The Lionel Messi GOAT debate surfaces AGAIN! | ESPN FC Extra Time
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ก.ค. 2024
- The Lionel Messi GOAT debate surfaces AGAIN! | ESPN FC Extra Time
Shaka Hislop, Craig Burley and Don Hutchison join Dan Thomas on ESPN FC Extra Time to answer all your questions.
0:00 Don’s return to FC!
1:37 Who is the most down-to-earth player they’ve ever met?
2:30 Who does Craig rate more: Ole Gunnar Solskjaer or Gareth Southgate?
3:00 Why are so many penalties missed?
5:00 How is Lionel Messi not the GOAT?
6:15 Grueling preseason memories.
11:00 Craig’s memories of Walsall.
11:49 Will Rangers be first on Shaka’s Power Rankings this season?
12:20 Did Craig let criticism get to him as a player?
13:20 Craig referring to Scotland and Chelsea as “we.”
16:45 Space exploration possibilities.
#ESPNFC #FCExtraTime #ExtraTime
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Don't mind them, they will always find an excuse. Even if Messi walks on water, they will still say is because he cannot SWIM.
Hahaha hahaha
If he wins the World Cup it will be because he didn't do it with another team other than Barca, if he moves from Barca at 40 years old and scores 50 goals a season for 5 seasons in the premier league they will say the premier league is no longer great and he left the best league in the world La Liga because things got too hard.
Nothing will ever be good enough, the goalposts will forever move.
Best comment ever
Lmaooooo
You can't go into a debate of GOATs by choosing whoever has World Cup titles under them or else we need to see more Goalkeepers and Defenders enter this debate then. Instead that should count as additional points for tie breakers since a player naturally doesn't want to betray their nationality just to win a World Cup imagine if Cristiano Ronaldo and/or Messi joined Spain in the World Cup bro easily thats 3 back to back wins for Spain and they would leap way over Pele and Maradona. Remember that players could switch nationalities if they live in that country for more than two years as resident of that nation, so respect to players who choose to remain in their birth country despite the chance of winning a World Cup, that's what I call patriotism.
He has not won the world cup, but at this point he has remained on top for like 15 years, when I was 7 messi was considered the best, all these years later and he still is, that's greatness, that's my GOAT
Thats facts hes been called the best since he was young the only ones to do that was cr7 and messi
@@thatzzcrazyy3282 Messi is clear of CR7
He went to 5 finals of major tournaments. This should not even be a debate. He is the GOAT.
@@idontmakecontent4870 i agree
Bro if lewandowski was messi would u expect lewandowski to win World Cup with Poland this argument is stupid messi and Ronaldo are the greatest I bring Ronaldo too cause he’s achieved as much as messi
Shaka’s argument makes literally no sense. By his logic if Messi had not played the final vs Germany and Argentina had won then he’d be the greatest of all time. You can’t just look at team trophies. Maradona didn’t score in the ‘86 final so by Shaka’s logic Maradona would be a worse player if his teammates hasn’t scored their chances. That is ridiculous. The achievements of a team cannot solely define an individual.
I swear Shaka's logic is so fuckall.
Shaka is an idiot he thinks being the greatest rides on a 7 game tournament that only happens every 4 years which is also based on being lucky to have good teammates and manager (all out a players control). What if maradonna, pele were born in a country like england or pakistani etc then what would he say? Clown
Totally agree mate. I was thinking the same thing.
espn fc is full of clowns
@@idontmakecontent4870 false wannabe pundents
WC is every 4 years, most stars only get to play in 3 of them on avg. You cant just judge someones lengthy career on just 3 or 4 one month tournaments throughout 15 years or so, its crazy. I prefer to judge them on season after season performance at the highest level.
not to mention he took his team to the final. one kick of the ball shouldn't be the decisive vote on greatness.
@@jessecenere9542 a sprinter that runs sub 10 Everytime he run for 15 hears but never wins an Olympic or world 100 title wud he be considered the greatest?
@@demircunningham1437 if he broke the world record by a considerable margin, id argue yes. thats also not a team sport. unfortuantely messi relies on his peers aswell. sprinters only themselves.
@@jessecenere9542 Tru not a team sports but yet u only singling our Messi right? How ever u said if he broke the record by a good margin well football record is WORLD CUP NOT HOW GOOD UR CLUB TEAM IS N IF OR NOT THEY CAN BUY PLAYERS TO SUIT U. PLAYING WELL AT CLUB LEVEL IS GOOD YES BUR A WORLD CUP IS CALLED A WORLD CUP FOR A REASON HE DOESNT EVEN HAVE THE MOST CHAMPIONS LEAGUE WIN SO WAT IS THE GOAT DEBATE ABOUT?
Bro you are true.. Instead world cup, messi have everything, he have stats, performance, trophies, individual trophies which are most important to judge a player but leave it for while, i mean he showed dribbling, passing, scoring and playmaking every year, every season consistently for 13 years. But why he is not Goat becoz he doesnt have that trophy in which just maximum 6-7 matches played 🤦🏻♂️
If y’all talk about a player being the goat everyday for the past 17 years, then ofc he is !!!
What?
@@carrion.adrian7 shutup
@@carrion.adrian7 this is a Leo Messi topic… why r u here??? Go watch some penaldo leaving juve news !!
@@alexwellbad1322 🤣🤣 penaldo leaving juve news 🤣🤣
Top 5 players in my books in term of completeness
5- Zidane
4-Ronaldo (cr7)
3-Pele
2-Maradona
1-Messi
Messi is not the Goat?! Yet, if you don’t put his name on the clip description no one watches your videos. 🤔
Exactly 🤣 the best way to get views, subscribers, comments etc…just put Messi-Ronaldo names in video’s title
@Danny Tallmage You call Messi fan dumb yet you're calling football soccer, thank god football fans aren't as dumb & silly as Ronaldo fans.
@@eiarto8165 pele can compete against me. I also scored a lot of goals against farmers and construction workers
I feel bad for Shaka. He has been taking the wrong side of that discussion for so long that he can't recognize he's wrong lol
Ahaha 🤣
@Danny Tallmage no that's Ronaldo fanboys like you he should be worried 😂
He knows he is wrong, he is just not man enough to say it
@@icildatugman6732 lolllllll he's right tho
He said that Brazilian Ronaldo is the goat for him but R9 never won the greatest prize on club level which is obviously the champions league. And individuals don't win trophies, teams do.
Messi was already the goat at 23. There is no debate.
🤣🤣🤣 this is why we can't take messi obsessive delusional fans serious. Am sure the people who agree with him are Millennials. How old are you ?
the greatest of all time at 23? are you alright?
@@seanynwa6975 lol i had to ask the same thing
Well sorry but I don't agree at all, Pele is the real goat and was much better then Messi no offense
@@rogerstephenroth8073 yes
I want to remind Shaka one thing. Messi played the WC final in 2014 and he was the best player in that tournament. Germany won the world cup and became the best team there, Messi won the WC's best player award and became the best player. Messi has already been the best player of what shaka considers to be the highest game of his respective sport.
I want to remind you something: Do you remember the scandal it caused when Messi was given the best player of WC award?! It was called a compensation. Even Masche and Di Maria were better than him.
You guy have a strange logic when it comes to Messi:
When Argentina loses, it's his teammates' fault, especially Higuain, even when Messi misses his penalty in the final vs Chile.
When Argentina wins with an invisible Messi, and amazing De Paul and Di Maria (again), Messi takes all the credit.
These are facts.
You guys need to get checked
@@dammitimmad9121 contributed in 9 outta 12 goals in the tournament cry
@@dammitimmad9121 hm 4 goals in group stages and winning assist in Round of 16. and not to say about performance in each game.
@@dammitimmad9121 How was Di Maria better than Messi at the world cup in 2014?? He scored 1 (assisted by Messi) and assisted 0 goals. Meanwhile, Messi scored 4 and assisted 1. His influence was there to be seen for four games in a row, while Di Maria shone in just the game against Switerzland. Mascherano shone in the knockouts but without Messi's goals they wouldn't have made it to that stage. And Messi didn't take all the credit for the win in the final. Di Maria and De Paul both were regarded as the best players in that game. The credit for Messi came from the other games that helped them reach the final, considering he was directly involved in 9 of their 12 goals.
Solid point
The moment someone talks about how many world cups a player has won, I stop taking them seriously.
How many average players have won 🏆
Does that mean they are better than Messi, ronaldo, cruyff, puskas, Di Stefano, eusebio and zlatan.
Exactly.
I decided along time ago to stop speaking to what I call "World Cup watchers" a long time ago.
No one that bases a players entire career on a month long tournament can't have an informed opinion on the subject of football.
Exactly bro, a world cup victory only proves yourself to casual football watchers. People who watch football week in week out know who's the greatest.
you re in the right here but never put zlatan in the same level as these legends
He's the GOAT, some people just need to accept the fact. He was literally the GOAT 10 years ago.
😱😱😱😱 v i Rangers FC just said msssi is the goat 😱🥶 now that definitely changes my mind 😑😐
Just because Barcelona fans say Messi is the goat dosent mean he is…
My goat penaldo wons euro 😂
Copa america >euro
@@DannyIMCF I’m not even trolling on the internet 🤣
I could tell you 99% of the trollers here troll in other social media’s…
Messi fan spotted
@@carrion.adrian7Real Madrid, Juve, Man United and Portuguese fans will say that Ronaldo is the Goat. The rest of the world think Messi is the GOAT. Accept it kid
@J H Messi has actually won 4 champions Leagues... If your only counting 3 because Messi didn't play the final in 2006 then that would mean Ronaldos euros win wouldn't count then. Would it 👀👀
Being the greatest player of all time, is an individual title. Being the best team of all time, is a collective title. The two are not aligned whatsoever. No one has ever done the things Messi does in almost every single match. His dribbling, shot accuracy, passing, playmaking, assisting, goal scoring, vision, etc. are all unheard of. He is the greatest player of all time. He is also the second most successful player of all time. Only Dani Alves is ahead of him in terms of trophies won, with a total of 42, whereas Messi is number 2, with 38 total trophies. Is Dani Alves the best football player of all time? No, although he certainly is a legend of football.
It bothers me that these so called football experts, don't have the intellectual capacity to distinguish between collectivism and individualism. The best player is an individual title, dependent on the abilities of an individual. The best team is a collective title, dependent on the abilities of a team. No individual player is going to win the world cup or anything else for that matter on their own. With your logic, the best player ever is only capable of coming from large countries with large populations, because those countries are by far the most likely to come any close to winning something such as the world cup. That's too exclusive and completely illogical from an intellectual perspective, although intellect isn't something typically associated with football enthusiasts, so you I'll give you a pass.
Messi is the game at this moment! These pundits know it, they're just making a show.
Guys just ask yourself why do people say Pele and Maradona are GOATs? Its because of their performance in World Cup. Its the greatest football tournament on Earth and it is a must to be declared GOAT.
Maradona is the one and turly G.O.A.T because Pele played in a strong National team back in his time. Brazil won 1962 World Cup even without Pele when Pele was injured and missed the later matches of the tournament. Pele was like the present day CR7, he scored a monstrous amount of goals for club and country.
Kids these days don't know the full story of Maradona. He single handedly won the 1986 World Cup. He scored 5 goals and 5 assists, thats a total of 10 goal contributions in a single WC. Compare that to Messi's 4 goals and 1 assist in WC 2014. Watch Maradona's goals vs England and vs Belgium and his goal of the century. Maradona's quality of play in WC is still unmatched to this day. He then went till the final of 1990 World Cup too. That's two WC finals !! He played with injured ankle in the Final of 1990 WC, had he been 100% fit, he would have won that WC too. He was fouled a record 50 times in that WC !!!
What he had achieved in WC tournaments with his talent, already declared him the GOAT, but what made him the "God of Football" is his love story with Napoli. And his story with Napoli is too long to explain here. Watch his documentary or read it online atleast. In short: When he joined Napoli, Italy was the toughest and the most famous league in Europe. Almost all the great players in that time played in Italy, and the Northern rich clubs like Juventus, AC Milan, Inter, etc dominated Serie A. Napoli was from poor southern italy and it was at the bottom in Serie A table, barely escaped relegation.
Napoli had never won Serie A in their entire history since the club was first founded. The Napoli President literally collected all the money the club could afford to sign him, and when it still wasn't enough, people collected money in the streets just to bring Maradona in Napoli. Some say the Mafia helped with money, but whatever the case, Maradona went to a club that couldn't afford to buy him. Napoli climbed to 8th position after the first season with Maradona. Then in second season they finished 3rd, and finally in third season Napoli won Serie A 1986-1987 for the first time in their history.
They went on to win Copa Italia in 1987, UEFA Cup in 1989, Supercoppa Italiana in 1990 and again another Serie A in 1990. After Maradona left, Napoli never won Serie A or UEFA Cup again till date. Its their only win with Maradona. In 1990 World Cup Semi-final between Argentina vs Italy, which was held in Naples, Maradona asked the people of Naples to support Argentina instead of Italy, and they did, they answered his call. This is the only time in WC history where the citizen of a country supported the opponents. Such was the status of Maradona.
What Maradona achieved with Argentina and Napoli, made him the God of football, the Greatest of all Time. He almost single handedly won the WC, then he carried Napoli from the depths to their very first Serie A victory. Messi and Ronaldo are great, but Maradona's achievements far exceeds the achievements of Messi or Ronaldo. He single handedly lifted the whole southern part of Italy and rose above the racism by northern italy.
Tell me about any other GOAT in any other sport who hasn't won the biggest tournament in that particular sport,,I think Messi and Ronaldo are excused so much,,I term them boring talents if u can't do what maradona did,he will be above u and if can't do what Pele did,becomes before all of u
@@legendovbago4716 Pele and Maradona didn't win the world cup. Brazil and Argentina did. A large squad of players, in a different time. Again, that's collectivism, not individualism. Being the GOAT, is an individual title. If you can't make out the difference of those two very defined terms, then perhaps it isn't wise to try and determine who the GOAT really is. This is a very subjective topic, but statistically no one comes close to Messi.
The world cup is a tournament won my teams. A collective of 11, plus substitutes, manager and staff. Messi made it to the final, and lost against a team, with a far stronger collection of players. There's no logic in saying ONE match keeps someone from being the GOAT. Again, it's too exclusive. Most countries won't come near winning the world cup, so their players stand no chance of ever being the GOAT, according to your logic.
@@deadpool8422 how old are you?
I think you appreciate and believe the story than your eyes.
There is no debate lol, he is the best to ever kick the ball.
And many world cup medals too. Worlds best needs to win worlds best title. He is only goat for barca, same Ronaldo goat for real madrid on club level.
@King 🤴 your a joke what are u talking about.
The goat has always been and always will be pele
Penaldians can't accept that fact
@@chuchu-mh2jw you sound 12 ... This isnt that era anymore. WC is much more competitive... Thats not even remotely close to what determines how good he is. stop being a sheep
These pundits are clowns lol when Messi wins a World Cup , they will say “he hasn’t won 2 world cups” 🤡
Karine Prusalyan..when Messi wins? The best chance he had to win a world cup was 2014 against Germany right in his back yard South America. That has gone.
He said when like if they would win they would say he would need 2
@@wainwalsh5260 cry
Exactly. They will say Pele has 3 (even though he didn't even play more than 2 games in 1962)
@Danny Tallmage yeah they will.. You are just pouting
70% of journalists, analysts, and players say messi but I'm supposed to believe there's a debate lmao
By your logic if journalists,analysts and players say Neymar is better than Maradona are you gonna believe then?
That’s a stupid logic by your logic if journalists, analysts and players say Phil Jones is better than Messi you’re gonna believe that?
Just stating by your logic kiddo 😉😁
Yeahh, I like to troll messi a lot for not doing it for Argentina. But if I’m being real, it’s undeniable how great he’s been. I remember in 2011 I think he was 23 and they were already arguing if he was the best ever. That just says it all
@@carrion.adrian7 i mean if that many people were saying that then there'd be some reason behind it lol they're not all dumb
@@carrion.adrian7 And why would they say Neymar is better than Maradona?
@@mixfcb1086 that’s just a example what I’m trying to say if journalists players and analysts say that mr bandwagon Barcelona golden state will believe that 🤷♂️
They think he is not a G.O A.T because they can't play like him in their career 😂😂😂.
Espn is only baised towards real madrid, psg and Manchester shitty
Messis longevity, records, consistency, week in week out, trophies, international achievements, goals, assists for 15 years non stop makes him the GOAT for me and for MAJORITY
Also Messis passing, vision, dribbling, finishing is a level above any other GOAT
🐐
According to Shaka's logic, Mbappe is ahead of both Messi and Ronaldo in the goat rankings.
Also according to his logic, if you are born in Finland you are automatically disqualified.
😂😂😂😂😂😂
Shaka is always struggling to talk
Well if mbbape wins the UCL than he sure he will surpass meesi and Ronaldo legacy
Giroud as well😂 since he has won almost everything
The debate is over, honestly I don’t bother anymore after Argentina won the Copa America I’m so relieved and to people who loves Messi , who loves and have passion for football around the globe are relieved for Life❤️❤️❤️
there has never been a debate messi has always been better. second best is werner
@@soydegoatReal what!! Werner 🤣
His own people don’t even call him the best
@@Skankhunt-wl5jy the rest of the world that watched him play regularly for 15 years say it though...messi is by far the best of all time..his 7th balon dor will be the one he's crowned under no doubt he's the best ever
@@abcdefg3214 absolutely spot on
Messi was already the GOAT when he won his 4th Ballon d'Or.
Pele is the real goat, Messi is not the goat
@@rogerstephenroth8073 you mean the guy who won 3 world cups and wasn’t the best player in any of them ?? Was also injured in one of them and scored 1 goal
Pele played in farmers league. And lie about his goalsm
@@LeeRenthlei Is la liga best league with maximum any of the 3 teams winning everytime?
@@aksptc1086 nah but Messi has 4 champions leagues also it's pretty hard to win la liga with the best club of all time playing in the same league with their best ever player at the same time.. and Messi won 6 league titles in 9 years at that time too, pretty much sums up his dominance 👍
England reaches a finals in 60 years party Italy reaches a finals in 10 years blah blah .Messi takes an average team to 5 finals where 16 or 32 teams play 2nd on 4 occasions 1st on 1 ..man of the tournament on 4 occasions all the club insanity added
Debate finished
if these stats are real, then, wow. How is there even a debate
People talk about ronaldo's longevity but messi is about to become the oldest player to win balon d'or in almost 60 years
Not coming home 😁😂🤣
17? 9 years the last was in 2012
Amazing point
Lionel Messi is already the best Player in the history he doesn't need to lift the cup to prove what he is
Oh yes he does. Messi is amazing but he's no Pele or Maradona
Lol not best player in history brodah.
@@Benny-zo3qh people say Messi hasn’t won World Cup like them
Well they never win UCL or copa America or ballon Dor like him
@@namedclaiming821 unless them includes Zidane or Ronaldinho
@@kingaskeladd5052 Zidane Ronaldinho have much less UCL and Ballon dor than Messi
The sole reason this channel is alive is cuz of those messi thumbnails they put in🤣
The fact that the debate comes up every month shows that Messi is the greatest footballer ever
And the funny thing is Messi doesn’t care about the GOAT debate.
These idiots only bring up the topic and put Messi on the thumbnail to just gain views lol
If Messi wins the world cup. They'll say he hasn't played in EPL. Can't please everyone
if he did,it wouldn't be enough. GOAT conversation over, MESSI IS THE GOAT-.
He said MJ won the NBA 6 times but the NBA finals happen every year whereas world cup is every 4 years
Basketball is also basically contested by teams from one country so it’s unfair to compare these 6 titles to the champions league let alone the World Cup.
NBA Finals is more like UCL.
Yup, the nba playoffs should rather be compared ucl as it is a yearly event
And on top of that its not country vs country world cup but teams of US....if that is the case then Messi's been GOAT for 10 years straight...
True and if you wanna talk about players who have gone undefeated in finals….then neither Messi nor Cr7 makes the cut…
It will probably be Iniesta…who is 7-0 in Major Finals..not to mention he gave world class performances in all 7 of those finals..
Even cr7 is 6-2 in Major finals..
Messi is the goat, no matter what anyone says.
Second best player of all time Werner
@SoyDeGoat 🅘 Marcos Rojo🇦🇷🤭
@SoyDeGoat 🅘 de ligt is the best handballer not footballer🤣🤣🤣
speak mate
Lol his own people don’t even consider the best
Shaka is still going to say Messi needs a World Cup as usual 🙄
I trust, he will...
Who tf is this shaka anyway never heard of this guy till this show started lmao
@@BreakingCLY He was a premier league goalkeeper so he’s not a compete nobody.
Shaka needs to come out of retirement and win the FA Cup before he can say something about Messi not being the goat because he hasn't won the world cup yet
His own people don’t even say he’s the best
There was never a debate. Every season Messi is on top of almost every offensive stat. He has way more MOTM than any other current player. The most complete forward ever... He is just too good...
yes messi against werner was always cool the 2 best footballers of all time
Insane how some people think CR7 is anywhere near Messi’s level…
@@idontmakecontent4870 dumb people that watch only goals
In the almighty La Liga. Hasnt proven anything else where
@@johneefizterbottom la liga is the league that dominated for 15 years in champions and Europa league
Go watch ur overpayed premier
We really not gonna talk about the fact that Messi has the same number of international player of the tournament awards as Pele, Maradona and Ronaldo combined. No Debate.
Ronaldo is just a better version of morata bro. Messi is just a better version than Maradona. Big difference that certain fan bases don't get
@@MehrunesDagonJM you can praise Messi who I also believe to be the goat without saying such ridiculous statements about Ronaldo
These guys they just say what they feel like saying sometimes
It’s extra time , kinda what this is about lol
Just a load of toilet water coming out of their mouths most of the time
Why don’t they understand that if winning the World Cup was something similar to winning the ballon d’or then he would have won the most, just like he has won ballon d’or the most times..( 7th is almost confirmed).
Winning the World Cup depends totally on how the whole team plays..single player cannot make that much of a difference in team sport..
AT THIS POINT ESPN IS JUST USING MESSI’s NAME TO GENERATE VIEWS ..
Lmaoooo
Yeah
It’s working because here you are
True 😂
Unless someone surpasses 6 Ballon d'Ors, 6 Golden Boots, 4 playmaker awards, 1 Laureus award, 1 WC Golden Ball, 2 Copa/Euro Golden Ball - Messi's the undisputed GOAT. Debate's closed now. These guys need to accept it.
Regardless of what they say, the majority of professionals within the sport already think that Messi is the GOAT, even before winning the Copa América. Do not even take into account the fan's opinion. Just pure players, coaches and executives (old and current) points of views agree in a huge majority that Messi is GOAT.
Maradona and Pele didn't even won a Copa América. Messi took the team to a world cup final but he didn't have the luck like Maradona that his teammates actually scored.
In our sport we can't categorized the World Cup as the ultimate prize. The WC is more like a child's dream to win one day. The WC is only 7 games every 4 years...how can that be considered the measurement to greatness? Its ridiculous, and on top of that in those 7 games also luck gets involved...lol.
The consistency, longevity and skills throughout 12 years on top is what should be considered greatness. Not Pele, not Maradona has done what Messi has done, not close.
Whoever has a slim knowledge of football and its history will know that Messi is the GOAT of our sport.
Yet we can't also compare Pele nor Maradona with Messi. Why? Because each of them was the GOAT of their respective era/time. Pele was the GOAT in his time, also Maradona. Thats why all three sit at the same table.
But if we go pure statistics, including titles at individual and collective levels, Messi has no other.
In some years ahead, maybe 20 years from now there will most likely be another GOAT in the making that will sit at the same table than Messi, Pele and Maradona.
Also I wanted to add that there's many players in football history that had won world cups and they're not even close to being considered GOAT status and barely have won significant or major titles, individually or collective.
But yet they won a world cup...so to some people like Shaka that means that they are GOATs because they won a world cup...makes no sense.
And yet there are a bunch of legendary players that were ridiculously good at the game and never won a world cup, so they have no greatness? The likes of Cruyff, Platini, Eusebio, Van Basten, Di stefano and much more...
But I guess these legendary players are worse than the likes of Griezmann, Capdevila, Draxler, Schurrle, thauvin and more...
These world cup champions are better players than those who didn't win the world cup according to some like Shaka...what a joke hahahaha.
Speak on Brother! It's so weird how Argentina played their world cup final, and 2 copa finals with their dream team, and lost them all. But with Messi and mostly not really big name players, they beat a good Brazil team in the final, and held on to their lead!
@@dmnick123ify How can you disregard di maria, seriously? they won this time only by di maria throughout the tournament he was best and messi didn't did anything, remember he was a player who retired from argentina at a young age which means he didn't liked argentina as compared to barcelona most of the time, his stats can clearly prove this with both teams
@@aksptc1086 No one is disrespecting Di Maria. Messi scored and assisted in most of the games that led them to the finals. Messi covers spaces that opens spaces for other people. Di Maria is great. I appreciate his goal, but I still say overall, without Messi, they dont make it to the finals. Though Di Maria scored the final goal. Also, you have to realize that in most of the games, Di Maria was a sub. He was more rested as well compared to Messi. so dont say I disrespected Di Maria, I didnt.
@@dmnick123ify Ok but he faced brazil as a decent opposition in which only di maria shined, messi looked frustrated, tell me one thing are other teams they faced even capable of winning it?
@@aksptc1086 so what point are making? Without a doubt Dimaria was great in the final. Messi wasn't. However Messi was excellent in all the games leading to it
Messi is gonna have 10 ballon d’ors and people still won’t call him the goat
Stop riding bro
@@carrion.adrian7 Messi will win his 7th to commemorate you Ronaldo 💪🏾😤
@@jaimerodriguez1332 Yeah whatever he is not a team guy cr7 won big trophies for his teams not a indivisual dedicated player which messi is thanks to ballon d'ors without parrallel national trophies and ucl
@@aksptc1086 not a team guy? Why does he assist more than Ronaldo? Guess you were talking about Ronaldo. Yeah it’s true Ronaldo rather shoot a shot from an impossible angle rather than passing to a teammate with an open goal.
@@jaimerodriguez1332 I would rather say team player is one who creates chances from deep end and also sacrifices for the team while defending, so that way no messi or ronaldo are team players as both don't defend and does deep line play making
I think he is the goat best all around player ever
Best all around offensive player at least
I don't think I've seen him score with his head so goat status tarnished
all around player u good? man doesn't come back to save his life.
@@Chimera_166 you have missed so much of football man
@@Chimera_166
It’s not about goals, it’s about what he does on the field, how he plays the game
If Messi wins the World Cup next year people will still say he's not the GOAT. They'll tell you Pele has 3 world cups. For me Maldini is the GOAT but he was a defender so in most people's mind that's not possible.
You had me until the end there
@@bonkerzisgood I am saying the greatest is just a debate. It can't be about who win tings. Haaland can become a great great player but what are the chances of him winning an international trophy with Norway. I went on to say for me which is my opinion,Maldini is the greatest to play the game but because he's a defender people with other opinions will tell you that is not possible and like my original comment stated. Even if Messi wins the world cup Pele and his fans will still say Pele is the greatest because he has 3 cups and if the logic is about winning the world cup Pele should be the greatest.
@@maldini3184 Brazil until 1958 wasn’t a great team but still Pelé managed to win the WC. Tbh, for me, I can’t tell he’s the goat because I haven’t seen him playing, but, at the same time, I can’t tell that Messi and CR7 are goats because nowadays there isn’t as many beasts as they to compete like there was in the 80s, 90s and 00s. I see many people saying “Pele played against bad, amateur teams”, which isn’t true at all, since Brazil had a top 3 tier league at that point. But if we consider this point of view, it’s completely possible to say that Messi and CR7 played and scored mainly against bad teams like Almería and Real Vallalolid. That’s why I believe there should always have a debate on this, it’s not something “decided”.
@@john-yk5ri your comparing Norway to Brazil
Messi is the greatest footballer to play the beautiful game. 🙏🏽 🐐
Misspelled Cristiano Ronaldo
@@carrion.adrian7 Ronaldo is the best athlete ever for sure, but what Messi has done for football and is still doing is out of this world! 🐐
@@carrion.adrian7 to honestly believe in youre heart and soul without any prejudice or allegiance to a team or player and honestly think that Ronaldo is a better footballer than messi shows a severe shameful ignorance. And I suggest give up watching football its clearly not for you
@@carrion.adrian7 you don’t understand football
@@carrion.adrian7 ronaldo fan boys so obsessed by messi what u do here 😂😂😂
So according to Shaka’s logic French striker Olivier Giroud is a goat coz he won the highest prize which is “World Cup” in 2018 despite scoring zero goals in that tournament even more shockingly having zero shot on target 🎯
according to all messi fanboy logic
since messi won copa america he is automatically greatest of all time
@@seanynwa6975 He actually don't need Copa or WC but hater keep saying he need international trophy to be one..so now he won it. End of debate. He was already considered the goat by most people who followed football closely, with international trophy he just wrap it up which he already sealed it.
@TRUE BARCA say no to ESL clowns I didn’t say Messi wasn’t the best? I dont even think Ronaldo is the best of all time… but I’m not a Messi fanboy. I think it’s stupid how people say that the goat debate is over just because Messi won a copa America
@@seanynwa6975 Golden boot, golden ball..
Nobody comes close
Giroud won WC he must be better than Suarez, Lewa, Zlatan, RVP, RVN, Johan Cruff
Modric won more Ballon D'ors than Xavi+Iniesta combined then he must be better....logic people are using these days 🤣
All I need to say is…
Messi x3 Best player in Major Tournaments
Ronaldo x0 “ “
Messi 0 Goals, 4 Assists, 3 MotM’s after World Cup group stages.
Ronaldo 0 Goals, 0 Assists, 0 MotM’s after World Cup group stages.
Portugal have poor stats in World Cup
You cant compare portugal to argentina
Gotta listen to Shaka and his WC agenda,just because of a Messi video smh
The fact that people are even discussing this with Messi being 34 years old pretty much ends the debate, he's been the GOAT for over 15 years, and will still be the GOAT until he retires.
According to Shaka's logic even if you are born in India you need to make them win a world cup to be considered the best
Lmaooooooo
Messi is an will always be de goat cus he play an dominated in every area
India is Famous in Cricket not in Football that is why Sunil Chettri is never recognized. India won 5 ICC Tournaments in Cricket. Indian Hockey Team is better than Indian Football Team
Love the chemistry between these guys
Looking at these guys, I believe we all can be better pundits than these wafflers.
Nothing to argue. Messi is the GOAT.
I mean everyone is entitled to their opinion though
@@bzizou5966 People can believe whatever they want but it doesn’t make them right
He's the goat, should be the undisputed goat. He, along with Tom Brady, LeBron James, Roger Federer, they've been tearing it up since before I was born, and all of them except _maybe_ LeBron are the goat, and they still play at the highest level to this day. Yes goat, doesn't need a world cup when he's been to a final and has a Copa and an Olympic gold
There can be no undisputed goat football not started now it started 70 years ago there are so many legends. Many condition are changed pitch is better, there is training, tactics, ball is lighter how can there be a sole goat. I would say There can be like 4 5 goats of football not a sole goat
Lol This joker
Djokovic goat
Rodgers > Brady
According to Shaka, Umtiti>Messi😶
Only a fool can debate this ...its been over for 10 years now ..where have yas all been???
3 years penaldo
91 penalties
175 freekicks taken scored 1 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I have seen Messi on top since I was like 12 and now I'm about to turn 24... unreal consistency
He is the GOAT ..we don't need these clowns approval 🤡
So why are you here commenting you 🤡
Watching that Shaka guy gives me goosebumps. I can't watch this ESPN again.
Maradona was more talented than messi is. Messi is more professional and that's why he's been so good for so long. Maradonas peak is the best ever.
Lionel Messi is the best football player ever. Period.
He is the GOAT. There is no debate now , especially after the Copa America win.
He hasn't won the World Cup yet , but no one has achieved the things he has.
I cant think of a more complete player than him, even if you consider the players who HAVE won the world cup , no one amongst them comes close to his stats.
Winning the World Cup would be overkill , he's already the best.
I agree with almost everything u said. But may I suggest, Ronaldinho was the better goat, if u consider "the things he achieved" ... Ronaldinho has won all the major trophies football can offer...
You can clearly feel this GOAT debate DYING OUT
Messi and Ronaldo are so much better than maradona, peel, R9 etc. they have put up ridiculous numbers for 14+ seasons
Incoming R9 is the greatest ever had the most potential blah blah comments.
@@zephune9506 I grew up in r9’s prime and while he was very talented, he was very inconsistent. I mean he only had 16 champions league goals
I mean, Giroud is now the GOAT because he has won the WC and not Messi by their logic......😅😅😅
Pele is still the goat of this sport
He is the Michael Jordan of Football/ Soccer
Litterly every single sport has advanced with records been broken yearly.
Yet you think Pele who played well over 50 years ago matches players of the modern age?? Go watch his games again and honestly look at that horrendous standard,its barely professional to the sport nowadays.
Pele is the king of amateur football i agree
@@abcdefg3214 lol same logic will be applied to Messi than 50 years from now, dont discredit predecessors
Messi is, followed by Maradona then Pele.
@@calm123 That is the way it should be. They have to consider many categories, however, like passing, play-making, dribbling, shooting with both feet, headers, field vision, playing under pressure, diving, attitude, composure, leadership, cheating/honesty, and the number of trophies- individual, club, and countries.
Pele was not even the best of his era garincha was!!!!
With all due respect; what Shaka things about Messi is not a fact. That's his OPINION and not of others. That doesn't make him right because he says it on TV. He should STOP saying that the WC is the highest level and so Messi needs to win that to prove he is the GOAT. It is the most prestigeous tournament because you represent your country! Once every 4 years makes it extra special but that doesn't mean it is the highest level! Start playing the Champions League once every 4 years and see how we will appreciate it more. In the early days the WC was the biggest tournament because you had the best players in it playing for their country. Now with the Champions League you got the BEST players of the world playing in a tounament as well. So at the very least the level is the same. Champions League even is higher level i would say because unlike in the WC where teams are made for a short time and where they play under their potential because they don't quite gel yet, with Champions League they gel and play year in and out with each other. How can you then still say WC is higher? Shaka needs to stop with his silly reasoning
ther'es no debate. he's been the GOAT for years now. just stop lol.
No he isn't, Pele was much better
@Wolffpak 4lyf hahahahah 😂😂😂 you're hilarious if you think r9 can dribble faster than messi
George Weah is one of football's greats that never went to a world cup. Too many factors determines who goes to a world cup, when and what they achieve in it. For example, Messi and Maradona both played one WC final each and both didn't score in them.
Maradona played 2 wc finals
@@akhilsai2371 I stand corrected.
He didn't score in either though
When Brazilian fans, after loosing a final...in their backyard... against Argentina... are still happy for Messi....you know HE is the GOAT!!
From 2010/11 season until the current 2020-21 season, Messi averages around 50 goals and roughly 21 assists per season. Let that number sink in. The highest no. of assists in Premier League is 20 jointly held by Henry and De Bruyne just for context. Goals per season highest is 32 by Mo Salah and that is just one season. Just to see that Messi not only averaged 50 goals per season but also assisted 21 for more than a decade puts him in an unprecedented godly tier. Now for the tournaments won debate, I hope he does win the WC but the numbers he has even without the WC trophy puts him at the GOAT level. Also, when comparing NBA and American football, you need to know we only one NBA and superbowl championship per year that maybe equivalent of Champions League not the world cup because it is every year and it is on club level not the nation level obviously.
The World Cup debate is so stupid. He can’t choose his national team. All those other names moved to the top teams in their field.
If he won the World Cup I don’t even think it would be a debate to be honest
People would still find a way to discredit him either way. The world is filled with idiots
Trust me there is always som idoit WHO would debate even of Messi won wc they would say well he has not won it 3 times like pele or somting this haters Will always hate
All Messi needed to do was choose Spain and this debate would be long gone.
If only Higuain scored those opportunities
Griezman is better than Platini because of a world cup Trophy??
7th Ballandor is on the way. I thing that is the biggest acheivement for a player in the football. World cup is won by the team not by any individual player. Getting the world cup is something really prestigious thing but it doesnt mean that it is the ultimate deciding factor. People is trying to compare each and every player to messi eventhough it is not possible. I havent seen any player doing half of the things that is done by messi in these many years.If u love football analyse it without any partiality you cannot see any other complete player like messi.
Y'all are the GOAT for clicking and responding everytime.
Personally, I consider Messi, CR7, Pele and Maradona the 4 goats of soccer
No it’s not he’s the greatest
lemme guess you also think lebron>mj
@@jaycfc3909 lol🤣🤣🤣👍👍👍
Lebron sucks
It’s is quite funny how everytime Dan host the show there is a messi goat question lol apparently Ronaldo 100 million fans don’t ask the same question.
Mario Kempes won both the golden boot & the golden ball in 1978 WC when Argentina won that tournament. He must be their biggest legend after Maradona & Messi
He is clearly the best player of all time now. I mean 91 goals in 2012 should of ended the debate right there soon to be 7 balon d ors
Shaka Hislop and co. are unbelievably deluded but it’s okay :) ... they believe if Messi wins a World Cup, he will be a better football player than he was prior to winning the World Cup. If that isn’t delusion then idk what is.
It never left, it is written in stones that messi is the GOAT idk what y'all talking about
Which is hard to win
tournament vs League?
There's no debate
He is the greatest player to ever played football all these jokers all the players know too 👏but paid penaldo trolls and funded sport channels won't admit
There is GOAT debate only because there is Ronaldo PR. The same kind of PR is the reason why Neymar out of all people is touted as the so called 3rd best of this generation. Ronaldo is so inferior to some of the artists of football that we have seen. Keeps standing at one place and scoring majority as tap ins and penalties. Has also forgot how to take free kicks in the last 3-4 years and is hardly involved in the game.
you can’t be playing at the same level you were a decade back. the body will take a toll on you no matter how consistently you take care of it, the ageing process does not stop. ronaldo nazario’s critical dribbling was amazing to watch but his knees took the damage. even if he didn’t get injured in his career but soon enough his knees would’ve gave in if he continued that type of dribbling. you need to make changes in your play style and cristiano did just that to keep playing at the highest level possible for over 15 years now. won’t be surprised if messi gets his dribbling levels down soon which he has started to do so slowly.
What has Neymar to do with anything who is better than him to be the number three? You are a fool if you think that pace merchant Mbappe is better then him.
@@krishchaudhry2222 agreed, but Ronaldo has been playing as a proper central striker since 2011-12 season. He is a winger only on paper. He can barely curl the ball to put a cross in. R9 was a different beast. There was an end product to all his dribbling. CR7 had to give up dribbling to score 42 goals in 2007-08 season. And he became addicted to that since then. He is a great goalscorer agreed. But Messi has the same number of goals overall and the manner in which he scores them and his involvement in the game throughout 90 min is what sets him apart. Of course, Messi's dribbling is on the decline as well but he has improved his long passes and free kicks to compensate for efficiency just which are more beautiful to watch than tap ins (both take too many penalties - so tied there)
@@stefankazimirovic7957 I'm not even taking about Mbappe. Neymar was good in his early days and until around 2017 but over the past 4 years - KDB, Lewandowski, Kante, Haaland, Kane etc have become more reliable. Even di Maria turns up more in the big matches than Neymar.
@@sagarranjan4585 I agree but Neymae has been the third best player for the most time from 2015 to 2020. Even this year his wav very good vs Bayern, his problem are his injuries not his talent.
Messi has the highest goal numbers, highest assist numbers, best passing , GOAT level dribbling ability
You tell me another player with that level of stats and ABILITY and consistency and trophies and records and longevity for 17 years straight.
MESSI the GOAT just stop it now
Did this guy just say Michael Jordan winning 6 nba championships equals World Cup wins? And then Maradona is the greatest of all time? He’s scored a quarter of the goals Messi has and nearly 100 less official assists. Come on now jesus
Messi and Ronaldo are blessings to our generation for two decades and counting... I am blessed to see these players do it; putting everyone else below them.
I prefer Messi's game though but they are both monsters at their games.
Messi is the goat 🐐 say whatever u want!!💥🔥
Is no one at ESPN ever going to change that "YOUTUVE" part the Dan says at the end? 😂😂
Messi and Argentina won in Brazil in an major final - the last time it happened was 60+ years ago.
GOAT discussions should be abolished. Unless one can pit all the players deemed all time greats, against each other on a football field to duke it out. ( All things being equal. Each player having equal access , to all that modern sports science confers to a player). It's all conjecture. Off course that's never gonna happen, due to the different era's they played in. Let's just enjoy all the great players that have graced the game & stop this GOAT nonsense.
I do believe messi wld come off the pitch the best player of the game tbh.
@@keranseunarine4274 Believe & FACT are two different things buddy
@@johnpacino007 you just made a giant hypothetical match with all the greatest playing on the same pitch and i said messi wld still come out the best. 🤨
@@keranseunarine4274 Nope! I said that would *_never_* happen. Therefore, all GOAT narrative's ( whoever the chosen player in question is ) is all conjecture. Period!... You can never pit them against each other, for generational reasons. It's a nice *_discussion_* to have down the local pub & that's it.
Meh, I think he's one of the greatest.
This is a disgusting debate, Argentina won the world cup not Maradona, Brazil won the world cup not pele. This is not Tennis, this is a team game. There are lot of factors to win a world cup. And world cup is not the measure.
People can still argue about the GOAT of all time , but the GOAT of this generation is obviously Lionel Messi by far
Ronaldo fans probably started the debate.
“Ronaldo fans probably started the debate”- 🤓
@@carrion.adrian7 Ronaldo didn't even won nothing this year.
@@shrekwazowski3836 Super Cup
Coppa Italia?????
@@carrion.adrian7 7th balon dor id say is sickening you
Siuuuuuuuuuuuu
Guys let's chill, espn is trying to get a views by putting Messi's thumbnail. We know who is the greatest of all time. 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
It takes a whole team to win the WC.
10 other players also determine the team performance not just Messi.
Also they were literally runners up in 2014 , no one has made it to the finals and simultaneously achieved all those things that Messi has.
I don't know why Shaka keeps pointing to the World Cup and overlooks all his other achievements.
He is objectively the GOAT .
It would be great to hear more stories of the antics these pundits took part in, or . . . . . . witnessed.
Dear ESPN FC: Yall better stop using the GOATs name on these video titles, for views. I only watched it because I saw his name. Y'all opinions are not law and neither does it determined any players status, Shaka's opinion is clear, and that's what it is , his opinion. Stop trying to convince him otherwise as if his opinion carry more weight than any other individual on the face of thee earth. Shaka hislop has his own opinion. Dan Thomas we're tired of you trying to convince Uncle Shaka. Please stop mate, The GOAT Leo Messi doesn't need Uncle Shaka approval in the debate.
Is Leo the GOAT now for some haters??? Please answer
No
Btw I’m not a Messi hater not like y’all Barcelona fans…
@@carrion.adrian7 y’all can never answer your sides comments. You always go to the Messi/Barcelona fans to say something. They have their own family already. Go find yours and stop making yourself look like a victim to your wrong doings🤦🏻♂️💀
Top 5 players in my books in term of completeness
5- Zidane
4-Ronaldo (cr7)
3-Pele
2-Maradona
1-Messi
Joke list if you have that penalty kick/tap in merchant on their
Ronaldo won Champions league 3 times on the row. Won championship with all his clubs. Won Europe for portugal and the mini version. Golden boots England, Spain, Italy. Europe. Best goal scorer for country. Best goal scorer for Champions league. Stop the hate.
Someone please ask Shaka if Messi does win the 2022 world cup. Would he be the G.O.A.T then or the debate will turn to he needs to win 3???
Because before it was he as to win with Argentina, now it's Copa is easy, he needs to win 2.