Tesla Model 3 LFP Battery + Sandy Visits the ONE Facility
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 พ.ค. 2024
- Sandy and Team took a trip to Our Next Energy! Sandy got to talk all things batteries with the guys there, including the Tesla Model 3 LFP.
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Outro:
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#Tesla #Model3 #EVbattery - บันเทิง
*Mujeeb* highly articulate. *Tim* as well. Seems they are benchmarking CATL packs to optimize or step function forward.
What an amazing look at the intersection between the electric past and the electric future. Thanks Sandy and the Munro team!
I wonder if looking at the designs of the past might help us to innovate even faster in the electric space? When we realize we're not 'inventing' a lot of these innovations, that much of it has been done before.
Loved this episode. Getting more explanation from the historical perspective of the electric vehicle is so worthwhile. And I loved the little look under the cover of the new battery design. I'll look forward to Munro returning to ONE.
Actually same here, can't wait for the next time.
That was very insightful, thanks Sandy
Excellent video. Sandy looks like he's regressing in age with all these positive and exciting encounters. His enthusiasm and genuine curiosity is infectious. Nevermind that everytime we see another newer design of anything on a Tesla it seems to get exponentially better.
I wish that were true. His enthusiasm is still there but his energy level has noticeably declined in the past year. Considering that I'm comparing him to someone older, retired and sedentary, that's not good. I think he and his spouse need to take a REAL vacation ASAP to recover from their move.
Well well. Sandy being into Egypt is something close to my heart. Who knew that would come up but awesome! More respect for you now. Also never knew Sandy is Canadian?!
Is he??
Even if he's not, Canada is claiming him anyway! Apparently he's a Windsor boy.
@@davidsc4680 ... He said it himself @ 05:28. we Canadians punch above our weight.
EH!
@@jrb_sland5066 Sandy said "born in" he didn't say when he moved, but he grew up in Windsor and went to work as a toolmaker there and later and later as an engineer for Ford. Having since moved to the US, established a business and gained dual citizenship, he's as Canadian as Elon Musk is African. (btw, Mr Musk came via Canada).
What you say about punching above one's weight could be applied to many, even most, immigrants to the US. It takes drive to get past the systemic glass barriers.
Immigrants are what built the US and their infusion of energy and ideas are what helps keeps us improving. I wish the former President had been more knowledgeable and understood that.
Don't get me wrong, I generally find lifelong residents of Canada, to be better "americans" than we folks from the US (even though more than half of the population lives south of the northern extent of the continental US). Having a huge area of 'frontier", a smaller total population than the state of California, and a "super"power federation next door has to have a positive effect on their worldview.
I'm a history buff and got an ironic chuckle from learning Mrs. Ford, Mrs. Edison and Mrs. Rockefeller were driving electric cars over a hundred years ago. Mujeeb's antique electric car is sweet! Can't wait to see where ONE goes in the future!
It's funny, but when you look at the COST of an EV back then, you also learn how those 3 women were living a more luxurious life than about 99% of the population. They were definitely one percenters.
Great episode. Love seeing new and innovative companies pushing forward with EV technologies. Good work guys! 👽🖖"Na-nu"
Thanks for watching!
Sooo cool!! LOVE THE STRUCTURAL PACK WITH LAMINATE CONECTIONS! Can't wait for the next visit to ONE!
Excellent content. Thanks to Sandy and Mujeeb and Tim.
The history of the Electric Car is so much older that most know, so when we think we are "inventing something new" it is actually just an better iteration of an older idea. Love this episode!
if it werent for oil and legacy auto, EVs would be way more popular than they are now. but they have both done everything in their power to keep EVs from becoming popular, but tesla let the cat out of the bag. we should probably be 30 years into the EV revolution by this point if it werent for legacy auto and oil
@@PeteZam They never allowed battery technology to develop.
Ford tried to built affordable and quality EVs with Edison but once the model t came out so much cheaper, it destroyed everything else.
Plus care for environment and climate was non existent back then.
@@PeteZam nonsense, the lithium battery was just barely invented in the 90's and had/needs to evolve. Oil helped build the world from mining to agriculture, construction, roads, devices, medical equipments.......
@@neeljavia2965 bullshit, they actually allowed it to work, no one was going to buy a vehicle back in the 90's with 100 or 150 miles of range....
I actually think the M3 LFP battery is the better battery for a standard range M3. The lower energy density doesn’t matter much because the pack had a lot of empty space anyway, and LFP likes being charged to 100% instead of 80% so you have more usable range on a daily basis. Now it looks like the CATL LFP is also better designed as well. And LFP is less likely to catch fire, important for consumer safety of mind with recent fires.
Not to mention LFP easily has a total lifespan of more than double that of Lithium Ion, while being far cheaper.
Also degredation is a huuuge point. Lfp will actually have more range than after X amount of miles
Edit: more range than NCA
If love this battery. Full power down to 10% and the performance motor on back :) my solar generator charges everything that is not needed in the house into the battery.
However, the LFP pack reduces vehicle load capacity of Model 3 and Model Y SR+ to a point where you can hardly put 5 people and their luggage inside of them - weightwise. So, Tesla should increase maximum permissible weight to make up for that.
The main issue with LFP is cold weather behaviour, you get a larger drop in performance vs the standard 2170 packs.
Now if you live in a hot climate this is not an issue, but it is obviously not true for everyone.
You were born in CANADA!!!!!!!!! That changes everything!
I had a BMW 1200GS the huge boxer with two 600cc slugs whacking in and out. The 14 Amp hours lead acid starter battery weighed 5kg (12 lbs). I switched to a 4 Amp hours LFP weighing 0.8kg (2lbs) it kicked the engine over better than the heavy lead acid and was small enough to tuck away anywhere on the bike.
The snag was poor cold performance. Easily solved by a heater pad and coolant conditioning in EVs.
That's a pretty cool mod! These days, with the availability of ultra capacitors, those can be used to get around the cold temps to start that big Beemer.
Thanks Uncle Sandy and Mujeeb for sharing the history of early EV's. I've been cautiously moving towards purchasing an EV, and am certain my next daily driver will be an EV. Amazing how the automobile industry has been so rigid and averse to change.
Next time you're coming through Colorado make a stop at the Rocky Mountain Institute and see their working Edison iron battery solar system, and ask Mr. Lovins about his hypercar design.
Loved how they both put their hands all over the pack with the big "DANGER HIGH VOLTAGE" sign. I'm sure they knew it was safe, but the signs were there. :)
Thank you!
You're welcome!
I love watching this channel because it sheds so much light on the future, not only with regards to electric vehicles, but to our species as a whole. In a world seemingly so full of people looking for handouts, it's easy to become jaded and overlook all of the human collaboration that is also taking place right now. We are living in the midst of several technological paradigm shifts, and this era of human civilization will be told for thousands of years.
At 9:50 Sandy refers to Egypt having electrical technology. If you look at the Pharaoh statues they are holding rods made of copper and zinc when held produce .75 volts. Make them yourself or get them on amazon or etsy called the "cylinders of the pharaoh"
See - Bagdad battery.
That was your best yet Sandy, super informative, great stuff....keep bringing this kind of high quality info, made my day!
Thank you! Will do!
I like this solution especially for converted vehicles where a larger battery is added. Also LiFePO4 is much safer. Nevertheless, i am interested what the Tesla guys deliver with the 4680 cell. Thats just standard knowledge and can be done by all companies.
But, Tesla is capable to get the batteries and produce the cars out of the batteries. The company going into this big quantities. They drive the development etc.
Looks like this is the closest we'll get to a MIC LFP Model 3 battery teardown. I'm not complaining; it's good stuff! Thanks for the overview, even if it was only that.
Also really cool to see a brief history of EVs. That interior was amazing. Old cars are something else, man.
I was waiting for LFP teardownvever since they Tesla put them in Chinese made Model 3s!
Excellent video!! I'm considering a Model Y. The Chinese one has LFP batteries. I plan on keeping the car 20 years. LFP looks like a better option. See Tesla Bjorn's channel testing a Chinese Y with LFP. Looks excellent.
Rigid battery pack plus giga casting a home run.
Y with lfp.does not exist
not to mention, newer lifepo4 batteries have a 5000-7500 cycles life. That means if you get 300 miles from 1 charge, your pack is good for 1.5 millions miles before reaching that 75-80% rated capacity.
lifepo4 are really the future, even if they are not as energy dense as standard li-ion. And they are getting cheaper really fast.
AND they Have no problems when used in a V2G configuration, because they Have the cycles to Do that easily. So charge the car when the Sun shines and usea little Bit in the Night for Your home.
19:24 - Sandy is so fixated on that cover ahaha! You can see how he just wants to toy with it.
I'm strangely impressed by Mujeeb's hair, coming from someone with thining hair on top. A robust patch in the front, sides and back. Shining top. Nicely done.
Extremely informative. Watched every second of the episode. Love to see what's evolving in the industry. Thanks Sandy and Corey!!
21:30 Haha, you can tell how annoyed Sandy is by that cop-out answer but he's keeping it clean for the kids that are watching
Love the horseless carriage story. Good quality content, keep it coming, thx.
Thanks, will do!
Very Awesome presentation , thanks !
You are welcome!
the latest generation model 3 battery pack is 82kWh. 74kWh battery packs were 1st iteration and I think the current Model 3 is on its 3rd or 4th iteration.
I had the pleasure of briefly talking to Mr. Ijaz while charging at the Supercharger in Bay City this summer. He was towing a horse buggy on a trailer with his Model Y and I struck up a conversation with him. Being an Electrical/Computer/Software engineer, and not knowing who he was, I was really impressed with his breadth of knowledge and enthusiasm for the future of BEVs. After I looked up his company, I was shocked that I could randomly wander across a person that's so involved in the field.
Great Video. Thanks to Monroe and Mujeeb at ONE.
I can basically guarantee you that the new Model 3 LFP battery pack was designed by the former Grohman engineers and some other Tesla engineers. Grohman was purchased by Tesla for their world leading expertise in automating production.
Great video !!!!
Wow. That car - Anderson Electric - is so beautiful and revolutionary ! People don't know about this company
Another outstanding insight to just how fast developments are moving and coming down the line. Looking forward to the next visit. Thanks.
More technical detail on that 3,2V CATL cells would be great 😀 (size, Ah). There is a lot of people (really all over the world) DiY building powerwalls from prismatic cells like that, from manufacturers CATL, EVE and LISHEN.
This continues to be one of my top 3 TH-cam channels that I never miss!
It’s the Model 3 standard-range LFP battery. (Not: short range) Currently has 55kWh but coming models should have 60-61kWh LFP
Wow! 60 kwh sounds good enough, do you know its coming in near future, months?
@@deas1972 Probably 2022 if not already. 60kWh is certainly enough for 90% of people. No need for no cobolt!
@@deas1972 Q4 2021.
@@quansun7633 great news! I had ordered one SR+ with delivery december sales advidor said. Last shipping was from Shanghai to Sweden. They Said that next delivery can be bott from Usa and China. Will Tesla put in 60 kWh in both factorys you think?
@@deas1972 I read a post from tweeter. It shows a map of batteries used for model 3, Y , S and X from 2019 to 2021. It appears the 60kwh LFP battery from CATL will be used in both Fremont and Shanghai from Q4. Hope it is accurate.
The switch from early EVs to ICEVs was all about the COO (cost of ownership). Now COO takes us back to EVs. Got me laffin. 😁
Lol.... wrong, it was all about the flexibility and the range that ICE gave to people, the ICE from gasoline to diesel have been used power trains, ships, aircrafts, for mining, agriculture to build the roads, the grid, dams, infrastructures basically the ICE has built the world.
While ice vehicles may have built the world , at the same time they were polluting it to death. The true cost of ownership will be paid for by many generations that will only see them in old movies.
Back in the day, 90 cents was real money, but the point is real and pertinent. EV is the future. I love no oil dripping on the driveway, no smelly exhaust, no oil and spark plug changes, instant power and torque, the quiet ride, etc. etc.
Great tour. Thanks for sharing this
>@12:45 ..
Great Sandy, that was a very good interview at Ones facility, very interesting indeed and looking forward to what One has going on for the future...!
The FUTURE is in LI- Silicon batteries.
This is truly incredible thank you Monroe and friends so much for all that you are doing
4:43 the only time I have ever seen Sandy giddy.
What great old technology . Thank you for the show . Keep smiling everyone
Imagine a world where the EV maintained the dominant mode of transport since 1908.
It would be a whole lot quieter and the atmosphere would be a damn sight cleaner. Would advanced battery technology have spread to industry, ships and commercial aircraft by now? I think so. Maybe there would be no major HICC problem by now. But then we have to factor in wars and the kerosene jet engine would probably have eventually been dominant in that sector, if it had been invented in this alternative timeline. It's a fascinating "What if..?" question though.
Then for the most part of the century we'd be running on coal essentially + have overhead of all the problems / costs of the battery + analog battery management systems + slow charching due to lack of high power inverters
@@pawelmagnowski2014 You're imagining a world where there would have been little or no progress in battery and associated technologies.
Henry Ford, the great planet killer.
For individual transport, sure. But to transport Americans cross country: trains, trolleys and subways would also have to have improved significantly. Which means the conspiracy between GM, Standard Oil and Michelin to buy up and shut down trolleys and replace them with buses also could not have happened.
What's your name?
"Mujeeb"
Hi, Bujeev! Mind if I call you Bujeev?
...
Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, ...... Beetlejuice.
Mr Bejabers, I'm Sandy...
i watched this episode on first day without taking the LFP battery seriously which is Tesla's future and most EVs. Packaging of LFP turns out to be so good, there's plenty of space left.
Munro should have analysis or review with the LFP battery by now. but no, even the Plaid has no analysis yet.
This was a good one....past/present and future in 22mins. Thanks Sandy
Look at the amazing beautiful Curves in that ancient electric-car! Really really beautiful design.
I hope the big three are getting and education also, I learn so much from these videos.
THANKSGIVING Sandy
Thanks guys. I learnt a lot in 20 minutes. Appreciate your efforts
Great episode. ONE is definitely worth following up. Very historical and educational.
Many thanks to Sandy & his crew for the ONE walkabout. I'm a great fan of LiFePO4 cells - their long life & thermal safety are top priorities for me. I was lucky some years ago to purchase a couple of 6-cell sample kits from A123 of their 26650 cylindrical cells a few months before their bankruptcy - some of these single cells power my now-antique Black & Decker "Dustbuster" units - one nominal 3.6 volt LFP cell in the tool's handle replaces three NiCd cells. I float-charge the cell @ the A123-recommended 3.45 volts using a low-power switching regulator added into the stock mounting fixture, and these little vacuum cleaners will suck hard for well over 20 minutes. Very happy...
Love that vintage car. When I was a kid we had a 1929 Dodge that had to be started with a crank or rolled down a hill. It had a really nice interior just like this car.
I believe the 2021 Model 3 Battery Pack is now 82KWH.
Super interesting video so glad that you were invited to their factory,looking forward to the next episode
As always great video Sandy
Great episode. Thanks for sharing ONE's innovation. Looking forward to a return visit.
Always interesting and informative. Thanks Sandy.
Hello Mr. Munro Great video thank you for making it. There’s a neat story about an old woman that lived in a hotel somewhere in California I believe maybe it was New York but she was driving her Baker electric clear into the 80s. Jay Leno told part of a story in one of his videos but never told anymore. I’ve always wanted to hear more about that story.
Lovely video about history, present (Catl LFP battery), and future (next video). Thanks a lot
LFP pack looks so much simpler. And with better safety and longevity, if you can do without the extra miles, looks a way better option.
Plus cheaper to make *and* more sustainable and environmentally-friendly (no Nickel or Cobalt needed). It’s a win-win all around besides them being slightly less energy dense. I really hope Tesla and other EV automakers start switching to LFP batteries in the near future.
@@philorgneopolotin8762 all manufacturers have already been using LFP batteries, tesla was among the last one to do.
carholic1336 you’re so wrong lol. Almost none of them use it. If they actually did then all EV’s would be recommended to charge to 100% every single night no problem, but surprise surprise, literally none of them advise that besides the few LFP’s Tesla’s sold. I’d love to see some proof that *all* other automakers use LFP batteries and Tesla was the last to do so.
@@philorgneopolotin8762 do you even realise how dumb you sound?! Tesla started using CATL LFP batteries recently unlike other manufacturers, you seem to have forgotten that CATL has been making and selling batteries to other companies right!
Always enjoy these episodes with Sandy. He is helping all of us non-engineers to understand batteries and EVs. With all the negative stories in the news these developments in batteries are a big positive. Have owned a Tesla Model Y for a year and never going back to ICE. Thanks Sandy!
A very informative and beautifully presented video. Chapeau!
SANDY!! Excellent history session!! Great education for the "old dumb guys" !! Greatly appreciated!! Greetings from Canada!! GIDDYUP!!
We need more documentaries on early electric cars. It is crazy how mature the industry was getting when oil displaced it by being cheaper. They had public chargers all over and it was a huge selling point to charge at home.
The first Porsche was electric.
I have no idea what they are talking about but I definitely feel smart watching this.
wooo! finally we see the lfp
Took a long time.
I liked how Mr Munro casually yet comfortably explained that he knows something of the 'hidden' history not taught at public schools.
I assume he thinks of word etymology too, knows why cannabis was made illegal and why the alcohol prohibition stopped biofuels a 100 years ago as well.
Excellent. More of this.
Thanks for a great video, Sandy and ONE!
That was a worthwhile watch. Thanks.
What a great story. Love the history that goes with the future of electric transportation.
I believe the reason LFP batteries are made in China is due to a patent held in the US preventing most people in the US making them. I find it interesting that that is not more widely known. Its almost like its been covered up.
They aren't prevented from making them (or weren't as I think most patents on this expired this year) , they would have had to pay a license fee though, Chinese companies were exempt from said fee.
@@bluetoad2668 Yes, I should have been more accurate. Prevented due to exorbitant license fees. And yes, my understanding is that the reason why Tesla is moving to using them even in the US has to do with patents expiring. I just find it interesting that this doesn't seem to be more widely known.
linkzable true, but LFP is only the battery. I got an LFP model 3 in the US and the car is still made and manufactured in Freemont, CA, only the battery is shipped from China. So at least for now, even the LFP model 3’s in the US are still not technically MIC.
Thank you. Great show🔋👍⚡️
Interesting, It seem there is 4 bricks of 27 LFP cells (108s 1p of CATL cells) for 345V nominal 16:00
amazing video ( as always). Thanks for sharing this interesting content.
Looking good these LiFePO4 packs, and nice history lesson!
This was awesome! Jam packed full of history
According to spec sheets the Aries pack is a little shorter than one of the four modules in a tesla, twice as high, and twice as wide. Is this aimed at cars? Because that shape seems really awkward for the now standard skateboard. I can't figure out how else it would fit in a car without compromising other aspects like interior seating positions, cargo space, or impact isolation. Maybe it is aimed at F-150 size pickups or delivery vans, where the pack could slide in between the ladder frame.
It is probably for all kinds of mobile applications including SUVs and pickup truck conversions, truck conversions, transit bus conversions, boats (Torqueedo went with the BMW i3 pack which is a similar "brick"), caravans and stuff.
Cybertruck comes to mind.
The specs would indicate that each of the 108 cells are 200 amp hour each and at that capacity are pretty big !!!
@@staudtj1 200 Ah is a pretty normal cell size. The ONE Aries pack is composed of 200 Ah blade cells, the presented Tesla-CATL pack has about 180 Ah per prismatic cell.
Mercedes EQS uses 140 Ah cells by CATL in NMC-811. BYD Han uses LiFePO4 pouch cells in blade style of about 165 Ah.
It would drop in beautifully in between the frame rails of a semi truck
Very interesting! Thank you.... what is old is new again!
What did you learn about the thermal management on that TESLA LFP battery?
Is it winter-proof?
@@abraxastulammo9940 LFP batteries dislikes cold climate (more than the other ones), so as i m from montreal canada, the temperature management is important. Will see the effect on the comming winter...
@@lionelboulnois2548 northern china gets pretty cold, and teslas have always had LFP in china, the winter performance is most likely good. if it wasnt, you would have heard a bunch of complaints by now.
@@PeteZam You can read the nextmove dossier about Tesla LFP winter performance from Dec 2020.
just engineering problems - cost is of course over riding goal. Safety a major factor. May well be the future for most affordable every mans vehicles.
We grabbed some LFP packs and stuck them together and we built an efficient structural battery 🤪
Excellently summarised history by Mujeeb Ijaz, this is exactly the right type of message to send out to everyone to restore hope. Much appreciated!
Nice tour and presentation.
Amazing. Fun. Loved it.
Thanks so much!
Great show. You gotta know history to live in context. Your host was totally correct.
I was wondering what the inside of a Tesla CATL/LFP looked like, Sandy. Thanks for that and I do like the presentation from Our Next Energy. The antique stuff was cool as well.
Thanks, Sandy. This was very interesting.
And I did not know the story about the starters for the ICE's.
gm and FORD stole the PARENTS for the starter motor from it's INVENTOR who worked for DODGE.
@@markplott4820 Interesting .I ever build a slipring automate for GM at PHILIPS in the 90's here in Belgium.Those sliprings were used for the GM starters. Did you ever saw the movie " flash of genius " ? A real life story about the wiperblade interval inventor.
So many new things and lots of neat history. Technology is going crazy and innovation is king.
Very interesting conversation!
Awesome Anderson. Even today it will be more easy to maintain and drive then any ICE. Certainly the same period models.
Nice history on battery.
Great lessons about the history. I just missed the oppertunity to buy a 1960 Henny Killowatt! That was quite alone in its day, somewhere in the middle between todays EV era and the one 100 years ago.
Now I want a show of Sandy's projects!
WOW! Awesome 👍