@@meriotroid I -really- don't, since there's waaaay enough youtubers doing stuff with facecam on these kind of subjects. Nintendo's not a good company, that's nothing new, but I'm more interested in fun themes than in rehashing that stuff while being overly critical on facecam. To each their own tho!
Luckily when they finally got around to re-releasing Sunshine 18 years later, they actually fixed the problems and didn't just do the same thing by rushing out the original running on an emulator, right?
@@jakedematteo2172 if anything it's getting better, it's gone from a generic channel video to an insightful commentary into the gaming industries political practices
you know, one of the biggest comforts I find in my 30’s is to find out that all those levels that made me feel I was missing something on the gameplay are actually the developers fault, not mine. Im a good gamer
I feel like Ceave might really dislike Luigi's Mansion 3, which is confusing because I think it's a fabulous game? He always seems to be making subtle jabs at it, but I actually can't tell if he means it or not
@@senecavermeulen8110 fascinating, because I think Luigi's Mansion 2 is such an abomination it's a miracle they greenlit the 3rd game which saved the series
I absolutely love this channel’s transformation into a soft economic/political commentary channel based on video games. You’ve really found your niche and I’m enjoying it.
@@legoboy7107 Yeah, I'm more into the scientific & analysis stuff that explains more mechanical things. "Is X Level fun/well-designed?" is only sort of fulfilling that niche for me?
I only recently got to play Sunshine for the first time and I was surprised that Corona Mountain was the final level. It really doesn't feel like a final level. When it dropped me into the Bowser fight, my first thought was: "Wait, that was it?" I had a harder time navigating Rico Harbor.
there's actually an unused title card for corona mountain in the files of the game, which lends extra credence to the idea that corona mountain was going to be an actual level instead of a bonus stage!
Ah TH-cam, such a magical place... A place where highly sexual content aimed at children is promoted (logan paul, all the strange spider man + elsa shit, a lot of ads, lele pons, use) but you have to censor the title of a maro level
@@jackburns6403 I dont think that's the only issue tbh, other websites probably have issues with server space and delivering high quality video to users
@@shayboual1892 What? Back in 2019 YT Was responsible for 10% of Google's overall revenue. Rakes in billions for Google. Where did you get the notion that the MOST USED VIDEOPLATFORM on the planet wouldn't generate money?
@@ngotemna8875 yeah ur right. Technically we don't know if yt is profitable because they don't release that data but with 15 bill from ads I've have to say it is
I love the new direction this channel has taken. The video essay format but applied to video game mechanics is so fun, and I'm addicted to the "the year is 19xx" sections.
This went from "I didn't knew you can water slide with Fludd" to "I didn't knew that the gamecube era wasn't actually selling well" by the end of the video.
Its so nuts how as a kid the three consoles felt like they were all equally popular but really the Gamecube and Xbox sold like 20+ mil copies compared to the PS2 selling 150+ or so? Insane. In retrospect I guess it explains why Nintendo decided to never release a direct competitor to a Playstation ever again.
I absolutely agree that they learned their lesson on this front. Just look at how long BotW was delayed before they finally had it ready. Or better yet, restarting from square one on Metroid Prime 4 after it not living up to their vision after years of development on it.
@@SongbirdOfficial yeah, the timed and emulated incomplete collection doesn't paint a good picture. So does Pokémon, and the insistence about the non-existence of the joycon drift.
@@SongbirdOfficial I see a lot of people piping up about Pokemon but here's the thing. Nintendo has no real design hands on Pokemon, lmao. That's all GameFreak and Nintendo is largely complacent to it.
@@SongbirdOfficial Oh, absolutely, but it's a much different issue than Nintendo directly handling the direction for Pokemon. In many ways, they have their hands tied unless they want to go to extremes to take the IP out of GameFreak's hands, and they don't want to do that, and I don't particularly blame them.
It’s heartbreaking to realize they did what they did to save a dying console that may not of sold well but has some of the best games (and quite a few of my personal faves) to ever be made on it.
GameCube wasn't dying it was merely facing the most intense competition to ever exist. PS2 was an unstoppable force & Nintendo was starting to panic. What I will never understand is how Xbox sold 20 Million Units when it had such a poor library compared to PS2 & GameCube.
I had the opposite experience, I got terrible luck in the pachinko stage but entering the lillypad stage knowing how notorious it was I was super cautious and used fludd to almost completely stop the lillypad and take my sweet time collecting the coins.
Well since the lily pads are more about skill, it took me like 15 tries. I would get close to the coins and barely miss them. I don’t know if I got lucky on pachinko, I just kinda played it safe and lined up myself
@@cranjismcbasketball3513 yeah that's another point, steering the pads is a skill you can learn and also you find them in other places while the weird physics of the pachinko machine are seemingly random and you only find them in that stage so you can't learn it.
@@cranjismcbasketball3513 one thing I'll give people is that these things, lilly pad, boats, chucksters, Noki Bay scuba diving, these things don't build on the core mechanics that really make Sunshine so fun instead opting to halt the action completely in favor of weird gimmicky junk.
I come in these videos expecting a reason on “why sunshine’s mountain is the worst level ever made” then come out with a whole ton of information that I never knew before.
The boat section gets 1000% easier if you use a speedrun strategy called "speedboat", funnily enough. This strategy involves pushing against every instinct you have and just going to the back of the boat and spraying full throttle, using small left and right movements to adjust your heading. It's really funny to me because it is *genuinely easier* than the way casual players drive the boat, even on your first try, but no casual player would ever, unprompted, choose to do it because it's an utterly ridiculous thing to do, going full throttle on a boat you're already struggling to control.
I love Sunshine, but its shortcomings are unavoidable in any playthrough. It really makes me wonder what might have been if they had spent more time polishing it like Galaxy or Odyssey.
We wouldn't have stupid hit box glitches, weird FLUDD physics when on a trampoline in the Pachinko stage, no Pachinko stage, teaching you how to correctly use the boat, and Corona Mountain apparently was a full course originally. Imagine a Bowser In The Sky-style volcano stage.
@@thesupervideogamenerdmore3171 I don't think we wouldn't have had the pachinko machine game if Nintendo hadn't rushed, to be honest. We wouldn't have had that really annoying bug for sure, though. But the concept for the pachinko level is actually really cool, and could've worked well if they polished that experience. Would I miss THIS SPECIFIC pachinko stage experience? No. But I'd like to see what a good fix would be.
Thats easy to say when Sunshine didn't have the modern benefit of zero day patches. Nowadays, a game can be launched basicallly half done and just have the fixes waiting on install.
@@digitaldigdug7811 64 and Galaxy also didn't have the modern benefits of zero day patches, and neither of them felt anywhere near as rushed as Sunshine did. In fact, they both barely felt rushed at all for their respective times. Clearly Nintendo is capable.
@OctagonalSM64 That's really dumb then. They all have their own controls, level design and aesthetics that separate them from Odyssey. The 3D All Stars collection is a loveless cash grab designed to make money with nostalgia, cruddy limited-time releases and nothing more. No polish, no extras, no care. In a market where games are remade from the ground up to be modern works, three untouched emulators from one of the biggest companies is egregious and you shouldn't defend it.
@OctagonalSM64 why would anybody buy them then? I can play all of those on my original consoles in their shitty graphic, but my eyes will burn down doing so, because i am used to better graphic now. Why would i play something which looks as shitty as the original. Nostalgia has nothing to do with graphics. It is the games mechanics that made it worth it back then.
That is most fair and true to life description of the boat I've heard. People over exaggerate it acting like it's bad enough to just be luck based when in reality it is really easy to control, but boring.
The same exact thing happened with Wind Waker! Rushed out to meet a Christmas deadline in order to prop up the Gamecube, so it had a lot of cut content and became a real slog in the second half. Even if you don't know that going in, you can just *feel* that stuff was cut as you're playing it. And then it too ended up not meeting Nintendo's expectations, and they (to my knowledge) didn't rush another Zelda game since. (I mean, just look at how long it's taking for them to even *mention* Breath of the Wild 2 again...)
for me headgear that kings and queens wear to show royalty mountain wasn't that hard. I died several times but it was easy if compared to SPOILER ALERT FOR SUPER MARIO ODYSSEY Darker side of the moon
Situations like this also bring up interesting design philosophy questions. For instance, when remastering a flawed game, is it worth improving rushed aspects and fixing old bugs, or is it more important to keep the original intact as much as possible under a fresh coat of aesthetic paint? I know which approach I'd prefer every time, but it's not so straightforward as it seems.
What's curious to me is that the best selling game on the gamecube, melee, was *also* a totally rushed, messy affair and yet its fans just ended up loving it in spite of (and to some extent because of) that.
I learned recently (well, I think I learned it from Jim Sterling before but forgot) that most of the budget studios announce for their games, unless explicitly described to fund the games, is just for marketing. All that money used to justify raising prices, just to advertize and market the damn thing and make CEOs even more money that will barely trickle down to developers crunching to ship out the product that will already be set up to fail the astronomical expectations.
I’m not a super regular viewer, but I’ve been watching your stuff for a few years on off and I gotta say it’s always so weird whenever I see a TH-camrs face for the first time that I only ever associated with a voice. That Mitten Squad face reveal is the one in recent memory that hit me the hardest
The familiar voice, the familiar music, the familiar themes... watching Ceave videos is like watching your favourite TV series! Entertaining, instructive... we never get bored!
I could feel the struggle from all of that Pachinko footage. I haven't even played it and I can imagine the joystick slammed all the way to the left and Mario's just... stuck.
Use of Delfino Plaza music for the volcano section was GREAT. After all, this music now means "you just went past the goal and can't go back anymore" in SMM2 troll levels.
@@ekuu8918 A physical object burning in a physical volcano would be the opposite of ironic because there is a causal connection to make it expected. An intellectual property metaphorically burning due to something that by simple coincidence happened to be volcano themed is ironic because without any causal connection it happened upon a thematic connection.
This level was the singular reason I just stopped playing Sunshine on my most recent playthrough after not playing it since I as a kid. This game had so much more BS in it than I remembered.
@@gnarly.bulblax Not sure if you missed the entire second half of the video, but I guarantee Sunshine's problems didn't come from a lack of testing. These were almost certainly known problems that weren't given the resources they needed to be fixed.
I kinda have to agree here. You really hit the nail on the head. I ADORE Sunshine, but that final level was crap. And you can definitely tell there are parts of the game that were rushed and not polished at all. I mean, come on...they had an opportunity to give BOWSER, king of the big lava turtles, a volcano themed final castle...and they completely blew it. Personally, given the themes of the game, I would have turned the entire volcano into a sort of evil Koopa Spa theme, like how Bowser himself is in a giant jacuzzi.
This channel has experienced one of the biggest 180’s in terms of the tone of the quality of their videos, and I’m all for it. I’ve always been a fan of your more laid back silly content but your recent, more serious content concerning topics that a lot of people would gloss over has been really good. It’s been very nice to see the evolution of your channel, because while your previous content was already pretty good, your new content is much more impressive Thanks for all of your great content, and continue making exceptional videos like this one. The passion and drive behind your new videos has been very very tangible and I think you deserve way more subscribers.
I managed to figure out the sweet spots for controlling the boat after a few frustrating deaths, and it ended up being very quick and easy. Try it yourself: when you're standing in the back half of the boat, spraying water left turns you left, and spraying right turns you right (the opposite of what you would think, but it's consistent). Once you learn to stay out of the front of the boat, you can get the blue coins in three minutes. Also, you can find some TH-cam videos about how to cheese the pachinko level, I managed to get it first try with those tips
I loved sword and shield. But if they even waited another YEAR and polished it like they polished the dlc, they could've been some of the best pokemon games. But instead, the pokemon company decided to give them an unreasonable time to finish it and it ended up being slightly better than the other 3d games, which isn't saying much
@@Polska_Edits I was honestly fine with that. My problem was just how rushed it felt. Like so many aspects of the game could've been just amazing but they rushed it out and you can notice that lack of polish. Take the story, for example. It wasn't bad, but they could've definitely let you have more involvement in it for example.
Why is Donald Trump pretty and I am not? But why does he only have a wife but I have TWO HOT GIRLFRIENDS who I show off in my masterpiece YT videos? Do you know the answer, dear dia
I actually completed this level first time on my first play through. While I can see its potential to be frustrating, it wasn’t anywhere near as difficult as I thought. The boss battle was awful, though.
"The volcano in Sunshine is the one time Nintendo came dangerously close to actually burning down their entire company." Look those Corona Mountain blue coins are hard to get but they aren't THAT hard to get.
This entire short term profits over long term sustainability thing is less because of capitalism and more because people don't behave rationally. It's largely a consequence of delay discounting where people care more about a small benefit in the short term rather than a big one in the long term. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbolic_discounting
fun fact, the boat controls actually make sense, spraying to the left in the front of the boat turns the boat right, spraying left in the back turns the boat left, and vice versa
You know when you go into any of the 7 stages and there is a shine select with the level’s name on top? Corona Mountan has it’s own shine select name unused in the game data. It was planned to be like the original 7 stages. How disappointing!
@@Tatokat you mean like the remakes of spyro and crash bandicoot? Oh wait the are sold as 3 games in 1 for less money. And these games were really created, not mostly only portet.
@@AlryFireBlade No, I'm talking about remakes like "Link's Awakening" or "Final Fantasy VII" or "Demon's Souls". All sold to the full prize (or more) upon release. The difference between the ones you named and the ones I named, is that yours haven't gotten all that much love over the years. Remakes are a good way to see whether there are actually still people who would buy those games if you're planning on ever continuing a pretty much dead franchise, or to get back into the good graces of the fanbase if you screwed up with previous games. If you make a remake for those reasons, you of course ask for less money. But the Mario franchise is still very much alive and very well received, so there is absolutely no reason for Nintendo to do that.
It would be more akin to bug fixes and minor adjustments I suppose. Patches weren't a possibility back in the gamecube days but these aren't the gamecube days anymore
really enjoying the recent sunshine videos. i just finished a playthrough on 3d allstars a few days ago. its really nice to see stuff on such on old, underrated, and frustrating game.
@@Aleks-hp8pr personally I hated the space Chapter 4 much much more. Not even the Whoa Zone though, that was somewhat bearable. It's the two levels before it where you're at the mercy of vortices in the middle of space, there are zero hints of where to go and the music is annoying as hell. (Super Paper Mario is my favourite Paper Mario tho)
@@Aleks-hp8pr Nintendo didn't make that though. Yeah I know, Intelligent Systems are a second-party Nintendo developer, but it's still not a *_Nintendo_* level.
To be fair, yeah it's true that Sunshine's final boss was a flop, but Galaxy was the first time a 3D Mario nailed the final boss fight, and I don't think it's really fair to fault Sunshine for something it got wrong when none of its predecessors could get it right either (something that can't be said about the leadup to the boss).
@@koolaid33 the thing is the brand is "Luigi's Mansion" which immediately tells us Luigi is vacuuming up ghosts. Like how "Super Mario ______" is the brand for 3D Mario game with fun platforming. "Luigi's Hotel" probably wouldn't sell as well due to the less consistent branding.
Yet pokemon keeps selling gangbusters with worse and titles unlike mario sunshine which flopped so they had to start making polished games again. At this point pokemon fans deserve what they get... Scarlet and violet sold 10 million copies in just 3 days while sunshine by comparison sold about a million copies during its entire launch week. Until people stop buying the games pokemon company has 0 reason to put any development time or money into the titles. If anything they're incentivized to invest less since the product sells well regardless
The idea of cashing in on trust is really interesting. I think you're saying that it's always bad. Another possibility is: trust is a resource Nintendo have. Maybe they knew they needed to cash some in at this time because they needed to recuperate costs on their underselling console, which enabled them to go on and rebuild that trust with later releases.
I think it's also possible that they just made some mistakes lol. Every released game is "rushed" in some way or another, like, if you spend too much time striving for ultimate perfection, nothing will ever be finished! Love the new video style dude.
That surprise breakdown of the short term profit incentive was impressive.
the profit motive strikes again
"Shiny but deadly coins" takes on a whole new meaning
Capitalism.
it really was. It should be obvious, but it wasn't, at least to me. I'm very thankful of this video.
@@gamermapper Ah yes, the obligatory "Capitalism." comment. Because we all know the best videogames come from socialist countries.
Ceave then: Here's this cool mario maker trick
Ceave now: Game industry messed up also I have a face
Hard to ignore it anymore innit?
I like the new video format/topics better ngl
@@meriotroid I do too
@@meriotroid I -really- don't, since there's waaaay enough youtubers doing stuff with facecam on these kind of subjects. Nintendo's not a good company, that's nothing new, but I'm more interested in fun themes than in rehashing that stuff while being overly critical on facecam. To each their own tho!
@@arthurjeannin3357
Honestly, is there ever a good company?
Now I want a remake of Sunshine with additional levels, fixed bugs and a revamped volcano
3D All-Stars: I'm gonna pretend I didn't see that.
Yeah let’s make the volcano worse
Nintendo: Yeah, let’s just put a time restriction on it, then we don’t have to put in any work and we can still reap the rewards!
Check out Super Mario Sunburn, and don't tell Nintendo!
Like Mario 64 DS?
Luckily when they finally got around to re-releasing Sunshine 18 years later, they actually fixed the problems and didn't just do the same thing by rushing out the original running on an emulator, right?
This would be funny if it wasn't so depressing.
That would require effort
It's an emulated port
@@ryanm8529 That's kind of the point.
@@ryanm8529 whoosh
"Shiny, yet deadly coins" is taking on a whole new meaning.
Alt title: Roasting nintendo until they put global ground icicles back day 7
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I never beat Sunshine as a kid because of that stupid boat. Who decided to place a boat in a lava lake?
I love how the broken leaves melt in the water, but the boat is fine in the lava
The boat's designed for mud, it's fine
The devs.
Just be slow and methodical about it, you can trade skill for patience.
The boat mechanics make perfect sense, based on conservation of angular momentum.
This channel that started with dodging evil coins is now lowkey about Nintendo's business and design practices
And-a TH-cam’s!
It started with Mario Maker tips tho
Yeah. And it’s slowly becoming worse.
Funnily enough, he’s cashing in our trust
@@jakedematteo2172 if anything it's getting better, it's gone from a generic channel video to an insightful commentary into the gaming industries political practices
@@frogg4711 yeah, that’s the problem. A lot of his videos like this are extremely misinformed
you know, one of the biggest comforts I find in my 30’s is to find out that all those levels that made me feel I was missing something on the gameplay are actually the developers fault, not mine. Im a good gamer
I love how each video he makes just seems like a retrospective at first, but turns into a big lesson in game design
"One of them is weird"
*shows luigis mansion 3*
Me:I guess that's fair
It’s weird but good
I feel like Ceave might really dislike Luigi's Mansion 3, which is confusing because I think it's a fabulous game? He always seems to be making subtle jabs at it, but I actually can't tell if he means it or not
@@Kelarys I also hate it tbh, I prefer Dark Moon much more
In my opinion its as good as the first Luigis Mansion. It may be weird, but its also good
@@senecavermeulen8110 fascinating, because I think Luigi's Mansion 2 is such an abomination it's a miracle they greenlit the 3rd game which saved the series
I absolutely love this channel’s transformation into a soft economic/political commentary channel based on video games. You’ve really found your niche and I’m enjoying it.
Yeah I also really love it! Amazing content😍
This channel has improved from a channel I watch to waste time to one of my favorite youtube channels
I do still miss him being like the Mario Maker science guy though. I really liked all the Mario Maker videos.
@@legoboy7107 Yeah, I'm more into the scientific & analysis stuff that explains more mechanical things. "Is X Level fun/well-designed?" is only sort of fulfilling that niche for me?
Hard disagree. He objectively has no idea what he's talking about on economic issues.
I only recently got to play Sunshine for the first time and I was surprised that Corona Mountain was the final level. It really doesn't feel like a final level. When it dropped me into the Bowser fight, my first thought was: "Wait, that was it?" I had a harder time navigating Rico Harbor.
there's actually an unused title card for corona mountain in the files of the game, which lends extra credence to the idea that corona mountain was going to be an actual level instead of a bonus stage!
Ah TH-cam, such a magical place... A place where highly sexual content aimed at children is promoted (logan paul, all the strange spider man + elsa shit, a lot of ads, lele pons, use) but you have to censor the title of a maro level
Yeah youtube is actual garbage these days but everyone uses it so its impossible to switch to a better site
@@jackburns6403 I dont think that's the only issue tbh, other websites probably have issues with server space and delivering high quality video to users
@@jackburns6403 TH-cam isn't actually profitable, other companies wouldnt really want to take its place cuz it doesn't make money
@@shayboual1892 What? Back in 2019 YT Was responsible for 10% of Google's overall revenue.
Rakes in billions for Google.
Where did you get the notion that the MOST USED VIDEOPLATFORM on the planet wouldn't generate money?
@@ngotemna8875 yeah ur right. Technically we don't know if yt is profitable because they don't release that data but with 15 bill from ads I've have to say it is
That coin flip sound effect actually startled me
There was a coin flip sound?
Süshi~Vølcano at 5:15
ME TOO! I looked around me hahahaha
TH-cam: demonetizes the word “corona”
Ceave: S U N S H I N E V O L C A N O
It's not just the italian but also the spanish word for crown.
@Kly I know that
i live in a city named corona
Also Polish, but with a k instead of a c
@HF gaming A popular Austrian skiing town is named "Sankt Corona". Perhaps it's that one.
Unrealistic deadlines: The destroyer of good games.
The destroyer of any good work
Also known as companies being companies
I love the new direction this channel has taken. The video essay format but applied to video game mechanics is so fun, and I'm addicted to the "the year is 19xx" sections.
This went from "I didn't knew you can water slide with Fludd" to "I didn't knew that the gamecube era wasn't actually selling well" by the end of the video.
Its so nuts how as a kid the three consoles felt like they were all equally popular but really the Gamecube and Xbox sold like 20+ mil copies compared to the PS2 selling 150+ or so? Insane. In retrospect I guess it explains why Nintendo decided to never release a direct competitor to a Playstation ever again.
Ah yes, Censored Mountain. Who doesn't remember dealing with that mess?
Probably not the first time it's been called "censored mountain" either.
yeah I never liked [REMOVED TO CONFORM WITH LOCAL AND INTERNATIONAL CENSORSHIP LAWS] mountain
I was crying playing it on 3d all stars
Its so frustrating
C
O
R
O
N
A
Mountain.
me because i was like 5
I absolutely agree that they learned their lesson on this front. Just look at how long BotW was delayed before they finally had it ready. Or better yet, restarting from square one on Metroid Prime 4 after it not living up to their vision after years of development on it.
And yet they also released the All Stars Collection for a limited time and also the whole shift in design philosophy of recent Pokemon games.
@@SongbirdOfficial yeah, the timed and emulated incomplete collection doesn't paint a good picture.
So does Pokémon, and the insistence about the non-existence of the joycon drift.
@@SongbirdOfficial I see a lot of people piping up about Pokemon but here's the thing.
Nintendo has no real design hands on Pokemon, lmao. That's all GameFreak and Nintendo is largely complacent to it.
@@arieltroncoso3871 Well, them being complacent to it is also a problem, is it not? :P
@@SongbirdOfficial Oh, absolutely, but it's a much different issue than Nintendo directly handling the direction for Pokemon.
In many ways, they have their hands tied unless they want to go to extremes to take the IP out of GameFreak's hands, and they don't want to do that, and I don't particularly blame them.
Ceave realy rants about Sunshine a good bit.
*really*
@@AtLeast3Characters743 nobody cares
As he should
MARIO SUNSHINE IS EASY
@@chantelled2546 its hard
Shut up
It’s heartbreaking to realize they did what they did to save a dying console that may not of sold well but has some of the best games (and quite a few of my personal faves) to ever be made on it.
GameCube wasn't dying it was merely facing the most intense competition to ever exist. PS2 was an unstoppable force & Nintendo was starting to panic. What I will never understand is how Xbox sold 20 Million Units when it had such a poor library compared to PS2 & GameCube.
“Guys the Volcano in Mario Sunshine predicted 2020!”
So did corona beer
Not gonna lie I only died once on pachinko. That lily pad red coin river is ten times worse
I had the opposite experience, I got terrible luck in the pachinko stage but entering the lillypad stage knowing how notorious it was I was super cautious and used fludd to almost completely stop the lillypad and take my sweet time collecting the coins.
Well since the lily pads are more about skill, it took me like 15 tries. I would get close to the coins and barely miss them. I don’t know if I got lucky on pachinko, I just kinda played it safe and lined up myself
@@cranjismcbasketball3513 yeah that's another point, steering the pads is a skill you can learn and also you find them in other places while the weird physics of the pachinko machine are seemingly random and you only find them in that stage so you can't learn it.
@@devin5201 yeah, so many people complain about chucksters but it really comes down to aiming where you talk to them
@@cranjismcbasketball3513 one thing I'll give people is that these things, lilly pad, boats, chucksters, Noki Bay scuba diving, these things don't build on the core mechanics that really make Sunshine so fun instead opting to halt the action completely in favor of weird gimmicky junk.
I come in these videos expecting a reason on “why sunshine’s mountain is the worst level ever made” then come out with a whole ton of information that I never knew before.
The boat section gets 1000% easier if you use a speedrun strategy called "speedboat", funnily enough. This strategy involves pushing against every instinct you have and just going to the back of the boat and spraying full throttle, using small left and right movements to adjust your heading.
It's really funny to me because it is *genuinely easier* than the way casual players drive the boat, even on your first try, but no casual player would ever, unprompted, choose to do it because it's an utterly ridiculous thing to do, going full throttle on a boat you're already struggling to control.
I saw the title and got confused when it said "Volcano"
Then I remembered the "Mountain's" name.
This is the most elaborate “slow and steady wins the race” tale I’ve ever heard
I love Sunshine, but its shortcomings are unavoidable in any playthrough. It really makes me wonder what might have been if they had spent more time polishing it like Galaxy or Odyssey.
We wouldn't have stupid hit box glitches, weird FLUDD physics when on a trampoline in the Pachinko stage, no Pachinko stage, teaching you how to correctly use the boat, and Corona Mountain apparently was a full course originally. Imagine a Bowser In The Sky-style volcano stage.
@@thesupervideogamenerdmore3171 I don't think we wouldn't have had the pachinko machine game if Nintendo hadn't rushed, to be honest. We wouldn't have had that really annoying bug for sure, though. But the concept for the pachinko level is actually really cool, and could've worked well if they polished that experience.
Would I miss THIS SPECIFIC pachinko stage experience? No. But I'd like to see what a good fix would be.
Thats easy to say when Sunshine didn't have the modern benefit of zero day patches. Nowadays, a game can be launched basicallly half done and just have the fixes waiting on install.
@@digitaldigdug7811 64 and Galaxy also didn't have the modern benefits of zero day patches, and neither of them felt anywhere near as rushed as Sunshine did. In fact, they both barely felt rushed at all for their respective times. Clearly Nintendo is capable.
The recent Mario 3D Collection shows that Nintendo is trying other questionable ways of getting money through exploiting trust and nostalgia...
@OctagonalSM64 nostalgia isn't all about graphics
@@spongey01234 woosh
@OctagonalSM64 That's really dumb then. They all have their own controls, level design and aesthetics that separate them from Odyssey. The 3D All Stars collection is a loveless cash grab designed to make money with nostalgia, cruddy limited-time releases and nothing more. No polish, no extras, no care. In a market where games are remade from the ground up to be modern works, three untouched emulators from one of the biggest companies is egregious and you shouldn't defend it.
@OctagonalSM64 why would anybody buy them then? I can play all of those on my original consoles in their shitty graphic, but my eyes will burn down doing so, because i am used to better graphic now. Why would i play something which looks as shitty as the original. Nostalgia has nothing to do with graphics. It is the games mechanics that made it worth it back then.
@OctagonalSM64 I'll only be earning money in april (if borders open March 1st). Guess I won't play the rereleases (:
That is most fair and true to life description of the boat I've heard. People over exaggerate it acting like it's bad enough to just be luck based when in reality it is really easy to control, but boring.
"TH-cam doesn't like the Italian word for crown"
Try the Spanish one
You do know that the Spanish and Italian word for crown are the same... ?
@@Anodoni joke
/dʒəʊk/
noun
a thing that someone says to cause amusement or laughter, especially a story with a funny punchline.
@@Anodoni If that was a bit too rough, I do know. That's the joke. I'm a Spaniard myself
@@Anodoni that's the *joke*
The same exact thing happened with Wind Waker! Rushed out to meet a Christmas deadline in order to prop up the Gamecube, so it had a lot of cut content and became a real slog in the second half. Even if you don't know that going in, you can just *feel* that stuff was cut as you're playing it. And then it too ended up not meeting Nintendo's expectations, and they (to my knowledge) didn't rush another Zelda game since. (I mean, just look at how long it's taking for them to even *mention* Breath of the Wild 2 again...)
All 7 Ocarina of Time Water Temple fans are popping off right now
You know we are
There are dozens of us!
At least the 3DS version made it actually good. Great even.
Here i am. You're right.
Yes.
Ah yes, I remember how hard headgear that kings and queen's wear to show royalty mountain was for me
Oh yeah... carolla mountain. Good times, that toyota mario
Yeah! Head mountain was *pain*
Isn't it tiara mountain?
for me headgear that kings and queens wear to show royalty mountain wasn't that hard. I died several times but it was easy if compared to SPOILER ALERT FOR SUPER MARIO ODYSSEY
Darker side of the moon
Carlotta Mountain
who would win?
a: The Volcano
b: Ceave's Waterbottle
Waterbottole
a
@Bartek Zabawa :
@Bartek Zabawa
Right when "Episode 2: How to Burn Down a Franchise" showed up I got an ad for Mario's 35th anniversary. I thought that was funny!
Situations like this also bring up interesting design philosophy questions. For instance, when remastering a flawed game, is it worth improving rushed aspects and fixing old bugs, or is it more important to keep the original intact as much as possible under a fresh coat of aesthetic paint?
I know which approach I'd prefer every time, but it's not so straightforward as it seems.
What's curious to me is that the best selling game on the gamecube, melee, was *also* a totally rushed, messy affair and yet its fans just ended up loving it in spite of (and to some extent because of) that.
I feel like this video woke me up to why we keep getting broken games lately.. it’s sad :(
Yeah, it really bad.
It's capatilism functioning as intended
I learned recently (well, I think I learned it from Jim Sterling before but forgot) that most of the budget studios announce for their games, unless explicitly described to fund the games, is just for marketing.
All that money used to justify raising prices, just to advertize and market the damn thing and make CEOs even more money that will barely trickle down to developers crunching to ship out the product that will already be set up to fail the astronomical expectations.
1:01 "I see" sounding like "icy" whilst showing the "icy" intro of DKCTF. Well edited Ceave, well edited.
I’m not a super regular viewer, but I’ve been watching your stuff for a few years on off and I gotta say it’s always so weird whenever I see a TH-camrs face for the first time that I only ever associated with a voice. That Mitten Squad face reveal is the one in recent memory that hit me the hardest
0:12 that transition was pretty sick, props to your editing skills.
"Demonetized Mountain"
The familiar voice, the familiar music, the familiar themes... watching Ceave videos is like watching your favourite TV series!
Entertaining, instructive... we never get bored!
And I wrote this before seeing that the video is divided in episodes lol
I could feel the struggle from all of that Pachinko footage. I haven't even played it and I can imagine the joystick slammed all the way to the left and Mario's just... stuck.
Use of Delfino Plaza music for the volcano section was GREAT. After all, this music now means "you just went past the goal and can't go back anymore" in SMM2 troll levels.
Ironic that the closest Mario has come to burning down was inside a volcano.
Isn't that the opposite of ironic? 🤔
@@ekuu8918 no, irony can go both ways
Nintendo had to rush the level so they almost burned their company in attempt to make volcano level
also there is the name.....
@@ekuu8918 A physical object burning in a physical volcano would be the opposite of ironic because there is a causal connection to make it expected. An intellectual property metaphorically burning due to something that by simple coincidence happened to be volcano themed is ironic because without any causal connection it happened upon a thematic connection.
"TH-cam doesn't like the Italian "crown" mountain."
I am actually laughing WAY hard that I should (I am Italian ngl)
Whats the italian word for crown?
Same with other launges btw
@@excrementgaming9050 corona
@@excrementgaming9050 basically the name of the virus
@@MyHandleIsAplaceholder can TH-cam demonetize comments?
This level was the singular reason I just stopped playing Sunshine on my most recent playthrough after not playing it since I as a kid. This game had so much more BS in it than I remembered.
I quit cause of the chuckster secret level lol
Try to get the 8 red coins in the final (8th) level of Monte village
I just wish they actually play-tested their game
@@gnarly.bulblax Not sure if you missed the entire second half of the video, but I guarantee Sunshine's problems didn't come from a lack of testing. These were almost certainly known problems that weren't given the resources they needed to be fixed.
@@ZackBogucki I was being sarcastic
I wish I could experience the alternate universe where Sunshine wasn't rushed to release and has much more content and fewer bugs
I kinda have to agree here. You really hit the nail on the head. I ADORE Sunshine, but that final level was crap. And you can definitely tell there are parts of the game that were rushed and not polished at all. I mean, come on...they had an opportunity to give BOWSER, king of the big lava turtles, a volcano themed final castle...and they completely blew it. Personally, given the themes of the game, I would have turned the entire volcano into a sort of evil Koopa Spa theme, like how Bowser himself is in a giant jacuzzi.
Love how people can't say the real name of this level these days because it has the c-word.
Doesn't make any sense tbh
???
What word tho
Is it corana mountain?
@@jyjaeskz yeah
It took me FOREVER to beat Corana Mountain when I was a kid
"Their games almost never feel like a rushed mess"
Pokemon sword and shield have entered the chat
switch BotW too...
Umm, when has a Pokemon game NOT felt like a rushed mess? lol
@@Michirin9801 Emerald, gen 2, gen 3...
@@vyor8837 ?? How's switch botw rushed?
@@ramensamosa8186 it's performance was ass on launch
This channel has experienced one of the biggest 180’s in terms of the tone of the quality of their videos, and I’m all for it.
I’ve always been a fan of your more laid back silly content but your recent, more serious content concerning topics that a lot of people would gloss over has been really good. It’s been very nice to see the evolution of your channel, because while your previous content was already pretty good, your new content is much more impressive
Thanks for all of your great content, and continue making exceptional videos like this one. The passion and drive behind your new videos has been very very tangible and I think you deserve way more subscribers.
I managed to figure out the sweet spots for controlling the boat after a few frustrating deaths, and it ended up being very quick and easy.
Try it yourself: when you're standing in the back half of the boat, spraying water left turns you left, and spraying right turns you right (the opposite of what you would think, but it's consistent). Once you learn to stay out of the front of the boat, you can get the blue coins in three minutes.
Also, you can find some TH-cam videos about how to cheese the pachinko level, I managed to get it first try with those tips
When you can’t say the name of the volcano because the video will get flagged as talking about a pandemic
ya so we gotta this little lava level started still needs some work though
HOLY SHIT THE GAME SHIPS IN AN HOUR
Or as a wise man once said.
YE ESTÁ EN TIENDAS.
_watches the whole video, then takes a long, sad look at Pkmn Sword & Shield_
They're really not bad imo
I read this as "Pikmin Sword and Shield" and was very confused.
I loved sword and shield. But if they even waited another YEAR and polished it like they polished the dlc, they could've been some of the best pokemon games. But instead, the pokemon company decided to give them an unreasonable time to finish it and it ended up being slightly better than the other 3d games, which isn't saying much
My biggest problem with it is the lack of All pokemon, especially beloved ones like garchomp. Oh and a moves/ mega evolution being gone.
@@Polska_Edits I was honestly fine with that. My problem was just how rushed it felt. Like so many aspects of the game could've been just amazing but they rushed it out and you can notice that lack of polish. Take the story, for example. It wasn't bad, but they could've definitely let you have more involvement in it for example.
“Wind Waker” was also rushed out the door, hence the Triforce fetch quest at the end. Nintendo was in bad shape after the N64 and GameCube flopped.
I lost it at "..leading up to demonetize mountain" 😂
First the beer and now Sunshine’s volcano. Any other unfortunate names of things out there?
(Also notification squad rise up)
Why is Donald Trump pretty and I am not? But why does he only have a wife but I have TWO HOT GIRLFRIENDS who I show off in my masterpiece YT videos? Do you know the answer, dear dia
@@AxxLAfriku what...
Im notif squad
RISE UPPP
There's also the Vtuber doggo, Korone.
I actually completed this level first time on my first play through. While I can see its potential to be frustrating, it wasn’t anywhere near as difficult as I thought. The boss battle was awful, though.
"The volcano in Sunshine is the one time Nintendo came dangerously close to actually burning down their entire company."
Look those Corona Mountain blue coins are hard to get but they aren't THAT hard to get.
Yes they are
I saw Arthas in the quick flashes of the intro. I really like how this guy pulls comparisons between games, makes the analysis so much realistic
Just takes me back to Arin screaming "TELL ME THAT SHITS FOR REAL"
I love how he wasn't afraid of the pitchforks of Sunshine fans because he knows even us Sunshine fans hate that level.
Wow new comment
First, Ceave hates coins
Now, Ceave has moved onto capitalism
And I'm here for it
This entire short term profits over long term sustainability thing is less because of capitalism and more because people don't behave rationally. It's largely a consequence of delay discounting where people care more about a small benefit in the short term rather than a big one in the long term. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbolic_discounting
@@WaluigiisthekingASmith Tragedy of the Commons.
....which is such a common thing BECAUSE of capitalism and how it functions 😐
@@ebonyobrien5895 exactly
@@ebonyobrien5895 uh no? Procrastination is this exact thinking but it's not dependant on the existence of capitalism.
fun fact, the boat controls actually make sense, spraying to the left in the front of the boat turns the boat right, spraying left in the back turns the boat left, and vice versa
Yea but the water would evaporate also, wood on lava
@@Polska_Edits there's a guy renting those same boats in noki bay and he says theyre made of mud
@@Polska_Edits the hover function of fludd would be physically impossible in real life, why even bring up logic in a videogame
You know when you go into any of the 7 stages and there is a shine select with the level’s name on top? Corona Mountan has it’s own shine select name unused in the game data. It was planned to be like the original 7 stages. How disappointing!
i love how you break down such incredible specific topics. great!
Speaking of remakes they wasted the potential to fix some issues on sunshine on the 3D All-stars collection
3D All-stars is not a remake. If it was, all three games would have been sold separately to the full prize. You know, like every other actual remake.
@@Tatokat you mean like the remakes of spyro and crash bandicoot? Oh wait the are sold as 3 games in 1 for less money.
And these games were really created, not mostly only portet.
@@AlryFireBlade No, I'm talking about remakes like "Link's Awakening" or "Final Fantasy VII" or "Demon's Souls". All sold to the full prize (or more) upon release. The difference between the ones you named and the ones I named, is that yours haven't gotten all that much love over the years. Remakes are a good way to see whether there are actually still people who would buy those games if you're planning on ever continuing a pretty much dead franchise, or to get back into the good graces of the fanbase if you screwed up with previous games. If you make a remake for those reasons, you of course ask for less money. But the Mario franchise is still very much alive and very well received, so there is absolutely no reason for Nintendo to do that.
It would be more akin to bug fixes and minor adjustments I suppose. Patches weren't a possibility back in the gamecube days but these aren't the gamecube days anymore
@@Tatokat No to me its an asshole move to sell the same games again for so much money.
"It's just as fun as the name suggests"
Sunshine is like the Crash Twinsanity of the Mario series.
My favorites from both series
really enjoying the recent sunshine videos. i just finished a playthrough on 3d allstars a few days ago. its really nice to see stuff on such on old, underrated, and frustrating game.
8:18 "a loveless, rushed climax"
I sure know a lot about those...
I just realized that picture of ruto to the left, it seems like his setup is slowly evolving with each passing video.
Imagine it in five years
[insert passive-aggressive comment about how the Volcano isn't the worst level Nintendo made because other game level bad here]
*cough* overthere stair *cough*
@@Aleks-hp8pr personally I hated the space Chapter 4 much much more. Not even the Whoa Zone though, that was somewhat bearable. It's the two levels before it where you're at the mercy of vortices in the middle of space, there are zero hints of where to go and the music is annoying as hell. (Super Paper Mario is my favourite Paper Mario tho)
@@Aleks-hp8pr Nintendo didn't make that though. Yeah I know, Intelligent Systems are a second-party Nintendo developer, but it's still not a *_Nintendo_* level.
Facecam is really great. It would be actually perfect if you could remove the echo. Definitely a good addition.
These kind of videos help explain things like level design and why things in games happen, hope you keep making this kind of content :)
"Why didn't he put corona mountain in the title---"
"Ohhhhhh........."
Even worse I think is the volcano's boss. Such a disappointing end, it feels like a second phase of the fight was cut or something.
To be fair, yeah it's true that Sunshine's final boss was a flop, but Galaxy was the first time a 3D Mario nailed the final boss fight, and I don't think it's really fair to fault Sunshine for something it got wrong when none of its predecessors could get it right either (something that can't be said about the leadup to the boss).
Spaniards reading Corona Mountain:
Yeah it’s crown mountain
Everyone else: it’s pestilence mountain
oh yeah, that mountain with the interesting name
0:59 The Tindersticks are a band, not a stick you use to light things with.
I genuinely don't remember the pachinko machine having the issue in the top left
"Nintendo release good games, but some were weird..." (puts footage of luigis mansion 3) me: And I took that personally.
Same, Luigi doesn't deserve that type of disrespect and cruelty. Also shouldn't Luigi's Mansion 3 technically be called Luigi's Hotel?
@@koolaid33 yes, it should have been lol.
@@koolaid33 the thing is the brand is "Luigi's Mansion" which immediately tells us Luigi is vacuuming up ghosts. Like how "Super Mario ______" is the brand for 3D Mario game with fun platforming.
"Luigi's Hotel" probably wouldn't sell as well due to the less consistent branding.
Corporate greed usually ruins everything in the end
Ceave: Nintendo never cashes in on trust
Nintendo: Sweats nervously in mario maker online
Basically what Game Freak does with Pokemon. They didn't learn the lesson, though.
Yet pokemon keeps selling gangbusters with worse and titles unlike mario sunshine which flopped so they had to start making polished games again. At this point pokemon fans deserve what they get... Scarlet and violet sold 10 million copies in just 3 days while sunshine by comparison sold about a million copies during its entire launch week.
Until people stop buying the games pokemon company has 0 reason to put any development time or money into the titles. If anything they're incentivized to invest less since the product sells well regardless
The idea of cashing in on trust is really interesting. I think you're saying that it's always bad. Another possibility is: trust is a resource Nintendo have. Maybe they knew they needed to cash some in at this time because they needed to recuperate costs on their underselling console, which enabled them to go on and rebuild that trust with later releases.
19:06 3D all stars has joined the chat
“That’s the content of the mountain that shall not be named” -Ceave 2021
"Why Sunshine’s Volcano is the Worst Level Nintendo Ever Made."
Wait you mean Coro-oh... I see
Three sunshine levels that give me flashbacks:
1. The volcano
2. The pachinko machine
3. Roller coaster
I think it's also possible that they just made some mistakes lol. Every released game is "rushed" in some way or another, like, if you spend too much time striving for ultimate perfection, nothing will ever be finished! Love the new video style dude.
"Demonitized Mountain." 😂🤣