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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 พ.ค. 2018
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Jason: / jasonylee_
Can feminists and non-feminists find middle ground in their beliefs on gender equality? We brought them together to discuss feminism, the differences between genders, and the challenges males and females face in society. SUBSCRIBE for more! 👉bit.ly/SUBSCRIBEjubilee 👈
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Gender doesn't make a good leader a good leader makes a good leader
Liam O'Mahony absolutely! But unfortunately biases can sometimes prevent good leaders from being elected. The issue isn’t that we should elect women just because they are women, it’s that we need to change the culture so that qualified candidates play on fair ground. A woman who is more qualified shouldn’t struggle to get elected just because she’s a woman. Unfortunately that happens sometimes.
@@ky4864 not with hilary tho...
Alberto Lucas Bustillo Ruis Bustillo Ruiz i said nothing about Hilary Clinton
@@ky4864 I know I'm just saying because normally that's what people say about why donald won.
Alberto Lucas Bustillo Ruis Bustillo Ruiz why Donald won is a mystery all it’s own. I’m just saying we need to remove the stigma so that we can recognize when there are qualified women being overlooked.
*Stop cutting the clip when the discussion gets good!!!*
They do it in every single one!!!!!! It's freaking ridiculous.
“Uncomfortable conversation bad everyone conceding to each other ideas good we must not be controversial “ says the jubilee editor
Ikr
Yes yes yasss exactly
Jubilee sucks
"Men and women need to work together to creat equality" I am so glad that all of them came up to talk on this one.
Men need to help women defeat misogyny because it's pretty much normalized in America.
@Mr. ENGlishJELLo Feminism goes too meaning it makes men feel uncomfortable bc women are demanding to be treated with respect in and outside the workforce. That we are no longer toys that men can buy and do what they want with.
@@startattoos300men and women are different. Biologically, this benefits different people for different things or purposes. Accept what you are given and make it your own, don’t find situations to pinpoint men as a problem.
@@xottnk Fair point, I understand.
@@startattoos300Ladies and gents this response just won the Internet.
"You're not oppressed in the same ways that I am." "No and I'm sure you're not oppressed in the same ways that I am."
And then the silence was deafening.
And I soo wish feminists would have simply asked what were the ways men are opressed, to at least aknowledge that men's opression exists. Instead I heard an unspoken "But you're not opressed at all so let's get back to women's problems".
🤷
@@WedrownyGrajek of course, everyone gets oppressed in different ways, depending on gender, race, ethnicity, sexuality’s, there is oppression everywhere and we acknowledge that but in most cases of rape, sexual assault, wages, women are the ones getting most oppressed and by saying “oh yeah but men are getting oppressed too” you are not even listening to what women are saying and making it seem like you are the victim
@@chickennoodlesoup9350 ...and we're back to square one.
🤷
@mermaidbeats2021 fr tho
@@chickennoodlesoup9350 The thing is he wasn't saying "BUT men get oppressed too" he was saying he wants recognition for men being oppressed as well. That's what feminism is and should be. Equality for all.
I'm so so glad they didn't put only women on the feminist side and only men on the not feminist side
Mirte M agree it’s more fair this way
@@bacht4799 They only did it because people complained about it the last time they covered this
The thing is, it shouldnt matter
Remo Crapstuff agree it’s shouldn’t matter.. side note.. who is that character you using.. I have seen that character so many times I don’t get who it is ..!!
Had to include simps
Imagine if they brought Derrick.
😭😂
Feminists and non-feminists would unite lol
LMAOO I LOVE HOW EVERYONE JUST KNOWS DERRICK ABJSNS
It’d ruin the conversation completely.
This comment is so underrated xD
"You are not oppressed in the same ways that I am"
"And I'm sure you are not oppressed in the same ways that I am"
"You dare use my spells against me?!"
nobody said men weren’t oppressed but a lot of studies have shown that woman have it harder then men. My problem is that when woman want to talk about their problems that’s the moment men bring up that they are also oppressed, but that doesn’t mean it’s okay that woman are. Men oppression is terrible and ofcourse we should talk about it but why does it has to be when we are taking about feminism and the oppression of woman?
I think, we should work together instead of comparing each other to see who has it harder.
@@rosadoueiri A lot of studies show men have it harder than women so what's your point? The guy merely pointed out the same logic applied to him and feminism is supposedly about gender equality so that's why you should want to talk about the oppression of men
@@shrisiva4016 why would someone think "feminism" is about gender equality??
@@rosadoueiri that is not verifiably true at all
The only male privilege that I am aware I experience, and it's a big one, is that I can go relatively anywhere at any time and nobody bothers me nor am I too concerned for my safety. When it comes to this issue, I feel really bad for women. I wish everyone would just mind their own business unless someone cries for help.
same,aside from that i dont really know any other privilages we're supposed to have
@@trallegas6589 It is a massive privilege and I would hate to have that kind of limitation. That being said, I know of nothing else I have over a woman.
@@Marta-zm8oe Wow! Thanks for putting so much effort into your response. So much to unpack here! There are many things I want to address and questions I have being that you seem versed on this from a more western society standpoint than individual. But work will be long today so I will address all of this in a day or two.
It's a double-edged sword. It also means that you get far less attention when you actually need it. That being said, I kind of agree
Men are way more likely to suffer a violent death though.. most likely inflicted by yet another male 😬 but still true..
It annoys me that people can’t accept that both genders have issues that need to be fixed
Edit: some of you don’t understand the point of this comment
Facts
WhAt AbOUT GenDer Fluidity ANd NoN BinaRy
CONSERVATIVES 🤣
Itz TectalicYT I didn’t mention those genders because this subject has more to do with sex than gender, not because I don’t believe in them
I’m a Yeti. No I was joking 🙃
Would be interesting if we had male feminists vs female traditionalists
THISS!
Female traditionalist would completely troll the male feminists. It would be hilarious.
YESS! that is such a good idea!
More likes so they can set this up💯
Even my wife said feminist are dumbs women's 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
The one thing I truly appreciate about all of the conversations had on this channel is that it effectively demonstrates what happens when people communicate in person and not on social media (Twitter, Facebook, ig... etc...)... This is true authentic core human interaction.
do you think some of them maybe holding back just cause they are on camera?
@@leonincheonan absolutely 100% you cant just say anything without immediate consequence in person...
I feel like the men's rights activits and the women's rights activits who actually care about their respective movements and don't just try to bring the other side down should join together as one for true equality because that is what all this is about. Being one as human beings. The other side is not the enemy in this case!!
Well thats only when modern wave feminists learn to hold themselves accountable and stop putting all the blame on misogyny.
@1000 Alt accounts and when Feminists stop using female issues to discount male issues.
In theory you are completely correct and I would love it if it actually could work like that in practice. The problem is that the feminist movement over the years created its own narrative on where the issues affecting women come from. And sadly a lot of it comes down to blaming men for everything. In their eyes, men are always privileged oppressors and women are always oppressed victims and they have been saying that for many years. Even simply admitting, that men can also be victims of women is already dangerous for their narrative (risk of exposing it as false).
@1000 Alt accounts We don't. You just SEE that we do because you want to be in the argument all the time and ALWAYS be mentioned
@Saddam Soldier congratulations????
she's just a walking buzzfeed article
Even got the color too
BuzzFeed is pretty good
@@LeoTakacs nice bait
I love how you didn’t even wrote who, bu we all know who you’re talking about
@@LeoTakacs how much are they paying you?
You don't need to identify as a feminist in order to advocate for equal rights.
THANK YOU
Yes exactly
Egalitarianism
That's the definition of feminist, so yeah, you kinda do.
@Amelia Piner
While women’s rights are a human issue, you don’t need to be one in order to advocate for the rights of all people. You can be a human rights activist and push for the equality of all people. Women’s rights are absolutely an incredibly important issue, but that doesn’t mean that you have to be a feminist to advocate for those rights. The same way you don’t need to be a part of the LGBTQ+ to advocate for LGBTQ+ rights. You don’t even need to consider yourself to be an ally, as long as you advocate for their rights. You don’t have to be a part of a label to advocate for equal rights.
I wish some of these conversations were longer to allow for speakers to say more and hear their perspectives. It is such a teaser for someone to reference “culture” as an example, and not hear more. I love the work and conversation that this platform is bringing about. Please continue to do so.
I think we can all agree that there are positives and negatives in being either gender. And it's about time we empathised with each other, rather than playing the blame game or trying to compete over who has it worse.
“Women didn’t want to be teachers” and im sure not all men wanted to go to the army
Why were women drafted? Sexism against them. No one wants to he in the army but the fact that men were the only ones forced in has nothing to do with misandry.
@Joselene Lu ridiculously flawed logic there
@Joselene Lu I feel like I know what you're getting at but if that were true, it wouldn't be privilege, it would just be equity; that is not the reality of things
@Joselene Lu are you messing with me right now? How do those go together
Joselene Lu wow I’m impressed I actually see where you are coming from, men are wired to be better and confident, and women to be wired to stay home and care for a family that’s just biologically correct and I’m fine with that. It’s also true that men have been put down because of expectations based on that. I hope I’m making sense.
There is a fine line between supporting women’s rights and being sexist
Yellow shirt girl can't tell the differnce
It’s really not that fine of a line though. Why do people feel the need to look down at the other gender?
情勢国際 idek people are weird sometimes
情勢国際
Wait… who told you supporting women’s rights is looking down on anybody?
Pretty Rat no I was talking about when feminists are sexist towards men sorrry I wasn’t clear enough:)
As a woman in stem, I agree with Seth’s point that there is a choice to choose the majors that lead to careers that pay higher. I’ve never seen any “systematic inequality” that made me think I couldn’t be a stem major.
Have you ever been in a comp sci class?
@@cevxj yes, I’m an electrical engineering major so I’m currently learning C++ and learned Java in high school (I’m only a freshman in college). my argument still remains the same that even though it’s a field with an astronomically high number of males I’ve never seen that as something that would hold me back. I don’t think of myself as being a minority or pity myself, I just get the work done.
In most cities (specially where I’m from) a woman going into stem or any male dominated field will get you sexually and verbally harassed, humiliated bc men think they’re better than you, men who will be jealous and even bully you bc they can’t stand a woman being better than them, etc. that’s what they’re talking about. Yes it’s a choice, however it scares most women away bc they get a taste of that harassment everyday. Some rather take a route that mostly surrounds them with other women.
@@jacqui407 I have to agree with someone who wants to be a engineer as my future career. More men choose careers which have higher pays then woman. I like to interview people at my school to see what they like and they're future and ideas. And what I've seen is more woman generally aren't interested in high paying jobs, while majority of the males I've interviewed would like high paying tech jobs or something that will lead to a successful life. I wouldn't call this feminism as both woman and males have almost the same chance to join a career. I would say it's more of a choice of what a male wants and what a female wants.
Ok. If there is a natural tendency for women to prefer certain types of careers that are different than the ones men typically prefer, then the systemic inequality lies in the fact that the male dominated careers are made to be higher paying.
True story... About 10 years ago, I applied for a job and when I was in the interview the manager told me the job started off at $9.00/hourly. I told them I need $12/hrly to make it worthwhile. They kindly said no and I walked away. 6 months later I came back to the company to do a little shopping and I saw a woman working in the position that I turned down. We started talking and I asked her about her job, she said she liked it but it didn't pay that well. I asked her "then why did you take the job if you knew the pay isn't enough to sustain you?" she said "because I was afraid if I asked for more I wouldn't get the job".
Bottom line, both genders have struggles. Everyone should be equal
Aj Azzone exactly!
Aj Azzone literally why can’t people just settle on this
Aj Azzone and that’s what true feminism is, but a lot of people think feminism is just for woman rights only.
Unfortunately that is still very open to interpretation. Equality can be interpreted as either equality of opportunity or equality of outcome, two very different ideals.
@@ddandymann I think equality of opportunity is a good factor, not equality of outcome. We should try to remove from the market system any impediments to people manifesting those talents that would make them effective and competent players in the productive market itself.
I'm very glad they had a female non feminist and vice versa
She was no help tho
Shes a feminist 100%. It's really clear to see that. Jubile failed me.
@@Marozaaaa shes pro choice tho and feminists arent
@@greenapple_cos4971 thats exacly what feminists are, every feminist is pro choice.
@@Marozaaaa Hell no, no they aren't Lmaoo
Seth is amazing. Saying this as a woman i whole-heartedly agreed with everything he said. So clear and well spoken.
you are non feminist too ? but why ?
@@sarahrean7174 Cuz she agrees more with that side of the discussion I think that might be the reason.
@@sarahrean7174 because feminism in 2023 makes no sense specially in the west.
As a latina, i also got told “Laura, set the table” by my grandma, but you know who had to go over the roof to fix stuff, who had to use the hammer, who had to go to do the dirty work? My brother. So, Who’s worst?
Ugh please, not all Latinos were raised that way. Not me.
@@GD-jc3wx me neither, my parents aren’t like that, but my grandma did behave like that.
But my point is, she was the one who implied hispanic culture is horrible for telling girls set the table. If she is gonna critize the hispanic culture for that she should also criticize that hispanics make boys do harder jobs.
As a white women, I had to do the same. It just didn’t affect me like it does everyone else ig
I've also noticed. She's lucky she only needs to set the table. As someone who grew up on traditional family culture, me and my brothers were also doing hard work when we were kids like helping in the construction or house repairs, fetching water every single day, mending fences etc. If I had to choose, I'd rather be setting the table than breaking my back mixing concrete, but it's a man's work so we have to suck it up and crack on.
@Leandro Martinez of course are men oppressed just as much as women.
The whole reason this started is because the P.E teacher put everyone on boys vs girls
Bruh underrated comment
Poor girls lmao
Hah yes
Yessss like my dude. Then all the boys would be like “there’s no way they can win” Or the P.E teacher was racist....
@Elinor Clancy but if we take a 15 years old team of boys vs girls without any experience , the boys will probablly win
“A big part of feminism is telling women they’re worth it already.”
Man that’s good.
I agree with that too
@Alex Meggoe facts
max e 😂😂😂😂
I loved how they zoomed to the Mexican girl right after he said that coz she said her life would be better if she were a man. You can see her face change a little when he said that
I understand what you're quoting, but when I say "hey, I'm not a feminist because the whole movement is toxic. I believe women should be treated the same as men," I get told that I'm a "white man's slave" as though I can't think for myself. I conceal carry & am from an actual oppressed country named Iran, but feminists don't care about me when I point those things out. I'm not already worth it to them.
This was the most eloquent and civil discussion yet... I feel like I could really see the points of the other side without getting upset right away.
Love these videos, but they're always soo short! I could watch this for hours !!
The best part about this show is that nobody raises their tone or insults each other. No matter what the other person says, the discussion continues, what an incredible production! Great job guys, love every single episode
Lmao
Did you not watch the religious one?
That old dickhead went crazy.
When your favorite youtube channel comments on a video you are watching you know you’re in the right place.
Seek discomfort ❤️
Love you guys ❤️ let’s make the world great together!
Yes Theory yes theory!
I would prefer to see this live and unedited, then we could really see what’s happening.
"Feminism is about equality about the sexes" also "this is a female movement and i dont care how men feel"
@@aliasmcgames thats simply not what she said. Its was literally a retort about her saying she doesnt care what men think about the movement while claiming that the movement is about the equal rights of the sexes. She ultimately hijacks the meaning to focus on the plight of women instead of aknowledging that men and women both have unique problems. I dont think a womens right to do anything with her own body should be restricted, but the insistence that men dont face problems is just cherry picking.
awesometico I don’t know why but the lady in the yellow shirt seemed like she hated men, men are definitely oppressed too😂 but feminist never talk about that.
Flame La lol right
awesometico no one says that
She says that she’s not going to change her beliefs so that a man might join her
Women have it so easy nowadays. When she said you need to understand your privileges to the gentleman, she really should take heed to her own advice.
Hearing the phrase "acknowledge your privilege first" just instantly invalidates an argument
I want that unedited footage of the man in white vs the female in yellow’s conversation
*woman in yellow's
@@What54321 *you're (contraction of "YOU aRE")
"Your" is for possession.
*affect (different meaning)
me 🤣
YES PLEASE
@TerrieI have seen woman, that is not a woman lol
I'm so happy there's a male feminist and a female non feminist
if only the female non feminists were actually not feminists
@@user-dj4bu8bq5r What do you consider being a feminist, and why do you think someone who is a women and considers themselves not a feminist is a feminist?
I think a feminist is someone who fights for the social and lawful rights of women. But I do realize that I worded my comment. I meant she's leaning more to the most common feminist beliefs than non feminist
@@user-dj4bu8bq5r oh right, actually in that sense I'd agree. In fact I think most people nowadays agree with most common feminist beliefs (equality between sexes) a lot of the time confusion comes from people being unsure what modern feminist movement wants I feel. Would certainty be interesting if in the was a women who did not believe in equality between sexes.
Why?
THANK YOU, I HATE WHEN FEMINIST SAY THAT "WE'RE MORE OPPRESSED THAN YOU", but completely ignore a mans oppression. GOES AGAINST ORIGINAL FEMINIST.
Maybe against the original meaning of feminist, but what she says actually matches the word FEMInist. It baffles me why even when the target was to get woman equal to men it had to be a female word whilst the movement claims to be for equality. Even though I am for equality where possible between the sexes, I laugh at men calling themselves feminists. Try asking if I am an equalist of something like that and I will be happy to say yes.
@@longbow857 b
@@longbow857 am a masculinist
Many feminists literally believe that women are superior to men which is in fact misandry.
Men are way more oppressed than women
Loved this Middle Ground, it’s the most respectful one I’ve seen
Woman in the yellow shirt: “I’m a feminist so in my eyes all genders should be treated equally”
Also yellow shirt woman: “You’re a man so I don’t care if you agree” lmao
Shes why I dont label myself as a feminist
@@jaidenkreuser Same lmao. And she isn't even the worst you can find. Entitled and ignorant.
@@TheMagnetShow facts.
Jaiden Kreuser same here
They arent feminists. They are feminazis. And I think she is leftist and leftism, as you may know, tends to lean on nazism.
Now the non feminist lady honestly was more of a feminist
She was literally bragging about how she loves being a woman the whole video xD
Yeah.
I think that's how a true feminist must be. If we're going to base that in a general definition she is the true feminist that admittedly rejects being a feminist as defined by the modern society. So yeah she's nit a feminist, she's a strong, independent, woman and that will help the society more than those who protests for freedom they have
Something tells me that jubilee takes the most extreme people
@Eva From Wall-E and i dont identify as a butterfly ur point...
“Why then are women choosing jobs that pay less?” Cause they picked it. No one forced them 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
Yea
jason, i appreciate what you and the team are doin at Jubilee. I'm learning and entertained at the same time
I always come to the comments to see who the annoying one will be
Anyone else?
Ey yo Thanos, do us a favor and erase feminazism in existence, will you?
Thanos the black girl
Yes
Black King okay but he should erase incels too
Hey
Jubilee is hella smart. Notice how they always plant that one person in every episode to piss us off
Edit: damn das alot of likes you guys are real cool
Salty Butter well.. wrestling has inspired more things that we thought and no offense I don’t like wrestling but it’s has made our discussion on TH-cam or even politics more interesting.. 🤷♀️
Oi narancia
Usually it’s a nonwhite
True
The Shield girl what-
In my less-than-a-minute-made opinion, we should strive to create equal opportunities instead of equal success. So at the end of the day, it's all up to you on how to use these opportunities to succeed in life. Then nobody can blame it on the status quo on why people can't do this or people can't do that...
The black girl with the yellow shirt acted like she was in the 1950s 😂
yellow shirt girl: we want women to be equal to men
also yellow shirt girl: i’m not concerned about what men have to offer on the topic
Translation:" i only care about me and if its convenient enough to help me, ill take it a
nd say its not enough."
Nae Ateny she makes me cringe whenever she speaks.
She is an outstanding example of why not enough men are willing to be feminists.
Nae Ateny they are the worst
@Brad1156 And a race baiter
Politicians should NEVER be hired on the basis of identity in any way
They aren't. They must be qualified to be politicians, what happens is that all else being equal, they account for lack of represention. The girl who is not a feminist said it perfectly: its common sense. We are a part of the population thus should be represented
@Abe Benjamin wow, incredibly you failed to engage with anything i said: *all else being equal* implies that both of these people have the same qualifications, they just use gender to break ties considering the historical disadvantages. Do you think events happen in a vaccum? Women have had rights for less than 100 years in America, 100 years in which men were allowed to go into careers that women weren't. This is no individual man's fault but I don't see what's wrong with using this metric to break a tie when all else is equal.
What other metric do you suggest be used to break ties then, when both candidates have the same qualifications and abilities?
I feel like people just have such narrow minded views of systems: just because women are equal legally does not mean they are not affected by being stalled for 100+ years, of a nation that is 250 years old and where men had the advantage to do things women couldn't; just because gender is considered to break ties does not mean anyone is being hired for "having a vagina". What do you suggest be done about the clear need to catch up? Nothing?
And also, is it fair that women exist as a demographic but aren't represented? How would you feel as a man if all your law and policy makers were women? How would you feel if they never addressed issues that disproportionately affect men and dismissed them? How would you feel if they had the right to regulate your reproductive system and bodily autonomy?
If the population of America is made of men and women, then why can't women have representation? Does it not make sense that 50% of the population be represented in our legislature and government especially when it comes to making decisions on women's issues?
Also, even if you do not understand the social importance of feminism in the West (which btw is still necessary even in law. Feminists campaigned to expand the meaning of rape in states in which the definition excluded men and other types of penetration, but not all states have gotten there yet. As recently as 2016 the state of Oklahoma did not consider it rape to orally penetrate a victim while unconscious), do you honestly think that globally feminism is no longer necessary? When 97% of women in Guinea Conakry are genitally mutilated; when some countries still do not acknowledge the existence of marital rape; when acid violence against women is common place; when on average one woman is killed every 7 hours in Brazil for being a woman- if you do, i suspect you want to hate on feminism because you believe its a bunch of crazy "SJW" compilation loudmouths yelling and man haters and are not engaging with feminism outside of the internet.
P.s: i can provide sources for all of my claims. If you want to engage with them and you want me to link them, i will gladly do so
@Abe Benjamin
Clearly you do not want to engage with anything said and are unwilling to even understand the arguments being posited.
Why do you hate feminism so much?
Never said genitals were a classification when a) its so simplistic to understand sex and gender as genitals. Trans women sometimes don't have vaginas, does that make them less than women? B) it is not a qualification, gender becomes a *tie breaker* when two candidates of different sexes and or genders have the *same qualifications*
@Abe Benjamin what makes you believe that though? I'm genuinely curious. You have yet to present a single argument to back any of your claims? How is feminism in any way akin to Nazism? Please do explain
If you don't mind me asking, how old are you?
maybe in the us but other countries with strong identity? yeah that's a bit marxist if you ask me
Yes this was awesome and we need more of people on opposite sides to sit and talk things out like adults and not get into shouting matches talk over each other and no one hears the other sides point of view.
Our differences is what unites us..
Nobody :
Man in Black Shirt : *interesting*
That gesture grabbed my attention too. It was a humble and sensible gesture even tho he was in the opposite side.
Twoset violin
@@daniajaber9888 Brooooooooooooooooooooooooo! SACRELIGOUS !
@@daniajaber9888 If you can be a non feminist slowly, you can be a non feminist quickly.
I watched it too 🤣
Body positivity activists vs. Health advocates.
UPDATE: They made the video after I requested it.
That would be a good one
AASDFHKLL IM HERE FOR IT
Yes, somebody call in Megan Jayne.
Science would kill those weirdos XD
K.Nizzles yassss
At 7:14 when she says she's more qualified is kinda confusing, but I think she might be talking about junior attorneys because she is also a junior attorney. Then if that's the case wouldn't it because of the number of cases they each took and successfully finished? Or is the law on an hourly wage aswell? Just asking for a friend to explain it for me.
Oh yea she also didn't mention the gender of the Co worker aswell so for all we know could be another women.
Personally, I think whenever you have conversations like that, you do need to have it on a basis of facts. It's infuriating to see people stating false claims and that just being accepted as a valid argument.
the guy in sweater is so affirm with his opinion and calm in discussion. what a lad
And was the most logical of them all I like him
(No homo)
The one with the glasses? Yeah i love him too
I didn't see a dude in a sweater haha
@@asha_vere The only guy that is on the feminist side
@@averagebody.averageheart2275 The dude in the white sweater is on the non-feminist side...
I've come to the conclusion that I can't watch these types of videos without getting pissed
Same. As soon as she said "Recognise your privilege" I just said "Not this crap again" and shut it off.
@@MJ-ky4oj Can you explain to me what I am ignorant of?
@@MJ-ky4oj kinda feel like you're also ignorant
@@MJ-ky4oj have you recognized your priveleges as a woman? That you are favored legally? That you are typically raised with less expectations? That standards for men are much higher than standards for women? Everyone has priveleges. You can't just blame men for all of women's problems and you can't expect for change to only come from men. That defeats the whole purpose of being a feminist anyways. You are basically saying you need a man's help to be equal when that's not the case.
@@MJ-ky4oj You keep mentioning many many things... So explain to me the many things that men have that women dont get to have because of the patriarchy or systemic sexism etc. If women are so unable to achieve "equal footing" without men then why pray tell are there so many feminists that exclude men from feminism.
I think that this group could, with time, actual make some significant progress towards harmony.
i want this group to do it again - but add **derrick** into the mix
Who wants Jubilee to upload the full version of these discussions? I know I do. It doesn't matter if it's 5 hours long!!
Nate p exactly Then they just put time stamps of each topic
How about 15
Yassss get that ad revenue jubilee
No because the feminist would be getting slaughtered
yeah literally I would watch the entire thing. They kept cutting when the discussion got good.
To me equality doesn’t mean identical, yeah, men and women do have differences but those differences should not translate to differences in opportunities, respect and overall fairness and human rights.
Well said
Amen
Preach
Equality means identical i believe. Maybe you are talkimg of equity.
@@charbelalam2648 equity means identical equality is like equal opportunity
That yellow sweater women🥱🥱
That male feminist was a Mama's boy.
So?
Feminism was supposed to mean equality, but people are distorting it.
False. This is referenceable even in the feminist corpus academically, and one absolutely critical component gets dropped without hardly anyone noticing: the belief, not only that men and women should be equal, but that women are objectively disadvantaged compared to men. That's actually the core of the discussion, but no one is grasping that.
MoSEaO yea, they want equality
It's about power now man. It makes it harder to support feminist man.
@Angry Egalitarian Yep , it's difficult to support their ideology.
MoSEaO no one said u were twisting it but so much of the feminist movement is now about female superiority- that’s not everyone but it’s a large number of ppl.
"you are not oppressed in the same ways that I am"
"No and I'm sure that you are not oppressed in the same ways that I am" lolll
Abidali Liyaqat Khan he’s right. I am a straight, white, and cisgender male. But I still faced discrimination for supposedly being gay. But I never was and still am not. But under the black lady’s definition, I’m not a victim.
Destruction level 100
@@beardedbros7215 if the pressure to be so overtly masculine didn't exist (which is a direct result of the patriarchy anyway), you wouldn't be discriminated against for 'supposedly being gay'. so the reason why you are discriminated against can be solved with feminism, because feminism fights against the patriarchy and against toxic masculinity. we're all fighting for the same thing (:
@@SophiaKalo It's so interesting that feminism can solve male discrimination by not actually letting men be a part of the conversation and attempting to reroute every issue that's a male issue as a woman's issue.
Forced to enlist in the selective service? Well, if society treated women perfectly, then this wouldn't exist... somehow.
Men are treated as disposable wallets rather than living people? Well, if we got rid of every single gender stereotype that affects women first while ignoring male stereotypes, I'm sure this will go away too!
OtterlySilly men are treated that way because of reinforced gender norms which is something that the patriarchy perpetuates. we are just more vocal about women’s issues specifically because as women it is more relevant to our experience and we need to speak up because no one else will. as I was saying though, the way society oppresses women also impacts men, so our fight is for everyone. no one’s stopping you from joining the fight and speaking up about your own experiences though...
Equality is there in most place. And in those places It's like saying Here I'll give you equality the end result depends on how you use this, then people started working hard but due to biological factors many women can't get to where men are and they start complaining and then force society to place a handicap on men so that they could get their equality.
The woman that is an attorney needs to wake up. She literally knows that men get worse punishments for the same crimes, yet she doesn't want to talk about that if anyone would have brought that up. Plus, the makeup is caked sooooooooooooooo hard on her face. You can just tell by under her neck.
One example of patriarchy is degrading a women’s appearance instead of addressing the substance of her contribution, just so you know
@@down-to-earth-mystery-school I'm a woman. Lol. So you can't say this is the patriarchy. I also addressed both, just in case you couldn't read.
@@Ravesy yeah you can, it's called internalized misogyny
@@panchikocut Lol. The idiocracy of that statement.
@@Ravesy Pick me pick meee that's how you sound like to us
Seeing a male feminist and a female non feminist is soo interesting.thanks for the video
Yes ! I agree. But unfortunately, the female non feminist wasn't doing and saying much. It's like she wasn't even present. I would love to hear, as a christian female feminist myself, her opinion a bit more.
@@noemiepalan7247 I’m a non-feminist woman and I would like to answer some of you questions if you have any hihi
@@Alleballe ahh i smell commmon sense from you, its wonderful
@@Zoger32114 the other person asked
@@lasthopehope1211 how is that common sense lmao what
The first statement should've been "I believe in gender equality."
jubilee, please post unediated versions of these id love towatch them
Feminism really needs to change its attitude towards male abuse survivors without calling anyone misogynist for saying so.
Not after the way men have treated Amber Heard
@@quietopinion9637 No. Nice try but no.
1) AH 100% deserved to be held in contempt after the abuse she dished out. It wasn't just "men" who hated her but even if it was, who cares?
2) There's zero excuse that the feminist movement has for their appalling attitudes - victim blaming, abuse apologism etc - towards male abuse survivors.
@@quietopinion9637 Thanks for exposing yourself as a misandrist.
@@quietopinion9637 😐😐😐😐
The yellow shirt chick definitely applied to work at buzzfeed
Lmao
Probably got rejected because she’s “not black enough”.
@@the1theonlyg248 this was just a funny comment and then you had to dampen it with your political correctness 🙄
If she was gay she would have been accepted
she’s an attorney...
If you use your gender/race/sexuality as your only personality trait then you need to find a new one. (P.s don’t take this as a homophobic comment I am lesbian)
Lele Pons went 👁👄👁
Im lAtInA
New race?
Sexuality too. Some many people use that as their only trait.
Dvc2007-2 I’ll put that there too.
Everyone has privilege, the fact that all of these people are able to talk in the same room, is privilege.
.
Every feminist wants equal privilege yet want to damage men mental health in the process. Feminist aren’t sticking to their ideology of equality.
How is feminism damaging men’s mental health?
Since a long time ago, Feminism is DENGUE
The most respectful MG video yet in S2 is the Vegan vs. Meat Eaters. That was soooooooo fun to watch!
"You are not oppressed the same way as I am."
-"And you are not oppressed the same way as I am."
That was a good one.
Yana Raev Why not?
But have you ever lived as a white man? If your answer is no, then I cannot understand how you can make this judgment. It seems inconsiderate for you to say that when you you probably didn't get the chance to experience both lives. I would understand if there were laws that put white men in a higher status by the states, but this is not the case.
okay wow that’s really horrible, I find it amazing how observant you are btw noticing all of that in high school. I 100%, 100%! Agree with you on everything you wrote but I see little hope that the generation you and I are growing up in is slowly starting to see all the nonsense and drama going on around us, but just haven’t taken the chance to step up. There are many kids who are standing up for views that I may not agree with, but it always seems to puzzle me why the opposite views don’t speak out and yet in the recent voter registration there were more conservatives among the youth than not. Sorry this is off topic and all over the place but your comment really got me thinking. 😁
'quantity' shouldn't be a factor, any oppression should be considered is what the guy probably meant
Yeah but if someone is experiencing more oppressions shouldn't that be put on the front burner
yellow shirt girl: "as a woman i'm not sure that i'm concerned whether or not you wanna join"
.
.
everyone: *confused*
This is so sad 😭
Jessica Tjeng yellow shirt woman: “everyone is equal” “we don’t need to change our many many definitions of a flawed movement to work around a mans itty witty brain” hah
They were shocked that she dropped the facade and undermined everyone's pro-modern-day-feminism argument, including her own, up until that point.
As soon as I read the comment she said this exact same thing
i had to watch that multiple times to take in that she just said "my feminists thoughts are superior to you men"
Possibly one of the best groups I've ever seen having a discussion on the idea a ND not killing each other.
As a male Mexican I can tell you it’s not easy being in my shoes lol
Animal rights activist and hunters please. :)
Yesss
They did a farmers and animal rights activists
Google iqsquared us debates "don't eat anything that has a face" and iqsquared us debates "hunters preserve wildlife", hunters get handily stomped both times.
btw not anti hunter here
Hunt sabs Vs. Hunters
Forever Woof yes yes yes yes yes and yes
That yellow shirt girl has a personality of a Buzzfeed employee
xD
Legit she is a feminazi
Straight facts
It's like you took those words out of my mouth
Exact same thing
Equality of opportunity: Both men and women get equal chances to become a politician
Equality of outcome: Appointing politicians simply for their gender, regardless if they are fit to lead or have your best interests in mind
Take your pick
However you have to acknowledge bias. Even a more suited woman will get over looked.
" aCkNoWlEdGe yOuR pRiViLeGe " lmao
?
I love that even though Derrick has no presence in this video, half the comments are literally about him 😂
Bro, right😂?
He is a legend
@@georgesunshine8806 no
@@georgesunshine8806 He's memorable for misrepresenting men. he's far from being a "legend"
Who is Derrick I am confused..
Bruh the chick that wasn’t a feminist was definitely a feminist
Lol I don't get it. Where is she a feminist?
@@kilianlechner5400 "male privilege is real"
@@gavinhomourinho1359 ik
@@gavinhomourinho1359 and? that's true. saying that dosen't make her a feminist
Nah
The lady in yellow is dodging all difficult questions just like AOC😂😂
If miss yellow shirt and orange pants hadn't been there it would have been rhe best middle ground video of the decade
yes
“The title feminist excludes men, but the definition doesn’t”
- mic drop
@Angry Egalitarian Yup, the definition includes men. But the title doesn't. Egalitarian is a better term imo.
Oh my heart hurts now!
@Ayanokoji i agree, for example men are less likely to obtain custody of their child compared to a woman. This only happens bc being nurturing was thought to be a feminine/woman trait, so the mothers got the child. So this unfairness placed on men stems from sexist thinking (nurturing is feminine and therefore weak so men can't be nurturing or else they're weaklings), if mainstream/white feminism understood this then I'd be all for it but the feminism I saw was not inclusive like it should've been
@@JG-xg9bd what who said nurturing is weak because it's not, nurturing is a really big part of anyone's life it can even define if you will have a mental health problem when you grow up like learning, socializing and even the way you think over all because if you have a good Mom it doesn't matter what other bad influences tell you because she'll grow you right and that's easier for women because of maternal instinct that you can't blame society for.
Can we agree that comparing an apple to an orange because we can is not a rational justification? Its ontological principle is oxymoronic since its discovered almost immediately that we are clearly different, and that trying to eliminate those differences eliminates men and women as concepts entirely, thus removing all justification for attempting to equalize in the first place. Text book subversive marxism.
My opinion about more women leaders. I really dont care weather the leader is a man or woman just as long as they are a good leader with good intentions. A good leader that just so happenes to be a woman is fine with me as well as for men
a 100% agree but i think that we do need women's opinions on decision that affect women since most decisions that affect women are made by males.
@@darla8592 agree with you
@@darla8592 Same.
Yes, exactly. Your gender does not make u better or worse in leading, it's what you stand for that matters. We just need to have the same base for everyone and the same chances for everyone to be that leader.
@Liquid Sun honestly the leaders actions and behaviors can depend on the situation of the country
this channel is amazing, thank you Middle Ground
The editing made this video hard to watch. The lack of rebuttals on the points presented paints a picture that doesn’t show the whole story.
Jubilee deserves so much more recognition for their content. Their content is eye-opening, moving, touching, spreading light on issues people struggle with, in their daily lives (big or small). All of their series are just inspiring. It encourages me to be more positive and think about others before doing something. it allows me to get into the mindset that things will get better and allows me to know that people have it worse than me... and this is huge for me to say this because I have depression and anxiety. I love their series, such as this one, which involves seeing a topic from two or more perspectives. It encourages me to be more open-minded and educates me to make wiser, more mature decisions.
true! and their channel is so much better than buzzfeeds lol.
Slick Bean Lookin Chrome Dome Head No, it's not like Buzzfeed. Buzzfeed is awful and they bend their statistics.
Buzzfeed is too biased to have a valid opinion about anything.
These really need to be long. "Why are women choosing jobs that pay less?" "culture" *skips to next scene*. That could have been more of a discussion. They always get cut off way to quickly to resolve anything.
Ekton it’s not culture. It’s flexibility. Jobs that pay less probably have you work less hard and less often than someone who does hard jobs that pay a lot. Before someone mentions something about fast food, you flip burgers. An accountant crunches numbers for hours on end and makes sure that they’re all correct because a simple error can screw their client out of thousands of dollars.
The Joker it's not only flipping burgers tho
The Joker yea man all low paying jobs are flipping burgers.
Then make a video, Ekton. Show us what a long-form discussion should be on this and other topics.
I have neither the time nor the resources.
When they talk about the male student not listening to his mother it is mostly based on how she commands authority because in my school the strict teacher always has authority over everyone whether they be a female or male, it has nothing to do with gender in my opinion
A lawyer just made a claim that her employer is committing wages discrimination. She is violating her oath by not reporting it.
Personally, please don't take offence but I believe Americans are completely lost when it comes to political views, they all talk about peace and coming to amicable conclusions but it creates some of the worst political violence in the World. Other countries have issues but America's own people are split up into 1000s of categories.
Western countries are the most free so it makes sense that there are so many split views and opinions, also there is a strict police enforcement.
Compared to other countries with less police they probably have more crime and more vigilante justice and are limited in freedom to thinking in only a few different ways.
@@WhiteWolfeHU why are Americans so obssesed with freedom/peace, do they think the States are the only place in the world where there is ''freedom'' or ''peace'' ? Just because people don't live in the States doesn't mean they live in a s..t hole or there's constantly crime. Look around the crime in the states ( where they are full of police as you said ) for the last couple of years and then talk peace and freedom.
@@daria8950 not all Americans are like that
@@daria8950 Oh I do look at the crime especially racial statistics
yeah man those blm protests
America is weird bro. (Speaking from an Irish perspective).
As a Canadian, I totally agree
As a American, totally agree
My nationality doesn't matter aha ur all gud
My nationality doesn't matter thanks mate
@My nationality doesn't matter dont worry or apologetic cause there was nothing u can do.
Dude is correct. Studies have shown that on a PER HOUR pay in similar job there is no noticeable pay difference.
I love this set of people!! They know how to properly converse amongst themselves.
The non-feminist guy looks like Jeremy form Phineas and Ferb 😂😂
Jesus Christ he does
So true
Omg I can’t unsee it
Facts
He is not anti-feminist he is not-femenist
The woman is the yellow shirt has such a different face when another woman is talking compared to when a man is talking.
Necrotoxic i can be like that too sometimes because i don’t feel safe around men. there could be reasons
Necrotoxic lmfao wow. There’s so much negativity against her but she made more sense than anybody else on there.
@@sadak163 Now, I am not the type of man to tell you that you have the wrong opinion, but she did make a couple factual errors in her arguments. If I remember correctly of course.
@@kayleybrett8608 I didn't consider that, but I just made an observation about how she looks at the men in the video differently.
you must be a man hating feminist, probably a lesbian too
I wish they made these longer so you can hear more of the conversations then just 2 talking points
the 2 male non feminists are great speakers and they voiced my exact opinions of why as a women i willcnever be a feminist