Creality and E3D team up! It didn't go smoothly... (Titan Extruder Upgrade)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ก.พ. 2020
- Creality now offers a genuine E3D Titan Extruder upgrade for the CR-10 V2, but my experience attaching it was nothing short of disastrous.
I am excited to see these two companies work together in future, but the QC and user experience needs to be improved.
Links to topics mentioned in the video:
Creality CR-10 V2 Review - • Can the CR-10 V2 toppl...
E3D Titan Extruder upgrade - www.creality3dofficial.com/pr...
E3D V6 Cooling fan used - www.thingiverse.com/thing:1746358
Creality Ender 3 Direct Drive mod - www.printermods.com/
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50 3D Printing Tips and Tricks - gumroad.com/l/QWAh
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While our involvement with this upgrade was mainly relegated to supply of parts I still feel a weight of responsibility here. When I get in on Monday I'll catch up with the team, as well as reach out to Creality to offer our help to improve this integration. I'm sure that by working together we can make a success of this.
Dude, there was nothing wrong with the titan unit supplied.
@@MakersMuse Hi Angus
I... Was honestly stunned when I saw that fan shroud.
Reminds me a lot of this:
www.thingiverse.com/thing:3358417
Was a design I did some months ago. Please have a careful look at all the screenshots. This one worked very well. There are so many similarities between mine and this one...
Not that I am mad that my design was copied, it's more because it was copied so badly ;)
Edit.
That is, if it has been copied ;)
@@MakersMuse But it still looks bad for thier product even if the fault is due to the way it was implemented by someone else. If thier vendors aren't successful, they aren't successful.
I would have expected a firmware update and an approval on the part cooler design at least. Even if you had not supplied the rest. Even with Prusa people were not designing the cooler based around your heat-sink designs so I recommend that you guys add some cooling recommendations based on your recent V6 performance and flow testing. You should have some info about the static pressure requirements/flow. Recommended direction of flow and stuff like that. The fact that you shouldn't dump the hot air from the heatsink to the part etc.
@Timothy Hoogland Nah Creality needs to make it right on their end is the point. Most people aren't going to know about your site. The info should be in the manual.
Angus, thank you for the honest feedback, we will check with the company everything you mentioned and sorry for all inconvenience :(
Creality good on you for being open to feedback. Quality control and support defInitely goes a long way.
Creality open to feedback? Lol right? Well, maybe, if you run a 555K subscribers channel, they know the impact on buyers, otherwise... :\
@@jacobcreech4382 Ok, thanks for your suggestions.
@Jason Watkins Great, thank you for loving our printer.
I love Creality. They are always open to feedback to further improve their products. They even paid people a while back to give them feedback on the cr-10s pro. I was one who actually benefited from that. It allowed me to add a bltouch to mine for free, and people who buy the pro v2 now, get one with the machine. Gotta love a company who tries so hard to make their customers happy.
🤣🤣🤣 the electric drill was priceless
Having put a mouse on a laboratory shaker last week to keep a Windows session alive, I have to say I loved the drill hack.
I did exactly the same thing when I upgraded my CR-10S to a titan aero.
If your machine has a knob...
Ridiculous. M92 E[new_value] then M500. Agnus certainly has the experience to do this. Furthermore, he must have noticed that he loosened the heat block while installing the stepper on the extruder, but he plowed on and let it leak and fail.
@@GnuReligion but the drill is hilarious
That blue molding is classic engineering by the marketing department; can't let the customers know how easy it is to bolt an after-market part onto our printer ;)
or simply to "make it look nice" without considering the hardship it would add to maintenance. it does in fact make it look very nice. but I would prefer easy maintenance over looks nice :-)
Glad to see your back and ok. Was a little worried about you and the fires and then the flooding. I have been following you since i started printing, about a year and a few months, and I have learned so much and look forward to learning more. Thank you so much! 🙂
Bruh, using a drill to turn the knob was freaking GENIUS!!!!! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Actually was really dumb considering the type or rotary encoder the machine has it doesnt do well with fast rotations like that. He could have easily created a gcode file .
@@cutty02 Not to mention the wear - sounds like a good way to have to buy a spare on aliexpress
Hahaha “going to be an awesome year” hahahahaahha
Came here looking for this comment. Hahaha, I laughed when he said that.
@@eucolecionodinossauros Same
Great to see you back Angus! I have been talking to Theressa and got a little worried when not hearing from you. Glad your ok. Excellent video
I remember seeing your journey through this on Twitter, man that was hell
haha yeah, frustrating indeed.
Yup me too... Inside scoop before TH-cam
This guy is not the sharpest tool or he was being extremely lazy. How hard is it to put the titan on before putting the V6 in the shroud. Seriously double check your work.
Loads of kudos to you, I am happy to see all cons and pros to the printers, also it learns me a lot just by watching a lot of your videos, just got a CR-10S Pro bought (in a silly offer I could not refuse!) and so I went with it, it will be a fun learning process for me!
But this is whats good, seeing a review of bad stuff before we purchase themselves is worth SO much, thanks for this vid!
So glad you're back. Your videos on Fusion 360 basically taught me everything I know about CAD, and I couldn't be more greatful.
SAVAGE!
Great video! You don't let anything slide.
I love it!
Been awhile, glad your back!
Really appreciate the shout out on my upgrade kit on your Ender 3, this will also fit perfectly on your CR-10. I have put a lot of time and effort to offer a superior product and easy to install kit for most of the Creality machines.
Matthew Basaraba What is the kit called? I think he mentioned it was on eBay?
I have it on my cr10s and it works well with petg.
@@PeterVanLaarhoven81 It has moved off of Ebay and he posted the new link. Check out www.PrinterMods.com now for new direct drives and linear kits.
Really good to see you again! Thanks for posting.
It's great to see someone with experience go through all these different upgrades for the CR-10 V2! I got mine CR-10s V2 this christmas and there are lots of stuff that I want to change and with my lack of experience I would problably buy the wrong stuff. Keep up the good work!
I brought one too and love it. Right i was getting the best machine good the price. There are small things i want to do for better durability but I'm up to hear what you suggest.
Freaky... I left a comment on your previous video last night to say "hope you're well" and here you are!
Good to see you Angus. 👍😎
I got bashed for saying those angled supports weren’t needed but talk about over engineered! My V2 is now just a printfarm machine. It’s printing as good as my original CR-10 just quieter. Based on this I’m not sure I want to mess with it even though they sent me one too. And I agree, the Ender 3 is an amazing design for the money and prints incredibly well even in its stock bowden setup.
I regret messing with it, it was printing just fine with the 1mm nozzle I fitted before all this. Ah well.
That’s crazy. So glad I came across your video about the wires… I genuinely thought I was going crazy. Not sure about swapping the cords around myself.. I’ll have to keep looking for more info. Thanks for helping me narrow this down.
"It's going to be an awesome year" - Angus Feb 2020
Sadface
Glad to see your back and doing well!! I'm two things, one I use a drill from time to time to manage E-steps when modding so I understand, second it honestly seems like the upgrade was a last minute thing that wasn't released properly but they just wanted to put out there anyways without testing, but who knows. Good job either way
good to have you back, you were missed
Im not surprised this has happened. I watch alot of your videos and youve educated me so much with printers and problems and I have seen (as a new user of the Ender 3 Pro) that there will always be a certain amount of head scratching and frustration in getting a decent return for your money with these printers and upgrades.
So far my experience with my Ender 3 (not pro) was awesome! But I could just be one of the lucky ones without any quality flaws straight from the factory.
Glad to see you back
Great thinking on the cordless drill rotary encoder hack, love it!
I put that same orange cooling fan duct mount (the second one with the blower fan and 30mm fan) printed in HIPS on my heavily upgraded Folger Tech Reprap 2020 i3, and its been producing excellent quality prints since. I like that idea of converting the Ender 3's bowden to direct drive while keeping the connectors between a very short PTFE length.
Angus couldn't agree more had the exact same experience upgrading my cr-10v2
I have fitted a Hemera onto my Ender 3 Pro and not looking back! What a great multifilament unit my Ender 3 Pro is now. Such smooth and beautifully laid down plastic it can accomplish. I have never been happy with any Titan style printing extruder.
I like my Ender and S5 but glad you bash on Creality as well. I like that your perspective is different and glad that it sounds like you're going to pump out some more videos! Keep it up mate
I got into 3d printing this christmas. The biggest issue wich made me fiddle with my ender 3 pro for hours and weeks was heat creep causing the material to get stuck in the extruder. I used the standard and a cheap all metal hotend both got cloged several times. Then i bought a little bit better all metal hotend and it did it too.
It always worked a while and then the prints got bad and worse.
What really saved me was a video where someone used thermal paste for the metal tube to make better contact to the cooler. Since then i just need to load the gcode and it printed nearly a complete kg roll without maintenance since then.
I've been using a Titan Aero with Volcano on my CR-10 for years. It is a fantastic combination and has been extremely reliable. I used a custom bracket/cooler from thingiverse to mount it and adjusted the end stops to account for the size difference. I had to swap out a bearing on the Aero and that is the only failure in many thousands of hours of printing. Even the original fan is somehow still alive. I will have no qualms going back to E3D next time I need an extruder/hot end.
Cheers, thanks for being honest all the time! Like it!
3d printing technology isn't improving as fast as we imagined 5~10 years ago 💔 we thought by 2020 we'd have many of the inconveniences eliminated, however we still have long, long way to go.
We really did didn't we... In some ways they've improved such as silent stepper drivers and better slicers, but quality control is still an ongoing issue as consumers demand cheaper and cheaper products.
@@MakersMuse I guess we just get what we pay for. If we want cheat we should expect cheap quality. If something is going to be dumb expensive then it better be top notch quality.
My experience has been better than yours. My third printer is light years from my first. The cheap printers are getting all the features of the expensive ones. I agree with Jose though. If you buy cheap from companies known for cutting corners you're not going to be pleased with the results.
@@MakersMuse I wouldn't mind a somewhat higher price tag if it came with reliably higher reliability. But at least here the most common differentiatior is the lack of community support. I get similar problems but no one to ask about. At least until you get into the clearly professional bracket with prices to match.
Consumer/hobbie grade improves very slow compared to Industrial grade additive technology. It's just the tradeoff between opensource practical improvements vs proprietary high budget R&D. I'm still happy how we as a community can tinker around low budget printers and help each other to find solutions.
Always good work.
I bought two E3D extruders. Spent a whole month trying to fix extrusion issues, with their support being evasive. Switched to a BondTech and everything worked beautifully.
can we have an update on the v3 version of this printer
and bring back the old-style fan shroud? Man, that thing was great. One time we got the classic "ball of death" and it was surprisingly easy to clean. Just a few screws and you can open it up and scrape everything off.
It worked fine with me, the Allen key didn't quite fit so I used my fine tip screwdriver and the 4th bolt went it perfectly, took 2 minutes to install. They also had precompiled firmware so I didn't have to worry about any drive/esteps issues. Was probably the smoothest upgrade I've ever done on a 3D printer...
‘It’s going to be an awesome year’
Thanks for the video.
Long time no let'e get started!
Based on your Creality coments, I went for the Sidewinder. Using PLA, it has only once failed to print, and looking at my model, it was clearly my mistake. Fixed the mistake and it printed beautifully. Thanks for your channel. (Yes, I'm barefoot now.)
I agree about the Creality fan shroud it's pure decoration
“going to be an awesome year”
I had that leaking nozzle/backfill problem on the heat element. It's not a write off. Get it apart, pick as much out as possible, then soak the whole thing in solvent, careful not to expose the wiring. I used a methyl acetate based paint stripper. After a few days it turns PLA into snot and you can clean it up easily.
6:40
Angus: "There are so many Design for ducts that kinda sucks"
Duct: Thats why I am here
Engineers: We've made it so that it can blow quite well.
Production Manager: We need more material on it so the customers feels better about us, need more aesthetic as well.
Engineers: that will ruin the air flow.
Production Manager: Just do it.
I've got a CR-10 V2 and an ender 3, and I have to agree, the Ender 3 (and many other creality printers) cooling duct is just such a simple design, so easy to troubleshoot and upgrade, just undo a couple of screws and you're in! The Cr10 V2 one though... may look nice on the outside but that cooling duct is such a pain I have the feel I want to change it just so I don't have to dissasemble it ever again.
Thank you Angus for being frank, I really appriciate and respect that. Keep being honest to yourself, it makes you awesome!
I recently did similar back and forth rotation of the heater block on a Prusa MK3S by about the same angle. The reason for it was different of course but the result was the same leak you got.
I ordered mine when they first became available. Took quite awhile to get here, but it installed fine. I did have the plastic leaking, but I think it was my fault. I used the firmware from Creality and didn't have to set steps or anything. I re-installed the short piece of bowden tube and redid the nozzle and it's been printing fine ever since with the factory nozzle and heatbreak.
So glad you did this video. On my CR10S Pro which now has an E3D Hermes installed. This will print the Benchy but not the top canopy it can't seem to do the bridging at all no matter what I do. The same file prints just fine on my other 3D printer so I'm reaching out to you or to anyone else who could point me in the correct direction to fix this. This prints ok with supports on but that's not really the way this test is to be printed.
Thanks for an unbiased review
Thanks for sharing 👍😀
Asger Vestbjerg - my electronics teacher from AMU back in 1996/1997 ?
It looks like you should remove the fan screw and use the long screw to hold the fan and the Titan. I just ordered the CR-10 V2 and will be getting the Titan soon so will update on what I find.
@Angus..
in the video, you mentionned an v6 clone.. I have an anet a8, and I've been thinking of changing my hotend, and the V6 (and clones) are a popular option (although I'd like to keep a direct drive).. but I can't really get a reliable review of real vs cloned V6, and which clones can be trusted (and which cheapest is good?).
I was wondering if this is something that would interest you, to produce as a video..
thanks for all the good work and good luck this year.
I use a drill too, when I dont have a computer on hand, to rapidly increment my knob control to change my ESteps on my TEVO Tarantula. I am glad to see my janky solution isn't just my solution.
I recently bought my first 3d printer and really like your videos and use a lot of tpu for my drones I have the creality cr-10s pro and want to upgrade the extruder to direct drive but the e3d is currently not distributing so do you have any suggestions should I wait or is there another with similar quality
This is bit unfair to Creality. I did this upgrade to my CR-10 V2 without any issues whatsoever and am really happy with the prints I am now getting. The trick was to read the instructions provided and follow them. I installed the recommended firmware, there was no need to modify cables or use an electric drill to get the correct esteps, the firmware took care of it all. Yes it was a little fiddly getting the extruder in place but again by following the provided instructions I had it in place in under 10 minutes. Really happy will this upgrade so far, including printing of flexible filaments.
Happy to see this video.. Just backs up my decision to buy a V2, and sell it again after 14 days because nothing would stick to the bed. Just aweful.. Also with powercut, after heating up the nozzle, it started to print, despite the bed was keeping cooling, so I had to manually enter the temp for the bed again. It really wasnt what I had expected from Creality.. My old Ender3 is running flawlessly, althought I should probably have changed the steppermotors already to get rid of the squicky sound..
Off topic: Cant wait for you to get your hands on a Prusa MINI and review it :)
Nice video, thanks for the honesty. What is your retraction settings on the direct drive setup, I tried several diff settings and filaments but cant get rid of stringing?
Great stuff as always Angus, my buddy just picked up the creality CR-10 V3. It did a few good prints but now nothing sticks to the bed!! I have resolved a few problems with alignment of the gantry, bed, USB driver so it will communicate with the computer but we still can't get it to stick to the borosilacate glass bed. Its almost like it goes to home and we do a leveling then when it goes to print, it seems to lift up about .1ish higher than its supposed to be so no bed adheasion?? I have an A5 and i have to wait until the bed cools or i won't get the print off!! We have been on the creality site to get the firmware to reflash it but they don't have it. Since the V2 is a bowden and the V3 is a DD, the settings would be different but they say to use the V2s firmware??
Any ideas or suggestions?
Thanks
Im running the e3d volcano on my anet8, it takes a bit of tweaking and improved thinking, but once its running, it runs very well. First change needs to be a larger cooling fan on the hotend.
Your opinion is like gold to me and I rely on it for ALL my 3D purchases and honestly I cant know for sure but I am betting you have saved me a thousand dollars because of your brutal honesty and that is exactly what this community needs most. Especially with all the crap and hacks that are out there trying to take your money!
I recently got the CR-10 v2 and noticed the following: the included aluminum Bowden extruder works really well. I upgraded to a Bondtech but only minimal improvement. During the upgrade I noticed the included Bowden tube was causing friction and binding (I think it’s just cheap plastic) so I upgraded that to a Capricorn. That fixed the binding issue I was feeling when manually feeding PLA. The last thing I noticed is the heatbed seems low on the right side but that’s because the X Gantry needs to be adjusted for square. Otherwise, a great buy and great results for me as a Bowden setup.
Same here.
I've had a Creality 3 for 6 months, so am just moving out of beginner mode. I'm considering buying another printer and have looked at loads of reviews. My decision is to buy another Creality 3. It's simple, cheap, I know how it works and it's easy to upgrade. Keep up the good work ... your videos are very entertaining (and educational).
Do u mean a Ender 3 ?
Yes ... my bad
@@derekhawley9660 ah ok, yeah it's a awesome printer i have one too :). And I agree, it's a very capable well made printer for a low price! 👍
This machine's gantry is actually really good and solid, and the overall construction of the machine is solid. It even features Trinamic TMC2209 Drivers, which are nice. But yeah, if your print doesn't stick and you dont stop it, the filament will literally fill up the nozzle cavity like a balloon and you have to dissasemble the whole nozzle, then reheat it and clean out literally everything. If you're gonna buy this machine just be ready for that, or upgrade to a different hotend
I just want to start off by saying I like your honest reviews and to be honest when I bought my first couple realities not knowing about 3D printing I just assumed they were startup machines and since then I've modified it to death so my opinion you're right they could do better but most the time I think reality is a startup and then you learn from there from the ground up
Angus back at it after the fires boo yah
Just got one of these on order after watching your review. Can you tell me what nozzles are needed for these as I want to put a 0.8mm one in to speed up printing face visors?
I've had an Ender 3 for just about a year and have had pretty much only two issues which was when the acrylic extruder arm broke (admittedly a very poor design choice) and the PTFE tubing degrading. Since I've replaced both I've had no problems. I've gone both with small nozzles (down to 0.2) to make D&D minis as well as big (up to 0.8mm) for figures as big as it can handle and no issues. I would still would like to see some changes.
1. Better stock extruder.
2. A hotend fan that only turns on when the hotend is heated.
3. Better fan shroud.
4. E3D compatible hotend. I have both the Ender 3 and the Anycubic predator and I'd rather have the same kind of nozzle for both.
5. Wi-Fi enabled.
I know the struggle of trying to swap out the hotend. The heater element in my tevo tarantula died so I bought an e3d replacement hotend. Never got it to print properly ever since.
3:45 LOVE THAT
Do a cooling duct benchmark
I've been using the circular ones for a long time now
if you have spare time you might could review the Climber7 printer ? :D Have seen this thing today on aliexpress and it looks quite nice
I think they fixed the issues quite nicely in the V3 .... it comes pre-assembled with the titan and I got great prints right out of the box ... in fact Im really not keen to upgrade anything as it's printing perfectly as is ... no stringing and part cooling seems to be good as well
They should provide an adapter cable for the motor polarity support
That little bit where rotating the assembly unscrewed the hotend is the main reason why I've grown to hate the V6-style hotends. Having to line up the heatbrake and nozzle perfectly against each other is such a pain, not to mention the mounting method for the whole hotend (the whole slot-ring thing) makes it _impossible_ to keep the thing still while tightening... I switched to a mosquito (clone) on my Ender 3 and the thing is rock solid, haven't had a leak since, and I've been swapping nozzles more often because I don't have to spend an hour recalibrating everything anymore.
hi thanks so much for your videos… I’m a beginner in 3D printing with a second hand from a friend up mini 2…. Let’s say I’m made my first errors and broken the hotend… I know you are still using the up mini, have you ever try an alternative hotend, more affordable or easier available? that would help me a lot… Thanks so much
Could you cover second hand 3d printers, now plenty on gummytree. Is it even worth buying one or just go for new?
Hello
Maker's Muse.
If someone is getting a new 3D printer today what 3D printer would you recommend getting mostly for good surface PLA prints ?
I just repaired a jam in my Cr10 v3, and it has the same awkward extruder setup. Caused a lot of headache. Taking it apart was very awkward. But I really manhandled it and it held up so theres that.
Thanks for the video, it seems that there is not much testing before the put it on the market, shame on them.
It feels like when it came to the fitting they should have supplied a longer bolt to replace the top left fan one. bolting through the fan rather than that twisting. Side note keep debating about upgrading to direct drive but everything is printing really nice that I'm reluctant to.
Sir, a question if I may. When you were assembling the extruder, why didn’t you remove the blue cooling duct from the hot end to give you clearance to install the extruder? It looks like it was fairly easy to remove as you did it later in the video to try and clean the hot end.
@airwalwer
i couldn't understand why he didn't do that either?
I had absolutely zero problems setting up my Titan extruder on my cr-10 V2 .
I installed their firmware got all the data that I needed flash get back to Marlin 2.0.3 set up all the parameters that I just recorded from their firmware
And it works beautiful
But I had to purchase my extruder and the marketing stated it was included.
China has no problem with false advertising
^ Thank you this guy makes it look terrible when its super easy to do. I can sense a total bias
I say put a Hemera on it! I put one on my Tevo Tornado and the prints are AMAZING!!!
I've had problems with my cr10spro. Wont stay level, no thermal run away, print bed chipped while taking a print off, main board sd slot broke, the pfte tube wont stay in printer. I changed to a micro swiss hot end and just bought a wham bam.
I like my prusa mk3s and minis
My Ender 3 Pro is my new workhorse!
Hi, I have a cr-10s. One from the year it was first released. Its been a solid work horse but its time to replace.
Would you go with a V2 bowden or newer V3 that solves the issue you had with the original v2?
Thanks for the help
Using a drill was genius!
Could you avoid the accidental unscrewing of the hot block by taking the entire hot end assembly off the carriage and then installing the extruder? Just curious
Have you done a review on the Micro Swiss all metal direct drive hot end yet? I'm looking at one for my CR10S.
The Printermods version (shown on his Ender 3) is far superior and half the price.
The Chinese consumer electronics industry has matured at a phenomenal rate over the last few years, but there is still plenty of room for improvement in quality control, and after sales support. It is reminiscent of Japan about fifty years ago - the future looks bright!
Do you know where I can get a palette plus? I can't find one.
Strange, I've just done almost exactly the same thing over the last week with a part cooling fan upgrade - it put pressure onto the heater wires enough that it nudged the heater block around by a couple of degrees after a few days of use and has now spurged plastic all over the top.
Bugger.
Oh and 7:31 - Ouch at the flexing of that filament. I'm surprised that's possible.
I’m having the same problem with the PLA overflowing inside the hot end. I ordered an original hot end kit from Amazon, but, trying to separate the plastic shroud I found that is stack at one end and I'm not sure what will happen if I try to force it. It looks as though the PLA stack to it. Do you have any suggestions? I’ve been following your videos and I found them most useful because I’m beginner to this and I needed to make a simple part for one of my mechanical projects. I’m having no luck at the moment and I bought the CR10 V2 from a friend and as I found it has many problems and I can see that someone’s inexperienced paws have been at it. Thanks Mike
You should do another video on best 3D printers for their price, by the way what is your favorite/best three printer?
Anycubic came up with an Mega upgrade with a titan clone extruder. I didn't have the same level of problems as you but I did really feel something was sorely lacking in the design and instructions. I'm thinking this is more about the state of the industry and not one company in particular.
Anyway, Off topic but, glad you're safe and doing well, Angus.
how does the v2 compare to the sidewinder? especially concerning about print speed. Thanks
Many printer companies rely on people like you to do their reverse engineering. YOU find the problems and issues after it's released, and they eventually correct what you find wrong. Just like software companies that release a new build that they know isn't ready for the general public, but it's more important to get their product to market, than to get it working properly first.
I've just snapped my wires on the thermistor, by tightening my tube adapter on top it rotated the nozzle and broke the wires, I'm swapping it all out for micro Swiss or something
I'm curious on what your e-steps ended up being. I've been through mine, with this mod, and i cant seem to get the right value. Its close though
Thank you for reminding me why I bought a Prusa i3 Mk3 :)