BMX Frame Geometry | EXPLAINED
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ค. 2024
- BMX frame geometry can be a pretty intimidating topic to learn about for someone first starting out with riding.
In this video I cover every aspect of BMX frame geometry in a clear and concise way so that anyone can learn what all of these crazy numbers mean!
Once you've mastered frame geometry, learn about handlebar geometry next! - • BMX Handlebar Geometry...
This video would not have happened had it not have been for Kurt at BMX Union. Almost all of the information in this video is from an insight write up he put together all about BMX frame geometry.
bmxunion.com/blog/insight-bmx...
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#framegeometry #bmx #bmxgeometry
Dude, this is the BEST frame description ive ever seen !! Ive been killing myself trying to figure out what size I nned for a frame to ride flatland & a little street ( but mostly flatland ) ,you said most flatland frames are 18 " 19 " , but I'm '6 1" so I would probably need like a 20 or 21 " ? I'm guessing . or would a 18" or 19" be better, seems to me that would be to small , but more controllable , I don't know ..hmmmm , all these new school bikes have me confused, I'm 44 and been thinking about getting back into bmx ( when I say a little street , just mostly grinding and stuff, nothing to major, like I said mostly flatland
Thanks man! Honestly I’m not to sure about the answer to your question. I bet you could find it with a google search about flatland frame lengths.
I’m sorry that I can’t help more
my friends rides a 19.5 flatland frame and he is 6'1
however i also had a friend who did flantland on a 26 inch mtb with suspension disc brakes and pegs. he was like maybe 5'11 www.pinkbike.com/photo/2488414/
as well as a regular WTP street frame built up as a flatland bike.
this dude used to ride old school bikes as well. honestly for me it seems like any slightly smaller frame with a short rear end and steep headtube with a low standover is going to be decent for flatland.
oh another older rider i used to ride with road a 20inch kink frame for his flatland/park/street bike. he mostly did flatland and ramp though.
personal preference.
Jason Freeman Get that ! No matter what age but I think the Haro Matias frame is a little flat land street geometry.
I know your struggle man lol I'm 48 just getting back into it and it's been a major pain in the ass I've been through about 10 different bikes trying to find one that works for me
This played automatically after today's video. Never seen this video. Well done. You covered everything.
Thanks man!! Did my best on this one. I remember my legs and feet hurting so bad because I filmed it standing up. Big mistake. Haha
This is by far the best explanation of frame geometry I've found - not only on TH-cam, but the entire rest of the internet as well. Great job. You earned a well -deserved sub.
Had to go back and watch this one again. Awesome explanation.
u speak perfectly , i m french and i understand all
Awesome!! That’s so good to hear! I hope this video helped you
Thanks to this video, I made a well-information decision on my new frame. I always felt like the geometry of my bike wasn't right for me, but now I actually know. I'm going to this guy first from now on for informational bmx videos. Thank you for creating this video!
Hey it's super awesome to hear that the video helped you and thank you for all of the kind words!!!
Funny you mention the frames with the built in seat post. I was just talking about the Sunday Ian Schwartz frame with my friend. It had the post slammed into the frame which I didn’t like bc you couldn’t raise it. But this was also 10+ years ago when a lot more people were slamming their seat. And also where I used to work at Seattle Bike, they had that Sunday frame so I miss working there and getting to see all the incoming parts. They had the Deuce Deuce by Macneil which had a 22 inch top tube!
Its fun to think about all those crazy things that have been tried with BMX frames and parts throughout the years
Good stuff Brant! Just finished my S&M CCR build, and wow, quite a difference from my "return to bmx" bike, Fit Mac complete! I was aware of the geometry numbers(and took into consideration) but once I got to throw a leg over the new bike, I was kinda surprised, its a whole different beast! I also noticed how twitchy my fit felt riding the local bowl, so I'm stoked to now be on a bike that will be a lot more stable.
Had I not known about geometry, this would be a great video to understand and help in choosing a frame. Would recommend this to anyone that is seriously getting into riding.
Just wanted to say thanks for this video, it helped me choose my current bike. I'm 61 and have been riding since I was 26 and as I'm older I needed a bike that was easy to ride and that I felt safe on. I'd been riding a 2017 Wethepeople Atlas 24" which is a great bike but felt a bit too big for skatepark riding so needed to switch to a twenty inch. After watching your video I decided a trail bike might be my best bet so bought myself a Wethepeople Volta. I gotta say this bike more than makes up for my lack of skills and I feel rock steady riding it. Thanks again for the great advice.
Wow that is so awesome to hear!! Happy your found a bike that’s the right fit for you man and I hope it works out great!
Thanks Brant 👍 you just made an old '80s bmxer make sense out of all the modern day talk. I now have a clear idea of what bikes I should be looking at. Buying myself a bike for my 50th to get back into it as there's an amazing indoor park nearby, ramps I could only dream about in the 80s.
50 going on 15 again! WHOOP!!🤘😎
Heck yea!! Super awesome to hear! Thanks for watching and hopefully I’ll see you again in the comments.
What bike are you going to get?
@Brant_Moore
Thanks man, yes I'm here to stay! I love your channel and I'm hooked. You have such great content here which you always deliver in an intelligent and eloquent way. I discovered your channel when your vid regarding CBE popped up in my feed somehow. I was really impressed with your sensitivity on the matter and your sincerity in feeling the need to get it talked about really came across. Keep on keeping on!
As for which bike I'll be getting, I think I'll be gunning for a 22". The Verde Spectrum XL is standing out for me at the moment as it looks to be a good balance between quality and bang for buck (I'm 6ft 2" and in ok shape). I'm presently on a huge educational curve about what's what in the BMX world today, as I last rode bowls in 1992! (ridden rigid then hard tail MTBs since then which I love, but I've always looked at it through a BMXers eyes. I think in BMX!😄) Dude your channel is helping me so much and inspiring me which is very very much appreciated. Cheers! 👊
@Brant_Moore
Thanks bro. I only ride trails so you’ve helped me narrow down what bike I should get. You rock!
Hell yes! Happy to help man!!
dude this video was so helpful. Realy helped me pick the right frame.
Always happy to help!!! Thanks for watching and hopefully i'll see you in the comments again!
The soundwave v3 is by far the best frame I've ever owned. I can't wait until the v4
im thinking of building my next bmx so this has helped loads on deciding what geo to go for. im still unsure what i want but you have given me some good start points cheers.
Always happy to help! Thanks for being here man
Great explanation , thanks a lot 🎉
Excellent. A real help.
You explained everything really well thank you
Thank you! Hope it helped!
Dude thank you so much! Super informative
Yea man!!! I’m always happy to help!! Hope it does help you
Wow dude THANK YOU. Really appreciate the lesson! Keep making videos!
I’m always happy to help!! Doing my best to keep them going! About to export tomorrow’s video now. Consider subscribing so you can check it out man
Good video man! Just missed a few things. Gyro tab options, bottom bracket bearing size, Head tube bearing options, drop out axel size.
Awesome explanation Brant. Love this video.
Thanks Mark!! Hope it helped you!
Thanks for the awesome vid Brant! The only things you missed which weren't too massive but are worth a mention are chain stay grind plates like on the deco self titled frame and taller head tubes like on the s and m tallboy, Sunday excelsior and wtp frames
Thank you!
Dang it I did think about the taller head tubes but completely forgot to put it in there.
At least they arent huge things I missed! haha
Great help thanks .
Happy to help! Thanks for being here and watching the video
Excellent vid
Thanks so much for this!
Always happy to help when I can!
Awesome video man, thanks
Hope it helped man!! Thank you!
When you find a frame geometry that works, you just stick with it. My current frame is a Lairdframe and it's the best handling frame I've had since the first Fly Pantera frame I got in 2004. The geometry I currently run is probably 10 or 15 years ahead of what's coming out even now but it works. Otherwise, I wouldn't have been using the same frame for the past 8 years and if it ever breaks on me, my next frame is getting built with the same geometry I've been riding since 2015.
People definitely tend to do that. It’s funny though because I rode a complete bike im testing for the first time recently and it felt kinda good geometry wise honestly. It’s much more tech oriented geometry than what I ride normally which is just middle of the road normal geo that works good for everything.
I don’t know yet if I will make changed based on this but it’s interesting to think about
Thank you ~ very informative
Always happy to help!!
Superb delivery on a very informative topic. Props! Now who can help me choosing the geometry/dimensions on a 24” I’m planning to buy. Its general purpose will be “urban cruising”. I’ll probably switch out to thinner wheels and tires too.
Great Dude was very useful !!!
Thank you!
Hope it was useful enough to earn your subscription!
great video thanks.
Super informative stuff
Thank you! Always trying to help people learn
That was great brooo!
Wow I've never seen that little devil head tube badge, now I need one haha. Solid vid!
haha Oh man, good luck in finding one!! They only did 2 runs of 25 I think.
One of the last things they did before they went MIA again.
Thanks man!
Well said bro
This vid has helped me out a lot figuring out what frame to get, the one I've been using is for trails and tall people
Heck yea awesome to hear!!
What is the kind you have please ??
@@Bobcatspiritdude old or new one? My old one is the DK Four Pack, but I ended up getting the Bone Deth "Machine Frame" to replace it.
Thanks i can see your mechanic experience i love your style too lol
Thanks for the info man ride safe.
Thank you for watching! You ride safe too man. Hope to see you in the comments again!
I’m 40 and getting back into BMX for fun and exercise. Come to find out, there are a zillion more configurations available nowadays. This video explains those configurations very well and helped me decide which frame to go with. Thank you.
Glad to hear you're back into it man! And Im happy to have been able to help you a little bit in the journey!
One thing to note about this stuff is that ultimately you do get used to the bike you're riding, and you're going to want to be very used to your own bike, and then try other people's bikes, and figure out what you like about them, and that'll be how you really get a feel for what is your most ideal geometry. Gotta try dem bikes, y'all
Dude. Great info. Subbed.
THank you! Did my best. Glad it was useful for you! Thanks for subscribing as well!!!
Very informative. Thanks!
Thank you for watching! Hope my videos are helpful enough to have earned your subscription
@@Brant_Moore They are. subbed.
Thank you so much!!!
Excellent video and really well explained! Coming from MTB I knew some of them but interesting how it translates to BMX
Hey thank you! Awesome to hear that it helped you and welcome to BMX!
@Brant_Moore thanks! Although I did BMX when I was young, my first bike was a Haro Schredder 96 or something, so a lot has changed since then haha
Yea man bmx bikes have come a long way since 96! Haha
Headtube badges used to be a pretty standard thing on bikes in the 80;s and early 90's. then they just kinda died off for a while and made that comeback in the 2010's i think. just a little thing i remebered, my old schwinns and redlines always had fancy logo badges.
I love your vid. I'm sub'n!
Thank you so much! I hope it helped you out!
One of the most useful and educational pieces of BMX content on youtube. Thank you!
Thanks so much!!! I did my best on it! Glad to hear that it helped you out!! Hope it can earn your subscription!
Pls show videos difference on 20” trial bicycle frame and bmx frame measurement/geometry
What’s the difference between brake mounts on the chain stays/seat stays?
As always very informative videos,.. Thankz Bro´
Hey, thank you for watching!!!
Does anyone happen to know why gussets in most frames" tob and down tubes are not fully welded all around?
Thank you sm helped a lot but I wanna do more park riding but idk what frame I should get
There’s lots of options out there in that space. Modern street riding frame geometry also fits well for technical park riding too
Great video honestly, the only 2 thing I believe you missed was headtube types like integrated and push in cups. Also different bottom bracket types like Euro and Spanish which can affect what cranks you have to run..
Thank you!
I did miss a couple things, thanks for the input
What are the dimensions of pipe depth and diameter on the bottom bracket?
Well said bro
Thank you! Hope it helps
The redline John Purse 4130 big block is suitable for a kid?
well done.
Thank you!
At 6:46 wouldn't a steep head tube and seat angle make it feel closer? Slanted seat angle seems like it would make it feel longer.
what is the angle between standover and toptube? what is the angle between standover and bottomtube? angle between toptube and bottom tube? angle between chainstay and seatstay?
Absolutely no idea. It would depend on all the of other dimensions so it’s always going to be different
Seems legit. Good job.
Thanks man!
Ayyy Brant, I ride a skavenger bridge v2!! 🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻
That’s awesome! I rode that one for a while
I’ve been riding mine for six years now. Still going strong!
Wow thats crazy!!
Thanks man
Thank you for being here to watch it!
Hope it helped enough to earn your subscription
Is the geometry of BMX bike similar to that a folding bicycles?
I’m looking into getting my first bmx, I’ve chosen the kink whip when it comes back into stock but lately I’ve been debating building my own, could you do a pros and cons video on buying vs building, I know cost would be a big part but at the same time I feel it would be more sentimental if my first bike was hand built
That is a good idea that is a bit too complex to cover in just a comment so I’ll add it to my list, thanks!
What I will say now is that most of the time when you get a complete bike you end up replacing parts and making it your own anyway. So it might not start hand built in the same way, but you very quickly can start to make it hand built and your own
I like his vids.
Thank you!!!!
TardSquad stopping in for another great video 🤘🏻😎🤘🏻
Thank you! Whats TardSquad?
We ride motorcycles, gokarts, bmx, and everything in between. Check us out. Myself and Etard Adventures. ✌🏻
Hi, great vid! I'm currently writing my engineering diplomma which will compare modern dirt/trails geometry with typical street but I have a great problem finding some real trails frame with 21' TT and some classic street bike with longer seat tube and 21' TT too. May I ask you for help in finding nice example for both? they don't really need to be 21' TT, but I would need them to have the same length of the top tube :)
Can you copy and paste this to me on Instagram? It’s the same as my TH-cam name.
I’d gladly like to help if I can
for a street frame pretty sure the quan frame or a few S&M frames would do you.
also fairly certain S&M makes some trails frames in that size as well.
I had the same problem until I bought the s&m black bike.. I've tried the hoder btm frame and love that as well.
what would be the perfect geo for Street / Flat? 19.5 ish?
That is the go to for a few people I know. 19.5 is more flatland but regardless, you'll get used to it and it will work for anything you want!
I wanted to do a tailwhip but it figures out I had a frame (20.50 inches) that was too long for me (5.4 ft) and I should get a 18.50 or 19 inches frame
Whats a good frame thats 19 or 19.5 cuz i cant seem to find any 19's
Oh man that’s tough. I think S&M makes one called the Intrikut
Bro my Khe evo 0.3 came it came with the wrong parts "cheap stuff" i took it back the drop outs were drilled uneven and welded bent but.... I found a 2016 Fit Dugan 1 for $125 not a. Year old and bro are u from PA too?
Wow thats kinda crappy, that sucks. Hopefully the Dugan works well for you
Im not in PA. Ohio
anyone knows if it would make much difference for me (i`m 6ft2) to switch from a 20,5 inch frame to a 21 or 21,5 plus from a 9 inch bar to a 10... just wondering i feel way too tall for my bike, help
Generally longer frames fit taller people better and taller bars make you feel less haunches over. In theory it should help you not feel too tall for the bike
I'm 6'2" and I started on a 20.25 with 9"s and I went to 20.75 with 10"s and it made everything so much easier and I felt better on my bike.
I still want to go up another 1/4 or 1/2 inch though. I think I want to ride a perfect 21. The 21.25's I tried felt a little too big especially since I'm used to a smaller frame.
Can you please do a how to cut bmx forks
I’m 5’6-7 and I’ve always used my 21” I’ve noticed it’s too big but I’ve learned it looking for a new shorter bike cuz I feel like with me being small a smaller bike will help me progress more
It's definitely possible that it'll help you. Especially since you've been riding a 21 for a while already
I'm 6 foot 1 what top tube length frame should I get? (Sorry for bad English)
21” is normal
Hey I will be riding a lot of pump & jump tracks , I’m about 5’8 ! :S what would ur preference be?
There are trails orientated frames out there. Longer rear ends with mellower top tubes
@Brant_Moore trail frames I’m looking at are atleast 21” top tube ! Do many pros my height ride this size ? Some people are telling me it’s preferable some tell me it’s to big 😂🙃
I’m 5’10 and lanky. I ride park and street. I love manuals and have been meaning to improve my whips and bars. I’m wondering if I want 20.75 or 21...
20.75
how to measure height of bottom bracket? from the ground or?
From the ground to the center of the bottom bracket
@Brant_Moore thanks man.
You got it!! Thank you for being here
I'm 5'7 my friends tell me that my bike is too short for me, the size of the top tube is 20" and the seat tube is 8" is it too short? Or it is exact on my height. Thankyou!
It depends on what you like to do and if you’re comfortable on it. Try other bikes the are longer. If they feel better than your bike and you get back on yours and it feels too short, then maybe it is. It’s 100% up to your personal preference and what is comfortable to you
Thankyou sir from🇵🇭 nice content!!!
Yo, I'm 6'4 and skinny. What size frame would you recommend?
21.5 or 21.8
Why did some frames have angled seat tube at the top
Hmmm I’m not sure what you mean
@@Brant_Moore like on your frame the where the sest goes into is slit sideways at the top
Idk if you remember me but i have different youtube a accounts a d i figured id suscribe to u with all of them 😁
Thats awesome, thank you so much!
Can u do a video on how to go higher off of jumps
I can try to in the future for sure
@Brant_Moore yah that would be sick
Guys im newbie, how can i identify an integrated frame? all of the people i ask told me to have and integrated frame. planning to build
Look at where the headset bearings go in. If the frame itself is made for the bearings to sit in it it’s integrated. The other kind requires cups to be pressed into the frame you can very easily tell that they’re there.
Id guess that 99% of aftermarket frames are integrated
@Brant_Moore thankyousomuch man! now i am enlightened, i've searched a lot but couldn't get the answer that i can understand, but i do now thanks to u! God bless you man staysafe
Always happy to help man!!!!
As a beginner, which geometry would be best to learn Bunny Hop and manual? Which Chain stay?
I feel like geometry doesn’t matter quite as much for someone who is just starting out unless it’s some kind of race bike or something that has an extremely long frame/chainstay. Any complete freestyle bike you buy will have geometry that you’ll get used to as you learn and determine what works best for you
@@Brant_Moore Thanks mate for your opinion 👌
@@Brant_Moorethank you for that. I also had a similar question. New to bmx and have a nice bike with a 21 TT and 12.5 chainstay. I’m 5’11 and wondering will I always feel like I’m looping out on bunny hops or is it technique? I feel like it’s likely my errors and not the bike :)
@andrewstrobert5840 The bike could be helping that happen a bit but it’s not something that you won’t get used to over time.
And if it doesn’t get any better after months and months, or if you really don’t like it after trying to get used to it..maybe then I’d consider a different frame
Thanks. I am yet to give months of practice. I’ll keep at it and see how it goes. If I don’t get used to it, I have the ability to switch it with my brother for a kink whip xl. Same top tube but longer chainstay. Thanks for the insight, at this point I think I need more practice in general. I’m a newbie to Bmx coming from mtb and gravel. Riding with my kid, so I’m determined to learn 👍
I bought this bike on line. Can you tell me who makes this frame by looking at the geometry?
Probably not, a lot of companies make a huge variety of different geometries. There’s BMX Facebook groups where you can post pictures of different features of it and someone might know.
Not sure if you said this or someone in the comments did, some chainstays are so short that you can't put a large sprocket such as a 30t for example on.
That is a good point. So easy to miss small things like that in a huge topic like this
Can you do a how to setup straight cable brake setups and how to adjust springs properly
I just go to my local shop. Bike worx to get the cable cut or springs properly setup
I have a video of how to adjust springs. Its in my tuesday tips and tricks playlist.
When it comes to a straight cable its pretty straight forward but I could make one one day.
@Brant_Moore oh yeah I watched the spring tension how to but you should definitely do a how to adjust pads properly
Missed out on the black hole drop outs, my wtf frame has it and it’s so annoying putting wheels in! It’s also very weird as it’s meant to be a street frame but has a long chain stay, low bb height and a 75.5 head tube angle. All the opposite
What’s a black hole drop out? I don’t even know that one. Haha
@@Brant_Moore If you look up S&M WTF Frame you'll see them, they're enclosed dropouts so they're not an open ended slot.
Ohhhhh okay I know what you’re talking about. Female only
How tall is everyone and what top length are you running?
5’ 10” and a 21”
6'4 and a 21''
You DID however forget about wtp and stranger doing the hydro form headtube but it’s ok not many are doing it
Love your vids no matter what been watching you on insta for years haha
Haha yea i forgot a couple different things. Its tough when talking about such specific things.
Thanks though man, really appreciate it
If at all possible , I recommend riding many different bikes to get a solid idea of what works for you .
You find a bike that rides perfect , just check the geometry and then buy that bad boy and build er up !!
That's definitely the cheapest and best way to do it!
I quit riding for a good 5 yrs while i concentrated on my career.. tried getting back into it bought a bike with a 12.75 chainstay... hehe im scared of that bike now. Loops for days.
I know i’m late to the party, but any frame builders in here? Is there a good tool I can buy to help me measure the angles of all my tubes when fabricating? I’ve been trying to get into building frames and can’t seem to find any pages/forums to do research on.
Message John Corts on instagram!
@@Brant_Moore Will do, Appreciate it man!!
how many tt framr if i tall 180cm
It's your preference
I'm 5'8 what size do you recommend me
I’m 5’8 I’m going for a 21”
I’m riding dirt jumps tho
Great video, but noticed that you mention tyre height. Having larger tyres raises the whole bike like you pointed out, but it doesn't have an effect on handling as the distance from BB to axle line is fixed. Tyre height isn't worth mentioning in a video about geometry. I'm just pointing this out so kids don't rush out to buy new tyres to change BB height :) There is no way to change BB height in correlation to your axles unless you had a frame with vertical dropouts.
Thanks for putting that out there!
And in a nice informative way too.
Much appreciated man!
@@Brant_Moore I think the confusion is because it's measured from the centre of the BB to the ground, which assumes a fixed tyre height, which isn't a problem; people just compare those distances from frame to frame. If they measured from the centre of the BB to the axle line (which is the important change that affects handling) it wouldn't be as confusing. The distance from the ground makes no difference other than making you higher up or lower down. Sure, if you have a fat high tyre on the front and a slimmer low tyre on the rear, your whole bike angle gets adjusted a small fraction but geometry is the same. BMX Racers use slimmer rear for less weight and park use a slimmer rear for easier whips, I assume.
You're absolutely right and it makes perfect sense. I wonder why they don't measure it to the center of the axle
The placebo affect is real when it comes to parts and geometry thats for sure
I'm assuming because on bigger wheeled bikes, the measurement is called 'BB Drop' (distance from centre BB to axle-line) and since the BB on 20" BMX bikes is always higher, that name isn't apt, so instead of calling it 'BB Rise' or something equally as apt, manufacturers decided on measuring to the ground.
Normally it’s listed as BB Height on BMX frame specs so it does work for what you’re explaining
U missed bottom bracket sizes lol but thank you for this video
I'm 5.2 feet tall,what frame do you recommend me to buy?thanks
What type of riding do you like to do?
@@Brant_Moore street .
@@Brant_Moore actualy I had a fit frame Ben Lewis frame 20 tt and 13 rnd but I felt it a little to big,and I'm looking for a help to get the right frame this time,thanks for you help,cool vids👍
There’s not too many frames that go below 20”, but I believe S&M makes one. You could also look into a stem with less reach. The more reach the further out your bars are as well
@@Brant_Moore thanks for your help👍✋
The bottom bracket height thing threw me when he talked about axle to axle wheel base. The way I understand it, it's basically just a measurement from the bottom of the tires to the center of the bottom bracket which wouldn't have anything to do with the wheelbase.
Will this be to small for a 5'6" girl?
Head tube badges aren't anything new. Decades and decades ago Schwinn had badges for their bikes.
It’s new that they’re common within BMX. That’s super awesome though
You have to admit that a badge is not very common. Daylight bmx frames also has a head tube badge. My 1986 Schwinn cruiser too.
I stick to my 98 Dyno Nsx 4130 even if it has no book value its a perfect bike for general purposes