In theory manhattan would lose a lot of land to the sea, but being honest, with all the long lasting tech, I can see the underground drains still working 200 years latter
That and parts of Manhattan wouldn't slide into the Atlantic due to it being built on a massive chunk of bedrock which allows them to build such tall buildings on a island.
Between a lot of Fallout's technology being damned near apocolypse proof, and the roaving swarms of robots of all stripes? I'd expect the drainage system to be in reasonable working order. Sections in disrepair or flooded, but still functioning.
The only defence to such an attack is to have things spread out. Which in the US it is not, at least in the 'capital wasteland area'. Chances are nothing would survice an initial attack even.
Proctor Ingram says they flew over new York on their way to Boston and that most of the sky scrapers are still standing but that the situation on the ground was "hellish"
New York is built on crazy strong bedrock, why skyscrapers can be built so tall. Seems perfect for vaults. The old pneumatic systems beneath the city, subway systems, and underground tunnels for roads are perfect for secret vault entrances, raider lairs, underground settlements. If DC is how it is as the literal capital of the old US why would NYC be any worse? Who’s to say there isn’t a New York Mr House who had enough money and know how to shoot down a couple bombs like he did
All valid reasoning but the real question left is 'Would it make a fun game?' Taking the lore as a whole there's every reason to believe the financial district might well have been an anthill of vaults and bunkers. Downside is it's a terrible location for postwar settlements. Without the infrastructure of a functioning society there's no good reason for survivors or exiting vault dwellers to stick around rather than head upstate where farmland and fresh water could be found. It's not enough for people to survive the war, there need to be a reason for people to fighting over what's left. No conflict, no story. A better setting would be farther up the Hudson with lower Manhattan being a late game destination story-wise. You're still wedging yourself in between two other already explored areas so largely just doing more of the same as 3 and 4. I'm hoping they'll either return to the west or finally branch out to the largely untouched mid-west. I'd love to see what happens when Caesar's Legion runs into the City States of the Mississippi Valley or some such really new environments.
if im not mistaken either haylen or another brotherhood member in fallout 4 says that as they were coming to boston they passed buildings so tall that the pyrdwen almost hit them, so unless they want to make Philadelphia or Baltimore a much larger city they were most likly referencing new york
@@azeria1 possibly, it’s been too many years since I’ve listened to the holotapes in game, even tried to delete this comment cause as soon as I hit enter radking mentioned this very tape really need to start waiting to the end to comment lol
It’s a tale as old as time. Person speculates on subject, other person makes the speculation their personal headcanon, yet another person takes the headcanon as canon, and it just spreads from there
@@Maliz_Ultraviolet_Lantern I used to have this yugioh gba game and a few other children I went to school with had the same game. One day I speculated to one of the kids “I wonder if you beat the whole game if you draw exodia” and like a week later everyone was playing exodia because apparently the kid I was speculating to just went and told everyone that’s what happens even though I definitely asked “what IF this happens lol that would be cool”
@@demonic_myst4503 And those same people act angry or that "Canon doesnt make sense" when said canon doesnt include their flimsy fan theory. Its perfectly fine to have headcanons. But thats it. They are your speculation.
I mean, there is a really easy answer to this question. The Boneyard, Los Angeles is the second largest city in the US, so it makes sense that New York suffered a similar fare. The city was certainly hit pretty bad, and most of its buildings are definitely in ruin, but there is no reason to think it's a crater.
Makes sense that New York would be heavily targeted and decimated, similar thing with Las Vegas, even though the majority survived, House claims that a total of 77 warheads were aimed at Vegas, though only 9 actually hit
NYC is a big place, so never say never about Bethesda making a Fallout game there. Broadway and midtown might be a radioactive crater, but there's plenty of other places in NYC that could have survived the barrage of nukes in some form. 🤷🏻♂
Manhattan is the core of NYC and I can absolutely believe China pounded it to hell. Queens probably got smacked too because that's where JFKIA is. But Brooklyn and the Bronx are probably still standing, and I promise Staten Island is completely unscathed.
Given how significant New York City is, I'd expect it to have a similar amount of devastation as DC. Granted I'd also expect NYC to have a conglomerate of ultra rich people who made it even more of a bastion than House made New Vegas.
Depends on what you consider more important, a economic or a government target, New vegas was targeted by several MIRVs and that was not that economically important, its possible New york had more MIRVs target it than DC. Their is also the notion that DC was likely more protected by the military air deffenses.
That is pretty much what I consider as well. DC was hit hard, but not completely destroyed. Vegas was hit, but fared pretty well (mostly thanks to Mr House) LAA was hit, but is still inhabited. (even if mostly by ghouls) So the seat of government and a civilian and military location and a large city stayed somewhat intact. Chances are good at least some of NYC is still around.
New York is arguably much more important to the stability of the US than DC is. New government can be created from the members of congress and the executive who weren’t in DC at the time, the entire financial capital can’t be recreated if it’s gone
@@logancarlile8895 Wrong, sorry :) Any idiot can be a "leader" What's truly IMPORTANT is actually food, water, electricity, organization of those and other *essentials* And of course, manufacturing. At least Fallout's world has far better local, long term electric production capacity with all the micro-nuke generators, than our idiot world where all infrastructure has been allowed to rot, because it isn't "profitable" for corporations to maintain essential necessities for Human civilization! :(
If Bethesda was up for a bit of a genre swap for the franchise, I could see a great idea for a survival horror rpg in NY. Start in a vault below the city that has been unable to contact anyone outside or even their own security cameras. They are forced to finally open the door to find resources but are attacked by feral ghouls. Cue the escape from New York theme.
How about New York becomes the largest glowing sea ever or the most mutated area due to a mix of maybe nuclear or biological or both that have a lot of mutants minus the super mutants. And to add if their was a power outage that means they have mistaken it a large area with less developed lands and new york may have survive and have some intact structure.
In Wolfenstein the New Order a newspaper mentions the destruction of New York, maybe it has something to do with somebody misremembering from which game he got the information
Proctor Ingram describes New York as "ruined towers touching the sky as far as you can see" and hell on earth beneath them. So atleast part of the city Still stands, but the condition on the ground is so bad it scares the brotherhood. So the question is whether the ground is highly irradiated and swarming with mutant monsters or is it just so filled with the Pitt style humans and tribals that it's suicide to enter?
@@AceH.-jk5knpretty sure Hoover dam was made after the split, so I don’t think it’s out of the question for them to have been built anyway. Edit: Oops, I was wrong. Turns out it was built in the 30s. But there’s plenty of other buildings built in the 60s that were included in the games, and the most recent song featured in the games is from 2009, so my point still stands.
Because other than not being the seat of government, a 1950’s style 2077 New York has a bigger population, has more corporate headquarters, is the financial center of the country, is a bigger center of international trade with it’s harbor, and is just generally more important than a 1950’s style 2077 Washington DC.
Most of the government had been evacuated well before the Great War, so the White House and Capitol were empty buildings when the bombs hit. I don't think New York had the same saving grace.
@@EyeOfMagnus4E201 NYC is vastly more important to the continued functioning of the US than DC. As an enemy selecting strategic targets Manhattan is a much more crippling blow.
Home of our biggest financial-trading houses, our cultural 'hub,' and a plain target-rich environment with 8+ million souls. No enterprising enemy of the States would keep the Big Apple from #1 contention.
@@TaraWert1 other people are saying that New York was more important. But what if New York is as heavily damaged as it is due to the fact that it wasn’t as well defended as the capitol?
I honestly think a Fallout set in Atlanta would be such an interesting concept. Especially if the CDC exists in the fallout universe. The idea of a post-apocalyptic plague ridden Atlanta is pretty sick (no pun intended)
This is a very cool idea, historically the South as a whole was a plague ridden swamp post-Columbian Exchange, migrants and settlers to the South would often catch diseases, I don't have the data off the top of my head, but the margins were large, 30-50% of the population would die of disease in a given area.
Considering that Atlanta is already a hellhole overrun with pseudo-ghouls and crazy wildlife I can only imagine the state of it after the nuclear apocalypse.
I actually think the idea at around 4:16 is really cool having New York City be a place full of gouls it’d be really cool to have are first main character goul outside of the show and besides small locations I don’t think we’ve ever seen what a fully goul ran society would function especially in a place like nyc
Though, tbh. I just want more Fallout in general. Regardless of location. But potentially, Bethesda could do a New York setting. But subvert the expectation a bit by having it be the outskirts of the NYC crater. The Ruins of NYC as the backdrop instead of the setting.
Fallout New Orleans would go so hard, imagine what sort of fucked up shit is created in the radioactive swamps, and some factions based off of Mardi Gras and French people and like idk a rivet city like location that’s actually just a fuckin cruise ship
@@mrziiz6893 And they pull in some cryptic and creatures form New Orleans based urban legends and myth with all the Ghosts, vampires, and stuff. Mutant swamp gators and other swamp stuff.
Considering that New York is the staple of America, even in the alternate universe that is Fallout. You could imagine NY would be the main target of a strike
I think the key here is Van Buren, I remember seeing videos explaining the lore of the cancelled Fallout 3 by black island, many things of that game were used for New Vegas, the videos I saw were made by Retcon Raider explaining things of the lore of Van Buren and I kinda remember that in those videos many cities were mentioned and NY being a crater was there.
In Fallout 4 Captain Kells mentioned almost hitting some skyscrapers on their way to the Commonwealth. If you look on a map NYC is directly in between DC and Boston. Don't think New York was stated by name but it can be a safe bet it was implied unless there's a in franchise city between the 2 instead like how there's not a major city named Watoga in West Virginia.
Counterpoint. The number of people from the capital wasteland that made it to the Commonwealth (BOS, MacCready, the Nuka lady) heavily implies the absence of any significant NYC remnants.
@@venator-fb7yy in the Divide in the DLC for New Vegas, there are ruins of high rise buildings. Seems like in the Fallout universe they liked building high rises, because where the divide is suppose to be in real life there are no cities. Maybe a small town or 2. But nothing with tall buildings. So there could have been all kinds of skyscrapers between DC and the Commonwealth.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem not saying i would get offended or that its even worth being offended over but It is far to on the nose (as the other guy said) for this to ever be a real thing, its a touchy thing even though it has been so long I'm sure there are many people here who have older siblings who were not even born for 9/11 you cant act like if Bethesda did that (Or anyone else) that it would not be on fox news in a weeks time.
If they wanted to mix things up, post-war New York could be like the "Lost" cities in XCOM 2: Abandoned, husk-like ruins both empty, and filled with zombies of some kind. There'd still be a city, and there could easily be some reason to be there (Take the city, some tech, just for fun...), but it'd be alien to the other games. That said, I'd vote for Anchorage, first and foremost. Loved the DLC, and would love to see what it's like post-war.
By the time of Fallout 4, NYC would be swamps and a smallish mountain range. To get there would be nearly impossible for an average explorer. However, someone like Enclave and BOS might reach it. Since, I read once, that if NYC was abandoned today, much of it be underwater within a decade. The follower in Fallout 76 reached it because it was within less than a decade, but time of Fallout 76 onward, NYC was likely unreachable. Since NYC is on isles that were swamps getting to NYC in any direction would be very hard to do. However, Native Americans had reached NYC isles even through massive swamps. So, it could be done, I guess?
Its been many years since I played fallout 3, it was my first real experience with the franchise, and back when I played it I wasn't online much, but I vaguely remember reading a terminal somewhere owned by a ghoul I think, that mentioned New York was destroyed as well as West Virginia. I can see WV being used in 76 as it takes place right after the bombs, and the line the overseer says about over using the nukes for fun could lead to WV being wiped off the map by the time of FO3. I am pretty sure I read it on a terminal in fallout 3, because me and my friends use to talk about other settings for future games, way before FO4.
I always forget that New York is a city and a state sometimes I can imagine a new vegas esq plot about Niagara Falls since it’s probably used for power like hoover dam is would also let us see a little bit of canada as well maybe a dlc in another part of Canada
I want to do a Radio style Broadcast about adventures of the Great Lakes region starring a Pre-War Ghoul Truck Driver turned Caravan Owner where the Main Location is Niagara Falls
First of all, bravo! This video is a masterpiece and the effort you put into it is appreciated! Second, being the most heavily populated city on the east coast and this being a full scale counter-value strike... Logic would suggest there wouldn't be much left of NYC. It's probably a necropolis. Due to the fact that so many buildings in Boston were magically still sanding, it's likely that most of NYC's buildings stand as well, at least partially. The amount of radiation would have been significantly higher than in Boston. Ghouls would be more frequently encountered. Very, very interesting!
Still think South Dakota would be a interesting spot for a fallout game. Crazy horse, Custer park, mt Rushmore, crystal caves, the badlands and the minuteman missile silos. Lots of DLC options like chimney rock, lots of native American lore potential. Vault tec could have expanded the records vault inside mt Rushmore. Could also expand more on competing vault companies that was brought up in 76.
Maaan . . . I know that it might be fairly new 2 alot of my bros out there, But Dude it totally still catches me off guard sometimes when a Fallout NPC mentions my local backyard Atlantic City! Sooo Wild. 🤘
It would be cool if in lore, some rich folk attempted to reenforce New York's landmarks like the Empire State Building and other parts of the city only for the immense heat from the blast to melt the steel beams and plating, creating imposing, jagged steal beams reaching into the sky like twisted, mangled trees. Also giant allegators are a must, its already real.
Sunset sarsaparilla adds 5 units of dehydration. You die when your dehydration reaches 1000 units, so depending on your dehydration level you need to drink somewhere between 1-200 bottles to die of thirst
Kinda odd theory- could be New York was nuked, however isn't fully destroyed, there was an old roblox game called ATF darkness which was set in New York after a nuclear war, most of the game took place underground in the subways, with some sections of New York still being accessible, with the empire state building still standing, albeit with half of it fallen over, and a good chunk of the city still not destroyed, however with multiple giant craters spread around the northern bit, basically being uninhabitable, I think if it was handled somewhat akin to that in fallout it'd be a good balance between the two.
I'm still struggling with the phrase 'an old roblox game'... Yeah, I mean, it's not untrue, I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around it. I'm so old...
Just imagine how pissed off the Brotherhood would be if a community of ghouls restored a portion of a city and perhaps even figured out how to prevent going feral. I can already hear the vertibirds
The RadKing, preaching truth and dispelling myth, all as Atom desires 😌 Hell yeah for shouting out the independent wiki. I'll make it a point to contribute 👍
The funny thing is the whole "new York is an important target so it would get alot more nukes" really falls flat when you remember that Washington DC, hub of the American government isn't a crater and the Whitehouse only received a single hit. And then you have apalachia which China knew was becoming a hot-spot for military automation which would make it a large target as well since even if the nuke factories were still a secret the abundance of military hardware being produced would have made it a huge easy win that couldn't be allowed to survive.
You could explain it by DC having a house style defense system, the Chinese knowing that the US had multiple continuity of government plans that would mean hitting DC was more of a propaganda victory than a strategic one, and that while hitting DC wouldn't effect the US strategically hitting new York, the global financial hub with no contingency plan, would.
@Patson20 you would think. But the president isn't the government. Like there is a literal army of civil servants in DC. And only very few civilians actually joined the enclave, it was mostly military brass and industry leaders with a couple cabinate members mixed in. Sure taking out the president of the US would kill moral, and the Whitehouse would be a target regardless but have you ever seen how quickly a city goes to heck when even a small branch like the rubbish collectors don't work? Point is the target in DC is the city itself not just one fancy house.
@samueleveleigh2767 I'm not sure if you're aware of this or not....but you don't need congress, the administrative state, and the Supreme Court in the event of nuclear war. Literally the entire plan in that scenario is the acting president, commander in chief of the military, declares martial law and focuses on retaliation and response. All that matters in this situation is military command and control, and as a distant second disaster response, which the military and remaining federal disaster response agencies will handle.
@@nikoladedic6623This, there are crators all over near major sites in D.C. but they are next to or a bit off from the significant locations. Banister crator and megaton were two different instances where the bombs were deflected from intented targets. Of course only one of those two bombs going off. And Mr. House in new vegas specifically mentions anti missile technology he got ahold of and modified. So it's unlikely the white house does have it too.
Winter of Atom mentions New York if I'm remembering correctly. One of the factions is attempting to relocate from Boston to New York, but their journey is described as foolhardy and misinformed. There's also a large roaming caravan which may make a stop in New York, but I can't remember.
Weirdly, you missed the part where a Brotherhood scribe talks about NYC. They said it's full of mutants and got hit, but was not leveled. She says that when they were flying over, mutants were shooting at them and they could see them from the rooftops. I'm writing a Fallout book set in Chicago so I've been watching all the lore videos. One of the NPCs tells you NYC is still there.
@@tygonmasterfairly certain it's Ingram, but the way she says it it sounds like they were scared of it because it was so bad. I mean honestly for the brotherhood at peak power to not take a detour to eliminate a mutant army shows how big of a threat it was
I remember that, honestly, seeing as NYC was a population center, I'd imagine that it was hit by muilple nukes, maybe even some designed to irradiate an area with nuclear material that makes a area uninhabitable, by standard humans, I could see a Fallout game in New York where alot of the ground area in highly irradiated and survivors live in the sky scrappers and buildings high enough to avoid the radiation. Also, imagine the number of feral ghouls....we're taking hordes of ferals the like that haven't been seen!
@@tygonmaster she doesn't specifically say NY or NYC, but its heavily implied based on direction and use of skyscrapers (the only other option really being Chicago)
In FO4 (and even FO3) we see that people travel from the Commonwealth to the Capitol Wasteland, and vise versa, somewhat regularly. All of these people would have to travel directly through New York along the way. I’d say it was confirmed that New York no longer existed in FO4 but was strongly hinted at in FO3.
Doesn't the news announcer, in the beginning of F4, say that NYC is one of the places hit at the beginning of the game? Not saying it would be a giant crater after that, but...
I played 76 for a few months earlier this year, amassing around 300 hours. I'll return to the game eventually to do expeditions and explore Skyline Valley, and then I'll write down any and all info I can gather on quests and places and help with the Wikis
While china itself probably got hit just as hard as the US by bombs, I would expect the situation to be very different there since China isn't as geographically isolated, it has a lot of neighbors that probably weren't involved in the war and would have expanded into the chinese wasteland. I wonder if Mongolia took over again.
Interesting, yes, but almost completely unlikely to happen. The whole theme of the games from the start was it's focus on the Americana, the parodies and extrapolations based on the American zeitgeist. To do it right you'd need to hire a whole staff of writers, artists, and designers deeply immersed in the Chinese culture and particularly the culture that served as counterpoint to the same periods of US history. If you aren't aware it's a particularly bleak and depressing story not lending itself well to spoofing or sarcasm involving, among other things, what may have been the greatest famine in human history. Fallout London is great because it was made largely by people looking at their own culture the same way but I don't think you could make it work with China. Maybe someday someone will make Fallout: Hong Kong, but I really doubt it.
It will definitely be fun and not annoying when Bethesda inevitably makes a Fallout game set in New York and we have a legion of people saying this is a giant retcon, and you ask them what's their source and they don't know, and you ask them to chill out for a sec and they plug their ears. Surely, can't wait, so excited.
Bethsoft have absolutely retconned a fair bit from the first two games. First one that comes to mind is the origins of Jet, in FO2 it's invented by a gang that sells it in New Reno (you can find and raid their base and there's also a quest that can take you there to wipe them out iirc) but in FO4 it's pre-war and in vaults as well as referenced in pre-war terminal entries.
@rdarkstorm8414 I'm not saying they haven't retconned i.e t45 existing then t60 existing then all power armor in 76. I'm just saying that some people are really blind when it comes to bethesda (not that's its all unfounded it took a while for 76 to get good and fuck fallout first)
@rdarkstorm8414 Nope Jet was brought by the gunners what you read was a programmer error on the terminal Bethesda made sure to confer it being a post war drug I Fallout 76.
I had to double check because I didn't think it would be something you'd miss but in the TV broadcast in fo4 prologue the newscaster does say they got confirmed reports of detonations in new York and Chicago
I would argue a couple things against New York being totally destroyed. First, saying "The big apple is a big crater" is fairly vague. At face value, it's saying that all of New york is gone, but I would argue that anywhere that got hit directly could be called "a big crater" compared it to its former glory. Second, New York and Pennsylvania were both first targets, but we have the Pitt, no? People are still in Pennsylvania, so why could they not also be in New York? Finally, if we're talking about "important targets", what more important target could there be than the nation's capitol? And society is still alive in DC, albeit not around the big, iconic parts. I could see people rebuilding in the boroughs around Manhattan, if it was the target, and treating it the way Bostonians treated the glowing sea. "Don't go there, just stay in the Bronx" and the like. And as a side note, and total conjecture, but for Atom's Chosen, I think NYC would be like their Mecca. I could see the nuke's ground zero being some kind of holy land for the Children.
"The big apple" as I'm interpreting it just refers to Manhattan, which I could definitely see it being blown to shit, especially the further south you go. Definitely would be the Glowing Sea of NYC.
The 76 quote is good. However DC should have also been totally destroyed - it wasn’t (using the theoretical knowledge used for NYC). I do like that they scrapped eliminating San Francisco - I would like to go back there (and have it be earlier than current games) and also visit Yosemite National Park.
As a resident of upstate NY, I'm fine with the Big Apple being a gigantic crater. Honestly, the fact that nobody seems to realize that New York isn't synonymous with New York City almost guarantees that the entire rest of the state would've probably been left relatively intact. I would love to see a Fallout game set in Rochester or Buffalo, or any of the other Western New York settlements. You could even include NYC as an endgame area akin to the glowing sea, only with the added wrinkle of needing to be air-lifted in or out due to being a literal hole in the ground.
@@olliegoriaManhattan is definitely a hellscape of a giant radioactive crater, which is only slightly worse than manhattan in our world. There is less traffic in that fallout Manhattan though so ehhh
@@mrziiz6893 True. They would probably hit JFKIA too, so I'm betting Queens is in a sorry state too. The Bronx and Brooklyn might have some pockets that'd survive. But I guarantee not one bomb would hit Staten Island
I'd love a Fallout game or just DLC set in New York, with a map that really plays with the density and verticality. A DLC set entirely in one or two fully explorable skyscrapers would be really cool.
In Fallout 4's intro the anchorman on the TV literally says that they have,"confirmed reports of nuclear detonations in New York and Pennsylvania" which canonically means that at least one bomb fell in New York, which could've destroyed Broadway as the Fallout 76 robot claims. So yeah there's actual lore that affirms the theory of New York being destroyed.
A bomb falling in New York does not mean that 1. New York the state is destroyed. 2. That it was on New York City, and it was destroyed. So all we know for sure is a bomb fell somewhere in New York state.
Boston was also nuked and thereby "destroyed," but it's far from a crater, and there's still plenty of people living in the city, plenty of things to find in-game. Same for Washington, DC. When fans "theorize" about New York City being "destroyed," they mean it's utterly gone, inaccessible, with nothing to do there. There's a huge difference. People need to be more careful in how they use "destroyed," and also need to check their sources.
I think NYC and the surrounding areas would have a lot of potential. I imagine a Manhattan converted into a glowing sea, but with extensive surviving tunnels and basements which might even house settlements. There would still be plenty of areas of varied types elsewhere. A much more intact Queens, Brooklyn, and Bronx, with a largely untouched suburban Long Island.
I feel like people always forget that NY is a pretty big state and not just NYC. A game set in the state could include so much like the coast and never even touch the five boroughs.
what i remember hearing of fallout new york was that the top was full of feral ghouls but all the tunnels where filled with mole people and many of the remaining skyscrapers where filled with tank sized spiders and bus sized centipedes and filled with all the mutants
In all honesty, this is likely the result of Bugthesda's B-Team googling something, finding a fan theory that was stated as if it was fact, took it as fact without verification, and put it in the game. Canon is a fickle thing in modern fiction. It used to be that everything has a purpose and whatever is published is set in stone. Now (likely thanks to popularization by DC and Marvel), anything can be retconned at any time, and it makes everything confusing. If you can just say "Oh that story you loved? That story you invested time and money into that moved you and got you interested in the first place? Well that's not Canon anymore" and it throws everything off. Why even craft these worlds if things can be retconned on a fucking whim?
new york would be perfect for a fallout game of a bit different kind. so far we've only had the spread out wasteland kind of fallout and the closest to a really urban experience is downtown boston in fo4 which everyone loved. but new york could take that to a new level, literally. sprawling tunnel systems subways and sewers with vaults dotted throughout, a maze like surface level choked with the debri from the decaying skyscrapers. then above that the towering buildings crisscrossed with ziplines, ramshackle bridges, fallen steel beams, maybe some skyway bridges (doesn't fit for NY but it fits the retrofuture style). the verticality would be the focus with the map opening up as you unlock shortcuts up and down and between the buildings, setting up ziplines bringing elevators online, dropping beams, etc. and as you open up the underground clearing blockages in tunnels turning subway trains back on, fixing pumps to open flooded sections. then in the late game you'll have power armor to jetpack and not worry about falling. so screw the theory and especially screw the '76 reference, new york would be fantastic for fallout.
I've never heard this rumor, I have heard that New York got hit hard in the first volley but I think it was something like 20 nukes to DC's 100. Nothing that would leave it a featureless crater. Like one of the comments in the video says, it's probably just an east coast version of Necropolis. Overrun by mutants and radiation, but still mostly standing.
Probably set more underground with all the subways.Other cities in fallout also got hit but people still build settlements around them or in the ruins.
Love this video, would like to see more analyzing fan misconceptions and what not about fallout or any game series in general. Learning about the data like this is super interesting. I also think that a contributing factor to the whole "NYC is bombed out in the fallout universe" confusion was likely further spurred on by that being the case in Wolfenstein the new Colossus, which came out around the same time the fallout fan base peaked in popularity in the mid to late 2010s. Both are Bethesda-published shooters, so I feel like they have a lot of audience overlap
This was really good! I want to run an RPG Tabletop game in NY (at least partially lol) and I was trying to remember what was actually said about NY, but couldn't think of anything aside from concerned hits in the opening of F4
Good video. Great research. Being a native New Yorker, I've always wished for a game set in NYC -- but San Francisco would be another fantastic place to explore in the Wasteland. I'd love to see Chicago too.
What I would like for Fallout New York: The city itself is partly badly destroyed but also intact in places. like in f04 . certain bases or trading points include the large train station and any well-known museums or large relevant buildings. It should be possible to cross the city on the surface. but also passages like in f04 where you can go from collapsing buildings to others in order to move forward. (like the F04 highway). Also of course for New York through sewage systems or subway, rails underground where you can move. Central points like Central Park should also play a role, fauna overgrown?
As someone who studies a lot of ancient religions and the evolution of myths over time, this is one of my favorite vids you've done yet. Humans have been doing this kind of thing with stories as long as we've been humans. One thing I love too is in some of those old Q&As the Fallout devs would sometimes say things like, "We decided this for this game, but decided to leave this broader question open for fan fiction and homebrew campaigns," so I think they always wanted to fuel this kind of speculation about the wider Fallout universe we're not directly shown. It is kinda cool the fan lore became canonized though. Part of me is always happy to see that.
New York City would be a high priority target, but so would the capita, Washington DC. If large parts of DC still exist in FO3, it’s likely large chunks of NYC survived too.
As someone born and raised in NY, i would LOVE to see a fallout gane in the big Apple. Ny is more than just cities. They're are many rural and suburban parts of the state. A fallout in ny world be very similar to 3 in regards to location design. Big blasted cities, Manhattan in ruin, it would probably look a lot like The Pitt. Brooklyn and the Bronx being destroyed apartments and flats, similar to the destroyed apartments in DC. And think about all the different monuments and landmarks, after two hundred years of rust and radiation would be awesome to see. The statue of Liberty, the empire State building, the new WTC, central park, coney Island, ect etc. even if it never appears in a main game, a mod similar to Fallout London would be pretty epic
A fallout game in New York would be fun just because of the variations of different biomes you could have. There's everything from Little islands, to mountain tops, to rivers and creeks and forests, to shelled out cities. You could have such a variety of different places to explore in different creatures to interact with.
Always wondered about a smaller fallout title focused more on underground locations, perhaps roguelike, and a spiritual take on the Metro series would take form. If New York is a glowing sea or a "meteor crater" it could be a prime location for a game where the surface is a less important part of the game, perhaps even the climax.
Hey, I thought you left the atomic scientologists! Also, I wouldn't mind a Fallout set in California. There's all kinds of fun stuff here like old WW2 bunkers, nukeyouler power plants and atomic sciencey institutions. And what I like best about 76 and London is that they started designing the games with color monitors in mind. I wanna see California's haunted atomic redwood forests. And maybe a few Radsquatches. Also, is it just me that thinks if you kill an animal with a fire, shock or laser weapon the resulting meat loot should be already cooked? I mean, hey, it just makes sense.
I just got into fallout roughly 4 years ago. During the pandemic i played allllll the games in my library except fallout 4. I liked it but i knew there were other games and got new vegas 2 years ago. I still play new vegas every day and dont really speculate on locations unless its directly mentioned in the games. I live in east TN and on thr fallout show map (during the vaultec meeting) i saw there was a vault near my area. My hometown is known as the secret city because of Y-12 nuclear power plant. I always guessed that my area would be perfect for some fallout lore but ive never seen anything about it so i still have hope we get a mention in the show or future games
I mean the tv at the beginning of Fallout 4 specifically states "We have confirmed reports of flashes, yes flashes and explosions. Confirmed reports of nuclear detonation in NEW YORK, and Pennsylvania.... my God" its not necessarily destroyed but it was hit basically directly by at least one nuke that was launched in game
You mentioned a BoS Holotape/Terminal entry talking about "Tall Buildings" between DC and Boston. That could very well have been Philadelphia. It lies almost directly in the path, and they would've seen that before even reaching Manhattan. However, I do agree with most fan theories. If NYC is even remotely habitable in the current Fallout Timeline, realistically, it wouldn't be Manhattan. It'd be the surrounding mainland areas and possibly even Long Island. I wouldn't be opposed to a game set in that area, the existence of Boston and newer console hardware shows that exploration of large city-scapes is completely viable.
Well ... Already planned for craters, but I'm going to keep it existing. New York has so much potential to feed to the wastes. I would like to just say that its potential that the war wasn't initiated by the countries, thus the world institution for commerce may have been spared the brunt of the attacks s
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In theory manhattan would lose a lot of land to the sea, but being honest, with all the long lasting tech, I can see the underground drains still working 200 years latter
That and parts of Manhattan wouldn't slide into the Atlantic due to it being built on a massive chunk of bedrock which allows them to build such tall buildings on a island.
@@Abyss-Watcheryes!!
The subway would lead to the rest being submerged
Between a lot of Fallout's technology being damned near apocolypse proof, and the roaving swarms of robots of all stripes? I'd expect the drainage system to be in reasonable working order. Sections in disrepair or flooded, but still functioning.
@@marrvynswillames4975 We literally see the Boston ones still working, at least in one facility.
The only defence to such an attack is to have things spread out. Which in the US it is not, at least in the 'capital wasteland area'. Chances are nothing would survice an initial attack even.
A terminal in the Nucleus in Far Harbor lists New York as, "gone," the same terminal stated DC was also gone but didn't say they were a crater.
We can assume they lost contact with both but didn't actually check since both the Washington monument and capital building still stand more or less
I believe that NYC getting nuked was also referenced by the TV Presenter during the FO4 Intro and by the Civil Defense Signal near Fort Hagen.
@MrHolodoc newscast doesn't mention NYC only new york as a whole. The fort hagen signal does. No way it wouldn't get hit to some degree.
"Gone" doesn't mean "a giant crater". Could easily mean "lost to war" which could mean well, anything
Proctor Ingram says they flew over new York on their way to Boston and that most of the sky scrapers are still standing but that the situation on the ground was "hellish"
New York is built on crazy strong bedrock, why skyscrapers can be built so tall. Seems perfect for vaults. The old pneumatic systems beneath the city, subway systems, and underground tunnels for roads are perfect for secret vault entrances, raider lairs, underground settlements. If DC is how it is as the literal capital of the old US why would NYC be any worse? Who’s to say there isn’t a New York Mr House who had enough money and know how to shoot down a couple bombs like he did
oh no, you got me picturing another fallout 3 where in order to go anywhere you ahve to go through the subways and the quest markers are useless...
If it weren't such a ripoff of Metro, a NYC Fallout set underground because the surface is too screwed would be interesting.
@@andrewdemarco3512 don’t let T*dd see this 😭😭
@@andrewdemarco3512 I remain the sole person on earth that thought that was interesting. 😂
All valid reasoning but the real question left is 'Would it make a fun game?' Taking the lore as a whole there's every reason to believe the financial district might well have been an anthill of vaults and bunkers. Downside is it's a terrible location for postwar settlements. Without the infrastructure of a functioning society there's no good reason for survivors or exiting vault dwellers to stick around rather than head upstate where farmland and fresh water could be found. It's not enough for people to survive the war, there need to be a reason for people to fighting over what's left. No conflict, no story. A better setting would be farther up the Hudson with lower Manhattan being a late game destination story-wise. You're still wedging yourself in between two other already explored areas so largely just doing more of the same as 3 and 4. I'm hoping they'll either return to the west or finally branch out to the largely untouched mid-west. I'd love to see what happens when Caesar's Legion runs into the City States of the Mississippi Valley or some such really new environments.
if im not mistaken either haylen or another brotherhood member in fallout 4 says that as they were coming to boston they passed buildings so tall that the pyrdwen almost hit them, so unless they want to make Philadelphia or Baltimore a much larger city they were most likly referencing new york
Also full of strange mutants and ghouls right? I think that's how the line went
@@azeria1 ye definitely. New York is still standing but likely filled with mutants and ghouls
@@azeria1 possibly, it’s been too many years since I’ve listened to the holotapes in game, even tried to delete this comment cause as soon as I hit enter radking mentioned this very tape really need to start waiting to the end to comment lol
@azeria1 Maybe a super mutant colony that formed from a FEV secret facility under New York....or a ton of Ghouls
@@Moftheg could be Chicago maybe?
It’s a tale as old as time. Person speculates on subject, other person makes the speculation their personal headcanon, yet another person takes the headcanon as canon, and it just spreads from there
@@Maliz_Ultraviolet_Lantern I used to have this yugioh gba game and a few other children I went to school with had the same game. One day I speculated to one of the kids “I wonder if you beat the whole game if you draw exodia” and like a week later everyone was playing exodia because apparently the kid I was speculating to just went and told everyone that’s what happens even though I definitely asked “what IF this happens lol that would be cool”
Ive met peoppe who in this exact debate began trying smugly claim head cannons are cannon if the comunity agrees on it using the term fanon as logic
@@demonic_myst4503 And those same people act angry or that "Canon doesnt make sense" when said canon doesnt include their flimsy fan theory. Its perfectly fine to have headcanons. But thats it. They are your speculation.
Headcanon is dumb.
I think the worst extension of this is when the misconception gets added to a wiki, and then someone working on the thing ends up making it canon
I mean, there is a really easy answer to this question. The Boneyard, Los Angeles is the second largest city in the US, so it makes sense that New York suffered a similar fare. The city was certainly hit pretty bad, and most of its buildings are definitely in ruin, but there is no reason to think it's a crater.
Chicago was also confirmed from BOS lore and dialog to essentially have been destroyed heavily from the war.
Makes sense that New York would be heavily targeted and decimated, similar thing with Las Vegas, even though the majority survived, House claims that a total of 77 warheads were aimed at Vegas, though only 9 actually hit
9:13 Confidently walks towards a supermutant with a Gamma Gun. Is this how RadKing plays the game normally?
The mutant is just bathing him in Atom's glow!
NYC is a big place, so never say never about Bethesda making a Fallout game there. Broadway and midtown might be a radioactive crater, but there's plenty of other places in NYC that could have survived the barrage of nukes in some form. 🤷🏻♂
Manhattan is the core of NYC and I can absolutely believe China pounded it to hell. Queens probably got smacked too because that's where JFKIA is. But Brooklyn and the Bronx are probably still standing, and I promise Staten Island is completely unscathed.
i hope they turn the statue of liberty into a settlement
Given how significant New York City is, I'd expect it to have a similar amount of devastation as DC. Granted I'd also expect NYC to have a conglomerate of ultra rich people who made it even more of a bastion than House made New Vegas.
Depends on what you consider more important, a economic or a government target, New vegas was targeted by several MIRVs and that was not that economically important, its possible New york had more MIRVs target it than DC. Their is also the notion that DC was likely more protected by the military air deffenses.
That is pretty much what I consider as well.
DC was hit hard, but not completely destroyed. Vegas was hit, but fared pretty well (mostly thanks to Mr House) LAA was hit, but is still inhabited. (even if mostly by ghouls)
So the seat of government and a civilian and military location and a large city stayed somewhat intact. Chances are good at least some of NYC is still around.
Idk about New York being a crater considering Washington D.C the capital of the US isn't just a giant crater
Well, the devs admitted that DC would eb shaved flat by all the nukes and firestorms, but that would be too boring ot play in so they had ruins ;)
To Bethesda's credit, it's as close as we've seen so far.
@@silverbladeTE thats true I'd think you would want to not have everywhere flattened so you have options for settings.
New York is arguably much more important to the stability of the US than DC is. New government can be created from the members of congress and the executive who weren’t in DC at the time, the entire financial capital can’t be recreated if it’s gone
@@logancarlile8895 Wrong, sorry :)
Any idiot can be a "leader"
What's truly IMPORTANT is actually food, water, electricity, organization of those and other *essentials*
And of course, manufacturing.
At least Fallout's world has far better local, long term electric production capacity with all the micro-nuke generators, than our idiot world where all infrastructure has been allowed to rot, because it isn't "profitable" for corporations to maintain essential necessities for Human civilization! :(
If Bethesda was up for a bit of a genre swap for the franchise, I could see a great idea for a survival horror rpg in NY. Start in a vault below the city that has been unable to contact anyone outside or even their own security cameras. They are forced to finally open the door to find resources but are attacked by feral ghouls. Cue the escape from New York theme.
How about New York becomes the largest glowing sea ever or the most mutated area due to a mix of maybe nuclear or biological or both that have a lot of mutants minus the super mutants. And to add if their was a power outage that means they have mistaken it a large area with less developed lands and new york may have survive and have some intact structure.
Ive actually thought of this a city of the dead would be so cool
Well, that, or the Duke Nukem theme. Wasn't "Time to Kill" set in New York?
@jefftanner690 They had that in 1, it was called Necropolis.
@LiquidDIO ghoul's weren't ghoul's in 1
In Wolfenstein the New Order a newspaper mentions the destruction of New York, maybe it has something to do with somebody misremembering from which game he got the information
But you have to go to new york in wolfenstein and it is still kinda still stranding, not just a big crater
@@Yanderelink1 you go there in New Colossus and it’s not really a crater
@@senorbolainas2991Yes but in the sequel the new colossus, in the new order all you get is a random newspaper
Proctor Ingram describes New York as "ruined towers touching the sky as far as you can see" and hell on earth beneath them. So atleast part of the city Still stands, but the condition on the ground is so bad it scares the brotherhood. So the question is whether the ground is highly irradiated and swarming with mutant monsters or is it just so filled with the Pitt style humans and tribals that it's suicide to enter?
@BarryMcjohnjohn i mean it has a giant crater and the rest of the city is ruins and highly irradiated.
Imagine 2 towers are the only surviving architecture
There should be a quest about destroying them if they ever make a New York Fallout game 😭
no..? the twins were made in 1966, and finished in 1973, way after the timeline split
@@AceH.-jk5kn Gotta love a video speaking against thoughtless headcanon, having headcanon as a response to one of the first comments.
@@AceH.-jk5knpretty sure Hoover dam was made after the split, so I don’t think it’s out of the question for them to have been built anyway.
Edit: Oops, I was wrong. Turns out it was built in the 30s. But there’s plenty of other buildings built in the 60s that were included in the games, and the most recent song featured in the games is from 2009, so my point still stands.
@@mtndewmslayer2564 dawg what?? the hoover dam was made in the 1930's
I feel like if the Capital would be intact enough to have a game based in it, why would NYC have been singled out as the "must obliterate" city.
Because other than not being the seat of government, a 1950’s style 2077 New York has a bigger population, has more corporate headquarters, is the financial center of the country, is a bigger center of international trade with it’s harbor, and is just generally more important than a 1950’s style 2077 Washington DC.
Most of the government had been evacuated well before the Great War, so the White House and Capitol were empty buildings when the bombs hit. I don't think New York had the same saving grace.
@@EyeOfMagnus4E201 NYC is vastly more important to the continued functioning of the US than DC. As an enemy selecting strategic targets Manhattan is a much more crippling blow.
Home of our biggest financial-trading houses, our cultural 'hub,' and a plain target-rich environment with 8+ million souls. No enterprising enemy of the States would keep the Big Apple from #1 contention.
@@TaraWert1 other people are saying that New York was more important. But what if New York is as heavily damaged as it is due to the fact that it wasn’t as well defended as the capitol?
I honestly think a Fallout set in Atlanta would be such an interesting concept. Especially if the CDC exists in the fallout universe. The idea of a post-apocalyptic plague ridden Atlanta is pretty sick (no pun intended)
@@MGHL9898 this is how I feel about Seattle. It's such an interesting place to set a FO game if you know much about the city and the PNW
This is a very cool idea, historically the South as a whole was a plague ridden swamp post-Columbian Exchange, migrants and settlers to the South would often catch diseases, I don't have the data off the top of my head, but the margins were large, 30-50% of the population would die of disease in a given area.
Like in 76?
Considering that Atlanta is already a hellhole overrun with pseudo-ghouls and crazy wildlife I can only imagine the state of it after the nuclear apocalypse.
If that’s what it takes to get rid of the traffic, so be it
I actually think the idea at around 4:16 is really cool having New York City be a place full of gouls it’d be really cool to have are first main character goul outside of the show and besides small locations I don’t think we’ve ever seen what a fully goul ran society would function especially in a place like nyc
21:38 Bethesda did make a game with nothing in it... Starfield
Instead if either coasts. I wanna see a Midwest Fallout. Or deep south like Fallout New Orleans.
Though, tbh. I just want more Fallout in general. Regardless of location.
But potentially, Bethesda could do a New York setting. But subvert the expectation a bit by having it be the outskirts of the NYC crater. The Ruins of NYC as the backdrop instead of the setting.
Fallout New Orleans would go so hard, imagine what sort of fucked up shit is created in the radioactive swamps, and some factions based off of Mardi Gras and French people and like idk a rivet city like location that’s actually just a fuckin cruise ship
@@mrziiz6893 And they pull in some cryptic and creatures form New Orleans based urban legends and myth with all the Ghosts, vampires, and stuff.
Mutant swamp gators and other swamp stuff.
@@alicevoidspeaker2100 real, especially mutant gators, I shiver at the thought
How about leaving the US altogether? I've wanted one set in Mexico since New Vegas and Raul.
Considering that New York is the staple of America, even in the alternate universe that is Fallout. You could imagine NY would be the main target of a strike
I think the key here is Van Buren, I remember seeing videos explaining the lore of the cancelled Fallout 3 by black island, many things of that game were used for New Vegas, the videos I saw were made by Retcon Raider explaining things of the lore of Van Buren and I kinda remember that in those videos many cities were mentioned and NY being a crater was there.
In Fallout 4 Captain Kells mentioned almost hitting some skyscrapers on their way to the Commonwealth. If you look on a map NYC is directly in between DC and Boston. Don't think New York was stated by name but it can be a safe bet it was implied unless there's a in franchise city between the 2 instead like how there's not a major city named Watoga in West Virginia.
Counterpoint. The number of people from the capital wasteland that made it to the Commonwealth (BOS, MacCready, the Nuka lady) heavily implies the absence of any significant NYC remnants.
@@venator-fb7yy in the Divide in the DLC for New Vegas, there are ruins of high rise buildings. Seems like in the Fallout universe they liked building high rises, because where the divide is suppose to be in real life there are no cities. Maybe a small town or 2. But nothing with tall buildings. So there could have been all kinds of skyscrapers between DC and the Commonwealth.
But there is a Wautoma in Wisconsin that I keep mispronouncing as Watoga
Great video; we've had to navigate fans' belief in this myth quite a lot.
It's one of the most common comments we get.
Can't wait to see this
It would be funny if in the fallout universe, the twin towers are the only sky scrapers still standing post-war
That would be so funny but Bethesda would not dare to put something that offensive in a fallout game even though that would be like I said, mad funny.
@@skator8423 How would it be offensive?
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem it would definitely be on the nose
@@cheesemanthe2nd Sure, but not offensive.
@@ALLMINDmercenarysupportsystem not saying i would get offended or that its even worth being offended over but It is far to on the nose (as the other guy said) for this to ever be a real thing, its a touchy thing even though it has been so long I'm sure there are many people here who have older siblings who were not even born for 9/11 you cant act like if Bethesda did that (Or anyone else) that it would not be on fox news in a weeks time.
If they wanted to mix things up, post-war New York could be like the "Lost" cities in XCOM 2: Abandoned, husk-like ruins both empty, and filled with zombies of some kind. There'd still be a city, and there could easily be some reason to be there (Take the city, some tech, just for fun...), but it'd be alien to the other games.
That said, I'd vote for Anchorage, first and foremost. Loved the DLC, and would love to see what it's like post-war.
By the time of Fallout 4, NYC would be swamps and a smallish mountain range. To get there would be nearly impossible for an average explorer. However, someone like Enclave and BOS might reach it. Since, I read once, that if NYC was abandoned today, much of it be underwater within a decade. The follower in Fallout 76 reached it because it was within less than a decade, but time of Fallout 76 onward, NYC was likely unreachable. Since NYC is on isles that were swamps getting to NYC in any direction would be very hard to do. However, Native Americans had reached NYC isles even through massive swamps. So, it could be done, I guess?
Its been many years since I played fallout 3, it was my first real experience with the franchise, and back when I played it I wasn't online much, but I vaguely remember reading a terminal somewhere owned by a ghoul I think, that mentioned New York was destroyed as well as West Virginia. I can see WV being used in 76 as it takes place right after the bombs, and the line the overseer says about over using the nukes for fun could lead to WV being wiped off the map by the time of FO3. I am pretty sure I read it on a terminal in fallout 3, because me and my friends use to talk about other settings for future games, way before FO4.
I always forget that New York is a city and a state sometimes I can imagine a new vegas esq plot about Niagara Falls since it’s probably used for power like hoover dam is would also let us see a little bit of canada as well maybe a dlc in another part of Canada
if there's a Canada DLC I hope they include Nate
Ronto DLC
I want to do a Radio style Broadcast about adventures of the Great Lakes region starring a Pre-War Ghoul Truck Driver turned Caravan Owner where the Main Location is Niagara Falls
First of all, bravo! This video is a masterpiece and the effort you put into it is appreciated!
Second, being the most heavily populated city on the east coast and this being a full scale counter-value strike... Logic would suggest there wouldn't be much left of NYC. It's probably a necropolis. Due to the fact that so many buildings in Boston were magically still sanding, it's likely that most of NYC's buildings stand as well, at least partially. The amount of radiation would have been significantly higher than in Boston. Ghouls would be more frequently encountered.
Very, very interesting!
Still think South Dakota would be a interesting spot for a fallout game. Crazy horse, Custer park, mt Rushmore, crystal caves, the badlands and the minuteman missile silos. Lots of DLC options like chimney rock, lots of native American lore potential. Vault tec could have expanded the records vault inside mt Rushmore. Could also expand more on competing vault companies that was brought up in 76.
Well, I hope there we get some references to The Day After.
Maaan . . . I know that it might be fairly new 2 alot of my bros out there, But Dude it totally still catches me off guard sometimes when a Fallout NPC mentions my local backyard Atlantic City!
Sooo Wild. 🤘
I just KNOW you were tempted to post this 3 days ago
It would be cool if in lore, some rich folk attempted to reenforce New York's landmarks like the Empire State Building and other parts of the city only for the immense heat from the blast to melt the steel beams and plating, creating imposing, jagged steal beams reaching into the sky like twisted, mangled trees. Also giant allegators are a must, its already real.
Heres a stupid fallout question: how much sunset sarsaparilla would one need to drink in fallout new vegas hardcore mode to die of thirst?
Sunset sarsaparilla adds 5 units of dehydration. You die when your dehydration reaches 1000 units, so depending on your dehydration level you need to drink somewhere between 1-200 bottles to die of thirst
@@volc9464 I'm pretty sure you'd die well before drinking the full 200. Something about that stuff just don't seem right.
A lot of sunset sarsparilla
@@singletona082according to festus its a-okay to drink sunset sarsaparilla
So, Schrödinger's City? It's either gone or not, and we won't know unless we go there and look.
"I don't know if New York City is alive or dead unless I votch inside ze box."
"ᴵ'ᵐ ᵗʰᵉ ᴮᶦᵍ ᴬᵖᵖˡᵉᵎ"
"Shut up."
Kinda odd theory- could be New York was nuked, however isn't fully destroyed, there was an old roblox game called ATF darkness which was set in New York after a nuclear war, most of the game took place underground in the subways, with some sections of New York still being accessible, with the empire state building still standing, albeit with half of it fallen over, and a good chunk of the city still not destroyed, however with multiple giant craters spread around the northern bit, basically being uninhabitable, I think if it was handled somewhat akin to that in fallout it'd be a good balance between the two.
kind of like the Metro series
Metro, but Ney York lol
After the flash reference lets goooo
I'm still struggling with the phrase 'an old roblox game'... Yeah, I mean, it's not untrue, I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around it. I'm so old...
@@DamnedSilly I'm sure it doesn't help much but I got over it about 2 years back, hurts looking back on it, but it was still good while it lasted.
Just imagine how pissed off the Brotherhood would be if a community of ghouls restored a portion of a city and perhaps even figured out how to prevent going feral. I can already hear the vertibirds
The RadKing, preaching truth and dispelling myth, all as Atom desires 😌
Hell yeah for shouting out the independent wiki. I'll make it a point to contribute 👍
This was such an amazing investigation. If you ever branch out from fallout content this type of video could do well for so many online myths
The funny thing is the whole "new York is an important target so it would get alot more nukes" really falls flat when you remember that Washington DC, hub of the American government isn't a crater and the Whitehouse only received a single hit.
And then you have apalachia which China knew was becoming a hot-spot for military automation which would make it a large target as well since even if the nuke factories were still a secret the abundance of military hardware being produced would have made it a huge easy win that couldn't be allowed to survive.
And probably they got assigned their own anti-missile defenves.
You could explain it by DC having a house style defense system, the Chinese knowing that the US had multiple continuity of government plans that would mean hitting DC was more of a propaganda victory than a strategic one, and that while hitting DC wouldn't effect the US strategically hitting new York, the global financial hub with no contingency plan, would.
@Patson20 you would think. But the president isn't the government.
Like there is a literal army of civil servants in DC.
And only very few civilians actually joined the enclave, it was mostly military brass and industry leaders with a couple cabinate members mixed in.
Sure taking out the president of the US would kill moral, and the Whitehouse would be a target regardless but have you ever seen how quickly a city goes to heck when even a small branch like the rubbish collectors don't work?
Point is the target in DC is the city itself not just one fancy house.
@samueleveleigh2767 I'm not sure if you're aware of this or not....but you don't need congress, the administrative state, and the Supreme Court in the event of nuclear war. Literally the entire plan in that scenario is the acting president, commander in chief of the military, declares martial law and focuses on retaliation and response. All that matters in this situation is military command and control, and as a distant second disaster response, which the military and remaining federal disaster response agencies will handle.
@@nikoladedic6623This, there are crators all over near major sites in D.C. but they are next to or a bit off from the significant locations. Banister crator and megaton were two different instances where the bombs were deflected from intented targets. Of course only one of those two bombs going off. And Mr. House in new vegas specifically mentions anti missile technology he got ahold of and modified. So it's unlikely the white house does have it too.
Winter of Atom mentions New York if I'm remembering correctly.
One of the factions is attempting to relocate from Boston to New York, but their journey is described as foolhardy and misinformed.
There's also a large roaming caravan which may make a stop in New York, but I can't remember.
Weirdly, you missed the part where a Brotherhood scribe talks about NYC. They said it's full of mutants and got hit, but was not leveled. She says that when they were flying over, mutants were shooting at them and they could see them from the rooftops. I'm writing a Fallout book set in Chicago so I've been watching all the lore videos. One of the NPCs tells you NYC is still there.
Care to name the scribe? Or say what game/media they were in? Or any information where one could locate such a line? There are a lot of scribes.
@@tygonmaster i think it was ingram orrrr it was cap kells
@@tygonmasterfairly certain it's Ingram, but the way she says it it sounds like they were scared of it because it was so bad. I mean honestly for the brotherhood at peak power to not take a detour to eliminate a mutant army shows how big of a threat it was
I remember that, honestly, seeing as NYC was a population center, I'd imagine that it was hit by muilple nukes, maybe even some designed to irradiate an area with nuclear material that makes a area uninhabitable, by standard humans, I could see a Fallout game in New York where alot of the ground area in highly irradiated and survivors live in the sky scrappers and buildings high enough to avoid the radiation. Also, imagine the number of feral ghouls....we're taking hordes of ferals the like that haven't been seen!
@@tygonmaster she doesn't specifically say NY or NYC, but its heavily implied based on direction and use of skyscrapers (the only other option really being Chicago)
In FO4 (and even FO3) we see that people travel from the Commonwealth to the Capitol Wasteland, and vise versa, somewhat regularly. All of these people would have to travel directly through New York along the way. I’d say it was confirmed that New York no longer existed in FO4 but was strongly hinted at in FO3.
It's a reference to real life! New York City is uninhabitable today.
I wish New York was a giant crater.
day 8 when will trash of fallout pt2 be?
2nd this
I third this
i fourth this
kinda selfish tryna dictate the content bro makes
@@KPx-ke8bg he's fighting the good fight
I believe there was an emergency broadcast saying New York was gone
Doesn't the news announcer, in the beginning of F4, say that NYC is one of the places hit at the beginning of the game? Not saying it would be a giant crater after that, but...
The announcer mentions new york state and Pennsylvania were hit
@@MrMud99 Ah! Well close, but no cigar then. But one could 'assume' NYC got smegged, but that's no conformation.
Yeah and we see Boston was also hit.
Fallout 4 isn't a giant crater though, yeah?
@@EvilParagon4 Yeah. The Glowing Sea was Ground Zero and Boston was collateral.
I played 76 for a few months earlier this year, amassing around 300 hours. I'll return to the game eventually to do expeditions and explore Skyline Valley, and then I'll write down any and all info I can gather on quests and places and help with the Wikis
it´d also be cool to know what happened the the big cities in china for example, and how everything evolved over there for the last 200 years
Robot army
While china itself probably got hit just as hard as the US by bombs, I would expect the situation to be very different there since China isn't as geographically isolated, it has a lot of neighbors that probably weren't involved in the war and would have expanded into the chinese wasteland.
I wonder if Mongolia took over again.
Interesting, yes, but almost completely unlikely to happen. The whole theme of the games from the start was it's focus on the Americana, the parodies and extrapolations based on the American zeitgeist. To do it right you'd need to hire a whole staff of writers, artists, and designers deeply immersed in the Chinese culture and particularly the culture that served as counterpoint to the same periods of US history. If you aren't aware it's a particularly bleak and depressing story not lending itself well to spoofing or sarcasm involving, among other things, what may have been the greatest famine in human history. Fallout London is great because it was made largely by people looking at their own culture the same way but I don't think you could make it work with China. Maybe someday someone will make Fallout: Hong Kong, but I really doubt it.
I’m glad this channel doesn’t do shorts.
It will definitely be fun and not annoying when Bethesda inevitably makes a Fallout game set in New York and we have a legion of people saying this is a giant retcon, and you ask them what's their source and they don't know, and you ask them to chill out for a sec and they plug their ears.
Surely, can't wait, so excited.
Dude bethesda could breath and would people freak and call it a retcon
@@jamesnwg8117 well they do retcon a lot. Idk I guess that’s why people would assume it’s a retcon.
Bethsoft have absolutely retconned a fair bit from the first two games. First one that comes to mind is the origins of Jet, in FO2 it's invented by a gang that sells it in New Reno (you can find and raid their base and there's also a quest that can take you there to wipe them out iirc) but in FO4 it's pre-war and in vaults as well as referenced in pre-war terminal entries.
@rdarkstorm8414 I'm not saying they haven't retconned i.e t45 existing then t60 existing then all power armor in 76. I'm just saying that some people are really blind when it comes to bethesda (not that's its all unfounded it took a while for 76 to get good and fuck fallout first)
@rdarkstorm8414 Nope Jet was brought by the gunners what you read was a programmer error on the terminal Bethesda made sure to confer it being a post war drug I Fallout 76.
I had to double check because I didn't think it would be something you'd miss but in the TV broadcast in fo4 prologue the newscaster does say they got confirmed reports of detonations in new York and Chicago
I would argue a couple things against New York being totally destroyed.
First, saying "The big apple is a big crater" is fairly vague. At face value, it's saying that all of New york is gone, but I would argue that anywhere that got hit directly could be called "a big crater" compared it to its former glory.
Second, New York and Pennsylvania were both first targets, but we have the Pitt, no? People are still in Pennsylvania, so why could they not also be in New York?
Finally, if we're talking about "important targets", what more important target could there be than the nation's capitol? And society is still alive in DC, albeit not around the big, iconic parts.
I could see people rebuilding in the boroughs around Manhattan, if it was the target, and treating it the way Bostonians treated the glowing sea. "Don't go there, just stay in the Bronx" and the like.
And as a side note, and total conjecture, but for Atom's Chosen, I think NYC would be like their Mecca. I could see the nuke's ground zero being some kind of holy land for the Children.
"The big apple" as I'm interpreting it just refers to Manhattan, which I could definitely see it being blown to shit, especially the further south you go. Definitely would be the Glowing Sea of NYC.
The 76 quote is good. However DC should have also been totally destroyed - it wasn’t (using the theoretical knowledge used for NYC).
I do like that they scrapped eliminating San Francisco - I would like to go back there (and have it be earlier than current games) and also visit Yosemite National Park.
1:54 if u played fallout 4 then u know that the botherhood flow over NY and this rusty city still exists but now it’s a super mutant heaven
@@thewildcat7972 didn't a member say that the tops of the ruins nearly scraped the
As a resident of upstate NY, I'm fine with the Big Apple being a gigantic crater. Honestly, the fact that nobody seems to realize that New York isn't synonymous with New York City almost guarantees that the entire rest of the state would've probably been left relatively intact.
I would love to see a Fallout game set in Rochester or Buffalo, or any of the other Western New York settlements. You could even include NYC as an endgame area akin to the glowing sea, only with the added wrinkle of needing to be air-lifted in or out due to being a literal hole in the ground.
I'm partial to there being a big crater somewhere prominent in the city but there still being a number of structures.
The big crater is in one of three places: Times Square, Wall Street, or JFKIA.
@@olliegoriaManhattan is definitely a hellscape of a giant radioactive crater, which is only slightly worse than manhattan in our world. There is less traffic in that fallout Manhattan though so ehhh
@@mrziiz6893 True. They would probably hit JFKIA too, so I'm betting Queens is in a sorry state too. The Bronx and Brooklyn might have some pockets that'd survive. But I guarantee not one bomb would hit Staten Island
Sort of like the huge crater in the neon district in Infamous? Certainly a cool image.
I love the way you just poke at the questions I didn’t think to ask while playing
Umpteenth time asking: What is the guy saying on the PA at the end of the intro?
I'd love a Fallout game or just DLC set in New York, with a map that really plays with the density and verticality. A DLC set entirely in one or two fully explorable skyscrapers would be really cool.
Why do I get the feeling that this Myth was propagated by Oxhorn...
I feel like I'm going crazy, but I remember sometime between Fallout 3 and 4 that there were rumors about an MMO Fallout game set in New York City
In Fallout 4's intro the anchorman on the TV literally says that they have,"confirmed reports of nuclear detonations in New York and Pennsylvania" which canonically means that at least one bomb fell in New York, which could've destroyed Broadway as the Fallout 76 robot claims.
So yeah there's actual lore that affirms the theory of New York being destroyed.
A bomb falling in New York does not mean that 1. New York the state is destroyed. 2. That it was on New York City, and it was destroyed.
So all we know for sure is a bomb fell somewhere in New York state.
@@Jadiaz-ev9hm indeed, we don't know where but we do know for a fact that it was nuked
Did you even watch the whole video before commenting?
Boston was also nuked and thereby "destroyed," but it's far from a crater, and there's still plenty of people living in the city, plenty of things to find in-game. Same for Washington, DC. When fans "theorize" about New York City being "destroyed," they mean it's utterly gone, inaccessible, with nothing to do there. There's a huge difference.
People need to be more careful in how they use "destroyed," and also need to check their sources.
A nuke dropping doesn't mean New York was destroyed. Multiple places were nuked but not destroyed
you should do your own full in detail fallout timeline video i feel like you give a lot more insight and deep dive into more lore than most people
Emil said they wouldn't be tied "by stupid stuff people wrote 20 years ago" so if BGS wanted to do a game in new york they would just do it.
That's rich, coming from someone who has contributed nothing but stupid writing to Fallout.
@@FuteFranta That sounds like something he'd say.
That was Pete Hines, not Emil.
@@DarthWall275 It also sounds like something Pete would say. He also has even less to contribute than Emil.
I think NYC and the surrounding areas would have a lot of potential. I imagine a Manhattan converted into a glowing sea, but with extensive surviving tunnels and basements which might even house settlements. There would still be plenty of areas of varied types elsewhere. A much more intact Queens, Brooklyn, and Bronx, with a largely untouched suburban Long Island.
It’s also believable because other super important places were completely destroyed. Like the White House in fallout 3
I feel like people always forget that NY is a pretty big state and not just NYC. A game set in the state could include so much like the coast and never even touch the five boroughs.
what i remember hearing of fallout new york was that the top was full of feral ghouls but all the tunnels where filled with mole people and many of the remaining skyscrapers where filled with tank sized spiders and bus sized centipedes and filled with all the mutants
In all honesty, this is likely the result of Bugthesda's B-Team googling something, finding a fan theory that was stated as if it was fact, took it as fact without verification, and put it in the game.
Canon is a fickle thing in modern fiction. It used to be that everything has a purpose and whatever is published is set in stone. Now (likely thanks to popularization by DC and Marvel), anything can be retconned at any time, and it makes everything confusing. If you can just say "Oh that story you loved? That story you invested time and money into that moved you and got you interested in the first place? Well that's not Canon anymore" and it throws everything off. Why even craft these worlds if things can be retconned on a fucking whim?
new york would be perfect for a fallout game of a bit different kind. so far we've only had the spread out wasteland kind of fallout and the closest to a really urban experience is downtown boston in fo4 which everyone loved. but new york could take that to a new level, literally. sprawling tunnel systems subways and sewers with vaults dotted throughout, a maze like surface level choked with the debri from the decaying skyscrapers. then above that the towering buildings crisscrossed with ziplines, ramshackle bridges, fallen steel beams, maybe some skyway bridges (doesn't fit for NY but it fits the retrofuture style). the verticality would be the focus with the map opening up as you unlock shortcuts up and down and between the buildings, setting up ziplines bringing elevators online, dropping beams, etc. and as you open up the underground clearing blockages in tunnels turning subway trains back on, fixing pumps to open flooded sections. then in the late game you'll have power armor to jetpack and not worry about falling.
so screw the theory and especially screw the '76 reference, new york would be fantastic for fallout.
I'd like to see a game based on oragon, Minnesota or even Louisiana.
I've never heard this rumor, I have heard that New York got hit hard in the first volley but I think it was something like 20 nukes to DC's 100. Nothing that would leave it a featureless crater. Like one of the comments in the video says, it's probably just an east coast version of Necropolis. Overrun by mutants and radiation, but still mostly standing.
Probably set more underground with all the subways.Other cities in fallout also got hit but people still build settlements around them or in the ruins.
A New York game would probably be great.
Love this video, would like to see more analyzing fan misconceptions and what not about fallout or any game series in general. Learning about the data like this is super interesting. I also think that a contributing factor to the whole "NYC is bombed out in the fallout universe" confusion was likely further spurred on by that being the case in Wolfenstein the new Colossus, which came out around the same time the fallout fan base peaked in popularity in the mid to late 2010s. Both are Bethesda-published shooters, so I feel like they have a lot of audience overlap
Wolfenstein in the thumbnail, a Radking video, AND discussing what happened to New York? Heck yeah!
Well that was way more interesting than it should have been. Now I want videos analyzing the external origins of other Fallout legends. Good job 👍🏻
This was really good! I want to run an RPG Tabletop game in NY (at least partially lol) and I was trying to remember what was actually said about NY, but couldn't think of anything aside from concerned hits in the opening of F4
I've never heard this myth but I do love fallout so I'm here
Good video. Great research. Being a native New Yorker, I've always wished for a game set in NYC -- but San Francisco would be another fantastic place to explore in the Wasteland. I'd love to see Chicago too.
The only thing I can remember is 4 saying there was nuclear detonations in NY
I could have swarn one of the npcs said something about it in passing
wow!!! Seriously awesome video. Sociology study done in a fallout video! Really love the effort.
this was a very interesting deepdive into the development of myths
What I would like for Fallout New York:
The city itself is partly badly destroyed but also intact in places. like in f04 .
certain bases or trading points include the large train station and any well-known museums or large relevant buildings.
It should be possible to cross the city on the surface. but also passages like in f04 where you can go from collapsing buildings to others in order to move forward. (like the F04 highway).
Also of course for New York through sewage systems or subway, rails underground where you can move.
Central points like Central Park should also play a role, fauna overgrown?
This is an incredibly well researched video and I love it.
The Independant Fallout Wiki is really good, ive been using them with Fallout London as they have sections for mods as well
As someone who studies a lot of ancient religions and the evolution of myths over time, this is one of my favorite vids you've done yet. Humans have been doing this kind of thing with stories as long as we've been humans. One thing I love too is in some of those old Q&As the Fallout devs would sometimes say things like, "We decided this for this game, but decided to leave this broader question open for fan fiction and homebrew campaigns," so I think they always wanted to fuel this kind of speculation about the wider Fallout universe we're not directly shown. It is kinda cool the fan lore became canonized though. Part of me is always happy to see that.
New York City would be a high priority target, but so would the capita, Washington DC. If large parts of DC still exist in FO3, it’s likely large chunks of NYC survived too.
I agree, I think NYC is likely much like DC, largely destroyed but not completely, and people still live there.
Absolutely love the depth of the research
Ive always wanted a Fallout set in New York since the 2nd game. It would be a shame imo of new york was destroyed
Chicago would be perfect. New region and lore to dig into.
As someone born and raised in NY, i would LOVE to see a fallout gane in the big Apple. Ny is more than just cities. They're are many rural and suburban parts of the state. A fallout in ny world be very similar to 3 in regards to location design. Big blasted cities, Manhattan in ruin, it would probably look a lot like The Pitt. Brooklyn and the Bronx being destroyed apartments and flats, similar to the destroyed apartments in DC.
And think about all the different monuments and landmarks, after two hundred years of rust and radiation would be awesome to see. The statue of Liberty, the empire State building, the new WTC, central park, coney Island, ect etc. even if it never appears in a main game, a mod similar to Fallout London would be pretty epic
A fallout game in New York would be fun just because of the variations of different biomes you could have. There's everything from Little islands, to mountain tops, to rivers and creeks and forests, to shelled out cities. You could have such a variety of different places to explore in different creatures to interact with.
Always wondered about a smaller fallout title focused more on underground locations, perhaps roguelike, and a spiritual take on the Metro series would take form. If New York is a glowing sea or a "meteor crater" it could be a prime location for a game where the surface is a less important part of the game, perhaps even the climax.
Hey, I thought you left the atomic scientologists! Also, I wouldn't mind a Fallout set in California. There's all kinds of fun stuff here like old WW2 bunkers, nukeyouler power plants and atomic sciencey institutions. And what I like best about 76 and London is that they started designing the games with color monitors in mind. I wanna see California's haunted atomic redwood forests. And maybe a few Radsquatches.
Also, is it just me that thinks if you kill an animal with a fire, shock or laser weapon the resulting meat loot should be already cooked? I mean, hey, it just makes sense.
Love the video but honestly I’m kinda tired with both west and east I want a mid western expansion
I'd love for the next fallout game to be mid west, ohh that would be amazing!!
I think that would be pretty cool, but I kinda wanna see one that the entire game takes place in Canada and Alaska
I’d like to see Fallout versions of Chicago, Cleveland, St Louis, or Detroit.
Fallout Detroit
@@Ben-kv7wrso just Detroit?
I just got into fallout roughly 4 years ago. During the pandemic i played allllll the games in my library except fallout 4. I liked it but i knew there were other games and got new vegas 2 years ago. I still play new vegas every day and dont really speculate on locations unless its directly mentioned in the games. I live in east TN and on thr fallout show map (during the vaultec meeting) i saw there was a vault near my area. My hometown is known as the secret city because of Y-12 nuclear power plant. I always guessed that my area would be perfect for some fallout lore but ive never seen anything about it so i still have hope we get a mention in the show or future games
I mean the tv at the beginning of Fallout 4 specifically states "We have confirmed reports of flashes, yes flashes and explosions. Confirmed reports of nuclear detonation in NEW YORK, and Pennsylvania.... my God" its not necessarily destroyed but it was hit basically directly by at least one nuke that was launched in game
You mentioned a BoS Holotape/Terminal entry talking about "Tall Buildings" between DC and Boston. That could very well have been Philadelphia. It lies almost directly in the path, and they would've seen that before even reaching Manhattan. However, I do agree with most fan theories. If NYC is even remotely habitable in the current Fallout Timeline, realistically, it wouldn't be Manhattan. It'd be the surrounding mainland areas and possibly even Long Island. I wouldn't be opposed to a game set in that area, the existence of Boston and newer console hardware shows that exploration of large city-scapes is completely viable.
I'm doing New York for my ttrpg. I appreciate that you did this video.
Well ... Already planned for craters, but I'm going to keep it existing. New York has so much potential to feed to the wastes.
I would like to just say that its potential that the war wasn't initiated by the countries, thus the world institution for commerce may have been spared the brunt of the attacks s