Ups & Downs From Star Trek: Lower Decks 4.1 - Twovix
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2023
- Lower Decks is back! So is Voyager!
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Best line of the episode: "It's Voyager. Sh*t got freaky." 😆🖖
I imagine when they got back it was a long debate on whether to give the crew a medal or toss them in jail for a few things...
I mean, that should have been the tagline for voyager
@@tenofprime or both and in what order it should be done.....
"We're Starfleet officers. Weird is part of the job." - Janeway to Kim
I vote for: "This ship got damaged by cheese?"
“This ship is outdated and smells like borg.” Had me in stitches.
What would Borg smell like? Diesel and rotting flesh?
I thought that line was weird, the Intrepid Class is still contemporary and a lot more advanced than, say, the Cerritos.
The lizard babies.... Just gonna throw out there was like 3+ babies but there was only two robo-lizards. Leads me to believe it was not the babies but Janeway and Paris instead, which made the lizard sitting in the captains chair all the funnier
I wish janeway kept them in a terrarium like picards fish in his ready room
Yeah this channel is kind of weird..... Sometimes they miss OBVIOUS stuff when they even mention it and then will say like see how this jacket is 3-1 stitched when the others are 2-3 stitched well that is a reference to the third episode of 4th season of TNG yadda yadda yadda. I mean the fact that he even said one is sitting in Janeway's seat sitting quite Janewayesque should have been the hit you over the head moment that it was not the lizard babies.
@@YukonWilleh gee would you keep your highly evolved kids in such a place? Chakotay made the right decision to leave them on their world
@@Tallacus Well, not perfect leaving them there, but it was probably the best option.
That's what I thought
17:44 In the German dubbed version, Margot Rothweiler, aged 77, returned as the computer voice. She was the computer voice of the U.S.S. Voyager and the U.S.S. Enterprise E. It was absolutely wonderful to hear that voice again after 21 years. She was last heard in Star Trek Nemesis.
wow
Sean! SERIOUSLY?!?!?...how in the galaxy do you NOT say one word about Shaks asking T'illips, 'Just how many, physical, memories do you have?' 🤷🏼♂️🤯
I could swear when I saw Voyager, I heard a petite lady named Ellie from the UK cry out joyfully.
Also the human salamanders where of Janeway and Paris because there are only 2 not 3. Which makes more funny that the borg salamander sitting in the captain’s chair could have been the salamander that represented Janeway.
That's absolutely how I read it as well. The writers took the idea of all of the Voyager deepcuts from the perspective of the curator. That means the curator would not have cared about representing the babies, but rather Paris & Janeway.
Yeah, that's Janeway Salamander, and she sits right like the Real Janeway, totally hilarious, it's another missing up
SalamathrynJanemander
Oh-ho! You are correct! I didn't catch that and thought they were of the babies.
WERE, not where. Why do I see SO MANY IDIOTS confuse a verb with a preposition?
"Shaka when the walls fell" was my favorite part of the episode.
I did like how it addressed the controversy of Tuvix, confirm it was murder, but also vindicate Janeway's choice as Voyager was alone in the Delta Quadrant with limited options and she had to consider Tyvok and Neelix's lives aswell.
How did T’Illips response to Shax’s question about memories not get an up?!?!
I was just about to jump on here and say just that. In fact, I'd say the lack of a mention of that scene is a down for this video.
I guess Sean missed that one. Another thing I was thinking is that I'm pretty sure the scene of the mysterious ship destroying the Romulans was on episode 1, right after the scene of the Klingons. Am I wrong? If I'm not, I guess Sean might have missed that one too.
I howled at that
@@gardinchannel1166it was the beginning of episode 2
I will give you my Up from remembering that, totally hilarious
The problem with Tuvix was that while the narration stated that he was with the crew for several weeks, allowing the crew to get to know him, he was only in one episode, so the audience didn't get to know him. Imagine how much more impact it would have had if he had been in several episodes before being split up again!
the show runner for voyager hated doing anything more then anomaly of the week episodes, when he left DS9 is when they started doing more overarching story
Which is better. An over arching storyline has too much drama, and we're talking sci fi to tap into social issues. I don't want Days of Our Lives.
@@mickeyinc So you prefer the "hit the reset button every week" with not character development? All they needed was a few episodes with Tuvix instead of Neelix and Tuvok.
@@apmcd47 well all the characters grew, like 7 of 9. I guess Tuvix hanging around wouldn't have been a bad idea, but the episode stands on it's own. Your argument is let's build the tension and drama by making him more of an integral part making the decision harder. To what effect? The point was already made well in the episode, you don't need to drag it on, this is perhaps the biggest gripe with discovery. You pretty much know the outcome it just gets dragged on to try to make you 'feel'. No, trek is supposed to get you to ask important questions not feel bad. The debate about what a captain should do is the real philosophical question, not the drama of the characters crying for 30 minutes of an episode like Burnham does.
@@mickeyinc Hey, that's Voyager you're talking about - no character development at all for anyone besides 7 and the doctor.
I loved how excited Mariner is about going to Voyager. Between this and he NX museum mention in TOS she's turning into a real historic ships fan-girl.
She appreciates a lady with fine lines.
Mariner has a degree in xenohistory. She's a massive nerd, she just hides it well.
I actually got into star trek thanks to lower decks, i saw that i didnt NEED to know about star trek to watch it, i knew i would've miss a lot of references but i didnt mind, until my curiosity just got the better of me and i started watching star trek by the end of 2021, watched all of it and i actually really enjoyed it, to the point of becoming a fan, i'm really glad i did.
My poor 15-year-old son was just trying to watch the show, and stupid Daddy kept laughing out loud at the oblique references to Janeway's "solution" and especially, "I miss my wife."
I cannot explain to you how much I love Voyager.
Both the show AND the ship.
Ep1 was just amazing in every way
As someone whose first time watching Star Trek was with Voyager, this episode was perfection. Without Voyager I wouldn’t be a Star Trek fan and seeing all of the references made me so happy.
Pretty much same. I’d seen a new TNG episodes through sheer cultural osmosis but it was voyager that was my first Trek series that I actively watched & stole my heart.
@@Sk8rToon Same here! It's a really special show. I always go to Voyager when I need to feel like everything is going to be alright because that's exactly what happens with Voyager; it's all alright in the end!
Same here. If it wasn't for Voyager, I wouldn't have become a Star Trek fan or a sci-fi fan in general. Seeing all this love for Voyager in the various shows recently has made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. Voyager is my safe place, even when there are macro viruses on the loose!
Joining in here with the same response LOL. I was aware of the previous Trek's that were out before Voyager but it was Voyager that got me hooked onto Star Trek and then I went back and watched everything properly and became a proper Star Trek fan. If it wasn't for Voyager not only would I have not maybe got into Star Trek but it also helped me through a difficult time in my life back when it aired on TV and because of that Voyager will always hold a special place in my heart!
Same here. My first Foster Dad got me into Star Trek and was the only way my first Foster Mom would allow myself, my brother, and my foster siblings actually stay up an extra hour past our bedtime.
Voyager was the first show I ever laid my eyes on and paid attention to during this time and was how I fell in love with Star Trek and the Franchise!
My heart felt all warm and fuzzy and brought up memories of those times back at my first foster home.
Thanks Captain Janeway and Co. for convincing my first foster parents that we needed to stay up for Voyager! Lol. LLAP. 💖🖖🌈
I literally teared up when Voyager came on the screen with the theme playing in the background. Between Prodigy, Picard season 3, and this episode Voyager fans are getting spoiled as of late haha
Two things:
There was a VOY joke you missed. If not named T'illups, what would their name be?
Also, none of the wreckage scenes have bodies; I have a feeling the lack of an explicit explosion from that beam is intentional. Don't write off our Klingon friends just yet.
Ha! The naming joke is awesome.
Well spotted! 💯👍
I was just going to mention the possibility the Klingons aren't dead. in the follow-up in the second episode's opening, it looked like a transporter beam was activated just before the ship exploded.
Bilana, genius lol 😂🤣
According to the Memory Alpha wiki, Lower Decks 4x07 scheduled for oct 12 will be the 900th produced episode of Star Trek!
Not exactly. MA counts productions not episodes and includes the movies and counts the double episodes (Encounter at Farpoint, Way of the Warrior, Caretaker, etc) as one each. The actual 900th episode will be the season 4 finale of Lower Decks.
@@hypered0100so all your episodes, double counts and movies changes the figures by 3 heh? So he say 407, you say 410. 10-7 is 3
Theres more than 3 double episodes in one franchise alone, so all them doubled, plus 12 movies, plus whatever… is not 3
@@hypered0100 I did specify produced eps. Don't understand how you are counting if it's only off by 3 eps?
@@Fred247 @samwalker8893 Firstly a movie is not an episode and MA counts the movies along with the pilot 'The Cage' neither of which CBS/ Paramount include in their tally specifically of broadcast episodes. There are 11 double episodes which CBS/ Paramount count as two each, so starting with MA's count it's minus 14 (movies and Cage) and then add 11 for the double episodes. Hence the count being off by three.
However you count, my original comment is fact and, I think, worth noting.
One of my favorite details was with Chaotica, if you pay close attention, his holo image flickers once in a while like it's a film projection
And there was heavy film grain being animated on his character model.
@@ffreedI noticed both of those. It was a neat touch.
I wish Seska was one of the holograms used by the macrovirus, it would've been perfect for this episode 😂
I would agree, but considering how dangerous the Seska program would have been, I'm sure Starfleet would have straight up deleted her, or throw her at the AI holding facility at Daystrom's.
fr she probably would have beat them easily i bet they burned the gel pack as soon as the credits rolled lol@@jgvillan01
Seska from Worst Case Scenario I assume
@@jgvillan01probably the latter
@@jgvillan01given how dangerous the Borg nanites were, you’d think they’d have purged all of them too. And the macro virus. Maybe Starfleet aren’t as thorough after all!
I love Trek Culture, but nothing beats my weekly Ups and Downs!
Well, except for Ellie saying " Goodbye, sweeties " ❤
Ellie
I love little masks slip from Mariner when she sees Voyager, she just as excited as the rest of the gang (maybe even more excited than the rest). With standard Mariner redirection "Boimler gonna flip" after that.
I don't know, Tawny Newsome preferred Deep Space Nine instead
7:20 - I do think it's worth mentioning that joining T'ana, a character with an extremely over-the-top sex life, with the asexual Billups was an interesting choice.
I loved the tuvix stuff and the fact they kept on mentioning he was murdered 😂😂
I laughed every time they said it.
No ups for Ransome saying “Shaka when the walls fell” and Kayshon saying “Sokath his eyes uncovered”
Followed by Ransome saying he’s been paying attention!!!
Come on!!!
That made me laugh, especially the fist bump
The Fear hologram was most likely developed by the curator for a presentation or a display. I know it's not explicitly stated, but it makes the most sense considering that no one on VOY was going to create a replica, and the doctor did not directly interact with Fear, therefore there was no holographic copy made.
The clown sneakily uploading himself
through the Doctor's connection as eg a hidden file found by the lizard/macrovirus Borg could've explained the apparent inconsistency of his presence in a more enjoyable way than simply lampshading it, so that's a down for me. :)
I think they missed the opportunity for the clown to retell his last words when he gets deleted. "I'm afraid ...."
The inclusion of the whale probe in the intro is a deep, deep cut reference to the novel Probe, where we learn that the probe was damaged in a Borg encounter prior to the events of The Voyage Home. It's beta/non-canon of course, but still suitable for the LD intro.
"The mites in their cuboid ships"
Good book that. Has an interesting take on the Romulans.
Was that a Shatner-verse? I've definitely read it, and I swear it has a sequel or follow up. I remember someone in a crystal
@@auricstorm No, it was 30 years ago, well before Shatner got started.
That's so interesting that they paired T'Lin with Tendi, the most expressive, emotional person in the lower decks. And she doesn't seem annoyed. They each do their own thing. ❤😊
I was surprised they weren't Tuvixed
I love a lot of the bridges in Star Trek. The Enterprice D, Pike's Enterprise, Discovery, and Kirk's Enterprise A... But Voyager's bridge feels like home. It has always been my absolute favorite ship and my favorite bridge. And this just might be my favorite Lower Decks episode (so far).
My first complete watch of voyager, I had a sick surround sound and the hum of the ship through those speakers really made it. Love that low drone humming.
Funny thing, I watched the Voyager episode “Tuvix” 6 hours beforehand, without realizing that “Twovix” existed
I have a playlist of movies and tv episodes shuffling on my living room tv 24/7. I walk through and there might be anything out of several thousand files playing at any time (including looney toons, TNG-VOY, robotech, forever knight, mst3k, just random cool stuff from my adolescence) and it just so happened that the other day, i was going to the store and stopped to watch a few minutes of Tuvix. Serendipitous indeed.
Just amazed at the level of quality we are getting in both Strange New Worlds and Lower Decks. The second Golden age has begun.
I'd argue the second golden age began a couple years ago.
I'd say we've had one hell of a streak: LD S2, DISCO S4, SNW S1, LD S3, Prodigy, PIC S3, SNW S2, and now LD S4
@@forrestpenrod2294 I think believe you are right, prodigy, lower decks, and Strange new worlds have been fantastic. I think I just don’t like Discover enough to want to lump them in. Don’t get me wrong, the first 2 seasons of discovery were pretty fun…. It’s the latter two that didn’t resonate with me at all.
I think T'Linn was transporting them all to the brig, but because she transported them together they melded into one huge blob.
As Séan said, she made a whoopsie, it was a mistake. That's how they sidestepped the ethical problem.
Yep. No murder, just accidental death caused by reasonable selfdefense :P
It makes me wonder why would one be so willing to use the transporter then? This device is so glitchy and dangerous.
@@wpaunan Except that the billions of times it gets used every single day without incident throughout the galaxy makes for a crap episode of television.
@@wpaunan The writers need something to set up drama in an episode. The Warp Core or Transporters malfunctioning somehow makes that incredibly easy.
That whale probe in the credits battle.. its purpose in life was cetacean observation. I choose to believe that they added it as a shout out to Seán and Kris.
You know it's a good episode when the ups and downs run longer than the episode itself 😂
Voyager looked amazing. All the space stuff looked amazing.
How did them gagging at the simulated Nelix cooking not get an up I laughed so hard!
The most frustrating thing about the computer voice in new trek is that right before she passed away she took the time to have a full voice recording of her for at the nowadays primitive text to speech bot but with modern AI it would be easy her last gift to trek was the ability to have her be the computer forever
This is not what happened, and specifically what she did record was not for that purpose. Her family respected that
do you have a link? From what I remember Apple had talked to Gene about her being the voice of Siri which they thought would be cool so she recorded them? @@samwalker8893
Also I would like to point out the computer was infected by the Borg so not using Majel Barrett works in a way.
Possibly my favouritist episode of StarTrek of all time 😂 "They broke the ship with cheese?!" 🤣
I was initially like, "How could Starfleet have missed a micro virus lying dormant. What happened to ship quarantines and periodic baryon sweeps." Sure, Voyager could have returned with one, but one would think the Baryon sweeps that they made an entire episode out of in TNG could take care of it. Then I recall that it eliminates organic matter, which Voyager depends on with its Bioneural circuitry. So either they would have to remove all the binaural components (ridiculous extensive work) or shield them from radiation, so finding a Macrovirus behind the protective casing of a bioneural Gell pack makes sense. The Borg nanoprode didn't really need much explanation, as those regenerative chambers were probably filled to the brim with them. Great episode.
Speaking of Voyager. Roxann Dawson was the director of last weeks Foundation episode and was interviewed on the pod cast for the show.
I have to say Lower Decks really brought back so much of my love for Star Trek. In so many inventive ways.
I loved how they framed this as Voyager just having some really weird adventures in the Delta Quadrant. And when you think about it, they were some really strange occurrences happening on that ship, which is why this love letter felt just right!
I love that Starfleet actually was proactive for once & inoculated everyone against the macrovirus (& presumably all the other delta quadrant diseases voyager discovered).
Made it a comical nuisance rather than a direct threat
They can thank the good EMH for those inoculations. Starfleet had to have a major heyday dismantling Voyager especially the data tracks\computer core.
@@jasonsumma1530 "HOW ARE YOU ALL NOT DEAD!?"
I have to say the two robotic representations of the Warp 10 Lizards are not representing the baby's they had, but Janeway and Paris themselves after they were transformed into them.
That's why there's only two and the baby's were nowhere to be seen in the display exibit.
Babies
I have a down that we didn't get any Voyager era guest voices. I know Robert Duncan McNeil appeared a few seasons ago but, it'd been nice if perhaps the EMH was still around or Commodore Kim (Starfleet fast tracked that, it's my head canon) was around to over see the transfer.
I had my hopes up when the curator said one of his last lines and he sounded a bit like Neelix, but I didn't see Ethan Phillips in the credits.
We know the Doctor is still around but he is not on Voyager, well not this one, right around this time he would be chief medical officer of the USS Voyager-A
That should be a trellium down! Big disappointment there wasn't a single Voyager actor.
We needed a still Ensign Kim show up when they all got their promotions!
@@TheHumanGay. Easy there Satan.
Y'all missed the Breen ship also added to the battle in the opening credits.
Thank you! I could not for the life of me remember whose ship that was.
I lucked out. I was bored so I did a Lower Decks marathon, then found out season 4 was coming out a couple days later. I am so glad I got to go into it with everything fresh in my mind. Lower Decks is my favorite thing going right now.
I did the same thing just before S3
Happy Star Trek Day Trek Culture.
I took Mariner's "I told Ransom to promote you" as bluster...covering for her feelings. That's why Ransom was so touched when he watched the logs.
100% agree, Voyager's bridge is the most beautiful 🤩
Love, love, love the shot of Voyager in San Francisco - I was always sad we never got to see anything that happened once they got home, so that felt like a lovely touch.
This was great, and omg I didn't even notice the Klingon towel guy 😂😂😂 (RIP though 👀)
The "Voy" thing is also a reference to "We'll Always Have Tom Paris" where Boimler calls it Voy and Mariner makes fun of him then admits it does save time.
How can you not mention the funniest joke in the episode? "Holodeck Safety Protocols set to: Random"
I look forward to this channel so much. Thanks for bringing light to the community. - a San Diego Choreographer
I am a Voyager Fan boy. Excellent episode. Since the strange new worlds crossover I have been watching Lower Decks for the first time. Lower Decks has taken all the stuffiness out of the NEXT GENERATION.Loving it all
3 things i liked
- The USS Voyager is shown to be almost falling apart
- Everyone agreed that Janeway solution is to kill Tuvix is messed up
- Imagine how awkward if the actual crew saw the Salamanders memorial.
This was a very tongue-in-cheek jab at the shenanigans in Voyager. Does the macrovirus surviving and laying dormant on the bridge make sense? Hell naw. But it's a hilarious nod nonetheless
Addressed by Ransom’s line “It’s Voyager. Shit git weird.”
Robot lizard babies were adorable. Definitely merchable. Plushies?
I LOL'd reading this!
that's crazy - the most hated ep in all of Voyager (the lizards featured on the ep for less than a couple of minutes, the rest of the ep focuses on the warp 10 flight apart from Paris's "evolution")....and now everyone wants "plush toy lizard babies"?????
Voyager! Voyager! Voyager! My favorite show. I am so happy with this episode.
I think the reason lower decks works so good is that the crew of the Cerritos is all of us fans. The things they say, the way they react to the universe around them is how we would all be. Each episode is truly a love letter to the fans.
I demand more T'Lyn! Her staring down Tendi while hydrating as Tendi asked "But WE'RE friends, right?" deserved an up. We waited a whole season for the galaxies bitchiest Vulcan to join this crew, dammit, and she is DELIVERING.
Galaxy's. It's possessive.
And we know she’s just there to prove herself to the High Command
I love Voyager so this episode was a pure delight for me.
I literally laughed so hard I had tears coming down my face with so many voyager references laid down one atop another
14:20
and the tune that plays there is the leadership theme from TMP and TWOK, the little progression that precedes the Enterprise theme proper, that immediately resolves to the theme of Lower Decks.
it's so well placed in that scene, for Tendi, and it's perfectly placed _as a component of the scene_ that it takes the whole thing to Star Wars theatrics level: the action plays, and the music sets the emotion, much like Greek theater.
perfect composition there... the director deserves another pip.
I always used to think there was a simple solution to the Tuvix situation: duplicate Tuvix by replicating the accident in which Riker got duplicated, and then split the second Tuvix. But later I realized, you'd still be killing that second Tuvix so not really a solution at all.
Also, foreshadowing the next episode, I'll just say "Moopsy!"
😁
Yeah, I'm sure they could do it all in one so duplicate T'illups never makes it out of the pattern buffer to know they've ever existed.
I'm sorry I missed the debut of Ups & Downs going live. This was a wild and silly episode. I love the attention they gave to Voyager lore while diving into one of the greatest debates in Star Trek history. This season already looks like a wild ride as our now Lt Junior Grade Lower Deckers get into even more insanity. Love the use of the Voyager music and the addition of the Whale Probe in the intro.
We saw a Borg drone just chilling in his alcove in Lower Decks season 2, in the stinger of "wej Duj."
And the cube's number was 90182, its location was unknown though.
I love that during the episode, everyone is questioning Janeway's decision and T'lyn is like: Nah, I don't have time for this! Bye T'ilups!
Not sure what's better, the episode itself, or Sean's joy and excitement when talking about it 😁
Love your content!
There is a Star Trek Novel called Probe set after Star Trek IV. Part of the probes history mentions that is was damaged in a battle with with a cuboid ship.
The fact that they have adapted the fan culture to this show is hysterical. It’s like Will Wheaton is a writer.
The line that the curator used 'subtle updates that don't impact historical consistency are an acceptable compromise for conservation' is an actual almost direct line from my museum studies undergrad textbook. Now that is a deep-cut 🤣🤣🤣🤣
"Are you chewing gum!?" The writers must have been watching Trek Culture!
They should have had Rebecca Romijn do the voice of the computer.
Great Voyager tribute episode, I think they only Voyager reference I personally wished they included was something to do with the Equinox...like if we got confirmation if Captain Rudolph Ransom is at all related to Cerritos first officer, Jack Ransom
I love how now whenever I watch a voyager episode set after the Macrovirus all I'll think is "Theres still one hiding on the bridge"
So good to have Ups and Downs as much as the episodes themselves!
Also have to ask Sean...where do you get your tshirts?
Am I the only one who wanted to see Tendi and T'Lyn twovixxed?
Sure there's an artist out there drawing that at this moment
Ten'Lyndi?
1st I love the mustache. Looks good on you. 2nd the line Running around with a caulk gun full of cheese just made me laugh so hard. Finally one of my favorite lines from this show was when the Doctor who was explaining being Tuvixed said "Same thing happened to commander Tuvok and Neelix back in the 70's."
Voyager’s bridge is my favourite. Love it. This whole episode had me in stitches
I definitely think the beam teleported the Klingon crew before destroying the ship (LD invested too much into them just to kill them off) since we see the romulans in the next episode, I definitely think the Vulcans will be visited too, leading into a puniltimate episode where all these crews team up.
But I don't think we'll get more references to NX-01. We already had a pretty big reference with the Pike thing.
I hope you're right about the Klingons , because they were fun.
Now you’re saying that I’m getting a vibe like The Orville S1E02 “Command Performance” where Ed and Kelly are beamed to a Calivon Zoo. And is the plot of LD S4E02 a tease on this?
Yeah! It’s got Data getting collected plus the Voyager crew getting hunted on the holodeck vibes. My wild guess is that Peanut Hamper, Badgey, and the Jeffrey Combs evil bot have gotten free and built a ship to take revenge. Maybe they beamed the crews up to use on their ships? And destroyed the ships to start a war? Honestly, I didn’t think this one out, but yeah, I hope they’re alive
4:20 so, didn't you see the breen ship, in the opeing credits battle scene? top right, chasing a klingon warbird, when the cerritos turns to flee.
This episode went from 0 to 60 very quickly! Excellent Start!
Loved this episode. Lovd the detail on Voyager. Mike McMahan is truly a Star Trek fan. This was a VOY Love Letter to the extreme. And LOVED the Pike reference!
Agree with your 2nd down, I’m going to miss that Klingon captain and any future stories with him.
I'm going with Jesse Gender's theory that they're still alive somehow until proven otherwise.
Right. The beam probably transported all crew before destroying the ship since the explosion didn't seem to be immediate. Same with the Romulan ship at the start of episode 2. There were no bodies floating in space amongst the large pieces of ship.
My final opinion on the Tuvix debate is that Janeway made the right decision, Tuvix died to save two Voyager crew members, at least one of them was a vital crew member
the need of the many outweighs the need of the few
I do agree. This whole "Tuvix" situation is very multi-layered and brings up serious ethical dilemas about accidental new forms of life and their right to exist as their own being. Unfortunately, taking all factors into account, both Tuvok and Neelix had no say in being fused together and in the Voyager's dire situation being trapped in the Delta Quadrant with minimal crew and resources (despite the show's bad habit of weekly status quo resets) they were in desperate need of their logical steadfast lieutenant and chef. If this had happened in Federatiom space where time was not of the essence, maybe things would have played out differently. Its heartbreaking what happened to Tuvix and you could still very much say this was borderline murder. But in the grand scheme, I do believe Janeway made the right call. Every major decision made by a leader surrounding the needs of the many over the few is not going to be squeaky clean, there are still heavy consequences. Despite this heavy topic being done in a more comical sense, very ballsy of the writers to make this the title plotline of not just their Voyager episode, but the season premiere as well. One of the many reasons why I love Lower Decks in how the people behind it are as big of fans as we are and are willing to tackle stories like this from decades past.
My take on is that Tuvix killed two to be alive in the first place, so letting Tuvix live was condoning that killing... morally/ethically, that's the wrong choice. Another way of looking at it is Tuvix was denying both Tuvok and Neelix their right to life, so again it would be the wrong choice to not separate them back out.
When it comes to Voyager and being stranded in the Delta Quadrant, they made the right decision.
BUT, I do think there's a way to save all 3 by recreating the "Transporter clone" incidents that both Riker & Boimler have been through, but it's just a theory.
What I wish was that someone had asked Tuvok or Neelix how they felt about it. Not in that episode, that episode needed to end how it did, but later, maybe in the mess hall. Or Seven could have asked Tuvok about it. I really want to know how they feel.
Lower Decks is such a good tool for the Star Trek universe because whether it's the DS9 or Voyager themed episodes or their own characters coming to Strange New Worlds, it just has this ability to really celebrate the whole of the franchise. But also I love that for all the love letter to Voyager stuff they keep it about the LD characters. Just as SNW crossover really used the device to develop the SNW characters.
There's something else about the Voyager bridge scene where the macrovirus was discovered behind the panel.
It's a callback to a set accident on TNG, as told by Wil Wheaton during his tour of the remade Enterprise D bridge for Picard Season 3. There was a scene in TNG (he thinks it was Best of Both Worlds part 1) where the camera shaking factor was a "10" -- first time it was ever that high. So Patrick Stewart hurls himself at the wall panel, and breaks it entirely. Wesley comments "hull breach on Deck One", to a totally not laughing crew.
In Twovix, they say "these panels could withstand a photon torpedo" -- it falls off as Boilmer gently touches it.
The upgraded tricorder gave me vibes of when Barclay offered to upgrade Dr. Crusher's medical tricorder.
There was nobody in the pilot seat, when Voyager took off. Boimler and Mariner stood behind it. Are ships automatic now?😁
Back in "Remember Me," the Enterprise-D could pilot itself, so I assume so.
Yeah ships and shuttles have always been shown to have automated controls. The computer could pretty much run the ship alone, but usually we see the crew doing everything, which is kinda the point of starfleet
What a way to kick off the season! Absolute madness but such a love letter to Voyager. The Voyager theme gets me in the feels so much and I loved the Mariner-Boimler interplay.
Voyager transporter effect when the transporter was used...perfect!
The Borg timeline isn't confusing. At the time this episode happens, many Borg ships were likely rendered inert when Adm Janeway infected the Collective with the pathogen. The dormant cube wasn't contacted, but Voyager set a course for it. The Jurati Collective is presumably staying out of history's way. And the events of Picard S3 haven't happened yet, so the Queen hasn't cannibalized what she could yet.
It’s also very likely that there are still plenty of Borg ships and planets just sitting in stasis even after the queen dies. All it would take is one to get reactivated for the collective rebuild and quickly. One idiot trying to salvage off a cube could easily undo the disaster
I believe Jurati's Collective is called the Borg Cooperative. Then again I haven't seen season 3 yet.
I had a thought. Sean, for Halloween you should switch places with Simon Miller for one ups and downs. You could do wrestling and he could do lower decks. I think that would be funny
"It was Voyager. Sh*t got weird, man"
Perfect summary of 7 seasons of Voyager.
Honestly, Ransom is shaping up to be my fav character this season. He's so chill and kind and supportive. Its awesome.
When it comes to dealing with the ethical question, I think you would have to figure out a way to do a Thomas Riker and a Tuvix reversal in one transport sequence (while depositing the base Tuvixed character on a different transporter pad).
I have one "down" for this episode that wasn't mentioned. Why did all of the Tuvixed characters immediately join the cause to merge other crewmembers? That part didn't make sense to me.
Because they all already contained the orchid DNA that had enabled the combination in the first place, when they all got transported together they all merged. I'd say it makes perfect sense. Why exactly it was too many separate bodies, and it ended up a giant blob rather than one super-merged person is a little weird, though. But it was a conceit to allow them to sidestep the ethics by making the separation of the blob the ethical win, even if creating the blob deliberately would have been an ethical failure.
@@DavidBeddard Are you saying that the orchid DNA drove them to create more hybrid beings like themselves? If that's the case, then why wasn't Tuvix driven to do that?
@@InJeffable Not that it drove them, no, just that it was the presence of the orchid DNA within the transporter beam that caused the anomaly that combined them, so beaming all of the twinned pairs would also lead to merging. Perhaps the merging was imperfect because it wasn't with a pure sample but a pre-merged version.
What drove T'illups to create more copies was the fear of being murdered plus the particular combination of of personalities. Original Tuvix would never have done such a thing.
Random thoughts: It's good to see the UFP continuing their tradition of destroying their enemies by turning them into allies, as seen with the Kzinti.
But why aren't Boimler and Mariner supposed to talk about their time travel? It won't affect their future. The Enterprise crew shouldn't, of course, but the Cerritos crew? Why not?
My guess is they never filed a formal report on what happened and are hoping nobody found out about their many, MANY regulation violations during the whole mess. Would you want a visit from Temporal Affairs? I would not.
the voyager reveal was so beautiful, i made a very high and audible sound as i sat alone in my room.
almost creamed my pants
I had to wait 5 days to see this episode, fortunately the festival I was at had no Internet so avoided spoilers, and so glad for that, this was a gorgeous season opener, with so much Voyager love that I share. I think Janeaway did the right thing and I am so glad, it was referenced here so blatantly without condemning her. Captains have to make the right decisions not the popular ones. A really strong season opener!