Great to hear your thoughts. I felt similarly after driving the base version, the amount of potential it had was insane. I think if Nissan dialed in the the throttle, suspension and steering out of the box, it would have fared better on the market. I didn’t buy one because it would have taken a decent amount of money to make it into the car that I wanted. I feel like a lot of others felt the same way (and it’s not like the market for a new sports car is huge anyway)
Yup those 3 things need to be addressed. It's tuned far too much like a GT, which isn't necessarily bad but doesn't align with what potential customers want. I'm itching to try one with quality coilovers and a light flywheel/tune. Total cost at that point would be on par with a GR Supra 3.0.
@@Zygrene Yeah, that might be too much to justify against the Supra, but if you could manage to find someone with a modified Z, that would be a cool comparison to make if you could get ahold of a Stock Supra press car!
@@Realistick But it sounds like the base is exactly what you'd want? $10k to put in your own limited slip, coilovers, wheels/tires and an aftermarket seat that fits you? Probably a little left over for a tune or chassis or sway bar.
@@pab3783When it first came out, lack of inventory and dealers wanted $15k+ markup on these cars. This went on for 2 years. There are some selling without ADM, but they still slap on added accessories. The emotional drive to buy this car pretty much died with people more worried about inflation than buy a car that costs more than a Supra or V8 Mustang.
@@pab3783markups, I used to work for a Nissan dealer doing photography and the z I shot was 80k with a markup. Sad thing is it was the auto. Still don’t understand why this car gets hate tho, people really need to drive one first before writing it off
@@wheraboo5013it's not faster because you call people haters. It's NOT faster as a fact. If you want one, then get your parents or SO to pay out the ass for this ugly ass car. Tech advances, yes. I get that. Going another 20k more on the price tag is what is even more insane.
@@wheraboo5013 old cars like the 90s lightweight turbo cars with few electronics, Z is outdated, 370z ran 4 years too long, Nissan is lost in the sauce
@@jasondueck9130 There's a maroon/burgundy low-mileage twin-turbo 300ZX in a showroom a mile from me. They want $40k for it. If I had the extra money it could be a good investment. Drive it every now and then keep it indoors. Another 10 or 15 years and you could probably profit.
In my area, the Z is on sale at multiple dealerships for under $55K. C8 Vettes are listed for over $70K. Plus the C8 are ugly in my opinion, but I'm sure many will disagree. The C8 has more HPs, but the Z is plenty fast enough. But whatever. I wouldn't buy either.
@@JohnBowl14690 The Corvette is the absolute opposite of the Z though. It's all new technology and design, a whole new platform. The Z is old engineering and platform with a new face and insane pricing. The Corvette is more than just more horsepower, it's mid-engine. Flat-plane V8 like a Ferrari would be. It's a "cheap" super car. I don't love the look of it, but I'd take it over the new Z any day. Personally I love the C5.
@@drownthepoor - Point taken. I guess I would be more interested in a C8 if they got rid of that ugly rear end and did a few changes. To me, the C8 is close to looking awesome, but it doesn't for some reason. I just don't know why.
1- Dealer Markups 2- BMW Supra is superior 3- Other costs (Insurance Costs, high apr, etc.). 4- Other more affordable alternatives even with markups (Type R, GR Corolla, etc.).
Supra is way superior, almost as if using BMW is cheating when you use their drivetrain. Anyways, if you have the supra side by side with the 400z and you ignore the price tags, drivetrains, and performance. All you have is looks, or exterior design. The supra looks way more exotic, way more exciting, and lighter weight. Just the looks alone fades the 400z away. The 400z just doesn't look exciting, or that cool.
@@metalmike570 I agree, pricing in the 30s range would be a great deal for what you get. I would only get the nismo because the front end looks cleaned up more.
Yup, price. 12-15k over priced. The Z has always been the budget friendly Sports car giving you a deal. MSRP is no deal compared to competitors. The top trim Z should be no more than 43k after sales tax.
Lots around even at a discount where I live. Still not selling so it is something else. For me the lack of adaptive ride, 18 way leather seats, upgraded tech, manual on the Nismo. These are features of the M2 and others that are in the bracket.
@mperformance3502 $20,000 was the price difference not the price. Sorry if I worded that poorly, the 370z Sport with LSD was under $35k in 2019 and now the 2024 Z Performance is $20k more. It's had possibly the biggest price increase of any of the "inexpensive" sports cars lately.
@@mperformance3502 while I agree with that assessment, only pricing has risen with inflation, income really has not for a lot of people so it still feels like a substantial jump in price even if it can be explained away by inflation.
… and the car guys with money buy Porsches, McLarens, Superformance Cobras, or Lotuses. Corvettes have also always been “great tuning platforms”. A built C7 manual Grand Sport with all the Katech and DSC Sport engine and suspension bits is about the fastest RWD NA manual canyon carver you can get, and even the coupes have targa tops, all for under 6 figures even new. New Z06s are ridiculous too, 95% of the fun of a 458 Spyder for less than half the price, and with twice the reliability. Plenty of great track day cars out there these days too if you want something spicier than a Miata, which are also still fantastic and some of the most fun you can have new under $30k.
This right here. Gone are the days of 80s,90s, and early 00 JDM import tuners. Cars sold today are not sold barebones with respectable internals/platforms. Look at this one. A $60k+ vehicle that, off the lot, doesn't speak the language the target market does. Those folks wanna tune, tinker, and have fun. No one is chopping up a $60,000 car for the sake of enthusiasm. Those guys who have the $ go out and buy supreme performance vehicles (see: luxury) not a Japanese car with retro yearnings of yesteryear. It's not profitable anymore to sell a tuner for $20,000.
I own a 1972 Datsun 240z. When this new Z car came out I was super excited to buy one. Went to the dealer and as soon as I saw the $100k dealer MARKUP I told them to F-off and haven't gone back..
They have 9 Zs in my town dealership. All are $56,000.. That is an beyond ridiculous price. I cud buy a mustang V8 for much less. Does nissan want to go bankrupt??
The price. The Z needs to be cheaper than the Camaro, Mustang, and Challenger in order to sell. They made it more expensive. They made their bed now they must lay in it.
The problems with this car are endless. The 400Z is a modified 370z chassis, the 370z chassis is a modified 350z chassis. This is a 20+ year old platform. The engine is a slightly tweaked redsport engine, 6 years old at time of launch. The entire car is a parts bin with the exception of the head/tail lights. At launch dealers were asking 5-10k over sticker. The community swore this was going to be a Supra killer, even the NISMO is slower in every way. It's not that it's a bad car per se, but barely anything about it is new or worth 45-60k.
I don’t think any of that was a problem except the dealer markups. It has a viable chassis and motor, hell the R35 and 911 chassis are just tweaked over time also, “if it ain’t broke don’t fix it, just improve on it” Hell if they brought back the s-series chassis I don’t think anyone would bitch!
Th chassis isn’t the problem. It’s still ridged, balanced, and weighs exactly what it should given the dimensions. Sports car chassis design hasn’t changed much in the last 20 years. Supercars on the other hand have evolved a lot over that period of time chassis wise.
No one in the community thought this would be a Supra killer. We all knew the powertrain and chassis going into it. However, people were excited for a truly Japanese alternative with a manual.(which Supra didn’t offer at the time). I still ended up going Supra for all the reasons you mentioned.
@@Superdimensional Nissan is not Porsche, and the way they build the Z does not mirror the philosophy of Porsche. Nissan is controlled by accountants, Porsche is controlled by engineers. The decisions made along the way are not comparable
@@brianbohnet1907But Porsche hasn’t changed its car design since its inception example Bugatti VW Lamborghini Audi same old designs from the 20th century
When dealerships marked them up to $85k+ all across the states, that's what killed the hype. I saw dealerships trying to sell them for $100k as well. Even now, a new one costs around $65k. You can buy a lightly used g82 M4 for $65k.
@@Digiphex Even 60k is to much for this car, it's a Z for gosh sakes, not a damn Vette or Jaguar. And lets not forget no matter where you are in the country, dealers are not letting people test drive these things, and they have very little if any on their lots. Ordering site unseen, is not something many like to do, especially sports car enthusiasts.
my theory - Nissan has damaged their brand so much in the past decade that no one cares for them anymore and the 400Z is a casualty of that. feel bad for the engineers but Nissan made their bed
It's a parts bin car.. 350/370 chassis + q60 red sport motor + 6spd manual.. they did what they could with what they had.. Toyota had to go into bed with two other manufacturers to make their sports cars.. If this car was priced to top out at like $40-45k USD, it'd be a much more compelling buy.. but there's just too much on the used market in that price range that I'd rather spend my money on.. Hell, you could get 2-3 cars, if you wanted to, with a new Z budget..
@@dre32pitt Yes thats how it's always worked. Used cars are better deals than new cars. This is nothign new. For the price of a $25k corolla you can get two used corollas. Yes.
Seems like a Camaro/Mustang tier car for almost the price of a base Corvette, and it's still basically a facelifted 370Z. Maybe it's just a false perspective, but it doesn't seem like a very good value for money. Maybe that's enough to turn people off.
what Killed this ? IT IS DEALERSHIPS FAULT they added Markups bringing prices to $60k even $70k for a Performance that was supposed to be in the 40s. i've seen Nismo's priced at $90k... what do you expect???
People were eager, willing and able to buy this car. They waited and waited... then, only few were offered. But offered at a very high price.... over priced. We were told at the beginning what this car would be and at what price. But then the dealerships started to take advantage and abuse the customers with high markups. That's the consequence of all of that...
@@4drturbo85 you can get basically the same thing if you buy a used Infiniti Q50 or Q60 redsport and the infiniti looks 100 times better than the nissan z
I tried to buy one last week. 15k in dealer fees brought it to over 80k(Canadian), bad financing rates on top considering they don't sell any and still advertise 2023 models. I walked.
I still remember when it first came out a local dealer in Vancouver Canada had a launch edition on the showroom floor already sold to a collector. The sales told me it was part of the deal to let them display the car for a bit before the customer could take it home. He also said they were trading for well over USD100K. I walked too.
Dealers around Vancouver offer them at for 4K below MSRP on their web site. I think an in-between trim would have been a good idea, the 10K jump is just too much. So far I have only ever seen one Z in traffic and the few times I visited dealerships they did not have any. So no wonder they are not around, high price for the upper trims and no availability.
@@FlexRogersI have a client that bought a NISMO version Over 80k CAD! . I could not believe what he paid for it. Also the platform itself is pretty ancient even with revisions. The engine I didnt find to be anything special either. Im not exactly a Mustang fan but the GT Performance Pack is over 20k cheaper at list prices…
Great commentary during the drive. Oodles of useful details, without annoying music or excessive editing. Like the old Chris Harris videos, but on turbo.
To this date (October 27, 2024) I haven’t seen a single one of these on the road. I did see one at a car show before it was released. It’s crazy. I still see a lot of the old ones.
@@lucky1206I think Subaru is BRZ. It’s not as many that i saw, But it’s well respected in the community. The same one with Toyota is GR86 which is very common. Probably more common than a Miata. Step up after that is Toyota GR supra which also is very common.
I live in the city of San Diego, travel all over the whole county and have seen like 3. I see lambos and ferraris often and only three of these since they dropped lol
Don't see these on the roads at all. Was interested when they first came out, but dealer mark-ups were crazy. Nowadays would look to a Supra or Mustang GT.
Supra all day, and I don't say that easily because I actually like the look of the Z more, but there's just to many advantages to the Supra over the Z for me to say otherwise.
I drive a semi truck for a living and the only one I've seen was one thay was being hauled to a dealership. I've never seen one on the road and I drive all over the US.
@@ztotheu2974 - Nissan is kind of stale, but I'd still pick this car over a C8 Vette. These are currently listed for $53K in my local area. I happen to like the looks of this car better than the Supra and definitely better than the Mustang.
Because the fans actually want a Sylvia replacement. Lighter, newer, more affordable FR sports car. Something that reminds them of their 240SX. The 370Z is just a refresh wrapped in a more expensive package and the motor from the Inifnity Q50 I beleive.
The dealership canceled my allocation because I didn’t wanna pay the $30k over sticker at my local Nissan dealership, car sat in the showroom for months, I have only seen 5 cars on the road in the last 2 years. Everyone has lost interest in these cars.
The new Z is probably the rot lot king by now. I saw one on the streets since they came out. $50k is crazy, you can buy a older GT-R for $60 ish. Just insane.
Base 370 started at 30k. starting at 42k was already too expensive for a car with affordability in its ethos. Adding up to 20k on adm basically was nail in the coffin. I'm sure these will be sought after car in 20 years though.
Agree, its too expensive to start with and by the time you spent all the money and the hassle to make all the mods this reviewer recommends it makes no sense
As a Z fan it drives me nuts to say this but it’s out classed by the Supra for not a lot more and undercut on price by the gr86 which is also more fun. Ugh, Nissan…
@@MattWong117 you really think the GR86 is the same customer? I dunno, personally I wouldn’t even consider one of those, I feel it’s a teenagers car, the Z or Supra tho 👌
It’s a totally different target audience. The 86 BRZ is a tuner car, built on the fact the manufacturer knows buyers will ADD on parts, engine wise, suspension, body kits etc hence the low affordable prices. The Z is done, add a bit extra and you’re set.
Everything you said about the qualities of this car, is simply linear evolution of the Z. I've had a 280, 300, and 340. All of them more GT than track car. And frankly, I like it.
I think if this car was priced in the mid 40s it would be very competitive. Whats holding it back is it’s built on an aging platform, Nissan’s image as a brand has been declining in recent years, and there’s too many better options for $50-60k
What is aging about the platform? I feel people just say this stuff to say this stuff. It's double wishbone front and multi-link rear, you don't even get that in a Cayman? Is it the rigidity? What's the rigidity of the platform and what is the rigidity of the "new platform" you're comparing it to? If "new" is all it took to make a car good then no one would be interested in driving old cars. I think they missed the ball on this car because they didn't take their tuning seriously.
@@hamsterbrigade It’s built on Nissan/Infiniti’s FM platform which debuted in 2001. That’s a loooong time. Chassis rigidity, weight, and crash absorption have come a long way in almost 2.5 decades. 2 of those 3 things definitely have an effect on performance and how a car feels.
@@GolfCoyote You didn't actually answer any of my questions with numerical data. What "exactly" is aging about the platform as in: "I know actual numbers and comparative information." I feel you're all just regurgitating a standard line everyone says about a car if a reporter tells you they didn't "update" the platform. This is the same thing people did with the IS500. I'd bet hard money if I put 90+% of people in a revised car they wouldn't be able to tell me if it's a "aging platform" or not. I have an s2000 that chassis is still phenomenal and that car was designed in the 90s. That was built way before they could take a prior generation chassis and spooge adhesives and extra spot welds all over it to make it more stiff.
@@hamsterbrigade how can I quantify something they havnt done yet? Once they update the platform I’ll give you whatever information you want about improvements. My point was that technology advances quickly and this car in particular is competing against cars that are, as a whole, a lot newer which is just one reason why I think it’s asking too much money.
The base price of the sport is mid 40s. If you are to look at manual only transmission offerings for a new RWD cars what choices do you have under 50k? GR86? Mustang GT?
Former 370Z owner . . . why is this not selling? Price is one factor. But another is the awkward styling. Nissan wanted to update 240Z styling but missed the mark. It just looks odd.
I bought a 2024 Z and had to shop around. Dealers in Arizona, California, and Nevada playing games with 10 to $15,000 mark ups. Finally found a dealer in Colorado for MSRP. I LOVE MY Z!
I originally wanted this car so bad when it was announced was in love with the retro-modern design. I'd be on the phone with the dealer every month waiting for it to come in but kept getting jerked around with how much I'd be willing to pay over MSRP which I was not willing to entertain. Finally when the one I never cared for with yellow paint came in almost a year later aka the "PROTO" (omg yellow paint so special) they wanted $120k. I immediately went and bought the CT4 Blackwing at MSRP and got a much better and more practical car with no BS. I'm so glad I didn't get the Z now knowing it comes with such a soft suspension and worse manual transmission. Would've spent way too much on this little toy car to get it where I want to be.
Those are very different car designs. The Cadillac is more for a person who also may need to transport kids to soccer practice. And my bet is that both the Z and Supra will be less costly after warranties expire. GM's reliability, sadly, has been sub-par.
@@davepaturno4290 I disagree with you. First of all the CT4 has much better track times than the Z performance and even beats the Z nismo. The CT4 Blackwing is an updated version of the ATS-V which has proven to be very reliable even with tuning mods for the last 10 years. Only issue was a timing chain in the first few years of production which they later fixed. Also it is actually a compact size car making it the perfect size for pretty much anyone. Having four doors is way better for practicality and also lowers insurance costs.
@GeronimoBiggles Well, I've owned Corvettes for too many years to ever trust GM to make anything that can match Toyota/Lexus and Mazda reliability. Think your car is reliable? Keep it for ten or more years. I've always had both a multipurpose vehicle and a sportscar. Of course, my favorite was always the sportscar, particularly with the ability to drive with no roof over my head. It's a feeling that is unlike anything else on a curvy country road on a beautiful day. No fixed roof sedan can match the feeling. Someday, I hope you some day rent a lightweight convertible sportscar like a Miata. It will set you free AND go forever on a small tank of gas.
I hear you but some folks are incapable of leaving a car stock, even if it's great from the factory. Definitely a minority population though, which doesn't help the Z's case.
That's how these Z's always have been. Nissan gives you a decent GT car from the factory that's a blank canvas. Wait like 5-7 years from now when you can pick these up cheap and mod away. Just like the 350z and 370z is today. Decent when they were out but people picked them up for cheap used and made them into what they wanted...track car, drag car, drift car, show car, daily street car, takeover car (sigh),
I agree that dealer markups, and lack of inventory hurt this car. However, the death blow was the curb weight. This 2 seater is only around 100lbs lighter than my V8 LT1 Camaro. Let that sink in.
I think that the Z is a decent car, but it probably should've been priced a bit lower. It would've been a lot more well received had it been priced at 40k for the top trim. At 50k for the performance trim, you can get into a Supra, a GT350, a ZL1, an M2 Comp... some real heavy hitters against a car that's basically a parts bin reskin. I just don't understand how they thought that this car was a good idea.
It's a nicer styled 370z with twin turbos and a manual trans... How is that not a good idea? Not one of the cars you mentioned besides the Supra is a competitor to the price/age of the Z.
@@Desert_Spec if im being real, cars that arent in the same segment id rather buy is GR corolla, typeR, typeS, or hell even tlx typeS. I have a bunch of jdm car friends and no one has said they want the 400z. We all rather own the other jdm cars, idk if its looks or what but maybe price is part of it also
@@Desert_Spec The Supra is selling for the same price, is lighter and far better built. There really is no comparison. If Nissan wanted to be competitive, they should have dropped the price tag by 10k. It's absurd they thought they could sell something that's a parts bin from previous gens for this price.
@@hoppeanofasgard1365 You do realize the Supra is a parts bin car too right? Everything underneath the Toyota facade has a BMW logo on it and the B58 is just as old as the VR30DDTT. Toyota can afford to sell the Supra cheap considering they only accounted for 10% of the car's development and even then its still 13k USD more expensive than the Z (Car&Driver). The Z's price is already impressive considering the Z is all Nissan's responsibility. Sure, a 5k discount would be even better but 10k cheaper would make it the same price as a Civic Touring...
Had a local dealer trying to sell one for $105k for quite a while. I assume it was sold or traded to another dealer at some point since it is gone now.
I actually lived next to a neighbor not too long ago that bought one of these. I currently drive a 21 3.0 Supra, so I was curious on his thoughts about why he bought a Z for $50k. In short he enjoys how different it is compared to any other sports car on the road for the price point, (styling wise). Sure you rarely see Supras, but you never see these Z’s. I think it’s really targeted towards a Niche audience that wants a clean looking car that gets it’s job done. But outside of seeing people buying these just to be “different”, I really don’t understand why you’d choose this over so many other cars that give way more value for your money.
I think lifelong z fans like me wouldn’t consider anything else. I think it’d sell better if people actually saw them. A lot of people don’t follow the magazines and blogs and just buy stuff that “looks cute”. It’s only recently that I actually saw one at a dealer.
@@dejoreljackson1787 I totally get that. Z’s have never been my thing, but I understand why people love them. After seeing one in person I will say they are good looking cars.
@@fj06carnone They marked them up when hype was high...now that all the hype has lessened they took the markups off...but everyone went out and bought something else or lost interest.
I respect Nissan for totally designing and manufacturing the new Nissan RZ34. I really like the new Toyota GR Supra but it's powertrain and design is mostly BMW. I respect and appreciate what Toyota did with the GR Corolla(GZEA14), the GR Corolla is 100% Toyota and 100% awesome.
some manual transmission engines, the tuning, depending on how rich exhaust gasses are, can actually have an rpm surger when you clutch in. it's an emissions tuning decision to help keep the unburnt hydrocarbon levels down.
As a owner of 2 Z32s I learned these cars are some of the hardest to work on. Got to pull the engine to change the oil pan gasket. So I wouldn't buy a Z34. Can't change turbos unleess you pull the engine. Mitsubishi 3000GT was easier to work on and didn't require engjne removal to change a oil pan or turbos. Turbos also have gaskets that can leak coolant and oil causing overheating. So maintaince on a turbo car is a big deal.
I saw two for sale in a dealership near Omaha about two months ago. I’m pretty sure one was offered at about $75k and the other was about $85k. There’s now way in the world that makes sense to me
Insane. My local dealer only has a couple, and it's always automatics. I don't even bother driving the three minutes to go look at them. Not worth my time.
When the new NSX came out i commented on videos that it was a huge fail and no one would buy it. I cant tell you how many people told me i was stupid. Look who was right! I bought a 2006 g35 coupe manual for 35k out the door and loved that car. The reason this Z is not selling is because the 370z was substantially cheaper. The price change between the outgoing model and this model is enormous. That pissed people off and kept people from selling their old Z to buy the new one. The supra hasnt been sold in decades so sulpa loyalists dont see the price increase in the same way.
I agree about the NSX. I took one look at it and said "I don't know what that is, but it's not an NSX." The styling change was just way too drastic considering how legendary the styling of the original was. I mean, if you're gonna call it an NSX, it should probably at least somewhat remind people of an NSX. I knew from the very first glance that it wasn't going to sell. I've never even bothered to drive it in my racing sims because that's how uninteresting that car is to me.
@Kryptic1046 It didn't sell because of the price, not because of its performance. Its powertrain is super-sophisticated, yet the car has been very reliable. I was considering buying one, but even 7 year old ones are $150k. An oil change is $450. I ended up buying a 45th Anniv. GR Supra and couldn't be happier. It is a nice addition to my MX5.
@@davepaturno4290 I never thought it didn't sell because of its performance, I maintain it didn't sell because of the styling. The classical NSX has distinctive styling, it's one of the main things people love about it. It's hard to mistake it for anything else. If the newer one had styling closer to the original, it would've sold better.
@Kryptic1046 Sadly, the gen 1 NSX stying is kindof like the C5 Corvette styling. You can look at it as old school and slow or old school and cool. I prefer the gen 2 NSX, but the only downside is that it looks like other mid/rear engine exotics and now the C8 Corvette.
@davepaturno4290 the original nsxs styling was second to none during its time. Also the nsx was a complete departure from its original in terms of drivability. The original was incredibly light weight and nimble whereas the new one was a tank.
$54k for performance is just not it when Mustang GT and Supra exist for similar pricing and are faster the NISMO not having a manual is stupid when its closest competitors all have a manual and are CHEAPER in some cases. the Z is the best looking car in the segment IMO but Nissan really screwed up the pricing for this car for what could have been a proper Z revival
Best looking car in segment? Z was and always is an ugly ass car. It's literally only bought by young men trying to have a "sports car", and poor people trying to get into modding to act like they made a super car beater.
@@resulnaki idk man i like 240z, and this reminds me a lot of them. Is there anything wrong with people with not a ton of money looking to have fun? Or should everyone only aim for Ferraris?
@@ShaiyanHossain there is nothing wrong with that, but there are many cars you can do that with. Zs are just ugly cars. Ferrari? Lol aim for Porsche at least, Ferrari is a joke currently.
The market was also turning interest rates % were skyrocketing, so people would have astronomical payments! That also with the highest markups in history on a car with a 15 year old chassis
Sadly, Nissan has been slowly killing themselves off. The competition and market have little to do with things. When they brought back the Z as the 350 back in the day, then CEO Carlos Ghosn said in order for Nissan to stay competitive int he sports car market, the Z would be released as the sub $25k car....but when it actually launched....$32k+, and just kept going up with no real, measurable improvements over the years. And look what happened....the Z got cancelled again...then we have this travesty of a Z car. And now...Nissan is years away from closing entirely as a car brand. Altima....gone. Z...gone. Maxima...gone. Titan...gone. Xterra...gone. Frontier....needs to go. They just can't dig themselves out of the hole they put themselves in, which is why they pushed so hard for that alliance with Honda and Mitsubishi.
I would get the base model immediately swap a shorter FD and add an clutch or even helical LSD and LW flywheel it'll completely change modern Zs personality
I bought a black performance model & I absolutely Love it! My prior Z was a 370Z nismo tech which I thought handled better and kept your gut feeling like it was part of the road. I miss that feeling in the new Z but disagree with you that the car isn't good. I see a supra around here in Philly maybe once a month or 2. I don't like the way they look. I wouldn't buy 1 if it would have been $10K less than my Z.
I really took the time to think about this, yes I'm sure the dealerships had something to do with it. BUT I noticed something else. I have a 2019 nismo 370 with 22k miles. Every time I get in that car and hit the gas I've got smiles ear-to-ear.. it's firm, it's fast, it's sleek, the inner cabin is more like a cockpit, and the recaro racing seats once in make you one with a car. The fun Factor seems to be completely missing from this new Z. I'm not even a die-hard owner to this platform, it was the car that I stumbled upon that sold me. The car brings me smiles for days. When I saw the chassis response of the new z i was mortified. My Nismo does not do that in the least. And if I were the new owner of that car I would be furious with the sway left and right. Actually one test drive is all it would take for me to pass. People can say what they want about this motor and chassis, but as many have already said platforms like Porsche have not made major changes. It was the execution of the new Z that did itself in from the factory.
Recently picked up a GR Supra, the Z wasn’t even on my radar because the Supra just felt one generation newer than the Nissan Z. Stock for stock, the Supra is almost superior in every way: Powertrain, handling, cornering capability, clutch-based rear diff, etc.
@@Nismo1983 The vast majority of potential buyers are not modders. If you're a manufacturer, and you want your new car to succeed with big sales numbers, it had better appeal to regular folk in its stock form.
Every potential owner of this car already owned a comfortable gt car with the same engine in the form of the infiniti q50/60. Dont need another comfortable faux luxury car. It needed to be an affordable and value packed performance car with maybe nicer limited trims.
What confuses me about Nissan's decision making is how the car with the handling dynamics I am looking for is the only one that doesn't get the manual transmission. Between the stick versions being too soft and underbraked while also having massive dealer markups ran me off. If manufacturers got dealers under control with that, more of these would have moved.
So a $55k car in CA after taxes and fees would exceed $60k then you add another $5k for suspension parts and other expenses to make it better? There are better cars out of the box aren’t there at this price point? Then you look at the used market and the justification for this car becomes less appealing. If you really like this car then just keep it stock and enjoy it as a GT, don’t try to make it what it was not designed for.
People need to stop talking about markups. Its no longer 2022-2023. Some brand new 2024 models are selling under MSRP. Sport models $40k-45k Performance models $47k-$54k. Heck even C8 Z06 are selling under MSRP.
The Z honors its heritage. It is authentic and does not purport to be something that it is not. Take a look at used BMW’s. There is a reason why they are so cheap. Comparing the Supra and the Z is not the correct comparison. The Supra is not JDM. BMW generally has made fast, well performing cars but you wouldn’t want one after the lease is over or the warranty runs out. The Supra is actually a parts bin BMW. The exterior is not good and lacks cohesion in its design. The interior is cramped, vision is very limited and the steering wheel is laughable. The Z is set up to be more of a sport-tourer out of the box. It’s plenty fast to get into trouble, it’s beautiful to look at, it has a very good manual and with reasonable care, you can hold onto and enjoy it for a long time to come.
I think they just cut too many corners and didn’t execute as well as Toyota and BMW did with the Supra. This was like the “yeah well this one is all ours with no help!” response attempt, but it shows in bad ways. It may be a better priced option, but if I could only afford this one and not the Supra I’d probably just choose something different altogether.
I didn’t buy one because the dealer experience sucks, not to mention the dealer mark up. Then the car itself was not that impressive compared to the competition
I'd pick this over the Supra in the styling category. Not sure about sound and shifter feel as I haven't experienced them. Weight is probably accurate.
@@RyneLanders 400z is so ugly in the front, only the rear is decent. The supra on other hand looks different and cool which screams racecar/sportscar. Idk how old you are but everyone i know from 23-35 rather take the supra, gr corolla, typeR, or the typeS over this 400z
@@droptopp3479 i feel like you forget how much absolute shit the Supra got when it came out, everyone panned its looks. As for the Corolla or Civic, those can't hold a candle to the other cars on your list from a design standpoint. The Civic is hideous for sure. This looks a lot better than that. As for what 23 year olds like, I don't really care, hahaha. Not relevant to me.
@@chrisf8584 they were definitely going with retro vibes for sure. It was an intentional choice. You either love it or hate it. I didn't love it at first, but as a retro-modern design, it's growing on me. I could definitely see how it feels like a backwards move after the hyper-modern design evolution of the 370z
No one is buying them because B58 and S58. Hopefully I can get a G87 M2 someday. If not that, then at least an F22 M240i. I'm at a bad point in my life right now though.
The 350Z is still my favorite. I feel like the design and car just seem to get bigger and bigger. But I guess with regulations, easier to throw more power behind a heavier car than to go lighter and make a true sports car. I was seriously looking to buy one, but the reviews all say the same. Good to great GT car, needs suspension mods. $50k can get you a lot of used sports cars still. And I would rather have the new GR86/BRZ over this especially when factoring in price.
Regulations are killing the Z… exhaust is smaller to be complaint in CA. RPM surge with clutch for better emissions. Increased weight so the power is justified to the EPA… Using thin oil to meet EPA… not being able to sell in the EU. Also talks are that in Japan the z might not be able to continue as it’s “too loud” something regarding a 71 Db date or something along those lines.
Dealers. I wanted the base sport, no options, manual &black. 42k car, dealer was asking 70…. I’ll wait a few years until I can pick up a healthy used one with good maintenance and low miles in the 20’s or less IF I haven’t decided on anything else at that point. Overall, I think Nissan nailed it with this car. Simple & still a bit old school with the modern touch. Very much like the MX5 , but with more than twice the power.
UNDERPOWERED, OVERPRICED, FUGLY.... thats why no one is buying them. I got a Mustang, a Camaro and a Challenger, thats right, I got all three in my garage with lots more HP. Japanese designers today, are turning out ugly weird looking cars....
You car reviewers killed the car. Saying it’s a soft GT car and not as good as the Supra. Everyone is buying Supras, and they are buying them over MSRP, especially the manuals. And you can get a Z for under MSRP so the dealers didn’t kill the Z. The media did.
Is the media lying about the feel and performance of the Z? Perhaps Nissan underestimated the competition and their targeted market. Maybe Nissan missed the mark and an opportunity.
Bro I agree, every car has its own personality the Z is soft but better for it lol, I’ve driven gr86 Supra and Z without a doubt they are all fantastic. Like not everyone is going to modify the car, not only that things like “rev hang” literally every manual has it like the type r, Z, Supra Manual. The Z is soft but that’s not bad, I consistently corner with 1.1 g laterally. People need to understand that cars aren’t this or that, enjoy them have fun learn them. Be like Bestmotoring in the 90s not dogging on cars for being quiet or “soft” or “clunky” they enjoyed them for what they were and gave credit. Naturally that doesn’t mean criticism isn’t allowed some things like Overheating stock is worthy to talk about. The Z in my personal experience feels like a great 2000’s sporty car with great 2024 touches. My words as a senile man lol 😂.
@@wheraboo5013 It's good you don't mind the transient response (or lack thereof), but what of people who do mind the slow transient response and can't stand it? 🙂🤔 Why not offer a Performance or Nismo pack with uprated springs and damping for them?
The problem with the Z is it's basically a 370z which is a 2008 platform which in turn is barely different from the 2002 350z platform. This car is too expensive to be a stock car when you can get a new or slightly used BMW with much more performance for the price, and, it's not cheap enough to be a tuner car since you can buy and modify a 350z or 370z and still be well below the MSRP of this Z. If the Z was priced in the low to mid 30's with a manual and LSD stock then it would sell but somehow Nissan is convinced it's worth more or that someone in the market for this car would buy it without LSD. Nissan always cheaps out to their own detriment and instead of pushing units they're just sitting around losing value. I don't think Nissan corp has more than 5 years to exist at this rate.
Are you kidding me the amount of new altimas on the road is insane they are probably going to discontinue the Z like they did the Q60. I believe this is the last ditch effort for the Z, throwing in a redsport engine, and contracting a mercedes transmission to rival the supra
@@MarlonAllen-pg9dlare you kidding us? I have yet to see that hideous Altima anywhere. The old one are still around, the absolute disaster of a car design, but i have not seen a new one. Those are as ugly as the originals lol
I had a 370z in the past, and wanted one of these when they were debuted. But the dealer markups hurt. So I ended up getting a used RCF instead and now I think I'd rather just keep that as that car is everything I wanted (minus the manual) in a car. A japanese refined V8. I still think about the Z a lot and think this car is great but I just can't spend over 50k on a car. 40 is pushing it for me.
Nissan still has an image problem to overcome. I think the way to fix that would be to reintroduce a B210-like no frills car with yes... a manual transmission. Maybe a lower priced 200-240SX alternative to the BRZ / 86 Miatas. Lower prices get more buyers involved. Images get fixed by word of mouth, the more mouths chatting, the louder the voice. As you said, provide solid bones for tuning. Less sizzle more steak. Less obfuscation by technology is sometimes more in the same way people still listen to classic rock.
I went in to one of my local Nissan dealerships about a year and a half ago, wanting to by a base model Nissan Z. I saw one that was gun metal gray and I instantly fell in love with it's blue interior/exterior gray combo. Right after exchanging a few comments and terms with one of the reps, she finalized the car in total to be around $67,000... for a base model? I asked why and she claimed that there was a 15k mark-up due to their dealership having the only three Z's in the entire country and that it wasn't worth the wait and I should buy one, while they're still available. I instantly got up and left with an awful impression, and immediately went to my local Lexus dealership. I was in and out in about thirty minutes with my new 2023 Lexus IS350. But perhaps maybe I would have been out the door with the new Z, if they had initially given me a reasonable offer.. bummer..
The Performance Pack is what they base car should've been and priced around $40-42k. No idea why it costs $50k+ when the Performance components aren't even that good. That's how much the Nismo trim should've cost.
The handling is fine, the engine has enough power at 400 hp; the stye is attractive and its fairly comfortable yet if it is 250-300 lbs lighter weight, it would make the above handling and power even more appealing.
As a tamer driver now, I like the GT angle of this car. Would love to drive it across the Great Basin. It looks good, it sounds good, looks like it has a refined ride, I like it a lot. Classic American car vibes from Japan, surprised it hasn't taken off.
Great to hear your thoughts. I felt similarly after driving the base version, the amount of potential it had was insane. I think if Nissan dialed in the the throttle, suspension and steering out of the box, it would have fared better on the market. I didn’t buy one because it would have taken a decent amount of money to make it into the car that I wanted. I feel like a lot of others felt the same way (and it’s not like the market for a new sports car is huge anyway)
Yup those 3 things need to be addressed. It's tuned far too much like a GT, which isn't necessarily bad but doesn't align with what potential customers want. I'm itching to try one with quality coilovers and a light flywheel/tune. Total cost at that point would be on par with a GR Supra 3.0.
Huh? That’s like saying if they improved every aspect of a car that makes it a sports car then it would have been actually good
@@Zygrene Yeah, that might be too much to justify against the Supra, but if you could manage to find someone with a modified Z, that would be a cool comparison to make if you could get ahold of a Stock Supra press car!
@@orangejuice-xi3gt It’s more like saying the fundamentals were good, the execution was botched🥴
@@Realistick But it sounds like the base is exactly what you'd want? $10k to put in your own limited slip, coilovers, wheels/tires and an aftermarket seat that fits you? Probably a little left over for a tune or chassis or sway bar.
The dealers killed this car.
How?
@@pab3783When it first came out, lack of inventory and dealers wanted $15k+ markup on these cars. This went on for 2 years. There are some selling without ADM, but they still slap on added accessories. The emotional drive to buy this car pretty much died with people more worried about inflation than buy a car that costs more than a Supra or V8 Mustang.
@@pab3783markups, I used to work for a Nissan dealer doing photography and the z I shot was 80k with a markup. Sad thing is it was the auto. Still don’t understand why this car gets hate tho, people really need to drive one first before writing it off
@@pab3783 marked them up way too much
No, they didn't.
Nissan trying to sell a twenty year old platform for 50k plus dealer markup is what killed this car.
People talk about old cars feeling the best but when a company refined it to be faster and better than the previous generation there is tons of hate?
@@wheraboo5013 "faster" come on man...
@@wheraboo5013it's not faster because you call people haters. It's NOT faster as a fact. If you want one, then get your parents or SO to pay out the ass for this ugly ass car. Tech advances, yes. I get that. Going another 20k more on the price tag is what is even more insane.
@@wheraboo5013 old cars like the 90s lightweight turbo cars with few electronics,
Z is outdated, 370z ran 4 years too long, Nissan is lost in the sauce
@@702TifosiGambler 90s we’re a different time, sports cars themselves were at a peak, but not every car was light, Supra mk3, 300z just to name a few.
insane dealer markup. who the fuck buys a Nissan for the price of a Corvette
The 300ZX is one of my favorite cars. I bought a new C8 2 months ago and never considered the current Z.
@@jasondueck9130 There's a maroon/burgundy low-mileage twin-turbo 300ZX in a showroom a mile from me.
They want $40k for it. If I had the extra money it could be a good investment. Drive it every now and then keep it indoors. Another 10 or 15 years and you could probably profit.
In my area, the Z is on sale at multiple dealerships for under $55K. C8 Vettes are listed for over $70K. Plus the C8 are ugly in my opinion, but I'm sure many will disagree. The C8 has more HPs, but the Z is plenty fast enough. But whatever. I wouldn't buy either.
@@JohnBowl14690 The Corvette is the absolute opposite of the Z though.
It's all new technology and design, a whole new platform.
The Z is old engineering and platform with a new face and insane pricing.
The Corvette is more than just more horsepower, it's mid-engine. Flat-plane V8 like a Ferrari would be. It's a "cheap" super car. I don't love the look of it, but I'd take it over the new Z any day.
Personally I love the C5.
@@drownthepoor - Point taken. I guess I would be more interested in a C8 if they got rid of that ugly rear end and did a few changes. To me, the C8 is close to looking awesome, but it doesn't for some reason. I just don't know why.
I was so hyped for this car in 2021
2024 and I have only seen 1 on the road ever.
Not one single car but apparently Canada has a bunch in their inventory. But it’s insane to have a Nissan z car going as high as $90,000 cad
Dealer selling this for 70k in south Florida😂😂😂 Nissan dealer is crazy
Saw one the other day, it’s very rare nobody has it
@@SkyNetGeneral- I never thought this car would flop it all looked and sounded so good it’s so sad
Just saw one sitting in a parking lot just now. Decided to check out this video afterwards.
1- Dealer Markups
2- BMW Supra is superior
3- Other costs (Insurance Costs, high apr, etc.).
4- Other more affordable alternatives even with markups (Type R, GR Corolla, etc.).
Supra is way superior, almost as if using BMW is cheating when you use their drivetrain.
Anyways, if you have the supra side by side with the 400z and you ignore the price tags, drivetrains, and performance. All you have is looks, or exterior design. The supra looks way more exotic, way more exciting, and lighter weight. Just the looks alone fades the 400z away. The 400z just doesn't look exciting, or that cool.
@@abrahamg3354 Take the 400Z and dro pthe price to 38K and I'd bet they would sell.
@@metalmike570 I agree, pricing in the 30s range would be a great deal for what you get. I would only get the nismo because the front end looks cleaned up more.
@@abrahamg3354 It looks great.
Agree on #2, but I’m biased
The price man the price man
Yup, price. 12-15k over priced. The Z has always been the budget friendly Sports car giving you a deal. MSRP is no deal compared to competitors. The top trim Z should be no more than 43k after sales tax.
Selling below MSRP at this point
And the dealer markup didn't help initial enthusiasm
the markups man, the markups
@@GearbhallBS, then why did everyone buy marked up Supras and Type Rs
The price jump from the 370z (increase of $20,000), the dealer markups and lack of inventory for awhile really killed interest.
370z mrsp was never $20k. They were in the $33k+ back in 2009. If you add in inflation, this new Z isn’t much different in price.
Lots around even at a discount where I live. Still not selling so it is something else. For me the lack of adaptive ride, 18 way leather seats, upgraded tech, manual on the Nismo. These are features of the M2 and others that are in the bracket.
@mperformance3502 $20,000 was the price difference not the price. Sorry if I worded that poorly, the 370z Sport with LSD was under $35k in 2019 and now the 2024 Z Performance is $20k more. It's had possibly the biggest price increase of any of the "inexpensive" sports cars lately.
@@mperformance3502 while I agree with that assessment, only pricing has risen with inflation, income really has not for a lot of people so it still feels like a substantial jump in price even if it can be explained away by inflation.
It's due to inflation. Totally reasonable. But a 45k corolla? Shit ur pants and throw a fit I can't believe toyota. The audacity
a great tuning platform is $20k, not $60k. All those car modifying companies from the 90's are gone because they realized most car guys have no money.
then explain the 153132131 vw/bmw tuners out there lmao
… and the car guys with money buy Porsches, McLarens, Superformance Cobras, or Lotuses. Corvettes have also always been “great tuning platforms”. A built C7 manual Grand Sport with all the Katech and DSC Sport engine and suspension bits is about the fastest RWD NA manual canyon carver you can get, and even the coupes have targa tops, all for under 6 figures even new. New Z06s are ridiculous too, 95% of the fun of a 458 Spyder for less than half the price, and with twice the reliability. Plenty of great track day cars out there these days too if you want something spicier than a Miata, which are also still fantastic and some of the most fun you can have new under $30k.
This right here. Gone are the days of 80s,90s, and early 00 JDM import tuners. Cars sold today are not sold barebones with respectable internals/platforms. Look at this one. A $60k+ vehicle that, off the lot, doesn't speak the language the target market does. Those folks wanna tune, tinker, and have fun. No one is chopping up a $60,000 car for the sake of enthusiasm. Those guys who have the $ go out and buy supreme performance vehicles (see: luxury) not a Japanese car with retro yearnings of yesteryear.
It's not profitable anymore to sell a tuner for $20,000.
@@ogmechsftw
Credit
@@ogmechsftw high mileage
I own a 1972 Datsun 240z. When this new Z car came out I was super excited to buy one. Went to the dealer and as soon as I saw the $100k dealer MARKUP I told them to F-off and haven't gone back..
They have 9 Zs in my town dealership. All are $56,000..
That is an beyond ridiculous price. I cud buy a mustang V8 for much less.
Does nissan want to go bankrupt??
I had a '72 "Datsun" in '72. Fun cheap little car, but I lived near the ocean, and it was starting to rust out in 2 years!
Do you mean ford?
They can absolutely pound sand, this car shouldn’t be more than 40k
The price. The Z needs to be cheaper than the Camaro, Mustang, and Challenger in order to sell. They made it more expensive. They made their bed now they must lay in it.
The price is a result of your import tax. "They" didn't make it expensive. It's YOUR politicians.
The problems with this car are endless. The 400Z is a modified 370z chassis, the 370z chassis is a modified 350z chassis. This is a 20+ year old platform. The engine is a slightly tweaked redsport engine, 6 years old at time of launch. The entire car is a parts bin with the exception of the head/tail lights. At launch dealers were asking 5-10k over sticker. The community swore this was going to be a Supra killer, even the NISMO is slower in every way. It's not that it's a bad car per se, but barely anything about it is new or worth 45-60k.
I don’t think any of that was a problem except the dealer markups. It has a viable chassis and motor, hell the R35 and 911 chassis are just tweaked over time also, “if it ain’t broke don’t fix it, just improve on it” Hell if they brought back the s-series chassis I don’t think anyone would bitch!
Th chassis isn’t the problem. It’s still ridged, balanced, and weighs exactly what it should given the dimensions. Sports car chassis design hasn’t changed much in the last 20 years. Supercars on the other hand have evolved a lot over that period of time chassis wise.
No one in the community thought this would be a Supra killer. We all knew the powertrain and chassis going into it. However, people were excited for a truly Japanese alternative with a manual.(which Supra didn’t offer at the time). I still ended up going Supra for all the reasons you mentioned.
@@Superdimensional Nissan is not Porsche, and the way they build the Z does not mirror the philosophy of Porsche. Nissan is controlled by accountants, Porsche is controlled by engineers. The decisions made along the way are not comparable
@@brianbohnet1907But Porsche hasn’t changed its car design since its inception example Bugatti VW Lamborghini Audi same old designs from the 20th century
When dealerships marked them up to $85k+ all across the states, that's what killed the hype. I saw dealerships trying to sell them for $100k as well. Even now, a new one costs around $65k. You can buy a lightly used g82 M4 for $65k.
Not around North Carolina. They are discounted and still not selling so it is something else besides price and availability here.
@@Digiphex Even 60k is to much for this car, it's a Z for gosh sakes, not a damn Vette or Jaguar. And lets not forget no matter where you are in the country, dealers are not letting people test drive these things, and they have very little if any on their lots.
Ordering site unseen, is not something many like to do, especially sports car enthusiasts.
$100K USD is insane
@@Digiphex must be the NO SERVICE after the sale.
@@Digiphex buyers are gone, migrated to other brands.
my theory - Nissan has damaged their brand so much in the past decade that no one cares for them anymore and the 400Z is a casualty of that. feel bad for the engineers but Nissan made their bed
Please explain
Too many CVT failures
It's a parts bin car.. 350/370 chassis + q60 red sport motor + 6spd manual.. they did what they could with what they had.. Toyota had to go into bed with two other manufacturers to make their sports cars.. If this car was priced to top out at like $40-45k USD, it'd be a much more compelling buy.. but there's just too much on the used market in that price range that I'd rather spend my money on.. Hell, you could get 2-3 cars, if you wanted to, with a new Z budget..
wdym? all they've done is given us the r35 and z34 this past decade
@@dre32pitt Yes thats how it's always worked. Used cars are better deals than new cars. This is nothign new. For the price of a $25k corolla you can get two used corollas. Yes.
Seems like a Camaro/Mustang tier car for almost the price of a base Corvette, and it's still basically a facelifted 370Z. Maybe it's just a false perspective, but it doesn't seem like a very good value for money. Maybe that's enough to turn people off.
I just saw one at the dealer for 55K.
@@metalmike570at that point just get a Supra. Or a civic type r/gr corolla
what Killed this ?
IT IS DEALERSHIPS FAULT
they added Markups bringing prices to $60k even $70k for a Performance that was supposed to be in the 40s.
i've seen Nismo's priced at $90k...
what do you expect???
People were eager, willing and able to buy this car. They waited and waited... then, only few were offered. But offered at a very high price.... over priced. We were told at the beginning what this car would be and at what price. But then the dealerships started to take advantage and abuse the customers with high markups.
That's the consequence of all of that...
The price you mentioned is ABSURD given how strong the dollar is to the yen now. These should be 40k with the perf package, TOPS
Agreed 100%. $40k for a performance version would maybe put me in one despite having that ugly front end.
@@4drturbo85 you can get basically the same thing if you buy a used Infiniti Q50 or Q60 redsport and the infiniti looks 100 times better than the nissan z
They should be 32k honestly lol
@Freerider93 Nah, maybe in like 2014. Inflation is a bitch
I tried to buy one last week. 15k in dealer fees brought it to over 80k(Canadian), bad financing rates on top considering they don't sell any and still advertise 2023 models. I walked.
I still remember when it first came out a local dealer in Vancouver Canada had a launch edition on the showroom floor already sold to a collector. The sales told me it was part of the deal to let them display the car for a bit before the customer could take it home. He also said they were trading for well over USD100K. I walked too.
That’s crazy, this thing should be 65k Canadian out the door, tops
Come to the US, lots under MSRP
Dealers around Vancouver offer them at for 4K below MSRP on their web site. I think an in-between trim would have been a good idea, the 10K jump is just too much. So far I have only ever seen one Z in traffic and the few times I visited dealerships they did not have any. So no wonder they are not around, high price for the upper trims and no availability.
@@FlexRogersI have a client that bought a NISMO version Over 80k CAD! . I could not believe what he paid for it. Also the platform itself is pretty ancient even with revisions. The engine I didnt find to be anything special either. Im not exactly a Mustang fan but the GT Performance Pack is over 20k cheaper at list prices…
Great commentary during the drive. Oodles of useful details, without annoying music or excessive editing. Like the old Chris Harris videos, but on turbo.
To this date (October 27, 2024) I haven’t seen a single one of these on the road. I did see one at a car show before it was released.
It’s crazy. I still see a lot of the old ones.
I hardly see the Toyota BRZ or whatever they are calling it now lol
@@lucky1206I think Subaru is BRZ. It’s not as many that i saw, But it’s well respected in the community. The same one with Toyota is GR86 which is very common. Probably more common than a Miata. Step up after that is Toyota GR supra which also is very common.
No one is paying 80k for a Z. Dealers are out of control 😂
There’s plenty of performance Zs under MSRP. TF you talking about
@@19hundoc47depends on the area
@@19hundoc47 Yup. There are three Z's at my local dealer. Two are under MRSP. They've all been sitting there for over a year.
You can get a Tesla M3 performance that will dust this thing for less.
I wouldn't even pay over $40k for one
I literally have never even seen one in person!
I've seen 2 in two years and it may have been the same one.
Same here and I live in one of the biggest cities in the US.
The only time I've seen one is in person at a dealership when I was picking up parts.
I live in the city of San Diego, travel all over the whole county and have seen like 3. I see lambos and ferraris often and only three of these since they dropped lol
I'm in California, I have seen six Bugattis in the wild since this car released... But no Z
Same, before right now I didn't even know this was a vehicle..
Don't see these on the roads at all. Was interested when they first came out, but dealer mark-ups were crazy. Nowadays would look to a Supra or Mustang GT.
These look tired and boring compared to the competition. Nissan is a stale brand.
Supra all day, and I don't say that easily because I actually like the look of the Z more, but there's just to many advantages to the Supra over the Z for me to say otherwise.
I drive a semi truck for a living and the only one I've seen was one thay was being hauled to a dealership. I've never seen one on the road and I drive all over the US.
As a UPS driver, I have only seen one since release date. I live in LA county
@@ztotheu2974 - Nissan is kind of stale, but I'd still pick this car over a C8 Vette. These are currently listed for $53K in my local area. I happen to like the looks of this car better than the Supra and definitely better than the Mustang.
Because the fans actually want a Sylvia replacement. Lighter, newer, more affordable FR sports car. Something that reminds them of their 240SX. The 370Z is just a refresh wrapped in a more expensive package and the motor from the Inifnity Q50 I beleive.
The dealer markup was insane. The base model would be a great car - but that open diff. I remember first reading that???? What the….
The dealership canceled my allocation because I didn’t wanna pay the $30k over sticker at my local Nissan dealership, car sat in the showroom for months, I have only seen 5 cars on the road in the last 2 years. Everyone has lost interest in these cars.
100% At this point, the car doesn't even exist. Meanwhile, Z32's on Bring A Trailer are still fetching very strong prices.
The new Z is probably the rot lot king by now. I saw one on the streets since they came out. $50k is crazy, you can buy a older GT-R for $60 ish. Just insane.
For a brand new car though, well it's at least 7K too high.
The dealers jacking the prices up killed it. Just like the price jacking toyota is doing. It's how I wound up with a 22 BRZ no price jacking.
Yep. A BRZ is probably the best choice overall right now.
this car in stock form is essentially a better 370z, but it cost almost 50k with tax
Overpriced on a 22 year old platform with a 10 year old power plant.
Toyota is picking their lips
Base 370 started at 30k. starting at 42k was already too expensive for a car with affordability in its ethos. Adding up to 20k on adm basically was nail in the coffin. I'm sure these will be sought after car in 20 years though.
The bottom line is that $50K is way to much for a Z.
Agree, its too expensive to start with and by the time you spent all the money and the hassle to make all the mods this reviewer recommends it makes no sense
Maybe 38K and it'll sell.
Golf gti is 40k and is gay looking car compared to the Z
As a Z fan it drives me nuts to say this but it’s out classed by the Supra for not a lot more and undercut on price by the gr86 which is also more fun. Ugh, Nissan…
GR86 looks Lower, Tighter and Sharper in person. A Coworker has a White One and it’s gorgeous in person.
Nissan is stale and boring all around.
@@MattWong117 you really think the GR86 is the same customer? I dunno, personally I wouldn’t even consider one of those, I feel it’s a teenagers car, the Z or Supra tho 👌
Not to mention you could have bought a Camaro SS 1LE for cheaper which handles better, is faster, sounds better, and better on a track.
It’s a totally different target audience. The 86 BRZ is a tuner car, built on the fact the manufacturer knows buyers will ADD on parts, engine wise, suspension, body kits etc hence the low affordable prices. The Z is done, add a bit extra and you’re set.
Everything you said about the qualities of this car, is simply linear evolution of the Z. I've had a 280, 300, and 340. All of them more GT than track car. And frankly, I like it.
You’ll barely ever see a Z. Nobody is buying this car, period.
I think if this car was priced in the mid 40s it would be very competitive. Whats holding it back is it’s built on an aging platform, Nissan’s image as a brand has been declining in recent years, and there’s too many better options for $50-60k
What is aging about the platform? I feel people just say this stuff to say this stuff. It's double wishbone front and multi-link rear, you don't even get that in a Cayman? Is it the rigidity? What's the rigidity of the platform and what is the rigidity of the "new platform" you're comparing it to? If "new" is all it took to make a car good then no one would be interested in driving old cars. I think they missed the ball on this car because they didn't take their tuning seriously.
@@hamsterbrigade It’s built on Nissan/Infiniti’s FM platform which debuted in 2001. That’s a loooong time. Chassis rigidity, weight, and crash absorption have come a long way in almost 2.5 decades. 2 of those 3 things definitely have an effect on performance and how a car feels.
@@GolfCoyote You didn't actually answer any of my questions with numerical data. What "exactly" is aging about the platform as in: "I know actual numbers and comparative information." I feel you're all just regurgitating a standard line everyone says about a car if a reporter tells you they didn't "update" the platform. This is the same thing people did with the IS500. I'd bet hard money if I put 90+% of people in a revised car they wouldn't be able to tell me if it's a "aging platform" or not. I have an s2000 that chassis is still phenomenal and that car was designed in the 90s. That was built way before they could take a prior generation chassis and spooge adhesives and extra spot welds all over it to make it more stiff.
@@hamsterbrigade how can I quantify something they havnt done yet? Once they update the platform I’ll give you whatever information you want about improvements. My point was that technology advances quickly and this car in particular is competing against cars that are, as a whole, a lot newer which is just one reason why I think it’s asking too much money.
The base price of the sport is mid 40s. If you are to look at manual only transmission offerings for a new RWD cars what choices do you have under 50k? GR86? Mustang GT?
The rarest car zygrene has driven. 😜
Former 370Z owner . . . why is this not selling? Price is one factor. But another is the awkward styling. Nissan wanted to update 240Z styling but missed the mark. It just looks odd.
I personally rather have the 370z or 1987 300zx with pop up headlights
I personally rather have 370z pr 1987 300zx with pop up headlights
I think it looks kinda nice but def awkward on the front. Almost like the front and back don't match 😂
lets be polite, the 300z is beautiful, this is ugly and make me vomit🤮🤢🤢
I bought a 2024 Z and had to shop around. Dealers in Arizona, California, and Nevada playing games with 10 to $15,000 mark ups. Finally found a dealer in Colorado for MSRP. I LOVE MY Z!
My guy is bouncing all over the place in that car. What a great review. Really honest and well done. Thank you. I really liked this car.
I originally wanted this car so bad when it was announced was in love with the retro-modern design. I'd be on the phone with the dealer every month waiting for it to come in but kept getting jerked around with how much I'd be willing to pay over MSRP which I was not willing to entertain. Finally when the one I never cared for with yellow paint came in almost a year later aka the "PROTO" (omg yellow paint so special) they wanted $120k. I immediately went and bought the CT4 Blackwing at MSRP and got a much better and more practical car with no BS. I'm so glad I didn't get the Z now knowing it comes with such a soft suspension and worse manual transmission. Would've spent way too much on this little toy car to get it where I want to be.
Bro ct-4 blackwings are sick af you made the right choice.
@bencarey243 thanks I'm loving it 👍🏼👍🏼
Those are very different car designs. The Cadillac is more for a person who also may need to transport kids to soccer practice. And my bet is that both the Z and Supra will be less costly after warranties expire. GM's reliability, sadly, has been sub-par.
@@davepaturno4290 I disagree with you. First of all the CT4 has much better track times than the Z performance and even beats the Z nismo. The CT4 Blackwing is an updated version of the ATS-V which has proven to be very reliable even with tuning mods for the last 10 years. Only issue was a timing chain in the first few years of production which they later fixed. Also it is actually a compact size car making it the perfect size for pretty much anyone. Having four doors is way better for practicality and also lowers insurance costs.
@GeronimoBiggles Well, I've owned Corvettes for too many years to ever trust GM to make anything that can match Toyota/Lexus and Mazda reliability. Think your car is reliable? Keep it for ten or more years. I've always had both a multipurpose vehicle and a sportscar. Of course, my favorite was always the sportscar, particularly with the ability to drive with no roof over my head. It's a feeling that is unlike anything else on a curvy country road on a beautiful day. No fixed roof sedan can match the feeling.
Someday, I hope you some day rent a lightweight convertible sportscar like a Miata. It will set you free AND go forever on a small tank of gas.
It's too expensive and greedy dealerships are marking these up with stupid market adjustments.
If you need to spend another 3-4k on suspension then it’s not a good car
I hear you but some folks are incapable of leaving a car stock, even if it's great from the factory. Definitely a minority population though, which doesn't help the Z's case.
A lot of this could be solved by a decent set of springs. No need for 3k Nitrons/MCS lmao
What car in that price range wound not need Great aftermarket coilovers?
That's how these Z's always have been. Nissan gives you a decent GT car from the factory that's a blank canvas. Wait like 5-7 years from now when you can pick these up cheap and mod away. Just like the 350z and 370z is today. Decent when they were out but people picked them up for cheap used and made them into what they wanted...track car, drag car, drift car, show car, daily street car, takeover car (sigh),
if this car was 35k for base, it would fly off shelves and rebuild the bad name Nissan has esrned to a favorable one
Because it’s not worth a penny over 50k and dealers are charging way more than that 😂
I agree that dealer markups, and lack of inventory hurt this car. However, the death blow was the curb weight. This 2 seater is only around 100lbs lighter than my V8 LT1 Camaro. Let that sink in.
It weights more with less power
Spot on. I’ve literally seen only 2 of these driving on the road this year, and I live in SoCal.
Live here too. I’ve seen one and I drive the freeways everyday. If they’re not selling here, there’s not selling anywhere.
Same here, seen like 2 on the road ever on SoCal freeways.
Yup. In So Cal and I saw one in the wild for the first time this year.
I think that the Z is a decent car, but it probably should've been priced a bit lower. It would've been a lot more well received had it been priced at 40k for the top trim. At 50k for the performance trim, you can get into a Supra, a GT350, a ZL1, an M2 Comp... some real heavy hitters against a car that's basically a parts bin reskin. I just don't understand how they thought that this car was a good idea.
It's a nicer styled 370z with twin turbos and a manual trans... How is that not a good idea? Not one of the cars you mentioned besides the Supra is a competitor to the price/age of the Z.
@@Desert_Spec if im being real, cars that arent in the same segment id rather buy is GR corolla, typeR, typeS, or hell even tlx typeS. I have a bunch of jdm car friends and no one has said they want the 400z. We all rather own the other jdm cars, idk if its looks or what but maybe price is part of it also
@@Desert_Spec if we’re going by age the Z is competition with E46s & S197s.
@@Desert_Spec The Supra is selling for the same price, is lighter and far better built. There really is no comparison. If Nissan wanted to be competitive, they should have dropped the price tag by 10k.
It's absurd they thought they could sell something that's a parts bin from previous gens for this price.
@@hoppeanofasgard1365 You do realize the Supra is a parts bin car too right? Everything underneath the Toyota facade has a BMW logo on it and the B58 is just as old as the VR30DDTT.
Toyota can afford to sell the Supra cheap considering they only accounted for 10% of the car's development and even then its still 13k USD more expensive than the Z (Car&Driver).
The Z's price is already impressive considering the Z is all Nissan's responsibility. Sure, a 5k discount would be even better but 10k cheaper would make it the same price as a Civic Touring...
Love it. Slammed yet clean. Pulls raunchy. Dials in. Leather suede. No room for you
Had a local dealer trying to sell one for $105k for quite a while. I assume it was sold or traded to another dealer at some point since it is gone now.
I actually lived next to a neighbor not too long ago that bought one of these. I currently drive a 21 3.0 Supra, so I was curious on his thoughts about why he bought a Z for $50k.
In short he enjoys how different it is compared to any other sports car on the road for the price point, (styling wise). Sure you rarely see Supras, but you never see these Z’s. I think it’s really targeted towards a Niche audience that wants a clean looking car that gets it’s job done. But outside of seeing people buying these just to be “different”, I really don’t understand why you’d choose this over so many other cars that give way more value for your money.
I think lifelong z fans like me wouldn’t consider anything else. I think it’d sell better if people actually saw them. A lot of people don’t follow the magazines and blogs and just buy stuff that “looks cute”. It’s only recently that I actually saw one at a dealer.
@@dejoreljackson1787 I totally get that. Z’s have never been my thing, but I understand why people love them. After seeing one in person I will say they are good looking cars.
Rarely see Supra's? I see them almost every other day here in LA. The Z though is rare. Don't see them much.
@@Unicornpirate here in Oregon I maybe see a couple of them a week and I live near Portland.
@@UnicornpirateLiving in Miami I see loads of Supras, and many modified. I’ve only seen one Z, so far.
Dealers are stopping buyers from purchasing them.
Lol, think about what you're saying.
@@fj06carnone They marked them up when hype was high...now that all the hype has lessened they took the markups off...but everyone went out and bought something else or lost interest.
You'll own nothing and be happy @@fj06carnone
By canceling pre order allocations they technically are…
Great car. I would easily say the answer to the title is money. The price of the car is too much for the people who do want to buy it.
I respect Nissan for totally designing and manufacturing the new Nissan RZ34. I really like the new Toyota GR Supra but it's powertrain and design is mostly BMW. I respect and appreciate what Toyota did with the GR Corolla(GZEA14), the GR Corolla is 100% Toyota and 100% awesome.
Glad I got mine for under 50K, it's Performance, manual transmission. Love the way it drives.
some manual transmission engines, the tuning, depending on how rich exhaust gasses are, can actually have an rpm surger when you clutch in. it's an emissions tuning decision to help keep the unburnt hydrocarbon levels down.
Thanks for the comment. My 22 WRX surges every now and again when I clutch in while coming to a stop, I assume this is what's happening.
As a owner of 2 Z32s I learned these cars are some of the hardest to work on. Got to pull the engine to change the oil pan gasket. So I wouldn't buy a Z34. Can't change turbos unleess you pull the engine. Mitsubishi 3000GT was easier to work on and didn't require engjne removal to change a oil pan or turbos. Turbos also have gaskets that can leak coolant and oil causing overheating. So maintaince on a turbo car is a big deal.
I believe the GR Supra turbos are not difficult to replace.
I saw two for sale in a dealership near Omaha about two months ago. I’m pretty sure one was offered at about $75k and the other was about $85k. There’s now way in the world that makes sense to me
Insane. My local dealer only has a couple, and it's always automatics. I don't even bother driving the three minutes to go look at them. Not worth my time.
Lot's of people wanted to buy them. They(dealers) priced them to the point of a used, modern, Lamborghini or R8. At the end of the day, it's a Datsun.
I bought a '24 Nismo Z and I LOVE IT!!
All in/tax final price?
Of course you do, it's an automatic
When the new NSX came out i commented on videos that it was a huge fail and no one would buy it. I cant tell you how many people told me i was stupid. Look who was right! I bought a 2006 g35 coupe manual for 35k out the door and loved that car. The reason this Z is not selling is because the 370z was substantially cheaper. The price change between the outgoing model and this model is enormous. That pissed people off and kept people from selling their old Z to buy the new one. The supra hasnt been sold in decades so sulpa loyalists dont see the price increase in the same way.
I agree about the NSX. I took one look at it and said "I don't know what that is, but it's not an NSX." The styling change was just way too drastic considering how legendary the styling of the original was. I mean, if you're gonna call it an NSX, it should probably at least somewhat remind people of an NSX. I knew from the very first glance that it wasn't going to sell. I've never even bothered to drive it in my racing sims because that's how uninteresting that car is to me.
@Kryptic1046 It didn't sell because of the price, not because of its performance. Its powertrain is super-sophisticated, yet the car has been very reliable. I was considering buying one, but even 7 year old ones are $150k. An oil change is $450. I ended up buying a 45th Anniv. GR Supra and couldn't be happier. It is a nice addition to my MX5.
@@davepaturno4290 I never thought it didn't sell because of its performance, I maintain it didn't sell because of the styling. The classical NSX has distinctive styling, it's one of the main things people love about it. It's hard to mistake it for anything else. If the newer one had styling closer to the original, it would've sold better.
@Kryptic1046 Sadly, the gen 1 NSX stying is kindof like the C5 Corvette styling. You can look at it as old school and slow or old school and cool. I prefer the gen 2 NSX, but the only downside is that it looks like other mid/rear engine exotics and now the C8 Corvette.
@davepaturno4290 the original nsxs styling was second to none during its time. Also the nsx was a complete departure from its original in terms of drivability. The original was incredibly light weight and nimble whereas the new one was a tank.
$54k for performance is just not it when Mustang GT and Supra exist for similar pricing and are faster
the NISMO not having a manual is stupid when its closest competitors all have a manual and are CHEAPER in some cases.
the Z is the best looking car in the segment IMO but Nissan really screwed up the pricing for this car for what could have been a proper Z revival
Not true in a drag the flappy paddle z eats up the mustang impressively
Best looking car in segment? Z was and always is an ugly ass car. It's literally only bought by young men trying to have a "sports car", and poor people trying to get into modding to act like they made a super car beater.
@@resulnaki idk man i like 240z, and this reminds me a lot of them. Is there anything wrong with people with not a ton of money looking to have fun? Or should everyone only aim for Ferraris?
@@ShaiyanHossain there is nothing wrong with that, but there are many cars you can do that with. Zs are just ugly cars. Ferrari? Lol aim for Porsche at least, Ferrari is a joke currently.
@@resulnaki only porsche that interest me are 997 GT3s and 964 RSes. Dont currently have money for either haha
The market was also turning interest rates % were skyrocketing, so people would have astronomical payments! That also with the highest markups in history on a car with a 15 year old chassis
20+ year old chassis in actuality. Now that is beyond sad
Sadly, Nissan has been slowly killing themselves off. The competition and market have little to do with things. When they brought back the Z as the 350 back in the day, then CEO Carlos Ghosn said in order for Nissan to stay competitive int he sports car market, the Z would be released as the sub $25k car....but when it actually launched....$32k+, and just kept going up with no real, measurable improvements over the years.
And look what happened....the Z got cancelled again...then we have this travesty of a Z car. And now...Nissan is years away from closing entirely as a car brand. Altima....gone. Z...gone. Maxima...gone. Titan...gone. Xterra...gone. Frontier....needs to go. They just can't dig themselves out of the hole they put themselves in, which is why they pushed so hard for that alliance with Honda and Mitsubishi.
Awesome, comprehensive and insightful review, my G! Keep it up!!
I would get the base model immediately swap a shorter FD and add an clutch or even helical LSD and LW flywheel it'll completely change modern Zs personality
Nice to see you reviewing a car form the early 2000s
I bought a black performance model & I absolutely Love it! My prior Z was a 370Z nismo tech which I thought handled better and kept your gut feeling like it was part of the road. I miss that feeling in the new Z but disagree with you that the car isn't good. I see a supra around here in Philly maybe once a month or 2. I don't like the way they look. I wouldn't buy 1 if it would have been $10K less than my Z.
I really took the time to think about this, yes I'm sure the dealerships had something to do with it. BUT I noticed something else. I have a 2019 nismo 370 with 22k miles. Every time I get in that car and hit the gas I've got smiles ear-to-ear.. it's firm, it's fast, it's sleek, the inner cabin is more like a cockpit, and the recaro racing seats once in make you one with a car. The fun Factor seems to be completely missing from this new Z. I'm not even a die-hard owner to this platform, it was the car that I stumbled upon that sold me. The car brings me smiles for days. When I saw the chassis response of the new z i was mortified. My Nismo does not do that in the least. And if I were the new owner of that car I would be furious with the sway left and right. Actually one test drive is all it would take for me to pass. People can say what they want about this motor and chassis, but as many have already said platforms like Porsche have not made major changes. It was the execution of the new Z that did itself in from the factory.
After all the time these new Z's have been out, I've only seen one and that was just a few months ago. They're like unicorns.
Recently picked up a GR Supra, the Z wasn’t even on my radar because the Supra just felt one generation newer than the Nissan Z. Stock for stock, the Supra is almost superior in every way: Powertrain, handling, cornering capability, clutch-based rear diff, etc.
Supra also has a way nicer interior & has proven to be far more reliable.
@@autostory7125 it’s not what cars does stock especially if want sell u usa market is like skyline GTR R34 stock 276hp lol
@@Nismo1983 The vast majority of potential buyers are not modders. If you're a manufacturer, and you want your new car to succeed with big sales numbers, it had better appeal to regular folk in its stock form.
@@xtnuser5338 yea but for them is too make more money with aftermarket parts !!
I picked up a 2024 45th Anniv. Supra. It is amazing!
Every potential owner of this car already owned a comfortable gt car with the same engine in the form of the infiniti q50/60. Dont need another comfortable faux luxury car. It needed to be an affordable and value packed performance car with maybe nicer limited trims.
6:30 "It's a blank canvas of a car." This is why no one is buying them. What you get for that price is terrible.
No one is buying it because it's ugly! The 370 had great looks especially the nismo!
I saw my first one today. Rarer than Lambos and Ferrari's... Truly the best value ever. A $50,000 exotic if there ever was one!!!!
What confuses me about Nissan's decision making is how the car with the handling dynamics I am looking for is the only one that doesn't get the manual transmission. Between the stick versions being too soft and underbraked while also having massive dealer markups ran me off. If manufacturers got dealers under control with that, more of these would have moved.
So a $55k car in CA after taxes and fees would exceed $60k then you add another $5k for suspension parts and other expenses to make it better? There are better cars out of the box aren’t there at this price point? Then you look at the used market and the justification for this car becomes less appealing. If you really like this car then just keep it stock and enjoy it as a GT, don’t try to make it what it was not designed for.
People need to stop talking about markups. Its no longer 2022-2023. Some brand new 2024 models are selling under MSRP. Sport models $40k-45k Performance models $47k-$54k.
Heck even C8 Z06 are selling under MSRP.
Yes, I got my Nismo Z well under MSRP earlier this year.
People wanted a Supra, but none was on offer for ages. Now one IS on offer, and it is a better driver's car.
The Z honors its heritage. It is authentic and does not purport to be something that it is not. Take a look at used BMW’s. There is a reason why they are so cheap. Comparing the Supra and the Z is not the correct comparison. The Supra is not JDM. BMW generally has made fast, well performing cars but you wouldn’t want one after the lease is over or the warranty runs out. The Supra is actually a parts bin BMW. The exterior is not good and lacks cohesion in its design. The interior is cramped, vision is very limited and the steering wheel is laughable. The Z is set up to be more of a sport-tourer out of the box. It’s plenty fast to get into trouble, it’s beautiful to look at, it has a very good manual and with reasonable care, you can hold onto and enjoy it for a long time to come.
I think they just cut too many corners and didn’t execute as well as Toyota and BMW did with the Supra. This was like the “yeah well this one is all ours with no help!” response attempt, but it shows in bad ways. It may be a better priced option, but if I could only afford this one and not the Supra I’d probably just choose something different altogether.
I didn’t buy one because the dealer experience sucks, not to mention the dealer mark up. Then the car itself was not that impressive compared to the competition
Love seeing these on the road
Almost like spotting a Unicorn
i live in Vegas, only seen 2 or 3 at most in the last 18 months
Simple answer is: Modding this Z cost double the money of modding a Supra to hit the same numbers. Plus the b58 is at legendary status.
That car is awesome looking! The color is perfect! Nissan did a wonderful job!
Styling, curb weight, sound, and shifter feel are the reasons I would choose a Supra over this.
I'd pick this over the Supra in the styling category. Not sure about sound and shifter feel as I haven't experienced them. Weight is probably accurate.
@@RyneLanders 400z is so ugly in the front, only the rear is decent. The supra on other hand looks different and cool which screams racecar/sportscar. Idk how old you are but everyone i know from 23-35 rather take the supra, gr corolla, typeR, or the typeS over this 400z
@@droptopp3479 i feel like you forget how much absolute shit the Supra got when it came out, everyone panned its looks. As for the Corolla or Civic, those can't hold a candle to the other cars on your list from a design standpoint. The Civic is hideous for sure. This looks a lot better than that. As for what 23 year olds like, I don't really care, hahaha. Not relevant to me.
I'm a big Nissan fan and I would choose the Supra over it. I think it's a step down in styling from the 370z. I get 240sx S13 vibes from it.
@@chrisf8584 they were definitely going with retro vibes for sure. It was an intentional choice. You either love it or hate it. I didn't love it at first, but as a retro-modern design, it's growing on me. I could definitely see how it feels like a backwards move after the hyper-modern design evolution of the 370z
No one is buying them because B58 and S58. Hopefully I can get a G87 M2 someday. If not that, then at least an F22 M240i. I'm at a bad point in my life right now though.
The 350Z is still my favorite. I feel like the design and car just seem to get bigger and bigger. But I guess with regulations, easier to throw more power behind a heavier car than to go lighter and make a true sports car. I was seriously looking to buy one, but the reviews all say the same. Good to great GT car, needs suspension mods. $50k can get you a lot of used sports cars still. And I would rather have the new GR86/BRZ over this especially when factoring in price.
Yeah, 350z is my fave, too. Never liked the styling of the 370. And they just keep getting heavier and heavier.
Regulations are killing the Z… exhaust is smaller to be complaint in CA. RPM surge with clutch for better emissions. Increased weight so the power is justified to the EPA… Using thin oil to meet EPA… not being able to sell in the EU. Also talks are that in Japan the z might not be able to continue as it’s “too loud” something regarding a 71 Db date or something along those lines.
Dealers. I wanted the base sport, no options, manual &black. 42k car, dealer was asking 70…. I’ll wait a few years until I can pick up a healthy used one with good maintenance and low miles in the 20’s or less IF I haven’t decided on anything else at that point. Overall, I think Nissan nailed it with this car. Simple & still a bit old school with the modern touch. Very much like the MX5 , but with more than twice the power.
UNDERPOWERED, OVERPRICED, FUGLY.... thats why no one is buying them. I got a Mustang, a Camaro and a Challenger, thats right, I got all three in my garage with lots more HP.
Japanese designers today, are turning out ugly weird looking cars....
You car reviewers killed the car. Saying it’s a soft GT car and not as good as the Supra. Everyone is buying Supras, and they are buying them over MSRP, especially the manuals. And you can get a Z for under MSRP so the dealers didn’t kill the Z. The media did.
This is a fact
Is the media lying about the feel and performance of the Z? Perhaps Nissan underestimated the competition and their targeted market. Maybe Nissan missed the mark and an opportunity.
Bro I agree, every car has its own personality the Z is soft but better for it lol, I’ve driven gr86 Supra and Z without a doubt they are all fantastic. Like not everyone is going to modify the car, not only that things like “rev hang” literally every manual has it like the type r, Z, Supra Manual. The Z is soft but that’s not bad, I consistently corner with 1.1 g laterally. People need to understand that cars aren’t this or that, enjoy them have fun learn them. Be like Bestmotoring in the 90s not dogging on cars for being quiet or “soft” or “clunky” they enjoyed them for what they were and gave credit. Naturally that doesn’t mean criticism isn’t allowed some things like Overheating stock is worthy to talk about. The Z in my personal experience feels like a great 2000’s sporty car with great 2024 touches. My words as a senile man lol 😂.
@@wheraboo5013 It's good you don't mind the transient response (or lack thereof), but what of people who do mind the slow transient response and can't stand it? 🙂🤔 Why not offer a Performance or Nismo pack with uprated springs and damping for them?
The problem with the Z is it's basically a 370z which is a 2008 platform which in turn is barely different from the 2002 350z platform. This car is too expensive to be a stock car when you can get a new or slightly used BMW with much more performance for the price, and, it's not cheap enough to be a tuner car since you can buy and modify a 350z or 370z and still be well below the MSRP of this Z. If the Z was priced in the low to mid 30's with a manual and LSD stock then it would sell but somehow Nissan is convinced it's worth more or that someone in the market for this car would buy it without LSD. Nissan always cheaps out to their own detriment and instead of pushing units they're just sitting around losing value. I don't think Nissan corp has more than 5 years to exist at this rate.
YOU HIT IT ON THE HEAD
Are you kidding me the amount of new altimas on the road is insane they are probably going to discontinue the Z like they did the Q60. I believe this is the last ditch effort for the Z, throwing in a redsport engine, and contracting a mercedes transmission to rival the supra
@@MarlonAllen-pg9dlare you kidding us? I have yet to see that hideous Altima anywhere. The old one are still around, the absolute disaster of a car design, but i have not seen a new one. Those are as ugly as the originals lol
I had a 370z in the past, and wanted one of these when they were debuted. But the dealer markups hurt. So I ended up getting a used RCF instead and now I think I'd rather just keep that as that car is everything I wanted (minus the manual) in a car. A japanese refined V8. I still think about the Z a lot and think this car is great but I just can't spend over 50k on a car. 40 is pushing it for me.
Nissan still has an image problem to overcome. I think the way to fix that would be to reintroduce a B210-like no frills car with yes... a manual transmission. Maybe a lower priced 200-240SX alternative to the BRZ / 86 Miatas. Lower prices get more buyers involved. Images get fixed by word of mouth, the more mouths chatting, the louder the voice. As you said, provide solid bones for tuning. Less sizzle more steak. Less obfuscation by technology is sometimes more in the same way people still listen to classic rock.
I went in to one of my local Nissan dealerships about a year and a half ago, wanting to by a base model Nissan Z. I saw one that was gun metal gray and I instantly fell in love with it's blue interior/exterior gray combo. Right after exchanging a few comments and terms with one of the reps, she finalized the car in total to be around $67,000... for a base model? I asked why and she claimed that there was a 15k mark-up due to their dealership having the only three Z's in the entire country and that it wasn't worth the wait and I should buy one, while they're still available. I instantly got up and left with an awful impression, and immediately went to my local Lexus dealership. I was in and out in about thirty minutes with my new 2023 Lexus IS350. But perhaps maybe I would have been out the door with the new Z, if they had initially given me a reasonable offer.. bummer..
The Performance Pack is what they base car should've been and priced around $40-42k. No idea why it costs $50k+ when the Performance components aren't even that good. That's how much the Nismo trim should've cost.
In 1993 z's were 35 36k in 1993 money, no way thirty years later they're gonna sell for 40k. The car was never cheap and this take is just delusional.
@@PQ28120yes, GR Supra Manual is literally 68k+ in America man… Z has always been expensive every year lol
@@wheraboo5013 right and that's not a good deal either for its performance but it's a Toyota so it gets circlejerked to death.
@@PQ28120 In 2019 base 370Zs were discounted to 24-25K new. So at double the price after 4 years these new Zs don't look like a bargain.
@@oemj7147 oh well these will be discounted 10k soon so it'll only be a few grand more than it was in 2019. See? I can make random numbers up too.
I just find it really ugly....Z32 is always be the true Fairly Lady Z
The handling is fine, the engine has enough power at 400 hp; the stye is attractive and its fairly comfortable yet if it is 250-300 lbs lighter weight, it would make the above handling and power even more appealing.
Yep, it has WAY to much bloat!
As a tamer driver now, I like the GT angle of this car. Would love to drive it across the Great Basin. It looks good, it sounds good, looks like it has a refined ride, I like it a lot. Classic American car vibes from Japan, surprised it hasn't taken off.
thanks man! I like the succinct no bs style to bring to car reviews.