My step daughter bought me a Citidel Boss Hog for my birthday last year. Not wanting to hurt her feelings, I smiled and said thank you. Since then I have put several boxes of low base #8 birdshot , as well as a couple of boxes of #2 3inch magnum, a box of double 00 buck, and a box of slugs. The first shot with the #8 hung up on ejecting, after that I have never had an issue with it . It eats whatever I feed it and is as reliable as any of my more expensive guns. I guess I got lucky.
@@joeldiaz7416 So far it has held up very well. But I don't abuse my guns like in the videos either. It is not my one of my hunting guns. It sits by my bed loaded with buckshot.
"It's like the 12 ga. Semi-Ottoman Empire. So, what about the Citadel ATAC? Is it a Turkish Delight? Or just Constanti-nope-le?" Only men of culture can pun so well. And...the music at around 10 minutes made me feel like I was selecting a character in Street Fighter after dumping some quarters. Loved it.
The upside, this gun would be great for training shooters on handling failures, emergency field stripping and repairs etc... it's like simulating a mossberg/Remington/beretta etc... that has fired thousands of rounds of high power loads in adverse conditions.
Love your videos, I bought the Maverick 88 because of your tests. It has been so reliable that today I bought my second Maverick 88. Best $200 a person can spend on a shotgun that will shoot when you need it to.
not true... i've shot twelve hundred birdshot consistently. as long as you hold it to your shoulder. if you do not weigh around two hundred pounds i recommend another gun. as for the reliability, i've not had any issues with this piece until a cousin tried to fire it unshouldered. then you need thirteen fifty, or above. keep it clean, cuz i noticed tfb dude's gun is a filthy mess. also, if you are shooting high brass hot loads, you might want to loosen the choke... they have three modes.
Actually, guy back in the 50s sold a simple slam fire shotgun, was just a stock and receiver, that you slid the barrel into to set the primer off and fire. That was the real disposable shotgun
I have been a massive fan of the artistic mechanics of guns, I taught myself how to shoot and field strip my weapons, for the longest time I felt a shotgun was above my skill level and I couldn’t be proficient in learning to use one, but after seeing the multitude of failures that had be cleared it made me confident that I to can possibly ruin a shotgun too
I learned this with old 4runners. I thought my incompetence was far too developed. Then I gave in and started doing my own work, at which point I discovered my own incompetence was small and fragile in the face of the sublime incompetence of the great Previous Owner.
@@patrickriarchy6054 You'd be hard-pressed to do that today. An old wingmaster 870, Winchester defender etc is gonna cost you around $375 on a good deal. Six months ago I coulda bought 30-30's for $375 too............that same gun is $500 today, and where I live { rural } has no gun-buying pressure
I too was curious how such an inexpensive semi auto shotgun would perform and picked up a citadel boss hog on sale at my local sporting goods store. Fired about 150 rounds of various bird and buck shot, 2-3/4" and 3" varieties, all 1,300fps+. Surprisingly, I've had zero failures or issues. Wouldn't want to rely on this gun in a life threatening defensive situation but, so far, mine has functioned flawless and been a fun range toy.
You got to try the Girsan mc312. It’s a $400 Turkish semiautomatic benelli m2 clone with a 3.5” chamber. Runs 3.5” turkey loads and 2.75” Walmart birdshot no problem. I haven’t cleaned mine after 400 rounds still no failures (yet). Would love to see a torture test.
Still love my Maverick 88, it was the first 12 Gauge I bought and has been 100% reliable. I got a Stoeger M3500 semiauto 12 Gauge and that has been another great gun. I’ve had it for almost 3 years and have only had a couple failure to eject and I literally mean maybe 2. This series is the ultimate “You get what you pay for” series. I do own a Mossberg 590 and a Benelli SBE II, and those are EXCELLENT guns. But again, you get what you pay for. Great video James, keep doing what you do!✌🏼
Had a mossy 5hundy but stupidly traded it in and then got my hands on a maverick 88 but did not feel the same what so ever, years down the road and I now own another 5hundy and it feels so right
I vote for this series to not only continue, but to start going up the quality/price totem pole from the recent bottom of the barrel semis. I'm not even sure what would b a step up from the previous test sample, maybe stoeger, tri-star, or franchi perhaps? There's prob other options in there too
This video is super valuable. Probably prevented dozens of people from buying this POS as their budget shotgun. And I’m definitely happier with my Maverick 88 purchase, even though I don’t see myself putting 500+ rounds through it.
@@justinlance4174 I hope to never have to use it to defend my life. Sure I’ll take it to the range to make sure it operates cleanly, but it’s a home defense weapon I hope to never have to use. Plus 500 rounds of 12ga ammo is going to cost more than the Mav 88 did in the first place, lol.
@@Chevalier_knight I think I’ll likely put 50 through it in year 1 to make sure it operates properly and I can control it. Then maybe a couple dozen a year to make sure it’s in working order. But I’m not your typical enthusiast going to the range every other weekend. It’s a home defense weapon I hope to never have to use to defend my home.
My Turkish Panzer M4 just keeps trucking along with zero failures. One tough shotgun. Utterly reliable. One of the best purchases I have made in the world of shooting. (And I own MANY shotguns)
I can never understand people touting the prowess of their cheap clone shotguns. In the event of needing to defend my family and myself I know my Benelli M4 will function every time. Here is to you cheap people hoping their cheap firearms will work in a emergency. May the odds forever be in your favor.
I've been a duck hunter since the mid 80's. I've used a bunch of different shotguns in my day. In all that time I've only ever used 2 autos, one was a Winchester 1400 and one a Smith and Wesson 1000 (if memory serves). Duck hunting can be a torture test of it's own, with cold, windy, wet and muddy conditions. Auto's are great when they run. Single digit temps, below zero wind chills and spray turning to ice on your gun teach you pretty quick what works and what doesn't. I'll stick to my doubles and pump guns.
The Browning Auto-5 broke in to the waterfowl market around 1905 by being more reliable than even doubles (pre-plastic, cardboard shells swell when damp).
Gotta try a benelli SBE series I have used them for over a decade and it has only failed me once and it was my fault because I run the piss out of it and never clean it. The failure was after I went snow goose hunting and ran over a case of mixed 3 1/2" and 3" BB. After I got home it was pretty sluggish because I didnt clean it for over 1k rounds in the mud and it failed to chamber mid way through shooting some canadians. Took it apart wiped it down and sprayed some oil and it was good as new.
@@notchagrandpa8875 Pretty sure all those Turkish shotguns come from the same factory, unless there is like 8 shotgun factories in Turkey making nearly identical shotguns.
@@JuggoJuggo I always thought the same thing. But found out there are in fact a ton of firearms manufacturers in turkey. Most produce shotguns for export. And most copy each other's designs. And practically all of them really suck at metallurgy so you get lots of broken or rapidly worn internal parts, if they work in the first place. Even the single shot rifles and shotguns I've gotten from turkey suffer from sears that wear down and create a dead trigger, or broken(snapped) hammers, triggers, and sears.
James, it appears that the reason it the Shitadel turns into a bolt action when you shoot the 3" magnum shells is that the action is outrunning the magazine. The magnum shells are slamming the piston so hard that the bolt is traveling faster than the magazine tube spring can feed shells out. That why the spent casing is ejected and the next shell is released from the tube and waiting on the lifter in the receiver. It's a timing issue. If you were someone who wanted to make it work a stronger magazine tube spring would likely fix the issue.
@@philliphols not really, clearly ''it's a steaming pile of Istan-bullshit.'' The issue is more common on inertia operated guns (Benelli/Stoeger/Franchi) a good gas gun like a beretta should be able to regulate itself. Or like James said at least come with different pistons so you can manually regulate the gun. Just illuminating what the problem actually is.
@@OneStop14thamendmentAuditShop I assume you only typically run it with standard velocity 00 Buck and Bird shot? But I agree with the comment above mine. You gotta get those numbers up. LOL.
This is a great series. I’d love to see a Palmetto State Armory lineup torture test! The Dagger G19 clone, a midlength Freedom AR, and their 9mm carbine or AK
I really appreciated the dedication to sustaining the test. Just to be sure. Makes you appreciate how little you get when you buy the cheapest stuff. Also appreciate companies that can make a cheaper version that works well.
Every time you review these poverty tier guns they double in price, I was in a local gun store a few days after you first episode dropped about the citadel and they’re trying to sell these damn things for $350
I have a BA siaga mag fed 12 ga shotgun. I have done a crap load of work on it to make it reliable. I have made one off parts for it out of high strength alloys. Redesigning parts for better operation. By the time I was all done it would have been cheaper to do a high end semi-auto. However it does run now without problem now. Slugs, buck, and bird it runs it all.
Been seeing these at the local gun shops, can’t believe folks buy these things. Unfortunately a buddy got one at an auction, it was a “sweet deal” and “only 180 for a $400 gun”
I bought new year raffle for one of these at my LGS. At best I only spend $25 for a $400 gun, at worst my $500 Mossberg 590 won't have to share space with it.
For the next cheaper shotgun maybe try the lynx-12 and then You could put the Kalashnikov KS-12T to the test for shits and giggles. It’s awesome seeing cheaper guns put to the test but what about low/high dollar mag fed shotguns 🤷🏻♂️. Nice video!
@@EvanDickersonM81 you aren’t wrong there, it would be a fast video in that case 😂 and lucky you found out the issues. My cousin purchased the Lyxn 12 and will not run anything.. we’ve checked gas settings, tried different springs, different gas setting chokes and it’s bad wouldn’t even run high quality shells like 1500 FPS. if you was frustrated with the gas settings on these guns I understand “ slams head on desk “ lol.
@@roaringsteelmedia small story, I purchased the KS-12T back in may 2020, I’d like to say it’s the first Gen, absolutely loved it but it had some Issues I couldn’t stand. First it wouldn’t run anything under 1350fps regardless of the gas setting and break in period. Second the rust issues were horrible in joints and cracks, third the foldable / collapsible stock was absolute junk wouldn’t even stand bird shoot without collapsing and forth the hand guard’s screw was weak metal so it stripped out and ruined the hand guard. In the case they provide you with a forward handgrip and after I called Kalashnikov they told me not to use it because of that issue… I thought why did I get the T model if I can’t use hand grip accessories…? Anyway after I told them all of these issue’s they made it right and took my Gun back for a few months and when I got it back it was a dream to own, they gave me all the updated parts / stock and it now magically runs 1200FPS bird shot like a dream. I’d back up this company with customer service and repairs in a heartbeat. I say first Gen because if you look at older video’s of reviews you’ll notice a dinky stock and if you see newer videos you’ll see a more improved stock so I consider it being Gen 2
His shoulder would be dead trying a lynx out of box. In my experience and from what I can tell online it is a true Saiga, unlike the other Chinese Saigas.
For the next burndown, you should get a Stoeger semi-auto of some variety: it's an incredibly popular line, especially in the hunting world, that has gotten a reputation of stubborn reliability, helped along by the fact Stoeger is owned by Benelli and its semi-autos use the exact same inertial-driven system. There's even some parts interchangeability! We need to know: is this really a Benelli for half off or another Turkey shoot?
Hey just one experience here. But I've had a Stoeger M3500 for many years now. Its the cammo 3.5" semi auto. That gun has been flawless for the more than ten years of waterfowl hunting I've used it for. I usually only shoot 3" & 3.5" shells through it so I have the recoil reducer installed inside the butt stock. The directions say for reliability on light loads it's best not to have the recoil reducer in. But I've had zero issues with any light 2-3/4 birdshot. Now, years ago before my M3500, I had the Stoeger M2000 and it had light primer strikes all the time. But that's been many years ago and I would hope they fixed it. But like I said my M3500 has been solid. I can't think of any failure I've ever had with it.
Stoeger? Well, it's the same corporation as Beretta and Benelli; the same design and many of the same parts...but it's made in Turkey, doesn't cost $3000 (and didn't send them anything)-- must be junk!
I had issues with not feeding with bird shots. I put 1 onch slugs and 00 buck through it. I never again had trouble feeding or ejecting after the change of ammo. Perfect every time.
I myself own this shotgun and I know every gun is different with tolerances from turkiye* lol... but these shotguns are great if you spend the time to polish the chamber and feed system, good break in with 50-100 3 inch turkey shells, and keep them well lubricated I have about 800+ rounds through mine and it still looks great internally. Good lubrication is key and so is maintenance and thorough cleaning as with any semi-automatic firearm. This whole video talking shit on it is down to lack of Cleaning and lubrication. The sweet spot on mine are 3 inch 1400-1500fps or 2 3/4 1350-1800 slug and buckshot
When you cheap out on a firearm obviously a good lookover and tweaking will be needed to have a great running firearm. All I did was chamber polish and feed ramp cleanup and polish in the receiver, and remove all the factory oil and re lube with quality lube and its id say 99% reliable with failure to feeds just from ammo issues... Cleanliness and lube is Key. Also hot enough ammo, 3" high fps tss turkey loads are 100% reliable they just hurt to shoot and expensive
I have the Citadel Bosshog and this is what I did. Took it home, took it apart, cleaned off all the shipping grease and lubed every moving part like you are suppose to do. Took it to the range, fired 100 rounds of the recommended velocity ammo, ran with no problem other than the trigger pin starting to move. Took it home and did the same thing when I purchased this gun, and of course used a bit of loctite on the pin. When to the range again with a buddy, now we brought 200 rounds, 100 of them the cheap walmart bundle, 1200fps stuff. All fired no problem, pin stayed in place, I have since put a minimum of 600 rounds through this gun, added a tube extension and fires to this day without any issues. When you had the first failure and took it apart, I knew right away what your problem was, that whole gas ring was dry and dirty as fuck, your whole gun showed no lube what so ever. If you are going to do a torture test on an imported gun, you need to remove the shipping grease, it is not a gun lube, second, lube it up as per instructions. This failure was not a surprise to me one bit.
This dude admitted he's an elitist who believes no semi-auto under a grand (rack) is worthy. He's like Sig owners who think their P320/p365 is the Pen ultimate handgun only AFTER they change out almost ev ery moving part before firing it. Given what you did, per Citadel's recommendations, that company has grounds for a lawsuit against this man child for deliberately abusing a brand new weapon out of the box for the purpose of defaming them. He was just like some spoiled brat at Christmas who wanted a 1000 buck dream bike but his parents got him a 200 dollar one, and then deliberately goes out to trash it in a tantrum. It's also the equivalent of reving a brand new car and never changing the break in oil. This was not "normal use". This was abuse. A Maverick 88 wouldn't have taken this punishment much better. If Citadel and/or their importer hasn't already brought suit, I urge common sense folks to share this video with an encouragement to do so.
@@robertkeller9828 I now have over 2000 shells through this gun, still no problem. I ended up putting a crimp on the trigger pin because it was still moving and that solved the problem which was no big deal to begin with. Not bad for a $175 semi shotgun plus a 8 round tube extension for $60. Yeah I got this gun when on sale with a military discount thanks to the US Marines.
I've always wondered about these shotguns... I paid $199 for a Beretta 1201FP with the pistol grip from Al's army Navy store almost 20 years ago, but that thing is awesome. Citadel, not so much...
James if you want a quality turkish made shotgun, take a look at the stoeger m3000 freedom series. it has ghost ring sights, 7+1 capacity, beveled loading port, oversized bolt release and bolt handle. I think it's the best shotgun for money. Also, since stoeger is a beretta group establishment, it is of higher quality than other Turkish shotguns, but for almost same price.
I’ve seen far too many Stoegers absolutely choke. My little brother had a m3000, maybe 1000rds before it started failing to cycle more than it would cycle.
Mine did the same thing, the ring popped out. Snapped it back in and worked fine. Got home with it and took it apart and realized to keep the ring from popping out again, I pinged the groove that the ring sits in with a small punch just enough to keep it from coming out.
I bought an SDS Imports AR-T02C and got it for $199 with a 26" barrel and an 18.5" barrel. It's like a Beretta 1301 clone and it has thus far cycled every single thing I have put through it. 3" mags, Brenneke KO Slugs, 1650fps buckshot loads and target loads of 3 types etc. Never a failure thus far and handles target loads just as well as hot ones. One thing that is recommended for most semi-auto's is to clean it sometimes. Letting all the carbon build up is bad and also causes failures and shortens life spans. Not saying anything would have made that Citadel run, but I'm glad I bought the one I have and my brother got one too. Maybe someday I'll be sorry, but so far so good. If I had the funds for a 1301 I'd get it, but I can buy 7 of these for that price. lol
I have the same shot gun and I only run birdshot in it. Runs great with 1250 FPS. But it wouldn’t surprise me if the gun is over gassed and has loose tolerances due to poor quality control or some other fluke screw up.
Hey James. I was wondering if you could take a look at the Stoeger M3000. It's made in Turkey, but I heard they're owned by Beretta. I'd love to see it
Mossberg 930 SPX time? Boy, that's what it sounds like. Looking forward to it. The Maverick 88 was my first firearm purchase ever, and it's still the only shotgun that I own. I have an itch for a 1301, but that will have to come after a safe upgrade.
Last week when i went to my FFL to pick up my Benelli supernova I saw a citadel on the wall and thought, “I bet I see a video soon showing just how shitty that gun is”. James you did not disappoint
Would love to see a VR80 or Typhoon shotgun on here. I see them on the wall at Sportsman Warehouse and wonder if theyre any good being around 500 magazine fed shotguns
They aren't good. They suffer from the same QC and lack of support as the gun above. Just cheap rebraded bad quality tactical Turks to make a quick buck on aesthetics and cheapness. Don't be duped.
I shoot a VR80 in multigun competitions and it’s been flawless, but I drilled the gas ports out to .116 thou and changed the back end out for a collapsible AR stock, Taccom vr80 buffer and flat wire recoil spring, then polished the internals, so it’s far from stock and a lot of diy work, but still cheaper than true open shotguns
You got a lemon.. I have one with a little simple work runs like a champ .but I only use 2-3/4 shells . What I did to mine was to clean all the grease out and re lubed with CLP. I also polished the chamber with a wooden dowel with steel 0000 wool with Fitz to mirror polish.,cycled it manually about a thousand times and left it with the bolt locked back for a week ,then the following weekend I went to wally world and got a case of cheap estate 1250 fps # 8 and went to my shooting spot and shot like a charm no jams spit them all out. So I can't complain for the money I even shot 1oz slugs at 30 yards and was impressed with accuracy and also shot some 2-3/4 #5 using the full tube and pattern well for turkey. . I also did alittle de buring with some emery cloth around the loading port on the receiver, it was a little sharp . For 200 bucks it just fine for me and worth the money ,I don't think I would torture test with magum loads, I don't need mag loads anyways.. But I did out of the box have about every 3 round would stick a empty half way out. But cleaning and lubeing and especially polishing the chamber made it function flawless.. Great for a truck gun but yes it's a cheap gun and don't know how long it is going to last but so far so good and I have over 600 rounds through it. Another thing I do is to clean the gas system really good it gets pretty dirty after a 100 rounds .and make sure the barrel lock nut is tight too. I wouldn't trust it for a battle gun running it hard and through that kind of test,,I would find a differnt gun , for somthing to take out to the range and target shoot or maybe shoot some clay bird it just fine. These are hit and miss some guys get good ones and some are carp no matter what you do to it.,there are several good reviews on how good they run and as many on how bad they are. But remember your buy a cheap shotgun and it not going to run like a 1200 dollar Benelli So if you have a little gunsmith knowledge and do some work on it it will run fine.
Here's the thing - I am poor, by most of your viewers standards I'm probably very poor. $175 USD for a shotgun would actually take me quite a bit of saving. That's why my cheapest gun is a CZ 455 synthetic with a decent 3-9 Leupold on it. There's a difference between being poor and making stupid purchasing decisions.
Hi James. I would like to propose the following tactical shotguns for review in the under $1000 category. 1. Stoeger M3000 Freedom Series Defense Shotgun - MSRP $619 2. Mossberg 930 Combo Field/Security - MSRP $790 3. Mossberg 590S - MSRP $731 (and make sure to test the whole gambit from 1.75" to 3" shells) 4. Stoeger M3020 Defense Shotgun - MSRP $619 (it would be interesting to see a 20 gauge reviewed) 5. Mossberg International SA-20 Railed - Pistol Grip - MSRP $668 (another 20 gauge) I love this series, and look forward to future reviews.
There is a Clint Smith/Thunder Ranch video on TH-cam where he talks about home defense shotguns and running the gun you have. He says you just might be surprised what even a break action, single barrel can do then shows a simple method for getting a decent rate of fire with one. Being my first, two guns I got during my teenage years were singles - a .410 and later a 12 gauge - I have a a soft spot for single barrels as woods walking guns and so I own a few and decided to try his method. Now, I am certainly not at Clint Smith's experience level or even close but I practiced enough to do it smoothly and got to the point I was getting nearly the rate of fire that a newish shooter would likely get with a pump. My point is that with a buttcuff shell holder and a shotgun ammo belt (worn like a bandolier) I could maintain a faster, steadier rate of fire with a 1960s 20 gauge break action single barrel I got for $60 at a gun show than I could with the particular shotgun in this video.
Thanks for this. Just in time. I've been pondering getting one of these. Now I'll get a Maverick 88 instead and have a good shooter. Just subscribed too!
Somehow no problems so far with ours. 800+ shells and not a single issue. Maybe we got lucky or something. Taking it apart and cleaning it before ever shooting it is important. It had a some sticky oil and carboard dust gunking things up.
@@philipmarcus97 I am not 100% certain it could get off 500 rounds in a row like the test requires (haven’t tried it) but I am 100% certain it can get off all the rounds in the tube and my shot card in a home defense situation 100% of the time. My Mossberg 500 got shifted to the back of the safe because of it,
I have a boss 25, its like $400, got about 600 rounds through it. Still hanging tough. But it can be finicky changing types of ammo. If you have the wrong piston in, it'll mess with it
Man I love this series! Always enjoy seeing the low end of the cost spectrum firearms being fired. Still sticking to what I trained and carried in the old career, the Rem 870 riot. Bedside companion!
This one made me really nervous someone in the crew was going to have an out of battery and get Kentucky Ballistics'd. And the shotgun can't demand high velocity ammo, and then breakdown when it gets good ammo.
There was clearly something wrong with that Remington 3" slug. They fired a 3" the previous round as well, and that Remington had 2 to 3 times the recoil, muzzle flash and recoil. Then, they take it into their... well, somebody's workshop, make fun of gunsmiths, and reveal a stunning lack of basic knowledge about gas op autoloaders.... Seriously, I don't know why I'm bothering to even respond-- this is clearly a BS brand-snob channel that I'm never returning to.
Not gonna lie though, I bought a Panzer Arms BP12 Gen 1. Initially I saw a lot of people stating their biggest problem was failure to feed/eject. However, almost every one of these reviewers I saw got the shotgun, took it out of the box, and tried firing birdshot through it. No cleaning, no lubing, fresh from box. Let me tell you, it came DIRTY! SO DIRTY! Immediately upon receiving the shotgun, I stripped and cleaned it, and has run 200+ rounds of birdshot through it and 100s of rounds of buckshot through it no problem. I have not used 3" shells yet, or slugs yet. I mean it was a sub $500 shotgun when I bought it, I also quite dislike the plastic housing and the "faux suppressor" (honestly this is probably to add more weight to the front end because it is HUGELY back heavy), but other than that, I have loved it... Only thing I wish were that 1919 shotgun magazines were less expensive. Would love to see you torture test this semi shotgun. The price is in the range of "good" pump shotguns.
I have the Warthog and have not had any issue with mine outside of the occasional FTE when using low power stuff (which is rare because I try to avoid using it). It currently has just over 5000 rounds of mixed ammo through it. I routinely fire 1600fps buckshot through this gun. (The first 250 rounds were all 1600+) Mine cycles just about everything down to about 1200fps (1 brand rated at 1150fps still works fine). I will say that the internals of mine are different than the one you tested, I have seen at least 3 different versions of internals parts on these. I should also note that I added a magazine extension tube and replaced follower & the stock spring with one from Wolf. It was having feed issues with the spring that came with the kit. I guess I just got the good one?
@@JohnDoe-zg6fn I have well over 2000 rounds through my Boss Hog, I did the same mods as AMCITADEL did to his, it runs with no issue what so ever, you can also visit his channel where he demonstrates his gun before so simply trying to dismiss him.
Seeing this video makes me feel better after watching my Dickinson Marine Pump’s heat shield and rear sight blow off. I had only 100 rounds through it.
I have citadel warthog with the pistol grip and ghost ring sights, seems to be possibly the updated version of this. But as far as from my experience it's done alot better than that. Maybe you should give citadel one more chance and test out that one.
Being that it had a totally different type of failure on each magazine worth of ammo, it would be good for training, haha. You have to rapidly diagnose the problem and fix it on the clock.
I have that same exact shotgun, and it did the same thing to me. I simply replaced overring and it’s ran fine since then, but I also shoot all high brass out of it.
Hope so, I was about *this* close to pulling the metaphorical trigger on one from Panzer Arms before finding Maverick 88 (with the 18.5 & 28 inch barrel!) for the same price.
Picked up a Panzer Arms BP12 over the summer. Love the platform, FTF on new mag is the problem. Mag insertion/release was janky from the start. Now once a mag is done, when inserting new mag have to keep pressure on the charging handle and bang the hell out butt on a table to get it ready to load. Over 100 rds & still utter garbage. Selling & Mav 88 here I come. No more Turkish crap for me
I have a Stoeger m2000. Made in Turkey (it did cost 3x more than James' test gun). 1100 rounds before the first malfunction. I replaced the extractor with a Benelli M2 extractor, and its back in business- no malfunctions. I'm not defending all Turkish shotguns. I am saying all Turkish shotguns are NOT equal. I will also add that 2 of my friends have purchased Stoeger Semis after having shot mine. Its that good. You can win with a Stoeger made in Turkey.
I bought a Maverick 88 before I saw his burn down torture test. I'm so happy I have a Mossberg Maverick 88!!! The double ejector is slick like butter in the Maverick.
So this may be anecdotal, but my stoegor m3500 (3 1/2 chambering) is one of not only my most favorite shotguns, but guns in general. I’ve never once had any failures to feed or function right out of the box, after a good initial cleaning of course. She’s got thousands of rounds ranging from steel shot to magnum turkey and slugs and ate them all happily in every environment.
They're supposed to be one of the most reliable of the Turkish built shotguns...but they're Benelli-owned, not the usual run of local gunsmithing. I hope the M3000 is the one James was hinting at though.
Had 3 of them on our trap team a few years ago (condor, and 2 condor grand champions). 2 lost firing pins mid season, one lost the forend retention system (shotgun falls apart), and one had the brazed steel strips between the top and bottom barrel break off and make cool little metal whips off the barrel. The few guys I know that use the m3500 for duck and goose have had slightly better luck, but I suppose thats the territory with budget options.
The high velocity stuff makes the bolt outrun the magazine spring so it will fire and eject, but the bolt may pass by the next round without picking it up. That was the main issue with the Citadel Boss 25 I had... and the recoil sucked... and the Turkish factories cannot seem to figure out how to install the flip up sights at the factory. they are always on backward on the AR style guns. Overall, the only off-brand semi I have tested that works is the Tristar brand. The Raptor I bought has chrome lined barrel, chamber, and chrome plated bolt. It is smooth, runs everything even my light reloads, my heavy reloads, slugs, and buckshot. I only ran 2 3/4" shells through it, but it has been great with all of those. And tri star are about $350-400
Absolutely love my citadel warthog. After some filing here and there on the load ramps it absolutely never gets jammed or has a misfire with high velocity rounds 1300 fps or better. Very low recoil for a shotgun
I thought about picking up this shotgun a couple of months ago when my LGS had a few in stock. Good thing I decide to save the money and stuck with my old Mav 88 as my HD gun.
Please keep these coming! I love inexpensive firearms but I hate cheap. I was looking at one of these for a boat gun. I'll stick to my tried and true Mossberg.
I'll add to the Turkish shotgun discontent here. I took a chance on an Akkar 612 (previously "CZ" 612) Churchill 12 gauge pump. 18.5" model. I bought it because I really liked the ergonomics of the shotgun and it was extremely lightweight. Saw some positive reviews and thought "why not, for $199" Got it out to the range, and it wouldn't run more than 2 or 3 rounds through it without a malfunction. The shell would hit the side of the barrel on the way in and jam up. I thought "okay, well let's run about 200 rounds through it to see if it works itself out." 225 rounds later of mixed bird shot and buckshot..still the same thing. Turkish shotguns have gotten $199 + tax from me, and that's all they'll ever get. I'll stick to my Mossy 500 & 590's. I'm all good on anything Turkish shotgun from now on.
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I can't believe that James missed the opportunity to review the Boss Hog while wearing Daisy Dukes.
Its too dangerous to have that many distractions in a live fire event... lol
Re-do! 😅
Onlyfans exclusive
Some guys come for the guns while others, the buns.
😝
My step daughter bought me a Citidel Boss Hog for my birthday last year. Not wanting to hurt her feelings, I smiled and said thank you. Since then I have put several boxes of low base #8 birdshot , as well as a couple of boxes of #2 3inch magnum, a box of double 00 buck, and a box of slugs. The first shot with the #8 hung up on ejecting, after that I have never had an issue with it . It eats whatever I feed it and is as reliable as any of my more expensive guns. I guess I got lucky.
Has the gun still held up or has it died?
@@joeldiaz7416 So far it has held up very well. But I don't abuse my guns like in the videos either. It is not my one of my hunting guns. It sits by my bed loaded with buckshot.
Awesome daughter tbh
She has the spirit and thought of you; a good daughter.
That girl loves you!
"It's like the 12 ga. Semi-Ottoman Empire. So, what about the Citadel ATAC? Is it a Turkish Delight? Or just Constanti-nope-le?" Only men of culture can pun so well. And...the music at around 10 minutes made me feel like I was selecting a character in Street Fighter after dumping some quarters. Loved it.
Damn, I'm a man of culture! Fuck yeah!
I fkn lost it when you said "Trailer Park Protector" 🤣🤣🤣
The upside, this gun would be great for training shooters on handling failures, emergency field stripping and repairs etc... it's like simulating a mossberg/Remington/beretta etc... that has fired thousands of rounds of high power loads in adverse conditions.
Or a new Remington that has had 5 shells through it. Lmfao.
For a 176 trainer, that's not bad. But that's literally the only thing it's worth a damn for.
Until it blows up.
I wouldn’t trust that thing anywhere near my face
It should be marketed as the first single shot semi auto....and anti gunner's wet dream of a weapon
@@very7962 That's what she said
Love your videos, I bought the Maverick 88 because of your tests. It has been so reliable that today I bought my second Maverick 88. Best $200 a person can spend on a shotgun that will shoot when you need it to.
I got my Mav 88 like days before that review came out. I was sweating there until I saw it passing the test 😂
Warning: Will not cycle with ammo under 1300 fps. (also can not survive loads hotter than 1300 fps)
bro exactly
Goldilocks zone
Maybe you just need some ammo with exactly 1301 fps
not true... i've shot twelve hundred birdshot consistently. as long as you hold it to your shoulder. if you do not weigh around two hundred pounds i recommend another gun. as for the reliability, i've not had any issues with this piece until a cousin tried to fire it unshouldered. then you need thirteen fifty, or above. keep it clean, cuz i noticed tfb dude's gun is a filthy mess. also, if you are shooting high brass hot loads, you might want to loosen the choke... they have three modes.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't
The commentary, and the analogies are easily the best part of James's videos.
James beating that shotgun like it owes him money. $179 to be exact
Your username and pic are perfect... And John Redcorn speaks exactly that way.
Underrated comment!
Big Mountain Fudge Cake rules! Woooo!!!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣👌 you have me on the floor at option B, it engages its automatic disassembly feature. I'd love for you to try out the SRM 1216.
4:00-4:10. I don't know how long it took James to come up with these puns, but I applaud him. Great overall video as always
This could actually be marketed as the very first disposable shotgun.
Pretty sure that's an old zip gun.
Actually, guy back in the 50s sold a simple slam fire shotgun, was just a stock and receiver, that you slid the barrel into to set the primer off and fire. That was the real disposable shotgun
Like in cyberpunk 2077
Think of all the money you will save on ammunition.
@LabRat Knatz you should’ve left out the explanation and just let the real ones understand the reference 💯
I have been a massive fan of the artistic mechanics of guns, I taught myself how to shoot and field strip my weapons, for the longest time I felt a shotgun was above my skill level and I couldn’t be proficient in learning to use one, but after seeing the multitude of failures that had be cleared it made me confident that I to can possibly ruin a shotgun too
I learned this with old 4runners. I thought my incompetence was far too developed. Then I gave in and started doing my own work, at which point I discovered my own incompetence was small and fragile in the face of the sublime incompetence of the great Previous Owner.
Thanks for this series. You guys are keeping folks that can't afford to waste money from doing so.
Yeah, Your right, but it won't stop them !!! After all , it's $169 !!!!
@@georgeheidkesr1759
For that money you can get a decent used grandpa pump action in most places
@@patrickriarchy6054 You'd be hard-pressed to do that today. An old wingmaster 870, Winchester defender etc is gonna cost you around $375 on a good deal. Six months ago I coulda bought 30-30's for $375 too............that same gun is $500 today, and where I live { rural } has no gun-buying pressure
Buy once, cry once.
So glad I watched this video before I bought one for my Dad. I’m just gonna stick to Maverick 88’s as my go-to budget shotgun.
Props to your editor for that BANGER playing during your testing phase
The soundtrack is on point. James is definitely a connoisseur that sweet 80's synth/fused jams. bravo.........bravo *slow clap*
I too was curious how such an inexpensive semi auto shotgun would perform and picked up a citadel boss hog on sale at my local sporting goods store. Fired about 150 rounds of various bird and buck shot, 2-3/4" and 3" varieties, all 1,300fps+. Surprisingly, I've had zero failures or issues. Wouldn't want to rely on this gun in a life threatening defensive situation but, so far, mine has functioned flawless and been a fun range toy.
You chronographed every shot 🤔🤔🤔🤔
If it has never let you down or given you doubt, why wouldn't you use it to defend yourself?
@@winkletown8828the fps is advertised on the box. He is talking about the ammunition choice not the velocity performance.
James is the master of the pun n' gun and this video might be his masterpiece.
Semi-Ottoman Empire and Constanti-Nope-le set the new standard to be certain.
@@ub3rk0r3 Istanbul-lshit was pretty nifty too😂
You got to try the Girsan mc312. It’s a $400 Turkish semiautomatic benelli m2 clone with a 3.5” chamber. Runs 3.5” turkey loads and 2.75” Walmart birdshot no problem. I haven’t cleaned mine after 400 rounds still no failures (yet). Would love to see a torture test.
My Nephew's Girsan mc312 clicks all the time when we go dove hunting lmao
Yeah, same story I hear from all you turknelli clone owners. Just get a benelli and be done with it.
Just get a mossberg, Benelli or some other reputable brand. Quit buying Turkish made bullshit
Still love my Maverick 88, it was the first 12 Gauge I bought and has been 100% reliable. I got a Stoeger M3500 semiauto 12 Gauge and that has been another great gun. I’ve had it for almost 3 years and have only had a couple failure to eject and I literally mean maybe 2. This series is the ultimate “You get what you pay for” series. I do own a Mossberg 590 and a Benelli SBE II, and those are EXCELLENT guns. But again, you get what you pay for. Great video James, keep doing what you do!✌🏼
Bought my Mav 88 in 1989. Still running to this day.
I bought my Browning A5, made in 1973, but never fired, from a neighbor who will never shoot it again, for $100.
@@seanomeirs8362 stonks!
@@mithonig6553 That's what it feels like.
Had a mossy 5hundy but stupidly traded it in and then got my hands on a maverick 88 but did not feel the same what so ever, years down the road and I now own another 5hundy and it feels so right
I vote for this series to not only continue, but to start going up the quality/price totem pole from the recent bottom of the barrel semis. I'm not even sure what would b a step up from the previous test sample, maybe stoeger, tri-star, or franchi perhaps? There's prob other options in there too
This video is super valuable. Probably prevented dozens of people from buying this POS as their budget shotgun. And I’m definitely happier with my Maverick 88 purchase, even though I don’t see myself putting 500+ rounds through it.
If you have that shotgun for 5 years and you put 100 rounds a year though it that's easy 500 there
James saved me from buying anything Black Aces
Damn why have a gun if u never shoot it?
@@justinlance4174 I hope to never have to use it to defend my life. Sure I’ll take it to the range to make sure it operates cleanly, but it’s a home defense weapon I hope to never have to use.
Plus 500 rounds of 12ga ammo is going to cost more than the Mav 88 did in the first place, lol.
@@Chevalier_knight I think I’ll likely put 50 through it in year 1 to make sure it operates properly and I can control it. Then maybe a couple dozen a year to make sure it’s in working order. But I’m not your typical enthusiast going to the range every other weekend. It’s a home defense weapon I hope to never have to use to defend my home.
Oddly enough my Benelli M4 has never had any of these problems. It was almost 10x the price though 😂
Hard to beat a Benelli m4 super 90
@@Cain-IVI beat? True. But dollar for dollar is another thing.
My Turkish Panzer M4 just keeps trucking along with zero failures. One tough shotgun. Utterly reliable. One of the best purchases I have made in the world of shooting. (And I own MANY shotguns)
I can never understand people touting the prowess of their cheap clone shotguns. In the event of needing to defend my family and myself I know my Benelli M4 will function every time. Here is to you cheap people hoping their cheap firearms will work in a emergency. May the odds forever be in your favor.
@bradenhagen7977 dollars matter when your life or your family's lives are at stake 🤔🤷
Buy once cry once, quality costs more.
I've been a duck hunter since the mid 80's. I've used a bunch of different shotguns in my day. In all that time I've only ever used 2 autos, one was a Winchester 1400 and one a Smith and Wesson 1000 (if memory serves). Duck hunting can be a torture test of it's own, with cold, windy, wet and muddy conditions. Auto's are great when they run. Single digit temps, below zero wind chills and spray turning to ice on your gun teach you pretty quick what works and what doesn't. I'll stick to my doubles and pump guns.
The Browning Auto-5 broke in to the waterfowl market around 1905 by being more reliable than even doubles (pre-plastic, cardboard shells swell when damp).
Gotta try a benelli SBE series I have used them for over a decade and it has only failed me once and it was my fault because I run the piss out of it and never clean it. The failure was after I went snow goose hunting and ran over a case of mixed 3 1/2" and 3" BB. After I got home it was pretty sluggish because I didnt clean it for over 1k rounds in the mud and it failed to chamber mid way through shooting some canadians. Took it apart wiped it down and sprayed some oil and it was good as new.
Loved how they stopped and started the music as James was having to fuck with it to make it shoot half way through the video.
I like this series. Always on the look out for cheap reliable shotguns. Obviously not this one 😂
Stoeger!!
@@notchagrandpa8875 Pretty sure all those Turkish shotguns come from the same factory, unless there is like 8 shotgun factories in Turkey making nearly identical shotguns.
@@JuggoJuggo There multiple different factories producing very similar shotguns. I covered the differences in 2 of them in a recent video.
@@JuggoJuggo I always thought the same thing. But found out there are in fact a ton of firearms manufacturers in turkey. Most produce shotguns for export. And most copy each other's designs. And practically all of them really suck at metallurgy so you get lots of broken or rapidly worn internal parts, if they work in the first place.
Even the single shot rifles and shotguns I've gotten from turkey suffer from sears that wear down and create a dead trigger, or broken(snapped) hammers, triggers, and sears.
Any review info on Charles Daly 601?
This gives a whole new meaning to the term fighting with your shotgun!
James, it appears that the reason it the Shitadel turns into a bolt action when you shoot the 3" magnum shells is that the action is outrunning the magazine. The magnum shells are slamming the piston so hard that the bolt is traveling faster than the magazine tube spring can feed shells out. That why the spent casing is ejected and the next shell is released from the tube and waiting on the lifter in the receiver. It's a timing issue. If you were someone who wanted to make it work a stronger magazine tube spring would likely fix the issue.
Sounds like it needs variable porting or a different piston for different loads.
And here’s our JAG
@@philliphols not really, clearly ''it's a steaming pile of Istan-bullshit.'' The issue is more common on inertia operated guns (Benelli/Stoeger/Franchi) a good gas gun like a beretta should be able to regulate itself. Or like James said at least come with different pistons so you can manually regulate the gun. Just illuminating what the problem actually is.
I think the best fix is to spend the money on a Benelli or Beretta...
or just don't run three inch high brass... glad i saw this vid
That look of joy on James's face when it first failed is pure gold!
Moral of the story: If you buy a semi auto shotgun only to manually cycle each shell then might as well buy a pump shotgun.
I got the citadel pat 12g... No issues
@@OneStop14thamendmentAuditShop one of 1 million congrats
@@darrengarcia4937 I have one as well, had it since August of last year, at least 200 rounds through it. Runs just fine.
@@automaton2953 only 200? Thats barely a break in period.
@@OneStop14thamendmentAuditShop I assume you only typically run it with standard velocity 00 Buck and Bird shot? But I agree with the comment above mine. You gotta get those numbers up. LOL.
This is a great series. I’d love to see a Palmetto State Armory lineup torture test! The Dagger G19 clone, a midlength Freedom AR, and their 9mm carbine or AK
James is probably qualified now to teach a shotgun malfunction clearing course
I hear that the military is now using his videos for training.
I really appreciated the dedication to sustaining the test. Just to be sure. Makes you appreciate how little you get when you buy the cheapest stuff. Also appreciate companies that can make a cheaper version that works well.
Every time you review these poverty tier guns they double in price, I was in a local gun store a few days after you first episode dropped about the citadel and they’re trying to sell these damn things for $350
Maybe for $3.50
Then you should never go to the LGS again. Fk those guys.
Thats what they were going for a few months ago.......then came price drops !!
@@georgeheidkesr1759 They’ve never been more than $225 at my shop.
@@prettynormalguy3169 Found Maverick 88 at Academy for $219-229
I have a BA siaga mag fed 12 ga shotgun. I have done a crap load of work on it to make it reliable. I have made one off parts for it out of high strength alloys. Redesigning parts for better operation. By the time I was all done it would have been cheaper to do a high end semi-auto. However it does run now without problem now. Slugs, buck, and bird it runs it all.
Been seeing these at the local gun shops, can’t believe folks buy these things. Unfortunately a buddy got one at an auction, it was a “sweet deal” and “only 180 for a $400 gun”
I bought new year raffle for one of these at my LGS. At best I only spend $25 for a $400 gun, at worst my $500 Mossberg 590 won't have to share space with it.
@@PipBoy3k the price gouging on these thing are insane, for the “quality” you get they are not worth anywhere near 400
It's not a sweet deal if its guaranteed to jam.
The music stopping every time the gun jammed made me laugh so hard 🤪🤪
For the next cheaper shotgun maybe try the lynx-12 and then You could put the Kalashnikov KS-12T to the test for shits and giggles. It’s awesome seeing cheaper guns put to the test but what about low/high dollar mag fed shotguns 🤷🏻♂️. Nice video!
My lynx 12 has been pretty awesome. The sds civet 12 would be a good candidate though!
@@EvanDickersonM81 you aren’t wrong there, it would be a fast video in that case 😂 and lucky you found out the issues. My cousin purchased the Lyxn 12 and will not run anything.. we’ve checked gas settings, tried different springs, different gas setting chokes and it’s bad wouldn’t even run high quality shells like 1500 FPS. if you was frustrated with the gas settings on these guns I understand “ slams head on desk “ lol.
@@roaringsteelmedia small story,
I purchased the KS-12T back in may 2020, I’d like to say it’s the first Gen, absolutely loved it but it had some
Issues I couldn’t stand. First it wouldn’t run anything under 1350fps regardless of the gas setting and break in period. Second the rust issues were horrible in joints and cracks, third the foldable / collapsible stock was absolute junk wouldn’t even stand bird shoot without collapsing and forth the hand guard’s screw was weak metal so it stripped out and ruined the hand guard. In the case they provide you with a forward handgrip and after I called Kalashnikov they told me not to use it because of that issue… I thought why did I get the T model if I can’t use hand grip accessories…? Anyway after I told them all of these issue’s they made it right and took my
Gun back for a few months and when I got it back it was a dream to own, they gave me all the updated parts / stock and it now magically runs 1200FPS bird shot like a dream. I’d back up this company with customer service and repairs in a heartbeat.
I say first Gen because if you look at older video’s of reviews you’ll notice a dinky stock and if you see newer videos you’ll see a more improved stock so I consider it being Gen 2
@@addventure2863 I agree on that!
His shoulder would be dead trying a lynx out of box. In my experience and from what I can tell online it is a true Saiga, unlike the other Chinese Saigas.
15:01 Woah there Baldwin, get off the trigger when you work the bolt!
For the next burndown, you should get a Stoeger semi-auto of some variety: it's an incredibly popular line, especially in the hunting world, that has gotten a reputation of stubborn reliability, helped along by the fact Stoeger is owned by Benelli and its semi-autos use the exact same inertial-driven system. There's even some parts interchangeability!
We need to know: is this really a Benelli for half off or another Turkey shoot?
Stoeger is a legit workhorse of a shotgun.
Hey just one experience here. But I've had a Stoeger M3500 for many years now. Its the cammo 3.5" semi auto. That gun has been flawless for the more than ten years of waterfowl hunting I've used it for. I usually only shoot 3" & 3.5" shells through it so I have the recoil reducer installed inside the butt stock. The directions say for reliability on light loads it's best not to have the recoil reducer in. But I've had zero issues with any light 2-3/4 birdshot. Now, years ago before my M3500, I had the Stoeger M2000 and it had light primer strikes all the time. But that's been many years ago and I would hope they fixed it. But like I said my M3500 has been solid. I can't think of any failure I've ever had with it.
Stoeger? Well, it's the same corporation as Beretta and Benelli; the same design and many of the same parts...but it's made in Turkey, doesn't cost $3000 (and didn't send them anything)-- must be junk!
had to
rwbuild a stoeger m2000 the ither day. pita to get back together
I am 110% confident a m3000 will do just as good as the mossbergs, they are solid
I had issues with not feeding with bird shots. I put 1 onch slugs and 00 buck through it. I never again had trouble feeding or ejecting after the change of ammo. Perfect every time.
This was my first gun lol. I made a smarter decision and bought a mossberg 590 in the summer 😂
I myself own this shotgun and I know every gun is different with tolerances from turkiye* lol... but these shotguns are great if you spend the time to polish the chamber and feed system, good break in with 50-100 3 inch turkey shells, and keep them well lubricated I have about 800+ rounds through mine and it still looks great internally. Good lubrication is key and so is maintenance and thorough cleaning as with any semi-automatic firearm. This whole video talking shit on it is down to lack of Cleaning and lubrication. The sweet spot on mine are 3 inch 1400-1500fps or 2 3/4 1350-1800 slug and buckshot
When you cheap out on a firearm obviously a good lookover and tweaking will be needed to have a great running firearm. All I did was chamber polish and feed ramp cleanup and polish in the receiver, and remove all the factory oil and re lube with quality lube and its id say 99% reliable with failure to feeds just from ammo issues... Cleanliness and lube is Key. Also hot enough ammo, 3" high fps tss turkey loads are 100% reliable they just hurt to shoot and expensive
I would love for you guys to review one of the Turkish M4 clones. The Sulun arms Tac-12 seems like the perfect subject.
I'd like to see the Coppola Toros T4, which claims to be fully parts compatible with the real M4
I have the Citadel Bosshog and this is what I did.
Took it home, took it apart, cleaned off all the shipping grease and lubed every moving part like you are suppose to do.
Took it to the range, fired 100 rounds of the recommended velocity ammo, ran with no problem other than the trigger pin starting to move.
Took it home and did the same thing when I purchased this gun, and of course used a bit of loctite on the pin.
When to the range again with a buddy, now we brought 200 rounds, 100 of them the cheap walmart bundle, 1200fps stuff.
All fired no problem, pin stayed in place, I have since put a minimum of 600 rounds through this gun, added a tube extension and fires to this day without any issues.
When you had the first failure and took it apart, I knew right away what your problem was, that whole gas ring was dry and dirty as fuck, your whole gun showed no lube what so ever.
If you are going to do a torture test on an imported gun, you need to remove the shipping grease, it is not a gun lube, second, lube it up as per instructions.
This failure was not a surprise to me one bit.
This dude admitted he's an elitist who believes no semi-auto under a grand (rack) is worthy. He's like Sig owners who think their P320/p365 is the Pen ultimate handgun only AFTER they change out almost ev
ery moving part before firing it. Given what you did, per Citadel's recommendations, that company has grounds for a lawsuit against this man child for deliberately abusing a brand new weapon out of the box for the purpose of defaming them.
He was just like some spoiled brat at Christmas who wanted a 1000 buck dream bike but his parents got him a 200 dollar one, and then deliberately goes out to trash it in a tantrum.
It's also the equivalent of reving a brand new car and never changing the break in oil.
This was not "normal use". This was abuse. A Maverick 88 wouldn't have taken this punishment much better.
If Citadel and/or their importer hasn't already brought suit, I urge common sense folks to share this video with an encouragement to do so.
@@robertkeller9828 I now have over 2000 shells through this gun, still no problem.
I ended up putting a crimp on the trigger pin because it was still moving and that solved the problem which was no big deal to begin with. Not bad for a $175 semi shotgun plus a 8 round tube extension for $60. Yeah I got this gun when on sale with a military discount thanks to the US Marines.
Falling apart like Hickok45 at a Hustler club. Congrats James, you won the internet for the week.
Would love to see you test the Savage reneguage security shotgun!
I've always wondered about these shotguns... I paid $199 for a Beretta 1201FP with the pistol grip from Al's army Navy store almost 20 years ago, but that thing is awesome. Citadel, not so much...
$199 in 2001 is not the same as $199 in 2021.
True, but the point was, the 1201FP isn't a POS 👍
@@donprater6944 yes.
The music editing is brilliant 🤣🤣🤣🤣💪🏽💪🏽
James if you want a quality turkish made shotgun, take a look at the stoeger m3000 freedom series. it has ghost ring sights, 7+1 capacity, beveled loading port, oversized bolt release and bolt handle. I think it's the best shotgun for money. Also, since stoeger is a beretta group establishment, it is of higher quality than other Turkish shotguns, but for almost same price.
"The best shotgun money can buy." LOL
A couple specs makes it the best? Nothing you listed pertains to the action or cycling of the gun
Turkish is bad
I’ve seen far too many Stoegers absolutely choke. My little brother had a m3000, maybe 1000rds before it started failing to cycle more than it would cycle.
Mine did the same thing, the ring popped out. Snapped it back in and worked fine. Got home with it and took it apart and realized to keep the ring from popping out again, I pinged the groove that the ring sits in with a small punch just enough to keep it from coming out.
that blue flame coming out of the chamber was pretty cool. Need to kill one of those panzer or JTS shotguns next.
I bought an SDS Imports AR-T02C and got it for $199 with a 26" barrel and an 18.5" barrel. It's like a Beretta 1301 clone and it has thus far cycled every single thing I have put through it. 3" mags, Brenneke KO Slugs, 1650fps buckshot loads and target loads of 3 types etc. Never a failure thus far and handles target loads just as well as hot ones. One thing that is recommended for most semi-auto's is to clean it sometimes. Letting all the carbon build up is bad and also causes failures and shortens life spans. Not saying anything would have made that Citadel run, but I'm glad I bought the one I have and my brother got one too. Maybe someday I'll be sorry, but so far so good. If I had the funds for a 1301 I'd get it, but I can buy 7 of these for that price. lol
Trailer Park Protector! 🤣 Nice one James. Happy New Year TFBTV crew!
I have the same shot gun and I only run birdshot in it. Runs great with 1250 FPS. But it wouldn’t surprise me if the gun is over gassed and has loose tolerances due to poor quality control or some other fluke screw up.
Hey James. I was wondering if you could take a look at the Stoeger M3000. It's made in Turkey, but I heard they're owned by Beretta. I'd love to see it
Yeah, they're owned by Beretta/Benelli.
Mossberg 930 SPX time? Boy, that's what it sounds like. Looking forward to it. The Maverick 88 was my first firearm purchase ever, and it's still the only shotgun that I own. I have an itch for a 1301, but that will have to come after a safe upgrade.
Last week when i went to my FFL to pick up my Benelli supernova I saw a citadel on the wall and thought, “I bet I see a video soon showing just how shitty that gun is”. James you did not disappoint
Nice the Supernova is supposed to be a workhorse.
Oh it is. I have a tactical model and was putting everything through it including a 3 1/2 goose load. That’s a hot round
I have this gun and it has worked fine for me!
Would love to see a VR80 or Typhoon shotgun on here. I see them on the wall at Sportsman Warehouse and wonder if theyre any good being around 500 magazine fed shotguns
Agreed 💯!
I almost bought one of those VR80s but the guys I shoot 3-Gun with seem to have never-ending problems with them.
@@herknorth8691 interesting
They aren't good. They suffer from the same QC and lack of support as the gun above. Just cheap rebraded bad quality tactical Turks to make a quick buck on aesthetics and cheapness. Don't be duped.
I shoot a VR80 in multigun competitions and it’s been flawless, but I drilled the gas ports out to .116 thou and changed the back end out for a collapsible AR stock, Taccom vr80 buffer and flat wire recoil spring, then polished the internals, so it’s far from stock and a lot of diy work, but still cheaper than true open shotguns
You got a lemon..
I have one with a little simple work runs like a champ .but I only use 2-3/4 shells .
What I did to mine was to clean all the grease out and re lubed with CLP. I also polished the chamber with a wooden dowel with steel 0000 wool with Fitz to mirror polish.,cycled it manually about a thousand times and left it with the bolt locked back for a week ,then the following weekend I went to wally world and got a case of cheap estate 1250 fps # 8 and went to my shooting spot and shot like a charm no jams spit them all out.
So I can't complain for the money I even shot 1oz slugs at 30 yards and was impressed with accuracy and also shot some 2-3/4 #5 using the full tube and pattern well for turkey. .
I also did alittle de buring with some emery cloth around the loading port on the receiver, it was a little sharp .
For 200 bucks it just fine for me and worth the money ,I don't think I would torture test with magum loads, I don't need mag loads anyways..
But I did out of the box have about every 3 round would stick a empty half way out.
But cleaning and lubeing and especially polishing the chamber made it function flawless..
Great for a truck gun but yes it's a cheap gun and don't know how long it is going to last but so far so good and I have over 600 rounds through it.
Another thing I do is to clean the gas system really good it gets pretty dirty after a 100 rounds .and make sure the barrel lock nut is tight too.
I wouldn't trust it for a battle gun running it hard and through that kind of test,,I would find a differnt gun , for somthing to take out to the range and target shoot or maybe shoot some clay bird it just fine.
These are hit and miss some guys get good ones and some are carp no matter what you do to it.,there are several good reviews on how good they run and as many on how bad they are. But remember your buy a cheap shotgun and it not going to run like a 1200 dollar Benelli
So if you have a little gunsmith knowledge and do some work on it it will run fine.
Here's the thing - I am poor, by most of your viewers standards I'm probably very poor. $175 USD for a shotgun would actually take me quite a bit of saving. That's why my cheapest gun is a CZ 455 synthetic with a decent 3-9 Leupold on it. There's a difference between being poor and making stupid purchasing decisions.
"If you buy cheap, you buy twice" is true most of the time.
hands down my favorite gun guy right here. LOL, I laughed so hard at this video. Then laughed all the way home with my A300. Love you man.
So basically the Citidel is as reliable as the Turkish lira.
Lmao
KEKW! Like how it is now with the conflict in Ukraine dropping turkey's economy? LMAO!🤣😂
And about as reliable as the Lebanese Lira and government.
Hi James. I would like to propose the following tactical shotguns for review in the under $1000 category.
1. Stoeger M3000 Freedom Series Defense Shotgun - MSRP $619
2. Mossberg 930 Combo Field/Security - MSRP $790
3. Mossberg 590S - MSRP $731 (and make sure to test the whole gambit from 1.75" to 3" shells)
4. Stoeger M3020 Defense Shotgun - MSRP $619 (it would be interesting to see a 20 gauge reviewed)
5. Mossberg International SA-20 Railed - Pistol Grip - MSRP $668 (another 20 gauge)
I love this series, and look forward to future reviews.
Can’t wait for the “ JUST AS GOOD!” crowd to try to compare this to the m4 or the 1301.
It's clearly just as good, I've had mine for 2 years, got abt 5 rnds through it. No problem 😊
Shitadel it is. Oddly enough my RIA X4 has never failed and I did do a torture test in buckshot on it (1 case)
There is a Clint Smith/Thunder Ranch video on TH-cam where he talks about home defense shotguns and running the gun you have. He says you just might be surprised what even a break action, single barrel can do then shows a simple method for getting a decent rate of fire with one. Being my first, two guns I got during my teenage years were singles - a .410 and later a 12 gauge - I have a a soft spot for single barrels as woods walking guns and so I own a few and decided to try his method. Now, I am certainly not at Clint Smith's experience level or even close but I practiced enough to do it smoothly and got to the point I was getting nearly the rate of fire that a newish shooter would likely get with a pump. My point is that with a buttcuff shell holder and a shotgun ammo belt (worn like a bandolier) I could maintain a faster, steadier rate of fire with a 1960s 20 gauge break action single barrel I got for $60 at a gun show than I could with the particular shotgun in this video.
Thanks for this. Just in time. I've been pondering getting one of these. Now I'll get a Maverick 88 instead and have a good shooter. Just subscribed too!
Somehow no problems so far with ours. 800+ shells and not a single issue. Maybe we got lucky or something. Taking it apart and cleaning it before ever shooting it is important. It had a some sticky oil and carboard dust gunking things up.
Try one of those Stoeger M3000 shotguns. They’re supposed to be pretty great.
I like mine and want to see how it does.
I can vouch, mine is a monster!!
Imma have to buy one with all these great comments.
@@philipmarcus97 I am not 100% certain it could get off 500 rounds in a row like the test requires (haven’t tried it) but I am 100% certain it can get off all the rounds in the tube and my shot card in a home defense situation 100% of the time. My Mossberg 500 got shifted to the back of the safe because of it,
I have a boss 25, its like $400, got about 600 rounds through it. Still hanging tough. But it can be finicky changing types of ammo. If you have the wrong piston in, it'll mess with it
I'd still be interested in seeing the Stoeger M3000 defense version try this test. It would be cool to see if it's up to the task.
That gun is really popular in 3 gun. I have one. It's fine. Ran plenty of slugs through it.
The "Semi Ottoman Empire" is just a nibble of the golden word play included in the commentary. Nice work from James, Ryan and co.
Yall should do one of these for the M&P 12.
Man I love this series! Always enjoy seeing the low end of the cost spectrum firearms being fired. Still sticking to what I trained and carried in the old career, the Rem 870 riot. Bedside companion!
Remington 870 and Mossberg 500 = 2 OG legends
This one made me really nervous someone in the crew was going to have an out of battery and get Kentucky Ballistics'd. And the shotgun can't demand high velocity ammo, and then breakdown when it gets good ammo.
There was clearly something wrong with that Remington 3" slug. They fired a 3" the previous round as well, and that Remington had 2 to 3 times the recoil, muzzle flash and recoil. Then, they take it into their... well, somebody's workshop, make fun of gunsmiths, and reveal a stunning lack of basic knowledge about gas op autoloaders.... Seriously, I don't know why I'm bothering to even respond-- this is clearly a BS brand-snob channel that I'm never returning to.
Not gonna lie though, I bought a Panzer Arms BP12 Gen 1. Initially I saw a lot of people stating their biggest problem was failure to feed/eject. However, almost every one of these reviewers I saw got the shotgun, took it out of the box, and tried firing birdshot through it. No cleaning, no lubing, fresh from box. Let me tell you, it came DIRTY! SO DIRTY! Immediately upon receiving the shotgun, I stripped and cleaned it, and has run 200+ rounds of birdshot through it and 100s of rounds of buckshot through it no problem. I have not used 3" shells yet, or slugs yet. I mean it was a sub $500 shotgun when I bought it, I also quite dislike the plastic housing and the "faux suppressor" (honestly this is probably to add more weight to the front end because it is HUGELY back heavy), but other than that, I have loved it... Only thing I wish were that 1919 shotgun magazines were less expensive. Would love to see you torture test this semi shotgun. The price is in the range of "good" pump shotguns.
Hop might get upset James is moving into his territory. Great review even if it was only 5 shells. .
Edited for Grammar
Hop
@@ChevTecGroup
Word, thanks bro
Team Maverick 88 baby. My Maverick was my second gun purchased forever ago. She is a true value workhorse.
I have the Warthog and have not had any issue with mine outside of the occasional FTE when using low power stuff (which is rare because I try to avoid using it). It currently has just over 5000 rounds of mixed ammo through it.
I routinely fire 1600fps buckshot through this gun. (The first 250 rounds were all 1600+)
Mine cycles just about everything down to about 1200fps (1 brand rated at 1150fps still works fine).
I will say that the internals of mine are different than the one you tested, I have seen at least 3 different versions of internals parts on these.
I should also note that I added a magazine extension tube and replaced follower & the stock spring with one from Wolf. It was having feed issues with the spring that came with the kit.
I guess I just got the good one?
Love mine no problems
Sure guy, sure 🙄
@@JohnDoe-zg6fn
I have well over 2000 rounds through my Boss Hog, I did the same mods as AMCITADEL did to his, it runs with no issue what so ever, you can also visit his channel where he demonstrates his gun before so simply trying to dismiss him.
@@Diemerstein Yeah, ok bud 👌🏽
Mine died after 50 rounds. It was destroyed. 2.75 shells only. Internals came apart in the receiver.
The Bosshog, the Cthulhu monster of buyer’s remorse.
Seeing this video makes me feel better after watching my Dickinson Marine Pump’s heat shield and rear sight blow off. I had only 100 rounds through it.
I have citadel warthog with the pistol grip and ghost ring sights, seems to be possibly the updated version of this. But as far as from my experience it's done alot better than that. Maybe you should give citadel one more chance and test out that one.
I love these burn downs. I personally bought a beretta 1301 in ODG on your recommendation. Love every inch of it.
The Turkish jokes are incredible this video! Istanbullshit needs to be on a t-shirt.
I needed this video to be released one year ago to stop me from wasting my money. It took me 20 rounds to find out what you did in the video.
Being that it had a totally different type of failure on each magazine worth of ammo, it would be good for training, haha. You have to rapidly diagnose the problem and fix it on the clock.
I have that same exact shotgun, and it did the same thing to me. I simply replaced overring and it’s ran fine since then, but I also shoot all high brass out of it.
So, will this be leading to a torture test on some of the mag fed shotguns from turkey. Maybe even the bullpup??
That's what I'm hoping for as well... James got me 2nd guessing my ATI Bulldog purchase.
Hope so, I was about *this* close to pulling the metaphorical trigger on one from Panzer Arms before finding Maverick 88 (with the 18.5 & 28 inch barrel!) for the same price.
Mag fed shotguns under $1000 are junk.
Picked up a Panzer Arms BP12 over the summer. Love the platform, FTF on new mag is the problem. Mag insertion/release was janky from the start. Now once a mag is done, when inserting new mag have to keep pressure on the charging handle and bang the hell out butt on a table to get it ready to load. Over 100 rds & still utter garbage. Selling & Mav 88 here I come. No more Turkish crap for me
@@mikegirard2920 My VR80 runs flawless on anything its fed
I have a Stoeger m2000. Made in Turkey (it did cost 3x more than James' test gun). 1100 rounds before the first malfunction. I replaced the extractor with a Benelli M2 extractor, and its back in business- no malfunctions. I'm not defending all Turkish shotguns. I am saying all Turkish shotguns are NOT equal. I will also add that 2 of my friends have purchased Stoeger Semis after having shot mine. Its that good. You can win with a Stoeger made in Turkey.
These guns need to be gone through and tuned before they can become reliable
I bought a Maverick 88 before I saw his burn down torture test. I'm so happy I have a Mossberg Maverick 88!!! The double ejector is slick like butter in the Maverick.
I've heard stoeger shotguns are reliable. I'd be interested to know if there's any truth in that.
I have heard the opposite that someone got a Stoeger and they spent almost as much as the gun cost trying to get it working.
So this may be anecdotal, but my stoegor m3500 (3 1/2 chambering) is one of not only my most favorite shotguns, but guns in general. I’ve never once had any failures to feed or function right out of the box, after a good initial cleaning of course. She’s got thousands of rounds ranging from steel shot to magnum turkey and slugs and ate them all happily in every environment.
They're supposed to be one of the most reliable of the Turkish built shotguns...but they're Benelli-owned, not the usual run of local gunsmithing. I hope the M3000 is the one James was hinting at though.
Stoeger is wholly owned by Benelli / Beretta
Had 3 of them on our trap team a few years ago (condor, and 2 condor grand champions). 2 lost firing pins mid season, one lost the forend retention system (shotgun falls apart), and one had the brazed steel strips between the top and bottom barrel break off and make cool little metal whips off the barrel.
The few guys I know that use the m3500 for duck and goose have had slightly better luck, but I suppose thats the territory with budget options.
The high velocity stuff makes the bolt outrun the magazine spring so it will fire and eject, but the bolt may pass by the next round without picking it up. That was the main issue with the Citadel Boss 25 I had... and the recoil sucked... and the Turkish factories cannot seem to figure out how to install the flip up sights at the factory. they are always on backward on the AR style guns.
Overall, the only off-brand semi I have tested that works is the Tristar brand. The Raptor I bought has chrome lined barrel, chamber, and chrome plated bolt. It is smooth, runs everything even my light reloads, my heavy reloads, slugs, and buckshot. I only ran 2 3/4" shells through it, but it has been great with all of those. And tri star are about $350-400
Wow, just wow. I checked several retailers and I find it for $299, they must be joking.
Rural king sells them for $179 on sale or $199 standard
Absolutely love my citadel warthog. After some filing here and there on the load ramps it absolutely never gets jammed or has a misfire with high velocity rounds 1300 fps or better. Very low recoil for a shotgun
I thought about picking up this shotgun a couple of months ago when my LGS had a few in stock. Good thing I decide to save the money and stuck with my old Mav 88 as my HD gun.
Please keep these coming! I love inexpensive firearms but I hate cheap. I was looking at one of these for a boat gun. I'll stick to my tried and true Mossberg.
Glad I got a Remington 870 for $275 before the Ped O Joe administration . That baby is flawless and the wood furniture is classy af
I'll add to the Turkish shotgun discontent here. I took a chance on an Akkar 612 (previously "CZ" 612) Churchill 12 gauge pump. 18.5" model. I bought it because I really liked the ergonomics of the shotgun and it was extremely lightweight. Saw some positive reviews and thought "why not, for $199"
Got it out to the range, and it wouldn't run more than 2 or 3 rounds through it without a malfunction. The shell would hit the side of the barrel on the way in and jam up. I thought "okay, well let's run about 200 rounds through it to see if it works itself out." 225 rounds later of mixed bird shot and buckshot..still the same thing. Turkish shotguns have gotten $199 + tax from me, and that's all they'll ever get. I'll stick to my Mossy 500 & 590's. I'm all good on anything Turkish shotgun from now on.