Sorry to hear you’re injured and I hope you recover soon Tim. I enjoyed watching that, it’s impressive the data that zwift provides. Depending on the injury, I’ve tended to rest/ice and get physio, but also maintain strength training and stretching where I can. I used to have an ongoing back issue but ever since I started the strength training it’s kept it at bay. All the best with your recovery
Thanks and yes been trying to do a bit of all of that. In fact I am off to the physio later today. At least I managed to do a 7 mile run on Wednesday but am also keeping up the biking.
I can relate to your situation Tim. I’ve been sidelined from running the last month and back in Zwift. In fact I just did a ramp test a few days ago. Trying to stay positive and not gain weight and do some strength work.
Good (well sort of) to hear of somebody in a similar situation. I have a little bit of running this past week but need to be patient and keep up the biking. How long do you think it will be before can run again?
@@TimGroseI should be good to go in a month or so, maybe sooner. I'm already easing back in but still get some stiff and achy feelings in the hamstring/hip area if I overdo it. It's very annoying because things were going so well. just ran a 2:53 marathon in April. I'm 52 now so I guess it's to be expected :)
@@roadcyclist1 true but I thought the warm up was going to be a free ride so did not want to be say grinding up the Alps for that. Besides get more virtual miles on the flat :)
I like the full Ramp test, because the Lite test feels like you're warming up for 10-12 minutes with the really low wattages at the beginning. Noting wrong with warming up, but I would rather use my matches to get to the higher wattage levels.
I tried the Lite test before this one but was actually too "easy" for me as stopped at 250W. As you say, it starts very very easy. Ideally, for me, I think if a "middle" one started say 150W and stopped at about 400W it would last a bit longer. Still I think the one I did gave me a fairly accurate FTP. I kind of felt however, as I mentioned, that felt wanted to do something else.
Thanks. I've tried a bit of yoga but one of those things I feel I "should" do but kind of have to force myself to. Kind of ditto with rowing but I cancelled my gym membership few years ago so don't really have access to one. Weights never really done.
Definitely see if you can raise your cadence for future tests, 90rpm or so. It makes better use of aerobic fitness with slightly less reliance on pure leg strength. I like the ramp test as a good repeatable test that only really involves around 5 minutes of actual suffering! In my opinion the result is maybe slightly generous because I doubt I could hold the ftp generated for a whole hour but at least it’s consistent against itself
@@MattSwain1 yeah noted thanks. As may have mentioned if I ever venture outdoors I tend to spin much more. Funny isn’t it that only need 5 mins to estimate something you could maybe hold for about an hour. I did 10x5 min at my new FTP here on Friday and that was way harder in reality although, like any longer effort, never quite as “bad” at any moment. It is bit like comparing a marathon with an 800.
@@kimwarner6050 Ah know the problem. I bought 4 bikes in a couple of years in the mid 90s when was doing some duathlons and time trials and the TT one am on here in 2014 which at least am getting some use out of again. One day might actually venture outside for a proper ride. Have to admit I still have always preferred running but cycling and also golf have always been my backup sports as it were. So if you don’t run now are you still interested in running TH-cam channels even if rarely for me nothing really about running here!
I’m on my BMC/Wahoo while I watch your vids! That said, running (even at a plodding pace for 6 miles/day) gives me more fitness benefits than cycling. For me, elliptical is the best low-impact activity that directly enhances my running strength and endurance.
Ah thanks! Know what you mean but does it just show the best way to train for running is to run. Similarly have noticed feel am going better on the bike than when I got back on month or so OK but know in the past when did some running again properly it was still quite a shock. Interesting thought about elliptical. I don’t really have easy access to one right now.
@@TimGrose Ive found if I spend time on elliptical (let’s say following an injury), I can jump right back into running no problem. Not the same for me with cycling.
Good effort on the ftp test - not easy and once you blow there’s no coming back 🥵I’m trying to manage an Achilles niggle to get the 5K goal of sub-18 min when I turn 60 on 2 September. If I can hang on for these last few races I’ll then have to go into full blown rehab too 😨. Feel your frustration
Thanks and well advised by you to get on my bike. At the very least nice to see a little progression when my Garmin is now telling me my running fitness is getting worse and worse. Sub 18 would be very impressive. I last did one myself with a 17:59 in Poole parkun on Xmas Day 2019 then aged 53. I am 57 now and not too far off 58 and I doubt I will now be able to race again until get there in Nov. I always thought trying to eek out one more sub 18 would be a great aim but for the last year had been struggling to even break 19. I think fundamentally I also have an Achilles injury and feels like the ankle too and have got a fair amount of swelling which some days is worse than others. More physio tomorrow. Hope those races go well but be careful as don't want to tear anything as I have done a few times in the past.
Dealing with a nagging Achilles pain these days, comes and goes, odd...Not bad enough for me to stop running though as has been the case in the past and then yes in that case I hop on the HT too ! Being a 3 hour marathon runner with some practice you should get your FTP way higher than that, easily between 275 and 300 I'd say.
Yeah annoying isn’t it. I thought I had solved my Achilles issues after similar happened in 2017 but is a bit different this time and swelling comes & goes. I did get to around 300W back in 2017 when had a full season of outdoor 10 and 25 mile time trials although I think my power meter was “generous” by about 10W :)
I’ve found I can get a slightly better result on the 20 minute test, though I haven’t taken one for about 6 months. I really got into zwift in the winter when I had a stress reaction. You can maintain a decent level of fitness on it. I was able to return to running in February just in time to do 8 weeks of training for Brighton marathon. I still do a couple of sessions a week on Zwift to supplement my autumn marathon training.
I thought about doing the more "standard" 20 min test but done that before and had not the standard ramp test although I tried the "Lite" one the other week and had not really realised it only goes to 250W and I managed to get through that so the FTP estimation was clearly a little low. I tend to agree about the 20 min one especially for me who, at least at present, just isn't used to cycling and think you notice that more on tests like this when the hard effort is the relatively high watts. That said the ramp test I thought was surprisigly "in the ballpark" at estimating a fairly long duration metric in essentially a few minutes as really that test was only "hard" for about 5 minutes. Last time I had a very long time out running was in 2017 and into 2018 when did a lot of cycling that year including actual outdoor time trials. I found when I did start running it was a bit of a struggle but after a few months saw good progression and 2019 was a good running year. I think I may try and keep up some biking even when hopefully I can run properly again. I always dabbled from time to time in duathlons and bike time trials and as an aerobic activity easily the one I enjoy most after running. Sue just isn't keen on me actually riding outside as she thinks I used to fall off too often!
Yeah know what you mean. I have done a lot of approx 20 min (or 10 mile) bike TTs over the years but thought would try a ramp test this time. TBH I think the 20 min FTP test (especially if also do the suggested harder aggressive warm ups) is harder as it just takes longer. This ramp test was quite easy for a while until all of a sudden it wasn't. As such think could do it more often but ultimately I think the 20 min efforts are going to get me fitter and especially more in tune to what am really trying to do which is keep some fitness for running.
You did well. I think there is a degree of technique to this test. If you do a few of them a week or two apart, I'm sure you would improve just because you know what's coming up. Last one I did was in January, some time ago by now (and it was my first ever!), I did one a few days ago but didn't remember how hard it was and how much it took out of me. Maybe I'll do another next week, I'll be better prepared! A 'light' day the day before might also help... Thanks for sharing the video, lots of info and very informative.
Yeah was thinking just the same. Next time I know I need to survive the 300W and get the cadence up for the 320W and see if can get through it. Equally though I think the standard 20 min test is probably better as a training session but mentally it feels harder as I know they really hurt and you have to self select a wattage and see if can hold it.
Solid effort. Your cadence was dropping towards the end - try to increase it a few seconds before each wattage jump to get a headstart or your legs will limit you before your cardio does. You've definitely got a few more watts to squeeze out.
Yeah thanks I noted in the video my cadence was getting a bit low. I think it is partly a reflection of being rather "rusty" on the bike. Normally in hard efforts outside on this same TT bike I used to operate well over 90 rpm. Something to keep an eye on going forwards as I think a higher cadence ought to be better for me as a runner mainly looking to maintain fitness rather than building up "big" bike legs! That all said, on this occasion, 320W I think was pretty much my limit whatever. I might try the 20 min test next time which have done in the past. Just thought would try this ramp test this time not having not done one properly before - I did the "Lite" the one the other week but actually found it too "easy" as it stopped at 250W whereas this test seemed to get there very quickly.
I don' t know much about cycling but 220s looks pretty good! I' m lucky I rarely have an injury that takes me out for more than a few days. But in the past I've also done some biking and some Aquajogging(a bit boring but it's useful because it's very close to running). The last time I told myself to really focus on strength and stability stuff but found it a bit hard to motivate myself for it when there is no actual running that I'm doing it for;)
Yeah "strength" training always sounds good but TBH I am never quite sure what to do and always think I could do with somebody to directly help/motivate/demonstrate. Otherwise I think well decent mileage build strength - well until get a niggle and you think would it really have helped if had done xyz instead of a few more miles. Maybe this time at least I can work out how to blend in some cycling. Many elite runners just run but they aren't 57 like me!
Thanks! I guess I am a bit of a "fair weather" cyclists but have, at times, taken things a bit more seriously with 2 appearances in the World Age Group Duathlon Championships and I even rode in the National 10 mile time trial champs one year and, over the years, have done a fair number of outdoor 10 and 25 mile bike TT races. I certainly noticed my bike "legs" have got better after a month or so of riding on Zwift a few times a week. Think my biggest problem is still just feeling "comfortable" enough to ride for an hour at a time especially on Zwift when, even spinning along, you have to keep pedalling.
Found that strangely compelling. I have a Watt Bike from my recent injury years. I liked the Zwift set up although it seems they've not pursued the running side of the set up.
Ah I used to use a Watt Bike at the gym quite a lot (especially in 2017/8 when had a similar Achilles/ankle injury to now) and even bought their extended seat post with a saddle as I found the standard one did not quite go high enough :) I remember hooking up to Zwift on my iPad back then as well. Indeed I did first Zwift Run runs there too. Yeah I saw a recent interview with Zwift CEO Eric Min where he admitted they are just focusing on the ride side at the moment. However he did hint that the upcoming Wahoo KICKR RUN may give the space the type of hardware needed to make Zwift Run similarly immersive to Zwift Ride.
@@tworunningbrooms I think “end up” is key. Think will depend on the uptake of the Wahoo and how many rivals decide to make something similar and that will have to include gym treadmills as these things aren’t cheap.
I’ve found that the limiting factor is your leg strength if you’ve only just recently moved on to the bike for cross training. When cycling I prefer to go on the roads when the weather is good but I think Zwift is good for structured workouts and peaking the HR, which is needed if you want to go back to running in the best shape you can be in. I’m going to do the London marathon next year so doubt I will see you at an indoor event but sounds like a good aim for you. Maybe see you in early December at the British 5k champs in Battersea Park!
Yeah exactly that with leg strength on the bike but have already seen progress. Month ago was doing 40 sec/20 sec on/off at 200W and now my FTP is 227W. Not sure how I ever had an effective FTP around 300W. Think next time might try the 20 min test as then much closer to the 10 mile bike outdoor TT races I have done many of with a PB of 21:10 years ago and even 22:20 in 2017 when I had a year of biking largely for very similar injury reasons to now. I hope I will be able to actually race again sometime this year but it might well be Dec before both recover physically and aerobically. I think now I might wait until 60 to do another marathon. That "just" sub 3 last year felt some sense of closure and clearly right now would be nowhere near it.
@@TimGrose London *might* be my last one if I can crack the 2:40 barrier. I’ll be all in for that with a long build. If it is, then I might turn my attention to focusing on the shorter track stuff, even 800s!
also having issues with my ankle/foot/leg, plantar and tendon issues, for me it was speed sessions in the endorphin speed 4, not sure, but it seemed like you picked up your injury after... speed sessions in the endorphin speed 4.... ?? the last FTP test I did I got 240 (max heartrate) and almost died...
Ah sorry to hear that. TBH I don't think it is was any particular shoe and when I first really noticed it was after some 800 and 200 reps on the track in Vaporflys although oddly the session itself went well and was only when did a short warm down afterwards noticed the problems you also have. Since I have mainly used the Peg 41 to do longish walks with a bit of running at the end. I think it is a weakness I have had for a while and seemed quite similar to what really restricted my running back in 2017/8 which eventually cleared up and I ran well in 2019. True that I have done a fair bit in the Speed 4 including an actual Speed session but TBH that went fine although it was only a few days before the one I first noticed the problem. How long have you had the issues now and is it getting any better? I do at least feel today a little better but I didn't even do a walk yesterday. Are you also doing some cycling to maintain general fitness? I wasn't sure it is possible to get a 240 HR ! Mine is now so low (only got to 151 here) but as you may heard felt like was panting as much as I could !!!
@TimGrose I think it's been about 12 weeks, been much better over the last week or so and been running day on day off 5mile runs, need those rest days as I get older, was doing 6 days training one day off before and although there was a big improvement in performance it proved to be too much stress on the body. 240 wasn't a pleasant experience, although it was pre my type1 diagnosis so there might have been a hypo thrown in there for extra BPM stats. Wish I could churn out the watts I can produce whilst running, on the bike, but it just doesn't seem to work out that way. injuries are no fun, get well soon, Tim.
It is pretty much exactly 3.0 W/kg. Am 76 kg at present. Seemed to have put on a few kg since had to cut back running for last 2 months when was more like 73 kg.
Funny because I thought shall I do a video on this and I glad I did but it made what might have been all done and dusted in 20 mins take up half a day in the filming, execution and editing. Perhaps I could have just recorded about ten 5 minute sound bites on about ten shoes.
Yeah 300W that was my clearly my limit on this occassion. As soon as it ticked over to 320W, I only lasted a few seconds. I did speed up part of it around here to sort show the whole conclusion but also at the time my head was very close to my mic on the top of my singlet so think my panting just sounded even louder!
I know - they are a strange kind of torture you don't really do in running. That said this ramp test seemed incredibly "efficient". I was probably really only "trying" for about 5 mins and then all of a sudden that was it. Short of running up a mountain hard to think of a situation running where you literally would run out of all steam. Out of interest did you used to race competitively on the bike and what is it about cycling that you felt had to stop? It is often the other way round and runners taking to cycling as got older as "easier" on the legs.
@@TimGrose Ya, the ramp test only has a few minutes of pain… but the thing is… you know it is coming and when it hits it REALLY hits. Valuable data, but man, brutal tests. The thing is though is FTP doesn’t lie, at least on the bike. It’s a very objective gauge of fitness. More than we have in running, even if you train by power.
Sorry to hear you’re injured and I hope you recover soon Tim. I enjoyed watching that, it’s impressive the data that zwift provides. Depending on the injury, I’ve tended to rest/ice and get physio, but also maintain strength training and stretching where I can. I used to have an ongoing back issue but ever since I started the strength training it’s kept it at bay. All the best with your recovery
Thanks and yes been trying to do a bit of all of that. In fact I am off to the physio later today. At least I managed to do a 7 mile run on Wednesday but am also keeping up the biking.
I can relate to your situation Tim. I’ve been sidelined from running the last month and back in Zwift. In fact I just did a ramp test a few days ago. Trying to stay positive and not gain weight and do some strength work.
Good (well sort of) to hear of somebody in a similar situation. I have a little bit of running this past week but need to be patient and keep up the biking. How long do you think it will be before can run again?
@@TimGroseI should be good to go in a month or so, maybe sooner. I'm already easing back in but still get some stiff and achy feelings in the hamstring/hip area if I overdo it. It's very annoying because things were going so well. just ran a 2:53 marathon in April. I'm 52 now so I guess it's to be expected :)
It doesn't matter if you choose a flat course or not for ramp rest. The incline doesn't affect the test at all.
Agreed, it only affects the speed that the avatar moves through the world, doesn’t affect the test
@@roadcyclist1 true but I thought the warm up was going to be a free ride so did not want to be say grinding up the Alps for that. Besides get more virtual miles on the flat :)
I like the full Ramp test, because the Lite test feels like you're warming up for 10-12 minutes with the really low wattages at the beginning. Noting wrong with warming up, but I would rather use my matches to get to the higher wattage levels.
I tried the Lite test before this one but was actually too "easy" for me as stopped at 250W. As you say, it starts very very easy. Ideally, for me, I think if a "middle" one started say 150W and stopped at about 400W it would last a bit longer. Still I think the one I did gave me a fairly accurate FTP. I kind of felt however, as I mentioned, that felt wanted to do something else.
Well done Tim!
Yoga, Rowing and weights when Im injured. Hope your back running healthy again soon.
Thanks. I've tried a bit of yoga but one of those things I feel I "should" do but kind of have to force myself to. Kind of ditto with rowing but I cancelled my gym membership few years ago so don't really have access to one. Weights never really done.
Definitely see if you can raise your cadence for future tests, 90rpm or so. It makes better use of aerobic fitness with slightly less reliance on pure leg strength.
I like the ramp test as a good repeatable test that only really involves around 5 minutes of actual suffering! In my opinion the result is maybe slightly generous because I doubt I could hold the ftp generated for a whole hour but at least it’s consistent against itself
@@MattSwain1 yeah noted thanks. As may have mentioned if I ever venture outdoors I tend to spin much more. Funny isn’t it that only need 5 mins to estimate something you could maybe hold for about an hour. I did 10x5 min at my new FTP here on Friday and that was way harder in reality although, like any longer effort, never quite as “bad” at any moment. It is bit like comparing a marathon with an 800.
Injured my knee a few years running. I bought a bike, them many more bikes. I never went back to running. Cycling is way more fun
@@kimwarner6050 Ah know the problem. I bought 4 bikes in a couple of years in the mid 90s when was doing some duathlons and time trials and the TT one am on here in 2014 which at least am getting some use out of again. One day might actually venture outside for a proper ride. Have to admit I still have always preferred running but cycling and also golf have always been my backup sports as it were. So if you don’t run now are you still interested in running TH-cam channels even if rarely for me nothing really about running here!
@@TimGrose I still keep up on the shoe tech. Maybe one day I'll start running again.
I’m on my BMC/Wahoo while I watch your vids!
That said, running (even at a plodding pace for 6 miles/day) gives me more fitness benefits than cycling.
For me, elliptical is the best low-impact activity that directly enhances my running strength and endurance.
Ah thanks! Know what you mean but does it just show the best way to train for running is to run. Similarly have noticed feel am going better on the bike than when I got back on month or so OK but know in the past when did some running again properly it was still quite a shock. Interesting thought about elliptical. I don’t really have easy access to one right now.
@@TimGrose Ive found if I spend time on elliptical (let’s say following an injury), I can jump right back into running no problem. Not the same for me with cycling.
Good effort on the ftp test - not easy and once you blow there’s no coming back 🥵I’m trying to manage an Achilles niggle to get the 5K goal of sub-18 min when I turn 60 on 2 September. If I can hang on for these last few races I’ll then have to go into full blown rehab too 😨. Feel your frustration
Thanks and well advised by you to get on my bike. At the very least nice to see a little progression when my Garmin is now telling me my running fitness is getting worse and worse. Sub 18 would be very impressive. I last did one myself with a 17:59 in Poole parkun on Xmas Day 2019 then aged 53. I am 57 now and not too far off 58 and I doubt I will now be able to race again until get there in Nov. I always thought trying to eek out one more sub 18 would be a great aim but for the last year had been struggling to even break 19. I think fundamentally I also have an Achilles injury and feels like the ankle too and have got a fair amount of swelling which some days is worse than others. More physio tomorrow. Hope those races go well but be careful as don't want to tear anything as I have done a few times in the past.
Dealing with a nagging Achilles pain these days, comes and goes, odd...Not bad enough for me to stop running though as has been the case in the past and then yes in that case I hop on the HT too !
Being a 3 hour marathon runner with some practice you should get your FTP way higher than that, easily between 275 and 300 I'd say.
Yeah annoying isn’t it. I thought I had solved my Achilles issues after similar happened in 2017 but is a bit different this time and swelling comes & goes. I did get to around 300W back in 2017 when had a full season of outdoor 10 and 25 mile time trials although I think my power meter was “generous” by about 10W :)
I’ve found I can get a slightly better result on the 20 minute test, though I haven’t taken one for about 6 months. I really got into zwift in the winter when I had a stress reaction. You can maintain a decent level of fitness on it. I was able to return to running in February just in time to do 8 weeks of training for Brighton marathon. I still do a couple of sessions a week on Zwift to supplement my autumn marathon training.
I thought about doing the more "standard" 20 min test but done that before and had not the standard ramp test although I tried the "Lite" one the other week and had not really realised it only goes to 250W and I managed to get through that so the FTP estimation was clearly a little low. I tend to agree about the 20 min one especially for me who, at least at present, just isn't used to cycling and think you notice that more on tests like this when the hard effort is the relatively high watts. That said the ramp test I thought was surprisigly "in the ballpark" at estimating a fairly long duration metric in essentially a few minutes as really that test was only "hard" for about 5 minutes. Last time I had a very long time out running was in 2017 and into 2018 when did a lot of cycling that year including actual outdoor time trials. I found when I did start running it was a bit of a struggle but after a few months saw good progression and 2019 was a good running year. I think I may try and keep up some biking even when hopefully I can run properly again. I always dabbled from time to time in duathlons and bike time trials and as an aerobic activity easily the one I enjoy most after running. Sue just isn't keen on me actually riding outside as she thinks I used to fall off too often!
Good job. Not sure what i find harder, the ramp test or an all out 20 minute effort. Both are enjoyable in a grim sort of way!
Yeah know what you mean. I have done a lot of approx 20 min (or 10 mile) bike TTs over the years but thought would try a ramp test this time. TBH I think the 20 min FTP test (especially if also do the suggested harder aggressive warm ups) is harder as it just takes longer. This ramp test was quite easy for a while until all of a sudden it wasn't. As such think could do it more often but ultimately I think the 20 min efforts are going to get me fitter and especially more in tune to what am really trying to do which is keep some fitness for running.
You did well. I think there is a degree of technique to this test. If you do a few of them a week or two apart, I'm sure you would improve just because you know what's coming up. Last one I did was in January, some time ago by now (and it was my first ever!), I did one a few days ago but didn't remember how hard it was and how much it took out of me. Maybe I'll do another next week, I'll be better prepared! A 'light' day the day before might also help...
Thanks for sharing the video, lots of info and very informative.
Yeah was thinking just the same. Next time I know I need to survive the 300W and get the cadence up for the 320W and see if can get through it. Equally though I think the standard 20 min test is probably better as a training session but mentally it feels harder as I know they really hurt and you have to self select a wattage and see if can hold it.
Solid effort. Your cadence was dropping towards the end - try to increase it a few seconds before each wattage jump to get a headstart or your legs will limit you before your cardio does. You've definitely got a few more watts to squeeze out.
Yeah thanks I noted in the video my cadence was getting a bit low. I think it is partly a reflection of being rather "rusty" on the bike. Normally in hard efforts outside on this same TT bike I used to operate well over 90 rpm. Something to keep an eye on going forwards as I think a higher cadence ought to be better for me as a runner mainly looking to maintain fitness rather than building up "big" bike legs! That all said, on this occasion, 320W I think was pretty much my limit whatever. I might try the 20 min test next time which have done in the past. Just thought would try this ramp test this time not having not done one properly before - I did the "Lite" the one the other week but actually found it too "easy" as it stopped at 250W whereas this test seemed to get there very quickly.
I don' t know much about cycling but 220s looks pretty good!
I' m lucky I rarely have an injury that takes me out for more than a few days. But in the past I've also done some biking and some Aquajogging(a bit boring but it's useful because it's very close to running).
The last time I told myself to really focus on strength and stability stuff but found it a bit hard to motivate myself for it when there is no actual running that I'm doing it for;)
Yeah "strength" training always sounds good but TBH I am never quite sure what to do and always think I could do with somebody to directly help/motivate/demonstrate. Otherwise I think well decent mileage build strength - well until get a niggle and you think would it really have helped if had done xyz instead of a few more miles. Maybe this time at least I can work out how to blend in some cycling. Many elite runners just run but they aren't 57 like me!
Thats very respectible GFA FTP score for a non cyclist Tim and shows your good internal foundation based on all of your running through the years.
Thanks! I guess I am a bit of a "fair weather" cyclists but have, at times, taken things a bit more seriously with 2 appearances in the World Age Group Duathlon Championships and I even rode in the National 10 mile time trial champs one year and, over the years, have done a fair number of outdoor 10 and 25 mile bike TT races. I certainly noticed my bike "legs" have got better after a month or so of riding on Zwift a few times a week. Think my biggest problem is still just feeling "comfortable" enough to ride for an hour at a time especially on Zwift when, even spinning along, you have to keep pedalling.
Found that strangely compelling. I have a Watt Bike from my recent injury years. I liked the Zwift set up although it seems they've not pursued the running side of the set up.
Ah I used to use a Watt Bike at the gym quite a lot (especially in 2017/8 when had a similar Achilles/ankle injury to now) and even bought their extended seat post with a saddle as I found the standard one did not quite go high enough :) I remember hooking up to Zwift on my iPad back then as well. Indeed I did first Zwift Run runs there too. Yeah I saw a recent interview with Zwift CEO Eric Min where he admitted they are just focusing on the ride side at the moment. However he did hint that the upcoming Wahoo KICKR RUN may give the space the type of hardware needed to make Zwift Run similarly immersive to Zwift Ride.
@@TimGrose which they might end up charging for. Currently free.
@@tworunningbrooms I think “end up” is key. Think will depend on the uptake of the Wahoo and how many rivals decide to make something similar and that will have to include gym treadmills as these things aren’t cheap.
I’ve found that the limiting factor is your leg strength if you’ve only just recently moved on to the bike for cross training. When cycling I prefer to go on the roads when the weather is good but I think Zwift is good for structured workouts and peaking the HR, which is needed if you want to go back to running in the best shape you can be in.
I’m going to do the London marathon next year so doubt I will see you at an indoor event but sounds like a good aim for you. Maybe see you in early December at the British 5k champs in Battersea Park!
Yeah exactly that with leg strength on the bike but have already seen progress. Month ago was doing 40 sec/20 sec on/off at 200W and now my FTP is 227W. Not sure how I ever had an effective FTP around 300W. Think next time might try the 20 min test as then much closer to the 10 mile bike outdoor TT races I have done many of with a PB of 21:10 years ago and even 22:20 in 2017 when I had a year of biking largely for very similar injury reasons to now. I hope I will be able to actually race again sometime this year but it might well be Dec before both recover physically and aerobically. I think now I might wait until 60 to do another marathon. That "just" sub 3 last year felt some sense of closure and clearly right now would be nowhere near it.
@@TimGrose London *might* be my last one if I can crack the 2:40 barrier. I’ll be all in for that with a long build. If it is, then I might turn my attention to focusing on the shorter track stuff, even 800s!
Nice work sir.
Thanks!
Interesting stuff 😉.👍👍
Thanks - thought be worth looking at the whole process and I haven't been able to do any running race or even "proper" training vlogs of late.
also having issues with my ankle/foot/leg, plantar and tendon issues, for me it was speed sessions in the endorphin speed 4, not sure, but it seemed like you picked up your injury after... speed sessions in the endorphin speed 4.... ??
the last FTP test I did I got 240 (max heartrate) and almost died...
Ah sorry to hear that. TBH I don't think it is was any particular shoe and when I first really noticed it was after some 800 and 200 reps on the track in Vaporflys although oddly the session itself went well and was only when did a short warm down afterwards noticed the problems you also have. Since I have mainly used the Peg 41 to do longish walks with a bit of running at the end. I think it is a weakness I have had for a while and seemed quite similar to what really restricted my running back in 2017/8 which eventually cleared up and I ran well in 2019. True that I have done a fair bit in the Speed 4 including an actual Speed session but TBH that went fine although it was only a few days before the one I first noticed the problem. How long have you had the issues now and is it getting any better? I do at least feel today a little better but I didn't even do a walk yesterday. Are you also doing some cycling to maintain general fitness? I wasn't sure it is possible to get a 240 HR ! Mine is now so low (only got to 151 here) but as you may heard felt like was panting as much as I could !!!
@TimGrose I think it's been about 12 weeks, been much better over the last week or so and been running day on day off 5mile runs, need those rest days as I get older, was doing 6 days training one day off before and although there was a big improvement in performance it proved to be too much stress on the body.
240 wasn't a pleasant experience, although it was pre my type1 diagnosis so there might have been a hypo thrown in there for extra BPM stats.
Wish I could churn out the watts I can produce whilst running, on the bike, but it just doesn't seem to work out that way.
injuries are no fun, get well soon, Tim.
How much is your power per kilogram? 3.5w/kg?
It is pretty much exactly 3.0 W/kg. Am 76 kg at present. Seemed to have put on a few kg since had to cut back running for last 2 months when was more like 73 kg.
Interesting stuff Tim. That's all a bit involved for me but pretty incredible how it all works though. 😎🤘
Funny because I thought shall I do a video on this and I glad I did but it made what might have been all done and dusted in 20 mins take up half a day in the filming, execution and editing. Perhaps I could have just recorded about ten 5 minute sound bites on about ten shoes.
Your breathing really speeded up at 300, or maybe u had the tape on double speed
Yeah 300W that was my clearly my limit on this occassion. As soon as it ticked over to 320W, I only lasted a few seconds. I did speed up part of it around here to sort show the whole conclusion but also at the time my head was very close to my mic on the top of my singlet so think my panting just sounded even louder!
Morning
Another easy win. Has Fabster "retired" :)
I do not Miss FTP tests...not at all...
I know - they are a strange kind of torture you don't really do in running. That said this ramp test seemed incredibly "efficient". I was probably really only "trying" for about 5 mins and then all of a sudden that was it. Short of running up a mountain hard to think of a situation running where you literally would run out of all steam. Out of interest did you used to race competitively on the bike and what is it about cycling that you felt had to stop? It is often the other way round and runners taking to cycling as got older as "easier" on the legs.
@@TimGrose Ya, the ramp test only has a few minutes of pain… but the thing is… you know it is coming and when it hits it REALLY hits. Valuable data, but man, brutal tests.
The thing is though is FTP doesn’t lie, at least on the bike. It’s a very objective gauge of fitness. More than we have in running, even if you train by power.