Abandoned Golf Course - IS THERE A EPIDEMIC IN GOLF ?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ต.ค. 2024
- so golfmates in todays video i play Abandoned Golf Course - AND IS IS THERE A EPIDEMIC IN GOLF
TO MANY GOLF COURSES ARE CLOSING DOWN
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ABOUT ME:
I’m Liam Harrison, Bolton born and bred. I’m a lover of Golf, life and laughter.
Started Golf 12 years ago after packing in football when i was 28 due to a back injury.
I started the TH-cam channel as a laugh and a Wim, to make me practice but that went out the window as i started vlogging, loving being on camera but more so the interaction with my #golfmates.
In 14 months i have seen the channel evolve and become the only real golf community on TH-cam which i am extremly proud of.
I would like to thank all the #golfmates that have been with us and supported us and the channel from the start. Also not forgetting our new #golfmates that may have only just come across the channel.
This was my club. Had a secretary that took out loans and run it into the ground. We loved this club, the banter was amazing and there was no snobbish behaviour. best lads ever here
Reasons there closing is easy..
I started playing golf only 4 years ago.
I'm now on my 3rd club, reason is my previous 2 clubs did not look after new members.. Old timers are ignorant and treat you like shite.
Dead right that. Joined a club in Australia (won't mention the name), which had an option to bring a guest at half price green fees. I brought my father in law out 3-4 times as he was keen on getting back into the sport and wanted to see how he got on getting back into it. The club president (one of those old timers you mentioned) said I was abusing the guest option and told me to stop it or my membership would be revoked. Told them to cancel my membership. Some of these old timers are destroying the sport for the next generation. My father in law was that disgusted that he gave away getting back into the sport.
Must be a strange experience walking the dog and stumbling on to a bloke that plays golf in the middle of nowhere and singing into his grip :-D.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Our course almost closed down a couple of years ago. Luckily we voted in a new Executive with great business experience and we were able to workout a service agreement with our local municipality. We also hired a great general manager/pro, who has great ideas. Coupled with a local economic boom and we're in better shape now than we ever have been. Btw our club also has a curling rink attached to the clubhouse for year round use.
Love the games. We definitely need to adjust to the modern golf market.
I’m 29 years old and have only taken up the game this year. What held me back??
-The cost of starting up. Know what kit to buy and membership cost/joining fee.
-Worried about the rules/etiquette (including dress codes) if I was to break them without realising I had, how would I be viewed?
-The big reason though was the how unwelcome you can be made to feel by some members. Mainly the older generation who feel like they own the club. My age group 29-40yrs old are the future for many of these clubs. It’s not hard when you see a new member in the clubhouse to have a chat and invite them to your table for a pint and chat about their round. A little gesture like that would certainly help the sport.
couldn't agree more!! im 27 and in a similar situation to yourself..
Im 33 and yeah also happens sometimes
Same here. Some ridiculous rules eg. no camouflage shorts!.... Why! Shirts to be tuck in! oh, unless you are female. A very very expensive sport for beginners.
I'm 42 and have been playing on and off since the age of 13. The main things that prevent me playing a few of the courses local to me are MASSIVE membership fees and the silly rules regarding apparel ("must be RECOGNISED golf wear" apparently which I find horrifically uncomfortable - I prefer looser clothing on my slightly overly plump frame and cannot wear normal shoes due to an ankle injury, I have to wear boots to support it and they don't make those for playing golf).
I'm glad to say the one nearest to me isn't so "stuck up" and has members that assist in the upkeep of the course (they'll be working hard over the winter to get it set for next year and are very much appreciated by all). They're ALWAYS busy dispite being one of about 6 courses within 20 miles of my home and that's great to see, there was barely a space on the driving range today!
For me, the reasons I dont go are,
1- Time, 4 hours plus for a round.
2 - Money, too expensive to do regularly.
Great video, gets you thinking.
My reasons are...
1... Badly run
2... Afraid to move with times
3... To cliquey and looking down noses at new members
That last one is the nail in the coffin. I live in a small town area of 3 courses within about 15 miles for about 7,000 people in the few small towns and rural areas, and one is basically closed. They have 2 people on staff, no food, only a handful of beer options, it's barebones and not well maintained at all. The other, is well maintained, but it's really hilly and tough course, but it's like you said, the clientele is so cliquey you play there once and never want to go back. The third, is maintained, ok. In the height of summer and the grass doesn't grow as fast, it's great, but if it rains a lot they can't keep on top of it as well, but it's such a laid back environment. All the league guys are so cool, they're just there have a few beers what talking shit with their mates and knocking golf balls around. It feels like you're Norm from Cheers when you walk into the clubhouse literally lol. It's just a fun chilled out environment, which is what small town/rural area Midwest is like in every other aspect, so when you get those uppity ones at the course who when you walk in the clubhouse it feels like a ghost just walked through the door, sooner or later you will slowly die. Reputation is everything, but it happens slowly so it can be hard to worry about that when you're struggling with the day-to-day finances of a struggling club. Sorry for the length lol.
Add too costly to join and I totally agree with you!
Reason why - 5 clubs so close together . Unfortunately the better clubs will survive 😔
@@jtmoney841 Also, for members only clubs, who wants to join a club on a course you've never played? I'd want to play a course atleast 3-5 or so times before I commit to a membership. Because it's like you said, it's not exactly cheap, I want to make sure I'm making a good choice lol.
@@djjazzyjeff1232 I have it's a great course just costs a fortune to play not as a member twilight is $65
Was down driving range and over heard 2 young lads saying they would like to start playing but don't no how to even go about getting on a golf course think unless you no someone else who plays can be a very hard sport to get involved in especially some of the members at courses who don't exactly make it a welcoming environment for the younger generation trying to get into the sport ! So maybe more relaxed 9 hole courses aimed more at beginners to fill the gap between driving range and a full round
Totally agree re management, a good business manager knows you can't live on the memories of yesteryear and the full book of tee-off times that you had in the 70s and 80s, you need "X" pounds in the till every month to survive. So may clubs are run by people that have no business skills, they're just a band of the longest serving members and out of their depth.
However, fundamantally there just doesn't seem to be the required numbers of new players taking up the game and it's my opinion that this is in no small part due to the almost total lack of golf on Freeview TV. Is it a coincidence that when golf courses were busy we had "A Round With Allis", "Pro-Celeb Golf", and don't get me started on The R&A selling The Open coverage rights to SKY. There was a golf prog on every week.
Think that’s the problem Andy, they run courses on memberships and, when they fall off, it’s such a big hit. Little and often, bit like the playmore thing. Get people into big comps the more they play, incentivise players to play. Keep the course busy on weekend afternoons, like cheap society days. Find society’s and market to them, do deals with local clubhouses, even start TH-cam channels like Liam’s - that “why is he getting a free buggy” thing is exactly the problem. They don’t treat it like a business, they still think along the ‘build it and they will come’ line, it’s BS! You gotta go out and find the business and drag it in. And then keep them. With holes like that 2nd there’s no way that course should have gone out of business, simple as.
I think it is time for management to understand whom is doing a favor for whom. We have had several less prestigious courses go under and part of the reason is the land is prime and it is so tempting to cash in! So you play the 9 hole courses out of town and it can get crouded and many are not as well maintained. One I play has an oil field pump jack right in the middle of the 1st fairway! But it is part of the esthetics of the Rural Texas Course! The one in the TH-cam looked majestic at one time.
you played 5 golf clubs that shut down, think you're a bit of a jinx Liam :)
Love the video Liam
I find the price of equipment and the cost for membership can deter people from playing.
I live within 1km of probably the best course in the area but can not afford the membership so i travel 1/2 an hour to a club I can
How much are memberships where you live? About 90 a month in my area
1) in Arizona they overbuilt.
2) many courses are too hard for the average golfer. Only 10% of golfer shoot under 100.
3) make more par 3 courses.
4) baby boomers are dying out and millennials are too busy on their phones and social media to put in the effort.
5) it takes practice to even be decent and more recent generations are instant gratification junkies.
6) golf can be very slow. A) I play at off peak times B) sometimes I want to play 9 holes and many courses do not have a 9 hole price.
7) start up costs are high. I started playing later in life. If I were young there is no way I could have afford clubs or green fees. Club makers this is on you.
8) the sport was oversold when Tiger was dominating. It will survive but it will be smaller.
9) water is getting expensive.
10) the world is overpopulated and developers make more money on housing.
I agree with most points and am sure that point 4 and 5 are the main reasons.
I'm gonna be unpopular for saying this but you asked the question. Nearly 10 years of austerity. I'm a working class man, all my mates are. When times get tough, sadly luxuries like a golf membership are are just that, a luxury. Maybe there is are too many clubs in too many areas. It comes down to survival of the fittest. I also agree with your point about relaxing the rules to get more kids involved. There the future of the game. I'm in the southside of Glasgow, I can count about 10-12 golf clubs in a 5mile radius from my house. It's many complex issues without easy answer's.
Great video for raising awareness Liam, #Golfmates
There are a number of reasons
1. There was a boom in the 80s to 90s and many new clubs. Farm land was not giving good returns and many farmers either sold the land or swapped to golf. There were new golfers that joined these so some older clubs missed out on new members.
2. The financial crash in 2008 meant wages did not rise and many lost jobs.
3. Leisure is the first cost to be cut when you have less cash
4. This is a rebalancing of the boom
5. Young people, new to work cannot afford membership for a year and there are many other things that take their interest whereas many had spare cash in the 80s. Many play in societies and get out, say, once a month.
6. Golf is not that is always on television or news as football is.
I can see more clubs closing. In my area there is an old club, founded in the 1890s and one founded in the 90s and both are getting fewer members and visitors. Habberley GC ( 9 hole and founded in 1924) closed in 2017. That lost members to the 4 new courses that were started in the 90s. One of which , has also closed.
This type of winter won't help either.
spot on Liam, most clubs with stuck up members committees will eventually die out ,
golf courses need evolve with the times !
Lee Clift think you’ve hit the nail on the head their mate. Even if I’m dressed really smartly when I play with my friend at minchinhampton golf course I feel really uncomfortable there to be honest.
Alfie, i've had the same at a few courses, if youre not one of the old school or a member you dont seem to be welcomed, sad really
Heartbreaking. But it's a simple question of supply and demand probably. When I started in the mid 70s the game was niche and exclusive. In the 90s there was a big expansion. Thank you Seve, TV coverage, The Ryder Cup and then Tiger. I guess it expanded too quickly. In a world where lots of things have become more accessible golf has to compete for people's loyalty. With costs of equipment and course maintenance maybe the game is just finding its place in a very competitive market.
I just taken up golf this year 😂 and clubs do make it hard for new members. Gotta dress right. Have to have the correct shoes. Older members don’t like change!!!! And like you sad Liam they run the clubs. You are right golf in the uk needs to change so it survives. Great video Aabsolutely golf club shut its doors this year
Spot on
Phil Lewis That sounds like a decent deal.
Where I live in Australia, most country courses are operated by unpaid volunteers. Some have a greenkeeper for one or two days per week (shared with other courses). Generally these are courses in smaller communities. I am a member of two of these courses. They are wonderful courses with welcoming friendly members. Only courses in larger communities with 10000 plus population have paid employees.
Maybe courses in Great Britain could run on the same basis - much like cooperatives. Facilities in small communities do not need to close down when there are committed, and cooperative members. Band together, buy the place, run it cooperatively.
I watched one of your videos where the members bought the club. Maybe this is the model for the future.
I love what you're doing Liam. Power to you, golfmate!
Lindsay McIntyre
Cootamundra, New Soth Wales, Australia
I reckon in england theres a few things that drive courses to close, just got my membership renewal at £690
The old Guard in the club house looking down their noses at newcomers.
Out of date dress codes
Most folk can only really get out and weekends and most weekends theres comps on so you cant just have a relaxing round .
Just my opinions
This ^
Exactly , the golf culture has to change . Women are not welcomed , many golf courses don't allow walkers . etc .
New golf club opened two year ago in Essex. An inland links will driving range, 9 hole par 3 and gym.called ingerbourne links
@@johnleighton5174 thats the future, 9 holes and other facilities on site
This golf video is very much needed. Here in the hills of Huntington, West Virginia in the USA we had a course that was as old as the one in your video. It was called Spring Valley Golf & Country Club. It was the host of the very first West Virginia State Open. It hosted the our state amateur tournament for many a year. My uncle was a long time member and the board of directors just closed it. Sad that history is being lost. Thanks for the video.
For me that’s one of your best videos pal. Urban Exploration is a TH-cam trend where abandoned places are shown and maybe a bit of history as to why they’re left to rot. Albeit it sad that the course couldn’t survive it’s amazing to see how quick nature claims stuff back.
I heard a whisper that Newcastle United Golf Course is struggling. Hopefully not.
Again great video Liam lad.
Don't suppose Ashley is involved with that. Passed it many times. Get some of his over payed players to put their hands in
their pockets, bet they play at Slaley Hall, Close House, Ponteland etc; Lots of courses around Newcastle could be the problem but none as central as that one.
@@GolfMates Struth-Hope BWFC dosent have a golf course..(7-1 ho ho ho :) )
Very sad to see it close. One on my favorite courses here in the USA Georgia The Pines closed a few years ago
There seems to a wave of closings here in the states too. The first course I ever played was an executive called the Golden Wedge. It closed down years ago, which I knew about but that knowledge still couldn't prepare me for the time I drove down there to see it's all part of an industrial complex now. As well as I could work out, the area that used to be #8, which I aced in my second week playing (luckiest/greatest 8i shot of all time :P), is now part of paved parking lot or just inside a warehouse. That was kind of hard to take in.
Yes Colin Scott! I live in Cincinnati and I know of 5 Courses that have shut down within 20 miles of my home. There's probably a few closings that I'm unaware of. It's sad! They claim the Economy is Great, Unemployment at it's lowest in 60 years, lowest minority unemployment EVER, etc. Yet Golf Courses continue to close? Many of them are top notch courses. Something isn't right?
I came here to comment the same thing. Shawnee Lookout, (really kind of a crumby course) Crooked Tree, (Nice but difficult for average golfers) Greenhills Par 3, (build in the green belt community under the new deal in the 1930s) and the one that breaks my heart the most is 36 hole Gem Weatherwax. Also Deer run country club, hillview, hidden creek. Sadly most are being turned into large housing division's.
Hi Liam I was a member here and started to learn to play at fishwick Hall- a combination of constant flooding from the river on holes 2-10, members became disillusioned with rising costs of membership without noticeable improvements. In 2000 the Millennium Wheel path opened which followed the river around the bottom half of the course and there were constant trespassers on the course using it as a cut through from the local estates to the river. Finally financial mismanagement and s drastic loss of members led to its closure and sale, which was bought by a local developer who planned to build housing on the higher back 9 holes. Such as shame because the members were brilliant and we've all ended up scattering to other local clubs - eg Preston, Penwortham, Ashton & Lea, Pleasington and Leyland
Ingol Golf Club also in Preston closed about 2 or 3 years before fishwick too, so Preston has lost 2 clubs in a very close period of time
I see a perfect location for the first Golfmates golfclub!!
Mmmmm kay😆
I didnt see your comment. I just said exact the thing
Mr Mackey My thoughts exactly!
What a suggestion you could make it the Mecca for societies also. Liam Get The De Vere Club or play more golf interested.
Ideal location for the Golf mates Open championship..
One of the most enjoyable videos to date & very thought provoking. I'm in the USA near Washington DC but I vacation often in Mrytle Beach, South Carolina. They bill themselves as the golf capital of the world. I've going there since 1974 when they had about 40 golf courses and now have over 100 but over half of the originals were close for housing because of proximity to the coast/beach. It's sad to see some of the originals go (so many memories with my deceased dad & 2 deceased friends) but at least they were replaced much further inland. Housing seems to be a big issue in closings overall in the USA & most are daily fee courses not country clubs. There are many courses run by cities, counties & regional parks that aren't going anywhere. Thanks again for bringing this issue to light, thank you GolfMate
Liam grew up round there. Fishwick is neighboured by one of the roughest council estate in Preston,(callon). Very wet as well due to the river.
When it came to joining a club the choice was Fishwick now closed, charnock Richard closed and re opened I believe, penwortham, leyland.ashton and lea, ingol and Preston. A lot of courses in a small area. As one falls the other become stronger.
Hi Liam.
JB from the north of Scotland.
I have been a member of my club which is Garmouth and Kingston since I was 12 so 13 years and its potentially looking at closing. Due to it being next to the river spey, we have lost part of the course unfortunately. This resulted in losing members. Also the lack of members means no money and now the staff are having to work voluntary. It's just a shame as the course has been part of my life and was hoping to see my little boy play there sometime. Fingers crossed we at Garmouth and Kingston golf club can stay open. Keep up the good work Liam 👍
Jesus that was like a dark 1980's BBC2 documentary !
I thought Arthur Scargill was going to turn up in Ford Cortina at the end 😜
On a serious note just shows how much it must cost to keep a golf club maintained! If there's not enough revenue coming in they just cant survive! #toughtimes
Lol
No sadder sight than that of a closed down, abandoned golf course.
Golf clubs need to be more welcoming and be a part of the local community. Too many of them behave like a masonic lodge. Golf is expensive and time consuming and there is a lot of competition for people's money and time in other areas and sports. We have to persuade new players that it's a fantastic sport that is worth the effort and cost and I think that you, Liam, are helping massively in this regard. Keep up the good work, fella!
Bang on the money there pal
Beat me to it Liam - I was just going to do a video about three courses that I’ve played locally that have closed in 2019. Sod it, I’ll still do it just to amplify your message. And you’re right, never seen a golf course open (apart from one that got moved from its old site due to development).
Great video by the way, something a bit different 🙂
There’s a lot of courses you’ve either played or been a member of that have shut. Please don’t come to the Wrekin 😂😂
The Harrison effect
Nice little course The Wrekin, leave it well alone Liam and Market Drayton too. A course near me closed recently called Brookfields in Nantwich. Don't think they were making much money and the owner decided to sell to a private developer. Shame it was a decent course which would have been really nice with more time.
@@mickbarrett3498 Like the 'butterfly effect' but with Pings! 😂
Wow, I was shocked to hear that long list of shut down courses. I live north of Seattle, US, and the only course i'm aware of near me that was shut down is Kayak Point. I never went there because it was too expensive. The courses near me that have more reasonable prices were much busier this past summer. I live on hole 14 at Gleneagle Golf Course and I used to be able to sneak out at dusk to get some practice. This past summer was so busy that there were always golfers playing even past dusk so I couldn't sneak out any more.
Hi Liam, I am a big fan have been watching your videos for some time now. I can't necessarily speak about up north but down south in Berkshire the gold clubs seem to be slowly closing and it's more of a housing issue from what I can gather. Being so close to London the house prises are outrageous and so a common theme by me is golf courses being purchased and used to build houses. From my experience this is a massive shame as at 22 years old I find that most of my friends are interested in golf which suggests the sport is growing as you have said, however other demands in society seem to take a priority which is a massive shame. Many thanks to you and OMP for peaking my interest in the sport. I will be a fan for many years to come.
This is my 2nd comment on this vid !! And another thing, I played Fleetwood this summer. It cost £40 during the week so not expensive but not cheap either. A member and his guess pushed in front of me on the first tee and kept me behind the whole 18 holes. It was awful, slow and annoying. Now I know he part owns the club but his membership is only a few hundred on a great links course and their model is to let visitors on to subsidise their reduced membership so why piss off the visitors. Its a lovely course, very enjoyable to play and I've played it twice and loved it. Will I go back ? No, they don't want me there so I'll go elsewhere where they do want me and value me. That person is an idiot who doesn't want to pay the true cost of playing at his club yet fails to appreciate the help others offer him to afford his top class golf course. The North Wales courses are so much better at that, Prestatyn and North Wales golf club have always been very welcoming so anyone from the NW who wants good winter golf then head off to these 2 links course.
I do think your onto something Liam, i know alot of people who love going to the local pitch and putt because they love having a knock around but when i ask them to play on full course they say no because they dont have golf shoes or right clothes and the age old stereotype of clubs being full of snobs who look down on people really outs people off. It needs a pro who plays in hoodies and trainers who is covered in tattoos to bring golfs image into this century. People love golf but dont like the reputation it has.
Hi Liam, I have shared this video to our course manager. Absolutely spot on. I am Captain of Largs Golf Club in Ayrshire so I am fully aware of the problems facing members golf clubs. Committees come and go. Opinions change. You are dead right with the club manager we have one who is fully qualified. Ps Love your content.
As a PGA pro in NZ for over 30 years I have seen a decline in the number of memberships. A few courses have sadly closed and many are just hanging in there. I don't however think that there are less golfers overall. I just think that there's been a big shift away from committing to memberships both financially and time wise. Clubs however don't do themselves (or their members) any favours by offering cheap green fee deals. It undermines the value of the membership. People are opting for flexibility. Here's a question for you. As I previously lived in the UK, I realise that there is quite a distinction and difference between the private and public golf. If courses on the verge of closure rebranded themselves as public, do you think they'd have a greater chance of surviving? Food for thought?
We lost Riverlands Golf Course Milperra inn Sydney Australia about 3 years ago no it was a wonderful course that run by the George’s River.
If there’s a sign in the car park saying no changing of shoes allowed then there’s your problem.
I heard that originally this rule was introduced to avoid members breaking spikes in the car park - so for practical reasons. Not saying you are wrong though #justsayin
Liam, for what it’s worth. I’ve recently started playing golf after stopping for 20 years. I work away from home during the week but my local club are not interested in a weekend membership. Clubs have got to find a way to get more members in.
I also think more 9 hole courses would be beneficial. When I play with my father-in-law he really only wants 9 or 12 holes. He can’t be the only one like that.
Keep up the good work.
There are loads of reasons why golf clubs close
1. Elderly members fill clubs. They pay their subs but rarely spend anything in pro-shop, restaurants or bar. (This isn't criticism just how it is as many pensioners don't have a lot of spare £)
2. Discounts online and at golf superstores means the pro shop only sells mars bars and a few bits and pieces
3. Younger players (who work) who might spend in the clubhouse have to play at weekends and can't do 5-6 hour rounds. This comes from the PGA- players should be on a timer and be penalised for slow play
4. Land much more valuable for housing
5. Older members don't want change but the next generation of players want different things from their leisure activities
Clubs need to change to entice families and younger members otherwise they will go bust.
The most successful TH-cam golf channels (aside from the stat driven product reviewers) are focused on making golf fun with challenges and humour - that has to be the future
Great channel - golf should be fun!
Iain Brown everything you say is true.
I live in Preston. Hubby and I weren't members but played here quite often. We played the course 2 days before they closed and no one said a word. We were gutted, it was a beautiful course and we were always made to feel welcome.and......erm tes I pinch hubby's razor lol
I have heard that too many were built in the 70’s, 80’s and 90’s in the UK and not enough golfers to go around
Very true.
I agree with the nine hole comment. I was on a greens committe for 15 years and it is expensive to maintain a golf course. Gary Player said 12 holes was the optimum size course for the average golfer.?????
Such a shame that a lot of clubs are shutting down, I live in Scotland and it seems the game is as strong as ever, I’m a member at Loch Lomond and the waiting list is massive I just hope another Tiger Woods comes along soon and encourages the youngsters to take up this brilliant game.
Every glasgow municipal course is closed and Loch lomond fee could buy a house
what do you think Covid-19 impact will have on clubs now? can you do a video on whether clubs should suspend membership fees for the moment? love your videos
Golfs not dying it's the prices I think for membership....rounds....they've got to move on with the times...my opinion like
Golf prices are high and membership to clubs are insane. Nice course here in NC membership is 4500.00 a year. But u still have to pay 12 bucks every round for cart fee
When you need a loan for a set of clubs and need to make 6 figures to afford a membership it will start to die
Yes, and some of that is bad management. Most costs associated with a golf course are fixed, so it doesn't change if you have 10 people playing or 200 people playing. If you can only get 50 people a day at $55.00/player, perhaps you could get 100 or more people at $40.00 / player... which would you choose if you owned or ran a golf course? If people aren't playing, they also aren't paying!
Ian Henderson defo mate. Totally agree
Ian Henderson partly true but membership for juniors is still cheap, but would they want to play with miserable (not all) seniors
Same over here in Australia Liam. A number of courses have closed due to the cost of upkeep getting more expensive by the year. I am at Bribie Island Golf Club in Queensland which is a great course with plenty of members. The club diversifies with weddings and other functions that help towards the running costs and helps offset the fees for members. We are lucky as Bribie Island is a place that lots of retired people live and both men and ladies comps are virtually fully booked each week. Golf alone will not sustain a club unless the fees are excessive, like all businesses a club must look for extra income to balance the books.
I’d like also say I’m a shift worker. Very common these days. I work hard I get to play less than twice a month. Full membership is not viable. Clubs need to come up with more flexible memberships.
Totally agree with this
Definitely this...
For people who cant afford or justify the cost of a full 7 day membership the other options are still expensive and most mean no weekend golf.
Hahahahaha you do make me laugh when you clought a gooden and run for the camera. Haha 😂😅🤣💖🙏⛳️🏌🏻♂️
Sad to see, I was a member of Fishwick in the 90's. Lovely club very friendly and welcoming. Golf did take a major dive after the 2008 financial crash. The clubs in my area had 2 year waiting lists, now you can join them immediately, no joining fees.
@@GolfMates Lots of golf clubs around the Preston / Leyland area. Unfortunately my golfing days are now over, but I do miss it.
I was a member at fishwick 1996 - 2001 ..was a great club,brought a tear to my eye when it closed..
Colin Cross was one of the best players I ever played with..Club Champ many times.
I’m a younger golfer and have no interested in joining a club I just player wherever I want with my mates. There’s a place called Morley Hayes in Derbyshire that’s more of a facility. Restaurants, bars, wedding but has a driving range which a lot of people who never touch a course use. 9 hole course and a really good 18 course for £30. Not a traditional members course either. That’s the future of golf
Great vid Liam like you said heaton park gc, william wroe gc,boysnope gc, all closed in Manchester 2019 all sold to property developers its not looking good for the future tbh
@@GolfMates yh its a real shame a local club in Rochdale called Marland gc is setting a great example on how to adjust a club to the times by relaxing their etiquette on dress code and lowering the green fees its worked a treat for them so like you said the small clubs might have to start looking at going down this route its nearly 2020 after all 🏌🏻♂️⛳🎯👍
Ian Brooks .... And they’ve got a really knowledgable Green Keeper helping turn that corner..
Good luck to them👍🏻👍🏻😁😁
Great video, as a point I think very few clubs are immune from closure in the current economic State (those with long golfing history). I would say as you said bad management and the abundance of choice makes the reduction of courses inevitable.
I think committee's and committee members are a lot of the problem.
I was on our local clubs committee a short time ago, until I resigned for multiple reasons. At 42, I was the youngest committee member, and their actual words were that 'They see me as a junior club member'. I also submitted a 4 page, 15 item suggestion package to future proof the club and course, ideas to get more people playing as well as ways to get more money through the club, and 10 months later, and not ONE item has been approved. It's like it their own money that needs to be spent.
We have minimal youngsters coming through, and not a hell of a lot of mid age (30-40) players either. They refuse to listen to the younger generation as 'we don't know anything'.
I can see exactly how the sport is in decline.
The Ranga Pirate I would love to read your submission to see how it reads. Would you post it, or could you I guess because of club policy?
Great point..
I'm the youngest member in my club and I'm 33...but the others are so resistant to change and always preach about bringing in new members and are scared of the club closing...but they just think they know everything and dont want anything to change, but it doesnt work that way...they dont get that 1. They need more young people to join and 2. Those young people dont feel welcome and they're intimidated...golf's older generations still have that image of the proper dress code, the absolute proper "unspoken" etiquette, the way golfers have a way of raising their noses at people...in this day and are why would a young person join, most successful young adults and millenials dont need all that, we don't care as much about status and wealth like older generations, we just want convenience and fun...both things that golf does not give...but it's not golf per se....look st topgolf...theyre KILLING IT...most young people would happily go to topgolf and have a great time, but have no interest in real golf, which is a shame but golf is one of the greatest games ever created,
😢 this nearly happened to my local and I had no idea a quit golf for 18 years and just returned I’m lucky a local councillor kept it open so many memories ..... I’m glad I can create more 😁👍
I love golf. I have been playing all my life, but I can see how the game could be slowing down. It is just so difficult to get someone into the sport. Equipment and green fees are pricey and it's just so difficult to learn.
Natural athletes can pickup most sports quickly, except golf. Golf requires a massive time investment to get to a point where it is enjoyable to play.
I think you hit the nail on the head, a good manager that everyone reports to, cut out all the B S with committees. Maybe reduce yearly membership and consider 14 hole golf. Keep up the good work Liam.🏌️♂️
I had this last year with my job and golf course, which was Henley in Arden golf club. It was a lovely course to play having some interesting holes and it had some fantastic members!!! Was absolutely gutting what happened and this shouldn’t be happening to them as they are needed
I remember trying to book a golf society at Henley in Arden...kept ringing out.
Couldn't believe it went. Same happened at Patshull Park. Gone but not forgotten.
Liam, lots of good comments here. To counteract all of the doom & gloom, can I suggest a contrasting video on some courses that are doing it properly and are successful?
The ones near me are pricing themselves out of the market. If I owned a course, I'd rather charge £15 a round and have a full course than £35 and have the odd player turning up. Courses near me that have closed in the last 12 month's, Broke Hill, Austin Lodge, Woodlands Manor and I believe Pedham Place is in danger of closing for house building.
Price is a major factor for me, I can't afford to be a member but the £9 after work twilight rounds have kept me in the sport(usually 15 holes before it gets too dark)
Pedham place has been said to be close to being built on for about 20 years as I was a member there a few years ago and it was the same rumour then
@@southsidetrojans5232 I heard that Sevenoaks district council have to find land and build 25000 new homes by a set time. If not then Pedham will be compulsory bought for this purpose.
@@fiftyplusfitnessproject9525 no as pedham is privately owned not council owned
@@southsidetrojans5232 www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=www.kentlive.news/news/knife-edge-vote-leaves-2500-2259569.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjyyMjz-qrmAhXvRxUIHelgAtQQFjABegQIBxAK&usg=AOvVaw2LR7g88KwUKJp0sTNsTuy_&cf=1&cshid=1575976934814
I was part of the junior team at Fishwick and my dad was a member for 26 years! As far as I'm aware, the club was half owned by the council and they didn't have enough funds to keep it going. Also, you had muppets (like you said) coming on the course with quad bikes and motocross bikes ripping the greens apart. I remember playing as a junior and having my ball knicked by young lads running onto the course. It's a shame that its closed, was never the nicest course to play but the club house and the crack was second to none!
I was a member at fishwick hall for a couple of years the second hole par 5 was one of the most scenic holes you would play the course was great apart from the climb up the 12 th the one you were out of breath on the video they only had 200 members when it shut they said it wasnt viable run anymore im at stanley park now were there making it nine holes it was designed by alister mc kenzie who designed augusta what a travesty
We had 2 clubs close in Attleboro, Mass. USA in the last 3 years. One private, one public. Both were 9 hole courses that had been around for years. My father caddied at the private course when he was a kid. It was hoity toity, and very high brow. I don't really know the details, but, I think they couldn't keep up with the high cost of membership'. I worked in the grill room and was fired for being too friendly, figure that one out! The public course went bust because they couldn't make improvments without the guy across the street taking them to court. It cost them too much. When they closed, he bought the land to put housing on it! Love your videos keep up the good work .
The number of golfers has been declining for years is this due to high fees time taken clubs stuck in the past?
Hey Liam, similar process is happening in Australia. The causes I think come back to the value of the land for housing compared to golf and also the cost of playing golf seems to be getting dearer and dearer which is causing people to drop out of it.
In my opinion the cost of golf is getting to far out of reach for the average human with memberships on the rise in order to keep clubs afloat and the cost of equipment is slowly becoming unaffordable
lol .. bought an entire new set of one length Cobra,s ... driver and 3 hybrids.. over $3000.00 Canadian .. but will be worth every penny combined with OMP's pro golf tips... expecting to break 80 this year Liam !
Rumour has it that the owners of Bolton Open also own Regent Park where, by all accounts, all the finances were being directed hence it lost its driving range, lost its club house and then dropped to 9 holes which eventually led to the closure of the course where I learned to play and also played regular with my fire and rescue service colleagues. Instead of playing there we often attended the derelict buildings left there to put out numerous fires.... sad state of affairs. We also played Heaton Park and Boysnope on a regular basis so it is a real shame to hear that two very nice courses are now no more. Saddens me even more as I have got some great memories of playing with my Watch at theses venues after some tough night shifts... good for the old mindfulness as is the game as a whole... as long as you’re not slinging your clubs about in frustration as one of my golfing partners often did.
With regards to the running of a golf club, I was once asked to become a committee member at a club but was somewhat perplexed by the lack of due process in order to take up such a post. I have been a charity trustee and a school governor where structured and stringent processes were in place, in both cases, to ensure that you are the right person for the role. Should this not be the case for all golf club committees? The point raised in respect of club management is a very good one also and I am a little surprised to discover that this is not the case. As a leadership and management, project management and business management coach, the value of having a properly trained and experienced manager (I would suggest a minimum of Level 5 Operational Management, as it includes the fundamentals of Project Management which might be useful) should not be overlooked so I would agree that the introduction of an Operations Manager may well be a step in the right direction along with modernising the approach to club membership i.e. attract rather than deter... golf equipment has moved with the times, so should the clubs.
Just seen the bit where you said of the courses you've played at that are closed ... are you sure you're not just a massive jinx Liam?
@@GolfMates I was going to invite you to play my course, but now I'm not so sure.
I was a member over 7 years played all my junior golf here! What a sad watch. Hopefully will come back 🤞🏻
There are SO MANY golf courses in UK/Scotland. We have roughly the same amount of registered players in England as Germany (650,000), but England has 1,900 courses against Germany's 731. Twice as many courses to choose from. We've got so much more choice, indicating a saturated market.
It's supply and demand ...low average clubs (bottom 20%) that aren't turning any profits are sitting on huge amounts of land that's worth a some £££ (depending on location) and so cut the losses and sell up.
Say what you want about developers turning old courses with "history" into housing developments, but it's what the young generation so, so desperately needs. We're a tiny Atlantic island, barely built any housing to keep up with population increase/demand, so rent/house prices are absurd compared to what your grandparents generation could buy with a regular salary. I'll take the houses over a badly managed course that no-one wants to play.
Delapre course Northampton used to have a pitch & putt for the kiddies and three good 9-hole par-3s as well as the 18-hole. One of the 9-holes was closed/abandoned several years back, as was the pitch & putt. Then one of the 9-holes was converter to foot-golf (sigh) and the last 9-hole is now also the pitch & putt so is often overcrowded, mistreated and worn-down. Not played the 18 holes as its too expensive for this pensioner. Parking used to be great; now they've sub-let 80% of the parking to nearby companies so, pre-covid, golfers would find it hard to park monday to friday. Shame. I Used to go weekly, don't know when or if I will again. I enjoy your videos though, they're a great substitute - thanks.
We've had 5 courses in the past 5 years close in our county. Another just filed bankruptcy.
I live in Alabama in the U.S.
Started to play golf again after watching your videos, so I went to my favourite course in a national park. Bel air golf clubs in Adelaide Australia didn’t realise it had been closed for a year and a half.
Definitely not enough young ones taking up the sport. I'd say the majority of our club are aged 40 plus. What's it like at your club Liam?
I work in a cart barn. Not very many younger golfers maybe a handful
Mdmchannel I wouldn’t say that . I’m a junior and the majority of people a similar age (teen) look at golf as an old man sport which explains why they dislike it
I know the feeling. A couple of years ago, in Corona de Tucson, AZ, Santa Rita Golf Club suddenly closed (a site where "Tin Cup" was partially filmed). It was a golf course community (houses along the fairways), and the residents felt betrayed, the golf course being one of the reasons they bought homes there. Golf-quality-wise, it was no great loss: It was a short, quirky course, and not a lot of fun. But it was sudden and sad nonetheless. They ran on a shoestring because memberships were originally cheap and grandfathered in. Maintenance suffered. I also played another course, now closed, north of Tucson, AZ, with the same problems. Added to that, the members there had a reputation for a terrible attitude towards and relationship with non-members who came to play there, eventually drying up a necessary source of revenue. A shame; it was a wonderful Tom Weiskopf design.
Let's face it golf in it's present format on tv is boring to me . I'm a golfer, I play three times a week. It's always on my tv, in the back ground, I only really watch the last two hours of day four. They need to come up with a more exciting format. Now we all know how much interest the Ryder cup stirs so why not have more match play and other formats what about mixed team games played over 12 holes anything but medal over four days!!! My local Top Golf is always full of youngsters so they are interested in golf it's just about making it more accessible. Should golf centres have six hole loops under flood lights, golf simulators a cafe and bar. Just thought. Very frustrating seeing all these golf courses closing down.
We have several 9 hole courses within 30 minutes of me. They've mostly been bought out and are under new management in the past 10 years. One of those courses is owned by an early 30-something who owns one in a metro area as well. The course is in INCREDIBLE shape for being right outside a town of less than a thousand people. It appears he uses the equipment on both courses to spread the cost, because $23 riding for 9 is great and the course (other than size) is as well kept as our state golf association course. The summer weekends are always packed, including some of the weekdays, and all of the old "golf etiquette" codes are a bit more loose (not really a fan, but it keeps the game alive).
I've taken my kids out a few times and the interest is there, its just getting them to do it on their own that's tricky. Outside of well-to-do communities it's probably not the go-to sport. In the 90's we had Adam Sandler and Tiger Woods spark interest in otherwise-uninterested youth. Maybe that's what golf needs now?
It’s heartbreaking to see there a lot I think cost some old dinasour members who stop young people enjoying golf and clubs that still live in the past need to move on and modernise become attractive to young people the life bold of the game I think 🤔
They have to die off, but they are just then replaced with up and coming new "course policeman". Seen it all happen at different clubs I've been a member of in Greater Manchester.
Qe need to stop this happing i know difficult but all members who love golf and there home have the power and need to step up and cull the dinosaurs killing the game
Maybe its your singing that is causing the golf clubs to close down, mate? Hahahha kidding
Someone said to me a few weeks ago, 70 year olds telling 40 year olds how to attract 20 year olds!!
That's right, Grandad's telling Sons to get their sons playing. A lot of Grandad's getting kids into golf by the way.
@@sumpingwong6659 I think he means! Old farts are way out of touch with modern day youths, times have changed.
@@luapynneb3069 Only fair, Plenty of 20 somethings telling everyone else what to do.
luap ynneb a lot of older people aren’t happy with clubs ditching sign on fees but younger people can’t afford £500-£700 especially with younger families they just can’t justify it.
@@DrGeazy whos talking about fees? plus younger families of today can have it hard! but no harder than yesteryears, i'd even say there is far more money floating about these days in truth, "ask how many S10s or latest I-phones are sold to these kids, but that's not the point here! > It's about how to attract more people to this sport? because if we carry on as we are doing? all i can see is more clubs at grass roots going bust, to many clubs have far outdated snobbish rules/ideas to attract the numbers of people needed, which is a >>massive worry
Same things happening here in NZ. 2 old clubs under threat , 1 is a course called Miramar links in Wellington , Airport putting a new runway through 9 holes , and my own club in Nelson which is over 100 years old is also fighting to stop the Airport extending the runway through 4 holes !
I'm from michigan and I'm just getting into golf properly and one of my favorite 9 hole courses just started having memberships and I'm stoked. It's an easier course for beginners and the price is right
Where at in Mich. I from Cadillac.
Many years ago Eastleigh Municipal Golf Course closed now left to rot.Always seemed to be busy so why was it closed,they had a well known pro. locally David Miller.Maybe too many in the area but sad to see it go,they even had ladies pro.golf tournament played there back in the day.
i live in magpie lane next to the old eastleigh golf club was a member when first started playing .i played it on its last day the course was packed every golfer was as sad as hell the scummy council closed it because it was only making them 330 thousand a year and was not enough money for them so they closed it so people can walk there dogs up there and have a shit and not have to pick it up ive been up there in the summer and the area stinks of dog shit eastleigh council are scum
The course I play at has no dress code. And they let you play music on the course as long as it's not obnoxiously loud. And they even have these things they call "family tees" where say it's a 350yard par 4, there will be a green stake at about 120yards and you can tee off from there for the real youngsters or total beginners, just to come out, knock some golfballs around and have fun with the family.
And when you walk in the door, it feels like home, not like you're trespassing. The league president, whose become a dear friend of mine over the last 2 years, and the entire set of league guys are just as keen to have a few drinks, talk shit, hangout and have fun. Golf is almost secondary. Beer is cheap (cheaper than any bar in the area) and the food is fantastic, and I chalk it up to their "go out have fun, do whatever you want, just obviously don't be a prick" attitude of the establishment and it's attracted all the 20-35yr olds in the area, and that's why it's the only club around growing while one just a few miles up the road is basically shut.
Fun fact, the best golfer out there is a 27yr old guy who plays wearing Nike Hi-Tops, untied, hat on backwards, and no glove, usually with 3-5 beers in him and will shoot under par just about every time. A guy like that would get run off at most "traditional" clubs even though he'd out-shoot everyone there except maybe the local pro.
I just think they need to get with the times, and loosen the rules.
Not many golf clubs round here but the ones that are here are doing ok . I am in Nova Scotia, Canada
As a child, I had one toy it was called out. I went out, played out and all of my friends played out as well. Very few children do so today. Their parents are perfectly happy to have them inside and safe. The reality is that we are developing a generation of socially challenged, physically unfit youths that can only be entertained by the mayhem of a computer generated reality.
The Wall Street Journal reported that golf courses are closing in the US at an alarming rate. Going from 15,000 to 12,000 in a three year period. This trend is likely to continue as channels like yours are monetized by advertisers selling online or app driven golf games. Sad, but I’m not sure we can recover from this trend.
Hi Liam, I read somewhere the other week that 8 yes 8 courses are either closing down for good or temporary on the Midlands. One being Hilltop golf course sandwell, which was one of 7 municipals that were taken over by My time golf.
There are golf courses closing, being turned housing.
I was a member of Woodlands Manor GC in Kent. We had a fantastic pro who served the club over 20 years. In 2017 the club was sold to new owners. They were not golfers. The pro Realised where we were going and left! These new owners ruined the club! Over 80 years of history. You played for trophy’s donated by families etc. I loved the course. We had a signature hole called The Eiger a par 3 with huge elevation up hill. A great interesting course. I miss playing this course. We also had a real group of members. I played mid week what a great gang! These new owners brought the club and with bad intentions! I’m now at a new club members owned. So it’s safe. Be aware if there is a sole owner. I’ve been up to the club since. It broke my heart to see the course overgrown. The most happy I’ve ever been at any club in 36 years of playing golf gone by investment aresholes!
I think unfortunately some of these clubs are run with heart and no business sense☹️
Really enjoyed this Liam, you are spot on first and foremost it is a business. People who haven't run a business struggle to understand at times. Easy for them to say we should do this and that without understand what goes into doing this and that both financially and physically. They are usually the first ones to back out when asked to contribute and criticise when things don't go their way.
The main problem is that clubs are stuck in the dark ages.
It is, it's too bad. They also, around here anyway, they all have an uppity/exclusive reputation (except for the one whose growing like a weed, but I'll get to that) so new/young players don't play there. Also it's expensive. The course I'm member to, and everyone else whose age 20-35 is less expensive, but they let you play music on the course, no dress code. The older league guys and the staff and owners are really cool and great people. They're just as keen to go out with their mates have a few beers, talk shit, hangout, and have fun. The golf is almost secondary. But all matters. When you walk into the door at the clubhouse it feels like home, not like you're trespassing like it does at some of those other clubs. It's a shame to see them go, but usually the writing is on the walls and you can't help but feel like they're asking for it sometimes.
All these stuffy clubs. No jeans, no trainers, dress codes etc.
They need to modernise or the clubhouses will be demolished and housing will be built on the fairways.
@@PreservationEnthusiast to be honest, most nightclubs and bars have a dress code. I bet most on here get more dressed up to go to a bar on a Friday night, then they do to play golf.
@@notmenotme614 That's not really the point though. It's no good saying this or that other leisure sector has a dress code therefore we can. If they're not getting bums on seats, they can't afford to pick and choose.
Clearly they are not getting enough members and a major cause of that is likely old ones dying off and not attracting enough new young members because those people want to wear jeans and trainers.
A couple of really stupid rules I have seen is gentlemen must wear a collar but ladies don't have to, or gentlemen must wear knee length socks but ladies can wear ankle length. If I find a club like that, they can stuff their dress code up their backsides. I'll take my green fee elsewhere. Those are the kind of stuffy clubs which are struggling.
Pecan valley GC in San Antonio TX closed 7 years ago and it hosted the PGA Championship in 1969
When the mrs. takes the razor for the legs, it instantly renders it useless. I don't know what she has growing out of there but it ruins the razor utterly and completely. The worst part is she doesn't tell me and I find out by scratching the hell out of my face.
LOL! You win the best comment award!
We used to be members of a local course, that was costing us £750 a year back in (2008 when we last were members). I don't know what the current status/cost is but I do know there are half as many members now as there were then. They have been bought by a Hotel with a view to developing a large hotel complex on what is the driving range. They don't discount for temporary greens and seem to actively discourage visitors. At £25 a round it's not cheap and there are lots of other courses nearby that offer 2 4 1 deals. The last time we went for a nostalgic return there was one young lass in the empty of equipment 'pro shop' who was also running the bar. We have an old friend who is in his eighties who was a founder member with us. He was injured and just wanted to walk a few holes with us. They don't allow it. Last time I went to hit a few balls on the range the car park was virtually empty. (Bawtry, Doncaster).
I very much doubt you will get done for copyright, maybe noise pollution tho 🤣🤣
Would the words not need to be correct to get done for copyright??