at again, or own in the first place. A lot of people that complain about plasticky construction most like have never seen the speaker in person and never will. Those are not the core audience of this hobby. Just noise. The whole thing with replacing in your speaker internals to make it better is the same a buying a Toyota Corolla base model, adding a supercharger and a turbo to it cause the regular one doesn’t have enough power. How about you buy a car with more power from get go?! Like come on.
Put one dollar a jar reminded me of that video: you know how much you’ll have if you put away a dollar a day for a year? Roughly 30 thousand. 😂
I think this speaker hit it out of the park at its price point. You guys always deliver the realistic review and information. People just like to justify anything and everything today, regardless of how good or bad it could be or is. That’s why your channel and your opinions are so good and helpful when people actually start listening and understanding the message you’re trying to convey. Great conversation so far. And I’m still watching.
Hope Kristi is feeling much better and you both are having a lovely Friday!
I had a bit in this video talking about cars and adding a supercharger, so it's funny you mentioned the same thing. I touched upon how you can juice the engine all you want, but if the car wasn't designed to handle the power, for example, it can't handle the added torque or corner worth a shit, you just spent money for worse performance. Everyone is good here. Hope all is well on your end!
This comment 1,000,000 %
I’m very sorry that Andrew is coming between the two of you. He’s a home wrecker.
😂
hahah
There is something wrong to think speaker designers are “gods” and their designs can not be improved ! Some people just like to improve any product they buy and get great enjoyment to make improvements. If you don’t have a technical mind and can’t figure out things you shouldn’t look down on people who can !
Paul Klipsch was also a famous designer, there is also Dave Wilson and, Andy Payor and quite a few others.
Famous to those of us who nerd out on this stuff but not to most listeners or even average knowledge reviewers.
Hahaaaa....wrapped in a Bazooka bubblegum wrapper....laugh of the week, but it is damn true. thank you!
Sandy Gross can't be overlooked as a designer. Polk, Def Tech and Goldenear. 😘
Totally agree! Sandy is a legend.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Speaking of Goldenear, I don't recall seeing you review one of their products yet. I have always been intrigued by them. Do you have any contacts with Goldenear regarding review product? I have been eyeballing the ForceField 30 subs for future upgrades when I recover from my recent Paradigm and Emotiva upgrade.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Would it be possible to see a Goldenear speaker review in the future?
Go Greg Timbers. I love my JBL Studio 590's
Andrew,
Your comments about Elac speakers, and budget speaker construction made me smile from ear-to-ear!
I had a pair of ENERGY 3 speakers (mid-80s vintage) that simply out performed MANY of my friend's more "bespoke" bookshelf speakers (above 80 hz). Their components lasted about 25 years before having issues. A great (!) investment of mere $250/pair.
Thanks for your channel and both of your perspectives.
Andrew, did ever came across Pearl Acoustics Sibelius speakers? Maybe u are able to review them in the future… Harley Lovegrove seems to be a nice guy and will send you a pair 😉
Thanks a lot! Had a toxic electronics day yesterday so just picking up on my life. lol
The best part of Friday's! Thank you for my lunch break viewing pleasure!
So glad you could join us!
Great episode:) I got wharfedale diamond 230 floor standing. Spend £300 on sale in UK brand new. And love them. They sound so but so nice.
I love my bone stock Forte Fours. I'm sure there is a kit provider who would pick them apart, but I like them.
The brofest with Andrew Jones comes down to one word… PRESENTATION. Andrew Jones gives the best presentations by far of any other audio designer. If you’ve never been to one of his presentations then do yourself a favor. Then you’ll understand. By the way, he’s a twin. Most people don’t know that about him.
I always say speakers are very very subjective!! Cost doesnt mean a speaker will be good or not, you expect more from higher end and more costly speakers
Yes Andrew, don’t spend $200 on Modifying a $ 400 speaker, but I there are two examples of successful companies using really cheap parts that Compromise Sound. The two standouts in this category are magnapan and Klipsch. Both use poor Quality crossover parts, and both lack attention to proper bracing for economical reasons.
I have modified both the speakers brands for friends that have made a worthwhile improvement. Now, for reference, I have built many loudspeakers. A few were terrible when I started the rest, pretty good to great, but I did come across a pair of Vandersteen fives that I could not improve on.
I’m still rocking my Pioneer Andrew Jones SP-fs51s!!!
He's talented, charming, and photogenic.
People are coming for the look of these? Damn, to me they look sleek and very nice to be honest, kind of a mesh between old school design and this futuristic hifi look we are getting more and more nowadays.
AGREED...........The ELAC PRODUCT IS the best overall value in the industry ........PERIOD!!!!!
AMEN regarding the crossover!!!!!!
I love the Focal Theva . I’d buy the Elac and a sub . When Focal replaces the Theva with a new model I’ll buy the Thevas for half price just like I did with the Choas you showed us . I’m still loving my R700s too . Thank you 🙏 both so much for showing us and sharing with us all these things you both do such a great job with this I hope to follow you to much higher success that you both deserve . Buying the Elacs with 2 REL T5x subs for my mom’s room . 🎉❤
I do have a crush on AJ. However, I don't like guys, but I've had 2 of his designs. Seriously speaking, he's a nice guy who answers when you have a question. For real.
Welcome back Kristi
Thank you!
Andrew Jones is the Tom Ford of speaker design.
EDIT: I now need to build a Buffalo Nickel Bazooka Crossover.
🤭
You can only get that cross-over with my new speaker design, which has the world's first Faberge egg tweeter and unobtanium woofer.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Oh damn! Sign me up and shut up and take my money!! LOL
This was a great and fun video! Based on The review and the follow-up, I am probably going to purchase a pair of these! By the way, Andrew, my next speaker after the Elacs, will be a speaker with a crossover made of paper cups! 😅
GR research is the worst of this blasphemy
That guy loves screechingly bright speakers
@@metroboom25289- strange, since he typically adds padding resistors to bring tweeters down in level as part of his improvements
I hate that guy . He thinks he is always and only the right person on earth to design a speaker electronic component. Just trying to sell his garbage as snake oil or unobtanium or whatever you call it.
Hoping you get your hands on the Monitor Audio Gold 6G series for review!
Paul Barton 😂 & monitor audio Silver 100 7G
Winslow Burhoe, Mark Fenlon.
i have watched some guys saying, iron core this, air-core that, put a brass nut on the binding post...blah, blah, blah...I say - you should design and sell a speaker yourself. i agree with you guys. if you think you have to buy a set of speakers only to tear them apart and spend more money fixing them, sounds dumb to me. because the people that do it, didn't "fix" anything, they just turned that speaker into something else entirely and if that's what you're after, buy something else to begin with. redundant, but i just had to get that rant out because your justified argument struck a nerve with me as well.
I've had some fun in the speaker rebuilding arena. It is its own hobby, but it's not a cost-effective hobby. However, modding is an accessible hobby, where so much tech in the electronics arena requires considerable skill. Also, most of the changes to a speaker are reversible. It's best to play with older speakers, where who cares, but modding a new speaker is definitely a head scratcher.
Many cannot build a nice cabinet, but can upgrade parts or slopes in crossovers, add bracing, better insulation, add a damping layer, reglue boxes (yes, some companies do this poorly), and it makes sense to start with a modern speaker with fresh drivers…
I have fixed a lot of old speakers and also completely rebuilt two pair with new drivers, x-overs, and all - the rebuild can be fantastic…
Many of the recent modern retro style speakers prove that people want classic design and current drivers and parts
Andrew Jones absolutely knows who you guys are, make no mistake about it. He knows.
You say that like you have some insider info 😉
@@andrewrobinsonreviews ha ha. I wish I could say I do. I've chatted with him at a show, seen so many interviews and it's very clear that he's well dialed into the reviewer scene here and elsewhere for sure. He is aware of all the TH-cam reviewers, he searches for reviews of his stuff. He's not the type that is a hermit buried in a dark lab working on designs 24 hours a day. He's connected to the TH-cam reviewer community, he learns from reviews and comments. He knows you guys, there is no question and has seen the reviews you have done of his designs.
Suitcase question is easy for me, a pair of Morel Biggie Powered Bluetooth speakers with battery power that would be super useful on an island. These speakers sound fantastic from their 7"×7"×4.5" profile. Best of all, a pair is only $600.
He’s like an artist that talks about his art.
I thought Andrew Robinson was andrew Jones when I first tuned into the stream i.e., "is this the andrew that designed speakers and wrote in articles"
You need review the new Danish speaker. Radiant Acoustics Clarity 6.2. Design by the best people from Denmark. Heard them today, driven by Lyngdorf TDAI-3400. Its was fantastic
Andrew & Kristi you are one of those TH-camrs that make me look forward to next ”episode” Awesome! 👍🏼 I would be super duper happy if you could answer this question. I have a high end dedicated home theater. But for my budget tv/2ch system. Which one would YOU choose, Elac Debut 3.0 B6.3 or Klipsch RP-600m ii? Ignore any price difference. I like a dynamic sound with clear dialog. But as i said, which one would you choose? Happy weekend./From Sweden🇸🇪😊
The more dynamic and contrasty of the two speakers, that is, the sensation of greater bass with perhaps "higher" highs is going to be the Klipsch. Will it be more intelligible, that I can't say for certain. The better all-round speaker that is likely to be more agreeable or neutral, that's the ELAC all the way.
I don’t think I had heard of Andrew Jones before he got to Pioneer, and I recall them using his name in product marketing. Few if any other speaker ads/descriptions call out their designer like that.
The other famous British speaker designer is Peter Comeau ( Wharfedale Heritage series, Mission and Quad speakers) among many others.
Since Definitive Technology and Polk are part of the same company, can I mix those 2 brands for my 2 fronts and center. The Reserve line is pretty similar to the current Def Tech line.
I know what is in my speakers because I built and designed and built them and I like them to look like a piece of furniture. I think Andrew Jones is well known because he does interviews and most designers are interverts. My opinion on cones is that I like a paper blend. I paper sounds natural and the blends are lighter and faster. Aluminum and other compounds ring more when they break up. I don't like polypropylene, I think it sounds like Tupperware.
There is a fairly big diy speaker community so often people are looking for a good starting place that they can upgrade as they can afford to
Regarding inefficient budget speakers, I would add that typically budget speakers are smaller bookshelf type speakers, in part to save on cabinet costs. More difficult to get outstanding efficiency from a small two-way, regardless of the price point.
Thank you Andrew and Kristi for all of your hard work. I currently run a 2.1 setup with a Denon X3700 with Polk R600 and a SVS SB-3000. I enjoy my speakers and cannot replace them even if I wanted to. They are grandfathered in (WAF) to our space. If I replace the X3700 with the Marantz M1, would the R600 sound/perform significantly better? Our listening is 70/30 movies/music. Also, please try to review the Denon Home Amp. I, and I’m sure many of your viewers, would love to hear your comparison to the M1. Thank you for your insight.
If you use the X3700's room correction, there's a chance the M1 would sound very different and may lead you to believe it's not as good, or that your speakers sound "different" through it (the M1) versus the Denon. If you don't use Audyssey for room correction, the M1 might sound more controlled and authoritative. But you will give up room correction and that could be the difference maker if you're used to your speakers being better tailored to your room. Thanks for your support!
Another great episode!! Hey everyone!
Hello!
@@KristiWright Hey Kristi!! How is everything? MIssed you in the comments! I am over the moon this week!
@@txerapng Life is good! Speaking of the moon, did you see the harvest moon / partial eclipse on Tuesday? I've never seen the moon look so bright and clear.
Glad you're well!!
@@KristiWright I haven't seen the moon this week, but some great things have happened to me, that I have not still processed completely, i am really excited. Heard the TV is up in the backyard, its getting closer to finished isn't it?
@@txerapng That's awesome!!
Yes, the TV is up. We have some outdoor furniture arriving today. I think the pool is officially done. All that's left is a polish of the tiles to clean them up. The team is doing a second coat of concrete on the privacy wall, so we don't see the cinder blocks. Up next: painting the wall, landscaping and more outdoor furnishings. There's also plans for outdoor audio but it may be a while before that happens.
Arnie Nudell, founder of Infinity and then Genesis Technologies.
What makes a good box speaker? It's not a difficult formula. A stout, well braced non resonant box w/ rounded edges. Drivers w/ smooth responses that roll off gently and have little stored energy. Tweeters closely spaced to mid woof to maintain vertical phase alignment. Crossover w/ quality poly caps and air coil inductors and quality resisters designed to blend drivers properly and maintain phase. And no damn ferrous metal anywhere in the signal chain. Paint it w/ truck be liner and sell affordably or wrap in exotic veneer and sell for serious money. but it will sound good.
Slightly off the price point, but.. Which would you choose: MartinLogan vs. Magnepan + a sub, and why is it ML? ^^
always remember that there are great deals on second hand kit. don't need to buy new
LOL on the crossover parts, but here's the kicker they matter... Try it yourself, I have. A sand cast resistor on a tweeter is an easy part to change out. The irony is it makes a huge sonic difference. Had a pair of bookshelf polk speakers back in the day and the crossover was the size of the binding post. Never understood why it sounded horrid till I saw that. Of course it was probably the mix of parts and probably didn't measure well either. Still I have a high end diy speaker and didn't think it mattered either till I change a resistor on the tweeter. Just one resistor opened it up sonically in a way I'll never forget. So I moved on and replaced some capacitors on the woofer. Here is the thing I didn't hear a change there and went from clarity caps to mundorfs (expensive change). It didn't make much if any difference to me. So it depends on the network and what is changed.
The reality is that everyone builds to a price point. No one has great parts at an amazing price. It just doesn't happen. I have a set of 15k speakers that still have sand cast resistors. They also have steel core inductors as well which hold a magnetic charge. I'm not saying boutique parts make all the difference in the world, but they do matter. The issue is you get to the point of diminishing returns very quick. Maybe one of these days I'll rebuild my bookshelf speaker with junk crossovers and put it up so people can hear the difference.
While parts and overall construction matters, the point is that when the sound is great or what someone desires, then what does it actually matter? If you change parts in your speakers I hope you like them more but that difference doesn't equal better for all. The same applies to cables and measurements
@@Powerpickle68 sort of what I was saying by the law of diminishing returns. It's not that they don't make a difference though because they do.
Good Morning everyone
Good morning!
Good morning, Daniel! Thanks for tuning in.
Great episode & I agree 100% about people just wanting to pick apart a product out of context. On that note... It seems that a lot of people are misinformed about these speakers & where they fit into the overall Elac speaker range. During the video when Kristi was talking about past Elac speakers you reviewed, the photo you showed was the Debut Reference 2.0 which is one tier above & $300 more the new entry Debut 3.0. It seems that a lot of people think these are the only speaker Elac makes. They have 4 speaker lines in their "Home" or budget range & 6 speaker lines in their "Premium" range. The home range retail prices top out @ $1199 for a pair of bookshelf's & $1199 each for the floorstand. The premium range tops out @ $3499 for the pair of bookshelf's & $42,999.00 for the Concentro floorstand......... Context really matters!!
How about Heco Aurora 300? That would be mine 1st thing to compare.
I agree and disagree with you. Disagreement: parts do matter and driver differences is all marketing. Good example on the parts front are the Purifi midranges and woofers. These are high excursion, low distortion drivers as in higher excursion with lower distortion than previous drivers have been. These are expensive drivers and I think there are applications where these drivers can make a big difference (like 2-way bookshelf designs). Are they a game changer? No. Drivers like these can simplify the crossover by operating over a bigger frequency range or playing lower into the bass area than other similarly sized drivers. At the end of the day, these drivers are one more option a designer may have, depending on the price point he or she is designing to. I will grant you this, most speaker driver development has been restricted to refinements of well known driver topologies. I don’t see any particular one as necessarily better, more as options for a designer.
Where I totally agree is that no one should get caught up on parts, be they drivers or crossover parts. As an audiophile, your concern should be how well whatever is in your speaker has been implemented. And you judge that with your ears. I also agree that upgrades are questionable. You may be unhappy with your speakers, but you may not know why and certainly not how to fix it. The easiest path is either to just live with your speakers or buy a new pair more pleasing to your ears.
Instead of parts/materials, audiophiles should focus on basic design configurations, not in terms of sound, but in terms of whether it will work in your listening room. Open baffle speakers are a good example of this. They can sound great, but they need to be out in the room. If you don’t have the space or the SAF to get them out into the room, they won’t work for you because they simply will not sound good placed close to the wall. Rear ported speaker can offer enhanced bass performance due to the bass reinforcement from the back wall, but you need some placement flexibility to find the position where the bass works best in your room. The point is that some designs will work better in your room than others and you need to understand what those designs are. This is overlooked FAR too often.
Not relevant but I recall reading something about tuned cars where they put concrete in the bottom of the gearbox.
Youre not gonna get all the efficiency out of those elacs with a wimm amp unless you mono block somehow. I tried the elac unifi ub52 2.0s with a yahama as801 and it didnt work for me.
I have the Carina's and the RZ50 won't run them. They're quite a bit harder to drive than the debut's. It's fine for movies, but stereo listening forget it. I invested in the OSD Nero HTA7200 and 🤌 Magnefiique!
The waveguide on the tweeter for the Elac 3.0s is not as big and deep as the Arendals but I think that type of waveguide is something we will see more of from speaker designers. It just gives so much better off axis performance. I'm a bit turned off by the vertical jewelry on the Elac tweeter waveguide but if Kristi likes it, I love it lol
I’m guilty of the “tweaker mentality” but I love you guys! I watch and enjoy all your videos.
How about Dennis Murphy now building Philharmonic speakers?
TItle of the video had me thinking am I watching you or "What's Inside" :)!
Based on the title, I know exactly what's inside my speakers. I built two pairs based on the Parts-Express house brand, Dayton Audio. Anyone else heard of D.B. Keele, a speaker designer from way back? My Electro Voice horns were designed by him.
Let me preface this by saying, I love you guys and I'm just playing devils advocate when I say this... When you say "who cares" what the crossover parts are, understand that is an important factor for some people. Some people don't mind spending extra for quality parts even if the return on sound is negligable/incremental. I think this much like how you guys enjoy expensive/quality furniture and probably don't mind spending thousands on say a stone/concrete media console, when a Ikea piece would hold up your equipment just as well. FYI, Id spend the thousands on the nicer piece too, if I had the means :)
I think the point of the "who cares" comment is that these are the base or entry line of passive speaker Elac makes in their "Home" or budget speaker range. @ $450 / pair you're going to spend the same or close to it on the replacement premium parts, plus your time to replace them, & then hope you don't screw something up along the way..... Just move up the the DB Reference or Unifi or Unifi Reference. If those aren't good enough then move up their "Premium" speakers like the Corina, Solano 2.0, Vela 2.0 or Concentro, that top out @ $43K for the floorstand speaker.
@@robinsonmac You understood my point regarding the ELAC Debut 3.0 and its price point. Most speakers getting modded aren't of the thousand-dollar or more variety; it's the budget stuff. For example, a pair of Klipsch 600M MKIIs retail for $649/pair, and a popular crossover kit that "fixes" their response sells for $369, which you have to void your warranty and install yourself. Regardless, the 600M MKIIs are "worth" $649, yet some enthusiasts are now spending $1018 on the same speakers. With a budget of $1,000 for a pair of speakers, one could likely look for a better speaker with a response that is more to their liking or neutral and does not need to be modified.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Thanks for the response. I think maybe people are trying or looking to get the sound of a higher priced speaker for a perceived bargain by upgrading? Like thinking why buy speaker "****" for $1200 when I can buy the Debut 3.0 for $450 upgrade the crossover for $375 & I saved $375. Which in their mind is the ultimate perceived speaker value....... Also, thanks for the Monitor Audio Bronze 100 comparison! The Urban Grey color of the 100's are $450 right now.
Well said Andrew ..
my pick is probably kef lsx for the travel question
Great option too!
lol as far as box shaped speakers goes, i also really like the look of the dark grey Elac speakers.
Good viewpoints, would it be possible to do a review on the GR Research X-LS Encore bookshelf kit speakers, with the full upgrade, if you contact them I am sure they can send you an already built pair to review, and we can all find out how $900 kit speakers compare in this category of $500-$1200 speakers.
Speaking of Pioneer, there was a pair of PIONEER CS-R780 speakers on the side of my street this week. They are 4 ways! I don’t think I had heard of that before 😮
Well, since you asked “what do you want from us“, here’s my question. The interior architecture of the new Onkyo RZ 70 is completely different in appearance from the RZ 50. I’m wondering if you have any knowledge if this was designed by a new group of peopleto fight the overheating and HDMI issues that Onkyos have had for a while? I’ve been hoping for better quality and higher dependability for a while and I’m wondering if this is the first step? Thanks!
The RZ70 was designed by a new team at Klipsch/Onkyo and is an all-new design for Onkyo, whereas the RZ50 had some carry-over from the previous teams or generations.
@@andrewrobinsonreviewsThe RZ30 from the new regime as well ?
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Thanks Andrew! Have you heard any feedback or gotten any information about whether the new design is more dependable, more effective, or generally better to make it worth the nearly 3K msrp?
@@fonkenful I believe so, yes.
A truly balanced discussion... Refreshing! Thank you... Love your channel
It isn't always "Of course they gonna use the cheapest parts!" Buchardt has used fancy parts for their crossover of the S400 MKII. Andrew Jones uses the cheap yellow and white components for his MoFi speakers.
Even a pretty large bookshelf speaker will fit in a suitcase 😅 Also, crossovers, i once saw a speaker breakdown showing crossovers so huge i thought they would need their own heat sink 😮❤
Hi AR & KW! I was hoping for a Klipsch comparison. I have a friend who wants to set up a small 5.1 system (his first) and was wondering which speaker you would go with on a budget system. Thanks!
Good video and head to head comparisons……what is your take on the Kanto YU 5.25 speaker vs this ELAC?
The Kanto speakers are fantastic. We didn't listen to them side by side, so I can't say with 100% certainty whether the YUs will perform as well.
Andrew Jones is known for maximizing what a design can do, no matter what the budget for development of a speaker is. When it comes to electronics Schiit heads in a similar direction.
19:27 oh dang! 🫣 I did buy silver paste AND bare copper ribbon jumpers from Mapleshade back in the day 😆😂
So did I along with their cable risers and cryo-treated cables. I never heard a difference between their stock cables or cryo-cables, and I always thought their "bagged" interconnects were cool, but yeah, they played fast and loose with reality on a few of their tweaks.