Great video again. A couple questions that I may have missed. 1. What octane fuel did you use 2. What timing/ or can you show the timing map 3. What Air/fuel ratio did you try to maintain. Thanks for the great videos 4. Why did stop at 6k?
How about a field trip to the junk yard. And step by step on engine removal in the junk yard. Common issues, and pro tips. Awesome learning experience everytime I watch
He subs that out to a local guy but it’s relatively simple unplug everything and unbolt trans mount or bell housing it’s easier to get it out in one unit because they should have it up enough in the picknpull yards so it comes out easy. Just be courteous and ethical don’t be “That guy “ who destroys a bunch of stuff to get what you want. Make an effort to unplug things and unbolt them if possible don’t just destroy the wiring harness with wire cutters ect
Another Awesome video Richard! I currently have a blow-tru supercharged 68 302. At 16 psi it makes 537 at the wheels. The carb drops ambient temps by half, no intercooler needed. I love my blow-thru set up. Thank you for all your videos Richard!👍
Love to see someone working with carbs, everywhere I see people going EFI because of the ease to tune and run and people get the idea that carbs are just junk because of it
A lot of people will call it dated, but when set up right draw through carbs work really well and fuel distribution isn't an issue. You do need quite a bit more CFM's with draw through over blow through. I will admit I only have experience with this on VW's so v8' could have issues with it I don't know about.
I really do believe that blow-thru carburetors have there place, no matter how much people are afraid to change a jet or power valve or read a spark plug. EFI has basically only been around since the mid-eighties and is not that much different than carbs. There are simple parameters to follow as well certain values given for each sensor, someone commented that if your not going to tune an efi system then you should run a carb? A un-tuned blow-thru carb will be just as bad, either system will melt a piston or a turbine housing just as fast. One system is not greater than the other, it depends on you and what effort you put into it.
Distribution is different because the primary pipes on the headers are all the same as opposed to tuned to each cyl. To a lesser extent, the intake runners are different but not necessarily correct for each cyl. In other words, by changing dis or length of the primary tube, you could tune the cyl to be all the same.
I love what you do. On builds like this it would be awesome to see the temps and a/f of all 8 cylinders individually to see how well the intake and the carb do for distribution. Would also be cool to see the temps to see how much the carb is helping cool the charge air. Then add a Intercooler to check all the same items and see just how much is left on the table with a particular fuel if you stay non-Intercooled. Keep up the great work and was great to meet you at LS Fest!
I almost went this way with my 5.0 coyote but there are no good single plane intakes out there for the Coyote. Holley makes what is basically an inexpensive sheet metal EFI intake with a carb flange mounted on top but it's thin, pron to cracking under boost, and far from ideal with carb. The closest I've found is a carbed cast aluminum manifold for a 5.4 which requires modification for use with the 5.0 but it can work. So, instead, I'm just going to go with the 2018 Mustang intake manifold and a Holley HP EFI system.
Just commenting to help with the youtube algorithm, but cant believe your channel hasnt blown up much faster, wealth of knowledge amd your willingness to share it all is just awesome, thankyou, and i keep commenting on cleetus's channel for him to get you into the freedom factory 500
I run almost the same set up it’s a 5.3 with a C&S aerosol blow through carb and BW 75/83 in a s10 My carb hat is cocked to the right about 45 and reading the plugs 1&3 seamed leanest 6&8 were the rich holes I stager the jets to favor the left front It’s run 9.40@140mph
I'm running a draw through turbo set up on a 70's sbc 305 with slight head work and a heavy cam run on propane. 10psi boost and the motor loves it. No dyno yet but I'd say it pushed the motor well over 375hp from around 160.
Richard, do you remember BBC's factory Holley 780 3310s they had tabs on the left front and right rear boosters, said to help fuel and air distribution. Holley even cocked the carb for that reason.
Love the great variety Richard , thanks . Here’s my two cents . I have a twin Borg Warner 555 BBC with too small air to air intercooler on 335AFR heads ,ported victor junior as that’s what fits under my flat truck hood , big hydraulic roller cam and a CSU 850 blow through carb with twin needle and seat bowls . This makes 1340 to the wheels at 6500 still climbing at twenty pounds boost , has excellent street manners no hiccups and runs nines in 5000 pound truck not optimized for track as I have put street manners , ride comfort and quiet cruising first . Nothing is low budget including this carb but I have been going on short and long drives plus trips to the track for five years now barely tweaking it and changing plugs once a year just because. Kevin at CSU gives excellent after sales service and advice , however this truck has been brutal on transmissions and differentials . A previous 540 was 1000 engine hp using a ProCharger, no intercooler on a Quick fuel 750 BT but it was at the end of fuel delivery with same excellent driving manners so I love a good blow through carb .
I prefer injection, but I won't ever say that carburation doesn't have it's place. Seems to be pros and cons for each. For the last few months I have watched umpteen videos trying to learn as much as I can about manifolds. I want to CNC machine my own 2JZ manifold with a built in water to air intercooler. Long runners, short runners, big plenum, small plenum, lots of considerations. What I have semi decided on is two different length runners that are fairly long, but trying to make the runners as straight as possible. Also recently I have been thinking about trying to locate the injector much further back up the runner away from the head (possibly on the turn). So it can get some of the benefit the carburetor guys get with latent heat transfer. Probably will mull it over for a few more months yet.
Mech engineer here: If you know your desired powerband you can figure out your ideal runner length by using the distance from the back face of your valve to the beginning of your runner divided by the speed of sound and then matched up with your valve timing events. You will probably need to catch the wave on the 4th trip trough the runners (divide the original calculated length by 4) to get something that's not too long. There are formulas and stuff on the internet if you care to look.
@@Cowboy.underwater thanks, yes I saw a formula involving 84,000. Some of it will come down to available space without hitting the inner guards, hood clearance, available intercooler cores, and not inhibiting the tappet cover so much that I can't get to the plugs. I'm currently in the middle of making CNC upgrades on my X axis, so until I have that sorted I am just going to continue to ponder. I did see something similar based on a factory manifold, but it blocks the plugs by the looks of things. th-cam.com/video/bpiGM23-R8g/w-d-xo.html
I have not seen you test anything turbo with a tight LSA. Like 230s on a 108 or a 106. Against an identical cam on a 112 114 116 something like that. If you have done the test can you point me to the results?? !! Thanks
@@hereinmissoula11 I think Richard's test of 'every cam is a turbo cam' covers this question. If the overlap allows more fuel air to escape into the exhaust where it burns, then it will increase response. Some of the video's show some combinations end up with too much exhaust pressure in a ratio to intake if the turbo is too small in relation to how much air the engine will flow. Boost just moves the curve up no matter the cam lsa. Just my opinion.
Would like you to do an 8.1 liter Vortec turboed with maximum of 10 lbs boost on E85 considering this combination for tow truck what is your opinion on how well the motor can take it will it stand up over the long term got a great program I find it very informative especially your work with the camshaft set every cam is a turbo cam and wondering that for a long time
One thing I've been interested in is, I remember years ago, Duttweiler said not to run a split duration cam with turbos, but all we see with LS engines, are split duration. Any idea why? Might be interesting to test that.
@@richardholdener1727 Richard I need some info on a 6.0 ls motor. I found a truck that lost the oil filter and seized. What have you seen with the 6.0 are the normally repairable??
I'm just poking around trying to make a decision on how to get where I want to be. I'm building a daily CJ7 (CJ7 hybrid frame for TJ suspension and drivetrain, My TJ frame literally fell apart while driving home). What I'm aiming for is swapping a v8 in while keeping it a stick shift (I have an advanced adapters AX15 trans). The tricky part is I also want to go completely mechanical. Meaning I don't want an ecu. So I'm looking to go carbed with mechanical fuel injection. I also used to own a turbo car years back so I'd like to see if I can run forced induction, preferably a turbo. I haven't decided on the engine and the easier option (because it's what everybody does) is usually not the direction I want to go. I want to build what I want. Hopefully this works out and I can find a setup that will work well together.
If I remember the other video correctly cylinder to cylinder afr's get closer together when you add boost on a single plane It's a shame you didn't rev it 1K rpm higher
I like it. Kinda of what I am looking at doing with a 318 after it run for a while NA in a Stealth Bomber tribute car. Curious as to what a dual plan would do different than this single plane. Is it exactly the same as NA engines, I was wondering after your fuel distribution comments.
Go ahead and spin it till you drive over the crankshaft! No seriously if it's done marking power, you're done spinning it. Great stuff new subscriber. 👍
Have you thought about trying Holley Super Sniper efi ?? I'm hoping to see twin he351cw on 4.8 with a variety of induction systems as you are the only one to do any of these things.
Regardless of carb or efi distribution is never going to be perfect you have to get really picky with your tuning if you want every cylinder to fire extremely efficient. I've found it's a little easier to compensate with a efi, but it all comes down to your tune and how much time you want to play with it.
Just watched that video where you'd run the stock truck intake vs. the Victor on a 6.2 and a 416 last night, then there in the Holley tunnel ram. Makes me wonder if some of the gains the TR made across the board were from better fuel distribution. Would be an interesting thing to see on this engine. I mean, this definitely has enough carb on it now, but maybe the tunnel ram would work better merely because of the manifold
Excelent video but I wold have liked to see the dyno tests running this engine. I have a question, how you do to not a have lean mixture when the turbo is charging full pressure? Thanks
Rebuilt 317s with trunions/springs/seals/guides upgrade, 54-469-11 Comp cam, Victor jr, CSU 850 blow thru and a VS racing 85/102 turbo kit w/twin Wastegates on an Ebay "master" engine rebuild kit........Thats what I'm currently slap'n together. Can you tell I've been listening to ya Richard? 🤏😎
With respect to the runner length has anyone thought about Doing a custom intake where you match volume of long runners to the shorter runners maybe by decreasing size of the runner to closely match the volume of the shorter runner. Thus in turn more or less tuning the intake to balance flow to match each cylinder
Richard, love the builds and videos!! In your opinion, how much extra hp via boost can a truly stock V8 handle reliably? I have an older mercedes slk 55 amg with a 5.4l m113 engine that is like to put a set of rear mount twin turbos on. I know itll need to go to the dyno before attempting to run it ouke that, but just wondering where I should set the wastegate limits and what size turbos would be reasonable for it thanks!!
It was a interesting test but the boost curve seemed fairly bumpy for both cams... might be some "funny business" going on between the carb, intake manifold and exhaust, meaning cylinder to cylinder air flow differences. Carbs are massive blockage to flow, and it gets worse as the boost increases. Airflow imbalances also get worse particularly at part throttle when boosted... the throttle plates begin favoring certain cylinders because of the angle, and starving the others, and this causes weird pulsations in the exhaust leading to the bumpyness in the boost curve. I've seen flow bench tests were they tested all cylinders simultaneously with a throttle and manifold attached and at certain throttle positions there could be a 50% difference in airflow to individual cylinders. Also, I read an account of a guy that bothered to check how much airflow his carb was costing him... when his manifold pressure (after the carb) read 20psi, the manifold pressure before the carb was 28!! might be cool to try this same engine with EFI and four pairs of throttle bodies attached to a common plenum to see how big a deal manifolding and throttle plate angle can mess with airflow balance.
I have not read the 201 messages they already send and maybe this has been brought up already, but I will comment about cylinder distribution with that open plenum manifold with the carburetor you used in this test, I'm not expert ( absolutely far from it ) but I only can think is, that as the carburetor butterflies open they do so pointing to the middle of the manifold in Vee shape "V", since your closes runners to that "V" shape are your middle runners, logic points out that by traveling distance and resistance the middle cylinders will be possible filled more, ( I really don't know which cylinders were leaner/hotter or richer/colder since I was not present, the first think that I would do is install a 4 hole spacer like the guts from Engine Masters did but I will go with a 1,5" thick spacer as a minimum, I believe a 1" thick is not enough to correct enough the flow downwards, this will make the outer runners to help fill more the cylinders, but what I want to propose for you Richard to test is, to install higher rocker arm ratios on those cylinders that are leaner and see if that evens more the filling charge for all cylinders, so if you run 1.5 or 1.6 rocker ratio, try 1.7 in those leaner cylinders and see what happen, if you could do so on a Ford 302 or your least favored 289 that will be awesome, the trued it doesn't matter which engine you do the test on so far they are equal distanced/separation inlet ports, I hope you really are into it to this test if you find it valid, I think I know what the results will be but like I said I'm not expert, just a engine aficionado.
I have an interesting test for you. Can you use non VVT cams in a VVT engine and retain timing control? I have a 6.0L L76 vortec and want to run a better cam without breaking the bank. If it works i bet there isn't much difference between VVT and non VVT cams. Just like every rec port cam is a cathedral port cam and Visa versa. Im assuming degreeing the cam would be very important because not many people have done it. I love your videos. It's so awesome to see quantitative evidence of the books and articles I've read. Richard holdener is man.
I have to say I stumbled across your channel a few weeks ago. I love it, your super informative! Excellent information. I would love to see some coyote motors putting down some power as well as some 4.6/5.4. You ever play with a 03/04 cobra motor? That was probably Ford's best built motor to take boost from the factory as it's rods are super nice Hbeams with a complete forged rotating assembly.
How much of a charge cooling effect does a carb have vs port injection? Non intercooled setup. I'm currently running a non intercooled holley sniper tbi on my old 350. The highest MAT I've seen is 94F which is about 45-50F over ambient. I've seen as high as 155kpa or about 8psi from datalogs.
I think you should do both pin the gate and break the knob off the rev limiter !! Lmao it was quite impressive actually and I've thought of running a carbed L.S. motor just a cam swap will be plenty for me 350 hp or a a bit more is no joke in like a g body or even a c10 square body w a 373: 1 limited slip tire hell !! Lol
It would seem a dual quad intake with twin turbos would be more efficient as far as fuel distribution goes. If you think that might be true you should do a dyno comparison with single plane and quads, boosted of course
I'm glad you didn't run it at a higher rpm. Most guys that are trying this will be daily driving thier rig and higher rpm just about guarantees a blown motor.
I would love to see the motors do dyno pulls in cars so people can see the actual wheel hp it's putting down but I love this blow through set up, thinking about doing a fbody...
@@simpleman2004 Not everyone thinks like you, Simple Man. Lots of people want the BBC sound, and the low end torque, that a stock stroke LS just cannot deliver. They have these peanut port BBCs lying around that they'd like to make use of, but don't want to spend $3,000 on heads. I am one of those individuals, and I know several more.
Yeah I would like to see more carburetor Turbo yeah I would like to see more carbureted Turbo and turned all the way up and see what the power game is will it make the same power is the fuel injected motor turbo in my Malibu that is got a CSU carburetor on it right now
I would think carbs would do better from a single injection location distribution perspective. The reason why is the same as to why they often make more power; there is more fuel in vapor phase, thus less fuel being influenced by two phase flow dynamics.
While i like that every cam is a turbo cam, can you get into at what point a dedicated "turbo" grind would be better than a NA cam in an engine that made the most HP it could in "NA" form and then added boost to it. IE, If a boosted cam made less power than the NA cam, is it just the wrong cam? Lol
@@richardholdener1727 if for example the more power you start with NA, (as you stated), the more power you make boosted. So, for example, if you pull a cam out that made 600hp NA and install a dedicated turbo grind and make less power pre-boost how is a boost cam better? is my question. Hope that comes across correctly.
"Thanks for watching"....No thanks for making this shit...really changed the way I think about making power..I stopped watching other "LS guys" because all they do now is advertise parts they get free..Keep them coming!
I dunno, the carb stuff makes less and less sense with afordable efi like a fueltech ft450. Whem you add up the intake, msd and carb is nearing that or even more...
Because the carburetor will actually cool the air charge unlike fuel injection with spraying fuel directly into the cylinders, I do not run a intercooler on my CSU blow thru 5.3
Hey can you do the 2.8 chevy 173ci engine? I've been curious about performance gains and possible boost mods but I'm completely clueless where to start
![[MV] A leap of faith...ความเชื่อใจครั้งสุดท้าย (From "Petrichor the series")](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/U1piZH2CNXA/mqdefault.jpg)
You just gotta love what he does for the culture!!! There’s not another like him on TH-cam 👍🏾
Hands down the greatest!
"every cam is a turbo cam" some people can't get their heads around this. lol I love it.
I can't believe I actually catch myself waking up in the morning and looking for this guy on TH-cam thanks Rich
Raymond Walker same here
Every day bud 👍
I listen on my way to work.
Considering what I thought of him in the beginning... His videos have improved exponentially.
At first it was just a bunch of blabbing and arm waving.
It’s 3 am for me woke up in middle of the night haha
Been bugging you for a while Richard so glad the time has came for you passing on all the knowledge. Thank you buddy
Great video again. A couple questions that I may have missed.
1. What octane fuel did you use
2. What timing/ or can you show the timing map
3. What Air/fuel ratio did you try to maintain.
Thanks for the great videos
4. Why did stop at 6k?
How about a field trip to the junk yard. And step by step on engine removal in the junk yard. Common issues, and pro tips. Awesome learning experience everytime I watch
He subs that out to a local guy but it’s relatively simple unplug everything and unbolt trans mount or bell housing it’s easier to get it out in one unit because they should have it up enough in the picknpull yards so it comes out easy. Just be courteous and ethical don’t be “That guy “ who destroys a bunch of stuff to get what you want. Make an effort to unplug things and unbolt them if possible don’t just destroy the wiring harness with wire cutters ect
Another Awesome video Richard! I currently have a blow-tru supercharged 68 302. At 16 psi it makes 537 at the wheels. The carb drops ambient temps by half, no intercooler needed. I love my blow-thru set up. Thank you for all your videos Richard!👍
In thinking of putting a turbo on my 327, would I not need an intercooler either?
@@aaronvinegar8963 no intercooler needed if u have a carb. I do spray methanol though to help. Good luck on your setup 👍
@@imsoawesome_imnottho thank you!
Love to see someone working with carbs, everywhere I see people going EFI because of the ease to tune and run and people get the idea that carbs are just junk because of it
A lot of people will call it dated, but when set up right draw through carbs work really well and fuel distribution isn't an issue. You do need quite a bit more CFM's with draw through over blow through. I will admit I only have experience with this on VW's so v8' could have issues with it I don't know about.
I really do believe that blow-thru carburetors have there place, no matter how much people are afraid to change a jet or power valve or read a spark plug. EFI has basically only been around since the mid-eighties and is not that much different than carbs. There are simple parameters to follow as well certain values given for each sensor, someone commented that if your not going to tune an efi system then you should run a carb? A un-tuned blow-thru carb will be just as bad, either system will melt a piston or a turbine housing just as fast. One system is not greater than the other, it depends on you and what effort you put into it.
Perfect....Always wanted to do a blow thru combo....👍
Love the carb stuff! I'm learning a ton about ls motors. How about an in depth look at the msd ignition boxes, as far as set up and tuning.
Distribution is different because the primary pipes on the headers are all the same as opposed to tuned to each cyl. To a lesser extent, the intake runners are different but not necessarily correct for each cyl.
In other words, by changing dis or length of the primary tube, you could tune the cyl to be all the same.
I love what you do. On builds like this it would be awesome to see the temps and a/f of all 8 cylinders individually to see how well the intake and the carb do for distribution. Would also be cool to see the temps to see how much the carb is helping cool the charge air. Then add a Intercooler to check all the same items and see just how much is left on the table with a particular fuel if you stay non-Intercooled. Keep up the great work and was great to meet you at LS Fest!
I really like what you do. You have answered so many questions i have had just by watching your videos!!Keep it coming brother.
I almost went this way with my 5.0 coyote but there are no good single plane intakes out there for the Coyote. Holley makes what is basically an inexpensive sheet metal EFI intake with a carb flange mounted on top but it's thin, pron to cracking under boost, and far from ideal with carb. The closest I've found is a carbed cast aluminum manifold for a 5.4 which requires modification for use with the 5.0 but it can work. So, instead, I'm just going to go with the 2018 Mustang intake manifold and a Holley HP EFI system.
Just commenting to help with the youtube algorithm, but cant believe your channel hasnt blown up much faster, wealth of knowledge amd your willingness to share it all is just awesome, thankyou, and i keep commenting on cleetus's channel for him to get you into the freedom factory 500
I run almost the same set up it’s a 5.3 with a C&S aerosol blow through carb and BW 75/83 in a s10
My carb hat is cocked to the right about 45 and reading the plugs 1&3 seamed leanest 6&8 were the rich holes
I stager the jets to favor the left front
It’s run 9.40@140mph
Whats your timing and boost
I'm running a draw through turbo set up on a 70's sbc 305 with slight head work and a heavy cam run on propane. 10psi boost and the motor loves it. No dyno yet but I'd say it pushed the motor well over 375hp from around 160.
Don't know if you will see this but I would love to know more about your set up!
I want to see something done with the new 6.6L , can't wait until they are in the junkyards!
JAMES! Since the 70's I’m surprised that they haven’t released a crate motor yet.
The best intake for carburetor is duel carb... 2 sets of 4 intakes the same length. That's the Goldilock Zone
Richard, do you remember BBC's factory Holley 780 3310s they had tabs on the left front and right rear boosters, said to help fuel and air distribution. Holley even cocked the carb for that reason.
haven't seen an old 3310 for a long time
Love the great variety Richard , thanks . Here’s my two cents . I have a twin Borg Warner 555 BBC with too small air to air intercooler on 335AFR heads ,ported victor junior as that’s what fits under my flat truck hood , big hydraulic roller cam and a CSU 850 blow through carb with twin needle and seat bowls . This makes 1340 to the wheels at 6500 still climbing at twenty pounds boost , has excellent street manners no hiccups and runs nines in 5000 pound truck not optimized for track as I have put street manners , ride comfort and quiet cruising first . Nothing is low budget including this carb but I have been going on short and long drives plus trips to the track for five years now barely tweaking it and changing plugs once a year just because. Kevin at CSU gives excellent after sales service and advice , however this truck has been brutal on transmissions and differentials . A previous 540 was 1000 engine hp using a ProCharger, no intercooler on a Quick fuel 750 BT but it was at the end of fuel delivery with same excellent driving manners so I love a good blow through carb .
they work well
Good info....as always. Can't wait for the new stuff coming, hopefully some 351w tests!
I prefer injection, but I won't ever say that carburation doesn't have it's place. Seems to be pros and cons for each. For the last few months I have watched umpteen videos trying to learn as much as I can about manifolds. I want to CNC machine my own 2JZ manifold with a built in water to air intercooler. Long runners, short runners, big plenum, small plenum, lots of considerations. What I have semi decided on is two different length runners that are fairly long, but trying to make the runners as straight as possible. Also recently I have been thinking about trying to locate the injector much further back up the runner away from the head (possibly on the turn). So it can get some of the benefit the carburetor guys get with latent heat transfer. Probably will mull it over for a few more months yet.
Mech engineer here:
If you know your desired powerband you can figure out your ideal runner length by using the distance from the back face of your valve to the beginning of your runner divided by the speed of sound and then matched up with your valve timing events. You will probably need to catch the wave on the 4th trip trough the runners (divide the original calculated length by 4) to get something that's not too long.
There are formulas and stuff on the internet if you care to look.
@@Cowboy.underwater thanks, yes I saw a formula involving 84,000. Some of it will come down to available space without hitting the inner guards, hood clearance, available intercooler cores, and not inhibiting the tappet cover so much that I can't get to the plugs. I'm currently in the middle of making CNC upgrades on my X axis, so until I have that sorted I am just going to continue to ponder. I did see something similar based on a factory manifold, but it blocks the plugs by the looks of things. th-cam.com/video/bpiGM23-R8g/w-d-xo.html
I have not seen you test anything turbo with a tight LSA. Like 230s on a 108 or a 106. Against an identical cam on a 112 114 116 something like that. If you have done the test can you point me to the results?? !! Thanks
What do we Google. I asked the same question a while back
Doesn't include a turbo. So 🤷♂️
ZX1206 but everyone thinks the overlap will make a power loss . That’s what I would like to see tested !!
@@hereinmissoula11 I think Richard's test of 'every cam is a turbo cam' covers this question. If the overlap allows more fuel air to escape into the exhaust where it burns, then it will increase response. Some of the video's show some combinations end up with too much exhaust pressure in a ratio to intake if the turbo is too small in relation to how much air the engine will flow. Boost just moves the curve up no matter the cam lsa. Just my opinion.
Ron Dye Channel it needs a test ...... 👍👍👍
Would like you to do an 8.1 liter Vortec turboed with maximum of 10 lbs boost on E85 considering this combination for tow truck what is your opinion on how well the motor can take it will it stand up over the long term got a great program I find it very informative especially your work with the camshaft set every cam is a turbo cam and wondering that for a long time
I wonder what distribution would look on one of those sexy ITB manifolds with port injection, or alternatively with weber carbs.
One thing I've been interested in is, I remember years ago, Duttweiler said not to run a split duration cam with turbos, but all we see with LS engines, are split duration.
Any idea why? Might be interesting to test that.
Brian tooley tech talks are super informative on ls cam theory and heads
Brian is very good-and good people
Great videos as always. Thank you for posting so often. What ring gap do you run on supercharged and turbo LS motors?
.028-.030
@@richardholdener1727 Richard I need some info on a 6.0 ls motor. I found a truck that lost the oil filter and seized. What have you seen with the 6.0 are the normally repairable??
Do some tests with a Ford 351w out of early 90's trucks. Heads, cam, intake, boost
I'm just poking around trying to make a decision on how to get where I want to be.
I'm building a daily CJ7 (CJ7 hybrid frame for TJ suspension and drivetrain, My TJ frame literally fell apart while driving home).
What I'm aiming for is swapping a v8 in while keeping it a stick shift (I have an advanced adapters AX15 trans).
The tricky part is I also want to go completely mechanical. Meaning I don't want an ecu. So I'm looking to go carbed with mechanical fuel injection.
I also used to own a turbo car years back so I'd like to see if I can run forced induction, preferably a turbo. I haven't decided on the engine and the easier option (because it's what everybody does) is usually not the direction I want to go. I want to build what I want.
Hopefully this works out and I can find a setup that will work well together.
blow though carb and turbo
@@richardholdener1727 Seems like the right choice.
Thank you
If I remember the other video correctly cylinder to cylinder afr's get closer together when you add boost on a single plane
It's a shame you didn't rev it 1K rpm higher
6000 is good... Keeps the engine alive longer. I wish you would start the tests at a lower rpm so real street drivability can be assesed
I like it. Kinda of what I am looking at doing with a 318 after it run for a while NA in a Stealth Bomber tribute car. Curious as to what a dual plan would do different than this single plane. Is it exactly the same as NA engines, I was wondering after your fuel distribution comments.
How about an LS7 na vs Supercharged vs SC with meth vs turbo with meth No intercoolers.
Boost helps distribution
I like this combo. The only thing I would change would be dual plane intake and Holley super sniper efi.
Go ahead and spin it till you drive over the crankshaft! No seriously if it's done marking power, you're done spinning it. Great stuff new subscriber. 👍
Should go suck-through :) with a 2" SU, (might need 2 x 2" SU's to flow enough air or a single 50mm DCOE weber...)
Good info! I won't mind you up grade the turbo and try race fuel vs E85 and run up those rpms
Have you thought about trying Holley Super Sniper efi ?? I'm hoping to see twin he351cw on 4.8 with a variety of induction systems as you are the only one to do any of these things.
Regardless of carb or efi distribution is never going to be perfect you have to get really picky with your tuning if you want every cylinder to fire extremely efficient. I've found it's a little easier to compensate with a efi, but it all comes down to your tune and how much time you want to play with it.
Just watched that video where you'd run the stock truck intake vs. the Victor on a 6.2 and a 416 last night, then there in the Holley tunnel ram.
Makes me wonder if some of the gains the TR made across the board were from better fuel distribution.
Would be an interesting thing to see on this engine.
I mean, this definitely has enough carb on it now, but maybe the tunnel ram would work better merely because of the manifold
Excelent video but I wold have liked to see the dyno tests running this engine. I have a question, how you do to not a have lean mixture when the turbo is charging full pressure? Thanks
we tune the motor with the Holley ECU to provide the optimum AF and timing under boost
I love this channel, and I big ls fan, but with a budget and run what I have, have you done a video on sbc running turbo, carb or tbi
These are all old tests you've done, correct?
What are your most recent?
Id like to maybe see a bit more rpm, and more boost just to see where it will go, up or way up!
Rebuilt 317s with trunions/springs/seals/guides upgrade, 54-469-11 Comp cam, Victor jr, CSU 850 blow thru and a VS racing 85/102 turbo kit w/twin Wastegates on an Ebay "master" engine rebuild kit........Thats what I'm currently slap'n together. Can you tell I've been listening to ya Richard? 🤏😎
GOOD STUFF
I want to see a turbo 440 dodge with Holley sniper efi being as that is what I am building
I think carb distribution is just fine! I’d prefer it on a plate nitrous setup. Or, at a minimum, a carb style manifold.
Great info Richard. Will two 44mm wastegates on the crossover pipe control the boost level? I only have one and it doesn't
yes-we use two on our turbo stuff on the engine dyno
@@richardholdener1727 outstanding! Thank you Sir...
I would be interested is seeing the fuel distribution of a carbed tunnel ram with boost. I don't think it would matter what engine its on.
I have a blow thru 6.0 ls on e85 and it works great. Fueling was a little tricky to figure out. Which fuel was you running?
He said 91 in a previous comment
How much power you making ? Are you running a intercooler ?
Anyone who thinks blow thru carbs don't work needs to check out Billy's S10 on Street Racing Channel.
With respect to the runner length has anyone thought about Doing a custom intake where you match volume of long runners to the shorter runners maybe by decreasing size of the runner to closely match the volume of the shorter runner. Thus in turn more or less tuning the intake to balance flow to match each cylinder
it's not volume that produces the reflected wave tuning-it's length (distance traveled for the wave)
That is true and your long runners will always have a longer wave due to distance
Richard, love the builds and videos!! In your opinion, how much extra hp via boost can a truly stock V8 handle reliably? I have an older mercedes slk 55 amg with a 5.4l m113 engine that is like to put a set of rear mount twin turbos on. I know itll need to go to the dyno before attempting to run it ouke that, but just wondering where I should set the wastegate limits and what size turbos would be reasonable for it thanks!!
Oh yes one I’ve been waiting for
If only we could get the same dyno comparing it to the performer rpm, since boost should be low enough to not require the single plane.
I did a Vic jr, vs RPM na and under boost
Richard Holdener oh could you link the video?
It was a interesting test but the boost curve seemed fairly bumpy for both cams... might be some "funny business" going on between the carb, intake manifold and exhaust, meaning cylinder to cylinder air flow differences. Carbs are massive blockage to flow, and it gets worse as the boost increases. Airflow imbalances also get worse particularly at part throttle when boosted... the throttle plates begin favoring certain cylinders because of the angle, and starving the others, and this causes weird pulsations in the exhaust leading to the bumpyness in the boost curve. I've seen flow bench tests were they tested all cylinders simultaneously with a throttle and manifold attached and at certain throttle positions there could be a 50% difference in airflow to individual cylinders.
Also, I read an account of a guy that bothered to check how much airflow his carb was costing him... when his manifold pressure (after the carb) read 20psi, the manifold pressure before the carb was 28!! might be cool to try this same engine with EFI and four pairs of throttle bodies attached to a common plenum to see how big a deal manifolding and throttle plate angle can mess with airflow balance.
I have not read the 201 messages they already send and maybe this has been brought up already, but I will comment about cylinder distribution with that open plenum manifold with the carburetor you used in this test, I'm not expert ( absolutely far from it ) but I only can think is, that as the carburetor butterflies open they do so pointing to the middle of the manifold in Vee shape "V", since your closes runners to that "V" shape are your middle runners, logic points out that by traveling distance and resistance the middle cylinders will be possible filled more, ( I really don't know which cylinders were leaner/hotter or richer/colder since I was not present, the first think that I would do is install a 4 hole spacer like the guts from Engine Masters did but I will go with a 1,5" thick spacer as a minimum, I believe a 1" thick is not enough to correct enough the flow downwards, this will make the outer runners to help fill more the cylinders, but what I want to propose for you Richard to test is, to install higher rocker arm ratios on those cylinders that are leaner and see if that evens more the filling charge for all cylinders, so if you run 1.5 or 1.6 rocker ratio, try 1.7 in those leaner cylinders and see what happen, if you could do so on a Ford 302 or your least favored 289 that will be awesome, the trued it doesn't matter which engine you do the test on so far they are equal distanced/separation inlet ports, I hope you really are into it to this test if you find it valid, I think I know what the results will be but like I said I'm not expert, just a engine aficionado.
I have an interesting test for you. Can you use non VVT cams in a VVT engine and retain timing control? I have a 6.0L L76 vortec and want to run a better cam without breaking the bank. If it works i bet there isn't much difference between VVT and non VVT cams. Just like every rec port cam is a cathedral port cam and Visa versa. Im assuming degreeing the cam would be very important because not many people have done it. I love your videos. It's so awesome to see quantitative evidence of the books and articles I've read. Richard holdener is man.
I have to say I stumbled across your channel a few weeks ago.
I love it, your super informative! Excellent information.
I would love to see some coyote motors putting down some power as well as some 4.6/5.4.
You ever play with a 03/04 cobra motor?
That was probably Ford's best built motor to take boost from the factory as it's rods are super nice Hbeams with a complete forged rotating assembly.
lots on the 03/04 Cobra and Coyote-did you see the boost bash video where I ran every form of forced induction on the 03/04
@@richardholdener1727 no, I will have to go look,
Been waiting for blow through Video. Would like to see a comparison on exact setup same psi but efi. Are you sacrificing any power by choosing a carb.
How much of a charge cooling effect does a carb have vs port injection? Non intercooled setup.
I'm currently running a non intercooled holley sniper tbi on my old 350.
The highest MAT I've seen is 94F which is about 45-50F over ambient. I've seen as high as 155kpa or about 8psi from datalogs.
It can drop temps by 100 degrees
I think you should do both pin the gate and break the knob off the rev limiter !! Lmao it was quite impressive actually and I've thought of running a carbed L.S. motor just a cam swap will be plenty for me 350 hp or a a bit more is no joke in like a g body or even a c10 square body w a 373: 1 limited slip tire hell !! Lol
Great material and very well presented, Thank you for sharing!!!👍
It would seem a dual quad intake with twin turbos would be more efficient as far as fuel distribution goes. If you think that might be true you should do a dyno comparison with single plane and quads, boosted of course
Richard, what is your opinion on the power output of the Hooker turbo exhaust manifolds VS making your own from the truck manifolds?
I'm glad you didn't run it at a higher rpm. Most guys that are trying this will be daily driving thier rig and higher rpm just about guarantees a blown motor.
I would love to see the motors do dyno pulls in cars so people can see the actual wheel hp it's putting down but I love this blow through set up, thinking about doing a fbody...
What if you added two turbos? Would the engine blow over 6k? Should I take carb over injection to try and make 1000whp?
you can make over 1000 ho with one or two turbo (if properly sized) You can run over 6000 rpm with the right cam and intake package
MSD ls1/6 box and 8 coils... No other wiring or computers? No stock ECM/harness?
YOU NEED THE COIL HARNESS (ES)
It's not the carb it's how you ajust your fuel in your. Carb single plane is good a smaller intake closer and you'll be fine
I understand every cam is a turbo cam but what about nitrous? Could you do some tests with nitrous? Thanks man for even reading this if u do.
Richard for president !!!
Great video, might have been more useful in the '80's :)
If you want to make a popular video, put together a street peanut port 454 combination that can deliver 500+ HP.
How popular would that be? Not very many people using big blocks anymore. Can make more power with less weight, less real estate with an LS.
@@simpleman2004
Not everyone thinks like you, Simple Man.
Lots of people want the BBC sound, and the low end torque, that a stock stroke LS just cannot deliver. They have these peanut port BBCs lying around that they'd like to make use of, but don't want to spend $3,000 on heads.
I am one of those individuals, and I know several more.
Yeah I would like to see more carburetor Turbo yeah I would like to see more carbureted Turbo and turned all the way up and see what the power game is will it make the same power is the fuel injected motor turbo in my Malibu that is got a CSU carburetor on it right now
CSU is good stuff
I’d like to see carbed non intercooled intake temps per boost level to compare to efi intercooled
the carb drops it by about 100 degrees
I'm sure there's some distribution deviation but it's negligable
This is the video I’ve been waiting for!!!
Would love to see this turbo and carb on the new 496 big block series.
Richard good morning, why do cams specify the need for certain rear end gears or high stall torque converters ?
usually because they lose low-speed torque and work best at higher rpm
Richard Holdener what can you tell us about burn speed and RPM vs cylinder pressure
I've not had the opportunity to test in cylinder pressure
When you talk about opening the ring gap. What gap do you like to run and are you reusing factory rings?
I want do a build like this except rods pistons
What was your timing like with this set up with boost? Thank you good sir.
I would think carbs would do better from a single injection location distribution perspective. The reason why is the same as to why they often make more power; there is more fuel in vapor phase, thus less fuel being influenced by two phase flow dynamics.
Great video
While i like that every cam is a turbo cam, can you get into at what point a dedicated "turbo" grind would be better than a NA cam in an engine that made the most HP it could in "NA" form and then added boost to it. IE, If a boosted cam made less power than the NA cam, is it just the wrong cam? Lol
a typical turbo cam with the same intake duration will usually make less power than an NA cam-both na and boosted-doesn't mean it the wrong cam though
@@richardholdener1727 if for example the more power you start with NA, (as you stated), the more power you make boosted. So, for example, if you pull a cam out that made 600hp NA and install a dedicated turbo grind and make less power pre-boost how is a boost cam better? is my question. Hope that comes across correctly.
"Thanks for watching"....No thanks for making this shit...really changed the way I think about making power..I stopped watching other "LS guys" because all they do now is advertise parts they get free..Keep them coming!
1) rev it to 6500-7k
2) single plane intake + stock/mild cams + no rev= bad combo
Would the old trick of running screen between the intake and head to atomize the fuel be a good idea ?
I DON'T THINK SO
I wonder how much more power it would have made it had you it it added an intercooler??
I dunno, the carb stuff makes less and less sense with afordable efi like a fueltech ft450.
Whem you add up the intake, msd and carb is nearing that or even more...
Not if you get deals on things, also how much hp is the ft450 rated to?
Have you tested one of those trick boogie individual throttle body intakes? For air and fuel distribution?
just for power
Richard..did you use a boost reference fuel regulator ?? If so what kind??
aeromotive
@@richardholdener1727 thank you
Why no intercooler? I’m building a 460bbf foxbody. If you go with a blow through carb do you not need an intercooler?
intercooler always good
Because the carburetor will actually cool the air charge unlike fuel injection with spraying fuel directly into the cylinders, I do not run a intercooler on my CSU blow thru 5.3
Hey can you do the 2.8 chevy 173ci engine? I've been curious about performance gains and possible boost mods but I'm completely clueless where to start
Carbs work great unless your in the northern states mid winter.