I figure they should've given Gill a way to apply an element to a character without relying on v-skill or any meter. Maybe doing a combo with three moves of the same element without using the opposite element once could've applied the element at the cost of damage output. For instance, cr.hp xx cryokinesis, cryo cyber lariat would apply ice. It'd be a bitch to balance and at worst might call for entire combo routes to be altered though, so take that as you may
I agree with a lot of what you said. Rettribution is an awesome mechanic but its annoying I need to spend meter to utilize it. You could make it so moves put them in elemental state but the retribution return is decreased. Like freeze with hp cytokinesis but the fire attack follow up does less dmg and stun? So Gill still has meter less retribution but not as good payout when compared to setting up with Ex moves or Trigger? Your right this would be a pain in the ass to balance.
V-skill 1 should just be something you can cancel into that applies an element. Gill doesn't have a safe way to build V meter OR cause an elemental state. He should at least be able to combo into them on hit.
@@MiketheNerdRanger Last patch he was one of the worst characters in this game, it's too early to tell now, but I don't think he's soaring through the tier list any time soon. These changes just weren't enough.
There not really buffing him in the way I hoped for but at least he got buffs Side note: the buffs I wanted were that he could give the opponent the elemental debuff thing on counter hit with his specials and his heavy punch/kick along with his command heavy normals and that his knee drop would get gain an element on v trigger activation (element would depend on the v trigger used). Maybe that's abit much but this could help him
Gill isn't bottom 5 anymore, but they're really too scared to give Gill any game changing buffs. Bottom 10 isn't much of an improvement as even with the buffs he's an extremely gimmicky character. I'd argue the only meaningful buff he got was making Cr.MP +4 on hit which is kind of sad as it's only +1 extra to the frame data if I remember correctly. I would've loved to see his heavies apply retribution, at least while in VTrigger bare minimum VS1 cancellable as well as better frame data CR.HP being adjusted so it doesn't trade as often. If you compare Urien's crhp to Gill's it's insane how bad Gill's is by comparison. These changes are neat, but they're not enough. You still would never pick Gill over Urien competitively.
Gill still has huge problems with his oki game, retribution still is a gimmick at best, he has no defensive options outside of his extremely risky Parry and now VShift and his neutral isn't anything to write home about. Such a shame to see our true Ruler in this state.
Here we go, thanks for the vid. As a Gill player i honestly im happy with what we got, now VT 2 has "more uses" othen then spend 2 EX es to get 1 50/50 setup [ex fireball activate >cr.hp> ex Up fire ball >fhp> d.VT2] Now you "can" ex fireball > VT2 attack> F.hk > Down / down foward vt2 "trap" into a mixup and your +3 afterwards. (not trying to promote my channel or anything but i've made a vid demoing the setup (it aint much but i feel its somewhat usefull)
@@Luffa613 try this : put the trap behind them and go for an overhead or the cr.lk>cr.mk target combo to push them into the trap with the pushback . If I get hit they still get pushed back into it. Or if they have. Reversal just block , 70% of the time. They will just ex dp
You upload is crazy impressive. Sadly, I'm thinking these buffs aren't enough to really get Gill out of his low ranking, which is a shame because I'd like him to feel at least nominally powerful.
Gill doesn't actually have a Crush Counter. The Retribution system is there in place of a Crush Counter. Retribution does a few different things depending on the move, ranging from extra damage, hard knockdown, or new juggle opportunities.
Gill does get VS1 cancels from VT enhanced specials, similar to falke. Still -4 on heavy lariat cancel, but it has some uses for resets in the corner with fireball I believe.
@@Bafael Oh no I completely agree haha, VS1 is shit unless you are in the gief MU and in that case you don't want to spend v-meter because you want to have 50 seconds of both cryokenesis and meteor on screen.
@bafael Vskill startup reduction now gives him certain oki setups that didn't work before. He can be +3 on wakeup with a ball coming down to cover his pressure in the corner.
Gill was consistently ranked like bottom 3. He’s incredibly weak offensively and defensively while being a complex character and these buffs really weren’t enough to improve him.
@@FelipeWalker2 Gill has been ranked low/bottom tier in the game since basically day 1. His damage has always been ridiculously high but things like bad frame data, no crush counters, and being a hard zoner in a game where zoning isn’t very strong led to lots of players considering him one of the worst in the game. As a Gill player I can tell you that he’s honestly a really weak character, Nemo just makes him look amazing because Nemo is a godlike player
@@diangelo786 Ranked by whom? And yeah, Nemo really is an Alien (pun intended) but I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I saw a Gill getting bodied by someone else in ranked or otherwise. Meanwhile, people have been praising Necalli as a top tier since forever but I see him losing as much as winning.
@@FelipeWalker2 Given most Gill players are probably Gill specialists due to him being an uncommon character, he should actually have a high win rate. Being anywhere near 50% when only dedicated people play a character is a real bad sign.
@@FelipeWalker2 ranked by everyone like that,you can take punk as an example,he puts him in bottom tier in his tier list and in another video went as far as to say that he is the worst character in the game,if you think he is stronger than that,tell me why then
Gill is jack of all trades master of none. Okay-ish zoning with ice ball, still loses to Ryu, Guile, Sagat, even Bison fucks you over with your own fireball Sub-par normals with few exceptions, very easy to whiff punish and have a lot of recovery frames Good damage, outside v trigger, but in VT-1 esp scaling hits super hard, VT2 basically almost dead due to v shift, 99% people will v shift ice trap because its guess for game. Strong AA game. 16f dash, but no good oki game? Slow backwards movement Absolutely abysmal cr lp No ex wake up, have to gamble. What Gill supposed to do? He cannot zone properly, he cannot play rushdown due to poor oki, he is stuck in a limbo. If you want to zone, pick Poison, Guile, Sagat, and even Ryu in some cases. If you want to rush down Pick Urien, Cammy. For DLC character, and Boss at that, he is incredibly weak, capcom dropped the ball HARD here
He got slightly better. Everyone else in the bottom tier got a lot better. So while he's objectively a better character, functionally within the meta he's worse.
No gill in their right mind is gonna use vs1. Outside of trigger, using makes it so you cant use fire balls. Its unsafe as hell anywhere but fullscreen, and at full screen it's not much of a threat or deterrent without fireballs. And theres no safe set up for it besides retribution, which you need ex, vs1, or vt to set up. That being said vs1 is actually pretty solid during trigger, as the size of the projectile increases and gill can have both a fireball and meteor at the same time. It creates a maze of projectiles that can lock down the opponent at a long range. The main way they could buff this is by having sweep counter hit act as a crush counter regardless of retribution. A target combo for vs1 could turn it into a vortex tool, and that's not something gill should have outside of trigger.
He's a really cool character but I don't think these buffs are enough to help him out. It's a good thing he has some stuff to assist him, but I think he needs a bit more to help his Retribution and other sort of things. I want to keep playing as him as a sub despite not fairing up well with him.
SFV’s art style is kinda bland, and a lot of animations are hit and miss in terms of quality (perhaps due to them relying so much on motion capture, compared to their hand animated FGs last gen), but them using physics for long hair rather than hand animating it really is its worst offender. I get why they do it from a practical standpoint, as it’s definitely more cost effective, especially since they have so many costumes, and re-animating every frame for every costume that changes hairstyles to another long haired one just ends up being impractical and expensive. And it’s not like they didn’t do it for some characters in SFIV as well (though it was the ugliest part of that game, too). But ultimately, using hair physics for a fighting game just doesn’t look right, and is a huge contributor to this game looking more wack than it has to.
@@CrossfacePanda They got better at models and animations as the DLC went along, it's just that the art style and to some extent the engine really crippled what they could do. Most of the male characters have muscle structures that don't make sense and make their arms look like candy bars (seriously, Balrog has like five biceps per arm), and a lot of the early female characters looked more like animated dolls than like living things (R. Mika especially). I like SFV as a game but I hope they take the visuals in another direction for SF6 so the characters are more expressive.
"People who disregard Gill should watch one of the best players in the world beat people who don't know the matchup, and completely disregard all his flaws and bad matchups."
Patch Notes: Resurrection
Subtitle: we wanted to make him better. Deal with it.
It’s wild to me how underbuffed he is compared to, you know.
Who?
@@Davaroni Ryu
@@GemmaBee14 i thought u were gonna say urien tbh
I figure they should've given Gill a way to apply an element to a character without relying on v-skill or any meter. Maybe doing a combo with three moves of the same element without using the opposite element once could've applied the element at the cost of damage output. For instance, cr.hp xx cryokinesis, cryo cyber lariat would apply ice. It'd be a bitch to balance and at worst might call for entire combo routes to be altered though, so take that as you may
I agree with a lot of what you said.
Rettribution is an awesome mechanic but its annoying I need to spend meter to utilize it.
You could make it so moves put them in elemental state but the retribution return is decreased.
Like freeze with hp cytokinesis but the fire attack follow up does less dmg and stun?
So Gill still has meter less retribution but not as good payout when compared to setting up with Ex moves or Trigger?
Your right this would be a pain in the ass to balance.
I like that idea
V-skill 1 should just be something you can cancel into that applies an element.
Gill doesn't have a safe way to build V meter OR cause an elemental state. He should at least be able to combo into them on hit.
I really wish Gill was good. He’s such a cool character.
And hot lol
Is he bad?
@@MiketheNerdRanger He’s not a bad character (I don’t think so, at least), he’s just not particularly good.
@@MiketheNerdRanger Last patch he was one of the worst characters in this game, it's too early to tell now, but I don't think he's soaring through the tier list any time soon. These changes just weren't enough.
@@AsterDXZ keep in mind he now has V shift, he only had his super before if he wanted to blow through the pressure.
Babe wake up
New set of Bafael videos dropped
There not really buffing him in the way I hoped for but at least he got buffs
Side note: the buffs I wanted were that he could give the opponent the elemental debuff thing on counter hit with his specials and his heavy punch/kick along with his command heavy normals and that his knee drop would get gain an element on v trigger activation (element would depend on the v trigger used). Maybe that's abit much but this could help him
0:26 the sexual tension between ryu and gill
Gill isn't bottom 5 anymore, but they're really too scared to give Gill any game changing buffs. Bottom 10 isn't much of an improvement as even with the buffs he's an extremely gimmicky character. I'd argue the only meaningful buff he got was making Cr.MP +4 on hit which is kind of sad as it's only +1 extra to the frame data if I remember correctly.
I would've loved to see his heavies apply retribution, at least while in VTrigger bare minimum
VS1 cancellable as well as better frame data
CR.HP being adjusted so it doesn't trade as often. If you compare Urien's crhp to Gill's it's insane how bad Gill's is by comparison.
These changes are neat, but they're not enough. You still would never pick Gill over Urien competitively.
Gill still has huge problems with his oki game, retribution still is a gimmick at best, he has no defensive options outside of his extremely risky Parry and now VShift and his neutral isn't anything to write home about.
Such a shame to see our true Ruler in this state.
Aged like a fine wine
Me: looks away for 2 seconds
Bafael: Another one. Another one. Another one. Another one.
I wish retributions would give V-meter. crush counters do. what a shame
Here we go, thanks for the vid. As a Gill player i honestly im happy with what we got, now VT 2 has "more uses" othen then spend 2 EX es to get 1 50/50 setup [ex fireball activate >cr.hp> ex Up fire ball >fhp> d.VT2] Now you "can" ex fireball > VT2 attack> F.hk > Down / down foward vt2 "trap" into a mixup and your +3 afterwards.
(not trying to promote my channel or anything but i've made a vid demoing the setup (it aint much but i feel its somewhat usefull)
good thing our 50/50s are gone with v shift :)
@@Luffa613 try this : put the trap behind them and go for an overhead or the cr.lk>cr.mk target combo to push them into the trap with the pushback . If I get hit they still get pushed back into it. Or if they have. Reversal just block , 70% of the time. They will just ex dp
Amazing series, thank you man.
You upload is crazy impressive. Sadly, I'm thinking these buffs aren't enough to really get Gill out of his low ranking, which is a shame because I'd like him to feel at least nominally powerful.
I feel like Gill should get Retribution when he crush counters people but I don't know if that would be broken or still not enough. Someone help me!
Gill doesn't actually have a Crush Counter. The Retribution system is there in place of a Crush Counter. Retribution does a few different things depending on the move, ranging from extra damage, hard knockdown, or new juggle opportunities.
@@Unknownigen He means on counter hit Gill's elemental normals should install their element.
Gill does get VS1 cancels from VT enhanced specials, similar to falke. Still -4 on heavy lariat cancel, but it has some uses for resets in the corner with fireball I believe.
I feel like it's a bit late by the time trigger rolls around, since then he can get it just by using the trigger enhanced specials themselves lmao
@@Bafael Oh no I completely agree haha, VS1 is shit unless you are in the gief MU and in that case you don't want to spend v-meter because you want to have 50 seconds of both cryokenesis and meteor on screen.
@bafael Vskill startup reduction now gives him certain oki setups that didn't work before. He can be +3 on wakeup with a ball coming down to cover his pressure in the corner.
Still can't believe they gave Gill the Sean treatment
Care to elaborate? At least Gill was added to a game after 3rd strike, still waiting to see Sean again
@@Countdownsmiles Top tier in 1 game, ass next appearance
@@Swampson1738 what other game was Sean in???
@@Countdownsmiles second impact
You Trippin'
Thank the heavens he finally got something, still wasn't to much but at least it was something
magnet man with noodle hair
Gill was consistently ranked like bottom 3. He’s incredibly weak offensively and defensively while being a complex character and these buffs really weren’t enough to improve him.
Are you high or something? Bottom 3?
@@FelipeWalker2 Gill has been ranked low/bottom tier in the game since basically day 1. His damage has always been ridiculously high but things like bad frame data, no crush counters, and being a hard zoner in a game where zoning isn’t very strong led to lots of players considering him one of the worst in the game. As a Gill player I can tell you that he’s honestly a really weak character, Nemo just makes him look amazing because Nemo is a godlike player
@@diangelo786 Ranked by whom? And yeah, Nemo really is an Alien (pun intended) but I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I saw a Gill getting bodied by someone else in ranked or otherwise. Meanwhile, people have been praising Necalli as a top tier since forever but I see him losing as much as winning.
@@FelipeWalker2 Given most Gill players are probably Gill specialists due to him being an uncommon character, he should actually have a high win rate. Being anywhere near 50% when only dedicated people play a character is a real bad sign.
@@FelipeWalker2 ranked by everyone like that,you can take punk as an example,he puts him in bottom tier in his tier list and in another video went as far as to say that he is the worst character in the game,if you think he is stronger than that,tell me why then
Gill at a glance..... Gaag!
“The time has arrived.”
Gill is jack of all trades master of none.
Okay-ish zoning with ice ball, still loses to Ryu, Guile, Sagat, even Bison fucks you over with your own fireball
Sub-par normals with few exceptions, very easy to whiff punish and have a lot of recovery frames
Good damage, outside v trigger, but in VT-1 esp scaling hits super hard, VT2 basically almost dead due to v shift, 99% people will v shift ice trap because its guess for game.
Strong AA game.
16f dash, but no good oki game?
Slow backwards movement
Absolutely abysmal cr lp
No ex wake up, have to gamble.
What Gill supposed to do? He cannot zone properly, he cannot play rushdown due to poor oki, he is stuck in a limbo. If you want to zone, pick Poison, Guile, Sagat, and even Ryu in some cases. If you want to rush down Pick Urien, Cammy. For DLC character, and Boss at that, he is incredibly weak, capcom dropped the ball HARD here
Thanks for the vid Baf
He got slightly better. Everyone else in the bottom tier got a lot better. So while he's objectively a better character, functionally within the meta he's worse.
VS1 has really good left/right 50/50 mix ups, too bad they won't fix it to a point where ppl would want to take advantage of that.
So many new bafael videos lfg
No gill in their right mind is gonna use vs1. Outside of trigger, using makes it so you cant use fire balls. Its unsafe as hell anywhere but fullscreen, and at full screen it's not much of a threat or deterrent without fireballs. And theres no safe set up for it besides retribution, which you need ex, vs1, or vt to set up.
That being said vs1 is actually pretty solid during trigger, as the size of the projectile increases and gill can have both a fireball and meteor at the same time. It creates a maze of projectiles that can lock down the opponent at a long range.
The main way they could buff this is by having sweep counter hit act as a crush counter regardless of retribution. A target combo for vs1 could turn it into a vortex tool, and that's not something gill should have outside of trigger.
todoroki on ROIDS!
Is anyone else bothered by Gill's ankles when he crouches? They look like they're made of rubber.
He's a really cool character but I don't think these buffs are enough to help him out. It's a good thing he has some stuff to assist him, but I think he needs a bit more to help his Retribution and other sort of things.
I want to keep playing as him as a sub despite not fairing up well with him.
hopefully they give him more soon... i would love for him to be strong. i think him and vega really missed on out some buffs this patch
i wish vskill one could be done in the air
Gill had lower health and stun?????
I always felt like ch special moves should aply their element
Its ltg time
GTAB
Finalllyy
Why is the health and stun note at the beginning of the video
And uploading machine
Gill's hair, man. I know it's subjective, but the engine and the art style really didn't do the hair on any characters any favours
SFV’s art style is kinda bland, and a lot of animations are hit and miss in terms of quality (perhaps due to them relying so much on motion capture, compared to their hand animated FGs last gen), but them using physics for long hair rather than hand animating it really is its worst offender.
I get why they do it from a practical standpoint, as it’s definitely more cost effective, especially since they have so many costumes, and re-animating every frame for every costume that changes hairstyles to another long haired one just ends up being impractical and expensive. And it’s not like they didn’t do it for some characters in SFIV as well (though it was the ugliest part of that game, too). But ultimately, using hair physics for a fighting game just doesn’t look right, and is a huge contributor to this game looking more wack than it has to.
@@CrossfacePanda They got better at models and animations as the DLC went along, it's just that the art style and to some extent the engine really crippled what they could do. Most of the male characters have muscle structures that don't make sense and make their arms look like candy bars (seriously, Balrog has like five biceps per arm), and a lot of the early female characters looked more like animated dolls than like living things (R. Mika especially). I like SFV as a game but I hope they take the visuals in another direction for SF6 so the characters are more expressive.
Damn they did buff mah boy gill I didn’t know but still not godlike sadly
what lariat mean in SFV?
Gill literally has a move that is a lariat.
People complaining about Ryu getting too strong but LOOK AT THIS!!!
Baf can we be married at first sight?
So in other words he’s still horrible and bottoms 3 k cool
Imo gill is better but still not tourney viable
People who disregard Gill should watch some Nemo matches.
"People who disregard Gill should watch one of the best players in the world beat people who don't know the matchup, and completely disregard all his flaws and bad matchups."
What a stupid comment to make
bafael video drop, YEAH