HEY! The reason for the lack of megacastings in the Model 3 is that the Model Y is at the forefront of global expansion for Tesla, and the model Y is the car that has 3 new production lines being built for it (Giga Shanghai; Giga Berlin; Tera Austin), while Model 3 has none. The Y is a newer car, that Tesla predicts will make up more than half of their sales, and is their most competitive car, so concentrating all the new technologies in it, (including 4680 beginning with Berlin) is way more important than reworking the Model 3 to be a little more competitve at its much smaller market in the future.
@@rkan2 Exactly my thoughts! I'm so so so curious to see the differences in these points. MIC Model 3 lines were put in operation way later so a lot of learnings could have been applied in the meantime.
All very true. Also, the company making megacasting machines can only produce a limited amount in a limited time. I think the reason Sandy is so disappointed is he was so impressed with the Model Y, and how overall Tesla iterates "at the speed of thought." His hopes were high for Model 3.
The production figures are guesses cause in the US the Model Y might cannibalize Model 3 but not across the globe cause Model Y is here more expensive than the model 3 for example and Tesla is facing competition from european EV plants with new products that fit better to europe than model Y which has become too big. You get more space and benefits from a Skoda Enyaq and on top 15.000€ cheaper or a VW ID.4 which is 10.000€ cheaper. And Tesla has to be carefull and continue to work on the model 3 too, cause if economy gets hurt further like here in Germany with huge amounts of british covid mutation herds in hospitals and industry plants like AIrbus (500 in quarantine) than the sales figures will decrease again and also for Tesla that had no boost in the 4th quarter here as in the past. Finally: Tesla has no explanation about the roots or causes why the chinese gigafactory can not sell its production to the chinese - they need to export and that is not what had been planned. So, expectations had been wrong from the beginning of planning and guess they make more mistakes and demand decreases due to growing competition with better cars the success story is at stake. Remember: Blitzkrieg had worked quite well, but after 2 years in front of moscow in the freezing winter the impetus was gone and the enemies had copied technics and weapons and started to develope them further ... And the cyber truck is a US only thing that they can not really sell quite well anywhere ... and Model S and Model X are aging year by year and people get bored by the missing design progress. Annd autonomous driving is only a US thing while forbidden in many countries or not needed if you have to commute just 3 km or 15 km
By the time you remove all the robots and tooling that are building those 80 parts that make up the entire rear, you would have the room for the castings. I've seen the casting machines being built outside of the main factory, they're not really that big. I'm not sure if its a matter of "not having space" -- I think that maybe they are allowing the casting idea to have more of a long term testing in the model Y only, first; (to see if cracks easy after heavy use, or analyzing the results after several have been crashed in the field by customers); and see if any issues come up over time, before they just leap into using this idea for all their vehicles all at once. I'm sure it will be implemented into the next "new factory that is built for model 3's, where ever that may be.
@@calholli They have to do structure items to the building as the height of the machine is the problem. Hence why the megacasting machine is held outside of the factory in a tent.
Elon stated, a year or so ago. The base architecture would not be changed on Model 3’s until GIGA Berlin starts production with the new integrated battery pack configuration. In the mean time they have to keep the lines moving on the cars that keep the cash flowing in. I don’t see any major Fremont upgrades for Model 3 until Giga Texas model 3 production comes online in 2-3 years. Then they would have the capacity in place to shutdown model 3 production for the transition period.
...and they want to keep increasing the production so shutting down lines to change them is a difficult thing to do. Plus, another company is making the casting machines and how fast can they ramp up without adding too much capacity for the future?
yeah, the change will come in the new factories that are being built. I can see how changing your current production while new factories are not finished being built yet, would slow down the line in an unnecessary way that would hinder production/ its mainly due to timing.
Elon has been sand bagging improvements to stay away from the Osborn Effect, there has been some speculation that the Plaid Model S can be released by 2021 Q2 instead of end of 2021
Probably it makes no sense to make a change to single half casting in 2021 and then full front and back castings in 2022 or 2023. They tested half casting tech in MY in Freemont. Now they move to full body casting with structural battery in 2021 in Berlin. Afterwards Berlin, they will strat with updated Berlin´s version in Texas and only after everything is tuned up and they can have enough casting machines, they will update Freemont production. Basically they can not do everything at the same time.
My understanding is that Model 3s from Fremont will be the last line updates to the gigacasting. After Berlin and Texas are set up, the Chinese model 3 will get casting machines and then finally Fremont will. The casting machines there now are used exclusively for the Y.
Fremont has 2 of the casting machines running right now. Pretty sure it's just fine tuning the machines and the production line currently, but they do have stacks of the big unicasts
But when listening closely to Sandy, he proposes to use the same casting for M3 and MY. But yeah, still a question of having enough casting machines. But, the way I understand it, the new gigacastings would take over at least for the rear of the MY. That would free up the Megacastings currently used for MY to be transferred to M3.
As many others have already pointed out, Elon stated some time ago in an interview that while the Model 3 design is a PITA to build, it is a PITA that they understand and are good at. So it will remain as is until they have fully ramped Model Y production and have the excess capacity in casting machines to apply that method to Model 3.
Except they're not that good at it yet. Panel gaps, among other problems. Sandy is right to push them to improve. Right now Brand X's technology is years ahead, but their build quality is years behind. Tesla needs to do whatever it takes to improve quality, because right now its below all the major traditional automakers, and that doesn't make sense for a company that charges as much as they do.
@Reg Dewitt I agree/disagree. Yes, they're selling every one they make, but with the Chinese Gigafactory up and running, and with the German one coming online soon, and the Texas facility in the works, they may soon have more capacity than they're able to sell without making the vehicles more desirable. I wanted a Tesla at one point, but ended up going with a different brand because the build quality of a Tesla at the time wasn't acceptable to me. They're selling every car they make right now, but they're also establishing a reputation with non-owners at the moment. So just selling everything you make isn't the only think that matters in business.
@@ScrapKing73 I think we might see a large leap in quality once the new factories go online. We already hear great reports on quality of those Shanghai produced model 3s. Taking into account everything I've heard so far, I suspect they can't improve on the quality right now because the Fremont is a key piece in their puzzle. Once the capacity is higher, they might decide to make bigger changes to Fremont also. One thing that makes me wonder if it's not cheaper for Tesla to simply send those cars out with ok quality in the most part and having to schedule relatively limited number of service appointments rather than checking all the cars and trying to do something with them on the spot. With dealership model you could push some of the QA onto those dealership and the end customer didn't notice. Here, we don't have the dealerships and so more cars are getting into customers hands with those QA problems even though it is possible, the number of QA issues is the same for both Tesla and non-Tesla cars leaving the factory.
@@zbyszanna That's a great point that the dealer networks might be catching and/or compensating for quality issues with the other brands. If so, that's actually a great argument for having dealers. Since Tesla has decided to forgo dealers, the onus is on them to find a way to make it work without them. Yes, I'd also heard that the Chinese-made Teslas were of better quality than the Fremont-made ones. I imagine the German gigafactory is going to make excellent cars, due to the high quality and skill level of the German workforce and the high standards expected of German-made cars.
Also, its pretty well established that the crossover is just a better design over a sedan as a whole; and that's why every company is building one and many of their "cars" are dying. its common across the board. People are buying SUV/ crossovers at an incredibly higher rate than regular cars.
@@calholli Crossovers especially electric ones just give you soo much more added benefit. You have the space when you need it, but still have the EPA range, and can still park. The only thing it lacks is if you need also people space.
@@calholli Ppl are buying them at a high rate in part because it is so hard to find a car to buy. Not everyone wants a crossover or SUV, but the pickings are slim nowadays.
Elon said in an online discussion (that Sandy was part of), that the model 3 production line is setup & working and therefore the mega castings are probably two years away for the model 3 (this was about nine months ago). th-cam.com/video/pih4kU6yvz8/w-d-xo.html from 11:50 until 13:25
It stands to reason that once the stuff is working, and during this massive growth and delivery push they wouldn't take down production for a better version until it would make sense to pull those machines apart anyway for maintenance.
I've never seen Sandy so disappointed. It's like Christmas morning and he's expecting the latest game console, but wehn he opens it up, there's a brick of fruit-cake instead.
I don't think he can be credited for the MegaCasts. That's all Tesla. And they're doing it on their own timeline, with the need to stay cash flow positive, which means that the Model 3 can't be upgraded until all the other new lines are steadily ramping to ensure record quarter after record quarter.
Great to see that you are honest about your findings, both good and bad. Your openness about where improvements can be made is the driving force that institutes change and progress. Let’s hope that Tesla/Elon continues to keep an open mind about constructive criticism. Thanks for leading the charge to change for the better, much like evolution. Your videos are always greatly appreciated!
TeslaLeaks published a report on the abandoned oil and gas holes used for compressed air storage, and 100 other methods, as necessary, using the potential energy of the rigidity of a mountain or rock. Based on that new info on air storage from those wells they purchased, Tesla did hit 900 today, starting at about 2:15 est. The unused wells are where they can dump the Texas Wind overcapacity or other renewables at negative price energy. No need for large batteries and free the Lithium for other needs.
'It's almost as good as...' "...Let's keep it PC". Damn I almost choked on my coffee! Thanks Sandy (and the crew), you guys educate and entertain in equal measure.
My best guess is they are waiting for the Texas Terafactory to come online. Once that line is running with the megacasting for the model 3 they will shutdown the model 3 line in fremont and upgrade to include the megacasting. Since the 3 and y are there bread and butter I am thinking they don't want the interruption in production? That is the only thing that makes sense to me
I assume there is a limitation on the big casting mashines. Its one company producing them and the need a huge number in China, Berlin, Texas and Fremont. I assume the rather continue the M3 line running for now until the new Model Y lines are fully up. I can't think of another reason.
Teacher at school always said. “ the best weld is no weld” ( because it actually weakens the material around it // making it hard and brittle, which makes it easier to break) and Elon always says the best part is no part and the best step is no step, My teacher would’ve loved him.
Great video and videos. My guess on why there aren’t more improvements in M3 is they are biasing sales volume right now in their only US factory. They will need model Y ramped and S refresh ramped before they do a shut down on 3 lines so volume doesn’t take a major dip. although q1 is usually light so this would be time to do it.
Hey Sandy and team, I have 2 points: 1. Huge thank you for your videos and great work. I am really glad you are making these videos and showing everyone the beauty of engineering, especially of Tesla. It's amazing to see their improvement in a few years. Keep up the great work! 2. Will you also share with us comparison with any other car? As you did with Model Y motor vs. other EV's motors - so with other parts of the car. For example the suspension, seats, electronics etc. It would be great to see the background in the automotive industry. Or you aren't allowed to show details of other cars?
I’d be interested in a comparison too, I’m not so fussed by rival ev ( mainly because I can’t think of a suitable competitor - the leaf is far more of a budget car ) but if he could compare a long standing auto maker’s car such as a Merc E class ( both that and the model 3 roughly cost the same ) that would be mega interesting
@@MunroLive something with light weight materials would be fun. How Car companies use stuff like Carbon fiber and Magnesium alloys to cut down weight is very interesting.
methinks when they begin production of the 3 and Y at GigaTexas they will start out with the full casting. I think tooling at Fremont has reached diminishing returns while the other factories are moving so fast towards beginning production ramp.
I suspect Fremont will go directly to the structural cell + body castings all at the same time. They can keep the line running as is until it can leapfrog past the single-piece castings + 2170-skateboard intermediate step, maximizing the run rate of that line while providing stable cash flow for all the casting machines and cell lines required to ensure no new lines get installed that aren't 4680-based design. And that means structural batteries for everything new, and then retrofitting existing lines.
Good to know! I expect that they're iterating product lines significantly, which is why the model Y has so many improvements. I'd expect the Model 3 line on Shanghai to be much better than the Freemont one, and the upcoming Texas model 3 line to be significantly better than that. Some improvements made to the old lines for sure, but at a certain point you have to start over from scratch, and why do that when the model 3 is selling? Fantastic content as always, glad to see Sandy calling a spade a spade, even when he's disappointed by it.
... isn't wonderful that, in just a few years elon has allready spoiled us so much ?!!! Which other automaker is doing a better job at this ? Thx Sandy, your the only real expert ! 👍🏻
I'm under the impression that megacasting machines are a long-lead-time item. My guess is they'll switch over for the Model 3 to megacastings when they can get the machines delivered for it. In the meantime, while they wait for the megacasting machines, they're making minor tweaks to the underbody, but nothing too major. If they're switching to megacastings in the near future, there wouldn't be much point to spending a lot of engineering effort on the old configuration.
Many of those Model 3s have actual holes in the trink where different parts meet. Also the wheel wells aren‘t properly closed. Dirt and humidity get in there. Also, aluminum and metal parts touch without any primer in between. This may be a nightmare in a few years. Some already show considerable rust after a few months.
My opinion is that they didn’t have time to shut the line down for a transition. They were singularly focused on their delivery target that would make Wall Street happy.
I wonder if they are using megacastings on one line and the old multi-part ones on another? Maybe they are producing the megacasting but can't do so in enough volume yet. Have to believe they will switch to all megacastings eventually.
Maybe Fremont gigapresses are operating full tilt to produce for the Model Y. Maybe Model Y production will eventually all shift to Austin and gigapresses in Fremont will then shift to only supporting the 3, S and X?
Freemont casting machine is in the parking lot, could be as simple as not enough floor space. I recon they will get to the megacastings on the m3 when they can switch over to giga texas for model y production, that will free up the space at freemont to build a new model 3 line including the castings.
Great to see another video in this series, sorry that Tesla didn't do megacast, I thought I heard disappointment in Mr Munro's voice at the start of the video. Guess there will have to be another T3 teardown....
Sandy your shows are just the best. My guess is Tesla has looked at the demand curve for Model 3 and said incremental improvements only boys and girls your on the machine that makes the machine, 3 and Y are ramping just fine, oh sort S and X out before you go........27th Jan S and X on 4680 cells yea!
We don’t know Mark, because NO model Y with the new castings has been released for sale in any market in the world. We WILL know by the end of this year when the first production Model Y’s come out of the new Berlin factory. They will have the new front and rear mega castings, AND as well, the structurally integrated larger 4680 batteries. This has all been directly confirmed by Elon Musk on a number of occasions.
They clearly only have enough capacity at fremont for 1 giga casting which is why the TRIAL machine at fremont is outside and to put casting is US model 3 without taking away from fremont model y. Once they have the capacity to build a new plant is US for model 3 maybe once Texas is up and running
You bought this a bit premature if you were expecting there to be a Gigacasting. They'll get there. In the meantime, it's good to see the improvements they've made (however small).
There is probably a real factory space constraint in CA presently , not enough room to duplicate the welded stamped body version with the mega casting version (& wait for regulatory) until TX gets up and running
This is the type of cost cutting Engineers should push. Cutting the cost but improving the quality of the product by using newer technics not just omitting fasteners and changing aluminum to plastics/composite or whatever you may want to call it.
I'm guessing they could put the mega casting in Freemont for model 3, except for a minor detail. 1. As we speak, Tesla is having issues meeting customer demand. They can't afford to stop the best selling with best margin model y to run some model 3's through the casting machine with a block in it. 2. The foundation to be able to place the casting machine will require at least one month to do, plus time for permitting, inspections and so on. They can't just toss the machine onto the present foundation, the foundation would break up and that would be bad, really bad. 3. They do have at least one other mega casting machine at freemont now. With that I'm pretty sure that it won't be too long before they do an install. I'm guessing that this may happen when the Austin plant goes on line, but it could be sooner. 4. There are at least 8 mega casting foundations being poured and finished, maybe will be 10. Looks like the machines are coming in as well. So I'd say they will use them for Austin. Elon himself alluded to the fact that if toys can be casted as one piece, that should probably be a goal for an automaker...so I think he's working as much as possible toward exactly that. Berlin is also using the mega casting machines, at least being installed for use at this time. Hopefully, one day soon Elon can find the right lead engineer to take on the Tesla project. Tesla is working on iterations of vehicles, solar roof panels, batteries, battery storage, solar panels, software and hardware, a super computer for AI, neural link technologies (yes plural), tunnels, spaceships, electric motors, metallurgy, manufacturing processes, building manufacturing facilities, fuel production for space ships, rocket motors and if I keep going on my brain will explode. Oh, did I mention bio-tech such as RNA programming for vaccines, HVAC...well, you get the picture. I do appreciate your disappointments of Tesla, however. It means you have high expectations meaning you appreciate what they have achieved and their ability to do the right job, or do the job right. I also believe that either Elon or some of his engineers pay a lot of attention to the rights and wrongs you point out. It seems that sooner or later they actually do what you suggested should be done. Maybe the things they are doing are in part simple evolution of good engineering, but I think at least part of it is due to the cues you give during your teardowns. I am disappointed that Tesla was not willing to work with Arcimoto, for that matter, Nobe and Aptera as well. In a political sense, I would have helped them since in the long run it promotes sustainable transportation. Yes, they may or may not be as safe as cars, but then again, maybe some good engineering assistance could have enhanced the safety of the vehicles, as well as subsidies to help them scale up. I'm sure you have probably helped quite a bit on the safety and engineering end toward safety and scaling up, but I'll be Tesla could have helped financially and given them some good motors and maybe software to work with. Being human, I think we will always have vehicles like motorcycles and trikes, so it would have made sense to lend a hand to help make them safe as possible and scale up. Elon should have known Jeff would find a use for Rivian. I think if I was Elon I would have done it first. It could have made a good brand that Tesla would have it's hands in for the electric van market. If you wanted to destroy GM and Ford, helping Rivian and Lucid would have likely done the trick. The high end luxury sedan and pick-ups, ouch! I do have to say I hope GM and Ford survive even though it seems they are working against themselves.
Hey Sandy, another great video. Model 3 from Fremont is probably still using the old manufacture technique because they don’t want to shut down the line for upgrades. I’m sure no one would debate with you that the one piece casting is better.
Sandy was a tool designer. He goes into how to change the dies from the Y to the 3. Probably the issue was change management. They couldn't make all the changes they needed.
A lot of their effort is going toward battery and FSD improvements. So I can understand the lack of focus on improving manufacturing processes, however, I agree with Sandy that more could be done with the M3.
For what it's worth Sandy, Tesla DID hear you, they just needed longer to get what they needed installed. I just saw (today) that there now IS a casting machine for the Model 3 line at Freemont. It was spotted via a drone shot through an open section of roof/skylight.
Love hearing your honest critical feedback, Sandy. However, I don't think Tesla ever indicated they'd be reformatting the Model 3 body in white, did they? The megacasting and part reduction was always going to be for the Model Y.
I want to see Sandy go over Starship prototypes SN5 through SN11 and comment on the improvement in the weld quality and production. Bonus: no need to do a tear-down, SN12 was just disassembled and is in plain view.
Im assuming that Model 3 vehicles made at Fremont for the US market have changed little. But Model 3’s made at the shanghai plant id expect to see the castings in and a multitude of improvements that sandy expected. Model Y is the main focus i believe for Tesla and coupled with freemonts limited space and lack of available downtime i can see why they have not changed things that much.
One reason might be that they can't produce them (the castings) fast enough for both models so all the available castings go towards Model Y... for now.
Do they use jigs to hold the parts on the initial body welds? Somethings wrong to get one side nice and the other side with uneven gaps (obviously!). If a jig is minutely out, then as production continues those errors could be amplified. Seems ridiculous to have that many welds, or rather that many chances of slight error. They all add up.
I find these analytic videos helpful and informative. I am a future EV owner (possibly Tesla), but I'm waiting for both top notch innovation and excellent quality control. So far, only one box has been ticked.
I would imagine its a question of availability of casting capability. Its not out of bands that they will jump directly to single piece casting within a year...
I think you'll see them upgrade the Model 3 to the megacasting soon Sandy once they get the Giga Texas facility going and they have additional room for more casting equipment.
The introduction of mega-castings is probably on Tesla’s to do list but while sales are booming it is hard to introduce a fundamental change to the manufacturing process especially at a time when production cannot keep up with demand.
Maybe it's because they down want downtime to install new equipment on the lines. They are about peak production numbers right now. No demand issue. The model y is a newer line right? So it's gonna get all the new goodies. Plus the megacasting they have might not have enough throughput or a good yield on that cast and so they have to produce both types in order to keep up the numbers they want.
I think they did not implement the Megacasting to the Model 3 because it is very difficult to change an existing product line while it is running at full capacity all the time. They would have tu shutdown the whole production line for several days if not weeks to change the production line for the molde 3. So the loss for a shutdown would be higher than the savings from the megacasing. This is my theory. One day they will change it in Fremont, in new gigafactories it will be a megacasting from the beginning, i'm sure.
I’m sure they’ll get another casting machine for the model 3 lines. They’re probably waiting a little bit to make sure they’re satisfied with the current casting machine before buying more of them.
My guess is because they would have had to shut down the line to incorporate the single cast in the model 3. I am sure since there is less pressure this calendar year they will get right to it. 2020 was all about the 500,000. Cant do that with more lines shut down. Just an Idea. Great video as always!
My belief is that the final desired revision to model 3 body manufacturing has been deferred until midway through the ramp of giga Berlin and Giga Texas. Can't take down the Fremont Model 3 lines to retool until Berlin and Texas Factories at least 50% ramped. so in 2 years when they decide if they are staying in Fremont or not, they can retool. Fully functional Shanghai, Berlin, and Texas Factories provide Tesla with the option to take down Fremont for 6 months for much needed upgrades. The whole factory would get a redesign.
I can think of one reason not to switch the Model 3 to megacastings immediately. There is a limit to the number of casting machines Tesla can buy/build and install in a given amount of time, and they are trying to expand their production capacity. The frankenweld works, it meets the safety standards, and it is profitable (just not as profitable as it could be). So Tesla can choose, one line of cast cars, or one line of cast cars AND one line of frankenwelded cars. If this is the case, hopefully they can remove that bottleneck on casting machine installation soon and get all the lines updated, but until then, the most efficient use of a new casting machine may continue to be putting it in a new line.
If I had to guess, they don't have any more casting capacity at Fremont, or don't want to spend on changing the model 3 production line there until they perfect the megacastings for the Y. Sandy, have your contacts in China confirmed if the shanghai model 3 is also using a stamped and welded rear body?
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HEY! The reason for the lack of megacastings in the Model 3 is that the Model Y is at the forefront of global expansion for Tesla, and the model Y is the car that has 3 new production lines being built for it (Giga Shanghai; Giga Berlin; Tera Austin), while Model 3 has none. The Y is a newer car, that Tesla predicts will make up more than half of their sales, and is their most competitive car, so concentrating all the new technologies in it, (including 4680 beginning with Berlin) is way more important than reworking the Model 3 to be a little more competitve at its much smaller market in the future.
also ...Tesla cant just disturb their M3 lines and decrease their production run....
But they make the Model 3 in China??? I'd like ti see the rear end on those, since it came after the US Model Y if I remember correctly.
@@rkan2 Exactly my thoughts! I'm so so so curious to see the differences in these points. MIC Model 3 lines were put in operation way later so a lot of learnings could have been applied in the meantime.
All very true. Also, the company making megacasting machines can only produce a limited amount in a limited time. I think the reason Sandy is so disappointed is he was so impressed with the Model Y, and how overall Tesla iterates "at the speed of thought." His hopes were high for Model 3.
The production figures are guesses cause in the US the Model Y might cannibalize Model 3 but not across the globe cause Model Y is here more expensive than the model 3 for example and Tesla is facing competition from european EV plants with new products that fit better to europe than model Y which has become too big. You get more space and benefits from a Skoda Enyaq and on top 15.000€ cheaper or a VW ID.4 which is 10.000€ cheaper.
And Tesla has to be carefull and continue to work on the model 3 too, cause if economy gets hurt further like here in Germany with huge amounts of british covid mutation herds in hospitals and industry plants like AIrbus (500 in quarantine) than the sales figures will decrease again and also for Tesla that had no boost in the 4th quarter here as in the past.
Finally: Tesla has no explanation about the roots or causes why the chinese gigafactory can not sell its production to the chinese - they need to export and that is not what had been planned. So, expectations had been wrong from the beginning of planning and guess they make more mistakes and demand decreases due to growing competition with better cars the success story is at stake. Remember: Blitzkrieg had worked quite well, but after 2 years in front of moscow in the freezing winter the impetus was gone and the enemies had copied technics and weapons and started to develope them further ...
And the cyber truck is a US only thing that they can not really sell quite well anywhere ... and Model S and Model X are aging year by year and people get bored by the missing design progress.
Annd autonomous driving is only a US thing while forbidden in many countries or not needed if you have to commute just 3 km or 15 km
Fremont doesn't have the space for additional casting machines to supply Model 3's production rate. They only have the machines for Model Y.
By the time you remove all the robots and tooling that are building those 80 parts that make up the entire rear, you would have the room for the castings. I've seen the casting machines being built outside of the main factory, they're not really that big. I'm not sure if its a matter of "not having space" -- I think that maybe they are allowing the casting idea to have more of a long term testing in the model Y only, first; (to see if cracks easy after heavy use, or analyzing the results after several have been crashed in the field by customers); and see if any issues come up over time, before they just leap into using this idea for all their vehicles all at once. I'm sure it will be implemented into the next "new factory that is built for model 3's, where ever that may be.
@@calholli They have to do structure items to the building as the height of the machine is the problem. Hence why the megacasting machine is held outside of the factory in a tent.
Elon stated, a year or so ago. The base architecture would not be changed on Model 3’s until GIGA Berlin starts production with the new integrated battery pack configuration. In the mean time they have to keep the lines moving on the cars that keep the cash flowing in. I don’t see any major Fremont upgrades for Model 3 until Giga Texas model 3 production comes online in 2-3 years. Then they would have the capacity in place to shutdown model 3 production for the transition period.
I'd be interested to see a teardown of the Shanghai M3 - I'm willing to bet it would be a lot better overall.
What will it look like in Berlin? The Model 3 in Europe is made in China, they have new tooling there too?
I like automobiles living in Korea and am a student of automobile maintenance major. Thank you for watching the videos every time.
Good example of how hard it is to change something after its up and running.
...and they want to keep increasing the production so shutting down lines to change them is a difficult thing to do. Plus, another company is making the casting machines and how fast can they ramp up without adding too much capacity for the future?
yeah, the change will come in the new factories that are being built. I can see how changing your current production while new factories are not finished being built yet, would slow down the line in an unnecessary way that would hinder production/ its mainly due to timing.
@@calholli - Tesla is doing all it can just to get the casting equipment for factories being built.
I think we'll see it on other lines in different markets first.
@@ClockworksOfGL unfortunately the casting machines aren't easy to make.
Sandy, in an interwiev last year with you and Elon he said he would change model 3 to megacasting in a couple of years
So: wait for the 22 model👍🇳🇴
Elon has been sand bagging improvements to stay away from the Osborn Effect, there has been some speculation that the Plaid Model S can be released by 2021 Q2 instead of end of 2021
Probably it makes no sense to make a change to single half casting in 2021 and then full front and back castings in 2022 or 2023. They tested half casting tech in MY in Freemont. Now they move to full body casting with structural battery in 2021 in Berlin. Afterwards Berlin, they will strat with updated Berlin´s version in Texas and only after everything is tuned up and they can have enough casting machines, they will update Freemont production. Basically they can not do everything at the same time.
Seems that will be the version from the Berlin plant.
It looks like the Model Y is already getting the full rear casting for 2021. I bet the Model 3 gets it by 2022 after the Model S/X are updated.
@@SeahawkAz osborne effect is not a thing except for in the minds of people that surf r/stocks and tesla stock speculation videos
My understanding is that Model 3s from Fremont will be the last line updates to the gigacasting. After Berlin and Texas are set up, the Chinese model 3 will get casting machines and then finally Fremont will. The casting machines there now are used exclusively for the Y.
Fremont has 2 of the casting machines running right now. Pretty sure it's just fine tuning the machines and the production line currently, but they do have stacks of the big unicasts
@@Jaker788 IMO for S and X based on some TH-camr doing a size analysis of those castings.
@@Jaker788 those are just for the Model Y.
But when listening closely to Sandy, he proposes to use the same casting for M3 and MY.
But yeah, still a question of having enough casting machines. But, the way I understand it, the new gigacastings would take over at least for the rear of the MY. That would free up the Megacastings currently used for MY to be transferred to M3.
As many others have already pointed out, Elon stated some time ago in an interview that while the Model 3 design is a PITA to build, it is a PITA that they understand and are good at. So it will remain as is until they have fully ramped Model Y production and have the excess capacity in casting machines to apply that method to Model 3.
Except they're not that good at it yet. Panel gaps, among other problems. Sandy is right to push them to improve. Right now Brand X's technology is years ahead, but their build quality is years behind. Tesla needs to do whatever it takes to improve quality, because right now its below all the major traditional automakers, and that doesn't make sense for a company that charges as much as they do.
Are they good at it? My 2021 LR has many figment issues like what sandy has described. Rear passenger door doesn’t want to close all the time.
@Reg Dewitt I agree/disagree. Yes, they're selling every one they make, but with the Chinese Gigafactory up and running, and with the German one coming online soon, and the Texas facility in the works, they may soon have more capacity than they're able to sell without making the vehicles more desirable. I wanted a Tesla at one point, but ended up going with a different brand because the build quality of a Tesla at the time wasn't acceptable to me. They're selling every car they make right now, but they're also establishing a reputation with non-owners at the moment. So just selling everything you make isn't the only think that matters in business.
@@ScrapKing73 I think we might see a large leap in quality once the new factories go online. We already hear great reports on quality of those Shanghai produced model 3s. Taking into account everything I've heard so far, I suspect they can't improve on the quality right now because the Fremont is a key piece in their puzzle. Once the capacity is higher, they might decide to make bigger changes to Fremont also.
One thing that makes me wonder if it's not cheaper for Tesla to simply send those cars out with ok quality in the most part and having to schedule relatively limited number of service appointments rather than checking all the cars and trying to do something with them on the spot. With dealership model you could push some of the QA onto those dealership and the end customer didn't notice. Here, we don't have the dealerships and so more cars are getting into customers hands with those QA problems even though it is possible, the number of QA issues is the same for both Tesla and non-Tesla cars leaving the factory.
@@zbyszanna That's a great point that the dealer networks might be catching and/or compensating for quality issues with the other brands. If so, that's actually a great argument for having dealers. Since Tesla has decided to forgo dealers, the onus is on them to find a way to make it work without them. Yes, I'd also heard that the Chinese-made Teslas were of better quality than the Fremont-made ones. I imagine the German gigafactory is going to make excellent cars, due to the high quality and skill level of the German workforce and the high standards expected of German-made cars.
1 Year later... It would be neat to see comparisons of last year to this year
Sandy’s unveiling of the casting was the final reason I went with the 2021 Y over the 3.
Also, its pretty well established that the crossover is just a better design over a sedan as a whole; and that's why every company is building one and many of their "cars" are dying. its common across the board. People are buying SUV/ crossovers at an incredibly higher rate than regular cars.
@@calholli Crossovers especially electric ones just give you soo much more added benefit. You have the space when you need it, but still have the EPA range, and can still park. The only thing it lacks is if you need also people space.
@@faisal181 and if you need people space just buy a bigger one
@@calholli Ppl are buying them at a high rate in part because it is so hard to find a car to buy. Not everyone wants a crossover or SUV, but the pickings are slim nowadays.
kind of a strange reason, considering the rather different capabilities of those two cars
Who else is happy With another update from Sandy Munro ? 😄
Me
big time!
Everyone
Me
Yup, excellent to watch a clearly great engineer talk about the build process, even if, at the moment, it involves the slating of a car I own :-)
This never gets old, interesting and entertaining
Elon said in an online discussion (that Sandy was part of), that the model 3 production line is setup & working and therefore the mega castings are probably two years away for the model 3 (this was about nine months ago).
th-cam.com/video/pih4kU6yvz8/w-d-xo.html from 11:50 until 13:25
Source for this discussion?
Here it is
th-cam.com/video/pih4kU6yvz8/w-d-xo.html
It stands to reason that once the stuff is working, and during this massive growth and delivery push they wouldn't take down production for a better version until it would make sense to pull those machines apart anyway for maintenance.
@@envisionelectronics i’ve updated the post with link and timestamp.
Awesome fact finding. Sandy does get a little arrogant...
I've never seen Sandy so disappointed. It's like Christmas morning and he's expecting the latest game console, but wehn he opens it up, there's a brick of fruit-cake instead.
Lasts year's game console it was not a total fruit cake IMO that would have been zero changes.
Expecting a PS5 and getting the Xbox 360
Lol!!
@@khkgkgkjgkjh6647
He got an OUYA.
@@theuncalledfor Underrated comment!
I bet with a major refresh on the 3, we'll see 90% of Sandy's suggestions incorporated (plus mega-casting of course)
I don't think he can be credited for the MegaCasts. That's all Tesla. And they're doing it on their own timeline, with the need to stay cash flow positive, which means that the Model 3 can't be upgraded until all the other new lines are steadily ramping to ensure record quarter after record quarter.
Great to see that you are honest about your findings, both good and bad. Your openness about where improvements can be made is the driving force that institutes change and progress. Let’s hope that Tesla/Elon continues to keep an open mind about constructive criticism. Thanks for leading the charge to change for the better, much like evolution. Your videos are always greatly appreciated!
I enjoy how annoyed he is. Push them forward harder sandy!
TeslaLeaks published a report on the abandoned oil and gas holes used for compressed air storage, and 100 other methods, as necessary, using the potential energy of the rigidity of a mountain or rock. Based on that new info on air storage from those wells they purchased, Tesla did hit 900 today, starting at about 2:15 est. The unused wells are where they can dump the Texas Wind overcapacity or other renewables at negative price energy. No need for large batteries and free the Lithium for other needs.
Excellent video, Sandy! Nice to see these videos of great quality drop in my sub box.
'It's almost as good as...' "...Let's keep it PC". Damn I almost choked on my coffee! Thanks Sandy (and the crew), you guys educate and entertain in equal measure.
My best guess is they are waiting for the Texas Terafactory to come online. Once that line is running with the megacasting for the model 3 they will shutdown the model 3 line in fremont and upgrade to include the megacasting. Since the 3 and y are there bread and butter I am thinking they don't want the interruption in production? That is the only thing that makes sense to me
I sense your frustration. Thanks for your thoughts and observations, appreciated.
I assume there is a limitation on the big casting mashines. Its one company producing them and the need a huge number in China, Berlin, Texas and Fremont. I assume the rather continue the M3 line running for now until the new Model Y lines are fully up. I can't think of another reason.
Teacher at school always said. “ the best weld is no weld”
( because it actually weakens the material around it // making it hard and brittle, which makes it easier to break) and Elon always says the best part is no part and the best step is no step,
My teacher would’ve loved him.
Patience! They've just gotten it going for MY, which was clearly the place to start.
What you were hoping for, was 'quicker'. They have figured all these things out, no doubt they will make their way to the Model 3.
Great video and videos. My guess on why there aren’t more improvements in M3 is they are biasing sales volume right now in their only US factory. They will need model Y ramped and S refresh ramped before they do a shut down on 3 lines so volume doesn’t take a major dip. although q1 is usually light so this would be time to do it.
Why oh why ( YOY) is the Y still not available in the UK?
I’m waiting too. Have they delivered any in Europe yet? I know you can order in Europe.
Hey Sandy and team, I have 2 points:
1. Huge thank you for your videos and great work. I am really glad you are making these videos and showing everyone the beauty of engineering, especially of Tesla. It's amazing to see their improvement in a few years. Keep up the great work!
2. Will you also share with us comparison with any other car?
As you did with Model Y motor vs. other EV's motors - so with other parts of the car.
For example the suspension, seats, electronics etc. It would be great to see the background in the automotive industry. Or you aren't allowed to show details of other cars?
I’d be interested in a comparison too, I’m not so fussed by rival ev ( mainly because I can’t think of a suitable competitor - the leaf is far more of a budget car ) but if he could compare a long standing auto maker’s car such as a Merc E class ( both that and the model 3 roughly cost the same ) that would be mega interesting
Yes. We have several other vehicles planned for 2021 and 2022. Thanks for watching.
@@MunroLive something with light weight materials would be fun. How Car companies use stuff like Carbon fiber and Magnesium alloys to cut down weight is very interesting.
Admire your honesty, that's what more need to do. Also that some things were changed and more may come is a good sign.
BECAUSE They have contracts with all the parts manufacturers for x time or x quantity. When that expires it will surely change to mega-casting.
Thank you for mentioning the cashiers. Retail workers are underappreciated.
This video is worth watching! More videos like this, please!
methinks when they begin production of the 3 and Y at GigaTexas they will start out with the full casting. I think tooling at Fremont has reached diminishing returns while the other factories are moving so fast towards beginning production ramp.
I suspect Fremont will go directly to the structural cell + body castings all at the same time. They can keep the line running as is until it can leapfrog past the single-piece castings + 2170-skateboard intermediate step, maximizing the run rate of that line while providing stable cash flow for all the casting machines and cell lines required to ensure no new lines get installed that aren't 4680-based design. And that means structural batteries for everything new, and then retrofitting existing lines.
Man I love these videos. Thanks Sandy and crew!
What about advantage for collision repairs?
Perhaps, once Model Y production relocates to Austin, the Model 3 will get those casting machines.
Good to know! I expect that they're iterating product lines significantly, which is why the model Y has so many improvements. I'd expect the Model 3 line on Shanghai to be much better than the Freemont one, and the upcoming Texas model 3 line to be significantly better than that. Some improvements made to the old lines for sure, but at a certain point you have to start over from scratch, and why do that when the model 3 is selling?
Fantastic content as always, glad to see Sandy calling a spade a spade, even when he's disappointed by it.
... isn't wonderful that, in just a few years elon has allready spoiled us so much ?!!!
Which other automaker is doing a better job at this ?
Thx Sandy, your the only real expert !
👍🏻
I'm under the impression that megacasting machines are a long-lead-time item. My guess is they'll switch over for the Model 3 to megacastings when they can get the machines delivered for it.
In the meantime, while they wait for the megacasting machines, they're making minor tweaks to the underbody, but nothing too major. If they're switching to megacastings in the near future, there wouldn't be much point to spending a lot of engineering effort on the old configuration.
Many of those Model 3s have actual holes in the trink where different parts meet. Also the wheel wells aren‘t properly closed. Dirt and humidity get in there. Also, aluminum and metal parts touch without any primer in between. This may be a nightmare in a few years. Some already show considerable rust after a few months.
3:40 "Man, this is the kind of thing that makes engineers get all excited. It's almost as good as…" Smart guy, knows when to catch himself.
My opinion is that they didn’t have time to shut the line down for a transition. They were singularly focused on their delivery target that would make Wall Street happy.
I wonder if they are using megacastings on one line and the old multi-part ones on another? Maybe they are producing the megacasting but can't do so in enough volume yet. Have to believe they will switch to all megacastings eventually.
Maybe Fremont gigapresses are operating full tilt to produce for the Model Y. Maybe Model Y production will eventually all shift to Austin and gigapresses in Fremont will then shift to only supporting the 3, S and X?
Thanks Sandy
Freemont casting machine is in the parking lot, could be as simple as not enough floor space. I recon they will get to the megacastings on the m3 when they can switch over to giga texas for model y production, that will free up the space at freemont to build a new model 3 line including the castings.
Awesome video, as always! Thank you! My next car hopefully gonna be Model Y
...but we did find some good things. Always look on the bright side of things...right boys and girls. Like always He is as thorough as ever.
Ich mag wie er die Teile durch die Gegend wirft 😊
Measure the doors. Are they the same both sides?
Thanks boys and girls. Absolutely fantastic info. REDUCE THE PART COUNT. Thanks from Seattle.
Thanks for the honest analysis.
Great to see another video in this series, sorry that Tesla didn't do megacast, I thought I heard disappointment in Mr Munro's voice at the start of the video. Guess there will have to be another T3 teardown....
Sandy your shows are just the best. My guess is Tesla has looked at the demand curve for Model 3 and said incremental improvements only boys and girls your on the machine that makes the machine, 3 and Y are ramping just fine, oh sort S and X out before you go........27th Jan S and X on 4680 cells yea!
So now I'm curious, has the Mega Casting for Model-Y greatly improved build quality (Panel Gaps)?
Uhm nope, range rover has an unibody aluminium construction and it doesn't even flexes when offroading so tesla is the problem
We don’t know Mark, because NO model Y with the new castings has been released for sale in any market in the world. We WILL know by the end of this year when the first production Model Y’s come out of the new Berlin factory. They will have the new front and rear mega castings, AND as well, the structurally integrated larger 4680 batteries. This has all been directly confirmed by Elon Musk on a number of occasions.
They clearly only have enough capacity at fremont for 1 giga casting which is why the TRIAL machine at fremont is outside and to put casting is US model 3 without taking away from fremont model y. Once they have the capacity to build a new plant is US for model 3 maybe once Texas is up and running
You bought this a bit premature if you were expecting there to be a Gigacasting. They'll get there. In the meantime, it's good to see the improvements they've made (however small).
There is probably a real factory space constraint in CA presently , not enough room to duplicate the welded stamped body version with the mega casting version (& wait for regulatory) until TX gets up and running
we waiting for Berlin manufacturing !!! 🤞👌
Thanks for your work 👍
This is the type of cost cutting Engineers should push. Cutting the cost but improving the quality of the product by using newer technics not just omitting fasteners and changing aluminum to plastics/composite or whatever you may want to call it.
Thank you for this highly informative video!
I'm guessing they could put the mega casting in Freemont for model 3, except for a minor detail. 1. As we speak, Tesla is having issues meeting customer demand. They can't afford to stop the best selling with best margin model y to run some model 3's through the casting machine with a block in it. 2. The foundation to be able to place the casting machine will require at least one month to do, plus time for permitting, inspections and so on. They can't just toss the machine onto the present foundation, the foundation would break up and that would be bad, really bad. 3. They do have at least one other mega casting machine at freemont now. With that I'm pretty sure that it won't be too long before they do an install. I'm guessing that this may happen when the Austin plant goes on line, but it could be sooner. 4. There are at least 8 mega casting foundations being poured and finished, maybe will be 10. Looks like the machines are coming in as well. So I'd say they will use them for Austin. Elon himself alluded to the fact that if toys can be casted as one piece, that should probably be a goal for an automaker...so I think he's working as much as possible toward exactly that. Berlin is also using the mega casting machines, at least being installed for use at this time.
Hopefully, one day soon Elon can find the right lead engineer to take on the Tesla project. Tesla is working on iterations of vehicles, solar roof panels, batteries, battery storage, solar panels, software and hardware, a super computer for AI, neural link technologies (yes plural), tunnels, spaceships, electric motors, metallurgy, manufacturing processes, building manufacturing facilities, fuel production for space ships, rocket motors and if I keep going on my brain will explode. Oh, did I mention bio-tech such as RNA programming for vaccines, HVAC...well, you get the picture. I do appreciate your disappointments of Tesla, however. It means you have high expectations meaning you appreciate what they have achieved and their ability to do the right job, or do the job right. I also believe that either Elon or some of his engineers pay a lot of attention to the rights and wrongs you point out. It seems that sooner or later they actually do what you suggested should be done. Maybe the things they are doing are in part simple evolution of good engineering, but I think at least part of it is due to the cues you give during your teardowns.
I am disappointed that Tesla was not willing to work with Arcimoto, for that matter, Nobe and Aptera as well. In a political sense, I would have helped them since in the long run it promotes sustainable transportation. Yes, they may or may not be as safe as cars, but then again, maybe some good engineering assistance could have enhanced the safety of the vehicles, as well as subsidies to help them scale up. I'm sure you have probably helped quite a bit on the safety and engineering end toward safety and scaling up, but I'll be Tesla could have helped financially and given them some good motors and maybe software to work with. Being human, I think we will always have vehicles like motorcycles and trikes, so it would have made sense to lend a hand to help make them safe as possible and scale up. Elon should have known Jeff would find a use for Rivian. I think if I was Elon I would have done it first. It could have made a good brand that Tesla would have it's hands in for the electric van market. If you wanted to destroy GM and Ford, helping Rivian and Lucid would have likely done the trick. The high end luxury sedan and pick-ups, ouch! I do have to say I hope GM and Ford survive even though it seems they are working against themselves.
Mega casting machines are installed right now. But idk if it is for the m3 or mY. Do hope they improve that! Good video
Hey Sandy, another great video. Model 3 from Fremont is probably still using the old manufacture technique because they don’t want to shut down the line for upgrades. I’m sure no one would debate with you that the one piece casting is better.
The best part is no part ;-) And Yes inserts for the casting would help in the modular design.
Sandy was a tool designer. He goes into how to change the dies from the Y to the 3. Probably the issue was change management. They couldn't make all the changes they needed.
A lot of their effort is going toward battery and FSD improvements. So I can understand the lack of focus on improving manufacturing processes, however, I agree with Sandy that more could be done with the M3.
For what it's worth Sandy, Tesla DID hear you, they just needed longer to get what they needed installed. I just saw (today) that there now IS a casting machine for the Model 3 line at Freemont. It was spotted via a drone shot through an open section of roof/skylight.
So how are other manufacturers able to align their panels without the mega caster?
Love hearing your honest critical feedback, Sandy. However, I don't think Tesla ever indicated they'd be reformatting the Model 3 body in white, did they? The megacasting and part reduction was always going to be for the Model Y.
I want to see Sandy go over Starship prototypes SN5 through SN11 and comment on the improvement in the weld quality and production. Bonus: no need to do a tear-down, SN12 was just disassembled and is in plain view.
I would be interested in the prismatic LFP battery of the SR+ china model 3 - are there any images or specs out yet?
Love your videos
Im assuming that Model 3 vehicles made at Fremont for the US market have changed little. But Model 3’s made at the shanghai plant id expect to see the castings in and a multitude of improvements that sandy expected. Model Y is the main focus i believe for Tesla and coupled with freemonts limited space and lack of available downtime i can see why they have not changed things that much.
One reason might be that they can't produce them (the castings) fast enough for both models so all the available castings go towards Model Y... for now.
Maybe they already had all those other parts and are using them up before switching to the one moulded part?
Do they use jigs to hold the parts on the initial body welds? Somethings wrong to get one side nice and the other side with uneven gaps (obviously!). If a jig is minutely out, then as production continues those errors could be amplified. Seems ridiculous to have that many welds, or rather that many chances of slight error. They all add up.
I wonder if in Shanghai they are actually using the gigacasting for the M3
Great video. I’m guessing the 2018 Model 3 performance would be the same in regards to the welding 26 pieces? 🤦🏻♂️
Why DIDNT they use single casting since they have MegaCasting machines at Fremont now?
I find these analytic videos helpful and informative. I am a future EV owner (possibly Tesla), but I'm waiting for both top notch innovation and excellent quality control. So far, only one box has been ticked.
I would imagine its a question of availability of casting capability. Its not out of bands that they will jump directly to single piece casting within a year...
How do you create hollow parts with „Mega-casting“?
I think you'll see them upgrade the Model 3 to the megacasting soon Sandy once they get the Giga Texas facility going and they have additional room for more casting equipment.
The introduction of mega-castings is probably on Tesla’s to do list but while sales are booming it is hard to introduce a fundamental change to the manufacturing process especially at a time when production cannot keep up with demand.
Might be a capacity issue, maybe they don't have enough megacasting capacity right now.
Genuine feed back
Maybe it's because they down want downtime to install new equipment on the lines. They are about peak production numbers right now. No demand issue. The model y is a newer line right? So it's gonna get all the new goodies. Plus the megacasting they have might not have enough throughput or a good yield on that cast and so they have to produce both types in order to keep up the numbers they want.
I think they did not implement the Megacasting to the Model 3 because it is very difficult to change an existing product line while it is running at full capacity all the time. They would have tu shutdown the whole production line for several days if not weeks to change the production line for the molde 3. So the loss for a shutdown would be higher than the savings from the megacasing. This is my theory. One day they will change it in Fremont, in new gigafactories it will be a megacasting from the beginning, i'm sure.
I’m sure they’ll get another casting machine for the model 3 lines. They’re probably waiting a little bit to make sure they’re satisfied with the current casting machine before buying more of them.
Arent they building them in house?
@@RobbieFitzgerald they’re designing the specs in house but they’re being built custom for Tesla by another company IIRC
Hi,Sandy, can you please give a similar check for Nio’s car?
My guess is because they would have had to shut down the line to incorporate the single cast in the model 3. I am sure since there is less pressure this calendar year they will get right to it. 2020 was all about the 500,000. Cant do that with more lines shut down. Just an Idea. Great video as always!
I guess they may not make the casting until the 4680 cells are in full production to re tool the frame casting.
My belief is that the final desired revision to model 3 body manufacturing has been deferred until midway through the ramp of giga Berlin and Giga Texas. Can't take down the Fremont Model 3 lines to retool until Berlin and Texas Factories at least 50% ramped. so in 2 years when they decide if they are staying in Fremont or not, they can retool. Fully functional Shanghai, Berlin, and Texas Factories provide Tesla with the option to take down Fremont for 6 months for much needed upgrades. The whole factory would get a redesign.
I can think of one reason not to switch the Model 3 to megacastings immediately. There is a limit to the number of casting machines Tesla can buy/build and install in a given amount of time, and they are trying to expand their production capacity. The frankenweld works, it meets the safety standards, and it is profitable (just not as profitable as it could be). So Tesla can choose, one line of cast cars, or one line of cast cars AND one line of frankenwelded cars. If this is the case, hopefully they can remove that bottleneck on casting machine installation soon and get all the lines updated, but until then, the most efficient use of a new casting machine may continue to be putting it in a new line.
If I had to guess, they don't have any more casting capacity at Fremont, or don't want to spend on changing the model 3 production line there until they perfect the megacastings for the Y. Sandy, have your contacts in China confirmed if the shanghai model 3 is also using a stamped and welded rear body?
Every improvement is a step in the right direction. If improvements were not made there must have been a reason.
Sandyyyyy please stoooop, I can't handle this top quality content. WTF