*Super compact and easy to carry and travel with accessories for the electric **Generater.Systems** .I was worried this was going to be bulky or hard to use.Hooks up easy and charges quickly*
To make it optimal, we could add a BMS (Battery Management System), with cooling controlled fans, vetilation holes, with screens, and below freezing temperature shut off. Oh, and don't forget a metal box... Looks cooool! Great video! Thanks for sharing!
Holy shit.... someone on TH-cam doing a DIY that actually researched and knows what he is taking about. That's refreshing!! I'm an industrial electrician and constantly work with 480 and 208 three phase power. This guy is spot on with voltages and Watt hours etc. Good job!!
zaq405 question though; how many people have you seen on TH-cam make a video about something and they don't know a damn thing about it. All I was trying to say is it's refreshing to see a video made by someone that is not full of shit.
TR Custom Tech. That's precisely the issue I have. Someone might burn their house down because he gained some knowledge through this video. You and I have experience which would guide us from making fatal mistakes.
zaq405 I agree with you there. I have seen people do some pretty stupid things with electricity especially when it comes to batteries. Hell I've been hit pretty good by a 24 VDC power supply. But when it comes to batteries it doesn't take very many in series to have a pretty potent power source.
Every thing said, the stuffs you're doing is what modern day heroes do. To me, you're among the unknown unrecognized global heroes in the making. Only a passion to share knowledge to empower people can make people do what you do. Godspeed!
This panel can put out close to 100 watts th-cam.com/users/postUgkxOqI2yqX0XVrhR2BMJciTWrHJpG8FhJyg when positioned in the appropriate southernly direction, tilted to the optimal angle for your latitude/date, and connected to a higher capacity device than a 500. The built in kickstand angle is a fixed at 50 degrees. Up to 20% more power can be output by selecting the actual date and latitude optimal angle.The 500 will only input 3.5A maximum at 18 volts for 63 watts. Some of the excess power from the panel can be fed into a USB battery bank, charged directly from the panel while also charging a 500. This will allow you to harvest as much as 63 + 15 = 78 watts.If this panel is used to charge a larger device, such as the power station, then its full output potential can be realized.
Great idea....questions: 1. By using old batteries, isn't one vastly cutting life expectancy of the pack? 2. Are the batteries easy to remove/replace when they go bad? 3. Is there some visual cue that indicates when each cell quits working, to easily facilitate changing out only the bad cells? 4. And, what happens...anything adverse...by pairing cells of different ages and wear? The box could be configured to inset between wall studs, so avoid anything much sticking out off the wall surface!
Homeboy you are a godsend. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. So grateful for people like you teaching the rest of us how to do things we would think we were never capable of.
holy guacamole! that is impressive. - I built and installed my own solar after a ton of research. Everyone i have told thinks I am crazy, including my wife, but now that i have't burned down the house, and my AC is running at 75 degrees in 105 degree weather, now they don't think I am crazy... I have considered a battery backup, but going off grid would be epic! I am seriously IMPRESSED with your work. This is my first time to the channel... and your motherboard channel. I will be spending a few more sleepless nights listening to that content you have posted.
You built it? What were your thoughts, and lessons? How much did it end up costing you? Could you improve on the design? I'm seriously considering making this myself!
@@josebravo7998 I will be more than happy to help you... I am still learning how to integrate the powerwall with the solar system. But as far as solar, it's really cool
Hi there, You forgot to mention the costs of a control unit and an inverter, which - of course - are included in the Tesla Unit. Regards from The Netherlands, Roelof Kingma
I was working for a delivery business and seen this workshop that had 3 of the BIG industrial power walls side by side. First time I’d seen it, asked them a bunch of questions and they bacially hadn’t paid for electricity since they had them installed, and they used tools ALL DAY, shop fans, welders, hoists ect ect…
Just stumbled on this and was impressed, he’s friendly and knows his stuff. Keep it at the baby level, there is a mix of capabilities watching and some have been away from any tech work for a long time;)
I loved the part where you explained how you can wire battery packs for whichever voltage you need! Nobody seems to know just how useful and versatile 18650's from laptop batteries are!
Awesome, would love to see a start to finish portable version like charge the battery off solar and take it with you in a vehicle so you got a charge point on the go for long distance
What about cooling and ventilation? Tesla has an active cooling loop to maintain the correct temperature. What about redundancy? Tesla has overcapacity in the batteries to survive with battery failure. What about a battery management system? What about fire saftey? Lots of things to consider beyond just bunging a few laptop batteries in a box.
+125white125 cooling? what for? lithium ions never catch fire on their own! Thats why Boeing (a company full of really stupid engineers and physicists) had such great success putting them into airplanes!! Oh wait... im being sarcastic.
lead acid and nickle metal hydride are the most popular. The 787 is using lithium ion, but it should be noted that the company that did the original design of the batteries went bankrupt after the building burned down due to thermal runaway on one of their battery packs. Whoops.
Great job. If you look around you can even buy them new for a bargain and skip the tedious work of taking the laptop batteries apart. But what about balancing them? BMS? Several balance chargers?
Awesome job .. I love how you de-mystify this stuff .. it benefits even those folks who know, in principle, how this stuff works. One of my degrees is in EE, and I know plenty about how this stuff works, but I tend to let my imagination run wild about the possible complications, and so never undertake a project. Being able to see it actually done from stset to finish provides needed encouragement (and insight into which parts to use etc.) Please keepep them coming!
if you have a degree in EE you must then realize, his math is off. You'll never have 4.4KWH. That is the total at 3.7v To get 12v you divide the cells into 4 groups (not 3 as he states). at that point you are down to 1.11KWH. 24v system is dividing by 8 (not 6 as he states). At that point you are down to 555WH
@@candicefrancart2060 No, he is right, as far as he goes. It is AMP hours that will change according to the Voltage. Ohm's Law: Amps times Volts = Watts. The wattage will stay the same. He is just showing that it is possible to configure these batteries into 12V/24V/36V/48V. It's up to the person putting their own system together to figure out which is best for them. :)
Great project.. Its got me thinking. I don't know why you included the price of the wood in your project costs but didn't include the wires, wiring connectors, and immobilizer. I would imagine that would add some significant cost. $100 for the glass?.... well I guess there is a place for form over function, ( a piece of scrap metal painted with good paint and sticker would have achieved the same effect). I look forward to your next video.
While some commenting apparently don't like your work, overall it's great that you're sharing info. Personally, I'd rather spend the money you did on glass with logo on better (or new) batteries, since old ones have already spent some cycles and will have to be replaced sooner than later. A plain piece of glass is cheap, and labor or fire isn't. Overall, thumbs up and nice job.
Enjoyable video and good info. That said many folks are not aware of how easy it is to refurbish cordless tool batteries for peanuts. For the price of a replacement battery pack you can get 100 cells on ebay.
Cool project, I always love DIY and people who share the knowledge. To everybody else on here, right or wrong, we should be thankful for people who take the time to do a good video and share their knowledge, even if it is wrong or we don't agree with it fully. You can either learn good things, bad things and takeway (if you choose) something from things like this. Having said that, I do disagree with a few things. First the price, you only mention the batteries, wood and glass as cost on your BOM. However, and you even link to these in the video, there are many other components on the BOM. For example, the battery holders link you provide, takes me to eBay where there are holders that hold 15 batteries for 5.99 each. To buy enough of these to hold 600 batteries, it would cost $239.60 just for the holders. On top of that, there are many other items, for example the fuses, buss bars, wiring, etc... Given that, and not even factoring in labor, I think your actual BOM is more like $600-$700 (and that is assuming you still use that overpriced piece of glass). Still not bad if you want to take on a project of this magnitude. Which brings me to another point, the labor. Do you care to share how much time it takes to pull apart all the laptop batteries, test them and then arrange/solder them all together into these packs? I would venture to guess it would take many, many days. Finally, as others have pointed out, there are things like UL listing, thermal and environmental concerns, etc... that are not factored in to your solution. I love DIY, but some things that may burn my house down, I tend to proceed with caution. By the way, if you burn your house down with something DIY like this (no UL listing, etc...) you may not even be covered by your home insurance. So, my summary, while the Powerwall is $3k-$3500, that is actually a good price when you factor the BOM, labor to build and other engineering concerns. Mike
You made some good points. I liked this video because it gave a quick rundown of the battery types, how these wall units function, how batteries can be arranged for a specific power output, and how to calculate the output. All good info for the layman. On the other hand, I agree with your concerns about overall cost. Time is money too, so aside from the parts cost, labor should be factored in. Although, the enjoyment factor would negate some of the labor cost. Good video, subscribed!
A great place to get 18650's and other batteries FOR FREE is in those used battery recycling bins that are at most electronics and hardware stores, or you can ask at a recycling facility, 18650's are in everything from cordless drill battery packs to laptop batteries.
Definitely not new,but freeeee. The ones in old laptop batteries are for sure not new, and more worn. Most cordless tools have "smart chargers" that the unit will simply not recharge , but the batteries are still perfectly usable
Decent video though not for the uninitiated. One note, you stated Nickel Metal Hydride (NIMH) has a memory issue if not discharged fully before charged, that's actually Nickel Cadmium (NiCd) that has that issue hence their obsolescence and NIMH being used widely still due to their long life and lower cost than more advanced batteries.
It's all about the batteries.... weight and current vs. application capacity. II have a cluster of free 40 x 12V 20Ah UPS Led Acid batteries that I get to torment from time to time on my DYI UPS backup ideas. The other day I tried a load on just (1) single but good 12V Li-Ion, battery. So we dream every day of finally pulling off the grid and make good DIY stuff like you share with us. I can just say It's amazing the power one gets with no weigh from Li-Ion/ 18650 batteries. Thank you, Mr. Garcia for tons of inspiration, keep your nice production up : )
Have you heard of anyone changing the battery pack in a 2014 Ford Fusion Energi to get more mileage on battery power?? Off the showroom floor the batter design was 22 mile range. Currently a full charge provides 15 miles per charge which is only useful for errands around town. As soon as I hit the freeway 15 miles turns into 3 as the power is deleted and the combustible engine kicks in.
You need BMS, if your adding solar panels, you should also invest on MPPT charger controller. The inverter should be the size of whatever you plan on running continuously, take in consideration the surge power and it should be pure sine wave inverter. Good luck
Crazy irony: As soon as you have 600 batteries holding all your electric juice in box in your garage, you work to turn your DC into AC... To travel only A FEW FEET!!! A better investment of time would be to remove the numerous components in your various electric appliences to deal with the assumed AC input. The initial breakthrough of AC by Tesla a 100 years ago was to make electricity transmission possible. Now that solar panels have come so far, no need for power transmission lines. So, no need for AC-DC conversion portions of almost every electric circuit in every appliance (and the complimentary inefficiency!) Not only live on solar power, reduce the needed electric need by removing the DC-AC converters all over the house.
@@Alshafi But, at least removing all the ac-dc converters in all the appliances (fridge, freezer, AC, TV, etc.) amounts to nothing but wasted juice. As far as that goes, the DC-ac converter put in by the solar panel outfit waates juice. People have no idea how much juice is simply being WASTED converting from dc to ac then back to dc. Somebody will get the attention though! Then power needs will be effectively cut, again! Solar is the solution!
What are you saying... You would need specific Voltages transformed throughout your house... I guess it could be done, you'd have to literally modify everything... Might make sense for someone who builds a house in the woods just for this project. What about a rectenna.
Awesome video man, can't wait to see part 2! Would be cool to see some 18650 safety tests like fast current drains and over voltage charge and shorts etc.
+sk8rboy1255555 I recently charged a recycled 18650 cell to 8Volts. :( I was trickle charging it up from 0V and forgot about it. When I disconnected it from the charger it's voltage dribbled back down to 0.5V Think I might avoid using that cell ;)
Little 18650 or whatever have anywhere between 600 up to 2000 cycles Ignoring anything about BMS is bad But Bright idea and great DIY I'd really love to see this project continued
You could add some "ultra capacitors" across the battery packs in each box if you have room. They have huge lifespan & can source hundreds of amps, so can ease load on batteries during startup of any electric motor or refrigerator loads especially in cold weather.
I'm confused, did you go with 3s for 12v? 3s is really 10.8v or 11.1v. Most 12v inverters shutoff at 10.5v, meaning you probably will only see about a 50% capacity usage or less (depending on load) if you go with a 12v inverter. 24v inverter with 7S is a far better choice as the voltages are completely compatible.
Aloha Jehu, this video is 4 years old. Do you still recommend using this method to build a power wall? Or has the technology advanced so much that you recommend something else? Mahalo, from Hawaii!
This is great, I'll probably make one myself. Have you considered making kits for people who want to build stuff but don't have the time to build from scratch
Wow just as I was in the verge and creative time lapse of I should build my own 18650 battery pack for an eBike this guy pops up on my TH-cam news feed. Thank you my great guy! When my build is complete I’ll be sure to credit you for everything I’ve learned from you. - Abraham desde NY, nacido en Mexico! Cheers brother!
I enjoyed this, but I wonder about those wires you show. They appear to be no more than maybe ten gauge and, at 7.6V and 4.4kW you're talking about quite a lot of current. Do you actually power your house with this?
6 awg cable, most likely going to end up being 24 or 48 volts. The inverter will most likely be no bigger than 2000 watts so at 24v it will see a max of 85 Amps and at 48v around 43 Amps
6awg is rated in AC power distribution for less than 40A. Copper is not so expensive as to skimp on the power stack. Every milliOhm at such low DC voltage is wasted heat. Why not use #2 or #4 wire?
LMAO. How long did it take to sort through 100-odd laptop batteries? I had not thought of this as a solution before, but it now seems reasonable to think one could power an off grid home on recovered laptop batteries. How much work is it to repair when cells fail? I assume there is an indicator on the fuse to let you see it's blown?
All good questions, all unknown until someone tries it out. Im hoping when cells go out they just trip the fuse and they are disconnected, not too much to worry unless too many of them start to fail, in practice who knows if thats going to be a pain. I have a 12v battery on my car built just like this, haven't had to worry about it for 2 years. So its a proven concept on a smaller scale so we'll see.
I love you. You are the future. Got here because of vice and you inspire me to learn about it and know about it because it’s something about the future we r gonna have to deal with
That's pretty cumbersome when you have 600 cells. If you get a whole pack down to a certain voltage that doesn't mean that every cell is even. It just means the pack is that voltage. Without cell balancing, as time goes by individual cells will come out of balance, this is pretty much certain. This is why BMS is used in Lithium energy storage applications (off grid, etc).
+Rick Smith when he checks capacity he leaves them discharged, each pack is 150 cells @3.7v roughly 300ah. once you solder all the cells in parallel, the charge will even the cells out, then after letting them sit you can charge them to 4.2 or personally 4.1 or 4.15. I have also done this with packs that i have made with no issues, i do however add a bms of charging, but i set it up so that LVC doesn't work, but does give me visual warning (the battery power lights on an ebike) and even if a cell was way out of check or was super bad then the cell fuse will likely og out.
That's what I am saying. If 5 cells in a pack are .5 volts difference, how will bottom balancing help this? This is why with LIPO or LifePO4 people use BMS on each cell so that the cell cuts off charging at a set voltage and remaining charge goes to cells that are not topped off. In the build your own powerwall situation individual cell health and ability to take a full charge matters. If you have cells that are lower voltage than the rest in the pack you will still be at bottom while the higher voltage cells are not. Conversely if you have cells that will not top up to 4.2 volts and others that will you will over charge those that do in order to maintain full stage of charge. Without BMS/balancing there is no way to accurately charge individual cells based on their voltage. Long term this becomes a big problem. Cells will eventually drift to different voltages and capacities as they age. This out of balance situation is solved with FLA batteries during the equalization charge which is typically initiated once per month. Equalization sends voltage far over max state of charge to top up the lower voltage batteries. This can be done with FLA because it doesn't ruin FLA batteries. Lithium cannot be equalized in this manner because it damages the cells.
+Rick Smith It all depends on how plug'n'play you want the system. Riding the safe zone will lead to greater cycles but not getting that 80 percent energy available. In a DIY system I'd prefer a wall that let's you know you have a cell that's an outlier and an easy way to replace it...not a fan of balance by discharge either...but prefer one that mimics charging to the same level and swapping out...but that adds costs in switching circuits. Battery management can get overly complex which leads to paralysis by analysis. I like that Jehu just dives in with the attitude of solve problems as they come in. That's DIY spirit.
Dude, you are so impressive. This was my original video I found but then I saw your kickstarter and then that you actually have created other products... very impressed. Thanks for your videos.
Although I love the idea of having a powerwall I'm probably not going to do it and here's why. Inverter and converter power loss. Efficiency may vary from something just over 50% when a trickle of power is being used, to something over 90% when the output is approaching the inverters rated output. An inverter will use some power from your batteries even when you are not drawing any AC power from it. This results in the low efficiencies at low power levels. A 3Kw inverter may typically draw around 20 watts from your batteries when no AC current is being used. It would then follow that if you are using 20 watts of AC power, the inverter will be drawing 40 watts from the batteries and the efficiency will only be 50%. A small 200W inverter may on the other hand only draw 25 watts from the battery to give an AC outpur of 20 watts, resulting in an efficiency of 80%. So in my example I've talked a little about efficiency. I am wondering what your thoughts are about how you would use your wall as efficiency as possible?
Here's a very real issue to think about: most home insurance companies require ALL components of a home electrical system to be UL rated. This DIY will likely invalidate your homeowners insurance if you have a home fire
Wow you are so so wrong here. TONS of stuff! Just for giggles look up Chinese led reef lighting.. That will give you an idea.. So "just say" what you want but the facts are way different!
Yes. He has no BMS installed. All electric vehicles with lithium batteries (and even phones and laptops) have some type of battery management system to monitor and balance the battery over time. Without that and with all of these random age cells thrown together, I think that long term some of the cells could get dangerously overcharged.
What I find crazy is you got all these people spending thousands on batteries. I mean I watched a guy spend something like $800 on a lithium battery that was 1000 watts. I’m going watch more of your videos, because I do a lot of pc repair and I never thought about taking old laptop batteries apart. I got a box full of dead laptop batteries. Why not turn the remaining cells into something useful. I’m not a electrician by any means but I believe I could actually do this maybe 🙂
Just dont connect a bunch and you know stick a fork in a light socket. Safety first and foremost. I went to school for automotive and am currently going to school to be an industrial maintenance technician and electrician. Knowing whats dangerous and what isnt. Is the most important. You arent taking cells apart so as long as nothing breaks most anyone could do these things.
What you've essentially created is a 1260Ah battery at 3.7 volts DC. You can't really run anything useful off of it. You would have to wire it at 11.1v minimum to make it worth while (I would go 14.8 to delay onset of going below minimum inverter input). Wiring it at 14.8 volts to power an inverter would reduce the battery size to 315Ah. Rough estimate time. To power a small room (assuming LED everything) with a TV, a light and a laptop would be around 250 to 300 watts. This battery powering a 300 watt AC inverter would last, at maximum, 5 hours. The Powerwall inverter says it can power your whole house, so I would assume inverter output of 240 volts. It says 5kw is continuous output, and at 240 volts that would be 20 amps, so that seems right. So to claim a 14kwh battery at 240 volts AC, you would need 58Ah of battery. Convert that to 48 volts DC, and you get about 320Ah worth of combined cells. The Powerwall would run the small room from above for about 21 hours. To make something equivalent to the Powerwall, you would need about 1,976 of those 3.7v 2100mAh cells wired at 48v. Alternatively, you could make smaller batteries using 600 cells like you did (but still at 48v), and just keep adding them as you build them to slowly increase the Ah over time instead of making one giant battery in one fell swoop.
Hello Something I noticed was David was able to turn one disconnect on with the door open.? There should be a safety tab inside the disconnect that only allowed the disconnect turned on with the door closed.
NiMh batteries do not have issues with memory. That would be the NiCad batteries of the 80's and 90's. batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/memory_myth_or_fact
Brother you are a teacher, a skilled craftsman, a entrepreneur, a artist and all around model American Man! Thank you... i have subscribed... going to your channel now to catch up on all your videos! One request.. please name the components ("these guys") verbally or subtexts, either one would be fine.
18650"s are fantastic on paper. The c rate is awesome, the lifespan is awesome. When you say lead is toxic I question what battery tech is more recyclable? I have not factored in the lifespan of lithium ion vs lead but i think the casing and electrolyte will become a small factor vs a 18650 cell packaging. Does anyone have any data that could draw a conclusion? Are there any recyclers that will pay for a core charge? I really think we should be looking for the next tech to fix both problems.
Liion has been known to explode on infrequent occasions ; suggest you put it outside away from your house so your insurance is still good for the house. Nimh is NOT known for explosions and while heavier is not a factor because its not moving (in fact Ni-Fe might be best of all because space and weight are not players and Ni-Fe has been known to last 100 years). oh yes, you mentioned memory effects with nimh, actually its more the nicads that have that problem, nimh is not known for that.
Liion does not explode infrequently, having Liion batteries like a 18650 charging with Positive facing down for a prolonged period of time is what causes batteries to explode as the heat has no where to go and will build up to dangerous temperatures which is what causes problem, not the technology itself. It is still well worth mentioning Liion requires proper precautions to ensure stability and proper operation ;but there is nothing about Liion as a technology that should be a cause for concern.
This is a serious fire hazard unless done by trained professionals. I've experience working in a manufacturing facility for these types of batteries (not tesla) and in the R&D and product testing phases there were a lot of instances failure which resulted in extreme heat, sometimes melting or charring equipment. As it was a testing environment this did not go unnoticed and was dealt with quickly, I don't think the same can be said of DIY version built and used in the home. I'm a big fan of the maker attitude, but for projects with this level of health and safety risk I would say leave it to the professionals. Mega skills though! This advice is aimed at those who might not have the same skill set/level as you and fancy just giving it a shot. #PCPrinciple #MakingIsCoolThough
True story, put it in a concrete bunker away from your house and anything that can cause a problem if exposed to a jet of fire. Back yard power station.
Awesome video, I am looking for a high capacity "whole house" UPS for computers/routers/switches etc. I wonder how I could wire a big pack to an off the shelf 24V UPS, or if there is another way.
There is a strong suspicion that for static applications, the plating batteries will replace Lithium batteries. The Zinc Bromide battery, for instance, uses very common materials (plastic, zinc and bromine and an organic liquid which holds the bromine in the discharge phase) which are cheap. Better still it can be fully charged and fully discharged and will have the same capacity next year as it has this year. It also has no self discharge. If you charge it up today and come back a year later, it will still have the power you put into it. For industrial users, the liquid metal batteries could be an option. Probably not for home use but with the same characteristics as the electro-plating batteries and huge power density.
+FrequentFlier Anon Well you will still need to spend a lot of time collecting and putting this together. You also need the skills and the tools to assemble it all. Plus there is more technology inside of the tesla. Yes you can build a cheaper alternative but it will require a lot more time and effort and most people buying one of these will usually not have the skills, time or effort to build this.
featherman9 Yes, but it is only an investment in the skills-to-build for those of us without the skills already. I'd be willing to bet there are a lot of people who already have the skills (not me). So that part of it (learning the skills) is not an investment.
Brainbuster Of course learning the skills is an investment, lots of materials, possibly a class and or some books and the most valuable resource time. If you spend 3-4 weeks learning how to build this and you only save a few dollars is it really worth it? You could have spent the same time working or learning/working on other things that can save you a lot more money.
+delvis11 I've found good places to get very cheap 18650 cells are Computer recyclers (have got over 1200 cells from them so far), and XGoverment computer resellers.
Have you ever considered adding two alternators driven by the front wheels then connect a steppe transformer to help charge up the batteries for a longer charge life?
I have a friend that about 3 years ago had the Tesla wall battery house backup system installed OR almost installed. I would ask him every 3-4 months did the Tesla people ever get it in and running. He said not yet. I sent him an e-mail today, 3 years after my first asking him if it is up and running. Today, this afternoon, September 26, 2020 he e-mailed me back and said he cancelled the whole project. I don’t know if it’s the company that Tesla is using or Tesla itself. The point is his system got installed and working. I told him that Generac, the generator people have their system out and doing installs. They have been advertising their system all over the Houston area. I have a Generac 20KW natural gas whole house generator and it runs like a top. When the power goes out in 10 seconds the power comes right back on.
It is inportant to note that those cells are usually not to the standard of Tesla’s In capacity, current output, or just general quality. If you were to do this with something like Samsung 30Q’s, then it would run ya about 3 bucks a cell so cost would come around much closer to Tesla’s if you want the quality and longevity of not only better but newer cells.
*Super compact and easy to carry and travel with accessories for the electric **Generater.Systems** .I was worried this was going to be bulky or hard to use.Hooks up easy and charges quickly*
To make it optimal, we could add a BMS (Battery Management System), with cooling controlled fans, vetilation holes, with screens, and below freezing temperature shut off. Oh, and don't forget a metal box...
Looks cooool! Great video! Thanks for sharing!
why would it need a metal box
Holy shit.... someone on TH-cam doing a DIY that actually researched and knows what he is taking about. That's refreshing!! I'm an industrial electrician and constantly work with 480 and 208 three phase power. This guy is spot on with voltages and Watt hours etc. Good job!!
TR Custom Tech ?? We learn that stuff in school, it's just an extension of ohm's law after all.
zaq405 question though; how many people have you seen on TH-cam make a video about something and they don't know a damn thing about it. All I was trying to say is it's refreshing to see a video made by someone that is not full of shit.
TR Custom Tech. That's precisely the issue I have. Someone might burn their house down because he gained some knowledge through this video. You and I have experience which would guide us from making fatal mistakes.
zaq405 I agree with you there. I have seen people do some pretty stupid things with electricity especially when it comes to batteries. Hell I've been hit pretty good by a 24 VDC power supply. But when it comes to batteries it doesn't take very many in series to have a pretty potent power source.
TR Custom Tech where are you located? Would you be willing to teach someone as a helper?
Every thing said, the stuffs you're doing is what modern day heroes do. To me, you're among the unknown unrecognized global heroes in the making. Only a passion to share knowledge to empower people can make people do what you do. Godspeed!
Jehu has a real talent for teaching this stuff and you can tell he care about his audience , thanks man keep it up.
except this was a learning experiment. before he learned about BMS being needed.
You have a talent for explaining things where people can understand and without getting bored or losing interest
This panel can put out close to 100 watts th-cam.com/users/postUgkxOqI2yqX0XVrhR2BMJciTWrHJpG8FhJyg when positioned in the appropriate southernly direction, tilted to the optimal angle for your latitude/date, and connected to a higher capacity device than a 500. The built in kickstand angle is a fixed at 50 degrees. Up to 20% more power can be output by selecting the actual date and latitude optimal angle.The 500 will only input 3.5A maximum at 18 volts for 63 watts. Some of the excess power from the panel can be fed into a USB battery bank, charged directly from the panel while also charging a 500. This will allow you to harvest as much as 63 + 15 = 78 watts.If this panel is used to charge a larger device, such as the power station, then its full output potential can be realized.
What about the BMS to balance charges and loads? Did I miss something?
no here also missed coolant.... battery will got heat....
@@rpwang6784 biggest thing i was thinking. center channel, might be for a fan or something but nope
@@langjie7281 but still nice job~~！！！
Great idea....questions:
1. By using old batteries, isn't one vastly cutting life expectancy of the pack?
2. Are the batteries easy to remove/replace when they go bad?
3. Is there some visual cue that indicates when each cell quits working, to easily facilitate changing out only the bad cells?
4. And, what happens...anything adverse...by pairing cells of different ages and wear?
The box could be configured to inset between wall studs, so avoid anything much sticking out off the wall surface!
Have tried sodium batteries that have a longer shelf life? Can we see you do a DIY with This battery please.
Homeboy you are a godsend. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. So grateful for people like you teaching the rest of us how to do things we would think we were never capable of.
holy guacamole! that is impressive. - I built and installed my own solar after a ton of research. Everyone i have told thinks I am crazy, including my wife, but now that i have't burned down the house, and my AC is running at 75 degrees in 105 degree weather, now they don't think I am crazy... I have considered a battery backup, but going off grid would be epic! I am seriously IMPRESSED with your work. This is my first time to the channel... and your motherboard channel. I will be spending a few more sleepless nights listening to that content you have posted.
You built it? What were your thoughts, and lessons? How much did it end up costing you? Could you improve on the design? I'm seriously considering making this myself!
@@josebravo7998 I will be more than happy to help you... I am still learning how to integrate the powerwall with the solar system. But as far as solar, it's really cool
Hi there,
You forgot to mention the costs of a control unit and an inverter, which - of course - are included in the Tesla Unit.
Regards from The Netherlands,
Roelof Kingma
More like $1000 diy powerwall.
@@ctrlaltdebug With used batteries, he's going to be chasing dead cells constantly. What a mess.
@@nikolatesla811 That would be my issue. Balancing is going to be a mess.
I was working for a delivery business and seen this workshop that had 3 of the BIG industrial power walls side by side. First time I’d seen it, asked them a bunch of questions and they bacially hadn’t paid for electricity since they had them installed, and they used tools ALL DAY, shop fans, welders, hoists ect ect…
Just stumbled on this and was impressed, he’s friendly and knows his stuff. Keep it at the baby level, there is a mix of capabilities watching and some have been away from any tech work for a long time;)
I don't know how i stumbled onto this but im so glad i did. i cant wait to try do this!
I loved the part where you explained how you can wire battery packs for whichever voltage you need! Nobody seems to know just how useful and versatile 18650's from laptop batteries are!
thats basic electromechanics.. i thought kids are learning that in school everywhere.. at least i was when i was 14yo..
Awesome, would love to see a start to finish portable version like charge the battery off solar and take it with you in a vehicle so you got a charge point on the go for long distance
You might consider a fireproof enclosure for that contraption... you know, instead of wood.
ehh, just adds more.... flare!... kill me
SciPunk215 LOL
SciPunk215 i don't think there's much you could use that will stop a fire fueled by 600 li batteries
David H concrete?
SciPunk215 I was thinking the very same thing!!
So where can you even get your hands on so many laptop batteries and an inverter to even start this
Jag35.com
What about cooling and ventilation? Tesla has an active cooling loop to maintain the correct temperature. What about redundancy? Tesla has overcapacity in the batteries to survive with battery failure. What about a battery management system? What about fire saftey? Lots of things to consider beyond just bunging a few laptop batteries in a box.
+125white125 Also How long will this last compared to Tesla's warrantied battery.
+wiboater4 Its an experiment, results come at the end, we'll have to see
+125white125 cooling? what for? lithium ions never catch fire on their own! Thats why Boeing (a company full of really stupid engineers and physicists) had such great success putting them into airplanes!! Oh wait... im being sarcastic.
Curious, what kind of batteries do you think airplanes currently use?
lead acid and nickle metal hydride are the most popular. The 787 is using lithium ion, but it should be noted that the company that did the original design of the batteries went bankrupt after the building burned down due to thermal runaway on one of their battery packs. Whoops.
Great job. If you look around you can even buy them new for a bargain and skip the tedious work of taking the laptop batteries apart. But what about balancing them? BMS? Several balance chargers?
Ihaveausernametoo I was wondering about that.
Awesome job .. I love how you de-mystify this stuff .. it benefits even those folks who know, in principle, how this stuff works. One of my degrees is in EE, and I know plenty about how this stuff works, but I tend to let my imagination run wild about the possible complications, and so never undertake a project. Being able to see it actually done from stset to finish provides needed encouragement (and insight into which parts to use etc.)
Please keepep them coming!
if you have a degree in EE you must then realize, his math is off. You'll never have 4.4KWH. That is the total at 3.7v
To get 12v you divide the cells into 4 groups (not 3 as he states). at that point you are down to 1.11KWH.
24v system is dividing by 8 (not 6 as he states). At that point you are down to 555WH
@@candicefrancart2060 No, he is right, as far as he goes. It is AMP hours that will change according to the Voltage. Ohm's Law: Amps times Volts = Watts. The wattage will stay the same.
He is just showing that it is possible to configure these batteries into 12V/24V/36V/48V. It's up to the person putting their own system together to figure out which is best for them. :)
Make your own Tesla battery !!! The glass saying Tesla is the best part. Excellent!!!
The link in the top left no longer works. It says This listing (**********) has been removed, or this item is not available.
how do you charge it on solar?
What a nice project! All it needs is a charger now!
Great project.. Its got me thinking. I don't know why you included the price of the wood in your project costs but didn't include the wires, wiring connectors, and immobilizer. I would imagine that would add some significant cost. $100 for the glass?.... well I guess there is a place for form over function, ( a piece of scrap metal painted with good paint and sticker would have achieved the same effect). I look forward to your next video.
While some commenting apparently don't like your work, overall it's great that you're sharing info. Personally, I'd rather spend the money you did on glass with logo on better (or new) batteries, since old ones have already spent some cycles and will have to be replaced sooner than later. A plain piece of glass is cheap, and labor or fire isn't. Overall, thumbs up and nice job.
Enjoyable video and good info. That said many folks are not aware of how easy it is to refurbish cordless tool batteries for peanuts. For the price of a replacement battery pack you can get 100 cells on ebay.
Cool project, I always love DIY and people who share the knowledge. To everybody else on here, right or wrong, we should be thankful for people who take the time to do a good video and share their knowledge, even if it is wrong or we don't agree with it fully. You can either learn good things, bad things and takeway (if you choose) something from things like this.
Having said that, I do disagree with a few things. First the price, you only mention the batteries, wood and glass as cost on your BOM. However, and you even link to these in the video, there are many other components on the BOM. For example, the battery holders link you provide, takes me to eBay where there are holders that hold 15 batteries for 5.99 each. To buy enough of these to hold 600 batteries, it would cost $239.60 just for the holders. On top of that, there are many other items, for example the fuses, buss bars, wiring, etc...
Given that, and not even factoring in labor, I think your actual BOM is more like $600-$700 (and that is assuming you still use that overpriced piece of glass). Still not bad if you want to take on a project of this magnitude. Which brings me to another point, the labor. Do you care to share how much time it takes to pull apart all the laptop batteries, test them and then arrange/solder them all together into these packs? I would venture to guess it would take many, many days.
Finally, as others have pointed out, there are things like UL listing, thermal and environmental concerns, etc... that are not factored in to your solution. I love DIY, but some things that may burn my house down, I tend to proceed with caution. By the way, if you burn your house down with something DIY like this (no UL listing, etc...) you may not even be covered by your home insurance.
So, my summary, while the Powerwall is $3k-$3500, that is actually a good price when you factor the BOM, labor to build and other engineering concerns.
Mike
Michael Bedford can a Tesla powerwall be juiced with wind turbines?
You made some good points. I liked this video because it gave a quick rundown of the battery types, how these wall units function, how batteries can be arranged for a specific power output, and how to calculate the output. All good info for the layman.
On the other hand, I agree with your concerns about overall cost. Time is money too, so aside from the parts cost, labor should be factored in. Although, the enjoyment factor would negate some of the labor cost.
Good video, subscribed!
100$ for glass...
you could buy more cells
or beer
Exactly my thought when he was breaking up the cost.
Cekpi7 it was $100.00 spent on theater. Notice he covered the Tesla with his sticker after? What a statement!! Great way the end the video.
@Frank Navarrete, M.D. Nothing wrong with exercising his prerogative to make it look cool and be contained the way he wanted it
Glass Coors Lite mirror
You could build an electric gokart with that, kinda like making your own mini model S.
Finally...a video clear enough for us regular guys! Simple is always better... thanks!
Hey could I use this battery set up in a van?
A great place to get 18650's and other batteries FOR FREE is in those used battery recycling bins that are at most electronics and hardware stores, or you can ask at a recycling facility, 18650's are in everything from cordless drill battery packs to laptop batteries.
Definitely not new,but freeeee. The ones in old laptop batteries are for sure not new, and more worn. Most cordless tools have "smart chargers" that the unit will simply not recharge , but the batteries are still perfectly usable
+Video Québec lol "smart charger" = after it gets tired of you it tells you to go by another one
Basically lol apparently it's to protect the batteries/device. That's why it just stops working instead of gradually losing charge capacity
Des batteries gratuites comme celles-ci: là tu m'intéresses. :)
enator71 Uhhhh, it was like that before Trump was in office. It's called business.
Decent video though not for the uninitiated. One note, you stated Nickel Metal Hydride (NIMH) has a memory issue if not discharged fully before charged, that's actually Nickel Cadmium (NiCd) that has that issue hence their obsolescence and NIMH being used widely still due to their long life and lower cost than more advanced batteries.
It's all about the batteries.... weight and current vs. application capacity.
II have a cluster of free 40 x 12V 20Ah UPS Led Acid batteries that
I get to torment from time to time on my DYI UPS backup ideas.
The other day I tried a load on just (1) single but good 12V Li-Ion, battery.
So we dream every day of finally pulling off the grid and make good DIY stuff like you share with us.
I can just say It's amazing the power one gets with no weigh from Li-Ion/ 18650 batteries.
Thank you, Mr. Garcia for tons of inspiration, keep your nice production up : )
Have you heard of anyone changing the battery pack in a 2014 Ford Fusion Energi to get more mileage on battery power??
Off the showroom floor the batter design was 22 mile range. Currently a full charge provides 15 miles per charge which is only useful for errands around town. As soon as I hit the freeway 15 miles turns into 3 as the power is deleted and the combustible engine kicks in.
You need BMS, if your adding solar panels, you should also invest on MPPT charger controller. The inverter should be the size of whatever you plan on running continuously, take in consideration the surge power and it should be pure sine wave inverter.
Good luck
Crazy irony: As soon as you have 600 batteries holding all your electric juice in box in your garage, you work to turn your DC into AC...
To travel only A FEW FEET!!!
A better investment of time would be to remove the numerous components in your various electric appliences to deal with the assumed AC input.
The initial breakthrough of AC by Tesla a 100 years ago was to make electricity transmission possible.
Now that solar panels have come so far, no need for power transmission lines.
So, no need for AC-DC conversion portions of almost every electric circuit in every appliance (and the complimentary inefficiency!)
Not only live on solar power, reduce the needed electric need by removing the DC-AC converters all over the house.
Plus, you lose a lot of power in the AC/DC conversion. DC-DC is the future for sure!
@@Alshafi But, at least removing all the ac-dc converters in all the appliances (fridge, freezer, AC, TV, etc.) amounts to nothing but wasted juice.
As far as that goes, the DC-ac converter put in by the solar panel outfit waates juice.
People have no idea how much juice is simply being WASTED converting from dc to ac then back to dc.
Somebody will get the attention though!
Then power needs will be effectively cut, again!
Solar is the solution!
Dan Tyler what would that entail though 🤔
What are you saying... You would need specific Voltages transformed throughout your house... I guess it could be done, you'd have to literally modify everything... Might make sense for someone who builds a house in the woods just for this project. What about a rectenna.
Nissan had the idea of using used packs for grid storage. Just not home grid storage.
Awesome video man, can't wait to see part 2! Would be cool to see some 18650 safety tests like fast current drains and over voltage charge and shorts etc.
+sk8rboy1255555 Great idea.
+sk8rboy1255555 I recently charged a recycled 18650 cell to 8Volts. :(
I was trickle charging it up from 0V and forgot about it. When I disconnected it from the charger it's voltage dribbled back down to 0.5V
Think I might avoid using that cell ;)
Wow 8 volts! and no fiery ball of death? guess these things are safer than I thought.
+sk8rboy1255555 I was a bit freaked out when I noticed it. I don't want to do that again.
Little 18650 or whatever have anywhere between 600 up to 2000 cycles
Ignoring anything about BMS is bad
But
Bright idea and great DIY
I'd really love to see this project continued
You could add some "ultra capacitors" across the battery packs in each box if you have room. They have huge lifespan & can source hundreds of amps, so can ease load on batteries during startup of any electric motor or refrigerator loads especially in cold weather.
I'm confused, did you go with 3s for 12v? 3s is really 10.8v or 11.1v. Most 12v inverters shutoff at 10.5v, meaning you probably will only see about a 50% capacity usage or less (depending on load) if you go with a 12v inverter. 24v inverter with 7S is a far better choice as the voltages are completely compatible.
asusreviews 3.7 v minimum, 4.2 fully charged , so 3 for 12v is in the middle range for the cells.
Aloha Jehu, this video is 4 years old. Do you still recommend using this method to build a power wall? Or has the technology advanced so much that you recommend something else?
Mahalo, from Hawaii!
I'm not an expert but I would say that technology didn't change at all and this idea is still valid.
Looks like the budget for batteries is going to be higher now
@@noahno for a little while. I imagine EV batteries are going to be available soon, and demand for used laptop battery cells...not sure.
This is great, I'll probably make one myself. Have you considered making kits for people who want to build stuff but don't have the time to build from scratch
Wow just as I was in the verge and creative time lapse of I should build my own 18650 battery pack for an eBike this guy pops up on my TH-cam news feed. Thank you my great guy! When my build is complete I’ll be sure to credit you for everything I’ve learned from you.
- Abraham desde NY, nacido en Mexico!
Cheers brother!
That VW van was my first vehicle in 1976! Love it.
I enjoyed this, but I wonder about those wires you show. They appear to be no more than maybe ten gauge and, at 7.6V and 4.4kW you're talking about quite a lot of current. Do you actually power your house with this?
6 awg cable, most likely going to end up being 24 or 48 volts. The inverter will most likely be no bigger than 2000 watts so at 24v it will see a max of 85 Amps and at 48v around 43 Amps
6awg is rated in AC power distribution for less than 40A. Copper is not so expensive as to skimp on the power stack. Every milliOhm at such low DC voltage is wasted heat. Why not use #2 or #4 wire?
The right cable will be used once inverter is chosen, right now its a wooden box full of batteries with 2 cables sticking out of it.
LMAO. How long did it take to sort through 100-odd laptop batteries? I had not thought of this as a solution before, but it now seems reasonable to think one could power an off grid home on recovered laptop batteries. How much work is it to repair when cells fail? I assume there is an indicator on the fuse to let you see it's blown?
All good questions, all unknown until someone tries it out. Im hoping when cells go out they just trip the fuse and they are disconnected, not too much to worry unless too many of them start to fail, in practice who knows if thats going to be a pain. I have a 12v battery on my car built just like this, haven't had to worry about it for 2 years. So its a proven concept on a smaller scale so we'll see.
He's braver than I am. I'm building a shed outside for my batteries because they contain more energy than tnt.
I want to build one of these for my house 50kw. I dont know what charge controllers and fuses I would need. So I'm now a subscriber
I love you. You are the future. Got here because of vice and you inspire me to learn about it and know about it because it’s something about the future we r gonna have to deal with
Very encouraging for a first time exposure to what it takes to produce and charge high capacity batteries at a reasonable price.
Is plywood really a good material to store lithium batteries in?
+rimmersbryggeri yes
I thought lithium batteries were a fire hazard espeacially when you have so many in the same confined area.
they can be fire hazard, but if used correctly they are relatively safe
Yerp
How are you balancing your cells? This is necessary...
+Rick Smith bottom balancing is used, with periodic checks with multi meter.
That's pretty cumbersome when you have 600 cells. If you get a whole pack down to a certain voltage that doesn't mean that every cell is even. It just means the pack is that voltage. Without cell balancing, as time goes by individual cells will come out of balance, this is pretty much certain. This is why BMS is used in Lithium energy storage applications (off grid, etc).
+Rick Smith when he checks capacity he leaves them discharged, each pack is 150 cells @3.7v roughly 300ah. once you solder all the cells in parallel, the charge will even the cells out, then after letting them sit you can charge them to 4.2 or personally 4.1 or 4.15. I have also done this with packs that i have made with no issues, i do however add a bms of charging, but i set it up so that LVC doesn't work, but does give me visual warning (the battery power lights on an ebike) and even if a cell was way out of check or was super bad then the cell fuse will likely og out.
That's what I am saying. If 5 cells in a pack are .5 volts difference, how will bottom balancing help this? This is why with LIPO or LifePO4 people use BMS on each cell so that the cell cuts off charging at a set voltage and remaining charge goes to cells that are not topped off. In the build your own powerwall situation individual cell health and ability to take a full charge matters. If you have cells that are lower voltage than the rest in the pack you will still be at bottom while the higher voltage cells are not. Conversely if you have cells that will not top up to 4.2 volts and others that will you will over charge those that do in order to maintain full stage of charge. Without BMS/balancing there is no way to accurately charge individual cells based on their voltage. Long term this becomes a big problem. Cells will eventually drift to different voltages and capacities as they age. This out of balance situation is solved with FLA batteries during the equalization charge which is typically initiated once per month. Equalization sends voltage far over max state of charge to top up the lower voltage batteries. This can be done with FLA because it doesn't ruin FLA batteries. Lithium cannot be equalized in this manner because it damages the cells.
+Rick Smith It all depends on how plug'n'play you want the system. Riding the safe zone will lead to greater cycles but not getting that 80 percent energy available. In a DIY system I'd prefer a wall that let's you know you have a cell that's an outlier and an easy way to replace it...not a fan of balance by discharge either...but prefer one that mimics charging to the same level and swapping out...but that adds costs in switching circuits. Battery management can get overly complex which leads to paralysis by analysis. I like that Jehu just dives in with the attitude of solve problems as they come in. That's DIY spirit.
Dude, you are so impressive. This was my original video I found but then I saw your kickstarter and then that you actually have created other products... very impressed. Thanks for your videos.
Great info! Love that microbus. I had a '59 23 window with the factory electric fan, and clock. No gas gauge though. Wish I still had it.
Although I love the idea of having a powerwall I'm probably not going to do it and here's why. Inverter and converter power loss. Efficiency may vary from something just over 50% when a trickle of power is being used, to something over 90% when the output is approaching the inverters rated output. An inverter will use some power from your batteries even when you are not drawing any AC power from it. This results in the low efficiencies at low power levels.
A 3Kw inverter may typically draw around 20 watts from your batteries when no AC current is being used. It would then follow that if you are using 20 watts of AC power, the inverter will be drawing 40 watts from the batteries and the efficiency will only be 50%.
A small 200W inverter may on the other hand only draw 25 watts from the battery to give an AC outpur of 20 watts, resulting in an efficiency of 80%. So in my example I've talked a little about efficiency. I am wondering what your thoughts are about how you would use your wall as efficiency as possible?
AMIGO ERES LO MAXIMO ..EL MUNDO NECESITA MAS GENTE COMO ..UN ABRAZO DESDE CHILE!
You are amazing. Thank you for taking the time to make this video, I enjoyed it immensely.
You dont calculated he charger, the connerctors, the cable and the AC module. A glasswall like this costs in Germany only 19€.
Hi John can you do a Black Friday deal on powerwall and power station? Thanks brother
Good stuff, can you do a 5 gallon bucket off grid battery pack ?
Here's a very real issue to think about: most home insurance companies require ALL components of a home electrical system to be UL rated. This DIY will likely invalidate your homeowners insurance if you have a home fire
Marco Sartori Underwriters Laboratory. ALL electronics need to pass UL validation in operation and design testing to be insurable.
Id be willing to bet,, with Chinese imports, that few if ANY household in USA has ALL UL cert goods.
Karl Dulle Can't be imported without it....just saying
Wow you are so so wrong here. TONS of stuff! Just for giggles look up Chinese led reef lighting.. That will give you an idea.. So "just say" what you want but the facts are way different!
And than look up UL listing fraud.. LMAO The Chinese print their own labels..
Dude, you have an amazing channel.
Isn't it important to match all the cells performance?
Yes. He has no BMS installed. All electric vehicles with lithium batteries (and even phones and laptops) have some type of battery management system to monitor and balance the battery over time. Without that and with all of these random age cells thrown together, I think that long term some of the cells could get dangerously overcharged.
Don't you need a BMS for the battery's?
Is there an updated version of this with maybe 21700 cells? I still really want to do this. Anyone do this in Nashville Tennessee?
Holy crap this is awesome!!! You're a genius!
What I find crazy is you got all these people spending thousands on batteries. I mean I watched a guy spend something like $800 on a lithium battery that was 1000 watts. I’m going watch more of your videos, because I do a lot of pc repair and I never thought about taking old laptop batteries apart. I got a box full of dead laptop batteries. Why not turn the remaining cells into something useful. I’m not a electrician by any means but I believe I could actually do this maybe 🙂
Theres no way that pack last more than 500 cycles.... Theyre aready out of packs where one cell failed. That means the rest were about to go.
Just dont connect a bunch and you know stick a fork in a light socket. Safety first and foremost. I went to school for automotive and am currently going to school to be an industrial maintenance technician and electrician. Knowing whats dangerous and what isnt. Is the most important. You arent taking cells apart so as long as nothing breaks most anyone could do these things.
Where is the BMS, balancing?
th-cam.com/video/aQQ8hHJ1_vI/w-d-xo.html
What you've essentially created is a 1260Ah battery at 3.7 volts DC. You can't really run anything useful off of it. You would have to wire it at 11.1v minimum to make it worth while (I would go 14.8 to delay onset of going below minimum inverter input). Wiring it at 14.8 volts to power an inverter would reduce the battery size to 315Ah.
Rough estimate time. To power a small room (assuming LED everything) with a TV, a light and a laptop would be around 250 to 300 watts. This battery powering a 300 watt AC inverter would last, at maximum, 5 hours.
The Powerwall inverter says it can power your whole house, so I would assume inverter output of 240 volts. It says 5kw is continuous output, and at 240 volts that would be 20 amps, so that seems right. So to claim a 14kwh battery at 240 volts AC, you would need 58Ah of battery. Convert that to 48 volts DC, and you get about 320Ah worth of combined cells. The Powerwall would run the small room from above for about 21 hours.
To make something equivalent to the Powerwall, you would need about 1,976 of those 3.7v 2100mAh cells wired at 48v. Alternatively, you could make smaller batteries using 600 cells like you did (but still at 48v), and just keep adding them as you build them to slowly increase the Ah over time instead of making one giant battery in one fell swoop.
Hello
Something I noticed was David was able to turn one disconnect on with the door open.? There should be a safety tab inside the disconnect that only allowed the disconnect turned on with the door closed.
NiMh batteries do not have issues with memory. That would be the NiCad batteries of the 80's and 90's.
batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/memory_myth_or_fact
Shared !! Can't wait to finish my own similar project on my channel!
Solar to battery to inverter. The Solar is DC not AC.
Chris Braid 👍
7:04
Brother you are a teacher, a skilled craftsman, a entrepreneur, a artist and all around model American Man! Thank you... i have subscribed... going to your channel now to catch up on all your videos!
One request.. please name the components ("these guys") verbally or subtexts, either one would be fine.
18650"s are fantastic on paper. The c rate is awesome, the lifespan is awesome. When you say lead is toxic I question what battery tech is more recyclable? I have not factored in the lifespan of lithium ion vs lead but i think the casing and electrolyte will become a small factor vs a 18650 cell packaging. Does anyone have any data that could draw a conclusion? Are there any recyclers that will pay for a core charge? I really think we should be looking for the next tech to fix both problems.
I thought the NiCd batteries had the memory effect.
+thejaviesable Yes, and only when you have partial discharges/recharges. Many times it can be reversed.
Liion has been known to explode on infrequent occasions ; suggest you put it outside away from your house so your insurance is still good for the house. Nimh is NOT known for explosions and while heavier is not a factor because its not moving (in fact Ni-Fe might be best of all because space and weight are not players and Ni-Fe has been known to last 100 years). oh yes, you mentioned memory effects with nimh, actually its more the nicads that have that problem, nimh is not known for that.
So john for. I don't know jack about this but are you referring to AA rechargeable batteries? Thanks
Liion does not explode infrequently, having Liion batteries like a 18650 charging with Positive facing down for a prolonged period of time is what causes batteries to explode as the heat has no where to go and will build up to dangerous temperatures which is what causes problem, not the technology itself. It is still well worth mentioning Liion requires proper precautions to ensure stability and proper operation ;but there is nothing about Liion as a technology that should be a cause for concern.
They are a different kind of battery that has 3.7v instead of 1.2v. I think they are a different size too.
This is a serious fire hazard unless done by trained professionals. I've experience working in a manufacturing facility for these types of batteries (not tesla) and in the R&D and product testing phases there were a lot of instances failure which resulted in extreme heat, sometimes melting or charring equipment. As it was a testing environment this did not go unnoticed and was dealt with quickly, I don't think the same can be said of DIY version built and used in the home.
I'm a big fan of the maker attitude, but for projects with this level of health and safety risk I would say leave it to the professionals.
Mega skills though! This advice is aimed at those who might not have the same skill set/level as you and fancy just giving it a shot.
#PCPrinciple #MakingIsCoolThough
True story, put it in a concrete bunker away from your house and anything that can cause a problem if exposed to a jet of fire. Back yard power station.
How do you charge the batteries? And how would you know tha battery percetage if it needs charging or its fully charged
hi Jehu, thanks for the video, do you have a video where you show how you build the brick itself?
Hi Man!!! congrats! how many cicles you can use this powerwall?
Awesome video, I am looking for a high capacity "whole house" UPS for computers/routers/switches etc. I wonder how I could wire a big pack to an off the shelf 24V UPS, or if there is another way.
That's my question... any answers??
I really want to do this. Thanks mate!
There is a strong suspicion that for static applications, the plating batteries will replace Lithium batteries. The Zinc Bromide battery, for instance, uses very common materials (plastic, zinc and bromine and an organic liquid which holds the bromine in the discharge phase) which are cheap. Better still it can be fully charged and fully discharged and will have the same capacity next year as it has this year. It also has no self discharge. If you charge it up today and come back a year later, it will still have the power you put into it. For industrial users, the liquid metal batteries could be an option. Probably not for home use but with the same characteristics as the electro-plating batteries and huge power density.
I see in all your videos that you first charge the individual cells before assembling the battery bank. Is this also necessary when using new cells?
This is a great channel! Clear, concise, correct, cross-linked! Love it!
So really if you take away the fancy cover it's a $200 solution, not bad!
theonlyari Oh maybe not. I might opt to put it in a metal box outdoors or something just to be safe though.
+FrequentFlier Anon Yes, the fancy glass is something that might attract thieves.
+FrequentFlier Anon Well you will still need to spend a lot of time collecting and putting this together. You also need the skills and the tools to assemble it all. Plus there is more technology inside of the tesla.
Yes you can build a cheaper alternative but it will require a lot more time and effort and most people buying one of these will usually not have the skills, time or effort to build this.
featherman9
Yes, but it is only an investment in the skills-to-build for those of us without the skills already. I'd be willing to bet there are a lot of people who already have the skills (not me). So that part of it (learning the skills) is not an investment.
Brainbuster Of course learning the skills is an investment, lots of materials, possibly a class and or some books and the most valuable resource time. If you spend 3-4 weeks learning how to build this and you only save a few dollars is it really worth it? You could have spent the same time working or learning/working on other things that can save you a lot more money.
Wish I could find .39c per cell..
Ha ya, You can always ask local computer repair shops they normally have some waiting to be recycled.
+delvis11 I've found good places to get very cheap 18650 cells are Computer recyclers (have got over 1200 cells from them so far), and XGoverment computer resellers.
but in terrible quality, yes?
Have you ever considered adding two alternators driven by the front wheels then connect a steppe transformer to help charge up the batteries for a longer charge life?
I have a friend that about 3 years ago had the Tesla wall battery house backup system installed OR almost installed.
I would ask him every 3-4 months did the Tesla people ever get it in and running. He said not yet.
I sent him an e-mail today, 3 years after my first asking him if it is up and running.
Today, this afternoon, September 26, 2020 he e-mailed me back and said he cancelled the whole project.
I don’t know if it’s the company that Tesla is using or Tesla itself. The point is his system got installed and working.
I told him that Generac, the generator people have their system out and doing installs.
They have been advertising their system all over the Houston area.
I have a Generac 20KW natural gas whole house generator and it runs like a top. When the power goes out in 10 seconds the power comes right back on.
What happen to your Range Rover hopefully not the same thing that happen to mine timing chain jump now I need a new engine
Your videos are amazingly cool, keep it up👍
So how do we charge it?
Use any charge controller for the desired voltage and with lithium type battery charging option.
Hi Jehu, could you tell me where can I buy those batteries please?
It is inportant to note that those cells are usually not to the standard of Tesla’s In capacity, current output, or just general quality. If you were to do this with something like Samsung 30Q’s, then it would run ya about 3 bucks a cell so cost would come around much closer to Tesla’s if you want the quality and longevity of not only better but newer cells.