I show that Gunthor video in my classes each semester, and every year we marvel at the man's indomitable strength, fabulous purple lycra suit, and impeccable mustache. Oh and we also analyze his training methods a little bit too.
Werner's coach here is Jean Pierre Egger, one of the most intelligent and progressive coaches of all time, he went on to coach Valerie Adams to 4 world and 2 olympic gold medals in the shot. This is the best training video ever, even better than Ivan Drago's prep for USA vs Rus boxing
Was an athlete at the 1987 world champs in Rome, saw Werner at the pool a few times, the pool was an Olympic sized pool in the village. One day I saw him do a back flip into the pool, then later he causally did butterfly across the pool in what seemed like a few strokes. For a big man he was incredibly athletic.
Clarification on what that is at 12:26. It's a machine that makes the eccentric portion of the Squat heavier than the concentric. They do this because you can generate more force in the eccentric part of movement than in the concentric (see: strength-velocity curve). Nowadays we call this supramaximal loading. Very effective but very dangerous too. The amount of muscle damage we can produce in the eccentric is crazy. I just attended a S&C-Weekend in the same facility as Werner Günthör trained (Magglingen, Switzerland). His coach (Jean-Pierre Egger, guy in the white and red suit) gave the opening lecture. That's why I know. Cheers guys, love the content.
Yeah this is true, mi French professor in college who known Jean-Pierre Egger told me the same about the machine. It is made to make the eccentric way hard with pneumatic pressure.
You lads should definitely do Andreas Thorkildsen, he is a Javelin thrower whose workouts are interesting and versatile plus he is an absolute beast regarding upper body strength, especially considering his relatively lean look. Not a lot of people can perform iron cross pull ups and bench 200kg at around 90kg bodyweight.
Great video guys. Random note and only because you wondered, the location of all the outdoor weight training and track work is Club La Santa Lanzarote in the Canary Islands. Lots of athletes still go there for training camps and it has some spectacular looking facilities.
Saw a version of this video with some commentary, the electric smith machine provides more resistance on the concentric portion of the lift, until it hits those pins (where the video zoomed in and showed it at the beginning). So it resists the concentric until hitting that point, and then is a regular eccentric on the way down. *90% sure that's the previous explanation I saw.
At 17:37, "chevilles" means "ankles" in French, so it has no direct relation to "cheval," the French word for "horse." (at least to the best of my knowledge).
I was thinking that given the amount of videos the Sika guys have done about throwers, what if they do a video of them trying out the shot put and discus throws? Maybe hammer as well.
The electric smith machine. You could in theory provide a magnetic field and therefor make it harder or lighter :) Some of the newer ones can lock it if you fail an attempt. Just like a car has a safety when it drives to fast up to a car in front :)
Fun thing with shotput is you actually should use a heavier shot for your beginners who need technique focus heavier weight means slower movements and more body awareness as well as reduces risk of elbow issues.
I have no idea what the electric thing is. But is has Rocky IV vibes with Drago. This bit where he’s training and they show how advanced they are by showing a treadmill with a crystal… but all ends up with juicing
16:20 I did similar thing back in the day. 30 seconds of isometric hold and then lots of jumps. But i was in power-endurance business and there is made sense to build endurance side of muscle and after pre-fatigue require certain power output out of the muscle. However i wonder if this could help with fiber-activation even with pure power athletes: you pre-fatigue the muscle with holds and then force lazier fibers to engage in activity as dominant ones are out of the game. That way you have to do less plyos for same result (as you said: 130kg guy). Just a wild guess.
You got me curious about technique comparison. A new record was set in 1988 by an East German of 23.06. That was when Werner was near his peak and Wikipedia says the technique was “glide.” The article shows the “spin” technique took over from then onward and records continue to be broken. An American set a new outdoor record of 23.37 m in 2021.
I can perhaps see the first parts of the training as kind of accessory work. Sort of how Aaron Horschig prescribes single leg rdl to improve hip stability and core work. Günthör was basically doing that on a plank (don't know what plank brings?) but I can see how that control would be useful when your starting spot is that hanging with the shot put. Preparatory for sure, not strength developing or technique work, but accessory to build the capability for technique and sport specific training. Like you said, this is a bit different from making strength training hard, because this isn't really strength training, but preparing that body control. I never really thought about it but shot put really does have a lot of balancing, especially when you're holding a heavy ball. Also do you have a lot of lower weight versions of the shot put? Drilling the technique in like you'd do in weightlifting with a lower weight seems difficult if you had to do it with the full weight ball. Very interesting any way, because this looks a bit odd yet it intuitively feels right and not like useless hacks. Am I completely off or are isometrics a good way to build up fitness for your muscle? It feels like so often that halfway range of motion hold starts burning like hell very quickly.
I believe the electric thing may be an old velocity measuring device. It's typically used with throwers on lifts. The coach is probably touching it to reset it
Hey lads, are you familiar with the ecological approach to skill acquisition? I’m still learning about it but it’s been very interesting, BJJ Mental Models had Greg Souders (BJJ coach) and Rob Gray (skill development researcher focusing on the ecological approach) on a couple podcasts and it’s really shifting my view of how to train BJJ.
That's a baaad man. Great video as always. Girlfriend is only mildly annoyed that I woke her up when I was howling with the two of you at Fitz's "Propulsion en poussee"
I read in a Louie Simmons article that supposedly jumping to or from a soft surface places more emphasis on the muscles than the tendons. I have no idea if this is true though.
Actually being the best Dutch field hockey player DOES mean something (a LOT actually), because the Dutch field hockey competition is the strongest in the WORLD. The worlds strongest field Hockey players from countries like India and Australia come here to learn
This gym was famous for this video and the eccentric overload machine (your 'electric thing'). I was lucky enough to visit it in 2018 and ran into Werner on the way out (he still worked there at that stage). More recently Valerie Adams trained there.
Werner was a weightlifter before he was a shot putter from what I’ve heard. He is also the 8th best shot putter in history. Here is what his training program allegedly looked like: www.mbingisser.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/G%C3%BCnth%C3%B6r-Program.pdf
I show that Gunthor video in my classes each semester, and every year we marvel at the man's indomitable strength, fabulous purple lycra suit, and impeccable mustache. Oh and we also analyze his training methods a little bit too.
The lord's work
@@danielghesquiere2011 truly the Lords work.
18:55 you can see the smile creep on Dairre’s face like he knows he’s about to say something funny.
18:57 A Bevis and Butthead moment! 😂
Werner's coach here is Jean Pierre Egger, one of the most intelligent and progressive coaches of all time, he went on to coach Valerie Adams to 4 world and 2 olympic gold medals in the shot. This is the best training video ever, even better than Ivan Drago's prep for USA vs Rus boxing
Was an athlete at the 1987 world champs in Rome, saw Werner at the pool a few times, the pool was an Olympic sized pool in the village. One day I saw him do a back flip into the pool, then later he causally did butterfly across the pool in what seemed like a few strokes. For a big man he was incredibly athletic.
Clarification on what that is at 12:26. It's a machine that makes the eccentric portion of the Squat heavier than the concentric. They do this because you can generate more force in the eccentric part of movement than in the concentric (see: strength-velocity curve). Nowadays we call this supramaximal loading. Very effective but very dangerous too. The amount of muscle damage we can produce in the eccentric is crazy. I just attended a S&C-Weekend in the same facility as Werner Günthör trained (Magglingen, Switzerland). His coach (Jean-Pierre Egger, guy in the white and red suit) gave the opening lecture. That's why I know. Cheers guys, love the content.
Big if true 👀
Yeah this is true, mi French professor in college who known Jean-Pierre Egger told me the same about the machine. It is made to make the eccentric way hard with pneumatic pressure.
I think we all have to step up our Propulsion en poussee
The driplevel in these videos is just astounding
You lads should definitely do Andreas Thorkildsen, he is a Javelin thrower whose workouts are interesting and versatile plus he is an absolute beast regarding upper body strength, especially considering his relatively lean look. Not a lot of people can perform iron cross pull ups and bench 200kg at around 90kg bodyweight.
🤣🤣🤣 the sheer amount of propulsion facing any pousse would be mind blowing
Glad to see Donkey Boy Fitz is growing the beard out
Isometrics are the best way to increase tendon stiffness , which is highly important for any track and field athlete….
Great video guys. Random note and only because you wondered, the location of all the outdoor weight training and track work is Club La Santa Lanzarote in the Canary Islands. Lots of athletes still go there for training camps and it has some spectacular looking facilities.
Outdoor part is In La Santa, Lanzarote.
Saw a version of this video with some commentary, the electric smith machine provides more resistance on the concentric portion of the lift, until it hits those pins (where the video zoomed in and showed it at the beginning). So it resists the concentric until hitting that point, and then is a regular eccentric on the way down. *90% sure that's the previous explanation I saw.
"Impulsion des chevilles" is ankle impulsion
The famous "Propulsion en poussée" would be pushing propulsion
Werner sure had some propulsion en poussée
Exactly! Cheval does mean horse though
(And a baby horse is a "poulain" in french, so now the truth is known)
"wiener sure had some propulsion en poussée" fixed that for you.
At 17:37, "chevilles" means "ankles" in French, so it has no direct relation to "cheval," the French word for "horse." (at least to the best of my knowledge).
Will you guys react live to a few of the sessions of worlds? 89’s lineup looks awesome
Look at how big and tick dat man is 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 hilarious. Great episode thank you for this introduction to such a unit
I was thinking that given the amount of videos the Sika guys have done about throwers, what if they do a video of them trying out the shot put and discus throws? Maybe hammer as well.
22:00 Southern Switzerland looks quite Mediterranean, at least the Italian speaking part where I was.
Another great video from Eehoy and Darek
Those machines are pretty insane, whish we had some of those
The electric smith machine. You could in theory provide a magnetic field and therefor make it harder or lighter :)
Some of the newer ones can lock it if you fail an attempt. Just like a car has a safety when it drives to fast up to a car in front :)
Check out the 1080 Quantum. Can program eccentric and concentric velocities and load through to robotics
Sounds like a grindcore band.
I only discovered these tapes a couple of days ago so this video couldn't have come at a better time
Been waiting in anticipation for this one, can't wait to sink my teeth into it
When I saw you guys had a series of videos about this, I felt like it was basically made for Werner
Fun thing with shotput is you actually should use a heavier shot for your beginners who need technique focus heavier weight means slower movements and more body awareness as well as reduces risk of elbow issues.
I have no idea what the electric thing is. But is has Rocky IV vibes with Drago. This bit where he’s training and they show how advanced they are by showing a treadmill with a crystal… but all ends up with juicing
16:20 I did similar thing back in the day. 30 seconds of isometric hold and then lots of jumps. But i was in power-endurance business and there is made sense to build endurance side of muscle and after pre-fatigue require certain power output out of the muscle. However i wonder if this could help with fiber-activation even with pure power athletes: you pre-fatigue the muscle with holds and then force lazier fibers to engage in activity as dominant ones are out of the game. That way you have to do less plyos for same result (as you said: 130kg guy).
Just a wild guess.
You got me curious about technique comparison.
A new record was set in 1988 by an East German of 23.06. That was when Werner was near his peak and Wikipedia says the technique was “glide.” The article shows the “spin” technique took over from then onward and records continue to be broken. An American set a new outdoor record of 23.37 m in 2021.
Lanzarote Island, Spain. The training center complex is "La Santa Club", still a lot of training camps over there, specially triathletes.
To Fitz, Astronauts often use flywheels for training
I can perhaps see the first parts of the training as kind of accessory work. Sort of how Aaron Horschig prescribes single leg rdl to improve hip stability and core work. Günthör was basically doing that on a plank (don't know what plank brings?) but I can see how that control would be useful when your starting spot is that hanging with the shot put. Preparatory for sure, not strength developing or technique work, but accessory to build the capability for technique and sport specific training. Like you said, this is a bit different from making strength training hard, because this isn't really strength training, but preparing that body control.
I never really thought about it but shot put really does have a lot of balancing, especially when you're holding a heavy ball. Also do you have a lot of lower weight versions of the shot put? Drilling the technique in like you'd do in weightlifting with a lower weight seems difficult if you had to do it with the full weight ball. Very interesting any way, because this looks a bit odd yet it intuitively feels right and not like useless hacks.
Am I completely off or are isometrics a good way to build up fitness for your muscle? It feels like so often that halfway range of motion hold starts burning like hell very quickly.
The location is at the sport resort of Club la Santa which is located in the Canary Islands
I believe the electric thing may be an old velocity measuring device. It's typically used with throwers on lifts. The coach is probably touching it to reset it
Yes. We are watching🧐🇨🇭
Great Video!!
Thatdude had best training out there even by todays standarts.. just wow..
that sunny place at the end is spain, i guess Formentera.
Sadly, cheville isn't a small horse, it's ankles
At 12:28 the device gunthor is using is a Bérénice Machine
Hey lads, are you familiar with the ecological approach to skill acquisition? I’m still learning about it but it’s been very interesting, BJJ Mental Models had Greg Souders (BJJ coach) and Rob Gray (skill development researcher focusing on the ecological approach) on a couple podcasts and it’s really shifting my view of how to train BJJ.
I trained at a gym that had those squat racks where the taller you are the further you need to walk out.
That's a baaad man.
Great video as always. Girlfriend is only mildly annoyed that I woke her up when I was howling with the two of you at Fitz's "Propulsion en poussee"
"Cheville" means ankles in French.
If you do a video on isometrics, you could look into Alex Natera
Thanks for the video
I think he was in California training at the end
What’s a poussée?
A push
I read in a Louie Simmons article that supposedly jumping to or from a soft surface places more emphasis on the muscles than the tendons. I have no idea if this is true though.
"mid to late 80s out of 10" 😂
You should look at the powerlifter Theo Maddox
Actually being the best Dutch field hockey player DOES mean something (a LOT actually), because the Dutch field hockey competition is the strongest in the WORLD. The worlds strongest field Hockey players from countries like India and Australia come here to learn
Thats what they meant?
This gym was famous for this video and the eccentric overload machine (your 'electric thing'). I was lucky enough to visit it in 2018 and ran into Werner on the way out (he still worked there at that stage). More recently Valerie Adams trained there.
one disc is 25 kg, = 55.1 pounds.
At time 21.10, = 200 kg, 22.17 = 250 kg, 22.39 = 200 kg
Believe was lanzorote
If you don't have mats to do plyos with, is going on grass/turf a good alternative?
My concern would be the unevenness of most yards... mole holes, grass clumps,,etc
fyi cheville is ankle and propulsion pousee means pushed propulsion i.e. has nothing to do with pulsing pussy although in certain scenarios it might
"Chevilles" means ankles
Schwiizer wo sind ihr???
Propulsion en poussee
'Adult propulsion' 😂
i know these mats. they're everywhere for track and field. shoes don't work with the mats he jumped on. he needs friction.
So famous you can't even pronounce his name.
Werner was a weightlifter before he was a shot putter from what I’ve heard. He is also the 8th best shot putter in history.
Here is what his training program allegedly looked like:
www.mbingisser.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/G%C3%BCnth%C3%B6r-Program.pdf
He was actually a Decathlete who could high jump over 2 metres.