Remember what Sega said Hyper Sonic is not cannon it's just a bonus thing when you merge sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles but it did give so much content way after it was seen.
They said this, and then back tracked on it. Hyper is canon now. If that word even means anything with this series anymore when they come out saying “Everything is canon”.
@@user-TheChaoticShadowsOfEvil I don't trust Sega when they say something is cannon, they forget things like the moon, they say one thing then change it, like why the moon is fixed, look at Blaze, people till this day fight on how she works with 06, even when the comic says how it works, but they don't explain how Sonic and Blaze don't each other, yet Blaze knows Sonic in one scene
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Fun fact: each of the Titans in Frontiers are probably powerful enough to obliterate Perfect Chaos or even Metal Overlord, if we go by that base Sonic in generations could beat Perfect Chaos, and he needed to go Super to fight the Titans in Frontiers
Well they were also being juiced up by the chaos emeralds, so we don’t know how powerful, they are without it. Granted those characters were using the emeralds too (metal overlord aside) so I guess it’s fair.
@SaiSai-pb4sw Technically, he also scanned Knuckles and Tails. With team Sonic his line was “All life form data, successfully copied. Whereas with Team Dark it was “Ultimate life form data, has been copied”.
I don’t mind power creep. In my opinion we don’t get enough Sonic forms. Although I do believe really strong forms should only be when they really need it. Super used to be one of the coolest transformations and now people are starting to prefer alternatives due to how long it has stayed around, but personally I think it is a good fall back form in case they can’t use a stronger one.
Frontiers, with its semi-regular Super Sonic fights, did feel like the right place to bring back Hyper Sonic for a climactic final showdown with The End. But Iizuka's stubbornness aside, even though the Master Emerald was mentioned and shown in flashbacks it still wasn't physically present on the Starfall Islands. I think for the sake of lore, if HS comes back there should be a return to Angel Island to instigate it.
@meachy1 I'm actually currently researching how to get any form of game Sonic to complex multi and my best argument for it is Smash being canon to Sonic and scaling him to Joker, but I only have 1 peice of evidence for it being canon so I can't use it.
@@arichenry4573Is it how Kirby fights master hand in amazing mirror? Because that was canon but smash bros canonically is just a child playing with his toys with master and crazy hand being his two hands. Though Kirby fighting master hand is more of a scaling for him to be able to ascend his fictional reality like SpongeBob, Bugs bunny, or Popeye. Sonic just doesn’t have the master hand scaling for him though.
@kirbystar7474 Actually, I was referring to the Twitter takeovers also clearly not every character is a toy. Considering pit makes a joke about it in uprising
I do think that they handled Cyber Super Sonic really well in the Update, and made it a one and done thing. However, I do also think that this form can see a return in the future, if Eggman uses some of the ancients technology in his future machines. Since it has been FOREVER since Eggman last built a machine to rival Super Sonic, and I am down to see it now!
Honestly I think an easy way to bring back hyper sonic without making super sonic irrelevant would be to make achieving a hyper form very roundabout and difficult, making super sonic good for most situations, and have hyper sonic for those situations where a super form just won’t be enough, they could just put some lore about how the process of turning the chaos emeralds into the super emeralds is very difficult and requires a ton of power, they could also make that tie in to the fact that the special stages aren’t canon and that the emeralds (or whatever you are collecting in whatever game) are obtained through other means. It would be perfect!
I could see Hyper being used to take on hidden uber bosses, something for completionists and people who like to devote a lot of time to playing the game.
Its probably more like Super Kaioken (or if you wanna get more specific, SSB Berserk/SSG Dark Ki Unleashed) Where its less a new form of Sonic and more just stacking something onto Super Sonic.
So, something I want to comment on-- Cyberspace and the attendant cyber energy is pretty much constantly marked by the colors red and cyan, almost always in tandem. The cyber-corruption waves that wash over Sonic alternate between red and cyan. The portals light up red when active and cyan when mastered. The experience chips are cyan. The seeds that the Hermit uses to upgrade you are red for power, cyan for defense. And Sage changes from red when acting as a logical entity to cyan when experiencing emotion and illogical responses. When Sonic powers up, he seems to push a red energy OUT of his body and his formerly red eyes are now cyan. That suggests that whatever he's doing is being fueled by the energy of cyberspace. Possibly no longer corrupt-- it may be that what Tails, Amy, and Knuckles do to bring Sonic back will fix the corruption, but leave the cyberspace connection. Which will then most likely be a one-and-done thing like most other games, as leaving the Starfall Islands will mean no more Cyberspace connection. But that's just a theory... a Penguin Theory.
I did point out the red and blue colour scheme in the vid 😁 Your theory on his friends helping him get this harmonic boost makes sense though. Mad to think the vanilla story is actually being rewritten.
I think they are hiding something about the unused Sonic X goldy looking form, maybe thats the supposed Modern Hyper Sonic because Takashi Iizuka could hiding something about it. For future concept because thats the only form they didnt mention anything about just like how they ignore about hyper existence, because as you know Sonic forces mobile game has every sonic form except hyper sonic so maybe they are planning to make it returns but in a perfect game, i wont be surprised if that game is Sonic adventure 3 😂
To be honest I've honestly felt it was about time something like this happened. Shadow and Silver already have their own ways of surpassing their super forms theoretically (Shadow by combining it with his Chaos Boost technique and Silver combining it with his ESP sate). So yeah, this was long over due.
@@AceCardGaming fair enough, I assumed they weren't due to a different Sonic video I watched a few days ago saying they weren't. Though my point still stands.
Only 3 days to go. I haven't commented in a while but my love for this character brought me back here. I hope this DLC will complete the story to this game as I feel like it'll make this one of the best Sonic games in the series. This sort of feels like another Sonic 3&K in a way to me. I wonder if it will compare to that classic
When it comes to power creep in stories it's not neccessarily that the character gains a new ability/form that is stronger than another, thus invalidating the old forms, but rather the stakes that have been raised by such a thing existing. Some people have been suggesting that Hyper Sonic come back but not be possible to access on a regular basis, like needing the Super Emeralds specifically and that making it not something Sonic can do every game, so he only uses them when the situation is dire enough to require such mesures. This suggestion however still feeds into the major issue of power creep, as if there is a bigger and greater foe that needs Hyper Sonic to beat then all of Super Sonic's past and future victories would pale in comparison to the battles where Hyper Sonic is required, so any game that happens after the fact feeling like the stakes where much lower due to Hyper Sonic's lack of inclusion. I understand the idea that powering up to a next level is "really cool" but to me it's not really interesting to have Hyper Sonic because it's more or less "He's stronger because he is" Super Sonic is already stated to be impervious to damage, so to me I see Hyper Sonic as not much more than a new coat of paint on Super Sonic that would take credit away from some of the most iconic moments in the series that where achieved by Super Sonic. I'm by no means a hater of Hyper Sonic, I've been a huge fan of many fanworks that have used Hyper Sonic and I didn't like them any less for including the form, but power creep is a real concern and I think the desire to not have Hyper Sonic return/remove him from the cannon is entirely valid. As a side note I do think Hyper Sonic also takes away opportunities for more interesting solutions that I would have found a lot more interesting. For example, Sonic needing to team up with Shadow to fight the biolizard or Shadow and Silver to fight Solaris in 06 (which Flynn stated was the most powerful enemy they've fought) without the idea of a Hyper Sonic or a Super Sonic 2, we'd have more moments where Sonic has to team up with his allies to account for the strength he needs to fight stronger enemies, which I would like to see more often. Anyway that's my rant, thanks to all who read it, have a good day all.
The new Super Sonic form definitely looks pretty cool. I definitely really like the blue eyes for the new Super Sonic form. I’m definitely excited how they are going to use this form In update 3. Update 3 is literally right around the corner because Update 3 is coming in a few weeks. I definitely cannot wait to play as the New Playable characters in update 3. I’m just curious are they going to change the ending In update 3? They probably are going to change ending but I probably not. I’m definitely excited to see the new Super Sonic form and the Playable Characters and the New story and challenges. Great video Ace card Gaming)
YES!!! I agree 1000% percent with every point you made in this video and have been making these same arguments to everyone. I subscribed just because I knew this video was coming and because I knew we would be in agreement about Frontiers. All aboard the Hype(R) train!
I only hope this is a one off form, I don't want this to "replace" Hyper, especially considering there have been talks via Kishimoto on Twitter (refuse to call it by its dumb replacement name) about making a more narrative satisfying alternate to having Hyper. I don't mind if this is counted as like a "Mastered Super Saiyan" equivalent, but it absolutely should NOT be the "Super Saiyan 2" equivalent, that comparison will ALWAYS belong to Hyper in my eyes. The way I see the other forms for Sonic shouldn't be taken as forms that are stronger than Super, to me those other forms should AT BEST only count as different utilizations of Sonic's abilities he gained in the games those forms are presented. Basically to me (in terms of game mechanic stats): - Super: Elevation of base form (x2 even spread multiplier) - Hyper: Elevation of Super form (x3/x4 even spread multiplier) &/or used as a "last resort" method (something for instances like Solaris) - Others: Niche utilizations of abilities (min-maxing of certain moves & stats) How I want this new "Super Cyber Sonic" to work/be explained: Only him utilizing the power of Cyber Space that held The End at bay in another dimension in conjunction with his Super form and be exclusive to Frontiers.
I can say that this new “Cyber Sonic” form is most likely going to be a one-and-done deal, for one reason: It’s going to be a double-edged sword for Sonic. It’ll give him more power, but using it could end up being fatal to himself. Plus, it’s not really tied to Super Sonic at all.
@@SonicAndre2 With how much talk there has been about a possible Hyper return or replacement, I'm still worried. Feels like we're starting to navigate a minefield.
@@toonman5099 I’m not really worried, because, as much as I was trying to avoid it, I couldn’t help but peek at the script of the Final Horizon’s story.
@@SonicAndre2 Gotcha, most of this is me not getting a peek at the leaked script mostly because there's still a chance the script could change either due to said leak or just because of the fact it could have been an earlier version, and I don't want to be spoiled if it IS the final script.
I also think that Sonic Team has done a good job at managing Sonic's transformations by just allowing them to happen once (Darkspine, Excalibur or Werehog) However, when this trailer dropped, the community overall immediately thought that this was the next step for Super Sonic calling it Super Sonic 2, and I was one of the few ones who didn't think this was the case. In my opinion, what we see in the trailer is a boosted Super Sonic. And you might ask, "boosted with what?", and I think the answer is pretty obvious since the entire journey of Sonic through the Starfall Islands has been hinting at it, and of course I'm talking about the "Cyber Corruption" or whatever you want to call it. Sonic absorbed enough of that energy and now he is combining it with his Super transformation. I don't want to be that guy who doesn't let others speculate about a future more powerful transformation, but as a massive Dragon Ball fan, I think that it's better for Sonic and for storylines in general to stick to the Super transformation or/and have one and done transformations. As you can see, Goku and Vegeta are extremely powerful and Super Saiyan is basically useless at this point. Even Super Saiyan God is useless. I would hate for that to happen with Super Sonic. The need to have more powerful enemies in each arc or videogame is an unsustainable problem and I feel that Sonic Team knows that and that's why this "Super Sonic 2" is only happening in Frontiers, just like Darkspine in Secret Rings or the Werehog in Unleashed.
I also didn't call him Super Sonic 2 when he appeared. But I don't think it's a power boost, because his skill blue has changed to yellow, and that should mean that his eyes should also be yellow, plus those blue eyes aren't the same shade as the power boost. By the way, this reminded me of a moment from Sonic RPG episode 9, where Super Sonic's eyes also changed from red to cyan before becoming Hypep Sonic.
Excellent video as always! I don't understand wanting to avoid comparisons to DB, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and if it is done right what's the problem? So yeah, bring back Hyper Sonic!
As much as i would like hyper sonic its way too late for that because the super emeralds have nothing to do in this game if he went hyper it would just rise more eyebrows. Makes sense its new seeong how and where sonic gets this power from
The Master Emerald seems to have once resides on the starfall Islands. Based on what the Ancients themselves have said. There are ways to tie that together. 🙂
I’m confident that we will never see this form again. Sonic has had a TONE of extra 1 and done forms. Dark sonic, dark spine sonic, hyper sonic, Excalibur Sonic, unleashed Sonic. The franchise knows all about diminishing returns and the cyber energy is limited to the Starfall islands so I don’t think we need to worry about the Super Form losing its lustre and going the same way a super forms in DBZ.
I know we are ripping off DBZ and shonen anime in general at this point but I don’t care. New transformations are awesome and have loads of story potential. Shadow taps in between positive and negative energy becoming a divine purple being. Knuckles gets empowered by the Master Emerald with the help of Tikal’s spirit. Silver unlocks a new power up from the time stones. And Metal Sonic has so many monstrous forms to transform into. Edit: I may have started a war.
Super Sonic and the chaos emeralds are the only things that can be deemed as ripoffs. Aside from that Sonic doesn't really have any forms that are similar to dragon Ball
@@ashuraomega1000 The seven miracle gems he uses to achieve it. Silver takes huge inspiration from Future Trunks. Special stages in S3&K were inspired directly by King Kai’s planet (straight from the devs mouths), Sonic, like Goku befriends most of the enemies he can see good in, Shadow at his worst is similar to early Vegeta. These are just off the top of my head. There are loads of articles and videos on this topic.
I think we are getting some variation of the hyper form. Look at the flashes of lightning around Super Sonic. Its almost reminiscent of his hyper form color palette.
ITS CYBER SONIC NOT SUPER 2 THIS IS WHAT IS KNOWN IN LEAK SCRIPTS AS PARTIAL CYBER FORM WHERE HES NOT FULLY TRANSFORMED YES THERE ARE 2 CYBER FORMS BUT I WONT DIVE INTO SPOILERS BUT THE INFORMATION IS EASY TO FIND SO DONT WORRY
@@nasthesamurai8988 bro made 3 replys to one comment 💀💀💀💀 Also, are you fr telling me to get a life when you waited until the video started it just to comment first? And did bro ACTUALLY like his own comment???
I love the power ups in the Sonic franchise. Super Sonic has been played out for a while. It's just very irritating to not have Hyper Sonic for NO reason....every game has a an epilepsy warning. It's like the producers just don't care about Hyper Sonic's fame. They could've definitely used Hyper for this but I like the new form tho.
I’ve actually given this a lot of thought. How much could the Sonic series really do before the stakes can’t be raised any higher? Solaris feels like it’s almost peak. I think saving hyper before a hard reboot would be an excellent idea. Maybe the only way to save the multiverse is for history to repeat itself? Just not quite in the same way.
You're going to love this, trust me. What you see now is my normal state. This is a Super Saiyan... and this.. is known as a Super Saiyan that ascended past a Super Saiyan or you could call this a Super Saiyan 2
I don't understand the push back to the comparisons to anime and Dragon Ball. Sonic was created by japanese people, the games are made by japanese devs in Japan, let Sonic exercise his anime influence. So many things in Sonic are directly inspired by DB it is comical to try to bury everything now: the earliest sketches of Super Sonic is literally Sonic with Super Saiyan hair; S3 Special Stages are inspired by King Kai's planet; Silver is based on Future Trunks.
Sonic: This is my base form, and this is a Sonic that has realized the legend, also known as [Super Sonic], Now this is a Sonic that has ascended past a Super Sonic, or known as Super Sonic 2, and this is to go...even further beyond. *Emerald Sounds Rage*
I have an idea. Sonic using the cyber energy combined with the chaos emeralds could cause the super emeralds to return. We know the super emeralds currently reside in another dimension…If chaos emeralds are being combined with another power from another dimension (cyber)…this is an opportunity.
Yes! That's the same idea I had, well... almost. I thought to skip the super emeralds and have cyber energy + chaos emeralds = Hyper Sonic. Having cyber energy + chaos energy be equal to that of the super emeralds, but same idea basically.
@@HyperManSP I’m on board with the cyber power giving super sonic a massive boost, but I wouldn’t say it’s on par with hyper. I could be dead wrong on this, but I have always viewed one super emerald being equivalent to all 7. Meaning 7 super emeralds = Super Sonic multiplied by 7. Unfathomable power. I feel like this form that they’re introducing should be the prelude to Hyper Sonic. Sonic Adventure 3, LET’S GO!
@@HyperManSP Maybe the cyber energy is more powerful than I’m thinking and it really does bring about the hyper form! Another thing to consider, and I’m really reaching here… but Sonic Team has made a pretty big deal over the cyan colored emerald. It’s the 7th one, the only one that was undiscovered on South Island. It wasn’t until Westside island it was found. Chaos 0 also happens to be the same color. Sonic’s eyes turn cyan with this new super form. Again, idk if I’m reaching really hard, but cyan seems to be a key color here. What if the super emeralds and the cyber energy are actually linked, and Sonic’s using ONE super emerald?
@@BoyleVoices I imagine cyber energy to be "order", Sonic obtains "order" and brings order to the "chaos" of the emeralds, basically attaining power similar to that of their master emerald and unlocking Hyper. What if the super emeralds were only one way to attain the powers necessary for Hyper? But really all the Hyper form requires is the power of the master emerald, you attain that power through various means though. Interesting... Imagine Sonic does Chaos's stage 1 - 6 forms with the super emeralds, culminating in a Sonic Perfect with 7 super emeralds, a.k.a. Hyper Sonic.
Hyper Sonic did not exist anywhere before Super Saiyan. Neither did Super Sonic. Super Sonic was inspired by Super Saiyan. The Super Saiyan debuted in 1991.
Hyper Sonic is explicitly a "superior" version of Super Sonic though. Same with the Super Emeralds to the Chaos Emeralds. Whereas all the other forms are either equivalent to (Darkspine Sonic, Excalibur Sonic, and Burning Blaze) or covering a different niche than Super Sonic (Werehog). This "Super Sonic 2" form seems to be more of an addition or supplement to Super Sonic especially so when Cyberspace is essentially a Chaos Emerald powered UNIVERSE. Or an alteration of the Super Form if you will. The issue with power creep is that it requires greater obstacles to warrant suspense, drama, and continued investment eventually resulting in a lack and net loss of interest since there's no real stopgap to warrant that or guarantee sincerity when it comes to power. I like the other forms that Sonic has because they're DIFFERENT FROM and not explicitly overall "greater" than Super Sonic like Hyper Sonic is. Whereas Dragon Ball has Super Saiyan God and Blue effectively trumped by Ultra Instinct and even THAT trumped by True Ultra Instinct. Which is kind of bad since the forms are a MAJOR focus of the series. Yeah, there's Zeno, but he's so far removed, out of focus, and offhand with everything that he barely counts as a stopgap nor really treated like one. He's also NOT an enemy or fighter, so.
here's the real truth about Hyper. We have Super Sonic, sure a Hyper Sonic would be cool- but in the end that's all it would be. a novelty to have but ultimately pointless in the story itself. sure you WANT Hyper Sonic, but the story doesn't need it. especially considering the power that Super Sonic has already being enough. Sega is forced to dodge and weave any questions and request for Hyper because they know of the problem it would cause. Not only is the Hyper Form tedious to get, with all the special stages to unlock their power, but it makes Super Sonic look Super Lame in comparison. think of the original Super Saiyan transformation, cool and epic. But then the androids and Cell arcs came along right after and made the form look like a bitch. Then you had SSJ2 appear and then mean NOTHING when the Buu Saga came along. then you had SSJ3- then SSJ4. SSG. SSGSS. UI Omen, MUI, True UI if they brought back Hyper, Super would seem useless in comparison. People would want and expect Hyper to appear more and more, to the point they get bored of Hyper and say- "New Form?" and we go through the cycle again and again, the storybook games saved this by NOT having the forms reappear. Hyper, while cool, doesn't matter no fits within the story of Frontiers or any other Sonic Game. Not even S3&K to and extent! We have out Super Hedgehog already, we don't need and shouldn't have Hyper Hedgehog back- (especially considering Super Sonic and the Emeralds being infinite, the Hyper Form's power would canonically one shot bosses.) I get people like rainbow Super Sonic, but the intention was a new powerup to halt gameplay in S3&K and nothing more.
Yeah, super Sonic clearly isn’t enough here, necessitating this new form. So not really sure what your point is. They could have just used Hyper instead.
@@AceCardGaming it's inconsistent for Super not to be enough when Ian Flynn confirms The End is planetary while Solaris was going to destroy the sonic multiverse itself. Hyper couldn't be used as the way to power up the Chaos Emeralds into Super Emeralds would be tedious, it's canon to the lore of S.Emeralds you need the M.E with you and all stages completed to unlock Hyper.
@@thehedgebot99mph90 Yeah, except the Master emerald is portable and at once stage was on the StarFall Islands. There where ways to do it if they wanted to. I’m no writer, but it’s certainly not as impossible as you’re making out.
It’s funny because back when frontiers showed off super sonic, people were saying that sonic must get a new form to defeat the titans because super sonic wasn’t strong enough. Not realising that if it wasn’t a temporary form then it would completely Eclipse super sonic and make him Irrelevant, just like with ssj being overshadowed by ssb and sega knew this which is why all of the forms from the spin-off games were one-offs so super sonic would stay relevant to the story and not be replaced as the ultimate form of sonic, only to be used for nostalgia like “hey its that one super form that you used to like, doesn’t it suck, look how weak and useless it is now”. Hypersonic didn’t have this problem because it needs the master emerald in order to be activated so it could only be used when necessary, it’s stronger than super sonic but isn’t reliable enough to be used all the time because of its requirements. It’s not a ascended form that’s easy to use and is more effective than the previous one due to easier requirements to activate it. I’m hoping that super sonic 2 or cyber sonic is a one-off transformation and that super sonic stays as the strongest or at least super sonic 2 should be more difficult to consistently use often so it kinda becomes a last resort time of form only being used when absolutely necessary.
See for those wondering why hyper sonic isnt happening is because they said themselves their not allowed to use hyper sonic anymore. It was in a nutshell retconned.
@@AceCardGaming i said in a nutshell. Because their not allowed to use it. Never said it wasnt cannon just that it was mini retconned and thats why we’ll NEVER see it again
@@BahamutsThrone Retconned, non canon, tomAto Tomato. And the whole video was discussing the REASONS they’re not allowed to use Hyper forms anymore and debating the merits of those reasons. So again. Not really sure what point you were trying to make.
But this form will only be exclusive to Frontiers probably, he didn't, as many say, "went beyond the super form", he just used the power of corruption in it
I said this will likely just be for one game like all the others in the video. You can interpret how he powers up any way you like, but he factually pushed beyond the basic Super Sonic. Not sure what point you’re trying to make.
at least personally, it probably being linked to cyberspace, I assume it'll probably be a one use only super form similarly to dark spine sonic and excaliber sonic, with the confusion regarding it just being supersonic 2 just comes from a lackluster design that isn't different enough from base supersonic
As much as I like hyper Sonic and the fans interpretation throughout the years, I would like it if, this form were to stay, instead of being a one-off story form, like the Werehog and Excalibur. My only thing is, that they explain it well and it makes sense in the story, I always imagined Sonic going beyond his limits in Super and attaining a new Super 2. I don't think this is to replace hyper, they can always reintroduce that form in another story, this'll be a new add-on for Sonic's forms. As for the DBZ comparisons, that's always been around lol, but I never really called them rip-offs, especially not Sliver, I put him in the category of *Inspired* _by,_ rather than copy cat. And as far as powerscaling goes, nothing is completely wrong with it, so long as it makes sense, I've seen fans do their own powerscaling before and a lot of it is even, but people argue bs regardless. So if Sonic Team wanted to join in, it wouldn't be a bad thing, just keep 3 forns, Super Sonic, Super Sonic 2 and Hyper. It's not like they'll add any of his Archie forms like Ultra Sonic nor Fleetway.
A "new" form that looks exactly like SSJ2 only serves to invalidate every excuse they've made to avoid Hyper Sonic. Dragon Ball never had a form that pulsed through all the colors, making it unique to Sonic. As for seizures, that could be solved by having Sonic fade to a white glow between each color before fading to the next.
hyper sonic is just simply too broken to return for main series. i think we should look at it as a bonus for fans to do in their own works just like its a bonus is sonic 3. its almost like a reward for getting 2 games at the same time tbh. that being said i herd that somewhere in sonic lore super emeralds are as strong as 7 chaos emeralds so hyper sonic would be more accurate to say as super sonic 7 instead of super sonic 2. also i actually like when sonic series steals something from dragon ball because i find it funny and not annoying for some reason.
we need hyper but it being in frontiers makes no sense. solaris was stronger then the end and all it took was super sonic so him needing hyper doesn't make sense
the end is literally the strongest sonic villain (yes stronger than solaris, time eater, erazor djinn, egg salamander literally everyone) so i don't think we won't see this form for a while so hopefully power creep won't happen
Honestly the sonic and dbz comparisons makes me cringe seriously can sonic do something cool without being compared to dragonball is that too much to ask 😑
They can make you cringe, that’s fine. But they’re still valid. Sonic has done plenty of cool things that have nothing to do with Dragon Ball. It just so happens that there are also many inspirations from it. It is what it is.
I don't get this whole "power creep" thing that people are trying to argue about. Sonic has never had power scaling. They don't want the hyper form to come back because they don't want to have any more similarities with dragon Ball. If Sega was really concerned about how powerful these game exclusive forms are then Sonic would only have the super form and we wouldn't get any other game exclusive transformations. The franchise isn't going to suffer from power creep.
@@AceCardGaminghow do you know that? We don't even know anything about the form. He's most likely using the cyberspace energy to upgrade himself. It's just super Sonic but with blue eyes
I don't get the hype of Hyper Sonic, I don't find any compelling reason for his existence beyond fan-service nostalgia. From a conceptual and narrative standpoint, Hyper Sonic is really weak, lame and redundant. -Like what is it exactly? Super Sonic again but more super-ier??? -What are the super emeralds exactly? Chaos emeralds but more 'unlimited-ier" power? -How would one obtain the form? Same exact thing as Super Sonic? Maybe insert trials? Ehh... -What would this add to Sonic's character? This is a big thing of why people have a problem with the amount of transformations DBZ and super has, Transformations used to MEAN something. -Even from a gameplay standpoint I don't see the point, that screen nuke is cool and all but what's REALLY stopping the Super form from having this too? It pretty much serves the purpose of super sonic anyways. I don't see what Hyper would add anything meaningful besides brainless power level wanking. I find Dark Sonic to be WAY better in pretty much every regard because it's actually DISTINCT.
@@yungmuney5903 So according to you, Super Sonic 2 is ok, because it’s “Just a little add-on for Super Sonic”, but Hyper Sonic is NOT ok, because it’s “Just a little add-on for Super Sonic.” Yet I’m the one getting responses beginning with “yyyyeeeaaahhhh” like I’M the idiot… If you can’t read and understand your own points? Don’t expect others to.
Hyper Sonic would have been cool, and they could have easily fixed the flashing, if they made the energy change colour, fading one colour to the next
Exactly. They could even make it fade to a white glow between each color too
Remember what Sega said Hyper Sonic is not cannon it's just a bonus thing when you merge sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles but it did give so much content way after it was seen.
They said this, and then back tracked on it. Hyper is canon now. If that word even means anything with this series anymore when they come out saying “Everything is canon”.
@@user-TheChaoticShadowsOfEvil I don't trust Sega when they say something is cannon, they forget things like the moon, they say one thing then change it, like why the moon is fixed, look at Blaze, people till this day fight on how she works with 06, even when the comic says how it works, but they don't explain how Sonic and Blaze don't each other, yet Blaze knows Sonic in one scene
@@blazeneko3384sonic rush happens after 06
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I didn't know you had your own server so I just joined lol
I love your videos and super sonic 2 will go beyond in sonic frontiers update 3 acecardgaming!
Welcome welcome! It’s surprisingly sane in there for the time being. 😅
Made me laugh 😂 but thank you for the correction ☺️
Fun fact: each of the Titans in Frontiers are probably powerful enough to obliterate Perfect Chaos or even Metal Overlord, if we go by that base Sonic in generations could beat Perfect Chaos, and he needed to go Super to fight the Titans in Frontiers
Well they were also being juiced up by the chaos emeralds, so we don’t know how powerful, they are without it. Granted those characters were using the emeralds too (metal overlord aside) so I guess it’s fair.
@@P0tatoz9Metal Overlord used both Sonic and Shadow's life data so basically he's equal to base Shadic(non-canon fusion of Sonic and Shadow).
@@GojokeSatoru didn’t he use more than just sonic and shadows data? I could be remembering wrong.
@@P0tatoz9 Well, I'm guessing just Sonic and Shadow just because he only appeared in their part of the story and not others.
@SaiSai-pb4sw Technically, he also scanned Knuckles and Tails. With team Sonic his line was “All life form data, successfully copied. Whereas with Team Dark it was “Ultimate life form data, has been copied”.
I don’t mind power creep. In my opinion we don’t get enough Sonic forms. Although I do believe really strong forms should only be when they really need it. Super used to be one of the coolest transformations and now people are starting to prefer alternatives due to how long it has stayed around, but personally I think it is a good fall back form in case they can’t use a stronger one.
hyper forms are something ive always had a fascination with ever since nazo unleashed, i do enjoy a bit of anime flair in my sonic
Frontiers, with its semi-regular Super Sonic fights, did feel like the right place to bring back Hyper Sonic for a climactic final showdown with The End. But Iizuka's stubbornness aside, even though the Master Emerald was mentioned and shown in flashbacks it still wasn't physically present on the Starfall Islands. I think for the sake of lore, if HS comes back there should be a return to Angel Island to instigate it.
If this will be one of his permanent forms, i think it should be a last resort for when the enemy is higher than multiversal+ threats
I'm pretty sure Super Sonic has a few arguments for complex multi actually.
@arichenry4573 Oh, because his super form is easily 5D. Still though, he isn't able to destory an infinite amount of 4D Space time continumms.
@meachy1 I'm actually currently researching how to get any form of game Sonic to complex multi and my best argument for it is Smash being canon to Sonic and scaling him to Joker, but I only have 1 peice of evidence for it being canon so I can't use it.
@@arichenry4573Is it how Kirby fights master hand in amazing mirror? Because that was canon but smash bros canonically is just a child playing with his toys with master and crazy hand being his two hands. Though Kirby fighting master hand is more of a scaling for him to be able to ascend his fictional reality like SpongeBob, Bugs bunny, or Popeye. Sonic just doesn’t have the master hand scaling for him though.
@kirbystar7474 Actually, I was referring to the Twitter takeovers also clearly not every character is a toy. Considering pit makes a joke about it in uprising
I do think that they handled Cyber Super Sonic really well in the Update, and made it a one and done thing. However, I do also think that this form can see a return in the future, if Eggman uses some of the ancients technology in his future machines. Since it has been FOREVER since Eggman last built a machine to rival Super Sonic, and I am down to see it now!
Honestly I think an easy way to bring back hyper sonic without making super sonic irrelevant would be to make achieving a hyper form very roundabout and difficult, making super sonic good for most situations, and have hyper sonic for those situations where a super form just won’t be enough, they could just put some lore about how the process of turning the chaos emeralds into the super emeralds is very difficult and requires a ton of power, they could also make that tie in to the fact that the special stages aren’t canon and that the emeralds (or whatever you are collecting in whatever game) are obtained through other means. It would be perfect!
This!*
I could see Hyper being used to take on hidden uber bosses, something for completionists and people who like to devote a lot of time to playing the game.
I like this combination of the game-specific power and super. I think it fits better than hyper here.
Its probably more like Super Kaioken (or if you wanna get more specific, SSB Berserk/SSG Dark Ki Unleashed) Where its less a new form of Sonic and more just stacking something onto Super Sonic.
I’d consider it as a new form since it changes his appearance
I honestly like forms in sonic tbh I know power scaling would be so annoying but seeing sonic characters get stronger is just so cool
So, something I want to comment on-- Cyberspace and the attendant cyber energy is pretty much constantly marked by the colors red and cyan, almost always in tandem. The cyber-corruption waves that wash over Sonic alternate between red and cyan. The portals light up red when active and cyan when mastered. The experience chips are cyan. The seeds that the Hermit uses to upgrade you are red for power, cyan for defense. And Sage changes from red when acting as a logical entity to cyan when experiencing emotion and illogical responses. When Sonic powers up, he seems to push a red energy OUT of his body and his formerly red eyes are now cyan. That suggests that whatever he's doing is being fueled by the energy of cyberspace. Possibly no longer corrupt-- it may be that what Tails, Amy, and Knuckles do to bring Sonic back will fix the corruption, but leave the cyberspace connection. Which will then most likely be a one-and-done thing like most other games, as leaving the Starfall Islands will mean no more Cyberspace connection. But that's just a theory... a Penguin Theory.
I did point out the red and blue colour scheme in the vid 😁 Your theory on his friends helping him get this harmonic boost makes sense though. Mad to think the vanilla story is actually being rewritten.
This final DLC pack feels like we're seeing a director's cut. And we're all for it. 😃
I think they are hiding something about the unused Sonic X goldy looking form, maybe thats the supposed Modern Hyper Sonic because Takashi Iizuka could hiding something about it. For future concept because thats the only form they didnt mention anything about just like how they ignore about hyper existence, because as you know Sonic forces mobile game has every sonic form except hyper sonic so maybe they are planning to make it returns but in a perfect game, i wont be surprised if that game is Sonic adventure 3 😂
To be honest I've honestly felt it was about time something like this happened. Shadow and Silver already have their own ways of surpassing their super forms theoretically (Shadow by combining it with his Chaos Boost technique and Silver combining it with his ESP sate). So yeah, this was long over due.
Well, Hyper Sonic…
@@nithinshakthithiruppathi4028 yeah but that's not cannon.
It is canon. As are the Super Emeralds. Iizuka confirmed this but was adamant they won’t return.
@@AceCardGaming fair enough, I assumed they weren't due to a different Sonic video I watched a few days ago saying they weren't. Though my point still stands.
@@ultrashadow9551sorry to be a nerd but it's VERY cannon
Only 3 days to go. I haven't commented in a while but my love for this character brought me back here. I hope this DLC will complete the story to this game as I feel like it'll make this one of the best Sonic games in the series. This sort of feels like another Sonic 3&K in a way to me. I wonder if it will compare to that classic
LETS GOOOOOO! NEW PEAK VIDEO HAS ARRIVED! 😁
Why thank you! 😁
@@AceCardGaming always buddy 😁
Sonic Team: We're not going to bring back Hyper Sonic, but we're bringing in Super Sonic 2 because reasons.
When it comes to power creep in stories it's not neccessarily that the character gains a new ability/form that is stronger than another, thus invalidating the old forms, but rather the stakes that have been raised by such a thing existing. Some people have been suggesting that Hyper Sonic come back but not be possible to access on a regular basis, like needing the Super Emeralds specifically and that making it not something Sonic can do every game, so he only uses them when the situation is dire enough to require such mesures. This suggestion however still feeds into the major issue of power creep, as if there is a bigger and greater foe that needs Hyper Sonic to beat then all of Super Sonic's past and future victories would pale in comparison to the battles where Hyper Sonic is required, so any game that happens after the fact feeling like the stakes where much lower due to Hyper Sonic's lack of inclusion. I understand the idea that powering up to a next level is "really cool" but to me it's not really interesting to have Hyper Sonic because it's more or less "He's stronger because he is" Super Sonic is already stated to be impervious to damage, so to me I see Hyper Sonic as not much more than a new coat of paint on Super Sonic that would take credit away from some of the most iconic moments in the series that where achieved by Super Sonic. I'm by no means a hater of Hyper Sonic, I've been a huge fan of many fanworks that have used Hyper Sonic and I didn't like them any less for including the form, but power creep is a real concern and I think the desire to not have Hyper Sonic return/remove him from the cannon is entirely valid. As a side note I do think Hyper Sonic also takes away opportunities for more interesting solutions that I would have found a lot more interesting. For example, Sonic needing to team up with Shadow to fight the biolizard or Shadow and Silver to fight Solaris in 06 (which Flynn stated was the most powerful enemy they've fought) without the idea of a Hyper Sonic or a Super Sonic 2, we'd have more moments where Sonic has to team up with his allies to account for the strength he needs to fight stronger enemies, which I would like to see more often. Anyway that's my rant, thanks to all who read it, have a good day all.
When are tails a knuckles gonna get legitimate super forms !!?!....am I the only one in the fandom that cares about this.
I very much care about this! Knuckles especially as guardian of the Master Emerald.
2:21
I think this form may be a Frontiers exclusive.
The new Super Sonic form definitely looks pretty cool. I definitely really like the blue eyes for the new Super Sonic form. I’m definitely excited how they are going to use this form In update 3. Update 3 is literally right around the corner because Update 3 is coming in a few weeks. I definitely cannot wait to play as the New Playable characters in update 3. I’m just curious are they going to change the ending In update 3? They probably are going to change ending but I probably not. I’m definitely excited to see the new Super Sonic form and the Playable Characters and the New story and challenges. Great video Ace card Gaming)
Glad you enjoyed it! I don’t know if the ending itself will change, but I’m guessing how we get there will.
@@AceCardGaming same I don’t think they are going to change the ending in update 3.
His spikes go up in the new form.
YES!!! I agree 1000% percent with every point you made in this video and have been making these same arguments to everyone. I subscribed just because I knew this video was coming and because I knew we would be in agreement about Frontiers. All aboard the Hype(R) train!
I only hope this is a one off form, I don't want this to "replace" Hyper, especially considering there have been talks via Kishimoto on Twitter (refuse to call it by its dumb replacement name) about making a more narrative satisfying alternate to having Hyper. I don't mind if this is counted as like a "Mastered Super Saiyan" equivalent, but it absolutely should NOT be the "Super Saiyan 2" equivalent, that comparison will ALWAYS belong to Hyper in my eyes. The way I see the other forms for Sonic shouldn't be taken as forms that are stronger than Super, to me those other forms should AT BEST only count as different utilizations of Sonic's abilities he gained in the games those forms are presented.
Basically to me (in terms of game mechanic stats):
- Super: Elevation of base form (x2 even spread multiplier)
- Hyper: Elevation of Super form (x3/x4 even spread multiplier) &/or used as a "last resort" method (something for instances like Solaris)
- Others: Niche utilizations of abilities (min-maxing of certain moves & stats)
How I want this new "Super Cyber Sonic" to work/be explained: Only him utilizing the power of Cyber Space that held The End at bay in another dimension in conjunction with his Super form and be exclusive to Frontiers.
I can say that this new “Cyber Sonic” form is most likely going to be a one-and-done deal, for one reason: It’s going to be a double-edged sword for Sonic. It’ll give him more power, but using it could end up being fatal to himself. Plus, it’s not really tied to Super Sonic at all.
@@SonicAndre2 With how much talk there has been about a possible Hyper return or replacement, I'm still worried. Feels like we're starting to navigate a minefield.
@@toonman5099 I’m not really worried, because, as much as I was trying to avoid it, I couldn’t help but peek at the script of the Final Horizon’s story.
@@SonicAndre2 Gotcha, most of this is me not getting a peek at the leaked script mostly because there's still a chance the script could change either due to said leak or just because of the fact it could have been an earlier version, and I don't want to be spoiled if it IS the final script.
Starfall super sonic is stronger than super sonic though
I also think that Sonic Team has done a good job at managing Sonic's transformations by just allowing them to happen once (Darkspine, Excalibur or Werehog)
However, when this trailer dropped, the community overall immediately thought that this was the next step for Super Sonic calling it Super Sonic 2, and I was one of the few ones who didn't think this was the case.
In my opinion, what we see in the trailer is a boosted Super Sonic. And you might ask, "boosted with what?", and I think the answer is pretty obvious since the entire journey of Sonic through the Starfall Islands has been hinting at it, and of course I'm talking about the "Cyber Corruption" or whatever you want to call it. Sonic absorbed enough of that energy and now he is combining it with his Super transformation.
I don't want to be that guy who doesn't let others speculate about a future more powerful transformation, but as a massive Dragon Ball fan, I think that it's better for Sonic and for storylines in general to stick to the Super transformation or/and have one and done transformations.
As you can see, Goku and Vegeta are extremely powerful and Super Saiyan is basically useless at this point. Even Super Saiyan God is useless. I would hate for that to happen with Super Sonic.
The need to have more powerful enemies in each arc or videogame is an unsustainable problem and I feel that Sonic Team knows that and that's why this "Super Sonic 2" is only happening in Frontiers, just like Darkspine in Secret Rings or the Werehog in Unleashed.
Yeah it's just Super Sonic but with cyberspace energy. People are kidding themselves if they actually think it's a new form
I love dragon ball Z and sonic is going to be like goku and go beyond super sonic.
I also didn't call him Super Sonic 2 when he appeared. But I don't think it's a power boost, because his skill blue has changed to yellow, and that should mean that his eyes should also be yellow, plus those blue eyes aren't the same shade as the power boost. By the way, this reminded me of a moment from Sonic RPG episode 9, where Super Sonic's eyes also changed from red to cyan before becoming Hypep Sonic.
@@ashuraomega1000it is
Super sayin god and super sayin blue are good examples of power creep
4:41 Prismatic Sonic
Excellent video as always! I don't understand wanting to avoid comparisons to DB, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and if it is done right what's the problem? So yeah, bring back Hyper Sonic!
I'm going to try and watch the video, my nephew is dragging me arms lol.
I'll give my honest opinion afterwards.
That’s dedication, I salute this! 😁
I have heard someone say that Super sonic 1 in this game already has the Whole Fictional Arsenal
I dont wanna know how much stronger this could be-
I feel like this is harder to tell apart from Super Sonic than Super Saiyan 2 is to Super Saiyan
As much as i would like hyper sonic its way too late for that because the super emeralds have nothing to do in this game if he went hyper it would just rise more eyebrows. Makes sense its new seeong how and where sonic gets this power from
The Master Emerald seems to have once resides on the starfall Islands. Based on what the Ancients themselves have said. There are ways to tie that together. 🙂
I’m confident that we will never see this form again. Sonic has had a TONE of extra 1 and done forms. Dark sonic, dark spine sonic, hyper sonic, Excalibur Sonic, unleashed Sonic. The franchise knows all about diminishing returns and the cyber energy is limited to the Starfall islands so I don’t think we need to worry about the Super Form losing its lustre and going the same way a super forms in DBZ.
I know we are ripping off DBZ and shonen anime in general at this point but I don’t care. New transformations are awesome and have loads of story potential.
Shadow taps in between positive and negative energy becoming a divine purple being.
Knuckles gets empowered by the Master Emerald with the help of Tikal’s spirit.
Silver unlocks a new power up from the time stones.
And Metal Sonic has so many monstrous forms to transform into.
Edit: I may have started a war.
Super Sonic and the chaos emeralds are the only things that can be deemed as ripoffs. Aside from that Sonic doesn't really have any forms that are similar to dragon Ball
@ashuraomega1000 Forms aren’t the only thing the series rips from Dragon Ball. Just embrace it, most people have!
@@AceCardGaming what exactly have they taken from DBZ aside from super Sonic?
@@ashuraomega1000 The seven miracle gems he uses to achieve it. Silver takes huge inspiration from Future Trunks. Special stages in S3&K were inspired directly by King Kai’s planet (straight from the devs mouths), Sonic, like Goku befriends most of the enemies he can see good in, Shadow at his worst is similar to early Vegeta. These are just off the top of my head. There are loads of articles and videos on this topic.
Silver never uses the time stones or does he?
I think we are getting some variation of the hyper form. Look at the flashes of lightning around Super Sonic. Its almost reminiscent of his hyper form color palette.
ITS CYBER SONIC NOT SUPER 2
THIS IS WHAT IS KNOWN IN LEAK SCRIPTS AS PARTIAL CYBER FORM
WHERE HES NOT FULLY TRANSFORMED
YES THERE ARE 2 CYBER FORMS
BUT I WONT DIVE INTO SPOILERS BUT THE INFORMATION IS EASY TO FIND SO DONT WORRY
Yeah I mentioned Cyber Sonic in the vid. Super Sonic 2 is just people being funny with it. Calm down caps lock…
Great vid so far also first
Who asked?
@@notnormal8459 bro why are you so mad
@@notnormal8459 I just said it was a great video get a life dude
@@notnormal8459 Who asked you
@@nasthesamurai8988 bro made 3 replys to one comment 💀💀💀💀
Also, are you fr telling me to get a life when you waited until the video started it just to comment first?
And did bro ACTUALLY like his own comment???
That's what I said lol. 2:07
I like to call this form Ascended Super Sonic, which to me is Super 2.
Sonic is finally going super Saiyan two after years of avoiding it he’s finally going back to his monkey instincts
I love the power ups in the Sonic franchise. Super Sonic has been played out for a while. It's just very irritating to not have Hyper Sonic for NO reason....every game has a an epilepsy warning. It's like the producers just don't care about Hyper Sonic's fame. They could've definitely used Hyper for this but I like the new form tho.
I wonder if this form can scale beyond Super Sonic with his complex multiversal feats tiering wise
These things can die 😂😂😂😂😂 I’m with u on that one
Mabey hyper form can return at the peak or end of the series
I don’t see the Sonic series ending if I’m honest.
I’ve actually given this a lot of thought. How much could the Sonic series really do before the stakes can’t be raised any higher? Solaris feels like it’s almost peak.
I think saving hyper before a hard reboot would be an excellent idea. Maybe the only way to save the multiverse is for history to repeat itself? Just not quite in the same way.
You're going to love this, trust me. What you see now is my normal state. This is a Super Saiyan... and this.. is known as a Super Saiyan that ascended past a Super Saiyan or you could call this a Super Saiyan 2
I don't understand the push back to the comparisons to anime and Dragon Ball. Sonic was created by japanese people, the games are made by japanese devs in Japan, let Sonic exercise his anime influence.
So many things in Sonic are directly inspired by DB it is comical to try to bury everything now: the earliest sketches of Super Sonic is literally Sonic with Super Saiyan hair; S3 Special Stages are inspired by King Kai's planet; Silver is based on Future Trunks.
I’m surprised that so many people are still in denial about it. Just embrace it, both Sonic and DB are cool!
Sonic:
This is my base form,
and this is a Sonic that has realized the legend, also known as [Super Sonic],
Now this is a Sonic that has ascended past a Super Sonic, or known as Super Sonic 2,
and this is to go...even further beyond.
*Emerald Sounds Rage*
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH WISPS!
OBJECTION!!!
The wisps are amazing. I hope they bring them back into a new game in the future, especially Burst 🔥 and Lightning ⚡
I have an idea.
Sonic using the cyber energy combined with the chaos emeralds could cause the super emeralds to return.
We know the super emeralds currently reside in another dimension…If chaos emeralds are being combined with another power from another dimension (cyber)…this is an opportunity.
Yes! That's the same idea I had, well... almost. I thought to skip the super emeralds and have cyber energy + chaos emeralds = Hyper Sonic. Having cyber energy + chaos energy be equal to that of the super emeralds, but same idea basically.
@@HyperManSP I’m on board with the cyber power giving super sonic a massive boost, but I wouldn’t say it’s on par with hyper.
I could be dead wrong on this, but I have always viewed one super emerald being equivalent to all 7. Meaning 7 super emeralds = Super Sonic multiplied by 7. Unfathomable power.
I feel like this form that they’re introducing should be the prelude to Hyper Sonic. Sonic Adventure 3, LET’S GO!
@@BoyleVoices That could be too, I had considered it. But same basic idea, cyber energy combining with chaos energy that is.
@@HyperManSP Maybe the cyber energy is more powerful than I’m thinking and it really does bring about the hyper form! Another thing to consider, and I’m really reaching here…
but Sonic Team has made a pretty big deal over the cyan colored emerald. It’s the 7th one, the only one that was undiscovered on South Island. It wasn’t until Westside island it was found. Chaos 0 also happens to be the same color.
Sonic’s eyes turn cyan with this new super form. Again, idk if I’m reaching really hard, but cyan seems to be a key color here. What if the super emeralds and the cyber energy are actually linked, and Sonic’s using ONE super emerald?
@@BoyleVoices I imagine cyber energy to be "order", Sonic obtains "order" and brings order to the "chaos" of the emeralds, basically attaining power similar to that of their master emerald and unlocking Hyper. What if the super emeralds were only one way to attain the powers necessary for Hyper? But really all the Hyper form requires is the power of the master emerald, you attain that power through various means though.
Interesting... Imagine Sonic does Chaos's stage 1 - 6 forms with the super emeralds, culminating in a Sonic Perfect with 7 super emeralds, a.k.a. Hyper Sonic.
Yeah yeah but read the Archie comics and sonic had hyper sonic before ultra instinct and super Saiyan so
Hyper Sonic did not exist anywhere before Super Saiyan. Neither did Super Sonic. Super Sonic was inspired by Super Saiyan. The Super Saiyan debuted in 1991.
Hyper Sonic is explicitly a "superior" version of Super Sonic though. Same with the Super Emeralds to the Chaos Emeralds. Whereas all the other forms are either equivalent to (Darkspine Sonic, Excalibur Sonic, and Burning Blaze) or covering a different niche than Super Sonic (Werehog). This "Super Sonic 2" form seems to be more of an addition or supplement to Super Sonic especially so when Cyberspace is essentially a Chaos Emerald powered UNIVERSE. Or an alteration of the Super Form if you will.
The issue with power creep is that it requires greater obstacles to warrant suspense, drama, and continued investment eventually resulting in a lack and net loss of interest since there's no real stopgap to warrant that or guarantee sincerity when it comes to power. I like the other forms that Sonic has because they're DIFFERENT FROM and not explicitly overall "greater" than Super Sonic like Hyper Sonic is.
Whereas Dragon Ball has Super Saiyan God and Blue effectively trumped by Ultra Instinct and even THAT trumped by True Ultra Instinct. Which is kind of bad since the forms are a MAJOR focus of the series. Yeah, there's Zeno, but he's so far removed, out of focus, and offhand with everything that he barely counts as a stopgap nor really treated like one. He's also NOT an enemy or fighter, so.
here's the real truth about Hyper.
We have Super Sonic, sure a Hyper Sonic would be cool- but in the end that's all it would be. a novelty to have but ultimately pointless in the story itself.
sure you WANT Hyper Sonic, but the story doesn't need it. especially considering the power that Super Sonic has already being enough. Sega is forced to dodge and weave any questions and request for Hyper because they know of the problem it would cause. Not only is the Hyper Form tedious to get, with all the special stages to unlock their power, but it makes Super Sonic look Super Lame in comparison.
think of the original Super Saiyan transformation, cool and epic.
But then the androids and Cell arcs came along right after and made the form look like a bitch.
Then you had SSJ2 appear and then mean NOTHING when the Buu Saga came along. then you had SSJ3- then SSJ4. SSG. SSGSS. UI Omen, MUI, True UI
if they brought back Hyper, Super would seem useless in comparison. People would want and expect Hyper to appear more and more, to the point they get bored of Hyper and say- "New Form?"
and we go through the cycle again and again, the storybook games saved this by NOT having the forms reappear.
Hyper, while cool, doesn't matter no fits within the story of Frontiers or any other Sonic Game. Not even S3&K to and extent! We have out Super Hedgehog already, we don't need and shouldn't have Hyper Hedgehog back-
(especially considering Super Sonic and the Emeralds being infinite, the Hyper Form's power would canonically one shot bosses.)
I get people like rainbow Super Sonic, but the intention was a new powerup to halt gameplay in S3&K and nothing more.
Yeah, super Sonic clearly isn’t enough here, necessitating this new form. So not really sure what your point is. They could have just used Hyper instead.
@@AceCardGaming it's inconsistent for Super not to be enough when Ian Flynn confirms The End is planetary while Solaris was going to destroy the sonic multiverse itself.
Hyper couldn't be used as the way to power up the Chaos Emeralds into Super Emeralds would be tedious, it's canon to the lore of S.Emeralds you need the M.E with you and all stages completed to unlock Hyper.
@@thehedgebot99mph90 Yeah, except the Master emerald is portable and at once stage was on the StarFall Islands. There where ways to do it if they wanted to. I’m no writer, but it’s certainly not as impossible as you’re making out.
It’s funny because back when frontiers showed off super sonic, people were saying that sonic must get a new form to defeat the titans because super sonic wasn’t strong enough. Not realising that if it wasn’t a temporary form then it would completely Eclipse super sonic and make him Irrelevant, just like with ssj being overshadowed by ssb and sega knew this which is why all of the forms from the spin-off games were one-offs so super sonic would stay relevant to the story and not be replaced as the ultimate form of sonic, only to be used for nostalgia like “hey its that one super form that you used to like, doesn’t it suck, look how weak and useless it is now”. Hypersonic didn’t have this problem because it needs the master emerald in order to be activated so it could only be used when necessary, it’s stronger than super sonic but isn’t reliable enough to be used all the time because of its requirements. It’s not a ascended form that’s easy to use and is more effective than the previous one due to easier requirements to activate it. I’m hoping that super sonic 2 or cyber sonic is a one-off transformation and that super sonic stays as the strongest or at least super sonic 2 should be more difficult to consistently use often so it kinda becomes a last resort time of form only being used when absolutely necessary.
7:20 fin.
See for those wondering why hyper sonic isnt happening is because they said themselves their not allowed to use hyper sonic anymore. It was in a nutshell retconned.
It can’t be retconned and confirmed as canon by Takashi Iizuka.
@@AceCardGaming i said in a nutshell. Because their not allowed to use it. Never said it wasnt cannon just that it was mini retconned and thats why we’ll NEVER see it again
@@BahamutsThrone Retconned, non canon, tomAto Tomato. And the whole video was discussing the REASONS they’re not allowed to use Hyper forms anymore and debating the merits of those reasons. So again. Not really sure what point you were trying to make.
@@AceCardGaming i made my point very clear. The main reason being they arent allowed too because they already tried.
They already tried? Those words are literally nowhere in either of your comments.
But this form will only be exclusive to Frontiers probably, he didn't, as many say, "went beyond the super form", he just used the power of corruption in it
I said this will likely just be for one game like all the others in the video. You can interpret how he powers up any way you like, but he factually pushed beyond the basic Super Sonic. Not sure what point you’re trying to make.
at least personally, it probably being linked to cyberspace, I assume it'll probably be a one use only super form similarly to dark spine sonic and excaliber sonic, with the confusion regarding it just being supersonic 2 just comes from a lackluster design that isn't different enough from base supersonic
Eu gosto de sonic porem a super transformação porem ja esta ficando enjoativa muito repetitiva
In Sorry don't get mad at me people. I like super Sonic 2 and that Cyber Sonic more then hyper
As much as I like hyper Sonic and the fans interpretation throughout the years, I would like it if, this form were to stay, instead of being a one-off story form, like the Werehog and Excalibur.
My only thing is, that they explain it well and it makes sense in the story, I always imagined Sonic going beyond his limits in Super and attaining a new Super 2.
I don't think this is to replace hyper, they can always reintroduce that form in another story, this'll be a new add-on for Sonic's forms.
As for the DBZ comparisons, that's always been around lol, but I never really called them rip-offs, especially not Sliver, I put him in the category of *Inspired* _by,_ rather than copy cat.
And as far as powerscaling goes, nothing is completely wrong with it, so long as it makes sense, I've seen fans do their own powerscaling before and a lot of it is even, but people argue bs regardless.
So if Sonic Team wanted to join in, it wouldn't be a bad thing, just keep 3 forns, Super Sonic, Super Sonic 2 and Hyper.
It's not like they'll add any of his Archie forms like Ultra Sonic nor Fleetway.
A "new" form that looks exactly like SSJ2 only serves to invalidate every excuse they've made to avoid Hyper Sonic. Dragon Ball never had a form that pulsed through all the colors, making it unique to Sonic. As for seizures, that could be solved by having Sonic fade to a white glow between each color before fading to the next.
Wish he had 3 streaks on his head using the same eye color to help differentiate from Super Sonic better.
Sonic will only use this "form " in the new finalle then will lost the ability to use it again
THAT'S obvious lmao
Yep. I said this. 👍
What would be absolutely hilarious to me is if Sonic Team just also name this new form Hyper Sonic.
That would hurt me lol. I think they might go with Cyber Sonic or something. If of course this energy DOES come from Cyber Space.
i kinda feel like a super sonic 2 isn't a great idea?
Just make it a one time then, that way it won't power creep.
hyper sonic is just simply too broken to return for main series. i think we should look at it as a bonus for fans to do in their own works just like its a bonus is sonic 3. its almost like a reward for getting 2 games at the same time tbh.
that being said i herd that somewhere in sonic lore super emeralds are as strong as 7 chaos emeralds so hyper sonic would be more accurate to say as super sonic 7 instead of super sonic 2.
also i actually like when sonic series steals something from dragon ball because i find it funny and not annoying for some reason.
I like it when Sonic takes inspiration from DB as well! But how is Hyper Sonic broken?
we need hyper but it being in frontiers makes no sense. solaris was stronger then the end and all it took was super sonic so him needing hyper doesn't make sense
the end is literally the strongest sonic villain (yes stronger than solaris, time eater, erazor djinn, egg salamander literally everyone) so i don't think we won't see this form for a while so hopefully power creep won't happen
According to Ian Flynn, The End is not stronger than Solaris. One of his recent podcasts he said this.
No it isn’t .
@@DDDTJ infinite is stated to be stronger than every sonic villain and the end is stronger than infinite so take that
@@da-sonic name how infinite is stronger then Solaris who can consume the sonic multiverse in the present past and future.
@@DDDTJ official statements don't lie
Honestly the sonic and dbz comparisons makes me cringe seriously can sonic do something cool without being compared to dragonball is that too much to ask 😑
They can make you cringe, that’s fine. But they’re still valid. Sonic has done plenty of cool things that have nothing to do with Dragon Ball. It just so happens that there are also many inspirations from it. It is what it is.
I do agree the design is a rip off, but not the form itself.
It’s kinda the premise I’m talking about here. Not the actual design. The design so far is just blue eyes super sonic with a new aura.
@@AceCardGamingAgreed. Another form that is just an upgraded super form. But it has it’s differences like cyber energy etc.
I don't get this whole "power creep" thing that people are trying to argue about. Sonic has never had power scaling. They don't want the hyper form to come back because they don't want to have any more similarities with dragon Ball. If Sega was really concerned about how powerful these game exclusive forms are then Sonic would only have the super form and we wouldn't get any other game exclusive transformations. The franchise isn't going to suffer from power creep.
This new form is also a Dragon Ball rip off. So what exactly is your point?
@@AceCardGaminghow do you know that? We don't even know anything about the form. He's most likely using the cyberspace energy to upgrade himself. It's just super Sonic but with blue eyes
@@ashuraomega1000 It literally looked like a Saiyan going from Super Saiyan to Super Saiyan 2 by powering up. How did that need explaining?
@@AceCardGaming no it didn't. If anything it was more like kaioken.
Did you just prove my point anyway? I think you did. 😏
I don't get the hype of Hyper Sonic, I don't find any compelling reason for his existence beyond fan-service nostalgia.
From a conceptual and narrative standpoint, Hyper Sonic is really weak, lame and redundant.
-Like what is it exactly? Super Sonic again but more super-ier???
-What are the super emeralds exactly? Chaos emeralds but more 'unlimited-ier" power?
-How would one obtain the form? Same exact thing as Super Sonic? Maybe insert trials? Ehh...
-What would this add to Sonic's character? This is a big thing of why people have a problem with the amount of transformations DBZ and super has, Transformations used to MEAN something.
-Even from a gameplay standpoint I don't see the point, that screen nuke is cool and all but what's REALLY stopping the Super form from having this too? It pretty much serves the purpose of super sonic anyways.
I don't see what Hyper would add anything meaningful besides brainless power level wanking. I find Dark Sonic to be WAY better in pretty much every regard because it's actually DISTINCT.
So you’re totally against this new Super Sonic 2 as well then?
@@AceCardGaming No cause it's not really a new transformation, just a little add-on of the super form.
Which is how you basically described Hyper Sonic.
@@AceCardGaming Yyyyyeah??? That's the point? It's not sugarcoating as a new and unique form for cheap marketing.
@@yungmuney5903 So according to you, Super Sonic 2 is ok, because it’s “Just a little add-on for Super Sonic”, but Hyper Sonic is NOT ok, because it’s “Just a little add-on for Super Sonic.” Yet I’m the one getting responses beginning with “yyyyeeeaaahhhh” like I’M the idiot… If you can’t read and understand your own points? Don’t expect others to.
Super sonic 2 tf 😂😂