Nuclear physics ain't shit compared to those sweet, sweet Hax$ Dashes to waveshine to Up Smash into taunt. Molecules my ass, gimme them nuclear sets of melee.
I think this is all very valuable, though the reason the phrase 'option-select' isn't talked about as often for Melee isn't so much that people aren't willing to learn them, but because Smash games are actually very sparse in the amount of _true_ option selects that are actually available. In the Street Fighter example you showed, Ryu was able to cover 3 options with just _one single input_ , because of how the game reads throws, attacks, and blocks. The difference between this and the examples you showed, is that you are masking additional inputs with existing actions, rather than the input for the action _itself_ masking those potential inputs. In Smash games, there aren't many basic actions that are performed by combining existing actions, such as SF's walk back and blocking being the same, and 2 attack buttons being throw, among others. The closest Smash gets is Grab, which is Shield + A (even Z is just a macro for this), which actually does let you true OS something like a landing aerial if you're Fox. For example, if you hard shield for 4 frames (the Powershield window), then press A on the fifth frame (I'm forgetting if you must release Shield on this frame in Melee, but in some games you don't need to), you will cover a grab with 4 Powershield frames, and if something hits you during those frames, a Jab will come out instead. If you're close enough, this could of course result in a potential Up Smash. This isn't _super_ useful in Melee because Powershields greatly increase shield pushback, but you see this more commonly in the games following Melee, not just because of the reduced shield pushback, but also because of how the c-stick functions. In particular for Smash 4, Because the devs added the ability to customize your inputs, things like Attack and Smash stick are simply macros for an analog direction + A for 1 frame (with that analog input either being a soft or full input depending on if it's Attack/Smash). What this let you do is OS a Powershield Tilt or Smash attack, by instead inputting a direction on the c-stick after the initial Powershield frames (as the c-stick did not act as a buffer for OoS options in Brawl, making it result in a grab if combined with Shield).
Ya, the fox up throw on marth doesn't really seem like option coverage. Maybe if marth was asdi-ing out and di-ing to live. Then marth could be covering back air and up air.
@@ParagonPKC You cannot airdodge with a soft L or R input, which is what the 'shield' part of the macro does, so only the 'A' input will result in anything when airborne. It's essentially the same as L/R being depressed 43/255 (16.86%), which is the minimum input for a Light Shield. Since Light Shield was removed in later games, Z (or Shield+A macros) will result in an airdodge.
I would consider making your TH-cam name “Hax$”. I was not familiar with your real name and therefore didn’t realize this was Hax$ until I saw the comments. I think more melee fans would be able to find you that way!
For anyone asking: “why not use c-stick spotdodge instead of analog spotdodge to root yourself since you can buffer it?” It’s because if you use C-Stick, your shield will come out for 1 frame, and shield is not a root state so you would fly off.
Hax pls do more youtube content. Match Analysis, online games against other top players, enter tournaments, guides etc. We need you. You are the hero of 20XX.
Absolutely incredible. It’s amazing to see such high level melee dissected into information I can (barely) digest. I will never be good enough to use this info, but I throughly enjoyed this well made video
Amazing video. You really have an understanding of the game that I wish to have one day. You're also a great teacher, explaining these in just enough detail to make them accessible and support your points with great visuals. Love these videos!
Hax’s videos are always so well structured and descriptive. Big probs to him for pushing the game. Now waiting for the day for wizzy to dd grabcamp a fox at 200 - sounds pretty hype to me, no joke lol.
thank you so much for the tutorials, half-year in and still playing like a day I falcon, this stuff should make me a day II falcon for sure :^) keep it up, subbed
i feel like i've totally abandoned tech roll in most cases and replaced it with slide off. this is definitely due to the online meta, but it's still becoming more apparent that amsah tech is now expected and covered. feels like the best option of 2019 is 2021's mixup only option.
People really don't talk about the getting punished game enough. I think it was the paradigm of the 5 Gods that led to a culture of winning and "optimization" that led to conversations about the punish game almost always. I wonder if all these tools (e.g. Slippi, Boxx, etc) that came out of the that paradigm wouldn't have existed without that type of culture though. I wonder if talks about the getting punished game means Melee is in a crisis and the paradigm is about to change. It's all fuckin' fascinating.
What's the difference between Analog spotdodges and c-stick spotdodges for rooting your character on the stage? Wouldn't be better to use the c-stick since you can buffer it frame 1?
In the fox marth upthrow scenario at the start, could fox have used drift so that Marth SDI's into the 2nd hit of upair rather than away from it? This would cause Marth to have to guess which way to sdi.
The prophet speaks. Option selecting techs is prevalent in PM because of how strong SDI is, and your examples are a fantastic showcase of the technique. I look forward to hearing this observed in tournament commentary.
Wdym? Current meta is literally being frame perfect and choosing optimal OS every time. Have you not seen Zain and Mang0 right now? They are insane. Even the falcon mains understand these things on a very deep level, just look at wizzy‘s SDI or n0ne doing n0ne stuff lmao
Hax$ I respect your skill and the Boxx and everything you've done for the community dude. But why not hire a writer who can help you explain these concepts in ape form versus in college thesis explanations. I wanna sit through these vids, but 5 minutes in ADD kicks in and I'm skipping forward desperately looking for something to cling onto that isn't just jargon. Maybe moree graphs or something, cuz this is is just painful if you can't pay 100% full attention and 1 concept is slightly misinterpreted
Analog L/R is where you only press down them partially so that you don't activate the digital click. Digital clicking L/R is necessary for activating techs. Z also provides for an analog L cancel.
Babe wake up Hax posted a new video
...this did not age well...
Imagine if HAX$ loved nuclear physics as much as he loves Melee. We'd have nuclear fusion stabilized by now :P
i didn't know hax loved physics
Nuclear physics ain't shit compared to those sweet, sweet Hax$ Dashes to waveshine to Up Smash into taunt. Molecules my ass, gimme them nuclear sets of melee.
@@Supertaldo916 LOL
@@Supertaldo916 tbh? same
no
I think this is all very valuable, though the reason the phrase 'option-select' isn't talked about as often for Melee isn't so much that people aren't willing to learn them, but because Smash games are actually very sparse in the amount of _true_ option selects that are actually available. In the Street Fighter example you showed, Ryu was able to cover 3 options with just _one single input_ , because of how the game reads throws, attacks, and blocks. The difference between this and the examples you showed, is that you are masking additional inputs with existing actions, rather than the input for the action _itself_ masking those potential inputs. In Smash games, there aren't many basic actions that are performed by combining existing actions, such as SF's walk back and blocking being the same, and 2 attack buttons being throw, among others. The closest Smash gets is Grab, which is Shield + A (even Z is just a macro for this), which actually does let you true OS something like a landing aerial if you're Fox.
For example, if you hard shield for 4 frames (the Powershield window), then press A on the fifth frame (I'm forgetting if you must release Shield on this frame in Melee, but in some games you don't need to), you will cover a grab with 4 Powershield frames, and if something hits you during those frames, a Jab will come out instead. If you're close enough, this could of course result in a potential Up Smash. This isn't _super_ useful in Melee because Powershields greatly increase shield pushback, but you see this more commonly in the games following Melee, not just because of the reduced shield pushback, but also because of how the c-stick functions. In particular for Smash 4, Because the devs added the ability to customize your inputs, things like Attack and Smash stick are simply macros for an analog direction + A for 1 frame (with that analog input either being a soft or full input depending on if it's Attack/Smash). What this let you do is OS a Powershield Tilt or Smash attack, by instead inputting a direction on the c-stick after the initial Powershield frames (as the c-stick did not act as a buffer for OoS options in Brawl, making it result in a grab if combined with Shield).
Ya, the fox up throw on marth doesn't really seem like option coverage. Maybe if marth was asdi-ing out and di-ing to live. Then marth could be covering back air and up air.
@@drew1333 asdi alone wont be enough for marth to dodge the second hit of upair most of the time though.
@@dunK1x could
Would z be a macro for shield+A if you can aerial with it? How does the game read that input
@@ParagonPKC You cannot airdodge with a soft L or R input, which is what the 'shield' part of the macro does, so only the 'A' input will result in anything when airborne. It's essentially the same as L/R being depressed 43/255 (16.86%), which is the minimum input for a Light Shield. Since Light Shield was removed in later games, Z (or Shield+A macros) will result in an airdodge.
hearing HAX$ say "Ryu" is a surreal experience
I would consider making your TH-cam name “Hax$”. I was not familiar with your real name and therefore didn’t realize this was Hax$ until I saw the comments. I think more melee fans would be able to find you that way!
For anyone asking: “why not use c-stick spotdodge instead of analog spotdodge to root yourself since you can buffer it?”
It’s because if you use C-Stick, your shield will come out for 1 frame, and shield is not a root state so you would fly off.
LOL I thought that during the video and came to that realization, then read this comment. So funny. I guess I feel proud of myself now.
@@lucalyons-sosa9843 gotta love that feeling
This is unbelievable. Hax frickin’ money is the smartest man at the most technical game ever.
Is that 200% at 17:20 edited in? LOL it caught me so off guard. Great video as always though.
Probably had a lower percent in the script, and realized it was wrong when recording the example footage.
I didnt even notice when watching the video lol but thats prob cuz of phone audio
He cut himself off before he said Falcon was a low tier
it's honestly a crime that this doesn't have more views, learning about this stuff is so fascinating
i hope hax doesn't post anything crazy in the future
lol
F
boy do i have some news for you
It wasn't even crazy, just too passionately presented. Leffen truly still is a terrible person.
I loved the editing and format, the analog inputs really helped understanding, good shit hax!
Hax pls do more youtube content. Match Analysis, online games against other top players, enter tournaments, guides etc. We need you. You are the hero of 20XX.
GENERAL KENOBI
I can't use any of the things I learn in these videos in my play yet, but I still love watching them, because it shows how deep melee is.
funny how Hax makes a video on option selects after saying you should never hard press l cancel
Hard press l cancel is ridiculous
Hax just creates a new meta every damn month
holy fuck, Melee in 2050 will be sick
Lets go algorithm
Absolutely incredible. It’s amazing to see such high level melee dissected into information I can (barely) digest. I will never be good enough to use this info, but I throughly enjoyed this well made video
Top 10 moments before disaster
I've been following melee for 6 years but kind of stopped paying too much attention to it 2 years ago. It's crazy how much the meta has developed
14:31
Me, a peach main at low percent
Yes today I will press C stick down
Yup, I totally understood all of that.
Basically could be Statistics/probability paper on Hidden Latent Factors in Markov Chains
Amazing video. You really have an understanding of the game that I wish to have one day. You're also a great teacher, explaining these in just enough detail to make them accessible and support your points with great visuals. Love these videos!
Can you buffer a defensive input in the standing animation from crouch?
One of the three people on youtube I have notifications on for, I just know it won't disappoint
do top players ever react to these videos because I think it’d be really interesting to see their response when Aziz is spittin
Hax you are such a resource in the world of melee, huge respect to you!
when you say analogue stick SD does that mean either stick? And do both control and C-stick give the 3 frame buffer?
Such a great video, thanks for making it bro
Love the technical details in your videos.
Hax’s videos are always so well structured and descriptive. Big probs to him for pushing the game.
Now waiting for the day for wizzy to dd grabcamp a fox at 200 - sounds pretty hype to me, no joke lol.
this might be the best melee vid Ive ever seen
Where is the evidence 2 vid?
He said in his twitter he will release a new one tommorow
@@DarkJ1425 leffen literally shaking and crying 😂
@@mbabaneamputee7725 victim complex as usual
Great video Hax. Your knowledge of the game is incredible.
Damn, Hax
You're a friggin genius making quality content
GREAT content!
fantastic work
thank you so much for the tutorials, half-year in and still playing like a day I falcon, this stuff should make me a day II falcon for sure :^)
keep it up, subbed
Good Shit !!!
The human factor keeps competitive games from becoming stale. There's always something you can do to improve.
Long live Melee.
this is so fucking amazing and important for the community and melee as a whole
i feel like i've totally abandoned tech roll in most cases and replaced it with slide off. this is definitely due to the online meta, but it's still becoming more apparent that amsah tech is now expected and covered. feels like the best option of 2019 is 2021's mixup only option.
Yeah, instead of teching just big brain no tech
Love this kind of content
Does holding shield in melee not keep you from flying off the ledge?
People really don't talk about the getting punished game enough. I think it was the paradigm of the 5 Gods that led to a culture of winning and "optimization" that led to conversations about the punish game almost always.
I wonder if all these tools (e.g. Slippi, Boxx, etc) that came out of the that paradigm wouldn't have existed without that type of culture though. I wonder if talks about the getting punished game means Melee is in a crisis and the paradigm is about to change.
It's all fuckin' fascinating.
This is the best Hax video ever!!!
Banger video
I fucking love you hax
is this a remake of that old smash boards post
the saviour of melee
10/10
You the goat Bab
Schrodinger's Fox
But unfortunately, Falcon's aTwo-hundred percent.
What's the difference between Analog spotdodges and c-stick spotdodges for rooting your character on the stage? Wouldn't be better to use the c-stick since you can buffer it frame 1?
C stick spotdodges have 1 frame of shield which fails to root the player
@@SingularMechanicalCitrusFruit Thank you
fantastic video. amazing voice over.
Thanks for making all this available to us scrubs :^)
Huh, come to think about it, i think I've been doing this instinctively. Glad I have a better idea of how this works
Thank you hax❤️❤️❤️
When in danger jump FALCON KNEE
😂✌🏽‼️‼️‼️
Melee is siiiiiick
In the fox marth upthrow scenario at the start, could fox have used drift so that Marth SDI's into the 2nd hit of upair rather than away from it? This would cause Marth to have to guess which way to sdi.
the drift from a standing still jump isn’t enough to catch the sdi, and you can Sdi up
Will tech inputs also be spammed during shit lag if you're the defender? Say fox d-smashes me and I press tech during the hit lag, will my tech fail?
Aight I didn't catch that typo. Question still stands
very informational!
Neat video! Thanks for uploading!
GOAT
are there actually pros who don't analog L-cancel? even without the option select, it just takes less energy.
in the year 21xx, fd, no items
An OS might not be the best term, it is more a fuzzy guard.
No Australian was consulted on the wording of the section starting at 7:05
Baba hax enlighten the melee community
Thank you professor hax $$$$
The prophet speaks. Option selecting techs is prevalent in PM because of how strong SDI is, and your examples are a fantastic showcase of the technique. I look forward to hearing this observed in tournament commentary.
Run it up
Lets go nelson agholor
I'm confused
it just ain't right :( rip hax$
i wish people could remember what melee's about.
Smash goes
In hax we trust
godlike, thank you
oh no bro
HAX $
Nice
I'm too broke to buy a b0xx, any advice?
Pls option select before you tweet
That's amazing
I actually love this type of stuff, there are so many logical fallacies in the modern melee meta
Wdym? Current meta is literally being frame perfect and choosing optimal OS every time. Have you not seen Zain and Mang0 right now? They are insane. Even the falcon mains understand these things on a very deep level, just look at wizzy‘s SDI or n0ne doing n0ne stuff lmao
Hax$
I respect your skill and the Boxx and everything you've done for the community dude. But why not hire a writer who can help you explain these concepts in ape form versus in college thesis explanations.
I wanna sit through these vids, but 5 minutes in ADD kicks in and I'm skipping forward desperately looking for something to cling onto that isn't just jargon. Maybe moree graphs or something, cuz this is is just painful if you can't pay 100% full attention and 1 concept is slightly misinterpreted
Can someone explain the difference between analog and digital L/R?
Analog L/R is where you only press down them partially so that you don't activate the digital click. Digital clicking L/R is necessary for activating techs. Z also provides for an analog L cancel.
This is melee
Brap!
Algorithm time
Damn I’m early
Hax
magi is godlike at this
Algorithm Pog
If Mang0 took notes from you he’d probably be better than Zain rn
I miss my wife
Hax! I think your videos would be a lot more engaging if you add just some background music and sound effects. :)
east coast lol
sko