I feel like putting Tails on Chaos Island was an intentional decision. It’s very fitting to name a place of moving forwards in life after your biggest failure.
Using all of Tails inconsistencies and even his lowest point with Infinite as a springboard to push him back to who he was in the Adventure era is absolutely genius writing and I have nothing but respect for Ian Flynn doing this. Also, Tails just being allowed to reference past events at all was kind of a shock to me in and of itself. Just like... We're allowed to know past games exist and are relevant to this game in some way? What???
Amy and Tails are my favorite characters and to see this game address Tails flaws and actually want him to learn from them is a great move on their part. He really felt like his Adventure self, he was knowledgeable, but he wasn't solely defined by techno babble and had an arc about gaining confidence. I really hope this part of his character sticks in the next game and Frontiers DLC.
As good as the improvement of Tails is nothing in Frontiers can compare to a single line from Tails in that goofy Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog cartoon when it comes to how close he and Sonic are. "You're my mom, dad, and white picket fence."
What i love about Frontiers is that when the other characters are expressing how they feel, insecurities and fears, to Sonic and Sonic reminding them how awesome they are, they repay that kindness and help him escape from his corrupted state.
I really liked Tails in Sonic Frontiers, and I'm quite satisfied that the writing acknowledges that he has been pretty inconsistent. I could be really wrong about this though, but didn't we kind of see that he was the fox with a plan in his two game gear spin-off games, Tails' Adventure and Tails Skypatrol? Whether or not these games would be considered canon (I'm pretty sure they are considering some elements of both of these games were shown in his 30th anniversary comic), but I like to think that he was more than capable of being a hero as shown in these games, even way before his story in both SA1 and SA2. Even if I am wrong, it felt weird to not have him be somewhat capable of handling tough situations on his own in games like Lost World and Forces, and these games had really good setups to show it too.
Here’s my idea. Infinite returns more powerful than ever and beats Super Sonic with ease. Bashing the emeralds out of him the same way Knuckles did in Sonic 3. Infinite would threaten Tails to hand over the emeralds to him or he will die. Tails instead absorbs the power of the emeralds and becomes Super Tails, who gives Infinite the worst beating of his life. Smashing his mask to pieces in the process.
Yeah Tails felt the most normal out of that whole game, plus I kinda loved him getting to interact with Shadow one on one and wish it would happen more frequently.
@@Cloud-dt6xb Shadow the hedgehog had a lot of neat interactions with shadow and you could play as most characters following you around by doing what you do in sonic 2 by plugging a second controller in. This includes playable maria.
What tails is more than willing to do. -Help sonic fining chaos emeralds. -escort anyone like he usually carries sonic in emergencies. - He is capable of combat related to firng projectiles with and without mech if he is armed. -His scientific mind quickly figure things out the fastest, so allowing other members to realized quicker. He will grow, he will be independent at his own will and whim. He will be playable, along with knuckles and Amy.
I think Tails being the one to take the lead on saving Sonic from the corruption at the end of the game shows that he's always been stronger then he thinks he is. He does have the strength and will to be a hero, it was just buried under self doubt and only seeing himself as the sidekick for so long. Tails's experience on the Starfall Islands broke his perceptoin of Sonic being the one who always saves the day completely, it forced him to realize that his best friend has limits to and sometimes he needs to step up when nobody else can.
You know, it's kind of a genius move to have Tails, Knuckles, Amy and Eggman trapped in Cyberspace if you're looking for character development. Lots of people don't get a chance to self-reflect on their past, their actions and their future, even when they do have downtime. Being alone, truly alone, with no distractions and nothing but your thoughts for like 24 hours, how would you emerge from that on the other side?
I agree with what you said about Tails, he needs this for himself and I know that this can help him become a better character overtime. I believe in him and I know that with Ian flin doing the writing this will be great. I just hope people don't mess it up because Talls deserves to grow like he did in adventure.
I am so glad you discussed the relatively easy to miss optional conversation about Tails' experience in cyberspace. Tails' "burden" conversation is really important, but this optional conversation shows Flynn's ability to take the piss-poor writing from his predecessors (*cough*bollerspenders*cough*) and use them to frame character growth. I like to envision the conversation with the duplicate as being a bit more extended about that, and Tails is even forced to witness his younger self both in his Adventure years when he could still kick ass and then get slapped in the face with... well, his absolutely horrible moment in Forces. Part of it was even part of an unpublished fanfiction concept I wrote myself where Tails meets with Amy in a city that didn't fall to Eggman yet, and resulted in a harsh falling out between Tails and Amy, Tails choosing not to side with the Resistance, and leaving with only the designs for the Wispons as all Amy got out of the conversation. This was how I wanted to also explore the idea of the throwaway "Tails has lost it" line Silver gives in the game. The idea being that Amy, rather than tell the Resistance the truth about Tails actively sitting out the war, sets up a narrative about a nervous breakdown instead. I can guarantee just in that one scene I put about 10,000,000% more thought into Tails' character than Pontac and Graff did in ten years of writing Sonic games. Granted, whenever I write or RP Tails, he tends to be a bit more mature than normal, maybe a bit closer to his Adventure personality, but with a little more battle scars added to it. A version of Tails who realistically went through the trauma of Sonic Colors and Sonic Lost World. I never did 100% think of a great way to answer why Tails would be terrified of Chaos 0 of all things, though, aside from maybe there actually being a nervous breakdown later. The fanfic concept does heavily imply that the Tails double was emphasizing that Tails had fallen from his potential and he had to confront it.
I'm just gonna let you right now: I was not expecting to like this video. But you tackled this amazingly. The genre I'd like to see in a "Tails" game is whatever Ratchet & Clank was, but instead of buying equipment you have to make it with materials collected. I've been tossing this idea around for years haha
Hearing all this not only makes me relief with how they're handling the casts, but also gives me a spark of interest as to if Sonic team might give Tails his own chance to shine with his own game as well. It felt like how Pokémon had ash the main character for over 30 years and then they decided to let Ash to grow up and give a new cast of characters their own spotlight. what if we get a similar treatment with Sonic's friends? Like say bring in the IDW characters into the game or rework older characters like the freedom fighters or someone new? there is so many possible outcomes to what they would do next.
Knowing there is DLC with Amy, Knuckles, and Tails on the way I'm really hoping they let Ian Flynn and his team write the games from now on, there is a great deal of potential in the sonic series for an amazing Sonic Adventure 3 proven by the IDW series thus far that could answer a lot of old and new questions, like do we even have a cannon map of sonics world? Are there still humans around? there is so much to answer yet i feel like its going to take 10 more years to even have a chance of getting to that point, i love how the characters are maturing and i want it to continue i just hope the gameplay of future games can match the story.
Well hopefully the upcoming DLC of Frontiers that involves a new story and playable characters will show more of Tails and the other characters sides of the stories
I’m wondering will it be “End of the World” style levels like we seen in 06. Covering Amy, Knuckles and Tails in Cyber space after they save Sonic from the corruption. Will be interesting to see!
I was worried before the game release even in the marketing sense of things... cause they were hiding tails so much, after playing though it I can see why the did it... and it touched me in the heart
Spinoff or no, I just want Tails to fight Witchcart and her cronies again in a modern setting. If Tails is going on his own adventures without Sonic's help he deserves his own set of villains.
Or, how about the time he fought an entire army of Kukkus and sent their giant flying warship hurtling into the ocean? (By the way, the Japanese market says Tails Adventures is a prequel to Sonic 2. I believe this is what Tails refers to in the famous quote from Sonic Adventure: “I’ve changed a lot since I’ve started hanging with Sonic…”.)
Writers acknowledging the past games is important, because we can’t move on until the writers confront the problem and confirm that they’re going to do better. If they never did that, we wouldn’t know if Tails would just get retconed again next game.
@@bakedbeans5494 if you ignore the mistakes of past installments, you end up with garbage like the Star Wars Sequels. If it’s one or two moments, then that’s one thing. But when it’s been going on for a decade… that’s not out of character anymore, it’s just a character who got taken in a crappy direction. They have to acknowledge that before they can move past it.
Tails facing his demons with a bit of pep talk from the blue blur was probably one of the best things to witness in Frontiers. Mentioning the games from the past added onto it, as well as calling out his own inconsistencies when Sonic shut his argument down of being sidelined or useless. And hearing him go on his own to be his own hero really brought me hope for the future of Sonic The Hedhehog
If it was me at Sega and it was up to me all the characters by the end of their journey in frontiers want to go on their own ventures I would seriously take this opportunity to give them solo titles. Oh yes it's been so long I'd love a 3D tails and knuckles, and even Amy she wants to share the love with the world. Make a villain for her that feels like love is cruel there you go.
Wikipedia said that Sonic Prime is (unlike every other Sonic TV show) canon to the main series like IDW. I wonder if Frontiers was after Prime since Sonic became an inspiring figure in Frontiers from his time in the Shatterverse in Prime.
I love how Frontiers took the most contentious part of Forces with Tails cowering and turned it into a character arc after the fact. It was such an out of pocket scene for him that you'd think they'd just ignore it. But taking that moment and having Tails be just as frustrated as the fans were at himself for falling apart so easily while having Sonic explain what the fans said that Tails has done far more to show he's brave and competent was brilliant. It not only addresses the issue head on and makes an effort to fix it, that scene is also cathartic for the fans to have the game recognize exactly why they were frustrated instead of just ignoring it.
This is why Ian Flynn is the best Sonic Writer, pretty much of all time. Sure, a good writer, even Flynn himself could have just quietly ignored Tails' shameful downslide into a terrible character... but he basically did in Frontiers what he did when he was put in charge of the Archie comic: He actually FIXED the damage, rather than just swept it under the rug.
I like how the Cyberspace and the state of the Koco really does stay as a big theme through the whole game, this feels like a first game before new heights. That for the characters to reach those new heights, they should not feel binded from themselves. Sonic is always moving in and out of cyberspace because he's not a character that struggles with that until his short downfall of feeling like he has to do things by himself. His friends allow him to move on and he helps his friends and Koco do that too.
I have an interesting idea for a playable Tails segment in the next mainline game: "The city is attacked by Eggman (or a new villain who knows), so sonic goes hand-to-hand with him while we as tails are saving the civilians from danger"
Tails has come a long way since his debut in 1992. Throughout most of the series, he has been viewed as Sonic’s sidekick or his right hand man whenever the situation requires a little more support, either physical or mental. When he started out on his own along the way, he started to see what Sonic saw in him: a bright boy who just wants to do great things and above all, follow his example of being a fighter with a heart of gold. The forms of media I have seen such things were in Sonic X, the IDW comics, Sonic and Tails R and of course, Sonic Frontiers. It’s normal that he’s still unsure of himself by the occasions when he falls back because underneath that intellectual exterior, he’s still a child that needs guidance and given how his upbringing was, Tails is very fortunate to have someone who will give him the push into the right direction and be surrounded by those who love and care about him. As long as he has them in his heart, he’ll never lose his way and rise up to be the hero of his own story. 💛🦊
I really feel like they're starting to get stuff together now 🤩 We just need a few more years to see a few more games to be sure ☹️ MAN I'M TIRED OF WAITING WHY DOES VIDEO GAMES TAKE SO LONG ( as long as everything gets fixed then I'm okay )
Yea I say that he was right in his deleted Tails video. Sega had plans to grow Tails as a hero! He was even considered a 3D spin off game as well as Knuckles and Eggman but guessing never happened because Naka got fired.
Hm, fair and valid points and opinions, i can agree with what you said here, I really hope this gets followed up upon. Also, i appreciate the references.
Listening to this analysis of Tails character from the past few years and his characterization in Frontiers makes me think that someone took a listen to Tails’ theme song from the adventure games when trying to write his character for this game. “This is not simply my way. My own style. Gotta get a hold of my life.” “If I just follow you, I will never see the light.” I think that’s a good thing having Tails be reminded of how much he’s grown and how he’ll continue to grow.
I think the thing that we have to remember is that poor portrayals of Tails as well as him being unfairly sidelined is sadly nothing new. When Sonic 2 first came out I honestly felt like I was the only kid who actually liked Tails, as everyone else was always quick to select Sonic Alone in the options menu. And it wasn't just a gameplay thing either, I distinctly remember other kids saying things like "Oh, Tails just sucks! Nobody likes him! Even Sonic hates his guts! He's so much better without crappy ol' Tails!" And whenever I would stand up for him and talk about why I liked him and why I thought that he was cool, all I'd get was "Nope! You're wrong! Nothing cool or good about him whatsoever! He just sucks!" I remember reading Sonic the Comic and just hating how Sonic was portrayed as being such a prick, particularly to Tails for some reason. Always calling him hurtful names like "Pixel Brain" and constantly putting him down and calling him things like useless. It just made me think that the writers of that comic may have had a similar attitude towards Tails as my friends had; like they couldn't stand him either and were just venting their thoughts towards him through Sonic. It's the same with the SATAM series, in that it felt like the writers were sidelining him every chance that they could. "Off to beddy byes now Tails! We'll read you a bedtime story and then we, the grownups, can go and save the world! But you can't come!!!!" Heck, even in Sonic X it felt like he wasn't really being used to his full potential. His main role was just the pilot who flew everyone around in his big plane. People love to blame Pontac and Graff and the so called "meta era" for the downfall of Tails' character, but I can't help but think that they likely saw these portrayals of the character and just thought "oh, so that's all he is! Annoying and useless! Let's just do that but exaggerate it!" And even worse, the people at Sega approved these! Likely because they're constantly listening to the "story doesn't matter in a Sonic game" crowd. Tails' portrayal in Frontiers is such a breath of fresh air compared to what we've had in the past, but it feels like they're still playing it safe. "We'll fix his personality, but he still can't be playable!" Even with this new Frontiers DLC that's coming out, I'm worried that it'll just be a lazy reskin of Sonic with a half-arsed story tacked on similar to Shadow's DLC in Forces. And if it doesn't work out and people go right back into their "Sonic's stinky friends" rants, there's every chance that Sega will panic and go "Right! You heard 'em, boys! They hate Sonic's stupid friends! Back on the NPC pile with you! Gotta keep the haters happy! We better bring back Classic Sonic or they'll never trust us ever again!" *FACEPALM*
@@tailsprowerfan2729 That's what I've been saying for years. The problem is that, for the longest time, Sega seemed to have no interest in listening to actual positive and constructive criticisms. The only people that they'd listen to are the people who go "WAAAHH, DON'T LIKE IT, GET RID OF IT OR I'M NEVER PLAYING ANOTHER SONIC GAME EVER AGAIN REEEEE!"
Amy is gonna be a tough analysis video to make on, since she doesn’t even go through an arc like Knuckles and Tails. What would you even analyze her on? I hope Update 3 does this, but I severely doubt it, due to SEGA being SEGA.
1:13 My response to Lost World Tails best spoken by a certain potions professor: “Tell me, are you incapable of restraining yourself, or do you take pride in being an insufferable know-it-all?”
I'm guessing Amy will be in your next character analysis video. I hope you do her justice. There are people who claim that Frontiers made her boing. All because she wasn't her usually bubbly self when she was a cyber ghost. But said people ignore what Sonic's friends were going through when it comes to Amy. And they also ignore that she was back to her high-spirited self once she was freed from cyberspace for good. Even now, I'm sure someone will respond "Frontiers DID make Amy boring." That aside, I hope you point out that Amy's attraction to Sonic doesn't make her weak-minded. Just like Sonic's other friends, her character can be handled well or mishandled, depending on the writers. IDW proved that Amy can kick ass without sacrificing her affection for Sonic.
I mean I did miss Amy being more energatic but this really isn't my main issue with her in Frontiers at all. That would go to the same issue I have with Tails in Frontiers. And that is the very Meta view on there releashionship with Sonic. Frontiers goes off the very Meta perception that they spend all of there time with Sonic(because they are always together in the games we get to play) and therefor concludes that they need to distance them self from Sonic for at least a while to grow into there own. This however doesn't make sense as its been enstablished since at least SA1 that Tails and Amy spend most of there time without Sonic as he is always on the run for new adventures. Its why "long time no see" is one of the most overused phrases in the series because its true the nature of Sonic means he won't actually spend a lot of his time with them. So things like Amy being sad about properly not seeing Sonic for a good long while because to make her want to bring love to the world reality needing her to be away from Sonic for long periods of times end up being illogical as Amy has no reason to be dramatic about it its already how her and Sonic have always been in-universe.
@@rynobehnke8289 Well, we're getting their point of view. From their perspective, they need some distance from Sonic. Or in Knuckles' case, he's finally exploring the world on his accord. Amy watched at least three Koco pass on. One of them she bonded with and sympathized with. It's true that Sonic will set out for his next adventure, right after finishing one. But now, it's his friends following his example. And Sonic is supporting their decisions.
@@BlackFlash09 But that 's the issues "There point of view" isn't actually theirs its Ian Flynns from the Meta perspective of "they always are together in those games" when they always introduce each other by "long time no see" because not seeing each others for long time is the most casual thing in the world. Sonic Battle is to this day the only story were the group stayed together for a extended period of time and that was mostly to raise Emerl. The moment he died would this have ended. And sure Amy watches 3 Koco's die but now were Ian crowbared his comics into continuity did Amy as off there visit to Echo Base in the Comics see dozens of people die on the battle fields during Forces (as if the disaster of "Operation Big wave" wouldn't already be prove enough) so while death is shocking is this a Amy that already has gone throw 2 Global wars (never forget she was part of the strick force that attacked the Black Comet in Shadow's game too) and thought for months Sonic was dead during one of them. She shouldn't be this soft anymore. Also didn't Amy's story in SA1 end on the exact same sentiment anyway? In general do Amy and Tails at the end of Forces like they were back at the end of there stories in SA1 again with Amy being slightly toned down.
Maybe I really like Eggman as a Villain, that was somehow a bit more interessting to me, but this was good too. I always change my favourite characters, but I know that in most chases I enjoyed Amy a bit less and probably favour Team Dark a bit.
The problem with acknowledging Forces handling of Tails is that it was so wildly out of character for him to "lose it" to the point where he can't just be considered a moment of weakness for him, its just outright ignoring prior development of his character. This isn't the first time Sonic was assumed dead by Tails, and he faced the danger head on. So contextualizing Tails' character in Forces as him being "wildly inconsistent" at its worst will just serve to shield future games from criticism where he falls back into being a coward. The issue with choosing to acknowledge poor writing rather than ignore it is that in a long running series like Sonic it will inevitably mean constant relapses in character and then retreading the same development over and over again. I would have much rather Ian not tried to rationalize Tails' character in Forces and just moved past it because it honestly only makes Tails' character worse because now he's set up as someone with a weak resolve who is just going to retread his Adventure era development before possibly just reverting to his old self should Sonic Team or whatever writer is doing the story at the time choose to go that way.
I mean, worst case scenario, your fears may well be justified. But ideally, any growth Tails experiences from now on could be used to ensure that sort of lapse in characterisation never happens again. It just remains to be seen which will happen.
I feel like maybe a roguelike dungeon crawler thing could work with Tails, heck maybe even a Metroidvania, or maybe a puzzle game... Tails seems quite versatile
I feel like Sonic is a bit like a parent watching their child grow up old enough to leave the house, he is a bit saddened by this but at the same time extremely proud of him.
I still don't know how I feel of the notion that Tails needs to be away from Sonic to grow but I'm willing to wait to see where they go first. If we can get some awesome stuff with him then it'll be worth it, but I don't want them changing Tails's core personaility. The sweet happy kid who geeks out about techonolgy is why we loved him in the first place after all, but I was very happy with what we got in Frontiers it felt so refreshing for the games side of things.
I love the fact that Tails talks about his cowardness in sonic forces like the people who wrote sonic frontiers have to clean up the mistakes of the sonic forces writers
I agree Tails SA1 and SA2 were peak and frontiers saved him IMO he’s more than just a tech or guy in the chair this dude is fast and smart as eggman he should be a hero and equal to
Between the Mega Drive era and the GBA era was Tails my favourite character of the fandom. I was shocked to see what happened to him after 06. He became more like B-Movie sidekick to a AAA-Hero. Or sometimes he even acts like a Kindergarten-child. It is said that Tails is equal to Robotnik because of the I.Q. I have sometimes thought: If Sega has no ideas with Tails, than make him to Robotniks Partner for world domination. Better that a good guy becomes a villian than just to be a side note because he has to be. But Tails appearance in Frontiers made him more mature and also the Tails i once loved. I hope Sega will develop him more and this was not a one-hit-wonder.
Another great video! But I'll have to disagree with something here, one specific thing. I like the Miles Electric, please let him keep it. He can't do his tech magic without a piece of tech and the fact he has his own custom built one is cool to me. wondering if the next video gonna be about Sonic? I can't really see a WHOLE video done on Amy's portrayal since, all things concidered, her character hasn't really been let shine in the game in favor of prolonging the "we dont know whats going on and we're moody" vibe in the first section of the game
No I agree with this video I want that thing gone it makes it way too easy for Sega to rely on it as a crutch and it prevents Tails from actually showing how smart he really is. Compare anytime he uses that thing to Frontiers where he's able to solve mystery's of the island just by looking around and it's like night and day. He's meant to have an iq that's even better than Eggman's and the miles electric really robbed us of seeing that from him.
@@Cloud-dt6xb what i mean is not have it used that way, i see it as a problem sseperate from the miles electric. the reason why is how its portrayed in the comic andmost recently scrapnik island, its a portable computer of his so he uses it to make something in it that can help and it generally is a device that helps him get data, but tails and the ithers still have to do all the thinking it CAN and SHOULD work as a cool tool and not a magic can-do-anything gizmo, and thats exactly why i do not want it gone same goes for orbot and cubot, in games they could be annoying and seen as pointless, but ive seen enough other official material with them to know they can be done super well and in a way that makes me LOVE them even more. legit the geobots are some of my fav characters. (thothat mightalso be because i have an extremely LARGE pool of favourites)
honestly, I liked the attempts at humor in Sonic games.... but I do feel there should be a good balance for the series between that and serious character growth..... I mean its possible, Borderlands does it after all. As for the "Baldy Mc. Nosehair" joke... I feel it would have landed better if it was an actual funny name, or even a refrence to another franchise..... like instead of "Baldy Mc. Nosehair" how bout "Zar Baldy Bald the lard" a Bobobo reference (both sorta hated and loved that anime...) as for Mile's "journey" I would like an FPS or 3rd person shooter style game as a modern tails game.... it would fit super well I mean he makes mechs..... he could do something like the Cyclone v2, or an entirely new thing that's like a hover tank, or w/e..... then combine that with on foot sections which arn't speed, but something different... perhaps stealth? I dunno... just don't want a Tails game that's just "its Sonic, but he can fly!"
Maybe when Tails and Sonic reunite, it'll be a similar scene to when Ariel and Flounder reunited in Little Mermaid: Return To The Sea, with Sonic being all like "You're sure not a scaredy cat anymore!" or "You're sure not my LITTLE bro anymore!" What do you think?
A good writer retcons bad writing an amazing writer uses bad writing to springboard themselves and tell greater stories using said bad writing and making it potential for storytelling and character growth along with lore building.
Saying outloud "Then I'm inconsistent" is not amazing, it's one of the laziest and most pathetic cop-outs possible. This is straight up delusional rambling.
@@yrooxrksvi7142 Im saying if you wanna make something truly good you can use bad material to turn it into something good as there is no bad ideas only truly shitty executions.
Il Hope tails finally became back the tails he was in adventure stop stop begin to cry like the moment when choas attack him in sonic force when he try to fix omega and become a hero
Cool video. Good points. But I think your reason on why Tails mentioning Forces' Tails behavior is a bit forced. I can see the perspective of it being a nod to the mishandling of the character. But I don't think that Forces portrayed Tails in a completely wrong manner. Tails is a child who has Sonic as a role model. If his role model is beaten in front of him- it makes sense that he would break down himself. He doesn't see himself higher than Sonic. So if Sonic can't do it, he thinks he can't do it either. For you to say that Tails reacted this way due to bad writing...I would disagree. I think the mixture of mediocre writing by the old writers and the decline of Tails (which was already declined before Forces) added more disappointment in his character. Causing such backlash. Fans simply just had enough. But does that mean Tails wouldn't have reacted that way if the old writers weren't writing? No. I think Tails would still have the same reaction. Just written better so Tails doesn't just seem like a complete boring, reduced, and pathetic character. I would think competent writers would do him more justice with the same concept. Cause I think him breaking down still makes sense to his character to some degree. I think him saying that he needs to go at it alone for while is his chance to grow on his own. Because in that way, he won't have anyone to fall on. Cause up to now, he may have handled some situations on his own- but at the end of the day, Tails had some support in some way that kept him going. Being that his idol and his friends pushed him mentally. But thinking your role model/best friend lost and died? That's gotta fuck you up. Contrast in Adventure 2, Sonic died from Tails' perspective and with Sonic telling him to save the world and carry on was a direct motivator. But that's unlike Forces. In Forces, Sonic got defeated while pleading to Tails for a plan/reading on Infinite's power. No "carry on" quotes. He just loses. No last words. He's gone. He failed because of Tails. In Tails' mind that is. So I think they were trying to explore this kind of deep writing...but it came off lame. That's all it is to it in my opinion. I think the whole "acknowledging the previous games bad writing" claim is a bit too dramatic. Forced by how fans feel strongly against it. Maybe it's just that they are building/clarifying on a concept that was poorly handled by bad writers. I wouldn't overthink that.
I feel how you distinguish between Forces and SA2 when Tails thinks Sonic is dead is a bit sparse. Tails would feel directly at fault for Sonic’s death in SA2 so would arguably have an even bigger reason to break down emotionally but he didn’t. I’m not sure Sonic asking him to carry on the fight would just remove that guilt or sadness. He reacted differently because he was written better. Tails had just as many friends counting on him in Forces as he did in SA2, yet he didn’t bother. They could have wrote him to have a breakdown and then redeem himself, but they didn’t. It just didn’t work for me personally. I respect if it did for you though.
@@AceCardGaming I never said that Forces way of writing worked for me. Nor am i saying that it is the peak for writing his character. I hate Forces' way of doing things. What I'm saying is, is that the circumstances of Sonic's "deaths" were different. That's a fact you can not dispute. Do you not remember when Tails said something along the lines of "this is the first time Sonic has ever asked me to do something for him" or something like that. The difference in the two games is more clear if you consider that Tails was directly motivated in making a stand right then and there. Tails literally says that and acts with peer determination in respect of Sonic's wishes. Forces wasn't even close to the same thing. Tails was "left" by Sonic with nothing in terms of direction that Sonic gave him. He was just..gone. That would cause two different reactions in a person. If someone you loved died in front of you; wouldn't you feel better if they said something in acceptance to what's going on and motivate you... Opposed to them dying and you hear nothing from them. Just a sudden end. Not knowing what they thought about you or what was going on. Two different things right? Doesn't matter how many people "depended" on him. The world got taken over by Eggman. Aint no way Tails was the only thing to save it. Evidently his lack of courage and the overwhelming force against him didn't make a difference. He did try to help. He just put himself down so much he didn't reach his full potential. So you can't say he didn't try to redeem himself either. Even still, just cause someone has the courage to do something once, doesn't mean they can do it again so easily. With the clear suddenness of Sonic's departure in Forces..that is something I can see would set Tails back. Being at fault AND loss of a direction. Not being sure of what is or isnt. The circumstances are different. That's my opinion. That's all. I'm not saying you're right or wrong. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong either. I don't know if the writers were thinking that deep. I don't really care. But since you have pretty much the same opinion as every other Sonic fan, I felt like addressing that criticism people share with you. To be fair on both sides.
@@misterholmes221 what about Tails In Unleashed where he flees from the Dark Gaia Monsters? Which camp are you in on that? The one who's against it, or the one who defends it?
@@obd9660 Nothing wrong with that. The writers didn't make him look that lame. He ran away because Tails isn't the fighter type lol. He's more of the observe and waiting type. He can fight. But he's not really a fighter.
Wow, I feel like what Ace said,was on point with how he described Tails here, I can feel it, what he's saying is right. Again, different opinions between fans, but, how Tails handled Sonic's "supposed" death in SA2, was way better than how he handled his defeat in Forces.
I would love to see Tails have his own spin off, where he goes to bring confidence within himself.. of course soon to return to the team of friends, or at the very least taking charge of something for a while..? Unsure, still be rather neat... However, I don't think the arc for tails is abandoned, I think they have no clue where to take tails and stalled him into nothing more then a filled plot device giver. Despite that, we still get to see in depth of his untapped potential. Truly even if people didn't even like mentioning his past self in order games? But since the new writers are in, it's important to bring up the pass of everything. From Adventure to Frontiers, This is nothing more then reinsurance we will be seeing more of Tails doing something.. then being a sidelined Character.
what i want : sonic frontiers leads to Tails FINALLY getting his own important 3d game ( in my opinion a gameplay similar to a ratchet & clank game would make sense for Tails ) . in that game tails would go on adventures of his own and he would help anyone in need ( the game wouldnt be made by sonic team but sega would outsource it to another team ) , and then he would meet a huge threat ( maybe infinite from sonic forces or speedy and the battle bird armada from Tails Adventure are back or maybe they create a new villain for tails ) and now that he is far away from sonic , tails now has to fight alone against a huge army and save innocent people and at the end after defeating the enemy Tails would 100% become the lovable hero from SA2 , i am imagining a crowd much bigger than the one from SA1 cheering tails for his heroic actions and tails would silently leave the crowd because he did it because he wanted to save people NOT for attention . or imagine rookie from sonic forces is there as well but without sonic he isnt confident enough to do his best but tails would teach him to believe in himself and they would save people together . or imagine tails inventing a battle suit like iron man or samus aran and do all the cool things you could imagine for that . and then there would be a little time skip and show sonic fighting eggman but this time his robots are a too much for him but when it seems sonic is losing the battle , tails in his robotic suit would come and destroy one of the eggman robots and then he would approach sonic . sonic would say : " thanks... who are you? " then tails would take off his helmet and say : " i told you you wouldnt recognize me next time we meet " and sonic would smile and say : " welcome back brother... ready to destroy eggmans robots together ? " and tails would say as long as you are " then they would run to the remaining robots and we would see a very cool one shot of sonic and tails and then credits roll what i expect : tails would just be next to sonic in the next game and he would talk about the adventures he had while he was away from sonic , adventures that happened but we never saw because sega will never make a game about anyone other than sonic , and tails would just be an additional playable character and maybe the only tails exclusive media we would get is a few comic issues .
@@rickyrackey7930 i would like to think its happening alongside the next sonic game and the chaos emeralds are used there , i feel if the chaos emeralds are involved both eggman and sonic would find their way into the game , i think we could focus on tails better if there is no involvement of chaos emeralds and sonic and eggman . and going 100% fanfiction mode , i would love to see a super form for tails in frontiers dlc and then in the tails games that we would never get , instead of a super form , tails would go full on iron man mode 😅
Clearly this show the genius of Ian Flynn as a writer. Erasing all the bad and starting over is a thing, but keeping the bad and use it as a part of the characters' development properly asks for real talent.
Not sure if I would call it genuis as he cheery picked the bad things he acknlowedged, was not even attempting to give a good reason for Tails sudden shifts but just have Tails call him self inconsistant, ignoring all the times in recent past were Tails wasn't a coward like Colors and Lost world and made the big resolution based on the idea that Tails spends to much time with Sonic when SA1 enstablished and many games after it like Heroes and Unleashed further showed that Tails spends most of his free time on his own as Sonic is off adventuring.
While I give Flynn credit for at least not making the other characters into jokes, or cowards, but thats the bare minimum you'd expect. And given the past decade I think we could do with a bit more than the bare minimum to elevate the characters than saying, "its a good building block for the next game!" Screw the next game! What about the here and now! I feel Tails is a key example of this, doing the bare minimum, especially when compared to another story that came out just before Frontiers, Sonic and Tails R. Which covered the crisis of confidence angle he was suffering. Frontiers: Tails worried about being a burden to Sonic and complains about the past decade and how he's stuck on the sidelines, only for it to go nowhere as it ends with him basically saying, "I just needed to vent." Also considering the cyber corruption was nothing more than a poor man's Sonic 06, with less steps and and even less gameplay, as his big moment sees him back on the sidelines again - if he ever left them to begin with - was it really that impressive of a feat? If Sonic was actually looking to attack his friends, or was a boss fight as they tried to get the Chaos Emeralds, there might be something to shout about. Sonic And Tails R: Tails is worried he's slowing Sonic down. Only in it, rather than having the fox cub complain about being stuck on the sidelines for the past sixteen years and counting, they actually let Tails do things and show he can be counted by Sonic, allowing this plot point to meet a conclusion that feels earned. Is it official. No. But who cares, still miles better than what Frontiers did. I know he will be playable in a year's time, but I really do think he could have done with be playable out the gate and the story might have been abit more of him, and everyone else, standing on the sidelines doing an awful lot of nothing. So much so when Sonic's overcome by the cyber corruption, all he does is stand around and do nothing, but I guess at least the game is being quite on brand to itself.
@@liamphibia to get a Knuckles who wants to be like Sonic, by taking up travelling, even though he already travelled with Sonic, while in the Japanese version of the Frontiers he expressed a desire to find out the origins of his tribe. And Amy who acts more Mr. Burns, doped up on painkillers, as she declares "I bring you love!" Even though she was already doing this in previous games, she her allowing Gama to have a face turn in SA1. And in the Japanese version of Frontiers, expresses a desire to better herself, and becoming a charming lady, like what she said she was looking to do in SA1. No thanks. Plus Flynn's stories go where, with characters standing about doing nothing, even in the moments they should be doing something, like surely cyber corrupted Sonic should have done more than stand there. Secret Rings better pay off with the plot point of Sonic being inflicted with something that was killing him - with the flaming arrow making its way to to his heart - than the cyber corruption from Frontiers, which felt more like something out of the Meta Era with how quickly it was resolved.
@@DemonDethchase I feel the Japanese dialogue writes Amy's change better, but it still comes off more like it was written to appeal to fans than genuine development. Regardless I'm waiting to see how the next game handles this.
@@rickyrackey7930 I'll say it is better the stories from the Meta Era, but when the bar is very low and you only really have to do the bare minimum is it really anything to shout from the rooftops about? Because again, drawing comparisons to Secret Rings' story and Frontiers and how it handles scenes, because again, shared countdown on Sonic's life thanks to an infliction he's contracted Frontiers: While Sonic's friends are free, Sonic finally succumbs to the cyber corruption. The End declares its presence, but in order for Sonic's friends to bring the blue hedgehog back they join hands and through the Power of Friendship Sonic is back to normal. Almost as if nothing happened. Secret Rings: Sonic gathers all seven world rings just in the nick of time as the flaming arrow - which was meant for Shahra - draws ever closer to his heart, and so looks to confront Erazor Djinn, the one who gifted this infliction. Upon gain the seven World Rings, the genie declares, in order to claim ultimate power, a sacrifice must be made. And thus he chooses Sonic to be that sacrifice, and looks to kill the blue hedgehog. But before that can happen, Shahra throws herself in the way of the evil genie's attack to protect Sonic, and as Sonic wishes her to not die, she says that was a wish she couldn't grant before dying in his arms. All seemed lost, but then Sonic draws the World Rings of Rage, Sadness and Hatred and turns into Darkspine Sonic to take down Djinn before looking to set things back to right, through the three wishes that the blue hedgehog had won. Where was something like that, in Frontiers?
Tails' theme song "Believe in Myself" from SA2 is finally seeming to take root. Splitting up from Sonic to further mature and improve on his own while keeping in mind he may need help on occassion.
Frontiers quote from Tails: "Then I'm wildly inconsistent!" Me: "Yes, you have been Tails but that's not your fault, it's YOUR FAULT!" **angrily points at SEGA and all of the writers that have messed with his character over the years**
I would argue that Sonic Heroes kept the whole thing SA-SA2 of Tails being an equal, like pariah made a great comment about this because Tails while still innocent is still extremely helpful. Hell Sonic even said that if Tails hadn't been there, he might not have made it though.
Sonic is Kamina and Tails is Simon, Here's hoping Tails learns to have faith in the Tails that believes in himself and become the drill that pierces the heavens.
Is it weird that I actually liked Baldy Nosehair? Like, I mean, at first. It was a good joke that these alien creatures took one look at Eggman and immediately came up with such a disrespectful, immature sounding name for him, and the way Tails so casually seemed to mention it, and Sonic's reaction.. I don't know, it was a pretty neat joke. Nothing special or amazing, but I liked it. Too bad that single joke was the only continuity the Meta era had between games, and every time they used it it became drastically less funny and significantly more grating to hear, but it WAS funny the first time.
Sonic fans: *Why is Tails so inconsistent?!*
Frontiers: *The Fox admits*
Sonic fans: *Understandable*
We are all inconsistent.
@@rickyrackey7930
Sad but true; sad because a lot of people can't understand and forgive when and why someone does something inconsistent.
@@GawainW
“People make mistakes and so can fictional characters. It happens.”
-Diamondbolt
There is humanly inconsistent, and then there’s just bad writing. And I know which one of those problems the Meta era had.
why is he so annoying
I feel like putting Tails on Chaos Island was an intentional decision. It’s very fitting to name a place of moving forwards in life after your biggest failure.
Wha? Adventure was one of his best showings.
@@aidanhammans9337 I think he meant the Forces scene where he yells "Sonic help me" after seeing illusion of Chaos 0.
I’m talking about the universally scorned scene from Forces.
tails was never a good character
@thedarkknight2424That would be the best game of all time
Using all of Tails inconsistencies and even his lowest point with Infinite as a springboard to push him back to who he was in the Adventure era is absolutely genius writing and I have nothing but respect for Ian Flynn doing this.
Also, Tails just being allowed to reference past events at all was kind of a shock to me in and of itself. Just like... We're allowed to know past games exist and are relevant to this game in some way? What???
Imagine if Infinite returns and is defeated by not Sonic, but Tails who gains a super form in the process. SSJ2 Gohan vibes?
@@rickyrackey7930 That sounds amazing.
@@AlastorNahIdWinRadioDemon Infinite is the perfect final boss for Tails because he’s the one who damaged his reputation.
@@rickyrackey7930tails has a hyper form, not a super form.
@@crimsonzone8984 it's called Super Tails in game.
I genuinely loved every moment with tails in this game.
In what game?
@@shockhedgehog4771 Sonic Frontiers! :D
I love tails in any game like generations and I want to see a video about amy in the games ace card gaming!
@@shockhedgehog4771all
i hated it
Amy and Tails are my favorite characters and to see this game address Tails flaws and actually want him to learn from them is a great move on their part. He really felt like his Adventure self, he was knowledgeable, but he wasn't solely defined by techno babble and had an arc about gaining confidence. I really hope this part of his character sticks in the next game and Frontiers DLC.
How long are we going to wait until the DLC comes? I'm very excited!
@@liamphibia it's the end of this year
Blatant fanservice.
@@bakedbeans5494 Do you know when to stop?
@@bakedbeans5494 Okay now you are just being embarrassing.
The funniest part of that lost world scene is that the propeller was never hit, the wing got shot
th-cam.com/video/Jiupj4PyL4U/w-d-xo.html
(Confused Screaming)
Glad to see I’m not the only one who saw that as a plot hole.
As good as the improvement of Tails is nothing in Frontiers can compare to a single line from Tails in that goofy Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog cartoon when it comes to how close he and Sonic are. "You're my mom, dad, and white picket fence."
For such a goofy series, that Episode definitely tugged on the old heart strings!
What i love about Frontiers is that when the other characters are expressing how they feel, insecurities and fears, to Sonic and Sonic reminding them how awesome they are, they repay that kindness and help him escape from his corrupted state.
I really liked Tails in Sonic Frontiers, and I'm quite satisfied that the writing acknowledges that he has been pretty inconsistent. I could be really wrong about this though, but didn't we kind of see that he was the fox with a plan in his two game gear spin-off games, Tails' Adventure and Tails Skypatrol? Whether or not these games would be considered canon (I'm pretty sure they are considering some elements of both of these games were shown in his 30th anniversary comic), but I like to think that he was more than capable of being a hero as shown in these games, even way before his story in both SA1 and SA2. Even if I am wrong, it felt weird to not have him be somewhat capable of handling tough situations on his own in games like Lost World and Forces, and these games had really good setups to show it too.
Here’s my idea. Infinite returns more powerful than ever and beats Super Sonic with ease. Bashing the emeralds out of him the same way Knuckles did in Sonic 3. Infinite would threaten Tails to hand over the emeralds to him or he will die. Tails instead absorbs the power of the emeralds and becomes Super Tails, who gives Infinite the worst beating of his life. Smashing his mask to pieces in the process.
Frontiers was the first time since Shadow The Hedgehog (I love what that game did with him) where Tails felt like Tails to me.
Yeah Tails felt the most normal out of that whole game, plus I kinda loved him getting to interact with Shadow one on one and wish it would happen more frequently.
@@Cloud-dt6xb Shadow the hedgehog had a lot of neat interactions with shadow and you could play as most characters following you around by doing what you do in sonic 2 by plugging a second controller in. This includes playable maria.
What tails is more than willing to do.
-Help sonic fining chaos emeralds.
-escort anyone like he usually carries sonic in emergencies.
- He is capable of combat related to firng projectiles with and without mech if he is armed.
-His scientific mind quickly figure things out the fastest, so allowing other members to realized quicker.
He will grow, he will be independent at his own will and whim.
He will be playable, along with knuckles and Amy.
I think Tails being the one to take the lead on saving Sonic from the corruption at the end of the game shows that he's always been stronger then he thinks he is. He does have the strength and will to be a hero, it was just buried under self doubt and only seeing himself as the sidekick for so long. Tails's experience on the Starfall Islands broke his perceptoin of Sonic being the one who always saves the day completely, it forced him to realize that his best friend has limits to and sometimes he needs to step up when nobody else can.
Now imagine if He defeats a powerful villain by going super to conclude his character arc.
@@rickyrackey7930 A super form that makes him look like a nine tailed fox would be fitting.
@@ScorbunGame Nah that will be his hyper form. I imagine having him rocking the SSJ2 Gohan hair. The same way Sonic had SSJ Goku’s hair.
Glad that Tails is getting revived through the movies and Frontiers.
I love how cunning tails acted in this game, it made me happy they're finally fixing him!
Love the character growth of tails in frontiers, hopefully we can get more awesome adventures with him on his own
You just really gotta love that frontiers is about the og characters growing up to become more greater than their classic selves😊
You know, it's kind of a genius move to have Tails, Knuckles, Amy and Eggman trapped in Cyberspace if you're looking for character development. Lots of people don't get a chance to self-reflect on their past, their actions and their future, even when they do have downtime.
Being alone, truly alone, with no distractions and nothing but your thoughts for like 24 hours, how would you emerge from that on the other side?
I agree with what you said about Tails, he needs this for himself and I know that this can help him become a better character overtime. I believe in him and I know that with Ian flin doing the writing this will be great. I just hope people don't mess it up because Talls deserves to grow like he did in adventure.
I am so glad you discussed the relatively easy to miss optional conversation about Tails' experience in cyberspace. Tails' "burden" conversation is really important, but this optional conversation shows Flynn's ability to take the piss-poor writing from his predecessors (*cough*bollerspenders*cough*) and use them to frame character growth.
I like to envision the conversation with the duplicate as being a bit more extended about that, and Tails is even forced to witness his younger self both in his Adventure years when he could still kick ass and then get slapped in the face with... well, his absolutely horrible moment in Forces.
Part of it was even part of an unpublished fanfiction concept I wrote myself where Tails meets with Amy in a city that didn't fall to Eggman yet, and resulted in a harsh falling out between Tails and Amy, Tails choosing not to side with the Resistance, and leaving with only the designs for the Wispons as all Amy got out of the conversation. This was how I wanted to also explore the idea of the throwaway "Tails has lost it" line Silver gives in the game. The idea being that Amy, rather than tell the Resistance the truth about Tails actively sitting out the war, sets up a narrative about a nervous breakdown instead.
I can guarantee just in that one scene I put about 10,000,000% more thought into Tails' character than Pontac and Graff did in ten years of writing Sonic games. Granted, whenever I write or RP Tails, he tends to be a bit more mature than normal, maybe a bit closer to his Adventure personality, but with a little more battle scars added to it. A version of Tails who realistically went through the trauma of Sonic Colors and Sonic Lost World.
I never did 100% think of a great way to answer why Tails would be terrified of Chaos 0 of all things, though, aside from maybe there actually being a nervous breakdown later. The fanfic concept does heavily imply that the Tails double was emphasizing that Tails had fallen from his potential and he had to confront it.
I'm just gonna let you right now: I was not expecting to like this video. But you tackled this amazingly. The genre I'd like to see in a "Tails" game is whatever Ratchet & Clank was, but instead of buying equipment you have to make it with materials collected. I've been tossing this idea around for years haha
Why weren't you expecting to like this video?
Hearing all this not only makes me relief with how they're handling the casts, but also gives me a spark of interest as to if Sonic team might give Tails his own chance to shine with his own game as well. It felt like how Pokémon had ash the main character for over 30 years and then they decided to let Ash to grow up and give a new cast of characters their own spotlight. what if we get a similar treatment with Sonic's friends? Like say bring in the IDW characters into the game or rework older characters like the freedom fighters or someone new? there is so many possible outcomes to what they would do next.
Sonic Team can't write characters.
I think he’s talking about Ian Flynn.
Knowing there is DLC with Amy, Knuckles, and Tails on the way I'm really hoping they let Ian Flynn and his team write the games from now on, there is a great deal of potential in the sonic series for an amazing Sonic Adventure 3 proven by the IDW series thus far that could answer a lot of old and new questions, like do we even have a cannon map of sonics world? Are there still humans around? there is so much to answer yet i feel like its going to take 10 more years to even have a chance of getting to that point, i love how the characters are maturing and i want it to continue i just hope the gameplay of future games can match the story.
Well hopefully the upcoming DLC of Frontiers that involves a new story and playable characters will show more of Tails and the other characters sides of the stories
I’m wondering will it be “End of the World” style levels like we seen in 06. Covering Amy, Knuckles and Tails in Cyber space after they save Sonic from the corruption. Will be interesting to see!
@@AceCardGaming My best guest is that Tails will use his namesake to form a drill as an attack.
@@rickyrackey7930 Maybe! Plenty of moveset options available with those things!
@@AceCardGaming
Remember when they were tough enough to bend solid steel, in Sonic Adventure?
Tails is a wonderful character and I like his part in frontiers so I hope to see amy's part in frontiers ace card gaming!
I’m hoping to cover Amy too!
I was worried before the game release even in the marketing sense of things... cause they were hiding tails so much, after playing though it I can see why the did it... and it touched me in the heart
Excellent analysis as always. Things are finally looking promising for a lot of characters! Can't wait for your next video!
Spinoff or no, I just want Tails to fight Witchcart and her cronies again in a modern setting. If Tails is going on his own adventures without Sonic's help he deserves his own set of villains.
Or, how about the time he fought an entire army of Kukkus and sent their giant flying warship hurtling into the ocean?
(By the way, the Japanese market says Tails Adventures is a prequel to Sonic 2. I believe this is what Tails refers to in the famous quote from Sonic Adventure: “I’ve changed a lot since I’ve started hanging with Sonic…”.)
Writers acknowledging the past games is important, because we can’t move on until the writers confront the problem and confirm that they’re going to do better. If they never did that, we wouldn’t know if Tails would just get retconed again next game.
Out of character moments should be ignored.
@@bakedbeans5494 if you ignore the mistakes of past installments, you end up with garbage like the Star Wars Sequels. If it’s one or two moments, then that’s one thing. But when it’s been going on for a decade… that’s not out of character anymore, it’s just a character who got taken in a crappy direction. They have to acknowledge that before they can move past it.
Tails facing his demons with a bit of pep talk from the blue blur was probably one of the best things to witness in Frontiers. Mentioning the games from the past added onto it, as well as calling out his own inconsistencies when Sonic shut his argument down of being sidelined or useless. And hearing him go on his own to be his own hero really brought me hope for the future of Sonic The Hedhehog
If it was me at Sega and it was up to me all the characters by the end of their journey in frontiers want to go on their own ventures I would seriously take this opportunity to give them solo titles. Oh yes it's been so long I'd love a 3D tails and knuckles, and even Amy she wants to share the love with the world. Make a villain for her that feels like love is cruel there you go.
I love the title of the video, because Tails personality has been dead for years, now he's coming back.
Wikipedia said that Sonic Prime is (unlike every other Sonic TV show) canon to the main series like IDW. I wonder if Frontiers was after Prime since Sonic became an inspiring figure in Frontiers from his time in the Shatterverse in Prime.
I love how Frontiers took the most contentious part of Forces with Tails cowering and turned it into a character arc after the fact. It was such an out of pocket scene for him that you'd think they'd just ignore it. But taking that moment and having Tails be just as frustrated as the fans were at himself for falling apart so easily while having Sonic explain what the fans said that Tails has done far more to show he's brave and competent was brilliant. It not only addresses the issue head on and makes an effort to fix it, that scene is also cathartic for the fans to have the game recognize exactly why they were frustrated instead of just ignoring it.
This is why Ian Flynn is the best Sonic Writer, pretty much of all time. Sure, a good writer, even Flynn himself could have just quietly ignored Tails' shameful downslide into a terrible character... but he basically did in Frontiers what he did when he was put in charge of the Archie comic: He actually FIXED the damage, rather than just swept it under the rug.
8:17 Running from the past is a losing game, it never brings you glory
I like how the Cyberspace and the state of the Koco really does stay as a big theme through the whole game, this feels like a first game before new heights. That for the characters to reach those new heights, they should not feel binded from themselves. Sonic is always moving in and out of cyberspace because he's not a character that struggles with that until his short downfall of feeling like he has to do things by himself. His friends allow him to move on and he helps his friends and Koco do that too.
Lol you had me in tears when you said they demoted tails from a hero into technical support 😂
I have an interesting idea for a playable Tails segment in the next mainline game:
"The city is attacked by Eggman (or a new villain who knows), so sonic goes hand-to-hand with him while we as tails are saving the civilians from danger"
Yoo I haven't watched this Channel in quite a bit. Thanks youtube for finally reccomending ACG again lmao.
You can always sub and hit the bell! 😉 Hope you enjoy the video!
Same lol
Tails has come a long way since his debut in 1992. Throughout most of the series, he has been viewed as Sonic’s sidekick or his right hand man whenever the situation requires a little more support, either physical or mental. When he started out on his own along the way, he started to see what Sonic saw in him: a bright boy who just wants to do great things and above all, follow his example of being a fighter with a heart of gold. The forms of media I have seen such things were in Sonic X, the IDW comics, Sonic and Tails R and of course, Sonic Frontiers. It’s normal that he’s still unsure of himself by the occasions when he falls back because underneath that intellectual exterior, he’s still a child that needs guidance and given how his upbringing was, Tails is very fortunate to have someone who will give him the push into the right direction and be surrounded by those who love and care about him. As long as he has them in his heart, he’ll never lose his way and rise up to be the hero of his own story. 💛🦊
I really feel like they're starting to get stuff together now 🤩
We just need a few more years to see a few more games to be sure ☹️ MAN I'M TIRED OF WAITING WHY DOES VIDEO GAMES TAKE SO LONG ( as long as everything gets fixed then I'm okay )
I just want the characters to continue to grow, just like they were supposed to after Adventure 2.
Yea I say that he was right in his deleted Tails video. Sega had plans to grow Tails as a hero! He was even considered a 3D spin off game as well as Knuckles and Eggman but guessing never happened because Naka got fired.
Evidence is that Shadow grew as a hero in his game by making his own choices instead of Maria or Gerald’s. Imagine what they had planned for Tails!
Honestly Tails character arc in Sonic x season 3 was probably similar to what what they had planned for Tails.
Sadly though doubt that was meant to be cannon.
when shadow's own game and 06 is the peak of shadow's character you know it's dissapointing and sad.
OMG I want a full blown tails adventure 2 with a full own metroid like campaign
Hm, fair and valid points and opinions, i can agree with what you said here, I really hope this gets followed up upon.
Also, i appreciate the references.
Listening to this analysis of Tails character from the past few years and his characterization in Frontiers makes me think that someone took a listen to Tails’ theme song from the adventure games when trying to write his character for this game.
“This is not simply my way. My own style. Gotta get a hold of my life.”
“If I just follow you, I will never see the light.”
I think that’s a good thing having Tails be reminded of how much he’s grown and how he’ll continue to grow.
I think the thing that we have to remember is that poor portrayals of Tails as well as him being unfairly sidelined is sadly nothing new.
When Sonic 2 first came out I honestly felt like I was the only kid who actually liked Tails, as everyone else was always quick to select Sonic Alone in the options menu. And it wasn't just a gameplay thing either, I distinctly remember other kids saying things like "Oh, Tails just sucks! Nobody likes him! Even Sonic hates his guts! He's so much better without crappy ol' Tails!" And whenever I would stand up for him and talk about why I liked him and why I thought that he was cool, all I'd get was "Nope! You're wrong! Nothing cool or good about him whatsoever! He just sucks!"
I remember reading Sonic the Comic and just hating how Sonic was portrayed as being such a prick, particularly to Tails for some reason. Always calling him hurtful names like "Pixel Brain" and constantly putting him down and calling him things like useless. It just made me think that the writers of that comic may have had a similar attitude towards Tails as my friends had; like they couldn't stand him either and were just venting their thoughts towards him through Sonic. It's the same with the SATAM series, in that it felt like the writers were sidelining him every chance that they could. "Off to beddy byes now Tails! We'll read you a bedtime story and then we, the grownups, can go and save the world! But you can't come!!!!" Heck, even in Sonic X it felt like he wasn't really being used to his full potential. His main role was just the pilot who flew everyone around in his big plane.
People love to blame Pontac and Graff and the so called "meta era" for the downfall of Tails' character, but I can't help but think that they likely saw these portrayals of the character and just thought "oh, so that's all he is! Annoying and useless! Let's just do that but exaggerate it!" And even worse, the people at Sega approved these! Likely because they're constantly listening to the "story doesn't matter in a Sonic game" crowd.
Tails' portrayal in Frontiers is such a breath of fresh air compared to what we've had in the past, but it feels like they're still playing it safe. "We'll fix his personality, but he still can't be playable!" Even with this new Frontiers DLC that's coming out, I'm worried that it'll just be a lazy reskin of Sonic with a half-arsed story tacked on similar to Shadow's DLC in Forces. And if it doesn't work out and people go right back into their "Sonic's stinky friends" rants, there's every chance that Sega will panic and go "Right! You heard 'em, boys! They hate Sonic's stupid friends! Back on the NPC pile with you! Gotta keep the haters happy! We better bring back Classic Sonic or they'll never trust us ever again!" *FACEPALM*
They need to just ingore the sonic only fans
@@tailsprowerfan2729 That's what I've been saying for years. The problem is that, for the longest time, Sega seemed to have no interest in listening to actual positive and constructive criticisms. The only people that they'd listen to are the people who go "WAAAHH, DON'T LIKE IT, GET RID OF IT OR I'M NEVER PLAYING ANOTHER SONIC GAME EVER AGAIN REEEEE!"
Amy is gonna be a tough analysis video to make on, since she doesn’t even go through an arc like Knuckles and Tails. What would you even analyze her on? I hope Update 3 does this, but I severely doubt it, due to SEGA being SEGA.
Great video! Feels like a long time lol. Will there be an analyze of Blaze as well? 👀
Just a matter of when. 🙂
Fantastic video-essay as always!
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it. 🙂
1:13 My response to Lost World Tails best spoken by a certain potions professor:
“Tell me, are you incapable of restraining yourself, or do you take pride in being an insufferable know-it-all?”
I feel like Sonic himself will eventually get his own Frontiers video.
I'm guessing Amy will be in your next character analysis video. I hope you do her justice. There are people who claim that Frontiers made her boing. All because she wasn't her usually bubbly self when she was a cyber ghost. But said people ignore what Sonic's friends were going through when it comes to Amy. And they also ignore that she was back to her high-spirited self once she was freed from cyberspace for good.
Even now, I'm sure someone will respond "Frontiers DID make Amy boring." That aside, I hope you point out that Amy's attraction to Sonic doesn't make her weak-minded. Just like Sonic's other friends, her character can be handled well or mishandled, depending on the writers. IDW proved that Amy can kick ass without sacrificing her affection for Sonic.
Thank you!
@@rickyrackey7930 No problem.
I mean I did miss Amy being more energatic but this really isn't my main issue with her in Frontiers at all.
That would go to the same issue I have with Tails in Frontiers. And that is the very Meta view on there releashionship with Sonic.
Frontiers goes off the very Meta perception that they spend all of there time with Sonic(because they are always together in the games we get to play) and therefor concludes that they need to distance them self from Sonic for at least a while to grow into there own.
This however doesn't make sense as its been enstablished since at least SA1 that Tails and Amy spend most of there time without Sonic as he is always on the run for new adventures. Its why "long time no see" is one of the most overused phrases in the series because its true the nature of Sonic means he won't actually spend a lot of his time with them.
So things like Amy being sad about properly not seeing Sonic for a good long while because to make her want to bring love to the world reality needing her to be away from Sonic for long periods of times end up being illogical as Amy has no reason to be dramatic about it its already how her and Sonic have always been in-universe.
@@rynobehnke8289 Well, we're getting their point of view. From their perspective, they need some distance from Sonic. Or in Knuckles' case, he's finally exploring the world on his accord.
Amy watched at least three Koco pass on. One of them she bonded with and sympathized with. It's true that Sonic will set out for his next adventure, right after finishing one. But now, it's his friends following his example. And Sonic is supporting their decisions.
@@BlackFlash09
But that 's the issues "There point of view" isn't actually theirs its Ian Flynns from the Meta perspective of "they always are together in those games" when they always introduce each other by "long time no see" because not seeing each others for long time is the most casual thing in the world. Sonic Battle is to this day the only story were the group stayed together for a extended period of time and that was mostly to raise Emerl. The moment he died would this have ended.
And sure Amy watches 3 Koco's die but now were Ian crowbared his comics into continuity did Amy as off there visit to Echo Base in the Comics see dozens of people die on the battle fields during Forces (as if the disaster of "Operation Big wave" wouldn't already be prove enough) so while death is shocking is this a Amy that already has gone throw 2 Global wars (never forget she was part of the strick force that attacked the Black Comet in Shadow's game too) and thought for months Sonic was dead during one of them.
She shouldn't be this soft anymore.
Also didn't Amy's story in SA1 end on the exact same sentiment anyway?
In general do Amy and Tails at the end of Forces like they were back at the end of there stories in SA1 again with Amy being slightly toned down.
Think Tail will be just FINE...😉😊
ACE
It means nothing. He's been reset, that's all. They put down the shovel but denied him a ladder.
I hope tails finally gets his degrees so he can open up a start up company
Maybe I really like Eggman as a Villain, that was somehow a bit more interessting to me, but this was good too.
I always change my favourite characters, but I know that in most chases I enjoyed Amy a bit less and probably favour Team Dark a bit.
The problem with acknowledging Forces handling of Tails is that it was so wildly out of character for him to "lose it" to the point where he can't just be considered a moment of weakness for him, its just outright ignoring prior development of his character. This isn't the first time Sonic was assumed dead by Tails, and he faced the danger head on. So contextualizing Tails' character in Forces as him being "wildly inconsistent" at its worst will just serve to shield future games from criticism where he falls back into being a coward. The issue with choosing to acknowledge poor writing rather than ignore it is that in a long running series like Sonic it will inevitably mean constant relapses in character and then retreading the same development over and over again. I would have much rather Ian not tried to rationalize Tails' character in Forces and just moved past it because it honestly only makes Tails' character worse because now he's set up as someone with a weak resolve who is just going to retread his Adventure era development before possibly just reverting to his old self should Sonic Team or whatever writer is doing the story at the time choose to go that way.
I mean, worst case scenario, your fears may well be justified. But ideally, any growth Tails experiences from now on could be used to ensure that sort of lapse in characterisation never happens again. It just remains to be seen which will happen.
I feel like maybe a roguelike dungeon crawler thing could work with Tails, heck maybe even a Metroidvania, or maybe a puzzle game... Tails seems quite versatile
I love that tails is getting more development and growing up he seriously needed it badly. Loving Frontiers hope there’s more 😎
What development ? Saying outloud he's inconsistent is not "growing up", it's an admission of desperation.
I feel like Sonic is a bit like a parent watching their child grow up old enough to leave the house, he is a bit saddened by this but at the same time extremely proud of him.
Sonic Heroes was a good game, and Tails was great in that game. Just my opinion.
I still don't know how I feel of the notion that Tails needs to be away from Sonic to grow but I'm willing to wait to see where they go first. If we can get some awesome stuff with him then it'll be worth it, but I don't want them changing Tails's core personaility. The sweet happy kid who geeks out about techonolgy is why we loved him in the first place after all, but I was very happy with what we got in Frontiers it felt so refreshing for the games side of things.
He thinks he's Dick Grayson.
I love the fact that Tails talks about his cowardness in sonic forces like the people who wrote sonic frontiers have to clean up the mistakes of the sonic forces writers
By making more mistakes. Nobody needed Tails to pretty much confirm that the presence of Infinite scared him.
@@bakedbeans5494 Ok
@@bakedbeans5494 we get it, you like forces.
@@Number1Tailsfan Typical Ian Flynn fan excuse.
@@bakedbeans5494 Typical Pontac and Graff fan excuse.
I love tails and this's a great video about him so I hope that's not too late to comment! ❤👍🦊😁
Never too late Mayra 🙂
I hope his time away becomes a game
I just realized that when Tails said he wanted to go on his own and grow, that might be what Update 3 is...
I agree Tails SA1 and SA2 were peak and frontiers saved him IMO he’s more than just a tech or guy in the chair this dude is fast and smart as eggman he should be a hero and equal to
All this tails wanting to do things himself could be foreshadowing a new game
Between the Mega Drive era and the GBA era was Tails my favourite character of the fandom. I was shocked to see what happened to him after 06. He became more like B-Movie sidekick to a
AAA-Hero. Or sometimes he even acts like a Kindergarten-child. It is said that Tails is equal to Robotnik because of the I.Q. I have sometimes thought: If Sega has no ideas with Tails, than make him to Robotniks Partner for world domination. Better that a good guy becomes a villian than just to be a side note because he has to be. But Tails appearance in Frontiers made him more mature and also the Tails i once loved. I hope Sega will develop him more and this was not a one-hit-wonder.
Another great video! But I'll have to disagree with something here, one specific thing. I like the Miles Electric, please let him keep it. He can't do his tech magic without a piece of tech and the fact he has his own custom built one is cool to me.
wondering if the next video gonna be about Sonic? I can't really see a WHOLE video done on Amy's portrayal since, all things concidered, her character hasn't really been let shine in the game in favor of prolonging the "we dont know whats going on and we're moody" vibe in the first section of the game
No I agree with this video I want that thing gone it makes it way too easy for Sega to rely on it as a crutch and it prevents Tails from actually showing how smart he really is. Compare anytime he uses that thing to Frontiers where he's able to solve mystery's of the island just by looking around and it's like night and day. He's meant to have an iq that's even better than Eggman's and the miles electric really robbed us of seeing that from him.
@@Cloud-dt6xb what i mean is not have it used that way, i see it as a problem sseperate from the miles electric. the reason why is how its portrayed in the comic andmost recently scrapnik island, its a portable computer of his so he uses it to make something in it that can help and it generally is a device that helps him get data, but tails and the ithers still have to do all the thinking
it CAN and SHOULD work as a cool tool and not a magic can-do-anything gizmo, and thats exactly why i do not want it gone
same goes for orbot and cubot, in games they could be annoying and seen as pointless, but ive seen enough other official material with them to know they can be done super well and in a way that makes me LOVE them even more. legit the geobots are some of my fav characters. (thothat mightalso be because i have an extremely LARGE pool of favourites)
honestly, I liked the attempts at humor in Sonic games.... but I do feel there should be a good balance for the series between that and serious character growth..... I mean its possible, Borderlands does it after all. As for the "Baldy Mc. Nosehair" joke... I feel it would have landed better if it was an actual funny name, or even a refrence to another franchise..... like instead of "Baldy Mc. Nosehair" how bout "Zar Baldy Bald the lard" a Bobobo reference (both sorta hated and loved that anime...)
as for Mile's "journey" I would like an FPS or 3rd person shooter style game as a modern tails game.... it would fit super well I mean he makes mechs..... he could do something like the Cyclone v2, or an entirely new thing that's like a hover tank, or w/e..... then combine that with on foot sections which arn't speed, but something different... perhaps stealth? I dunno... just don't want a Tails game that's just "its Sonic, but he can fly!"
Ace:annoying brat
Tails:i have a god dang gun
Maybe when Tails and Sonic reunite, it'll be a similar scene to when Ariel and Flounder reunited in Little Mermaid: Return To The Sea, with Sonic being all like "You're sure not a scaredy cat anymore!" or "You're sure not my LITTLE bro anymore!" What do you think?
A good writer retcons bad writing an amazing writer uses bad writing to springboard themselves and tell greater stories using said bad writing and making it potential for storytelling and character growth along with lore building.
Saying outloud "Then I'm inconsistent" is not amazing, it's one of the laziest and most pathetic cop-outs possible. This is straight up delusional rambling.
@@yrooxrksvi7142 all comics books are bad now.
@@_Tzer Given the state of modern western comics, that's not a far-fetched assessment
@@yrooxrksvi7142 Im saying if you wanna make something truly good you can use bad material to turn it into something good as there is no bad ideas only truly shitty executions.
Idk why I find Baldy Nosehairs funny now 😂.
Damn it! Why did you have to use the PS1 console startup jingle?! 🤯😭😌
Perfect mind blown theme! 😁
Yeah what if we got a tails spin off since he says he has gotta go his own ways for a bit
I hope to hell that whoever fixed tails can fix shadow.
Like Sonic Adventure (&2) w/ the mechanic in some levels.
Il Hope tails finally became back the tails he was in adventure stop stop begin to cry like the moment when choas attack him in sonic force when he try to fix omega and become a hero
Cool video. Good points. But I think your reason on why Tails mentioning Forces' Tails behavior is a bit forced. I can see the perspective of it being a nod to the mishandling of the character. But I don't think that Forces portrayed Tails in a completely wrong manner. Tails is a child who has Sonic as a role model. If his role model is beaten in front of him- it makes sense that he would break down himself. He doesn't see himself higher than Sonic. So if Sonic can't do it, he thinks he can't do it either. For you to say that Tails reacted this way due to bad writing...I would disagree. I think the mixture of mediocre writing by the old writers and the decline of Tails (which was already declined before Forces) added more disappointment in his character. Causing such backlash. Fans simply just had enough. But does that mean Tails wouldn't have reacted that way if the old writers weren't writing? No. I think Tails would still have the same reaction. Just written better so Tails doesn't just seem like a complete boring, reduced, and pathetic character. I would think competent writers would do him more justice with the same concept. Cause I think him breaking down still makes sense to his character to some degree. I think him saying that he needs to go at it alone for while is his chance to grow on his own. Because in that way, he won't have anyone to fall on. Cause up to now, he may have handled some situations on his own- but at the end of the day, Tails had some support in some way that kept him going. Being that his idol and his friends pushed him mentally. But thinking your role model/best friend lost and died? That's gotta fuck you up. Contrast in Adventure 2, Sonic died from Tails' perspective and with Sonic telling him to save the world and carry on was a direct motivator. But that's unlike Forces. In Forces, Sonic got defeated while pleading to Tails for a plan/reading on Infinite's power. No "carry on" quotes. He just loses. No last words. He's gone. He failed because of Tails. In Tails' mind that is. So I think they were trying to explore this kind of deep writing...but it came off lame. That's all it is to it in my opinion. I think the whole "acknowledging the previous games bad writing" claim is a bit too dramatic. Forced by how fans feel strongly against it. Maybe it's just that they are building/clarifying on a concept that was poorly handled by bad writers. I wouldn't overthink that.
I feel how you distinguish between Forces and SA2 when Tails thinks Sonic is dead is a bit sparse. Tails would feel directly at fault for Sonic’s death in SA2 so would arguably have an even bigger reason to break down emotionally but he didn’t. I’m not sure Sonic asking him to carry on the fight would just remove that guilt or sadness. He reacted differently because he was written better. Tails had just as many friends counting on him in Forces as he did in SA2, yet he didn’t bother. They could have wrote him to have a breakdown and then redeem himself, but they didn’t. It just didn’t work for me personally. I respect if it did for you though.
@@AceCardGaming I never said that Forces way of writing worked for me. Nor am i saying that it is the peak for writing his character. I hate Forces' way of doing things. What I'm saying is, is that the circumstances of Sonic's "deaths" were different. That's a fact you can not dispute. Do you not remember when Tails said something along the lines of "this is the first time Sonic has ever asked me to do something for him" or something like that. The difference in the two games is more clear if you consider that Tails was directly motivated in making a stand right then and there. Tails literally says that and acts with peer determination in respect of Sonic's wishes. Forces wasn't even close to the same thing. Tails was "left" by Sonic with nothing in terms of direction that Sonic gave him. He was just..gone. That would cause two different reactions in a person. If someone you loved died in front of you; wouldn't you feel better if they said something in acceptance to what's going on and motivate you... Opposed to them dying and you hear nothing from them. Just a sudden end. Not knowing what they thought about you or what was going on. Two different things right? Doesn't matter how many people "depended" on him. The world got taken over by Eggman. Aint no way Tails was the only thing to save it. Evidently his lack of courage and the overwhelming force against him didn't make a difference. He did try to help. He just put himself down so much he didn't reach his full potential. So you can't say he didn't try to redeem himself either. Even still, just cause someone has the courage to do something once, doesn't mean they can do it again so easily. With the clear suddenness of Sonic's departure in Forces..that is something I can see would set Tails back. Being at fault AND loss of a direction. Not being sure of what is or isnt. The circumstances are different. That's my opinion. That's all. I'm not saying you're right or wrong. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong either. I don't know if the writers were thinking that deep. I don't really care. But since you have pretty much the same opinion as every other Sonic fan, I felt like addressing that criticism people share with you. To be fair on both sides.
@@misterholmes221 what about Tails In Unleashed where he flees from the Dark Gaia Monsters? Which camp are you in on that? The one who's against it, or the one who defends it?
@@obd9660 Nothing wrong with that. The writers didn't make him look that lame. He ran away because Tails isn't the fighter type lol. He's more of the observe and waiting type. He can fight. But he's not really a fighter.
Wow, I feel like what Ace said,was on point with how he described Tails here, I can feel it, what he's saying is right.
Again, different opinions between fans, but, how Tails handled Sonic's "supposed" death in SA2, was way better than how he handled his defeat in Forces.
I would love to see Tails have his own spin off, where he goes to bring confidence within himself.. of course soon to return to the team of friends, or at the very least taking charge of something for a while..? Unsure, still be rather neat...
However, I don't think the arc for tails is abandoned, I think they have no clue where to take tails and stalled him into nothing more then a filled plot device giver. Despite that, we still get to see in depth of his untapped potential. Truly even if people didn't even like mentioning his past self in order games? But since the new writers are in, it's important to bring up the pass of everything. From Adventure to Frontiers, This is nothing more then reinsurance we will be seeing more of Tails doing something.. then being a sidelined Character.
Sonic Colours had a better portrayal of Tails than trying Sonic Frontiers did.
@@bakedbeans5494 In my defense, I've played sonic colours.
Yeah
Now let's hope they do the same for shadow even though I personally think how he was portrayed in forces was decent
I'm Just saying, if we don't get a Tail's Sky Patrol 2 after this game, I'm gonna Riot!
We all will!
I had a crush on tails when I was 6.
Don't know why.
Hm, say do you know of The Sonic Show Channel?
What color is his eyes?
Honestly the third season of Sonic x with Tails is probably meant to be what they wanted to do in order grow Tails even further as a hero.
what i want : sonic frontiers leads to Tails FINALLY getting his own important 3d game ( in my opinion a gameplay similar to a ratchet & clank game would make sense for Tails ) . in that game tails would go on adventures of his own and he would help anyone in need ( the game wouldnt be made by sonic team but sega would outsource it to another team ) , and then he would meet a huge threat ( maybe infinite from sonic forces or speedy and the battle bird armada from Tails Adventure are back or maybe they create a new villain for tails ) and now that he is far away from sonic , tails now has to fight alone against a huge army and save innocent people and at the end after defeating the enemy Tails would 100% become the lovable hero from SA2 , i am imagining a crowd much bigger than the one from SA1 cheering tails for his heroic actions and tails would silently leave the crowd because he did it because he wanted to save people NOT for attention . or imagine rookie from sonic forces is there as well but without sonic he isnt confident enough to do his best but tails would teach him to believe in himself and they would save people together . or imagine tails inventing a battle suit like iron man or samus aran and do all the cool things you could imagine for that . and then there would be a little time skip and show sonic fighting eggman but this time his robots are a too much for him but when it seems sonic is losing the battle , tails in his robotic suit would come and destroy one of the eggman robots and then he would approach sonic . sonic would say : " thanks... who are you? " then tails would take off his helmet and say : " i told you you wouldnt recognize me next time we meet " and sonic would smile and say : " welcome back brother... ready to destroy eggmans robots together ? " and tails would say as long as you are " then they would run to the remaining robots and we would see a very cool one shot of sonic and tails and then credits roll
what i expect : tails would just be next to sonic in the next game and he would talk about the adventures he had while he was away from sonic , adventures that happened but we never saw because sega will never make a game about anyone other than sonic , and tails would just be an additional playable character and maybe the only tails exclusive media we would get is a few comic issues .
Instead of a battle suit, How about a Super Form.
@@rickyrackey7930 i would like to think its happening alongside the next sonic game and the chaos emeralds are used there , i feel if the chaos emeralds are involved both eggman and sonic would find their way into the game , i think we could focus on tails better if there is no involvement of chaos emeralds and sonic and eggman . and going 100% fanfiction mode , i would love to see a super form for tails in frontiers dlc and then in the tails games that we would never get , instead of a super form , tails would go full on iron man mode 😅
@@rickyrackey7930 Why not both hehe
Clearly this show the genius of Ian Flynn as a writer. Erasing all the bad and starting over is a thing, but keeping the bad and use it as a part of the characters' development properly asks for real talent.
Only Sonic fans would praiss overcorrection.
@@bakedbeans5494 Well I am a Sonic fan.
Not sure if I would call it genuis as he cheery picked the bad things he acknlowedged, was not even attempting to give a good reason for Tails sudden shifts but just have Tails call him self inconsistant, ignoring all the times in recent past were Tails wasn't a coward like Colors and Lost world and made the big resolution based on the idea that Tails spends to much time with Sonic when SA1 enstablished and many games after it like Heroes and Unleashed further showed that Tails spends most of his free time on his own as Sonic is off adventuring.
@@rynobehnke8289 Well it's still leagues above what Pontac and Graff did.
@@Oceane1803 Bad excuse.
9:56 fin.
While I give Flynn credit for at least not making the other characters into jokes, or cowards, but thats the bare minimum you'd expect. And given the past decade I think we could do with a bit more than the bare minimum to elevate the characters than saying, "its a good building block for the next game!" Screw the next game! What about the here and now!
I feel Tails is a key example of this, doing the bare minimum, especially when compared to another story that came out just before Frontiers, Sonic and Tails R. Which covered the crisis of confidence angle he was suffering.
Frontiers: Tails worried about being a burden to Sonic and complains about the past decade and how he's stuck on the sidelines, only for it to go nowhere as it ends with him basically saying, "I just needed to vent." Also considering the cyber corruption was nothing more than a poor man's Sonic 06, with less steps and and even less gameplay, as his big moment sees him back on the sidelines again - if he ever left them to begin with - was it really that impressive of a feat? If Sonic was actually looking to attack his friends, or was a boss fight as they tried to get the Chaos Emeralds, there might be something to shout about.
Sonic And Tails R: Tails is worried he's slowing Sonic down. Only in it, rather than having the fox cub complain about being stuck on the sidelines for the past sixteen years and counting, they actually let Tails do things and show he can be counted by Sonic, allowing this plot point to meet a conclusion that feels earned. Is it official. No. But who cares, still miles better than what Frontiers did.
I know he will be playable in a year's time, but I really do think he could have done with be playable out the gate and the story might have been abit more of him, and everyone else, standing on the sidelines doing an awful lot of nothing. So much so when Sonic's overcome by the cyber corruption, all he does is stand around and do nothing, but I guess at least the game is being quite on brand to itself.
Very good.
I hope Sega keeps Ian Flynn as their head writer for all future Sonic games.
@@liamphibia to get a Knuckles who wants to be like Sonic, by taking up travelling, even though he already travelled with Sonic, while in the Japanese version of the Frontiers he expressed a desire to find out the origins of his tribe.
And Amy who acts more Mr. Burns, doped up on painkillers, as she declares "I bring you love!" Even though she was already doing this in previous games, she her allowing Gama to have a face turn in SA1. And in the Japanese version of Frontiers, expresses a desire to better herself, and becoming a charming lady, like what she said she was looking to do in SA1.
No thanks. Plus Flynn's stories go where, with characters standing about doing nothing, even in the moments they should be doing something, like surely cyber corrupted Sonic should have done more than stand there. Secret Rings better pay off with the plot point of Sonic being inflicted with something that was killing him - with the flaming arrow making its way to to his heart - than the cyber corruption from Frontiers, which felt more like something out of the Meta Era with how quickly it was resolved.
@@DemonDethchase I feel the Japanese dialogue writes Amy's change better, but it still comes off more like it was written to appeal to fans than genuine development. Regardless I'm waiting to see how the next game handles this.
@@DemonDethchase You’re hard to satisfy.
@@rickyrackey7930 I'll say it is better the stories from the Meta Era, but when the bar is very low and you only really have to do the bare minimum is it really anything to shout from the rooftops about? Because again, drawing comparisons to Secret Rings' story and Frontiers and how it handles scenes, because again, shared countdown on Sonic's life thanks to an infliction he's contracted
Frontiers: While Sonic's friends are free, Sonic finally succumbs to the cyber corruption. The End declares its presence, but in order for Sonic's friends to bring the blue hedgehog back they join hands and through the Power of Friendship Sonic is back to normal. Almost as if nothing happened.
Secret Rings: Sonic gathers all seven world rings just in the nick of time as the flaming arrow - which was meant for Shahra - draws ever closer to his heart, and so looks to confront Erazor Djinn, the one who gifted this infliction. Upon gain the seven World Rings, the genie declares, in order to claim ultimate power, a sacrifice must be made. And thus he chooses Sonic to be that sacrifice, and looks to kill the blue hedgehog. But before that can happen, Shahra throws herself in the way of the evil genie's attack to protect Sonic, and as Sonic wishes her to not die, she says that was a wish she couldn't grant before dying in his arms. All seemed lost, but then Sonic draws the World Rings of Rage, Sadness and Hatred and turns into Darkspine Sonic to take down Djinn before looking to set things back to right, through the three wishes that the blue hedgehog had won.
Where was something like that, in Frontiers?
Tails' theme song "Believe in Myself" from SA2 is finally seeming to take root.
Splitting up from Sonic to further mature and improve on his own while keeping in mind he may need help on occassion.
Frontiers quote from Tails: "Then I'm wildly inconsistent!"
Me: "Yes, you have been Tails but that's not your fault, it's YOUR FAULT!" **angrily points at SEGA and all of the writers that have messed with his character over the years**
yfw we get Titan Tails next game
I would argue that Sonic Heroes kept the whole thing SA-SA2 of Tails being an equal, like pariah made a great comment about this because Tails while still innocent is still extremely helpful.
Hell Sonic even said that if Tails hadn't been there, he might not have made it though.
Sonic Prime is stated to be canon by the show runners. I wonder if Nine Tails's inspiration was because of the writing from Frontier.
Canon to what ?
Fox ≠ rodent
Correct! Gold star for you!!! ⭐️
Sonic is Kamina and Tails is Simon, Here's hoping Tails learns to have faith in the Tails that believes in himself and become the drill that pierces the heavens.
I still think that 12:15 was lacklustered.
Is it weird that I actually liked Baldy Nosehair? Like, I mean, at first. It was a good joke that these alien creatures took one look at Eggman and immediately came up with such a disrespectful, immature sounding name for him, and the way Tails so casually seemed to mention it, and Sonic's reaction.. I don't know, it was a pretty neat joke. Nothing special or amazing, but I liked it.
Too bad that single joke was the only continuity the Meta era had between games, and every time they used it it became drastically less funny and significantly more grating to hear, but it WAS funny the first time.