She deflected. Let's not address that God saw that lot was the only rightouse man in the town. And he offered his daughters up to get raped by ever man in the town.
Scientists believe they found the site of Sodom and Gomorrah. They believe that a meteor exploded over the city. It would have looked like a fireball coming down from Heaven. It would have burned the city in a flash. Shock wave, noise. If anyone witnessed it from a safe distance, it looked like God destroyed it utterly from anger.
But they still taking about it we live an a free society. They can choose to not talk about it an still they talking about it after 2024 years this is not first debate about the Bible these being many more trough the centuries God is good amen 🙏
😢@@Nijadj7 Dawkins is one of the heros among this crowd. Probably the primary hero. Wendy Wicke is nothing but a stupid snot. Dawkins should have slapped her, but he was too polite.
***** Why are you talking about Darwin. Even IFFF (and i dont see how) Evolution is proven false, it doesnt give ANY evidence to support the bible or any religion. You still have the burden of proof. I dont see why you brought up Dawkins marketing tool to answer seashelleyes1's point..
Yes but he conveniently ignores the history of slavery within Africa and tries to make it a purely western problem. That kind of disingenuous position needs to stop. I did like a number of the other points he made especially those involving the unity of humanity. Which btw is the very side Dawkins sits on, unlike the religious divisive crowd.
HAHAHAHA The evangelical man in red believes that a woman was turned into a block of salt?! And apparently 45% of Americans take this literally as well?! Is this real life I'm living?
Hypocrites basically !!! They believe something that never happened for instance a 700 year old man with A ark and lions tiggers elephants on a ark ?? With PENGUINS from Antarctic 🙄🙄🙄
I feel sorry for Richard because of the amount of stupidity that he has to endure. I mean, people applauding a man who just said that there can be no forgiveness without cost? What the hell is wrong with this world?
Is it stupidity, though? I used to have that same simple view of believers, but now i see it more nuanced. I try to understand the backgrounds of those who believe, and understand how they got to where they are. Perhaps you or i, had our life circumstances been different, could have been as fervently religious as some who are.
@@trekkiejunkbasically it’s dogmatic indoctrination and telling a child that they will burn in a non existent place forever if they are naughty naughty or don’t believe is child abuse at its finest
Bruh why on this earth every criminal that commits a crime isn't forgiven? And why do you expect God to forgive when he is all holy for all eternity and can't even think about sin? And you want him to forgive without cost?
I wonder if someone in there said they believed in Zeus, Apollo and other Greek gods and insist that this should be taught in science class just like creationism….I am sure he would have been laughed at.
Watch this. I'll use this very footage in the part 2. But this is an answer to this very question especially the begining historian question. th-cam.com/video/d3z8wJgcI60/w-d-xo.html
Imagine getting all your values and morals from only ONE book. And believing every other book is false. That's a dangerous concept no matter what the book is.
Francesca Stavrakopoulou. Brilliant and eloquent. I'm a bit smitten. But my brain hurts a bit from all the people in this debate constantly running around moving the goal posts.
I find religion abhorrent and a toxicity to society and I refuse to associate myself with it or like anything moderately to do with the ancient oppressive doctrine of Christianity. I hate everything the church stands for not because I'm a bigot but precisely because I am against bigotry. You might call me intolerant but ironically I'm only intolerant against intolerance itself...and that is what religion is. Intolerant against anyone or anything who does not conform to its sexist, homophobic, racist and oppressive agendas. As someone who stands for equality, morality and for human rights, christianity and religion goes against every fiber of my being. It's one of the biggest evils in society and religion can't reasonably be integrated into a positive. It's poisonous.
That is a very slippery slope you are starting down. When anyone apologizes to me for doing something wrong to me, I don't require a cost to forgive. I may judge intentions/ sincerety, but cost is irrevelant. Otherwise, I would be going down a path called vengence.
What's disgusting about it? Was the cost charged to you? Jesus paid the cost so that we would receive the free gift of Grace. Forgiveness is freely available to you and me... we don't deserve it, we can't "earn" it, but it is free because Jesus paid the cost. That's what he is saying.
God is righteous; before the destruction he gave these people chance after chance,but the Law he set demands the penalty of death before Christ resurrection! so if you are aware of the penalty but you still continue to do the crime after getting away and chance the first time, the punishment is on you!The is the nature of God's Laws of The Kingdom Government not Religion!!!!! The Bible is not a Religious Book of Christianity but the Constitutional Law of his Kingdom Government. remember,Just is King,kings rules Kingdoms, Governments!!!
RadioactiveSand that is not what the Bible teaches. It says there is NO SIN WITHOUT PENANCE and not no forgiveness without a cost. Actually read the book.
@@juliall255 Not just a Jewish woman - she's a rabbi. But yeah, an atheist myself, I don't agree with her but she was very switched on and open minded I thought
God's love is everlasting and ever present, allowing your Redemption at every point. But it takes Redemption. It is not unconditional certainly. Because that's how God made our souls and conscience in our body, able to have freewill, so we have the challenge of being Good or not, and then we shall reap reward for Eternity
Thomas Jefferson edited the bible into "The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth". He removed all the implausibilities, nonsense and miracles. This conversation of doubt has obviously been going on for some time and will probably still be going on long after I am gone.
rictus gate you say why do we desire to worship anything at all it is part of human nature some people want to admire something greater then themselves
rictus gate I focus on the false prophets that the bible talks about people that said earth was going end on a specific date like 1914 or the year 2000 someone also said the ending was coming in 2011 never did and finally came 2012 the bible says the ending will come like a thief in the night no one will see it coming we just pass 2012 all those dates came to pass just like the bible said I also focus in the calm in the night thinking about December 21 2012 knowing that we just pass it not too long thinking about this date it is almost as if a grip of fear comes over me cause you never know what to expect in the near future
Dr Lez is excellent at seeing the bigger picture and then zooming in. His perspective is so purely about truth from the most objective point of view possible. Admirable.
'No you don't have to filter the good stuff out. You just have to...' Then she proceeds to filter the good stuff out 🤣 Ah my talking snake believers you you really are the gift that keeps on giving 🤣🤣🤣😍😍
Richard Dawkins is (at least in my opinion) one of the best debaters alive today, in every single debate he will leave the opposition stumped on at least one occasion.
I commend Mr. Dawkins for sitting there silent while other people talk with the range of actual information he posesses in his head. A brilliant man listening to biblical jargon. It must be mind mind melting for him.
***** 'Better' version...?? maybe in your opinion. The're both still works of fiction & fairy stories & you can't really be called an 'adult' if you believe in fairy stories, can you..?
***** It's still all fiction. If you want to believe in some super power fictional being, go ahead, my 6 year old neice still believes in santa & the tooth fairy. You & her are so alike in your childish naivety.
***** You claim that the quran has so much to offer this world and it's followers, so many truths.... but exactly what have your kind done of value to human civilization and progress lately? What truths have you offered other than the same crap we roll our eyes at the Christians for: "god exists, obey him"?
The fact that we are even having this discussion on television is proof that religion is running on borrowed time. These kinds of discussions would be unheard of or even allowed not too long ago. It's a sign of change to come 👌
I'm more interested in: Do the majority of professed Christians have actually read the Bible? Being the most important book in a Christians life and all.
@@lightbeing8174 *The famous case of Anneliese Michel all points out to severe Psychosis and Epilepsy, unfortunately. In addition to a strict Roman Catholic upbringing. She was fascinated with the Church and thoroughly studied History, Latin and Hagiography of the Saints, wherein she easily role-played major historical figures and the “Adversary” himself under her state of “demonic possession”/psychotic episodes.*
I am so lucky that I escaped from religion at a young age. was around 7 or 8 when I worked it out.I am now a grown man who lives a good life.I help people everday, I love animals and am a loyal loving husband and father.I live a free life which is good.I don't need religion to show me tell how to live, and be told what I can eat and when.
I love the way tolerant, moral, religious people cannot control themselves when other people are talking. They have to constantly interrupt, constantly.
It is so bad in the real world that you have people driving around in cars with bibles hunting you down just to cram their nonsense down our throat. I detest religion because of the amount of insanity it has produced in the modern world.
'' ...We have a morality which is outside and independent from the bible, morality does not come from the bible, it comes from our evolutionary background'' ugh I clapped to! 👏👏🙌👍 So spot on! #GuyOtten 37:33.. Also another amazing point from an audience member, their are egalitarian societies existing today that have not even heard of the bible! Yet clearly run of fairness, thats morally correct.. How can you explain that? On a side note I cant believe people actually believe that if the bible did not exist, we as humans would miraculously become suspended of all morals in nature.. I wasn't brought up as a Christian and I still have my moral compass in check! I'm with Dr. Richard Dawkins too, Lets bypass the bible all together and look at moral philosophy! you know, an area thats doesn't contradict itself like the bible does.
If the Bible was divinely inspired perhaps it would have been deciphered and not oppressed people for the past 2000 years. It is only in the past 200 or so years of the long history of these books that any good has come from it. For the majority of its life, the Bible has allowed terror to reign.
22:56 the smug smile on his face as he finishes his immoral reposte. This is what religion does to people. He sincerely believes that his statement was morally profound. Evil.
Did anyone else get frustrated at how that priest kept interrupting and being condescending to Francesca and nobody else? She’s such far more intelligent and tactful than he is.
+Xerxes Underwood Hell doesn't exist but that's irrelevant because she as at least hot as the SUN which is much more beautiful than a hell lol. But I get your point lol.
27:50 - "If St. Paul were alive today - speaking into our society - our culture - he would be completely different - absolutely." WTF?!?!?!? Why a pile of crap that is . . . wow!!! There are a few things wrong with that statement . . . how in the world does she *know* this? Seriously . . . wtf? And if that's true then the word of god is null and void - it's a moot point . . . you have nothing to stand on . . . wow . . . what kind of convoluted mind produces such astoundingly absurd beliefs with such zeal and certainty?
I think what she was trying to say is. "If he grew up in our society. His views would be totally different." It's possible. Still, she is special pleading. Obviously, he didn't care much for women. He may have been the same. Many people, today, still think women should know their place. (And they DO grow up in modern societies.)
MrMdrscream I don't doubt that Paul would turn out differently if he were brought up today . . . but would his divinely inspired message change as well? This whole biblical god notion is such a joke . . . it claims there is only one god - but I look around and see each person makes up their own little godlet . . . what a joke. It's allllllllll just sentimental psychological bullshit that adults should learn to control far more.
rictus gate "but would his divinely inspired message change as well?" Exactly... That's an excellent point. If you were there. You would have deflated her sails. :-)
Rictus I agree with you absolutely. People are all a product and exist in their time and place. You can't just take someone out of their time and state with certainty what they would say today. And isn't it funny how that stupid woman claims that Paul would totally agree with her position. Very convenient.
basically you can't have a rational disscussion with people who still be lbelieve in the tooth fairy, their sense of history and reality is too warped I like how the rabbi states everything can be fantasy and it doesn't matter. What the heck is wrong with her? the other catholic woman says. you have to tell stories because people are basically stupid I guess.
This Bishop Michael character is a piece of work.He derides the treatment in Hinduism of Untouchables yet ignores the 'untouchables' which Christianity preserved for millenia such as homosexuals or even Jews.Far from Christianity being at the forefront of preventing the ill treatment of homosexuals - it still acts in some measure as a platform on which to continue such prejudices.
SuperPatrick777 Generally when one criticises statements it is customary to put forward evidence supporting that criticism.Should you wish to contradict any of my statements in the first post I invite you to do so.Merely writing 'foolish statement' or 'you fool' do not lend your posts any gravitas.
The woman at 10:00 says that the Bible should get special treatment because "It contains truth about us that endures." Well, so does Harry Potter. Agatha Christy books contain a lot of insight into the human psyche, should we give them special treatment as well?
The human species will never reach its full potential until religion, with all of its magical thinking and self-imposed ignorance, is relegated to the fringes of society where it firmly belongs.
It frustrates that Stavrakopoulou doesn't talk as much as others in debates/discussions like this. I really like her input and want to hear more of it.
That pakistanian guy said something interesting:- I know it is true ecause it has given a meaning to my life-..This is the widest used argument that converted cristians give, but since when an idea has to be true to give people a reason to live. People lie to themselves all the time in order to be happier (i'm going to get fit, i'm sure she'll come back, i'm sure my granpa who just passed away is going to a better place...) really? i think it all breaks down to the point that we make shit up because we are scared. It's not a stupid guess is it?
"I have a different take on what 'fact' is." Anyone who says this loses the right to profess anything. There is a FACT and then there is an opinion. That's it. You don't get to claim your opinion as fact.
What they are referencing is something like moral truth. Moral truths can't be proven scientifically but evidence may illuminate some things as closer to moral truths than others, for example thou shall not kill. So what Dawkins is truly focused on is scientific truth and what the religious panelists are referring to are moral truths.
The irony that some passages of the bible are to be retired based on morals that were brought about by modern philosophers. Religion proves it's own irrelevance on moral guidance with this statement.
The more debates I watch, the more mystified I become of the concept of "moderate" religiosity. When I broke up with Jesus at the age of 16 or so, it was precisely for the reasons that (1) it made no sense to be moderately following a god that would damn you to eternal suffering if you didn't get it right, and (2) the bible was too horrific to take literally so I couldn't be fundamentalist. After watching several documentaries mentioning the plethora of partially contradicting religious documents circulating at the time, and with bishops and other church official admitting that biblical events (including the virgin birth of Jesus and the resurrection of Lazarus) are mostly fictional, I'm even more mystified of all the people still choosing to believe it what little is left. To me, the only sensible way to remain a believer, is to tight-fistedly and hard-headedly decide to believe the entire thing, and stubbornly fight off all the evidence to the contrary. But *boy*! what a miserable position to be in.
This thing is disheartening. They say the god is love while torture and murder is a necessary sacrament for forgiveness. This is exactly the attitude of suicide bombers. they feel like they are sacrificing themselves to fight against the corruption of society and that this is the best way to appease their god
Christ was not born out of wedlock - his mother was married before his birth, but according to the Jewish marital tradition, she likely wasn't a virgin when she bore him, as her marriage to Joseph would have to have been consummated. The details of the circumstances regarding Christ's conception and birth are not important to me as a Christian, in the same way that I don't believe that Mary was this superhuman woman that no woman has ever been like, nor can ever be. Mary was a woman like any other, a mother like any other and she was given the choice to be so.
I love listening to Richard Dawkins debate religious people. ❤ it's hard to speak reason and logic to people who didn't use it to reach their conclusions in the first place.
Christians argue amongst themselves about how to read and interpret the Bible, but when an atheist says they are skeptical about the Bible and it teachings suddenly it is the atheist who is vilified. How can believers not see that it is a serious problem for their theology when they can't come to any kind of consensus about a book that is supposedly the way in which their god wants to communicate to them?
+AtheistComet80 Yup...........correct and on top of that their very scriptures claim that when they read those words that the holy spirit will reveal the truth to all believers.....................yeah sure.........
+jacopman To ‘see beyond the pale’--in English, German, French, and Spanish… just scroll down…sólo Desplácese hacia abajo... juste faire défiler vers le bas… Scrollen Sie einfach... To ‘see beyond the pale’... No it does not mean to pick up a perspective that is different than the white anglo-saxon ‘Murican whiteness perspective which you now utilize to make all your ‘insignificant’ decisions… since all your decisions are insignificant relative to the size of the hole you have to repair in the ‘knowledge’ gap you possess in the files in your subconscious mind… In much earlier times, a pale was a big wooden stake used as an outside wall component in a fortress-like enclosure… and to ‘see beyond the pale’ meant you could experience, by your sense of sight, things that existed outside of your small fortress-like structure, ‘seeing’ beyond the seeming entirety of your world... That's what is meant by “seeing beyond the pale” And doing just that... will yield for you your individual human enlightenment… put that way... it sounds pretty easy... but let me forewarn you... it is the hardest work you will ever do… but the ‘knowledge’, the intensely personal reward is... like the little elf would say; “It's Magically Delic---”... “Its actually deliciously, wonderfully, imagination-ingly, intellectually, creatively, comedically, ‘knowledge-ingly, the best “Thing” that has ever happened inside me… yes, the best “Thing” that has ever happened inside me… I ‘know’ this for me… and you could ‘know’ this for you… just… dare to think you can think for yourself...dare to know that you absolutely can… until you do… and then we will be ‘equals’... german Zu "sehen" indiskutabel... Nein es bedeutet nicht abholen, eine Perspektive, die anders als die weißen angelsächsischen ' Murican Weißgrad-Perspektive, die Sie jetzt nutzen, um Ihre "unbedeutenden" Entscheidungen zu treffen… Da alle Ihre Entscheidungen unbedeutend im Verhältnis zur Größe des Lochs sind müssen Sie in der "wissen" Lücke, die Sie besitzen Dateien in Ihr Unterbewusstsein zu reparieren... Viel früher war eine blasse einen großen hölzernen Pfahl verwendet als Außenwand-Komponente in einem Gehäuse festungsartigen… und zu "sehen" indiskutabel bedeutete Sie, durch Ihren Sinn für Anblick, entstünde, Dinge, die außerhalb Ihrer kleinen festungsartigen-Struktur existiert "sehen", über die scheinbare Gesamtheit Ihrer Welt... Das ist, was durch "sehen indiskutabel" und dabei genau das gemeint ist… ergibt sich für Sie Ihre individuellen menschlichen Erleuchtung... so... es klingt ziemlich einfach... aber lassen Sie mich Sie verhüten ist die härteste Arbeit, Sie werden jemals tun... aber das 'wissen', die intensiv persönliche Belohnung ist... wie der kleine Elf sagen würde; "Es ist magisch Delić---"... "Seine eigentlich herrlich, wunderbar, Phantasie-Einfuhrverbote, intellektuell, kreativ, comedically, ' wissen-Einfuhrverbote, das"beste"das ist jemals passiert in mir... ja, das"beste"hat, die jemals in mir passiert... Ich weiß' ' das für mich… french De « voir dépasse l'entendement »... Non, il ne signifie pas pour ramasser une perspective différente de l'anglo-saxonne blanc ' Murican perspective de blancheur qui vous utilisez maintenant pour faire toutes vos décisions « insignifiantes »… puisque toutes vos décisions sont insignifiantes par rapport à la taille du trou que vous devrez réparer dans l'écart de la « connaissance » que vous possédez dans les fichiers dans votre subconscient... À l'époque beaucoup plus tôt, une pale était un gros pieu de bois utilisé comme un élément de mur extérieur dans un boîtier-forteresse…et de « voir dépasse l'entendement » signifiait que vous pourriez vivre, par votre sens de la vue, les choses qui existaient à l'extérieur de votre petite forteresse-comme la structure, "voir" au-delà de l'apparente intégralité de votre monde... C'est ce que l'on entend par « voir dépasse l'entendement » et ce que font... produira pour vous votre éveil humain individuel... mettre de cette façon... ça sonne assez facile... mais permettez-moi de vous prévenir... c'est le plus dur travail vous aurez jamais faire... mais les « savoirs », la récompense intensément personnelle est... comme le petit lutin dirais ; « C'est comme par magie Depardieu---»… "Sa en fait délicieusement, merveilleusement, imagination-conséquence, intellectuellement, créative, comedically, ' connaissances-conséquence, la meilleure « chose » qui n'est jamais arrivé à l'intérieur de moi... Oui, la meilleure « chose » qui a jamais qui s'est passé à l'intérieur de moi... Je « sais » cela pour moi… spanish ' Ver más allá de la pálida '... No no significa tomar una perspectiva diferente de la anglosajona blanca ' Murican perspectiva de blancura que utiliza ahora para tomar todas sus decisiones 'insignificantes'...puesto que todas sus decisiones son insignificantes en relación con el tamaño del agujero tienes que reparar en la diferencia de 'conocimiento' que posee en los archivos de tu mente subconsciente... En épocas mucho anteriores, pálido fue una gran estaca de madera utilizada como un componente de la pared exterior en un recinto fortaleza-como… y ' ver más allá de la pálida ' significó que podría experimentar, por su sentido de la vista, cosas que existieron fuera de su pequeña fortaleza-como la estructura, 'ver' más allá de la aparente totalidad de vuestro mundo... Eso es lo que significa "ver más allá de los límites" y haciendo eso… producirá para usted su iluminación humana individual... poner así... suena fácil... pero me deja advertir... es el trabajo más duro que nunca se quiere hacer... pero el 'conocimiento', el es intensamente personal recompensa... como diría el pequeño elfo; "Es mágicamente Delic---"... "Su realmente delicioso, maravilloso, imaginación tanto intelectual, creativa, comedically, ' conocimiento tanto,"Lo mejor"que jamás ha sucedido dentro de mí... sí,"Lo mejor"que tiene siempre sucedió dentro de mí... 'Sé' esto para mí… y usted podría 'saber' esto para usted... justo... se atreve a pensar que puede pensar por ti mismo... se atreven a saber que usted absolutamente puede... hasta que hacer... y entonces estaremos 'equivale a'...
@Mark Cromwell That's only because he's caked up after the success of 'Reggae Reggae' sauce, he's got servants to fry his chips and shred his documents lol.
Forgiveness without a cost is so true. Let's apply it to ourselves. How many of will forgive someone that murdered a loved one? We will scream death to that person. Ha, that quote is so true.
Ronny Cardona Funny how Francesca argued against that statement -- it was a different time, but that doesn't make them a any less or more ignorant. They lacked the understanding of how the world works -- it is ignorance.
This was a very good watch. I am an atheist, and over the years I have watched the rise of fundamentalism in the United States. (I Am Canadian). I think I became an atheist because of my own upbringing. I went to a straight laced Baptist church Sunday mornings, and to a charismatic Pentecostal church on Sunday nights. What a change in church styles.Anyway, I just wanted to say that I loved the discussion on this show. Intelligent people having a thoughtful exchange of ideas, without the anyone throwing insults or threatening to get physical. I wish there were more shows of this ilk here on this side of the pond. Nice to see civilized people :)As an atheist, I have my own views on religion, but I am more than willing to listen to people who are from a theological background talking about biblical interpretation and the like, without forcing their views, and using some good reasoning without succumbing to emotion outbursts or threatening people with hellfire. I'm not a fan of sensationalism. many thanks to the poster for sharing this.
The Bishop continually interrupts other people and heckles them and yet expects others to be silent when he is speaking. His shirt is stained after all the cherrypicking that he has been doing. Very arrogant for a Christian and unaware of the humility expected from a Christian leader.
On a side note, why is this Christian wearing a cross when Jesus apparently died on it. If someone killed someone I love I would then wear or carry a knife with me its disgusting.
Mathew 16:24 records Jesus as saying that whoever wishes to be his disciple must take up their cross and follow him. The cross is both a symbol of Jesus' death but also that of a Christian's commitment to Jesus even to death. So the cross is not just a symbol of Jesus' death but also that of his followers aka Christians. That's why you see many Christians wear crosses.
93football4life Matthew (previously named Levi) was one of the original twelve Apostles of Jesus. According to the gospels Matthew was a tax collector and was hand picked by Jesus to be an Apostle. A gospel was penned and later attributed to Matthew an eye witness of Jesus' life and resurrection.
Jordan Cookie Not even the Bible claims that Mark was an eye witness to Jesus’ ministry. Modern, non Christian biblical scholars believe that the gospel of Mark was written in Syria by an unknown Christian no earlier than AD 70, using various sources including a passion narrative (probably written), collections of miracles stories (oral or written), apocalyptic traditions (probably written), and disputations and didactic sayings (some possibly written). These stories were in circulation year after year, told in different languages and in different countries from that of Jesus. That’s it. The source for the gospel of Mark is other peoples’ stories and writings. In other words, all of Mark’s sources were at best, second hand, more likely fifth or sixth hand. What happens to stories that circulate orally for years? Obviously, they come to be changed in the retelling. the source for much of the synoptic gospels is no more than hearsay The Gospel of Mark is the first of the Gospels to proffer quotes allegedly from Jesus. We question how authentic these quotes could possibly be, given the convoluted path from Jesus’ lips to “Marks” writing and the years that passed since the words were allegedly spoken. We have written a treatise on the impossibilities of Jesus’ actual words being accurately recorded 40+ years after they were spoken.
93football4life I never asserted that Mark was an eye witness. Many of the issues you raised can be dispelled if you accept the popular church tradition that Mark wrote his gospel from the first hand eye witness account of Peter the Apostle. However I'm not sure if you are willing to accept that considering your first instinct was to go to biblical scholars who aren't Christian. It would certainly make sense that Peter had his version of the story written down by someone other than himself considering he was an illiterate fisherman. Certainly a man so close to Jesus in the gospels would have written his own gospel but since he couldn't read or write it would make sense that he have someone else write it for him, namely Mark. I'm not sure how far this comment chain can go if neither of us can meet middle ground, however my intention was more or less to clear up confusion about the cross question you had. No amount of context I can give you will be enough. I have felt God and know God. All of the other details of my Christian worldview fall into place with careful research and it reassures me of what I already know. It is my sincere desire that you try to see if God is real for yourself. If you are open minded enough I would encourage you to pray or even ask God to reveal himself to you in some way. It is up to you my friend. I mean you no harm or discontent. I only want to bring you the fullness of life that I experience and to let you know that someone on this blue dot cares about you. (Both God and I.) I've been in enough of these comment chains to know that it will go on forever so I thought I would get to what I really wanted to say. That being that I love you as a person and I wish you the best. God Bless.
Ok I see why they get upset about the cherry picking of certain passages. But if you can disprove and show fallacy in one passage, what's to say the rest of it is true? Wow people...this is the 21 century. Can we just stop believing in santa and tooth fairies now?
ClaretBlueLove I wonder what she was thinking when that idiot of a "bishop" sitting next to her was telling all that nonsense..an arrogant bishop, nothing else..
The argument of moral absolutism derived from the Bible frustrates me to no end. Think about the process you go through when seeking moral wisdom from a biblical book. When you go through and read Leviticus or Deuteronomy and you read if "your bride is not a virgin, you must stone her in front of her father's doorstep" you will (hopefully) reject this lesson in moral wisdom and move on. Now if you read something nice such as 'love thy neighbor' and you accept this because it resonates with you, what is the guarantor of this decision in the acceptance of moral philosophy? It isn't the book, it is YOUR BRAIN deciding what is good and what is not.
An amusing argument frequently used to defend the barbaric verses of the bible is, "but you took that verse out of context." or "Things were different back then." What then, is the context in which one can excuse capital punishment for things we don't consider crimes at all in modern societies? In what context is forced slavery acceptable? If times were truly so different that the murder of your neighbor for working on Sunday is not only excusable, but encouraged, then how can you conclude that this book has any shred of relevance left in modern societies?
this makes me think of the beach. those arguing on the side of the bible are like kids slowly building up little sandcastles over 5-10 minutes, and then a big wave of dawkins washes it all away in 4 seconds lol and then they start builiding again as if they are unaware another wave is probably coming
Leviticus 26:27-29 “‘If in spite of this you still do not listen to me but continue to be hostile toward me, then in my anger I will be hostile toward you, and I myself will punish you for your sins seven times over. You will eat the flesh of your sons and the flesh of your daughters." So basically if you don't believe in god he will make you eat your children... How can you can follow such a God is beyond me!
It is odd to claim that all morality is somehow related to the bible or by extension religion, and then belittle indigenous societies because they do what all humans have done throughout time, including christians. Doesn't that prove the point in the first place that it is being human, and we've been around way longer than religion has, passing things on from one generation to the next. Even a toddler knows right from wrong without the concept of anything remotely related to the bible. But of course someone will then come along and claim it is the influence of the parents, who of course learned it from the bible. Circular logic. Works every time.
The religious cherry picking is almost laughable.
Blessed are the cherry pickers!
yeah and its also laughable for Richard Dawkins to be afraid of debating William L Craig.
It is laughable but also very depressing.
Noah's ark?!
I aM tAlLinG abOuT caNAan.
Almost? It's fucking hilarious listening to these brainwashed fools trying to justify their childish beliefs.
12:46
God burns down a whole city and turns a woman into salt
"The message that I got from this story is to argue about things"
Oh dear
Yes I know. The hoops some people have to jump through to make their bullshit fit 🤣
😂😂🤣🤣😂😂
😂😂😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣🤣
She deflected. Let's not address that God saw that lot was the only rightouse man in the town. And he offered his daughters up to get raped by ever man in the town.
Scientists believe they found the site of Sodom and Gomorrah. They believe that a meteor exploded over the city. It would have looked like a fireball coming down from Heaven. It would have burned the city in a flash. Shock wave, noise. If anyone witnessed it from a safe distance, it looked like God destroyed it utterly from anger.
I am amazed at how the apologists speculate about their holy book. After almost 2,000 years they still can't agree on what it says. It's madness.
watch the devil and father amorth trailer.
But they still taking about it we live an a free society. They can choose to not talk about it an still they talking about it after 2024 years this is not first debate about the Bible these being many more trough the centuries God is good amen 🙏
What happened 2,000 years ago ?
@@ByronAutry-il7jg I don’t know you tell me it looks you have the answer
excellent strawman
Richard Dawkins must be the politest and most patient human being in the world..... Hope more people buy his books.
Carola Adolf you should see his interview with Wendy Wicke
Sometimes. Dawkins can be an asshole, too. His thoughts about philosophy and the Bible aren't very sophisticated, but his views are mostly correct.
😢@@Nijadj7 Dawkins is one of the heros among this crowd. Probably the primary hero. Wendy Wicke is nothing but a stupid snot. Dawkins should have slapped her, but he was too polite.
😂Blind leading the Blind😂
He is making money but selling dumb books
I can't believe that people really think that morality only exists because of the bible and the ten commandments. Such ignorance.
***** What scam... explain.
***** Why are you talking about Darwin. Even IFFF (and i dont see how) Evolution is proven false, it doesnt give ANY evidence to support the bible or any religion. You still have the burden of proof. I dont see why you brought up Dawkins marketing tool to answer seashelleyes1's point..
I don't see it as anything until you explain..
neither of you are making sense.
***** um ok...
the black guy with the dreads,is awesome he brought up so many good points
Yes but he conveniently ignores the history of slavery within Africa and tries to make it a purely western problem. That kind of disingenuous position needs to stop. I did like a number of the other points he made especially those involving the unity of humanity. Which btw is the very side Dawkins sits on, unlike the religious divisive crowd.
@@jamesh318 Jesus is devisive , choose him or satan .
HAHAHAHA
The evangelical man in red believes that a woman was turned into a block of salt?! And apparently 45% of Americans take this literally as well?!
Is this real life I'm living?
Some americans also believe that the Earth is only 50,000 years old
May I ask, from where are you from?
Ireland
MarsRacingNetwork
actually they believe its 6,000 to 10,000 not 50,000.
Matt Lomas yes, yes it does.
The priest is awful, pompous, snide, sarcastic, old-fashioned and long-winded
Hypocrites basically !!! They believe something that never happened for instance a 700 year old man with A ark and lions tiggers elephants on a ark ?? With PENGUINS from Antarctic 🙄🙄🙄
He's a douche with zero evidence for any of his claims.
all the fangs and claws came out, which is very similar to what you should expect if you tried to take away drugs from a drug addict
Ya, he literally represents a perfect example as to why ppl were persecuted by religion.
No, he's fine.
I feel sorry for Richard because of the amount of stupidity that he has to endure. I mean, people applauding a man who just said that there can be no forgiveness without cost? What the hell is wrong with this world?
Is it stupidity, though? I used to have that same simple view of believers, but now i see it more nuanced. I try to understand the backgrounds of those who believe, and understand how they got to where they are. Perhaps you or i, had our life circumstances been different, could have been as fervently religious as some who are.
it is cringe worthy
@@trekkiejunkbasically it’s dogmatic indoctrination and telling a child that they will burn in a non existent place forever if they are naughty naughty or don’t believe is child abuse at its finest
Richard is the fool😂
Bruh why on this earth every criminal that commits a crime isn't forgiven? And why do you expect God to forgive when he is all holy for all eternity and can't even think about sin? And you want him to forgive without cost?
If your argument just doesn't hold water....just say...."it's my faith" and you'll get applause anyhow.
Richard Dawkins was a true gentleman, even when put up against a clearly biased audience.... He made more sense than the rest, as usual !
what Richard said: ''we shouldn't be discussing is the Bible relevant, we should be discussing is literature generally relevant''
Brilliant point!!!
Go Dawkins I would like to see see you up against an opponent with a similar intellect but I doubt there’s any like that on the other team
Dickens is more relevant
The rest of the debate supported that question.
Hottest biblical historian ever.
sooo true
id eat her history maker
She's fine as hell isn't she!?!?!
Markus Scott yep, she is fine, not even a blemish.
I came to the comment section for this statement.
I wonder if someone in there said they believed in Zeus, Apollo and other Greek gods and insist that this should be taught in science class just like creationism….I am sure he would have been laughed at.
Would you like a tit wank
Is the Bible relevant today? Yes. As an anthology of fiction meant to be studied for its literary contribution to our current culture.
Watch this. I'll use this very footage in the part 2. But this is an answer to this very question especially the begining historian question.
th-cam.com/video/d3z8wJgcI60/w-d-xo.html
Exactly. Its like all art and literature. It is a window in time to understand our cultural past
@Belfast Blue if he existed at all...he was def not white.
So before the bible came along everyone was immoral, bullshit!
I agree. An excellent work of fiction.
Imagine getting all your values and morals from only ONE book. And believing every other book is false. That's a dangerous concept no matter what the book is.
The Bible is a collection of books... the Koran is one book because it is a totalitarian ideology 📖
But its a special book. It has a talking snake, a talking donkey and a talking burning bush in it.
@@adriangeh6414😂
Except that the bible is true, and all ideas and thoughts that oppose it are false ideas and false thoughts.
"How can you applaud that?!" Haha i love richard dawkins. He always yells at the audience.
The African American man speaking at 29:32 and 30:25 was one of the best-said pieces in this show.
Ì agree
The British man.
Francesca Stavrakopoulou. Brilliant and eloquent. I'm a bit smitten. But my brain hurts a bit from all the people in this debate constantly running around moving the goal posts.
What ever the babe with the long dark hair says is okay with me!
yes sir she is a frikkin babe!!!!
That's the Professor with the long dark hair
@@marysimons8900 Professor? even better.
Now I can be intimidated and out smarted.
😂😂😂😂
And it came to pass that all real men followed Francesca!😍
20:36 - after the dude says "i believe jesus is the way, the truth, the life" you can hear someone whisper "Krishna".
The word christ even comes from the word Krishna
@@daveallan8730Really? I didnt know that
I find religion abhorrent and a toxicity to society and I refuse to associate myself with it or like anything moderately to do with the ancient oppressive doctrine of Christianity. I hate everything the church stands for not because I'm a bigot but precisely because I am against bigotry. You might call me intolerant but ironically I'm only intolerant against intolerance itself...and that is what religion is. Intolerant against anyone or anything who does not conform to its sexist, homophobic, racist and oppressive agendas. As someone who stands for equality, morality and for human rights, christianity and religion goes against every fiber of my being. It's one of the biggest evils in society and religion can't reasonably be integrated into a positive. It's poisonous.
Well said.
Amen brother
That black guy was the smartest guy in the room.
palemaster6000 He was definitely one of them. Fuh sho.
yeh, he's good. I liked it when he stood the cocky bishop down.
palemaster6000 I agree!
palemaster6000 very true.
Although Richard is the coolest person ever, that that brother is the coolest man in the room.
that arrogant bishop is getting on my nerves big time.
Pakistani genes.
Enough to make me a non-believer, if I had been a believer in the fist place....
if you tell a lie long enough it will become truth
yeah that's why many people are starting becoming atheists.
No... it will become accepted.
You get lied to from birth. Should be outlawed untill you're 18
“You don’t make something true by saying it repeatedly and louder”
Watching Francesca and Dawkins have a disagreement is like watching mommy and daddy fighting 🤣 my two faves
Timestamp?
Richard Dawkins absolutely smashed that arrogant priest when talking about the Ten Commandments.
I just farted
The funniest shit ever is Rev. Dr. Michael’s rebuttal to Dr. Dawkins’ arguments is to attack his character. That’s what one does when they’re losing.
The dude is a constant stream of fallacies. He's a complete narcissist.
Just a side note; I always loved Dawkin's zoology themed ties.
He must have humour.
No forgiveness without a cost is indeed the most DISGUSTING idea I've ever heard. It is perverting the concept of forgiveness itself.
That is a very slippery slope you are starting down. When anyone apologizes to me for doing something wrong to me, I don't require a cost to forgive. I may judge intentions/ sincerety, but cost is irrevelant. Otherwise, I would be going down a path called vengence.
What's disgusting about it? Was the cost charged to you? Jesus paid the cost so that we would receive the free gift of Grace. Forgiveness is freely available to you and me... we don't deserve it, we can't "earn" it, but it is free because Jesus paid the cost. That's what he is saying.
God is righteous; before the destruction he gave these people chance after chance,but the Law he set demands the penalty of death before Christ resurrection! so if you are aware of the penalty but you still continue to do the crime after getting away and chance the first time, the punishment is on you!The is the nature of God's Laws of The Kingdom Government not Religion!!!!! The Bible is not a Religious Book of Christianity but the Constitutional Law of his Kingdom Government. remember,Just is King,kings rules Kingdoms, Governments!!!
RadioactiveSand that is not what the Bible teaches. It says there is NO SIN WITHOUT PENANCE and not no forgiveness without a cost. Actually read the book.
Kinda of, no definitely narcissist !
"Jesus might have said let him finish the sentence" lol!
I'm atheist but I do love that Jewish woman - despite her firm religious convictions, she defiantly has the voice of reason.
@@juliall255 Not just a Jewish woman - she's a rabbi. But yeah, an atheist myself, I don't agree with her but she was very switched on and open minded I thought
*"There can be no forgiveness without cost"*
Just in, Bishop Micheal's interpretation of the bible is: _there is no unconditional love_.
God's love is everlasting and ever present, allowing your Redemption at every point. But it takes Redemption. It is not unconditional certainly. Because that's how God made our souls and conscience in our body, able to have freewill, so we have the challenge of being Good or not, and then we shall reap reward for Eternity
@Michael Romero To put it simply, the quran isn't true, the Bible is.
11 years later, and the answer is still no.
poor poor dawkins.... his patience is unreal!
Richard Dawkins is brilliant.
I mean, true, but the rest are just talking shite lol
Yeah---but just keep 'im off politics
Thomas Jefferson edited the bible into "The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth". He removed all the implausibilities, nonsense and miracles. This conversation of doubt has obviously been going on for some time and will probably still be going on long after I am gone.
31:05 - "We don't worship the Bible."
Question - why do you desire to worship anything at all?
*****
Guilty as charged . . .
***** so why do you think that anyone should respect you,what kind of special right do you think you have?Just saying
rictus gate you say why do we desire to worship anything at all it is part of human nature some people want to admire something greater then themselves
Saiyan Goku I guess we'll never learn then?
rictus gate I focus on the false prophets that the bible talks about people that said earth was going end on a specific date like 1914 or the year 2000 someone also said the ending was coming in 2011 never did and finally came 2012 the bible says the ending will come like a thief in the night no one will see it coming we just pass 2012 all those dates came to pass just like the bible said I also focus in the calm in the night thinking about December 21 2012 knowing that we just pass it not too long thinking about this date it is almost as if a grip of fear comes over me cause you never know what to expect in the near future
Dr Lez is excellent at seeing the bigger picture and then zooming in. His perspective is so purely about truth from the most objective point of view possible. Admirable.
'No you don't have to filter the good stuff out. You just have to...' Then she proceeds to filter the good stuff out 🤣
Ah my talking snake believers you you really are the gift that keeps on giving 🤣🤣🤣😍😍
Richard Dawkins is (at least in my opinion) one of the best debaters alive today, in every single debate he will leave the opposition stumped on at least one occasion.
I commend Mr. Dawkins for sitting there silent while other people talk with the range of actual information he posesses in his head. A brilliant man listening to biblical jargon. It must be mind mind melting for him.
Why is this nearly a hour long...???
Q.. Is the bible still relevant today..?
A..No..!
End of programme, what's on next..?
***** WTF..?? The Koran is just a revised version of the Bible & is also about as relevant as Santa Claus. Grow up.
***** 'Better' version...?? maybe in your opinion. The're both still works of fiction & fairy stories & you can't really be called an 'adult' if you believe in fairy stories, can you..?
***** It's still all fiction. If you want to believe in some super power fictional being, go ahead, my 6 year old neice still believes in santa & the tooth fairy. You & her are so alike in your childish naivety.
+woke
How many Muslims have ever won a Nobel prize?
*****
You claim that the quran has so much to offer this world and it's followers, so many truths.... but exactly what have your kind done of value to human civilization and progress lately? What truths have you offered other than the same crap we roll our eyes at the Christians for: "god exists, obey him"?
You can see that the worst person in the room is the priest in red-pinkish shirt. 🤦♂️😬🤦♂️
We should have a program like this in the USA. This will expose our ignorance.
American ignorance has been been on display for a long time culminating in maga
The fact that we are even having this discussion on television is proof that religion is running on borrowed time. These kinds of discussions would be unheard of or even allowed not too long ago. It's a sign of change to come 👌
I'm more interested in:
Do the majority of professed Christians have actually read the Bible?
Being the most important book in a Christians life and all.
Testing the bible out in an exorcism and possession case that's everything.
watch the devil and father amorth trailer.
Google the 6 voices of annelise michel. Listen to the 6 voices of annelise michel.
@@lightbeing8174 *The famous case of Anneliese Michel all points out to severe Psychosis and Epilepsy, unfortunately. In addition to a strict Roman Catholic upbringing. She was fascinated with the Church and thoroughly studied History, Latin and Hagiography of the Saints, wherein she easily role-played major historical figures and the “Adversary” himself under her state of “demonic possession”/psychotic episodes.*
@@StellaMontenegro Look into the case of the rain man donald decker while donald decker was possessed he could make it rain up, down and side ways.
I am so lucky that I escaped from religion at a young age. was around 7 or 8 when I worked it out.I am now a grown man who lives a good life.I help people everday, I love animals and am a loyal loving husband and father.I live a free life which is good.I don't need religion to show me tell how to live, and be told what I can eat and when.
I love the way tolerant, moral, religious people cannot control themselves when other people are talking. They have to constantly interrupt, constantly.
So does Prof. Dawkins!
It is so bad in the real world that you have people driving around in cars with bibles hunting you down just to cram their nonsense down our throat. I detest religion because of the amount of insanity it has produced in the modern world.
They prove by their unruly behaviour that religion is about wild irrational emotions.
'' ...We have a morality which is outside and independent from the bible, morality does not come from the bible, it comes from our evolutionary background'' ugh I clapped to! 👏👏🙌👍 So spot on! #GuyOtten 37:33.. Also another amazing point from an audience member, their are egalitarian societies existing today that have not even heard of the bible! Yet clearly run of fairness, thats morally correct.. How can you explain that?
On a side note I cant believe people actually believe that if the bible did not exist, we as humans would miraculously become suspended of all morals in nature.. I wasn't brought up as a Christian and I still have my moral compass in check! I'm with Dr. Richard Dawkins too, Lets bypass the bible all together and look at moral philosophy! you know, an area thats doesn't contradict itself like the bible does.
If the Bible was divinely inspired perhaps it would have been deciphered and not oppressed people for the past 2000 years. It is only in the past 200 or so years of the long history of these books that any good has come from it. For the majority of its life, the Bible has allowed terror to reign.
22:56 the smug smile on his face as he finishes his immoral reposte. This is what religion does to people. He sincerely believes that his statement was morally profound. Evil.
Did anyone else get frustrated at how that priest kept interrupting and being condescending to Francesca and nobody else? She’s such far more intelligent and tactful than he is.
Yes, he irritated me immensely. He behaved like an arrogant churchman dealing with a woman.
@@AS-rx4tp blatant sexism right there smh.
This had hardly any discussion about the relevancy of the bible in today…
"Jesus might have said, 'let him finish the sentence.'" haha nice touch to that blabbermouth priest.
Is it me or is Francesca Stravrakopoulou hot as hell. Heathrow here I come, if women like her are running around in The UK.
+Xerxes Underwood theres a few lol
***** yeah, as an American, her british accent is hot too the point that I forgot what this town hall like event was about.
+Xerxes Underwood She's hot as hell.
+Xerxes Underwood Hell doesn't exist but that's irrelevant because she as at least hot as the SUN which is much more beautiful than a hell lol. But I get your point lol.
+Hiloha'homa no that's not true she is not hot as the sun
27:50 - "If St. Paul were alive today - speaking into our society - our culture - he would be completely different - absolutely."
WTF?!?!?!? Why a pile of crap that is . . . wow!!! There are a few things wrong with that statement . . . how in the world does she *know* this? Seriously . . . wtf? And if that's true then the word of god is null and void - it's a moot point . . . you have nothing to stand on . . . wow . . . what kind of convoluted mind produces such astoundingly absurd beliefs with such zeal and certainty?
I think what she was trying to say is. "If he grew up in our society. His views would be totally different." It's possible.
Still, she is special pleading. Obviously, he didn't care much for women. He may have been the same.
Many people, today, still think women should know their place. (And they DO grow up in modern societies.)
MrMdrscream
I don't doubt that Paul would turn out differently if he were brought up today . . . but would his divinely inspired message change as well? This whole biblical god notion is such a joke . . . it claims there is only one god - but I look around and see each person makes up their own little godlet . . . what a joke. It's allllllllll just sentimental psychological bullshit that adults should learn to control far more.
rictus gate
"but would his divinely inspired message change as well?"
Exactly... That's an excellent point.
If you were there. You would have deflated her sails. :-)
Paul would be like "Why is this woman speaking? Whose property is this? "
Rictus I agree with you absolutely. People are all a product and exist in their time and place. You can't just take someone out of their time and state with certainty what they would say today.
And isn't it funny how that stupid woman claims that Paul would totally agree with her position. Very convenient.
basically you can't have a rational disscussion with people who still be lbelieve in the tooth fairy, their sense of history and reality is too warped I like how the rabbi states everything can be fantasy and it doesn't matter. What the heck is wrong with her? the other catholic woman says. you have to tell stories because people are basically stupid I guess.
try taking away drug from a drug addict
This Bishop Michael character is a piece of work.He derides the treatment in Hinduism of Untouchables yet ignores the 'untouchables' which Christianity preserved for millenia such as homosexuals or even Jews.Far from Christianity being at the forefront of preventing the ill treatment of homosexuals - it still acts in some measure as a platform on which to continue such prejudices.
Boy that was one foolish statement .
My statement or that of the Bishop?If my statement I'd appreciate if you could point out it's inaccuracies.
SuperPatrick777 Generally when one criticises statements it is customary to put forward evidence supporting that criticism.Should you wish to contradict any of my statements in the first post I invite you to do so.Merely writing 'foolish statement' or 'you fool' do not lend your posts any gravitas.
john phelan You will have to remind me of my comment , I can't find the post .
The woman at 10:00 says that the Bible should get special treatment because "It contains truth about us that endures." Well, so does Harry Potter. Agatha Christy books contain a lot of insight into the human psyche, should we give them special treatment as well?
“Is that not the most DEEGASTING idea you ever heard?” 21:58
I’m fucking wheezing! 😂😂😂
He’s right though.
@@phineus8397 exactly, and Hitchens was gay. As is Stephen Fry.. and a lot of the prominent atheists were hurt somehow over that lol..
@@phineus8397 lmfaoo it took me a while to think about it too, but most of them are. TJ Kirk is too.. more power to em tho 😂😂
The human species will never reach its full potential until religion, with all of its magical thinking and self-imposed ignorance, is relegated to the fringes of society where it firmly belongs.
dawkins man... what a clear thinker
It frustrates that Stavrakopoulou doesn't talk as much as others in debates/discussions like this. I really like her input and want to hear more of it.
Hear and see it, hm ;) ?
@miguelbranquinho7235 gross
She's a hotty
Richard Dawkins you're awesome. You're not in the same category with those asleep individuals.
The first rule of a good debate is no applause.
That pakistanian guy said something interesting:- I know it is true ecause it has given a meaning to my life-..This is the widest used argument that converted cristians give, but since when an idea has to be true to give people a reason to live. People lie to themselves all the time in order to be happier (i'm going to get fit, i'm sure she'll come back, i'm sure my granpa who just passed away is going to a better place...) really? i think it all breaks down to the point that we make shit up because we are scared. It's not a stupid guess is it?
"I have a different take on what 'fact' is."
Anyone who says this loses the right to profess anything. There is a FACT and then there is an opinion. That's it. You don't get to claim your opinion as fact.
One could very pedantically argue that what you just said is an opinion.
Eddie Marais But that doesn't make it a fact.
Eddie Marais This doesn't make it necessarily wrong. Per definition fact is what he said
What they are referencing is something like moral truth. Moral truths can't be proven scientifically but evidence may illuminate some things as closer to moral truths than others, for example thou shall not kill. So what Dawkins is truly focused on is scientific truth and what the religious panelists are referring to are moral truths.
24:10 "...the god I worship is the god of love!" Holy crap! This god rarely shows up in my bible!
The irony that some passages of the bible are to be retired based on morals that were brought about by modern philosophers. Religion proves it's own irrelevance on moral guidance with this statement.
damn this was a great argumentative interview
The more debates I watch, the more mystified I become of the concept of "moderate" religiosity.
When I broke up with Jesus at the age of 16 or so, it was precisely for the reasons that (1) it made no sense to be moderately following a god that would damn you to eternal suffering if you didn't get it right, and (2) the bible was too horrific to take literally so I couldn't be fundamentalist.
After watching several documentaries mentioning the plethora of partially contradicting religious documents circulating at the time, and with bishops and other church official admitting that biblical events (including the virgin birth of Jesus and the resurrection of Lazarus) are mostly fictional, I'm even more mystified of all the people still choosing to believe it what little is left. To me, the only sensible way to remain a believer, is to tight-fistedly and hard-headedly decide to believe the entire thing, and stubbornly fight off all the evidence to the contrary. But *boy*! what a miserable position to be in.
watch the devil and father amorth trailer.
Google the 6 voices of annelise michel. Listen to the 6 voices of annelise michel.
God has never existed. Morality and religion evolved!
This thing is disheartening. They say the god is love while torture and murder is a necessary sacrament for forgiveness. This is exactly the attitude of suicide bombers. they feel like they are sacrificing themselves to fight against the corruption of society and that this is the best way to appease their god
That bishop is unbelievably arrogant.
His whole career depends on it.
No matter how strong faith is it doesn't change opinions to facts.
But a possession changes a non believer in to a believer
When I was born the church denied to babtise me, because I was born out of wedloch. Should I consider myself Jesus?????????
Christ was not born out of wedlock - his mother was married before his birth, but according to the Jewish marital tradition, she likely wasn't a virgin when she bore him, as her marriage to Joseph would have to have been consummated. The details of the circumstances regarding Christ's conception and birth are not important to me as a Christian, in the same way that I don't believe that Mary was this superhuman woman that no woman has ever been like, nor can ever be. Mary was a woman like any other, a mother like any other and she was given the choice to be so.
I love listening to Richard Dawkins debate religious people. ❤ it's hard to speak reason and logic to people who didn't use it to reach their conclusions in the first place.
Christians argue amongst themselves about how to read and interpret the Bible, but when an atheist says they are skeptical about the Bible and it teachings suddenly it is the atheist who is vilified. How can believers not see that it is a serious problem for their theology when they can't come to any kind of consensus about a book that is supposedly the way in which their god wants to communicate to them?
AtheistComet80 Great comment mate.
+AtheistComet80 Yup...........correct and on top of that their very scriptures claim that when they read those words that the holy spirit will reveal the truth to all believers.....................yeah sure.........
+jacopman To ‘see beyond the pale’--in English, German, French, and Spanish… just scroll down…sólo Desplácese hacia abajo... juste faire défiler vers le bas… Scrollen Sie einfach...
To ‘see beyond the pale’... No it does not mean to pick up a perspective that is different than the white anglo-saxon ‘Murican whiteness perspective which you now utilize to make all your ‘insignificant’ decisions… since all your decisions are insignificant relative to the size of the hole you have to repair in the ‘knowledge’ gap you possess in the files in your subconscious mind… In much earlier times, a pale was a big wooden stake used as an outside wall component in a fortress-like enclosure… and to ‘see beyond the pale’ meant you could experience, by your sense of sight, things that existed outside of your small fortress-like structure, ‘seeing’ beyond the seeming entirety of your world... That's what is meant by “seeing beyond the pale” And doing just that... will yield for you your individual human enlightenment… put that way... it sounds pretty easy... but let me forewarn you... it is the hardest work you will ever do… but the ‘knowledge’, the intensely personal reward is... like the little elf would say; “It's Magically Delic---”... “Its actually deliciously, wonderfully, imagination-ingly, intellectually, creatively, comedically, ‘knowledge-ingly, the best “Thing” that has ever happened inside me… yes, the best “Thing” that has ever happened inside me… I ‘know’ this for me… and you could ‘know’ this for you… just… dare to think you can think for yourself...dare to know that you absolutely can… until you do… and then we will be ‘equals’...
german
Zu "sehen" indiskutabel... Nein es bedeutet nicht abholen, eine Perspektive, die anders als die weißen angelsächsischen ' Murican Weißgrad-Perspektive, die Sie jetzt nutzen, um Ihre "unbedeutenden" Entscheidungen zu treffen… Da alle Ihre Entscheidungen unbedeutend im Verhältnis zur Größe des Lochs sind müssen Sie in der "wissen" Lücke, die Sie besitzen Dateien in Ihr Unterbewusstsein zu reparieren... Viel früher war eine blasse einen großen hölzernen Pfahl verwendet als Außenwand-Komponente in einem Gehäuse festungsartigen… und zu "sehen" indiskutabel bedeutete Sie, durch Ihren Sinn für Anblick, entstünde, Dinge, die außerhalb Ihrer kleinen festungsartigen-Struktur existiert "sehen", über die scheinbare Gesamtheit Ihrer Welt... Das ist, was durch "sehen indiskutabel" und dabei genau das gemeint ist… ergibt sich für Sie Ihre individuellen menschlichen Erleuchtung... so... es klingt ziemlich einfach... aber lassen Sie mich Sie verhüten ist die härteste Arbeit, Sie werden jemals tun... aber das 'wissen', die intensiv persönliche Belohnung ist... wie der kleine Elf sagen würde; "Es ist magisch Delić---"... "Seine eigentlich herrlich, wunderbar, Phantasie-Einfuhrverbote, intellektuell, kreativ, comedically, ' wissen-Einfuhrverbote, das"beste"das ist jemals passiert in mir... ja, das"beste"hat, die jemals in mir passiert... Ich weiß' ' das für mich…
french
De « voir dépasse l'entendement »... Non, il ne signifie pas pour ramasser une perspective différente de l'anglo-saxonne blanc ' Murican perspective de blancheur qui vous utilisez maintenant pour faire toutes vos décisions « insignifiantes »… puisque toutes vos décisions sont insignifiantes par rapport à la taille du trou que vous devrez réparer dans l'écart de la « connaissance » que vous possédez dans les fichiers dans votre subconscient... À l'époque beaucoup plus tôt, une pale était un gros pieu de bois utilisé comme un élément de mur extérieur dans un boîtier-forteresse…et de « voir dépasse l'entendement » signifiait que vous pourriez vivre, par votre sens de la vue, les choses qui existaient à l'extérieur de votre petite forteresse-comme la structure, "voir" au-delà de l'apparente intégralité de votre monde... C'est ce que l'on entend par « voir dépasse l'entendement » et ce que font... produira pour vous votre éveil humain individuel... mettre de cette façon... ça sonne assez facile... mais permettez-moi de vous prévenir... c'est le plus dur travail vous aurez jamais faire... mais les « savoirs », la récompense intensément personnelle est... comme le petit lutin dirais ; « C'est comme par magie Depardieu---»… "Sa en fait délicieusement, merveilleusement, imagination-conséquence, intellectuellement, créative, comedically, ' connaissances-conséquence, la meilleure « chose » qui n'est jamais arrivé à l'intérieur de moi... Oui, la meilleure « chose » qui a jamais qui s'est passé à l'intérieur de moi... Je « sais » cela pour moi…
spanish
' Ver más allá de la pálida '... No no significa tomar una perspectiva diferente de la anglosajona blanca ' Murican perspectiva de blancura que utiliza ahora para tomar todas sus decisiones 'insignificantes'...puesto que todas sus decisiones son insignificantes en relación con el tamaño del agujero tienes que reparar en la diferencia de 'conocimiento' que posee en los archivos de tu mente subconsciente... En épocas mucho anteriores, pálido fue una gran estaca de madera utilizada como un componente de la pared exterior en un recinto fortaleza-como… y ' ver más allá de la pálida ' significó que podría experimentar, por su sentido de la vista, cosas que existieron fuera de su pequeña fortaleza-como la estructura, 'ver' más allá de la aparente totalidad de vuestro mundo... Eso es lo que significa "ver más allá de los límites" y haciendo eso… producirá para usted su iluminación humana individual... poner así... suena fácil... pero me deja advertir... es el trabajo más duro que nunca se quiere hacer... pero el 'conocimiento', el es intensamente personal recompensa... como diría el pequeño elfo; "Es mágicamente Delic---"... "Su realmente delicioso, maravilloso, imaginación tanto intelectual, creativa, comedically, ' conocimiento tanto,"Lo mejor"que jamás ha sucedido dentro de mí... sí,"Lo mejor"que tiene siempre sucedió dentro de mí... 'Sé' esto para mí… y usted podría 'saber' esto para usted... justo... se atreve a pensar que puede pensar por ti mismo... se atreven a saber que usted absolutamente puede... hasta que hacer... y entonces estaremos 'equivale a'...
Having graduated from a Catholic H.S., I believe that the Bible provides comfort for those people incapable of critical thinking.
Like Nikola Tesla or Isaac Newton?
The guy with the dreadlocks is a very smart logical man
Except for when it comes to hairdos...
@@rnw2739 🤣🤣🤣 that's subjective 🤣🤣 good comment 👍🏻
@Mark Cromwell I doubt its subjective when you've got the chip pan on the go or are shredding paper.... lool
@@rnw2739 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣❤️ levi roots gets by🤣🤣
@Mark Cromwell That's only because he's caked up after the success of 'Reggae Reggae' sauce, he's got servants to fry his chips and shred his documents lol.
Forgiveness without a cost is so true. Let's apply it to ourselves. How many of will forgive someone that murdered a loved one? We will scream death to that person. Ha, that quote is so true.
"ignorant dessert dwelling scribes" made me cry, such truth.
-Richard Dawkins
Ronny Cardona
Funny how Francesca argued against that statement -- it was a different time, but that doesn't make them a any less or more ignorant. They lacked the understanding of how the world works -- it is ignorance.
This was a very good watch. I am an atheist, and over the years I have watched the rise of fundamentalism in the United States. (I Am Canadian). I think I became an atheist because of my own upbringing. I went to a straight laced Baptist church Sunday mornings, and to a charismatic Pentecostal church on Sunday nights. What a change in church styles.Anyway, I just wanted to say that I loved the discussion on this show. Intelligent people having a thoughtful exchange of ideas, without the anyone throwing insults or threatening to get physical. I wish there were more shows of this ilk here on this side of the pond. Nice to see civilized people :)As an atheist, I have my own views on religion, but I am more than willing to listen to people who are from a theological background talking about biblical interpretation and the like, without forcing their views, and using some good reasoning without succumbing to emotion outbursts or threatening people with hellfire. I'm not a fan of sensationalism. many thanks to the poster for sharing this.
Sir Richard Dawkins is the all time best ❤
Dawkins is not a Lord.
@williamlillevik7644 Lord is a European word. What's your point.
The Bishop continually interrupts other people and heckles them and yet expects others to be silent when he is speaking. His shirt is stained after all the cherrypicking that he has been doing. Very arrogant for a Christian and unaware of the humility expected from a Christian leader.
On a side note, why is this Christian wearing a cross when Jesus apparently died on it. If someone killed someone I love I would then wear or carry a knife with me its disgusting.
Mathew 16:24 records Jesus as saying that whoever wishes to be his disciple must take up their cross and follow him. The cross is both a symbol of Jesus' death but also that of a Christian's commitment to Jesus even to death. So the cross is not just a symbol of Jesus' death but also that of his followers aka Christians. That's why you see many Christians wear crosses.
Jordan Cookie who is Matthew?
93football4life
Matthew (previously named Levi) was one of the original twelve Apostles of Jesus. According to the gospels Matthew was a tax collector and was hand picked by Jesus to be an Apostle. A gospel was penned and later attributed to Matthew an eye witness of Jesus' life and resurrection.
Jordan Cookie Not even the Bible claims that Mark was an eye witness to Jesus’ ministry. Modern, non Christian biblical scholars believe that the gospel of Mark was written in Syria by an unknown Christian no earlier than AD 70, using various sources including a passion narrative (probably written), collections of miracles stories (oral or written), apocalyptic traditions (probably written), and disputations and didactic sayings (some possibly written). These stories were in circulation year after year, told in different languages and in different countries from that of Jesus.
That’s it. The source for the gospel of Mark is other peoples’ stories and writings. In other words, all of Mark’s sources were at best, second hand, more likely fifth or sixth hand. What happens to stories that circulate orally for years? Obviously, they come to be changed in the retelling. the source for much of the synoptic gospels is no more than hearsay
The Gospel of Mark is the first of the Gospels to proffer quotes allegedly from Jesus. We question how authentic these quotes could possibly be, given the convoluted path from Jesus’ lips to “Marks” writing and the years that passed since the words were allegedly spoken. We have written a treatise on the impossibilities of Jesus’ actual words being accurately recorded 40+ years after they were spoken.
93football4life
I never asserted that Mark was an eye witness. Many of the issues you raised can be dispelled if you accept the popular church tradition that Mark wrote his gospel from the first hand eye witness account of Peter the Apostle. However I'm not sure if you are willing to accept that considering your first instinct was to go to biblical scholars who aren't Christian. It would certainly make sense that Peter had his version of the story written down by someone other than himself considering he was an illiterate fisherman. Certainly a man so close to Jesus in the gospels would have written his own gospel but since he couldn't read or write it would make sense that he have someone else write it for him, namely Mark. I'm not sure how far this comment chain can go if neither of us can meet middle ground, however my intention was more or less to clear up confusion about the cross question you had.
No amount of context I can give you will be enough. I have felt God and know God. All of the other details of my Christian worldview fall into place with careful research and it reassures me of what I already know. It is my sincere desire that you try to see if God is real for yourself. If you are open minded enough I would encourage you to pray or even ask God to reveal himself to you in some way. It is up to you my friend. I mean you no harm or discontent. I only want to bring you the fullness of life that I experience and to let you know that someone on this blue dot cares about you. (Both God and I.) I've been in enough of these comment chains to know that it will go on forever so I thought I would get to what I really wanted to say. That being that I love you as a person and I wish you the best. God Bless.
1:36 Dawkins thinking, "Yeah, I'd tap that." lol XD
"I have a completely different take on what fact is....."
Well, there ya go.
I just got lost at dat point
There are over 12 thousand contradictions in the new testament. It is pure fiction.
You know someone doesn't have strong points when they start yelling
Ok I see why they get upset about the cherry picking of certain passages. But if you can disprove and show fallacy in one passage, what's to say the rest of it is true? Wow people...this is the 21 century. Can we just stop believing in santa and tooth fairies now?
dr francesca is so hot
yes! all that brains with that body got me sweating profusely
I just love the faces she makes when people start trying to claim things that are completely false.
Brains and body...... >=)
ClaretBlueLove I wonder what she was thinking when that idiot of a "bishop" sitting next to her was telling all that nonsense..an arrogant bishop, nothing else..
Cristian VQ She has more than one brain ?
Please, a round of applause for the host, he just rocked 😂
The argument of moral absolutism derived from the Bible frustrates me to no end. Think about the process you go through when seeking moral wisdom from a biblical book. When you go through and read Leviticus or Deuteronomy and you read if "your bride is not a virgin, you must stone her in front of her father's doorstep" you will (hopefully) reject this lesson in moral wisdom and move on. Now if you read something nice such as 'love thy neighbor' and you accept this because it resonates with you, what is the guarantor of this decision in the acceptance of moral philosophy? It isn't the book, it is YOUR BRAIN deciding what is good and what is not.
Well, obviously the Bible is still relevant today...
How else are we to know how and when and how severely we should beat our slaves?
xP
Ah a lady parrot. Parrot on lady. Parrot on. Youll live and die never having ever had an original thought in your entire life.
An amusing argument frequently used to defend the barbaric verses of the bible is, "but you took that verse out of context." or "Things were different back then."
What then, is the context in which one can excuse capital punishment for things we don't consider crimes at all in modern societies? In what context is forced slavery acceptable? If times were truly so different that the murder of your neighbor for working on Sunday is not only excusable, but encouraged, then how can you conclude that this book has any shred of relevance left in modern societies?
Eloquence and common sense; refreshing.
The priest is a bigot.
He's a knob
this makes me think of the beach. those arguing on the side of the bible are like kids slowly building up little sandcastles over 5-10 minutes, and then a big wave of dawkins washes it all away in 4 seconds lol and then they start builiding again as if they are unaware another wave is probably coming
Glad that religion is declining.
Leviticus 26:27-29 “‘If in spite of this you still do not listen to me but continue to be hostile toward me, then in my anger I will be hostile toward you, and I myself will punish you for your sins seven times over. You will eat the flesh of your sons and the flesh of your daughters." So basically if you don't believe in god he will make you eat your children... How can you can follow such a God is beyond me!
YOU'RE GONNA EAT YOUR BABIES!!!😆x
It is odd to claim that all morality is somehow related to the bible or by extension religion, and then belittle indigenous societies because they do what all humans have done throughout time, including christians. Doesn't that prove the point in the first place that it is being human, and we've been around way longer than religion has, passing things on from one generation to the next. Even a toddler knows right from wrong without the concept of anything remotely related to the bible. But of course someone will then come along and claim it is the influence of the parents, who of course learned it from the bible. Circular logic. Works every time.