The Differences Between the Main and Portable Series Monster Hunter Games - Heavy Wings
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 มิ.ย. 2024
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In this video I discuss some of the ways in which the developers behind the portable and main series Monster Hunter games do things differently from each other.
0:00 Introduction
0:48 Monsters in Master Rank
5:15 Final Bosses and the Role of the Flagship Monster
8:12 Damage Numbers
11:53 Procedurally Generated Content
13:53 Endgames
17:28 Weapon Movesets
19:48 Combat Style
21:13 Themes and Motifs
25:58 Misc. Differences
27:47 Skillshare
28:57 Conclusion + Ending - เกม
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Does Freedom Unite use bloated or raw damage value?
@@vietthanhnguyen815It should be really easy to tell. Just compare weapons since with bloated values they each have a different multiplier.
The logos of the main series games have dragons in the games' emblems. The number of dragons correspond to the generation number. Gen 1 had 1 dragon: rathian. Mh 2 dos had 2 dragons, and so on. The portable series does whatever it wants, not following that structure
Oh wow, first time I've heard about that! Had to go look for myself!
The fifth one was hard to find on the World emblem, but I believe it's the head like thing on the middle bottom?
@@bok4822 yup. The 5th dragon is the nergigante head :)
But rathian is a wyvern, no?
@@natsukaa_- 90% of monsters are wyverns
and MH Wild still follow the same sturcture 6 headed dragon or serpents ?
When it comes to damage, showing true is best for me because it allows you to draw parallels
Yeah, makes it easier to feel sad when your choice of weapon has 10 less raw than the others of the same monster 🥲
for real man, they should do away with Bloat values in next mainline MH, its so hard to discern optimal damage levels, especially when you like to switch weapon types often. i have to go through the effort of calculating it just to get the True raw value
@@Jemski_T while not as tedious, modding the bloated values out in the pc versions is still pretty annoying
It still feels weird seeing numbers coming from mhfu years back
Yea i even use the true attack and true element values mod in my pc mhw iceborne saves
Love how he say Bulldrom and shows Fatalis
"They're the same picture"
hahaha
Bullfango and Bulldrome can go to hell.
That first Mizutsune hunt that when we're supposed to hunt Bulldrome in G/GU? Yeah that fight was he not because of the Mizutsune, but because of the Bulldrome
glad you're getting sponsorships at your size already. Love your content
I thought that when I started the video that's cool.
Yea that's metal
I really like being able to bring every weapon to Rarity 10. It feels like you have a lot more viable options for weapons that way instead of just using the same handful of weapons as everyone else, or having to grind RNG for a weapon. I did like Investigations though and I'm glad Sunbreak brought something similar.
true, it makes other weapons shine. also, is r10 the limit since iceborne had r12?
@@kekk3809 i think 10 is going to be the max unless they bring a way to get it further, which i personally doubt but could happen
@@kekk3809 R10 is usually the max. Iceborne was the exception and I really don’t know where those extra 2 rarities came from.
@@solomon9655 afaik, r12 were for the most part on title update monsters, with a few exceptions before them.
@@solomon9655 12 is mainly for Elder Dragons and even among them not every weapon type of an Elder Dragon got till 12, usually stuck at 11
I like the idea of replacing the base monster with variants, which feel like the same monster but improved, if it maintains the core element or status that marks its personality, like Seething or Savage. But when is for subspecies or variants that change the element like Ebony Odo or Pyre Kadaki then it's better to mantain both versions for armor and weapons sake so we keep a large variety of mixed sets and weapons options.
I genuinely hate bloated damage numbers on weapon stats. I never felt like remembering the multipliers for 14 different weapons, and true values make it way easier to compare across weapon types like you said :)
The short hand to compare weapon types without memorizing bloat multiplier is comparing your weapon to the weapon of the same monster across other trees, then compare your target weapon with the shared monster tree. Still harder than comparing true raw but not really that hard either.
Nah i like bloated more
Over time ive grown to prefer the general aesthetic and feel of the main series way more, i like the down to earth nature of it a lot.
But i also really like the crazyness of the portable games... in the end i couldnt say what version if the formular i enjoy the most i only know that i personally like the feel of gen3 and gen4 gameplay the most.
Yeah. Like the more grounded feel of the main games myself. I also enjoy more that all the weapons have their own distinct playstyles, instead of what Rise and Generations does where all weapons suddenly can do what other weapons can. I do like both systems, love having options, but I also love having defined roles of each weapon. Why would you need to try another weapon when you can just create a new build for your current weapon that does what you want? In World, if you want head breaks, hammer is the best choice. Dual blades if you want to trip monsters a lot. Longsword if you want to be an asshole. In Rise trips are not needed any more for other than openings, as most weapons can attack in the air in some way. Hunting horn is not this weird unique but cool weapon any more, now it's just a more fancy hammer with buffs and without the precision and control you needed before. Also longsword is overbuffed
@@bok4822 I agree, the main series is my favorite because of it down to earth tone that can steadily grow into some weirdness that we see in late game and in rise. I also enjoy the slower aspect of the game over the "got to go fast" madness that rise did, rise at time's feels like it breaks it combat flow for how fast you moving all the time. And the monsters and their environment feel hollow, monster fights don't feel like a deadly dance between two foe's and that the tables can be turned at any second instead it feels like a player fighting an AI boss and that player is maybe a little to strong for that boss, and the environment feels empty and Spacious instead of a more lived in feel that is full of life like in world.
You somewhat touched on it too with your combat section. The monster direction follows this too, at least for GU/Rise vs 4U/World. GU/Rise pushes for more fantastical designs whether it be a Brute Wyvern whose tail is a greatsword, A Fanged Wyvern who is like a Samurai that utilizes all his weapons, and a Elder Dragon who is based off of Dracula vs 4U/World where you have enigma monster that spreads a virus, a Elder Dragon that regrows spikes, and Elder Dragon that can control the cold air. I don't think either direction is superior as Malzeno and Velkhana, both sides of the coin, are my favorite.
While this is a general trend, it should be noted there are some exceptions. Tigrex, for example, is a pretty grounded design despite originating from Freedom 2. On the other side of the coin is Brachydios, which came from 3 Ultimate, and is one of the more wacky over-the-top anime designs you expect from the portable team.
@@joshuasgameplays9850 the portable team did help with making 3Ultimate, maybe thats the reason.
One thing i noticed is that the Portable Series often has the larger roster of Monsters.
As example:
Gen5:
Iceborne has 71 large Monsters
Sunbreak has 78 large Monsters
Gen4:
4 Ultimate has 75 large Monsters
Generations Ultimate has 92 large Monsters
Gen3:
Tri has 18 large Monsters
Portable 3rd has 40 large Monsters
Probably because the portable games come out after the mainline games, so they have more to pull from
it's quite ironic that sunbreak's TU1 invalidated both the apex part and that Rise's not being RNG heavy with afflicted investigations and the rng hell of qurio armor...
great video as always, going so far as analyzing the music, which for some people is an afterthough, was quite a good touch
I think it's worth mentioning that even tho base Narwa was omitted from Sunbreak, a bunch of the stuff she could do (IIRC Anyway) ends up being given to MR Ibushi instead, so Ibushi is more like base Narwa and Ibushi rolled into one, while Allmother is just Allmother.
Ibushi is like base Narwa and Ibushi rolled into one, in contrast to Allmother which is like base Narwa and Ibushi rolled into one.
I didn’t realize that a portable team existed before Rise. I imagined all previous games didn’t have a split since in my brain they were mostly on portable consoles. It does make sense though, since GU looks very different from 4U
-I prefer the true raw. As you said, we can see our damage numbers so bloated raw doesn’t serve a purpose
-I prefer how Rise handled “replacement” subspecies. They were able to make Seething and normal Bazel unique from each other so it seemed really weird when Iceborne flat out removed Normal Bazel. I was scratching my head when normal Vaal was replaced too. It’s in the rotten vale and has a different aesthetic compared to Blackveil, so why not? Even if the moves aren’t different it felt pretty sad to have to go into HR to fight the guy. An exception in my mind is Deviljho since I don’t think they’ll give normal Jho enough unique moves to matter
Yup.. That's understandable since almost 2 generations of MH was on Handheld and the biggest break of the franchise was defined from handheld before World came out..
Hence Rise kinda did a good job in easing the HR versions of the Monsters since they are kinda slow in a reasonable way.. Hence when they added the Master Rank versions it resonated really well how they are really beefed up and powered up..
One thing I noticed is how on the non-portable games your comrades (felynes/shakalakas) are usually bound to you by plot or similar, while in the portable games you can usually just recruit a bunch of randomly generated ones or with some specified traits of your liking:
-In 3/3U Cha-Cha and Kayamba both have their own personal stories and join you as you progress through the game's 'campaign'
-In 4/4U even though you can recruit random palicoes out in the wild, your main palico (The Ace Palico) has a story of his own, he's well known by other palicoes and he has his reasons to tag along with you
-In World you're prompted to create your own personal Palico at the beginning of the game along with your hunter. It is YOUR palico, it shows up in the cutscenes, has a personality, it's gonna be the one and only palico that will be there for you (not counting tailraiders and your friends' palicoes, I'm talking about plot/campaign)
The companions in these games aren't just AI helpers, they're also CHARACTERS with their own unique personalities!
Meanwhile in the portable games:
-Freedom Unite: you can recruit both palicoes and chefs from the felyne granny, you can get up to 20 of them iirc
-Portable 3rd: same as above, but you can bring two of them along with you in quests
-(I haven't played G/GU so I can't point anything out)
-Rise: Even though you're prompted to make your own custom Palico and Palamute at the beginning, just like in World, you can then recruit a lot of them from the buddy handler, each with different skills and looks, again, randomly generated (even though you can ask the handler to look for buddies with your desired traits)
In these games the companions do feel more like just AI helpers instead of actual characters with personalities.
Good video as always Heavy, congratulations on getting sponsored again man, and good to see you again after your hiatus!
If the Palamutes become a permanent addition to MH(I personally think it's likely) I'd like to see how the Main team characterizes your hunter's Palamute.
@@firetools Probably the hunter discovers the palamute being chased by a monster and decides to adopt it.
God I can't wait for Wild having me bond with my lizard dog mounts in story and farms.
You forgot to mention how the Portable team also places emphasis on the Felynes (And now Canynes) and the farms(Rip) more than the main series, and for the conclusion I always liked the portable way more, they aren't afraid of introducing new mechanics to spice up gameplay aswell as giving off more of a laid back feel. Although I desperately need the massive meals, the Dango system is perfect but they could've introduced the mechanics onto a full plate of food since eating a japanese snack doesn't fit in Elgado's european theme imo
100% my opinion here ☝
Bro i was so disappointed that the Dango system carried over to Elgado. I feel like Rise/SB is the first MH game since P3rd that doesn't have food prn meals :(
I agree with you but at least the Felyne chefs and their animations are such a pleasure.
@@AveryCreates Oh definitively, the Bunny Dango song is the best part of the entire Monster Hunter franchise
They could've just reskin it to be meat skewers or something, saw a mod for it
The portable series is inherently experimental. Hell, look at the sheer speed of rise, an experiment in increasing the overall speed of gameplay.
I like the speed of rise a lot. I'm not grinding for supplies to hunt, I'm hunting. I'm not trekking through a map to find a monster I'm hunting a monster within moments. I appreciate getting into the meat of the game quickly because I can pop on for a quick hunt if I have a half hour rather than have to prep/track/track for an extended time beforehand.
@@rabbitknight87yeah, the traditional way of playing Monster Hunter just the way i remembered
Something of note, is that with Title update 1 apex arzuros and apex Rathian are now in Master Rank Anomaly investigations with the others surely to follow. This would make Narwa the only HR monster to remain there.
Surprised you didn't mention the buddy systems. As far back as the 2nd generation, the portable games have had in-depth buddy recruitment and management mechanics. By contrast, the mainline team usually gives the player a fixed companion that acompanies them for their entire journey.
World was my first game, and so I originally preferred the approach taken by the mainline team, but over time the portable team's approach has really grown on me. My buddies in the portable games weirdly feel MORE special than my ones in the mainline games, because I had to seek them out and pick them out, rather than them being handed to me.
I wanted to mention them but I decided the video was too long already.
Besides I have plans on discussing AI companions throughout the series at some point.
@@HeavyWings Ah, cool! I'm looking forward to that buddy video!
Even though I've watched probably close to hundreds of videos on Monster Hunter's history I still very much enjoyed this video. I even learned some new things about Rise. I'm currently obsessed with everything Monster Hunter. When I'm not playing, I'm looking up content, so thank you for this. Keep up the good work.
I’m definitely a portable guy myself, but I really do like many of things the Main team does. I do appreciate the world they made, the food, and the investigations.
While I understand why World excluded some Monsters for their variants, I don't personally think it played out well in the long run because half of the replaced monsters were better than their replacements or lost something that made them special. Seething Bazel is a fantastic upgrade, but it was shoved into just the Elder's Recess when of all "roaming" monsters it easily makes the most sense for the role (Sunbreak's Seething Bazel can still roam, which also proves this was likely a kneejerk reaction to Bazel bomb-raid backlash and not because of Seething's biology). I find Ruiner Nergigante to be a downgrade from the original which is especially problematic when we're dealing with the variant replacing the base game's flagship. It lost some of Nergi's best attacks, got shoved all the way to MR 100, and the metal spikes idea makes Nergi's spikes go from surprisingly tasteful to looking like a mess (at least Ruiner's gear looks cooler). Finally Blackveil Vaal Hazak is interesting, but I prefer the original's design and the fight is absolutely terrible compared to the original form's surprisingly fun fight. The other 3 exclusions work for the reasons you mentioned, but the base forms of the 3 I mentioned really should have been handled better, especially with all of them being brand new World monsters and one of them being, again, the goddamn Flagship
And I can’t believe they didn’t put regular Narwa in master rank, I just wanna hear that theme again
I think Ruiner's spikes are more satisfying to break
I think IB Seething looks even more out of place now since Sunbreak has seethi ng and normal bazel in MR
2 notes
Apex monsters are in Sunbreak, they appear in anomaly investigations, they have new moves but also only drop melding materials
Anomaly investigation take the best of world investigation and the leveling system of the GU Deviants
I'm loving the anomaly investigations, I just hate that for my dual blades build is that the only the only augmentation that are worth it are elemental damage which I need to get to 5⭐ investigations unlocked.
This was probably filmed before the anomaly investigations so at the time of filming they weren’t in game
@@dinokingdash5332 yeah definitely, but the new investigations have given me a reason to grind since I don't have to fight the same monster 3 - 6 times just to hopefully upgrade one weapon, now I can at least try for a better augmentation roll on my armor after every hunt.
I don't see anything about it resembling the Deviants level system. If anything, the level stuff is much more like the Guild Quests from 4U.
@@LloydTheZephyrianThis. It definitely took elements from 4U on that aspect
I always prefered the approach to the world design and mood from mainline compared to the later portable entries but past that and to answer your notengagementfarming questions :
-I kind of like the idea of false damage on weapons but the confusion they create aren't worth it , especially with displayed damage numbers that exist now
-I much prefer fixed content rather than procedural grind , I feel they are kind of meaningless when not simply bad **ahem** guild quests**ahem** . I think they are at their best when optional but still usefull for everyone : cue to investigations in worldborne , they are usefull for anyplayer and don't require stupid amount of farming that only make sense in endgame for a somewhat stronger weapon . That's why I had no problem with Rise's endgame .
-Switchskill/customisable moveset is something that I think is really nice but can cause problem , styles are in my opinion a bit overwhelming unless you really dig into it and switch skills have led to case where one switch skill was literally better , skill swap kind of helped in that regard but still doesn't fix everything , in the end its not necesary and I kind of prefer simpler gameplans on weapon and its easier to make that with set movesets .
I think I have to disagree with you on the Magnamalo and the credits rolling after him part. I think it fits considering Magnamalo was the 'final boss' that the villagers of Kamura fended off 50 years ago. Kamura has a great deal of grudge against that Magnamalo and that's evident when you first get Scorned Magnamalo urgent quest and it's flavor text. The cause of the Rampage was a mystery until we the hunter and the twins came along, but Magnamalo has haunted Kamura ever since the beginning.
When the credits rolled that early we thought the whole game was done, that's why it felt weird seeing the credits only after Magnamalo. If the story was longer or they kept the final Magnamalo until later then I'd agree with you since we would be more invested into and understanding of this 50 year struggle.
I think the biggest boon the Portable team has is that the games are more experimental. While Portable 3rd was mostly just a "Tri but no swimming", Generations's hunting styles and arts were used as inspiration in World, Iceborne, Rise, and Sunbreak to expand the movesets. A good example of this being SnS's Blade Dance in Gen inspiring the Perfect Rush in Iceborne.
Generations is my favorite of the portable series. The hunting styles/arts fit well with what the game was aiming for and for the deviant fights as well. I definitely feel the inspiration more in Rise and I'm not looking for it to be the same of course..just feels a little watered down vs GU for me. I get what you're saying though.
I'd say the portable team is more experimental only in combat, specifically moveset.
Pretty much all major innovation for the series in a general sense were from the main team.
Just to fix something I saw that is technically incorrect in the vid (besides the Sunbreak-Apex thing), Zorah is in Master Rank/he did receive something TECHNICALLY. Zorah is the guiding lands which is why you’re able to make its armor after mining there.
Yeppp, I love seeing the giant Zorah skull within the rotten vale like part of the guiding lands.
5:13 I prefer quantity over quality, mostly bc 4U and Gen were my first games and I really enjoy them, and they both had huge rosters. More monsters = more chances for there to be good monsters and a variety of gear options (esp. With the GU/Sunbreak approach of giving final weapon upgrades similar stats)
I agree and Vaal Hazak is a great example. I considered Vaal one of my top 3 favorite fights in World, but Blackveil is so annoying and bad I think I literally only fought it 3 times total. The omission of normal Vaal really sucked, and that goes for the other monsters replaced by variants like Deviljho and Bazelgeuse as well.
They could always show both damage, like True Numbers and then Bloated in parenthesis like 100(140)
because I personally like bloated because big numbers make my monke brain go wow but I also like that you can draw parallels with true damage
I have to admit, I VASTLY prefer the main series and much of their design philosophy. It feels true to actual worldbuilding, something immersive to it that the Portable titles just don’t have.
That’s not to say both teams’ games don’t have their appeal, but the amount of care put into each and every main series game is astounding
Part of the draw of mh is the complications of EVERYTHING in the game. Learning these complications are part of the experience. Mh4u was by far the BEST experience for this. Such a great atmosphere it's as close to a masterpiece as any mh game can be.
Something to note is that there's already a system implemented so you can compare gear. Its the whole point of rarity existing. Weapons around the same rarity level will never differ too much in attack. If you have two rarity 6 weapons, one with more dmg but no element, and one with less dmg but an element, both of them being rarity 6 is the game telling you "hey, you will not downgrade your damage with the second weapon as long as you use it against the right monster."
The customizablity of combat affects which weapons I use significantly. There are weapons I don't touch if I can't modify them.
I didnt notice the motifs for the portable games and their flagships. Thats very neat things to point out
as a relatively new fan of the series (started with 5th gen, slowly trying to work my way backwards) this was a really fun video to watch!
I love your channel man every time you upload is such a treat.
Thanks, that means a lot to me!
The Apexes actually aren't ommitted from Sunbreak. They can be randomly found in Anomaly Investigations, and serve to give you extra Essence material.
A few things for the first 5 minutes, Apex's are currently showing up in the new Anomoly Investigations alongside other monsters, they still drop their original materials however.
As for Narwa as stated she's replaced by Allmother, but when you look at it again, Ibushi has been changed to fit more into what Narwa was, both in the Super Ibushi in the base game event quest, and the master rank Ibushi.
I loved this discussion. I totally forgot about free element! I think we have the best of both worlds having 2 different teams working on one franchise :)
What makes sunbreak/rise special is several frontier Devs are working on it. Hence why espinas(and espinas subspecies), several skills from frontier(Defiance aka 3 world's protection) and returning layered armors
I know this is ancient by internet standards, I'll give my 2 cents. While I think it makes sense to show the True Raw in the stats for the weapons, they should *also* include the Motion Values in the move dictionaries. It's the combination of the two that give you the final damage, which isn't super obvious to beginning players, especially ones that don't ever go online to look up stuff. Alternatively, they could label the bloat values as "Damage Rating" and *also* give the "Raw Damage" value. We're no longer really constrained by tiny pixel screens and having something like 730 (150) for a 150 Raw GS and 210 (150) for a 150 Raw SnS would be a good way to convey both pieces of information.
Loved the small part about investigations at the end lol
hope the "powerful monsters" tag for TU2 and TU3 are the Afflicted apex since we have Apex arzuros in AQ
Cross fingers for the return of deviant armors
Apex rathian too, seems theyre adding 2 per update, we might get apex rathalos and mizu next update
@@Duppy0906 its been rumored the next update would have A espinas Sub and a rare species Mizu
Probably Afflicted Gold/Sliver Rathian
Just observing this fabdom, I love seeing the way people talk about this game. And I also personally enjoy how the dev team seem like incredible stewards of the franchise. Their success was very hard-won. As a post-world player, I can only imagine having played all the old games when the fanbase was much smaller.
I credit dark souls with opening my mind more to games that are more action focused. The idea of a diamond in the rough I'm not seeing has forever stayed with me after I discovered that series. Monster Hunter was another jot to discover.
All in all, a great fandom, great devs that listen to feedback and the monsters are awesome! It's like Jurassic Park 1 on crack they all feel like real animals or they draw on folk lore. Those stylistic separations between main and portable were something I could see but this video crystallized a lot for me as a fan and a gamer.
Thanks!
I think I'm Team Portable, honestly. A lot of their design decisions make more sense to me. Or, I guess, align more with how I like to play games.
Imagine if we get a monster hunter game that literally has _all_ the mh monsters, and new ones that are introduced only in lore.
I dunno how it would be done, but just _imagine..._
Probably will happen in Gen 10 in 2 decades
Every video you post I learn so much and that is why I can't wait for more posts from you. You teach me something at a deeper level that I cant thank you enough for. I love this series, I love this game and I love your content. Keep it up
Thanks!
Your best video yet, love your content. As a World/Rise newcomer, it's cool to see the series's history. Really happy to see you get a sponsor too!
I miss a lot about World/Iceborne's presentation and realism, the weightiness of the combat etc. But Rise/Sunbreaks's roster is unreal. I really hope the next mainline game keeps the Carapaceons, Leviathans, Fanged Beasts.
As for including every monster, I feel that the best argument in favour is actually gear-based. Every monster adds at least new armour pieces and several new weapons, which leaves more room for experimentation, unique set bonuses etc. And more layered armour, for fashion!
The lack of those monster types from World that you mentioned was mostly due to technical problems, but with the new engine Capcom is using for most of their games it should be easier for them to incorporate those monster types in the next mainline game.
@@firetools Yes, I know World was the first game in the new engine and had to build up the basics. I hope that the work on MH6/MHW2 can make use of the work the Rise team did with the new skeletons. RE Engine is proving to be one hell of an engine.
@@lyonsrobbie999 World wasn't on a new engine. It was a modified version of the old engine. The reason why for World's difficulties was that the engine was an ancient.
I'm a type of guy who wants to try other weapons once in a while
So the true damage values on each weapon really helps me choose what weapon should I use on each type when I want to change
I wonder how much budget each team gets, since that would affect how they treat their project big time.
From all the examples you listed, I prefer the main series interations, but I'm still having a ton of fun with sunbreak right now.
For True and Bloated, I prefer True Value by far, but they should just give us the option, put Bloated by default since this is more intuitive for newcomers.
that was interesting to see the difference between the two teams and see that they both have the right to do their own thing while learning from each other.
Great video!
I think I prefer having all the monsters vs remove redundancies. This could just be a specific execution but I missed having the standard Bazelgeuse be a memeable invading terror in hunts when Seething was fought like a standard monster.
About the music, actually, portable team tends to use proof of a hero as the main theme, by extending it and adding unique parts to the song. In fact, GU, Rise and Sunbreak proof of a hero themes are waaaay longer than world or 4u proof of a hero. Can't really speak for P3rd tho
In the new anomaly investigations in sun break there are actually apex monsters that are part of quests. Don’t know if they got g-rank moves but there here.
This video was made before the title update but I’m glad they added something to rise like investigations in world
I actually was not expecting them to do that, but I'm glad they did. I've always wanted Guild Quests but with health scaling.
double cross being so loaded is one of many reasons its a masterpiece
25:12 This is more prevalent in Rise than you think. There's a single motif in Rise that's shared across the Village themes, the Hunting Locales, as well as the Rampage. The motif stems from the Storm Serpents' themes, specifically Allmother Narwa's, which is a combination of Narwa's theme and Ibushi's theme.
The motif is a rather simple series of notes, so it's a bit difficult to pick out at first. It's also exacerbated by Rise having so little themes for its brand new monsters- only Magnamalo, the Apexes (a shared theme), and the Storm Serpents get themes.
Granted, in Sunbreak only Malzeno gets a new theme out of the 3 Lords because of its flagship status, and the post-game monsters just have whatever theme they're already associated with. The final boss of course has its own theme as well.
The v.11 update for Sunbreak introduced Investigations of their own with augmentations.
Learning there are two different teams for MH games makes me reflect on my history with the series.
So, the first MH game I tried was 4U, at insistence of a cousin. And due to many things (the 3DS control scheme, the fact I picked the Switch Axe as my first weapon because it just looked cool and didn't really get how to use it, me wiping three times against the Great Jaggi and a quest I did with my cousin against a Gore Magala where I was the party's load and I felt bad for it), it just didn't click for me
Skip a few years, I get Generations Ultimate on my Switch, now due to insistence of my girlfriend, and oh my GOD, it was a 180. I managed to slay Valstrax and reach Hub High Rank (didn't go further because Rise was out by then and I figured many players wouldn't be online by then), and it felt like everything clicked.
Now with Rise, I am having one hell of a time too, I feel like I know what I am doing
So, maybe the portable team's approach is the one that clicked with me? Haven't played World due to gaming platforms and haven't thought about going back to 4U, but there must have been something in the Portable series that made me say "yeah, I can do this"
The difference between the "main series developers" and "portable series developers" is more of a myth now as the credits will show pretty much the same team with minor changes working on both.
Amazing work as always!
love that capcom specifically said theyre moving away from the portable/numbered games and yall are just OBSESSED with them
All in all, based in all points you presented on the video, I take mainline to be the standard, except for the endgame rng drops
So there is A Team and B Team!
I think investigations in both Rise and World are pretty cool, but as much as I like Kulve Taroth and Safi’jiva (I love them), it is pretty stupid that they rotate every 2 weeks for someone like me who can only play playstation on weekends. Furthermore I hope that multiplayer will be less required in future games, like in Rise.
Hypers and afflicted monsters are more similar than I first realized... lol
as of Sunbreak title update 1, Apexes have a possibility to appear in higher level anomaly investigation but without any new moves, also part of their reward drops are melding puddings/honey.
In World, you can arm wrestle in the gathering hub located at the very top floor of Astera (aka the boat).
I prefer the bloated values because it simplifies the difference in speed for the weapon's attack as well. The great sword may hit for 1408 dmg but it will be slow swings vs Charge Blade at 900 dmg but it hits a bit faster. When every weapon is similar numbers but different multipliers based on the weapon it doesn't give me a good idea on how this weapon will play before hand.
I do prefer having every Monster in G/Master Rank. Like, for being grounded's sake. Like, Savage deviljho's were supposed to be rare, a small chance that one would be this way because of their ecology. When Iceborne came along and made every Master Rank Deviljho savage, it broke my immersion a little.
the cantine and the chef of world and his master in iceborne were the best
no joke, i wanted to have those meals so badly. they looked so good
and the video of nch with the short credit scene, where the chef is all alone cause everybody is in seliana
and his master came to give him a meal, i went back so many times just to eat there after that video
17:00 the armor talisman form in the latest update has changed everything lol
I really, really didn’t like the RNG of deco drops in World. Might just be my least favorite mechanic they’ve ever had. Rise got backlash for the melding but it’s honestly a step in the right direction.
What bothers me is that 4U’s system was perfect. You could craft decos, and you had a talisman melder, BUT you also got random talisman rewards in the reward box of hunts similar to decos from World.
Some people argue for World’s system but the problem is the time required for decos which are integral to make your builds work at all, vs talismans which are usually a nice auxiliary bonus or capstone to your build.
Any time I’d play with my friend, he’d be good at the game but literally had no decos to work with because he didn’t play nearly as much as I did, which starved him of a ton of useful skills.
My last note is that decos feel great when you can craft them because they become a natural third addition to the crafting loop: Weapon, armor, decos. It’s always exciting fighting a new monster and seeing what new decos can be crafted along with its gear.
Yeah but now instead of having to get a set amount of all decorations, you need a 1 billion chance roll to get what you want. At least in world once you had the deco you didnt need more
@@slayer31397 Hey if that’s what you prefer I can’t change your mind. I personally don’t understand wanting the RNG of dozens of decos that are arguably more integral to builds than the talismans. I think people are too obsessed with getting god charms.
Unless you’re a speed runner, it’s really pointless to get a headache over it imho.
When you could craft talismans in World there were like maybe 3 good options, you’d make them and be done. Sure it works, but it added nothing to the gameplay loop and the options weren’t interesting.
Having decos you want to craft adds a fun third option to the loot system and if talismans have to be rng to accommodate I will take it.
I don’t love the rng charms but they don’t bother me either.
The hearty meals in the main games always look so damn good there's no way I'd say no to it.
hunting a giant monster would surely take up a lot of energy when you do flashy moves or wield a giant weapon, Dango on the other hand feels like you're eating snacks
Great video, I noticed these differences before but I thought it was a variance from game to game rather than main team to portable team.
I'm definitely more of a main-line MH fan but I would like to have True raw display, no MR monster replacement and customizable movesets(still grounded combat tho, custom sets doesnt need to mean flashy).
I much prefer True damage, because it makes it easier to compare.
Sunbreak has slowly becoming my favorite in the series overtaking world/iceborne. From its more fast paced combat, stylized yet smaller maps, more varied monsters and a way more fun low to mid tier experience. With atm it’s end game is improving but base Rise end game was lacking where base world was much better.
But with Sunbreak and it’s first title update competing to iceborne we will get another great year of content. And concerning it’s end game I prefer farming tailsmens than decorations in iceborne. We now have investigations again in Sunbreak and definitely improved and imagine will only expand with each update so I am happy. But for end game monsters and encounters Iceborne is still winning from its numerous encounters I would Sunbreak will have something in store but not relying on too many Elder Dragons but more sub species or variants is fun if done right.
The combat to me in Sunbreak is perfected so many weapons feel amazing and more mobile than ever before; and I will upset many just cause the older games combat was clunky and slow doesn’t mean it always has to be that or was always a good thing.
The more fantastical Sunbreak combat I think keeps me hunting more than the slower grounded combat or world/iceborne. And is the peak of monster hunter combat.
But what I love is we can have vastly popular, beloved and high quality entries in this series for more and more people. No longer stuck on handhelds and expanding and experimenting with these two teams.
Starting from MH4U, to MHG, World, Iceborne, MHGU, Rise and now Sunbreak. The future for this series is bright no matter what you think I look forward to every entry in the series even Stories 2 is something I’ve been looking forward to try.
The biggest thing in Sunbreak for me is weapon viability, further enhanced by the new endgame loop in Qurio crafting. I think it genuinely improves on what was tried in 4U, and honestly I would want this type of endgame loop and upgrading system to be a staple to the late-game in future titles.
I don’t think flashy and powerful extra moves need to stay necessarily, at least not all of them. But the improvements to some weapons like Gunlance should really carry through into the future in a similar way as to what Sunbreak accomplished.
@@Hibernial I agree we don’t need every flashy move but like you’d said Gunlance has never felt better in any other game. It was a fine choice even good but Sunbreak it brings it up, I think certain moves could be transferred into a regular move sets while others contained to more like how Generations ultimate handled it with gauges depending how well you do in the hunt and etc.
But even if the main line series stays more grounded and portable entires stay more flashy I wouldn’t mind as long as they both experiment and stir up the pot to test new things to see what could stay in new entires.
The theme of the returning flagships in World (Narga, Daora, Zinogre) has their respective games' themes mixed in.
Not related but it's a fun detail
Haha nice video. I was going to comment bout the update but it seems that bit had a hilarious mention at the end so yeah lol
Funny seeing this video about the Apex being omitted when several of them are now in the Investigations as random monsters that can appear.
I feel like the ideal damage display is that they first show the bloated number (with a bloat multiplier that acts as an average of all of the weapon's motion values, leaving out outliers), and have the true raw in parentheses next to it or below it.
Also, element has no reason to be bloated unless they have motion value modification.
If you consider why the attack values are bloated, it's clear that element has every reason to be bloated the way it is.
The bloated values are intended to allow you to compare the damage done by the weapon in a single hit. Physical bloat multipliers for each weapon are typically somewhere close to 10× the motion value (expressed as a decimal) of a "normal" attack from the weapon. For example, Great Sword's 4.8× bloat multiplier is actually exactly 10× the 0.48 motion value of a level 0 Charged Slash in World/Iceborne. (Most weapon types aren't quite this exact.) in order to mirror that, the elemental attack value is bloated by the exact same amount. Since the elemental motion value of most attacks (again as a decimal) is 1.00, it makes sense that the elemental bloat multiplier is 10.0×.
Even though there's no need to compare elemental attack values across weapons in the same way as for physical damage, it allows you to see a representation of how big of a contribution elemental damage can be compared to the weapon's physical damage for each individual weapon.
One design difference I think you missed is monster design, now this isn't a perfect one to one but generally mainline tend to make far more serious and grounded ecological designs while the portible tend to make more fun anime hype monsters, think Anjanath vs magnamalo from a ecology design perspective which somewhat lines up with the combat design aswell,
as for what I prefer well I definitely have a preference for the mainline games as I am a ecology nerd even tho I started in Freedom unite which is a portable entry but that was from a time before they started going full anime, but I do enjoy both flavours of game,
One thing I will say aswell is I'm starting to see a bit of a divide in the community between those who want the flashy anime game and those who want the more grounded ecological game and I belive capcom could do one thing that could please both fans and that's from 5th gen onwards have them be 2 different cannons and timeliness as from a world building perspective rise does a lot of stuff that breaks it, but if they are different timeliness it let's the mainline go fully into the grounded ecology angle while letting the portible team go full frontier mad for those who want it and boom everyone gets what they want, and you can still have soild world building by not having the 2 mingle to much, now they can still share stuff like a lot of rises roaster is great for mainline but I the making that distinction absolutely clear between the two would do a lot of good
I feel like a lot of Portable monsters still feel fairly realistic to me. The fated four for instance. Magnamalo, Valstrax and Zinogre kind of stick out and feel out of place but the other monsters are great like Arzuros, Goss Harag, Duramboros etc.
@@HeavyWings yeah as I said it isn't a perfect one to one and I still think a lot of portible monsters are fantastic from a ecology perspective my favourite is Tigrex after all, but I still think having 2 separate cannons would do a lot of good for the franchise going forward
Idk, feels to me like both Nerg and Shagaru are anime hype monsters, I can see both killing the final bosses in their respective games.
While Portable team usually make their flagships flashy but avoid making them the strongest, which kinda feels like a joke, like I'm pretty sure the story in P3rd is the Zinogres up in the mountain were terrified of Amatsu, so they came down, and Magnamalo is just an opportunistic predator benefiting from the chaos caused by the serpents.
I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be funny how you'd be scared of a Zinogre or a Magnamalo and think they're such a big threat, then you get to the Elder Dragons and are supposed to look back on it and maybe have a sensible chuckle.
There are exceptions like Valstrax of course, I can see him easily beating Ahtal-Ka.
@@bash3226 I hard disagree with nargacuga he is perhaps one of the most ground monsters but that perhaps comes from being a gen 2 monster, Shagaru on the other hand I'm 50/50 on
Also yeah that's true what you say about making them the strongest and having and having a bigger badder thing later, it's wierd then that the credits play after Zinogre and magnamalo in thier games despite the story not being done, really the credits should play after Amastu and allmother narwa respectively
@@stormerjc9493 By Nerg I meant Nergigante lol.
And Narga is definitely one of the most grounded monsters, what I'm trying to say is that in the bit about flagships, the point he's trying to make is that main series flagships are more grounded while portable series goes for more flashy, anime-ish monsters, which is kinda right in some cases but in 2nd gen Portable team had Tigrex and Narga as flagships, both being some of the most grounded monsters, and then Zinogre and Magnamalo, which are both just an affect of a much bigger threat, and probably stand no chance against their game's final bosses.
While main series devs in 2nd gen had a trio made up Chameleos, which was pretty grounded, Teostra, a manticore without the scorpion stinger, and Kushala, a metal dragon that somehow controls wind, then Lagi, which was also very grounded, then Gore and Shagaru, which are very anime-ish, especially with Shagaru's Morning Star vibes, then Seregios, which was somewhat grounded, then Nerg which is just full on anime especially if you read into some of the lore about him, I can see both Nerg and Shagaru soloing most if not all monsters in their games.
I don't know much about Velkhana cause I didn't play Iceborne yet but she seems pretty grounded from what I've seen.
As for Gen U, the devs just went as over the top as possible since it was an anniversary game, I'm assuming they were probably just having fun designing the monsters and making them as over the top as possible.
And yeah, I agree about the credits bit, but I guess they were pretty proud of the games and wanted to show the credits as soon as possible, especially since Monster Hunter can take a lot of time to beat and they weren't sure most people would play as far as the serpents.
I love how he used the fatalis for the bulldrome that was fucking hilarious
16:59 So basically one is more respectful to the player's time and the other not so much. Reminds me of Battlefront 2 lootbox system before they changed it entirely because of backlash.
Sunbreak does investigations better than Wolrdbone imo. I personally got bored of Worldborne's version over time.
(before anyone comments about how they prefer world's version. That's fine and all, but I just have my preferences!)
If you need an anomaly investigation for a specific monster, you can do an anomaly quest, unlock one for that monster and just rank that one up.
(not to mention that system lets you fight monsters of various levels and various types instead of just a select few).
I'm playing through MHGU on 3DS and it has just an absolute ton of stuff in it
There are so many armor variants, I don't even know what Prismatic Dandelions are but it lets me make a Blangonga set with a really nutso mask
I’ve recently got into it on my 3ds as well, and even though I’m still in lowrank I love all the maps. I can’t even believe it’s a game that’s on that system to be honest with all the content it has…
I think more Monsters never hurt. I'd really like to have 200 diffrent Monsters in one Game.
Monster Hunter Frontier had 140+ Monsters in it.^^
18:55 actually the first time in the series is Frontier
I don't mind monsters being omitted if there is cosmetic armor for them.
What are your honest thoughts about the spiribird mechanic? I've seen a lot of people split on it
In defence of Bloated Damage Values
I think true values are good for monster hunter veterens who know which weapons are more effective at dealing damage with a single strike. However noobies don't know if a bow deals more damage then the light bow gun or if a longsword deals more damage then the hammer. These differences aren't conveyed in game so using the bloated values helps new players recognise which weapons deal more damage per hit
That said as someone with a few games under my belt, I prefer true values
I've only played Rise so far, but I hope the main team keeps weapon customization. I like it a bunch and it can really change your playstyle like you said. I also hope they make endgame less random. I didn't realize Safi and Kulve gave random weapons. Seems like it would be real annoying especially with them having rotating availability.
Hate to say, but monster hunter endgames are always built on randomness, that's just how they are
@@michaelbailey1242 Random weapon drops from Kulve and Safi aren't even in the same ball park as charms and monster parts.
@@michaelbailey1242 A little randomness is ok, for example if you actually get the rare drop you want. My problem is having no way to affect it at all. For example I don't like how talismans are done in Rise and Sunbreak. It's completely random and I can't affect what type of talisman I want. Luckily talismans are extra in my opinion.
Now to go back to Sunbreak again, I don't like the armour Augmentation. You can randomly lose defense, skills, affinity, or resistance, or you can can gain a skill. I don't like it and haven't touched it. That's what I mean.
@@jandixon1867 My logic for the armour augments is the following, if you lose defence; refuse the augment... if you gain a skill that benefits you without sacrificing skills; add the augment, if you aren't a speedrunner you don't need a perfect augment
for example, getting Artillery on the Almudron Helm X, for impact phial CB it is perfect, and despite prefering Element Phials, it will come in handy for later
sure it's a logical nightmare for speedrunners and those who want to min-max, but overall it allows you to improve your current setup, but it isn't so big a boost that you absolutely need to do it
They should let you choose a preferred upgrade like a skill or slot upgrade at the cost of extra afflicted parts per roll to increase the chance of getting it. That would give afflicted parts another use while making the players that dislike the rng happier while still preserving the rng to an extent
While Rise & Sunbreak are the only MH games I've played (though I have World so I'll get to that eventually), just from the descriptions given, I think I'd prefer the portable approach.
Monsters in Master Rank: Definitely prefer portables approach here. While having lists upon lists of monsters could be daunting, as long as they variants are distinct from one another moveset and armor/weapon wise, I don't think there's a problem. The problem I had with the Apex monsters was that they didn't have their own gear. So outside of getting High Rank mats for Decorations, there was no reason to go back and fight them.
Final Bosses and the Role of Flagship Monsters: Gotta go with mainline. Having the credits roll after beating Magnamalo, when you still have Ibushi and Narwa to deal with is jarring.
Damage Numbers: Portable. Easily. Having those random high numbers is pretty confusing. Like the weapon is going up to 1000+ damage, so I guess these 600+ ones are garbage right? Thats probably not the case but thats the problem with those silly high numbers.
Procedurally Generated Content: I prefer Portable's fixed content but the idea of randomly generated hunts could be fun. It's basically what we have at the moment with Investigation Quests in Sunbreak.
Endgames: Gotta go with Portable. Hunting a monster to get mats to make their gear is preferable over praying to RNGesus that I'll get a good random weapon/armor drop. In my opinion, it also lets me experiment with new weapon types easier since I know what is on each weapon & armor set and what mats I need to get.
Weapon movesets: Portable. More movesets lets you play the game in more ways than one. No player will play the same with multiple movesets.
Combat: Just from the sound of it, portable. Maybe I won't mind World's combat but I'll have to see for myself. Though I'm sure the "realistic" games' fights are made with the system in mind.
Themes and Motiffs: I don't know older MH soundtracks so draw. Music is music. If there is a good track, I couldn't care less if it references a theme in it. If it sounds good, I'm sold.
So to tldr; portable all the way. Even with that in mind I'd definitely like to go backwards and play the games I've missed out on. I tried the demo for MH3 or 4 on the 3ds and didn't enjoy it because I thought it played weird. I think I'd enjoy them now, especially now that I have experience with a MH game.
World design, soundtrack, mood and fighting monsters in mainline is way better than portable series by a long shot and combat in Rise/Sunbreak are too over the top and make the fight too easy and not fun at all.
When fighting monsters in mainline you have to think carefully on when and where to attack but in rise you just spam skill and counter all day heck even in gen you need to actually damage monsters to use skill while in rise you have 4 skills on short cooldown that deal insane damage.
While I prefer mainline series I still like some of the portable stuff like palicos build and silly anime Monster
Portable games are for gameplay. Console/"Main" for presentation and roping in new players. Basically.
How much harder or easier do you think older or newer games would be with less or more mechanics remember bringing whetstones or if they brought back the hero pose potion animation or vice versa mh1 with silkbinds
29:25 Ah this makes sense
Interesting to see apexes have now come to sun break via anomaly investigations, definitely wasn’t expecting that
Great Video
Im pretty sure that Apex monsters do have MR versions in anomaly investigations btw. And I never thought about the portable team not replacing even base version when there's variants. I didn't like the new variants in Iceborne didn't get Arch Tempered versions tho
Apex do indeed have a MR version given they have a MR material tab in the hunters notes. It's just that..they don't drop anything really unique to them as of yet. Just a slight change in the drops but not anything significant.
I was listening while eating and I thought the skill share ad was part of the discussion for a second. 🤣