Thoughts on Yu-Gi-Oh VS Pokemon Digimon Vanguard TCGs
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 พ.ย. 2024
- Today we'll be talking about how Yugioh compares to other large TCGs. How does Yugioh stack up to major card games like Pokemon, Cardfight Vanguard, Digimon and others?
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Digimon is so well designed it actually feels so good to play
agreed! It feels so nice to draw everytime you digivolve
Would be nice if i could get a starter deck for under 30$ so i could try it out.... Doesn't seem worth the investment.
@@Jessevibes depending on which starter it's worth it. The singles from Gaia red pay for itself. U get 2 Gaia forces which is $20 a pop and the greymons are $5-6.
@@Jessevibes not worth 20 but the booster packs are worth
some poeple might disagree.. a friend of mine says it sucks because of the chrono clash mechanic.. it failed in the past and bandai is still trying to push that mechanic.. i disagree with him because the games go so fast..
Digimon has almost totally lured me away from YGO at this point. Definitely the sickest new TCG around, and the best designed one I’ve seen...just about ever
You'll be back.
They always come back.
This is how many iterations of Digimon gee idk. Force of will comes to mind aswell. 2016 ohh it'll kill Magic yea right. Not to take away from your geniune experience but new tcgs don't last long won't come near the big 3 heck won't even come near Vanguard.
@@orkyo Flesh and Blood wants to know your location
I've always loved digimon. Now it has the best tcg. About to sell my Pokemon cards for a digimon booster box
@@matthewoldridge9278 lol 😂
Tbh I think that Vanguard does the idea of playing cards without costs the best. Yes, you can call (summon) as many rearguards (monsters) as you want and for free because most rearguards don't have a cost to play them. But, because the main way you have to block incoming damage is by using your cards in hand, you're playing a game of risk and reward for every rearguard you call. That and the fact that there are actually two resource types in CFV and they're mainly used to pay costs for effects.
The soul and the damage zone, but I'd argue the prize shield zones from Pokemon and duel masters are a good way to indicate a victory though damage zone cards do damage the ability of the user when it's a card from the deck but most decks require consistency to play.
I've only played Vanguard and Yugioh. Vanguard was extremely fun and the card game is constantly evolving, maybe it might be a lot for some, but there are just so many different deck varients that I don't get bored. Of course there is still a meta but, there are just many different decks to play. I also love the amount of interaction between players with the guard system. Deck building isn't super difficult either, it's just all about ratios.
The way the guard system ,drive/damage checks and trigger mechanics work together. Makes for a very fun experience. Surviving because you got a 15k shield thanks to drive checking a crit last turn is great.
@@blanahaha While I do like the drive trigger system on paper, ultimately it makes it look like none of your decisions matter and that it all just comes down to who drive checks a trigger through the other's shield
@@defectivesickle5643 Try the game out, it takes some getting used to but once you figure out ratios, triggers very rarely steal games. Unless you bricked and just have no shield, but bricking happens in every game.
@@machina5 I have played the gane for years, albeit not at a very competitive level, and maybe my drive check bias comes from me maining a Daikaizer Goeagle deck. Even then, I can't say that the system promotes very much skillful gameplay, and more so to create the hype factor than anything else.
@@defectivesickle5643 Yeah your bias definitely does stem from your deck choice. You built a deck that lives and dies by its drive check, most decks aren't like that.
I started playing Digimon end of January and I can say that due to my YGO background it has made it easier to understand Digimon and how to go about the way I play and deck build👍 I thank YGO for that🙏 and I HIGHLY recommend any and all YGO players try out other TCGs. It gives you a breathe of fresh air... ESPECIALLY if you’re feeling burnt out from YGO.
*I also STRONGLY feel that DigimonTCG is here to stay🙏
I hope DIGIMON stays because coming from yugioh, it’s so refreshing and the card art is awesome. They messed up the product roll out but hopefully it doesn’t fail as a TCG!
Base Yugioh: One normal summon per turn.
Rush Duels: WHY YES WE NORMAL SUMMON UNTIL WE HAVE NO CARDS
one normal summon per turn and you still make your opponent scoop after 40 minutes of just vomiting the extra deck on the board
@@vvv_vimeru668 or normal summon Aliester the Invoker, search Invocation.
@@leoornstein3963 yeah there's one monke deck every now and then
You know bc the way that rush duels is set up it still doesn’t feel overwhelming with all the summoning. In Og Yugioh it lets you summon only once per turn but has tons of ways to special summon a crazy amount of times and is very overwhelming. Rush duels is actually very balanced and tons of fun
Vanguard is actually having its reboot come out next month. For any interested in getting into it the 5 starter decks are $4 each.
Plus the booster set combined with the starter decks have a total of 10 main archetypes with 2 per nation so those can mix between each other as well. The 10 decks also all have very unique play styles from one another.
I'm still waiting for my starter decks to come in 😅. But yeah I totally agree, it not like the other card games either especially with this new 5 nation support route
I don’t play Vangaurd but I swear every time I hear about it, it’s getting another reboot.
@@calvinbarboza eh it's only had 2 in the span of nearly 11 years so it's honestly not bad. Plus they are claiming to be designing it in a way that they won't reboot again (for context they switched design teams for this reboot due to the previous formats meta and pacing.)
What is cool is every format from before the reboot does get yearly or semi-annual support so even if the new format isn't your thing there are still official tournaments and product for the others.
I would love to see team aps duel in other type of card games, could be separate channels to keep it more organized but it just sounds fun
Yeah, I'd like to see them discuss Vanguard more in particular and maybe even play now and then. :)
Especially with the reboot thats coming now would be the time.
While Vanguard is more popular, I feel like Buddyfight was quite underrated for some time. Although, near the end it did kind of succumb to power creep. But they tried a lot of new and interesting ideas - the gauge and draw system was a kind of novel way to give players a chance to fix their opening hand without resorting to some form of a mulligan. Not to mention, they came out with a deck like mummies, where you can play any number of copies of the monsters in the deck, which I found fascinating.
“Other card games come and go”
*Vanguard celebrating its 10th anniversary and doing better than ever....
Yesss overdress is so good.
How TF is Vanguard sameey? Team Aps be crazy lol :)) and rush duels is unique he said. Vanguard can summon entire hand too wtf, and its from before rush
@@YGOHermit I actually kinda think he just played one or two games and then decided it was the same as every other cardgame that is not yugioh... so... yeah...
@@Jorch101 Really dislike uninformed statements like these.
....he has clearly not touched Overdress
I just started playing Cardfight Vangaurd and I like it as a means to play something different, I’m a long time Yu Gi Oh player.
I started playing vanguard last year and I’m thinking of dropping yugioh entirely to focus on vanguard especially with the release of overdress series.
I love vangaurd. Its the first card game I’ve really been able to get into. People dislike the luck aspect but I enjoy it
Which do you recomend i would like to know since i can only focus on one
@@abuukarez5161 I use Shadow Paladin but Royal Paladin or Kagero are good as well.
@@ITACHI_UCHIHA1016 but overdress doesn't have these
For me, after playing Yu-Gi-Oh! and Cardfight vanguard, I like vanguard better. I feel more in control in vanguard then Yu-Gi-Oh!. Not to mention there are little to no cards that have flat out have little negates for cards, and if they do it’s a heavy ass requirement. Not to mention I love the trigger mechanic more. Vs Yu-Gi-Oh! Where you can’t do pretty much anything if your opponent has the right board. I still love Yu-Gi-Oh! But I prefer Vanguard a lot more honestly.
Vanguard is getting another reboot. Starter decks will be $4 USD and its a good time to get into it.
Reference?
Another reboot. That’s troubling. Why get into the game if it keeps rebooting and you can’t play with your old cards . Two reboots means that the games not working and I don’t want to get into it and then face the third reboot
@@spencersss1251 the head of the bushiroad said in person on the weekly vanguard stream that this will be the last re-boot/ rotation and that vanguard is not a rotating game. old cards can still be played in premium format. the reason the game rebooted a second time is because the first reboot was a powercreeped mess and they ended up firing the entire design team and hiring a new one. i highly recomend getting into Vanguard overDress.
@@spencersss1251 it's the same as new master rules or new summoning mechanics.
All the reboot is. Is a new standard format for the new cards. New mechanic (over dress and over trigger) also making it easier to get into and just general making it better.
You can still play premium (old cards) and use standard in those decks.
@@redv2413 Actually what he said is that it's the last planned reboot and they will try to avoid rebooting in the future. You can't say vanguard won't reboot again because Bushiroad haven't outright said they'll never reboot again. And a future reboot is a legitimate concern going forward.
Premium format is very devicive though, it split the player base in 2 throughout Vera and for Premium to be playable you need to be lucky and live in an area where you have enough people playing it. Many stores couldn't support premium format because they just didn't have the numbers.
I do like that Overdress is cheap to get into but lets be real, they are cheap because bushiroad needed to be drastic in recruiting players due to how they handled their games lately. It'll be interesting to see if future decks go back to their normal pricing too.
Yugioh was my first card game to collect, followed up with Pokémon. Vanguard was my favorite game to play on a competitive level. But Yugioh will always stick with me because that’s just how I grew up. I want to play vanguard more and I want to enjoy it, but Yugioh will always be there for me to play and fall back on.
I collect & play Yu-Gi-Oh cards, for many years now, when I play it's for pure fun I'm a good sport, win or lose!
I would love to see the team play Magic or Yugioh with the Professor from Tolerian Community College!
Please make this happen!!!
Tolarian
Team APS DIGIMON battles would be so dope!
I would go deep in on true Digimon Card Game content.
Don't worry about pack openings. Just talk to me about the meta and show me gameplay!
Agreed. Love Digimon. Would love to see them dabble in it, while still staying true to the OC.
Agreed!
Played yugioh and Pokémon. Now I’m into Digimon and it’s been my favourite up to date.
Honestly I love Digimon and CFV. That would be so dope having some epusodes with those.
Rush Duels card layout I really like while being extremely clean looking
I WISH YGO would get full arts already. Every other game does it. And YGO has cool and iconic enough art that people would go for it.
@@OutlawOtaku not even full art. i just wish they removed the square that has the art like in rush duel. even Magic had a new design why does ygo keeps that outdated 2000's look
It looks clean...at the cost of violating the art zone, which is something I can’t stand since the reason I play Yugioh more than others card games because each of the card look like a miniature painting.
For a while, Yu-Gi-Oh! has been my favorite TCG, but I think that, in my opinion, Cardfight Vanguard has dethroned it as my favorite.
After playing digimon for 2 months I have a different perspective on yugioh as a whole. Yugioh is a one of a kind game that I will never stop loving, but after dabbling in digimon I realised that yugioh can improve in many aspects, such as starter decks and alternative rarities, but it also has a lot of things that make the game so much more interesting, like any card not having a resource cost and the fact that you aren't locked into colores (even though digi has a cool way of allowing color mixing but I digress).
tl;dr
Yugioh will continue to stand the test of time because it's so vastly different than any other card game out there, for better or for worse.
Hi, Paul. I really love your ideas about other cardgames. I've been playing Vanguard for 5 years ( well, I moved from YGO to Vanguard), and the game is taking a new change. Yea, Vanguard does have power creeps, as well as broken combos, but it's a good game in general. I'm practicing YGO right now, and I plan on coming back the game.
I started playing Wiess Schwarz, super refreshing!
As a former competitive Yugioh player, I am LOVING the Digimon card game. Its resource system is very unique, and I love the digivolve mechanic. Anyone reading this comment should definitely check it out if you like TCGs.
Digimon is amazing lol its my favorite game atm
Actually, its resource system is not that unique. Almost all Bandai card games had that resource system before. Altough it still is unique only to Bandai's games.
honestly preffer vanguard, more back and forth and the game is overall cheaper. its like every set theres a $80 card or $200 engine i gotta play. in vanguard the essential cards are printed as Rares and have alt halo printings for bling, and they get the equivalent of 4 Secret Rares and 1 ultimate rare per box. this makes the games overall cost down
Vanguard isn’t going anywhere recently. Sure, they’re having a new reboot (even then, there’s an expanded format as well) but they’ve gone on record that they do not plan on another reboot, and that the current era has a long schedule ahead of it. It’s even the most accessible the game has been with 3-4 dollar start decks that you only need one of (unless you want to bling out) and booster set ratios that actually favors a well balanced market.
Plus, from multiple proxy games across the community, the general consensus is that the game has never felt as fresh as it does now, and that it’s leagues better from anything the previous era put out and it’s only in its first set. I wouldn’t put vanguard out yet, this one’s stronger than ever right now
Agreed, for anyone looking to branch out, Vanguard should be on your radar, there's some fun times ahead and the entry point has never been lower. I mean, complete decks for the price of a yugioh booster pack? In the west, that's practically unheard of!
I honestly don't think it'll be that you need one of, it'll probably be like yugioh where you need multiple of one deck to actually make a coherent deck but even then if you get 4 of each starter deck for the new Vanguard stuff its still only gonna run you like $20 which is really neat
@@thatlonewolfguy2878 no, it won't be like that. The starter deck has playsets of every relevant card. The decklists are known, all the card effects have been revealed and it's already out in japan. They also already have the first set. And I am not kidding, in these trial decks, you only need to replace up to about 20 cards from the booster set to make them fully competitive and most of those are lower rarity cards that won't be expensive.
This is currently one of the cheapest games to get into that we have ever seen an English release of.
@@TheNeoDaedalus oh damn well I'll definitely be picking up a few different starter decks when it releases here, I might even pre order if any good UK retailers are doing them
@@thatlonewolfguy2878 Glad to hear that, may be a bit prematurely, but: welcome to vanguard! We're not the biggest game, but you'll find plenty of passion for it, whether you want to be completely casual or play competitively :)
If you're looking for more players, you can try the subreddit or different discords to find them. There is even an official discord server for playing over webcams during the corona pandemic (the company calls it remote fight). Worst case, you can always ask me :)
i don't see vanguard being indentical to other card games, sure vanguard needs some resources but the way resources came from are different if anything buddy fight was the more identical to resource management thing in where you gather points,costs each turn. Vanguard is also having their defensive play style in where you can do actions on you opponents turn more than just guarding
First point: I like what you're doing Paul. Understanding other games is important. TCGs are already a niche interest and we don't need to divide and hate other games.
Second point: I agree with the "too similar" aspect of other card games. A game dev needs something to make the game stick- an x factor. I was talking with a friend who plays magic about the new TCG Flesh and Blood. He said that it's very similar to Magic so he might as well play MTG. It really is a fine line developing a TCG.
the old there is not originallity line is well applyed here. If you know enough you can see elements of other games in everygame. innovations come far and between and are not always valued by those who are content in wanting more of the same.
Most games also come from japan and are conencted to some anime or manga, being very similar to each other with a new coat of paint.
Out of these, I only play YuGiOh and Vanguard. They’re both very solid games, and each have their strengths.
I love Vanguard, but i wish it wasnt so expensive. Hopefully going forward with overDress, the game will be more affordable.
The start decks are $4 so far and each booster set has at least 4RRRs (The max rarity for anything now)
So the prices should be so much more manageable than it has been in recent years.
@@four-en-tee Ok well depends what you mean by expensive because the game itself is super cheap. Clan Selection added in cards that are very viable into the meta (V-Premium meta) that are extremely affordable, can literally make a viable meta deck for literally $30-$40 bucks which is amazing. In regular premium sure some strides are VERY expensive but you don't need every single one of them to make the deck viable. For example, you don't need to buy any zeroth dragons if you already have ways to win the game, it just makes it easier. Unless you really are competitive then yeah you are just gonna have to invest but if just for fun, you can still give your opponent a rough time and have fun.
@@four-en-tee meta yugioh is just as expensive if not more then vanguard. Also just like yugioh what's stopping you from playing a cheap fun deck. Overdress atm is looking to be really cheap to get into. Based on JP prices one of the top decks(nirvana) is like less then 80$ usd. We'll have to see if people keep it around that range when it releases globally.
Vanguard has interaction tho especially in the premium format (eternal format). Besides that you right about everything else.
Vanguard isn’t going anywhere though. It’s not as marketed in the US but it’s popularity and the amount of ads you see of it are much much higher in Japan
@Gearz Xcon yeah. I’m not getting into a game that’s rebooted twice . Why get into it if it’s gonna get rebooted a third time.
@@spencersss1251 vanguard reboot is more like a hard rotation, though. There’s a format where you can use all the cards but people get scared off with all the interactions. Vanguard standard is supposed to be designed where it’s not hard to get in.
@Gearz Xcon a short time span being 3 years? Other games die in much shorter amounts of time
I have fallen in love with the Digimon card game. I really hope it takes off. The idea of using vanilla' cards again because of their low cost or high power is great again. Managing a resource really making you think about what you're doing, in digimon you don't have a max hand size because it doesn't matter how many cards are in your hand you can't play them all in a turn. Thus while in Yugioh drawing 10 cards would be overpowered in other card games that have hard resources extra draws aren't as important
I play magic and cardfight vanguard,i honestly quit yugioh but i still follow it some
I think Konami's best marketing strategy is not taking down the simulators.
@@AverageSneedEnjoyer how many years ago though
What I like about vanguard is that meta decks are not necessarily win all the time in a competitive standpoint. Someone in japan won the championship in 2018(I think?) with touken ranbu which is a collab deck filled with sword boys from other game. He won in a meta infested with golds, kagero and shadows.
Paul I love these vifeos everytime you make them, because they are very informative and helpful. But one thing i can majorly disagree with is Vanguard/Dugimon/Dragonball all feel vastly different.
vanguard and dragonball are not similar??
I dunno mang, new Digimon feels pretty unique. The resource system and evolution skills make it pretty different than other games, although it shares a lot of DNA with Duel Masters/Kaijudo. It feels good to build a big ole stack...and then watch it die to gaia force.
you do know the chrono system is not new, right?
You know I was going to mention it, but I didn't want my comment to address every nit pick that exists. Yes the Chrono System is not new, it has not been used in a booster based TCG before as far as I know - so far it's been more of an LCG or ECG thing, whatever you want to call it.
Also Chroniclash system is by Bandai, and they publish Digimon content too, so they can do whatever they have stakes in.
Vanguard and Yu-Gi-Oh! Are my favorite games
I love Yugioh... just not modern Yugioh.
I also explored different cardgames recently and one that really stood out to me was Krosmaga. It is super interesting because while it has mana, the monsters that you summon also need to walk over to your opponents side over several turns in order to attack. So to me it was the ultimate planning ahead/resource management and it was a great contrast to yugioh. That being said, after I got deeper into the game I realised some things which made me "return" to yugioh, some of them you said but here are some more:
1. Having a mana system prevents steamrolling, yes, but it definitely does not make the game less frustrating. It can actually feel like a massive waste of time so sit through an entire game and having a head to head battle with your opponent, but then they draw some powerful one-of and finish you out of nowhere.
2. I really dislike the idea of classes/mana colors, because one thing I love about yugioh is that there is in principle no restriction at all on how you can build your deck. Yes there are archetype locking cards, but there is no card which says "If you have this in your deck then you can only have cards of this archetype in your deck". That together with the abundance of cards which are also not rotated away allows for so many interesting deck choices, which is amazing to me.
3. I missed having the extra deck, which I realised is something that makes yugioh perhaps more "consistent" than other games.
4. This is minor but I feel like, even though expensive, it is relatively easy to acquire specific cards in yugioh, in contrast to most digital card games where there is no "trading" aspect but you can only buy packs or craft cards in some way.
dunno if anyone cared to read this, just throwing it out there
When you played Vanguard for this exercise did you play Standard or the Extended/Eternal format (which has extra deck, and interactions which disrupts opponent's boards on their turns) I'd assume standard? (or V now since new standard inbound)
Lol, you mean Premium and V-Premium?
I doubt he played Overdress
@@addictedtoJB At time of writing the comment I was not referring to Overdress as "standard".
I think that if you play a card game for a long time, it's a nice breath of fresh air to try out something new that's coming out. I've been playing DBSCG since it first came out and I'm enjoying Digimon now as well. Our DBSCG group has gotten small because many people have left the game during difficult meta eras or when the market exploded and made cards cost four times as much so it's nice to go into Digimon with a fresh group of players like it was in the good ol' days of DBSCG.
I think it's the same feeling as when you have been following the same routine every day and one day decide to change it up. It's nice to see how your game compares to others since the newer games are (usually) trying to improve on what's already been established. DBSCG does what MTG does with resource management but lets you use every card as a resource (whether it's to use as energy or to boost attacks) while MTG requires you to play land cards that could make or break your turn (mana choke is a term for a reason).
Rush duels is the best option for yugioh, new card pool, new rules, more interaction …. Just wait 10 years and we will see how powercreep is being managed . But yeah a fresh new start
Vanguard is hands down my favorite TCG of all time, i feel more fun than i have on ygo, the OTK don't realñy exist and there's no totally unfair deck thah just destroy you with no chance of you stopping it, is more fair and fun, plus, is way cheaper than YGO so feels good to be trated well and to have good prices
I agree, i love vanguard because I always felt it takes more skill. In yugioh you ho in with one combo and Thats it and if it doesn’t work you go to game two.
Where in Vanguard, Digimon,Pokemon
You have a win condition but you have to be able to change on the fly and the game truly isn’t over till it’s over
I’ve been playing MTG’s Commander format and I’m trying to get into Digimon cause it seems SO evidently fun. But Yugioh… It’s good to bring up how Yugioh is unique. With MTG and Digimon, there is a good likelyhood that if Digimon had come out FIRST in some offshoot timeline, then it would have become the standard mold! But Yugioh would still be Yugioh. That’s how unique it is. But while that uniqueness definitely helped to make Yugioh so popular, I honestly think that it was taken in a direction that is resulting in it slowly falling apart. The aspects of yugioh could have been taken in a direction where it’d still have power creep, but not be over the top. But instead it’s gotten to a point where there are SO many rules people don’t understand and the game is nearly impossible for new players to get into
I disagree about Vanguard come and go, it recently had its 10 year anniversary, and for a card game to last this long other than the big 3 really says something, I’ve been playing yugioh since GX era (casually), then I quit, came back to it in the pendulum era by using masked hero (competitive-ish), to this day I play yugioh with my best friend and trying to finish my hero deck (Faris, increase, and liquid soldier are way too expensive). In 2016(?) I got into vanguard from my same best friend and I loved it from the very start, I preferred it over yugioh and I still do, I love the aspect that I can make a come back and that I actually have turns to play and build up rather than HOPING to get hand traps so my opponent won’t steam roll me the first turn. As for all card games being similar I tried DIGIMON and it is very different from vanguard, you use monsters in DIGIMON and evolve through using memory, but vanguard you can call anytime as long as the conditions are met, the resource in vanguard is your damage zone which is your win con, that’s why damage denying is a strategy in vanguard to not give the opponent resource, because they know they can win later and hence don’t risk giving damage the opponent. That’s all just my take on it.
I’ve always felt like I’ve loved card games or at least appreciated them, started by collecting Pokémon when it first came out but then got serious into playing with YuGiOh and eventually Duel Masters for a short time.
but this year so far thanks to the New Digimon TCG I’ve been jumping into other Card Game Communities as well by actually playing the Pokémon TCG App, playing Magic The Gathering Arena for the first time and now started watching Cardfight Vanguard’s anime series and I now feel like I have a much deeper understanding and appreciation for every popular card game that’s out right now + with Digimon TCG still being recently new it’s so easy to start collecting and playing with others through the internet + it’s got me excited to go to my first ever Locals Tournament when we all can go back to our normal lives :)
Great topic as always Team, keep doing what you’re doing + keep on sharing the love for the TCG Community.
I can’t speak on the current state of Hearthstone but they used to balance fast paced aggro decks, midrange, and control decks pretty well. As far as Pokémon TCG goes, fire decks really seem to be the fastest paced decks with Centiscorch, Charizard, and Victini decks being able to apply a lot of early pressure and disrupt the play of slower decks.
I mainly played aggro/mid range in hearthstone, I loved the feeling of hitting your timings and pushing the tempo against a control deck. Aggro vs aggro is fun but aggro vs control is where men are made.
My decks are super agressive
I would literally play this channel 24/7 if yall incorporated other TCGs like magic I like yugioh but I love magic
Force of Will is still going strong
We in the community consider it a solid Tier 2 game
We aren’t going anywhere but we know we probably won’t break through the top 3 anytime soon
Lmao touch vanguard's shit first then talk about top 3.
@@orkyo
Hope you guys are having fun with the reboot mang
@@RustinWW I don't play Vanguard but keep up the updates and Reboot is looking unanimously positive. Force of will would definitely benefit from a online simulator or phone game.
@@orkyo Where is FoW big at?
@@machina5 the online community for the game is pretty tight. After normalcy returns a bit more I’m gonna try to get a group going again at my locals
Ngl the end part kinda feels like a personal bias popping in, because comparing the smaller card games and saying they all play the same, kinda undervalue them and its players, especially when you phrased as come and go. A lot of them have similar ideas but how they function makes them unique. It's why in these games different deck types stand out.
I say this as Duel Masters players(inb4 comment about it being a dead game, it still is going hard in Japan and is Japan second best selling card game), but Duel Masters plays very unlike the DCG when you really get down to it, same with Vanguard and similar game like Wixoss they have differences.
I know the idea was to like to show Yugioh has uniqueness despite its flaws, but idk this part kinda felt like ragging on the card games and making them feel less special.
I think he used "Samey" in a sense of resource management. Which makes them feel the same.
@@romkin1197 Well even then that still kinda boils the game down to something really basic. It is like, is every anime fighting game Guilty Gear, no, that really just boils it down and makes look less diverse.
I want to get into the Digimon TCG but I can’t find any place that isn’t scalping the decks for $40 and individual packs for $10 😭
I'm actually interested to see if Paul is willing to try out Magic. Magic has the elements of resources like Digimon/Pokemon TCG with the added with a life total and ways to interact on your opponents turn like YGO with instants and activated abilities. I know he had a talk with the Prof from Tolarian Community College, and would LOVE to see another collab again seeing if both can teach each other the card game they play to the other person.
Magic is the only TCG that I can think of where you can make a computer out of a deck. Its insane. But god damn the amount of cards that won't let you play from Blue decks SUCK.
@@romkin1197 limited knowledge of the game?
that would be great.
@@goncaloferreira6429 Not sure what you're asking.
@@romkin1197 coments like the one you made that use generalizations like that make me think that you dont know the game that well. also diminishes the variety in the game and the general desing balance that usually exists. blue is not just about stopping the oponent from playing. Ifyou generalize that part of the game when speaking to other thant dont know it, you are doing a diservice to them as they will absord negativity and. for example, be less inclined to try it.
I would put it like this: magic is a game of threats and answers. threats and answers exist in all colours as mtg is a game were interactability is very important. Each colour specializes in different types of threats and answers and types of gameplay.
I played yu-gi-oh, Vanguard and Pokémon.
I'm more of a collector than a player - mainly because not many people play Yu-Gi-Oh where I live. I have a history of playing Pokémon - it got me into TCG back in the day - and I have few Dragon Ball Super decks. I got some friends to play Dragon Ball Super with my decks, but none of them got really interested in collecting and building their own decks. A couple of friends also have some Pokémon cards and decks but we rarely play, we're not collecting it anymore. I'm sticking to Yu-Gi-Oh - which I always liked more as a card game - and I convinced some friends to try playing it with my decks. I hope to get them into it.
Digimon got some attention from me but I won't try it - I doubt anyone is interested in it where I live and it seems too similar to Dragon Ball Super - which in turn seems similar to a failed zombie-themed TCG by Bandai.
resources is instrumental in a card game.Thats why pokemon can have a draw three and be just fine but yugioh cant have a draw one at full copies and the draw twos have heavy restrictions
100% agreed. I started off with OG YGO. I lost interest after Yata Lock decks (grew out of it, found other hobbies, etc); but I definitely don't regret playing it. It was super fun for me at the time. I now watch YGO TCG videos from time to time but it's too intimidating to get back into for many personal reasons: aged artworks (its a big thing for me), essays on each card, complexity (its a good thing but not for accessibility), and $$.
I recently got back into playing TCG casually (I've played Pokemon and Magic alongside YGO in the past) because of the artworks - mainly the "full art" cards; can you tell I'm a sucker for amazing artworks? I'm now playing Digimon and Pokemon. I enjoy the artworks, simplicity (yet complex enough), and accessibility. I'm also looking forward to Lorcana when it drops.
I hope for YGO Rush Duel to do well.. but it definitely won't overtake mainstream YGO. I enjoy the new look a lot more. Time will tell if I ever touch YGO again (YGO Rush Duel, specifically).
I grew up playing yugioh but recently trying to get into other games. Force of will and vanguard are those games. Having fun learning and collecting
Honestly the resource management to me is why I dislike Yu-Gi-Oh, because the game to me almost encourages players to adopt the "you either win right here right now turn 1 or you just lose" mentality.
I´ve played Yugioh for almost 15 Years now and just recently discovered Vanguard. And honestly it took me away from Yugioh a little bit.
In the last few Years a just haven´t felt that connected to Yugioh. The Anime since Vrains just didn´t catch me and the cards just feel unpersonaly to me.
In Vanguard though I see the Idea in every Deck theme and the Soul that stands behind it. I always wanted to try it and since the new OverDress Format came out at the beginning of 2021 I got a chance to try it without being overwhelmed with too many cards and mechanics.
In Vanguard i just feel the spirit behind the cards while in Yugioh I feel like cards come out to sell good, like when new Blue-Eyes support comes out once again.
I don´t know if I loose the track of Yugioh soon but in Vanguard I think I found what I lost in Yugioh years ago. So maybe it´s for the better to shift my priorities, though Yugioh will always be something special to me.
I like the idea of Rush Duel and I'm currently trying it out with EDOPro.
Other on my list are Cardfighter Vanguard, Legends of Runeterra, Marvel Snap & Pokemon TCG Live..
You should really try out Magic! Started it a few weeks ago and its really fun. Has the slower ramp up like Pokemon/Digimon etc., but also the interaction in your opponents turn with Instant spells etc.
Maybe do a collab with TCCC where he teaches you MTG (and maybe even vice versa)
this
Well I will say this me being a huge Dragon Ball fan myself, I noticed that most people don't even really care that much for the card game when it comes to Dragon Ball. That's mainly because of the popularity of the video games, Manga and especially the anime of it as well. While I do have a few Dragon Ball cards, they are more or less for fun of collecting Dragon Ball merchandise. Granted I still have quite a bit of Yu-Gi-Oh cards. I probably have at least somewhere between 400-600 cards if not more. That's not even including the ones that my friend is holding onto for me.
I think YGO is really fun, and it's super exciting to see so many varied themes compete against each other (you've got the Roman Legion with dragons, Star-Wars-meets-Wizard-of-Oz, Pseudo Sentai, and more!), but it does get rather messy with so many powerful boss monsters, and I admittedly don't like that. Also, I'm rather bummed that the new Dragunity support is being squeezed into Ghosts from the Past rather than getting its Structure Deck R released here in the TCG.
I think MTG is great, too - its mana system (IMO) keeps the pace of the game under control fairly well (though there have been several really, really over-tuned cards). I also think there's value in how its themes are more cohesive (in contrast to YGO). It also has several formats that fit all sorts of different player goals, which other games don't really do all that well (YGO mainly has Advanced; Traditional feels almost like an afterthought, and not much attention is given to ways for 3 or 4 players to duel each other).
The PKMN TCG, despite its current supply problems, is also a really enjoyable game (though its success seems to be far more due to collecting than gameplay, which I somewhat dislike). Its gameplay is simpler, which isn't necessarily bad, and (IMO) allows it to be a great way to start playing TCGs, and notably, it has enough depth that you can continue playing it without it feeling too straightforward. The game itself, though, seems to be exclusively for 2 players, and there seems to be minimal support for non-Standard formats (even Expanded feels lacking in recognition and reprinting).
Have not played the Digimon TCG, but it looks really exciting. Adapting the Chrono Clash system seems like a very promising decision. There's a supply issue here as well, but if the game persists, it may well become another titan in the TCG world.
I've been thinking of starting Cardfight Vanguard, but I'm a little hesitant with Overdress coming. It looks cool, but I personally really liked one of the Nova Grappler archetypes from before, and I suspect the time-skip will mean that particular deck will not quite appear. Might build a (casual) V-Series deck anyway.
Outside of that, I also really like KeyForge, which I'd say works really hard to minimize the high cost of getting a competitive TCG deck, and I was interested in giving Future Card Buddyfight a shot (a real shame it's coming to an end).
Loving digimon so far myself as for yugioh, the speed duels would have been so much better if they didn't make it to where you need to buy whole new product just to play with cards you already potentially have
You should definitely play some Magic since you said haven’t played it before. It is definitely the middle ground between Pokémon and YGO. I think that has to do with it being the oldest of the three card games. Pokémon can be seen as taking their game design from the resource management aspects of Magic, as opposed to YGO which leans more into the interactivity of the game. While YGO has more inherent differences from Magic, such as the extra deck and the ability to immediately play cards. Magic is definitely the closest to Yugioh because of instant spells that can disrupt combos and attacks.
The reason why I like Magic the Gathering so much is all of the different formats. Cards that are normally not playable are now very powerful. Draft is a great way to start playing for cheap. It is only about $15 and if you get good at it then it will transfer to other formats.
Draft is the shit and an even playing field to show off skill/knowledge.
Wait so what happens with the cards when things change. You just can’t play with your deck and have to buy a new one? Sure yugioh ban list hit some decks but mostly it’s just one or two cards
@@spencersss1251 That is the trade off. Sometimes rotation doesn’t actually change a whole lot, but if there is a deck you hate it will eventually rotate. It keeps the value of cards lower also.
In yugioh you have no choice but to play the most competitive format unless you play goat.
A sense of progresion is what pretty much all other games have and yugioh lacks.
in pokemon there is no interaction between turns but there is interaction between players, like gusting and removing energies and hand disruption. There are also some choices to be made during your opponent turn.
not knowing about mtg is a big flaw when discussion tcgs. i guess trying other games is a start. What about digital card games? Runeterra has the latest design evolution with the changes to how turns work and mythgard uses positional play very well, bringing back a bit of what Scrolls did right.
2:59 of course the yugioh example of interaction would be negates.
I highly recommend Kohdok’s series the 7 Deadly Sins of Card Games. He does a pretty good job of explaining and going through a lot of design stuff like power creep it was interesting
That dude is a meme in the vanguard community.
@Oligoden most of his reasons are super outdated. The game and the show have changed so much that none of his points still apply, and even when it came out it was still pretty uninformed.
I gotta say the number one card game I miss the most is Legen of the Five Rings. Me and my friends used to play it every day for hours back in Highschool. Multiple ways to win, unique setting, great art, fun mechanics. It's a shame that it failed.
Vanguard is going wild right now. It's fantastic.
Edit: "Digimon doesn't feel that much different from Vanguard"
...Are you *sure* you've played Vanguard? lol
Edit 2: We aren't getting Rush Duels because we have Speed Duels.
I can’t wait for Overdress to come out and watching the anime made me want to try out Yuyu’s Dragon Empire deck
I've played MtG, Pokemon, Yugioh, Force of will, DBS, L5R, and Kaijudo on a semi competitive level and Digimon is my favorite tcg yet.
Yup digimon is my favorite so far and I've played Yugioh ever since I was like 5, I'm 25 now. Lol
Wanna give digimon a try but the artwork is so hit and miss.
im a pokemon tcg player by heart
but i see the value in spreading out to other card games
like yeah i've been playing yugioh lately and i love it
i don't think it's perfect but hell yeah i can take a afternoon and just dual and i'll have a good time
I prefer more effort into Pokemon but I do play duel links
Yugioh prizing is inferior to other TCG’s. We don’t win money at big tournaments, but MTG and Pokémon offer competitors the chance to win cash.
I think that some decks have a resource that they pool from, and those decks are inherently less strong because they have to build up that resource AND play Yu-Gi-Oh. The best example that I can think of is Endymion/Mythical Beast decks. They rely on Spell Counters being on the field, and the more Spell Counters the better. So these decks have to build up that resource while playing against a deck that doesn't need any sort of resource, and that's what makes these decks bad. I don't know. I think that resource decks in Yu-Gi-Oh are fun to play, but I want to see one become Tier 1 or something.
On a separate note, I've been super wanting to get into the Digimon TCG, specifically a Green deck. Anyone know of any good stuff to keep an eye out for? I want to build a deck sealed first
If you are really wanting to play sealed only green, then you are going to have to wait. The green starter deck, as well as purple and black, is delayed until june 11th along with the next set.
Yeah, I'd definitely want to wait until summer so that I'm out of school
You should try Weiß Schwarz or Force of Will.
They're still alive and good to go
Force of Will is trash. Too complicated and has rotation.
@@Kai-jn7pn FoW is nowhere near as complicated as YGO, and yes it has rotation like magic but it also has a eternal format
and the art is better
Look I'm not comparing this game to Yu-gi-oh. FOW is just basically MTG but with lands being in a separate deck. Boring.
@@Kai-jn7pn ruler system, different mechanics it IS a different game from magic
I went pretty hard into Digimon these last few weeks. Bought two booster boxes, 2 of the green, purple and black starters and a bunch of new sleeves. I'm mostly playing with my friend over the internet because getting the cards in Canada is a bit hard for most shops, at least in my city. I hope that will change soon because more people need to try this game. The art is fantastic, the card quality is superb and the gameplay is fun and refreshing if you're taking a break from MTG and Yugioh like I am. Bandai just needs to come out with some official multiplayer rules for 3+ people and the game is perfect.
I'll be keeping my eye on Yugioh Rush and buy a starter deck to try it out when the time comes. Also from what I hear about the Dragon Ball Super card game is that it's fantastic and the cards hold very high value as even just collectibles. I hope the three games I've talked about succeed and are here to stay.
I came back to Yugioh because of Speed Duels, i played as a kid and I just couldn't get into modern yugioh because at the time i was playing back then, there were no Synchros, no XYZ, no Pendulums, no Links, all that is extremely confusing for me and that's why I decided to play only Speed Duels, the problem is that Yugioh stopped supporting it and almost no one knows about speed duels. I decided to try MTG, Pokemon and Digimon, after playing those games, I got very angry at Yugioh, so I quit Yugioh, but came back after giving Master Duel a chance but I think I'm gonna focus more in MTG and Pokemon, I just don't like Yugioh that much.
0:01 Epic voice crack
absolute power move to keep it in the video though
Great video, I agree with a lot of your points! As much as I love yugioh, I've been taking a break from it to play Digimon and I am loving it!
Tbh Vanguard cards are my third fav after MTG, and then first YGO ofc. Their artworks look amazing, but card design wise, they don't really look like trading cards imho. Well, everyone plays what he/she wants, if TCG then it will be always YGO for me.
Yugioh is to card games as Marvel vs Capcom is to fighting games. Shit is super polarizing and toxic but at the end of the day its fun what you can do in it.
I've played every game you've mentioned with th exception of pokemon. I have to say what killed yugioh for me in recent years was the speed at which people could just go through their whole deck and OTK. In my opinion special summoning wasn't so special anymore and hand traps ruined the point of trap cards. Digimon is honestly the most balanced and fun card game I've played in the last year. Vanguard is fun but can be too heavily chance based because of the trigger system.
I have recently been trying to play YGO. I haven't played the game since around 2005ish. Last time I played the yugioh GX show was just starting to come out, and the game felt amazing to play. Right now, it just feels overwhelming how many chains and combos can go into a single turn. I mean, I have some idea of what I am doing with link cards and what not, and I will sit here playing out my turn for minutes on end sometimes. It is just silly. I am not saying this is horrible, but I much preferred the old style of play where I could build trap decks and what not. Enticing the opponent to attack a flip, trap or what not. It was simple but had a high thought process at the same time (at least from how I remember it).
@@chumbaman777 it is quite ridiculous especially when there are so many effect monsters that trigger on your turn making it seem like the opponent is playing on your turn. The power creep just became too absurd and there are too many archetypes to keep up with now. Oh yeah and there is too much focus on the extra deck.
@@Tai182 the extra deck thing sucks imo. Honestly, if they kept all the systems but slashed the extra deck the game would probably feel a lot better to me.
I play pokemon and yugioh. My issue with one vs the other is, pokemon will givr u top tier decks via their battle arena boxes every six months or so. We get reprints and alternate arts of top meta cards needed to compete. I was able to pick up a playset of a top meta draw engine in pokemon for 11 bucks, that same engine would be 400 in yugioh. Yugioh also takes years to support their catalog, especially the anime based archetypes. In pokemon if i wamna play a certain deck, i can get it for 100 bucks, even if its a top tier deck. In yugioh, if i wanna play an anime themed deck, say, dark magician, it costs 300-500 to get that deck, and idk when support will come for tht deck. It took almost 20 years for cyber dragon to get to where it is. If koonami released their anime themed deck archetypes in like a 100 dollar box set every so often, with current, and updated cards, i feel it would be easier to play the decks you want and keep up with them and not pay so much for prices of certain cards. I also hate how in yugioh a meta deck can be 500 bucks and then reprints and ban liat will kill your investment. But in pokemon, that same teir 0 meta deck will cost you at most 120, and itll be better after rotation in their expanded or unlimited format and still be top tier across all three formats.
Here's the thing with the thing. The speed at where Yu-Gi-Oh is right now is too damn fast. When you think about it, it's kinda stupid we have link monsters. How generic can an extra deck summoning get? Maybe that played a big part as to why we didn't get a new extra deck summoning method? But the breakneck speed is kinda addicting though to an extent. Konami really wants the game to be fast paced. But not kill the interactivity, so they made hand traps good. But hey that's just a theory a game theory.
In Pokemon, it takes tops 3 turns to wipe out a Pokemon V but that's due to no Pokemon tcg having Pokemon give out more prize cards equal to 6 prizes sure, you can't OTK but you can chip on Pokemon HP so that next turn you force the opponent to either heal or switch.
Resource management is the one constant present in every other ccg that is totally absent in yugioh so yea makes sense
If you want to get more into vanguard, I'd suggest checking out premium grandblue builds! They're very GY centric and allow for disruption on the opponent's combos
premium is too much for a new player
Fun Fact: Akira Ito the Co-Creator of Cardfight!! Vanguard was an assistant of Kazuki Takahasi the creator of Yugioh.
That being said, Vanguard has been my favorite card game since it came out and the one I actively play at a competitive level. Personally, I just like drive checks making the game have a reasonable level of luck involved. I've seen other people cite Triggers as a "bad mechanic" because it adds an uncertain outcome into the game, however I see triggers as added factor into the game that needs to be accounted for when playing the game. Since there are only 16 trigger units in a player's deck, being aware of the likelihood of your opponent seeing a trigger unit during their drive / damage check becomes really important at high level play.
I still like Yugioh at a casual level, I'm just not a fan of how volatile the game can be at times at the competitive level
Magic is something I play to hang out with my dad, so I'm not too sure about how I feel about the game itself (Like, I like playing with my dad and don't see myself playing at a local and I don't have friends that play).
Pokemon, Weiss Schwartz and Digimon are all fun and I enjoy playing those on occasion.
I was a longtime Yu-Gi-Oh player, having played for most of my life, but have completely switched over to Vanguard since I’ve found it cheaper and more enjoyable than Yu-Gi-Oh. As much fun as Yu-Gi-Oh is, I will stan Vanguard purely because I find it more enjoyable
Competitive Pokemon is more fun when it's going through the early game but the bonuses you get in the main game is why vanguard is my top 3, 1st being Pokemon tcg, Vanguard then yugioh and I exclusively play yugioh in duel links
I'd recommend trying out Grand Archive. It's a very unique game imo, in that you have a Hero/Champion like the WoW TCG, and most creatures work like in Magic, but your resource system works in two different ways. To play cards from your hand, you place cards in your hand face-down as a resource, then on the start of your next turn those cards return to your hand. But, if you play a card from your Champion/Regalia deck at the start of your turn, you pay their costs by sending your face down cards to the graveyard instead (any extra still return to your hand). I've enjoyed it the few times I've been able to play it so far, and I'd love to see more people try it out.
Hey Paul, have you tried the Dragonball card game?
It borrows elements from a bunch of card games, I really like how it handles lands (any card can be used as a land, some cards have bonus effects as lands)
They use Leader cards, almost like Deck Masters from that filler arc of Yugioh, which have archetypes tied to them. There are still colors like Magic, mostly used for staples between the colors or running engines/archetypes together. There is also a lot of player interaction as cards can activate on your opponents turn.
The game is really battle heavy but it doesn't feel caveman at all, I think it's really underrated!
I just wish Bandai wasn't handling it, they have a huge audience of people that would try it by virtue of it being DBZ but they've not really pushed it. No simulator (despite having a fully functioning one for a tutorial app), no real marketing, etc.
The game isn't even in the title of this video or in the thumbnail. Shows you how shit Bandai are at advertising the game.
I've tried my hand at digital "tcg's" over the past year, from Hearthstone to Shadowverse, but none of them kept me playing for more than a few days.. Gotten used to the speed in YGO.
Personal thought, in modern Yugioh there should also be a version of the game played with no Exodia deck allowed whatsoever(Just the 5 Pieces, not the others), then 20,000 life points per player, and a 50 card minimum to create a new game strategy across a longer game. That way the game would actually near the completion of the decks and you’d both get to play really drawn out strategies as well as drawn out combo turns. That would turn that iteration of the game from a 5-15 turn game into a 20-35 turn game. IMHO, that’s more fun and on a deck system like that in 35 turns you could easily go through the entire minimum 50 card deck on many modern strategies.
That’s an idea I’ve had lately, and been experimenting with it. It definitely does make the game more fun for sure because there’s way more back and forth. Just keep the ban/limited list the same, keep the 15 card Side/Extra Deck rule, and you’ve basically got a whole refresh of the game right there that will really liven up the game 😁👍🏼
Side Note: It makes Blue-Eyes and Dark Magician Decks absolutely insane too!!! Good old times hahaha
I know I only played Yugioh until 2006 aprox, but we knew this differences. I often read people complaining about the old yugioh players as if we didn't realized how op Pot of greed was... and we knew.
In my region we called it the "Advantage law", and it was basically "how much card advantage this card will give me against my opponent".
Of course, yugioh now is not the game I played, the synchros, xyz & pendulum monsters have altered the basic rules into something else. But there are things that have stayed the same.
Also, in another video it was implied that in "old yugioh" people just used powerful cards without arquetypes or combos in mind... And sure, there weren't that many explicit archetypes (I remember someone who used a Gravekeeper deck and I though was very very cool) and the Chaos decks were pretty open, but a lot of us had decks heavely based on combos or synergies. First turn last turn, manticores, burners, aqua return...
Btw, did they support the Gravekeeper arquetype, or they just forgot about it?
Edit: And about the uniqueness of Yugioh... I could agree, but I recommend anyone who wanna try a very very unique card game to try netrunner. It's an asymmetric one where one player controls the corporation and the other a hacker trying to gain access to their information. Extremely recommended, even though it's a very complex game. And it's only alive because of its community.
I would like to see a sequel to this video and possibly have the rest of the team way in as well with there thoughts.
I think you should look into Magic more as it has resource management and generally slower games, but does run on life as the main win condition and offers the ability to respond and interact with the opponents turn.
Cardfight vanguard is amazing
Gotten into Digimon and I have fallen in love with it. I personally don't think it's a "clone" of Magic as the memory gauge, to me, is veey unique and limits your plays. Plus things like Blockers and Security effects allow for that element of interaction. I will always love Yugioh but the last year I felt my passion wane, maybe because of cov6and not getting to play in person
Yeah 1 advantage about Digimon is the ability to have locals again though some people are still afraid most arent and just wanna play with shiny cardboard again.
I've played a lot of other card games and i definitely think you didnt give them enough justice but overall you had some good points.
I definitely feel vanguard was unique on its own before digimon came but vanguard is 10 years old and digimon just came out so i can't say its vanguard fault :P
Also digimon came out in just the right time as vanguard is getting a reboot which totally destroys everything that makes it special with getting rid of the variety of clans and playstyles of choices you had to choose from. Still i love vanguards way to forbid you from playing generic shit were they shouldn't be played and everything seems well planned overall. But rip to that with overdress.
Digimon so far has been reminding me a lot of early vanguard which was a great time for me personally. I hope they don't powercreep the game to the point that they reboot.
Was definitely nice hearing someone's insight who hasn't played religiously other games though, i think you gave me some arguments on yugioh that i hadn't thought about.
Good shit.