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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.ค. 2024
- With Barbara Gordon, comes Batgirl and Oracle. Two very important characters to the Batman, Nightwing and the rest of the Bat-Family. With both of her aliases comes the decision of who fans prefer Barbara to be. Another fist brawling, gadget throwing caped crusader, or a gifted hacker using her intelligence for strategy and information?
Comment below some more Batgirl/Oracle unpopular opinions!
0:00 - Intro
0:27 - @DFuxa
2:18 - @chaserowe9018
3:56 - @framerofworlds9984
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8:22 - @BladeStar-uq6xe
10:22 - @gptfights
11:38 - @J1P2K
13:35 - @zachcoats4849
15:27 - My Unpopular Opinion
17:27 - Ending
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Pulling Babs out of the wheelchair and having her be Batgirl alongside Cass and Steph is just not a very good idea.
Agreed
I personally adore Stephanie as Spoiler, but Cass as Batgirl is SO sick. Barbara is "the" Batgirl like Dick is "the" Robin, but I agree that Cassandra is the best one.
@@alexkunce2002 I agree with that too
@@Beriorn It was about the breakthroughs of medical-scientific results in real life of people paralyzed regaining their mobility just like some level of blindness can be treated to restore sight and deafness has new forms of treatment to regain hearing.
It was broadcasting the message that there is hope of returning what one thought was lost forever.
@@Beriorn true, get rid of the whole Bat family and just have the original Batgirl and Tim Drake as Robin. Jason has his outlaw crew, and Damian can join the Titans
I don't mind her as Oracle, it's just the messy circumstances that put her in that spot. Alan Moore did Barbara dirty in Killing Joke just to add angst to Jim and Batman.
I love young justice (TV show) way of doing it where cass accidentally stabs her and paralyses her and Barbara forgives her and trains her. It gives them a deeper connection
Speaking as someone who uses a wheelchair, I always thought the fact Barbara’s disability was something that she had to struggle with, but not let define her ( even after the New 52 took her out of the chair) was great. However, I never needed her to be “ just like me” for me to be able to relate to her character. Companies forget that similarity and relatability aren’t necessarily the same thing.
Visibility will always be important, but it should be incorporated with strong storytelling and good characterization, not pandering or box checking
According to DC they took her out of the chair based on current medical-scientific breakthroughs with thought to be paralyzed people managing to regain their Mobility through surgery in reality. Which is true for some but not all unfortunately.
@@DCis1 right. I read about that. I get it. Whole point of the new 52 was that the characters were supposed to be younger, and Barbara’s paralysis happened at very specific moment in her life, so it had to go, because to keep it would have aged Batman
@@Dhampir101980 I do know they deaged the characters and changed Batgirls origin story that she started her Batgirl life at 15-16 and I believe 5 years later ready to retire as Batgirl the Killing Joke happened and she was 20-21. I think the new 52 states that she was paralyzed for 2 years before her surgery to regain her mobility. She would be 23 at the start of the new 52 and they also listed Catwoman as 23 but I think Catwomans story was setup in her past and not the present.
That's how I view it as well especially when it comes to race or Gender swapping characters I didn't need to like them because they were black, white or because of a disability.
I didn't like bumblebee from Transformers because he can't use his voice I liked him because he was a cool bad ass robot that can turn into a car.
They're aspects to their character, I missed when they made diversity feel natural and authentic instead of making them reskins as a black person I find it a tad disrespectful
@@Achieme exactly. I don’t like Miles Morales just because he’s black like me . I like him in the spider verse movies because he’s an interesting character.
Batgirl getting her mobility back was based off of real life medical-scientific breakthroughs help paralyzed people gain their mobility in real life.
Stephanie Brown should've been the Batgirl of the New 52. Okay, I get this isn't a Barbara Gordon hot take but whatever. It's always remembered by people who know Stephanie Brown that Stephanie was Robin for a time, but I barely EVER see people acknowledge that she was Batgirl which is a shame because she was GREAT as the character. That Batgirl series was one of the better series DC had in the late 2000s, a time when DC was basically falling apart at the seams, and here we had just a really charming series with Stephanie as Batgirl. It started with her having to earn that title as Barbara didn't fully approve but she saw how similar Stephanie actually was to her and finally approved, letting Stephanie thrive in a role that really fit her only for it to be wiped by the New 52 in order to bring Barbara back in the role. What really sucks is that by the mid 2010s, Barbara seemed to start developing a lot of Stephanie Brown traits, specifically in Batgirl of Burnside, and that story would've been a great story for Stephanie but with Barbara it just didn't feel right. Imagine just how popular Steph could've been if the New 52 just let her stay as Batgirl, a series showing what makes her a hero, showing her vulnerabilities, her sense of humor, her understanding of her own failings, her ability to openly accept help from others, and watching her evolve into the best hero she can be. A bunch of these traits were already shown off in her own Batgirl series but we needed so much more of it. Justice for Stephanie.
Another hot take that is a little more Barbara centric is that DC should change how Killing Joke happened. Yes, it would change continuity but it wouldn't be the first time DC messed with continuity. The thing that made Barbara's crippling in Killing Joke so terrible is that Barbara was completely unimportant in that story, she was nothing more than just a pawn in Joker's goal of trying to turn Gordon insane. There's actually an easy way to change this, just make Barbara more involved in the story. Perhaps Gordon gets taken like in Killing Joke, Barbara finds out and helps Batman track down the Joker as Batgirl. When Joker's plan fails, he considers Gordon no fun and goes to shoot him to which Barbara responds by jumping in front of the bullet to save her father. Congrats, now Barbara has some agency in her story.
Also, this may be a hot take to some, but let Dick and Barbara get married finally. It sucks that the only reason DC allowed Dick to propose is because they thought they were going to kill Dick in Infinite Crisis, but because they didn't end up doing that, they just cancelled the engagement altogether and only looked back once when the let Pre-Flashpoint Dick and Barbara get married in Convergence but never brought that into mainline like they did with Jon Kent.
I really like Steph as Spoiler, but I totally agree. Tim and Stephanie together in new 52 would have fit flawlessly. Plus, we could have seen Oracle act as a mentor figure, leading Steph into finding her own place in the Bat family.
@@alexkunce2002 Act as her mentor like Barbara did for Stephanie pre New 52? On some level during the Batgirls Comics in 2021-2022 she was being a mentor to both Stephanie and Cassandra as Batgirls. Barbara was on again, off again in the wheelchair because she was having issues with the technology that gave her mobility and needed further treatment.
Plus if they truly are claiming Tim is bisexual then it's not impossible to put him and Stephanie back together which I'm all for but comics have a habit of keeping them in same sex relationships once they end up in one.
Right now John Kent is supposed to be Bi but for the past couple of years he has only been with Jay and showed no interest in the opposite sex at all but they showed us an older him with The Legion in the future happily married to a woman. Indicating he is bisexual.
@@UniverseChronology I agree with a lot of your suggestions. I don't know if you have read "The Boy Wonder" comics which has Damien studying and analyzing his 3 older brothers in the order when they were Robin. In Dicks issue #1 it included Batgirl and Damien points out that the 2 has great chemistry and are very much in sync with each other which only happens when you have absolute trust and Damien imagines Dicks parents being like that when he sees Nightwing and Batgirl pull off a stunt that he saw a video of Dicks parents do. It's also insinuated that Dick and Barbara are married and already have a child.
Crazy you used the Arkham example of Oracle, because when I was commenting that’s the exact “guy in the chair” vibes I was thinking of. I feel Oracle just works better when she feels needed as opposed to conveniently present.
Unpopular Opinion # 1 - Barbra did Oracle (Her AI From Oracle Rising) Dirty. That AI Combat Machine is basically her child.
Unpopular Opinion # 2 - I feel Barbra as Oracle is actually a bad thing because its somewhat the result of her character not being handle as equal as Batman to begin with.
In comics, Batman included, major heroes recover from their injuries eventually as a way to show their the arcs that they go through, the actions they have improved on and the situations they have since overcome.
As Oracle however it was an endless lingering defeat that the writers kept coming back to. Ironically a writing weakness even. Her own Jason Todd without that Red Hood or Tim Drake flare. And something that a Joker or whoever else would then keep coming back to finish the job and or lead to Barbra having to prove to herself that she had overcome it time and time again. It was a loop that needed to change.
Furthermore I feel that similar situations are handled too differently. During Batman Beyond Bruce becomes the chair guy because he had retired and got to choose to stop being Batman up until Terry stole his suit on some destiny mess. Within The Comics Barbra however just gets beaten up by Joker to test Batman and Gordon. She didn't chose to stop being Batgirl cuz of something she herself did, it was forced upon her by the circumstance. Barbra didn't get to make a mistake and make a new decision like Bruce did.
Unpopular Opinion #3 - Another way of imagining Barbra's transition away from Oracle is the idea that how in real life there is still a chance one can actually recover from a time they also thought was impossible to get pass, which likewise has occurred before to people with the technology that we actually use today.
What they needed to double down on is less of her recover but more-so the journey to it. But story wise writers were struggling to do that enough for some reason.
Unpopular Opinion Number #4 - In order to resolve the issues with Starfire, Batgirl should be a regular member of the Teen Titans. So that if anything happens with either its all relative.
Unpopular Opinion #5 - Barbra should have stayed the age she was before the modern era because it made her less of a side kick and more equal force in the Bat Family above a Robin.
Unpopular Opinion #6: I like else-world stories where Batgirl is the main focus of that universe because that's where one can see her more respected as a main character (sometimes)
Unpopular Opinion #7 - They did Batgirl from Zero Hour Real Dirty. Best Hero There
Unpopular Opinion # 8: Instead of Batgirl and Oracle existing as separate concepts Oracle should be more integrated into Batgirl's Persona and Suit. Well into Batman Beyond like Territory. And Barbra's Oracle Logo should exist within her Bat Symbol Instead.
Unpopular Opinion # 9 The Prototype Suit Batgirl wore for her Burnside adventures, with the wide yellow bat symbol was her best look.
Unpopular Opinion #10 - I think it matters less about who Batgirl is with and more-so how the relationship is written, and how stories around they don't always have to be some sort of Shakespearean tragedy for her.
Unpopular Opinion #11 - Batgirl's mask should actually come in layers that allow her to look like any version of the character across DC and she should use each layer based upon the stories she's in, or what happens in the story. Like Battle Armor when Batgirl Rips of her cowl you should be able see her with an open Domino Mask underneath and have her eyes showing for stories more relative to her personally or story about her connections with others. Like how the Flash as a super hero can both have an open mask (Barry) and a covered eyes (Wally)
Unpopular Opinion #12 Batgirl (Barbra) should be the next in line to take over Gotham before anyone else. Because Barbra best matches Batman's Ideal Hero outside of Cassandra herself, is the second most experienced of the family and watches Gotham more than that the other heroes do anywhere else. (Versus Nightwing who protects Blood Haven.)
And Finally Unpopular Opinion #13: In order to better develop Batgirl's Popularity she should have more a iconic Rogues Gallery from characters that fans can already recognize like Phantasm from the DCAU. As well as character's that her journey can personally heal.
EDIT: Fixed some typos
People forget that originally she was paired with Batman. She was a Congresswoman , making her older than Dick. A relationship with Dick makes a "cougar" now that's disgusting.
That was a long time ago tho, for around 30 years she’s been the same age as dick, which is the version that is most popular
The story goes like this. She worked in a library and was in her early to mid 20s, 23 or 24, to be exact. Dick was 16 or so and even in those times they would show him be flirty with Batgirl showing he had a crush on her. They then started the Batgirl and Robin comics when she was running for congress with Dick having a new design looking more like an adult, work for her campaign. He was in college, age 19 and Barbara age 27 which during these times Batgirl showed no interest in Batman in anyway romantically.
They are aware of each others identities and Barbara was clearly aware of his feelings for her, especially when he confessed that he was in love with her but she pretended to be asleep and didn't hear. There would be times that show Barbara was slightly interested or have thoughts about a potential romance between them on multiple occasions. She would admit she finds him attractive and charming but keeps talking herself out of it by using the 8 year age difference to stop her from pursuing a romance with Dick.
The popularity of the Robin and Batgirl potentially becoming a couple was huge with fans that DC decided to deage her to be closer to Dicks age to let them be together since the age difference is what they kept using to keep them apart.
As long as they are both adults. Nothing wrong with an age gap.
Finally some said it. So many forgot that she was closer to age with Bruce than she was with Dick. People like to bring up the Killing Joke movie relationship with Batman as gross. Technically the relationship with Dick was the gross one. She’s always been older than Dick was.
@@DCis1That's only partially true. They still did those golden age batgirl x batman wedding stories and other instances from there. Not sure if I am supposed to count the Wonder Woman x Batgirl x Batman Love Triangle however. I am happy to see the actual ages mentioned however.
They did say, when they did try to restore her ability to walk, it put strain on her. She wasn’t exactly the same as she used to be. It could only last for temporary amount of time.
*Most times they’ve said her dad knows it’s her but acts like he doesn’t*
True
I disagree with one thing. It wasn't her getting the ability to walk again, that made The Killing Joke meaningless, or just mean less. It was the fact, that every writer wanted it to be canon to their story, especially if they wanted to write a standard Batman story, which also goes for the mainline comics. You can't have that ending, where you think "did Batman actually snap?" and then have Batman be perfectly normal afterwards. Especially in the long run, The Killing Joke had more of an impact on Barbara than it did on Bruce, Jim or even the Joker and she was just a plot device Alan Moore put in, because he wanted to get fired. The Killing Joke works best as an elseworld story, that ends the way it ended, ambigious as to what happens next. If you want Oracle in your story, have her go out in a fight or something.
While Oracle will always be the GOAT and I love her stories as Oracle. I DO find it really strange that as far as storyline go writers can't seem to even figure out what to do with her as Batgirl when she IS utilized. Beyond shipping her with someone else. Its like they can only figure out what to do with her if she IS handicapped, but if she isn't they're at a complete loss.
Which definitely shows a lack of creativity on their part. If they're gonna use her as Batgirl, then they could use some new ideas beyond recycling the same stuff over and over again.
I think that also goes to show that there are way too many Bat-Family members (in my opinion at least). There are too many characters in which they don't know what to do with them or they keep making them do the same things time and time again.
I have a huge issue with Bruce and Babs, in the Batman beyond tie-in comic, They would never do that to Grayson. It's just so out of character for both of them!
That's not really a hot take. Anyone who's not Bruce Tim agrees with you.
@@oliveragag8576 According to Bruce Timm the whole point of it was to weird people out. He said that it was two people do something wrong and supposed to feel wrong. That's why that scene in, The Killing Joke, the music sounds dreary and disturbing, not happiness and love. Almost immediately both Bruce and Barbara felt that what they did was wrong and believed it to be a big mistake that should never have happened. According to Bruce Timm He even claims that it creeps him out.
@@DCis1with how much he uses or subtly hints at that pairing, I kind of doubt it actually creeps him out.
@@shroomfruit345 I just going by what he said at a comic con during a Q&A. That it was something he believes would creep people out if it would creep him out and the idea of Bruce and Barbara did that for him.
That's because it wasn't actually written by Bruce Tiim or Paul Dini or the DCAU crew. And was created by fan writers of the series inspired by it instead. Had it been the DCAU they probably would created a more tasteful version of the idea.
I've noticed that as Batgirl, in the New 52, she's kind of infantilized? I mean, in the New 52, she was back to being a college student. (She was *Dr.* Barbara Gordon when she became Batgirl originally.)
Amazing video, i just subscribed today after discovering your amazing channel, would love to see you complete the teen titans and do Cybrog and Starfire as the two next hot takes videos
Hey thanks for subbing, I'm glad you're enjoying my content! And yes Cyborg and Starfire are definitely on the list!
Every time I think I’ve escaped the Bat and Babs relationship, someone always has to remind me of it.
I'm inclined to agree on the Nightwing and Babs point, but with two addendums.
1. I'm willing to meet in the middle and let it remain if they just stay together. Enough of the cat and mouse crap. Let them be happy together. Its basically DC's version of Peter and MJ.
2. If they move on, please for the love of God, ship Babs with someone who isnt an immediate member of the Bat Family. It always felt weird as hell when Babs and Dick arent together and they have her go after what's basically one of Dick's brothers (or in some cases, father). If they HAVE to ship her with someone in the Bat Family, just please dont make it Bruce. That ship has always weirded me out whenever it was presented.
Dc has kinda let the remain together for the last couple of years. Even their pre new 52 versions were married before the reboot.
But I agree. Even Batman is sick of their will they won't they nonsense and got them both married 😅
Fr. Like why is she being paired with every single dude in the family across universes?
While I do agree that the idea of taking away Barbara Gordon's handicapped bound in a wheelchair and her Oracle Persona was not maybe a smart decision I think it was for the best. Because people will always go back to the og's, aka the original characters, of their personas like her as batgirl, Bruce Wayne/Batman, Dick Grayson/Nightwing etc.
Another plot Thread about this too is that with all the Advanced Medical Science stuff that the DC Universe has that it feels kind of a little silly that they couldn't actually fix Barbara's paralysis. Now I do get it that you want the other batgirls like Cassandra and Stephanie to have their time to shine as Barbara's successors but again it goes back to the fans saying they want the original character to return to the mantle.
Her going back to being Batgirl is like Nightwing going back to being Robin. She was just a way bigger and important hero as Oracle than as Batgirl.
Not sure if there were fans who wanted Barbara to regress into Batgirl and be de aged. Cass was very popular and she was the first Batgirl to get a long running solo series.
the Arkham games really made me realize why Oracle is important. I like Batgirl, and I like Barbara as Batgirl, I don't want her to be Batgirl anymore though. There are other females to be Batgirl now, Babs doesn't need to be in the suit
I think Barbara should stay as oracle for the Batfamily except for Bruce and Tim as they are the detectives of the family. Barbara should also be the one to mentor the batgirls that come in also. I think it could be really cool to see Babs struggle coming to terms with being paralyzed and physically limited and maybe it causes her to live vicariously through the other batfamily members or have her explore life outside of having to dress up and chase criminals around the city. I do like the idea of having her become mayor in a future gotham and it could be cool seeing her face off against a commissioner who is corrupt or antagonistic to the batfamily.
10:22 Maybe it's just me but this is comics isn't this the same stuff we read about characters dying and ressurecting. World ending threats every tuesday.
To expect them to keep things consistent is like expecting them to do the opposite of doing what i listed
Hey I wanted to ask for your opinion on something. I came up with this idea very recently and I wanted to know how you would like a second justice league. Like one after the first team disbands. In my ideal DC universe, after the Avengers: Endgame type event, a good bit of heroes have either retired or died in the battle. So I thought it would be cool if some younger and/or inexperienced heroes made their own justice league. My ideal lineup would be Dick Grayson as Batman, Supergirl, Wally West as the flash, Kyle Reiner as green lantern, Zatanna, Blue beetle, vixen, booster gold, and Martian Manhunter. Now I know what you’re probably thinking about Martian manhunter. “Martian Manhunter isn’t inexperienced.” And I agree. But I think this team would benefit from having a more seasoned hero to guide them and help them understand the ways of their predecessors. So do you like this idea, and if you do, who would you like on this New League?
I think the channel the first person is talking about is Casually Comics.. I could be wrong but that’s where I heard that opinion first
REALLY controversial opinion from me is, she shouldn't be a member of the Batfamily. She should be Black Canary's girl in the Chair for the Birds of Prey team IN A OTHER CITY. Alfred can pick up her position in Gotham for Batman. Shoot Batman can do it since he built the supercomputer and operate it at it's fullest. Batman can hack into Apocalyptian tech which is thousands of years more advanced than Earth's tech. She is unnecessary in the already bloated Batfamily.
Yeah that is controversial since it kinda diminishes her importance, she is normally the girl in the chair for every hero.
Can we get videos for the rest of the JL members, on who would be their ideal first villain? Or even better how you would plan a trilogy for them based on their villains ?
Changes that stay are canon, histiry, development. They're already so damn rare in the constant recycling of comics. Remaining Oracle would have been a strong statement in many ways. Returning to Batgirl is yet another comics example of "it's all temporary". In a lot of ways, it's like returning her from the dead, only to be one of many competing for the same identity.
As i said in the post, another problem with Babs is her rogue's gallery.
Yeah this thing could be said for basically all Bat-family members with the exception of Batman and (just a bit for) Nightwing but Babs' nemesis is Killer Moth...really? Of all B-list Batman villains she got THE joke villain of Batman's rogue's gallery.
P.S. i remember Barbara tried to run for mayor, it was back in the Bronze Age and i remember it cause it was Steve Englehart's last Batman comic where he used Doctor Phosphorus
Wasn't her nemesis Calculator? Also Jim Gordan Jr would be a pretty good villain take that spot for her though he is also Dick's villain.
@@huntertezz Calculator could have been considered her nemesis during the Oracle period but since Barbara became Batgirl again? I wouldn't say so.
Again Calculator wasn't exactly considered a serious Batman enemy (back when he was introduced) and got some more recognition when he basically became an Oracle for villains.
I agree on the Gordon Jr. point (having a villain in the family always works) but let's be honest: Gordon Jr.'s best story is against Dick Grayson not Barbara
That would be a cool idea for Barbara Gordon to run for mayor but her history of vigilantism will make her ineligible 😢
The best couple in DC is actually Oliver and Dinah (- ^ ) Their status quo has only ever been changed in Smallville and Arrow.
I do like Barb as Oracle but I love her as Batgirl tbh. The suit the relationship she has with Nightwing(Dick in general).
can you make an Unpopular Opinions/Hot Takes video on Tim Drake, Black Canary or Cassandra Cain?
Although I'm a fan of Dick Grayson and Barbara Gordon's relationship, I also like Barbara's stand-alone story. I like her dynamic with her father in some versions, as well as with her brother. By the way, her brother would be the perfect villain for her solo film (subjectivity). In the Arkham series, she is one of the most successfully written members of the bat family (certainly better than other Robins, again, in my opinion) I think that absolutely any character can be shown interestingly if you know the approach. Barbara's story is quite interesting and can be said to be multifaceted. Was it necessary to restore her ability to walk? The issue is moot. Personally, I don't see the need for this, but who cares about what I think. She also found herself in a new role as an Oracle, so the essence of returning to the beginning is not clear to me. Now I look at my comment and realize that I don't have any particularly hot takes. I just hope that she has a future both in comics and in other areas of media.
In my opinion if they make a movie with her brother as the main villain it should probably be in Dick's movie. Black Mirror was James Gordan jr's best story.
@@huntertezz maybe, maybe
Love Nightwing with Barb and Starfire but the best couple is Green Arrow and Canary. I just don’t want barb with Batman or any other bay family members.
Now you will never know what it originally said!
I always preferred her as Oracle rather than Batgirl. Her finding a way to make a difference even when she's in a wheelchair was really empowering and a great character moment, her passing the mantle to Cass and later Stephanie and mentoring them was great. The decision to bring her back was bad because they not only undid the character growth but also de aged her.
I never found her to be that interesting as Batgirl I think both Cass and Stephanie are more interesting Batgirls than Barbara. They don't have that many stories but both of their Batgirl runs are still considered to be among the best Batgirl stories.
Also I have noticed that some writers write Barbara to be way too headstrong and argumentative as Batgirl which I hate. In one issue she got mad at Dick even though she knows Dick got shot in the head and lost his memory. In my opinion the writers write her a lot better as Oracle.
I like that mayor suggestion.
Unpopular opinion/hottakes: Stephanie Brown, Jon Kent, and/or Roy Harper.
8:48 I think they mean that realistically, within ten minutes one of those characters could have helped heal her. She might have been paralyzed, but she would have been fixed up within ten minutes because there are so many options.
I really like the idea of Barbara temporarily possessing a lantern ring, which would temporarily help her mobility. But when the arc is done, she goes back to being her Oracle persona. This would give us, and Barbara, something a goodbye to her pre-paralysis state, without disservicing the fact that most real paralyzed people won't be able to walk again.
when are you going to do blue beetle
This is very minor and has more to do with her character design, but I’ve never really liked how her mask looks. Search up an image of the batfamily together and you’ll see a lot of domino masks and white eyes. Then you look a batgirl and it’s like, why are her eyes exposed? Where’s her white eyes? It breaks my immersion every time I see it. It’s not the biggest thing in the world, but why is it so common. I do understand live action or something like the Arkham games though, but that’s self explanatory. And on a grander note, why wouldn’t an artist take the opportunity to make it easier for themselves and just draw the white eyes. Is there something I’m missing or…? The Batman cartoon and Batman v TMNT gave her the white eyes and they were flawless imo
Her current Batgirl design has white eyes.
#BARBARAFORPRESIDENT
While the circumstances surrounding their relationships are obviously very different, the idea of Bruce Wayne and Barbara Gordon together in any romantic or sexual context makes me feel like I do at the thought of Slade Wilson/Deathstroke with Terra: Icky. I'm well aware that Batgirl was of adult age in the past, but it just feels wrong. 🤢
As someone who started reading Comics in 1964, Barbara was, and always will be Batgirl. I always liked her romance with Dick Greyson and I always liked her friendship with Supergirl! That's what I grew up with!
are you talking about her Later relationship with dick because in the 60s she was older than him and not dating him
For a change, I agree with you. She was great as babygirl but oracle was a unique character that was intricate to the DC heros . A handicap that did not diminish or stop her abilities in any way
I take it we don't usually have the same opinions? 😂
I want Babs to run her version of the Suicide Squad now
She manage the Suicide Squad once.
But her own equivalent to that team would be the Birds of Prey.
Speaking of Barbras romantic relationship with Dick i feel that Marvel and DC hardly stays commited when it comes to the romantic relationship of Characters they either have them tossed like salads, have them married or get married then divorce/ bail on the marriage.
The only consistent romantic relationship i can think of is Reed and Sue, Ben grim and his blind love intrest, wiccan and hulkling, rogue and gambit,
It doesnt help when other continuities try to make or establish a relationship that fans like which leads to a "this character should be with this character" no this character was way better with this character" like Dick and Barbra vs Dick and starfire.
15:09 So does Batwoman have an ethical or moral motivation? You didnt mention her.
Dang it I missed it.
Barbara did not create the persona of Batgirl Bette Kane did.
Pre Crisis for sure. That hasn't been the case for ages.
Yeah, there’s just no way you’re gonna convince me that Barbara is better as Oracle than Batgirl, I’d rather give Batman an AI like Jarvis and keep Batgirl. You could put her in a team like the Titans or the Birds of Prey, or a completely new team, or evolve her character like how Dick Grayson went from Robin to Nightwing, and have her be on the same level as them. But this way, she will always be relegated to only being the guy in the chair
Oracle was her equivalent to Nightwing. As Batgirl she was just another street level hero, but as Oracle she was a major character helping the Justice League, the Titans, leading the Bird of Prey (that's her team) and even Waller hired her to manage the suicide squad once.
@@huntertezz pushing buttons isn’t as cool as being an ass kicker tho, but they’re clearly never gonna do anything else with her besides that so I might as well get used to it
@@SarcastiEnchilada She was kicking ass even in her wheel chair. There have been times she has been forced into combat. Honestly she was way more badass as Oracle.
Even Joker once came for her and she broke his teeth.
@@huntertezz right… cause why have Batgirl when you can have Barbara punching people from a wheelchair, and being a secretary for superheroes. I like Barbara Gordon as a character so I don’t hate Oracle, just not my favorite iteration of the character, it’s just my personal opinion tho, I understand the majority of fans love her as Oracle
Don’t care for Cassandra. Just bland to me.
I loathe oracle. Batgirl will always be better.
Raceswap is lazy writing
i never liked barbara gordon/batgirl it's ok if you do
L
Barbra Gordon should be Bruce age not a girl.
Bat woman fits that role tho
Hell naw
@@billyboleson2830 no the BatGIRL fits Cassandra more than Barbra