Looks like you could also use a modified heater block with two heater cartridges, and use the same nozzle for high flow and low-oose depending on whether both heaters or just the lower one is powered? (Although maybe it would mean the heat break is higher than optimal)
i think it's a good alternative to the full volcano. I am wondering what the tool is called/where did you get the tool for holding the block to help install/remove the hotend at 6:30-6:35 in the video?
No, the cheapest option I found for the nut was $20 or more. For less than that I can get the brass nuts or even get a volcano block. If the nut was cheaper, I would heavily consider it.
I've literally been using a mod like this on my CR10s5 for ages now. With a titanium outer shell and a brass internal lining press fit into the titanium. It works perfectly. I used a full brass set-up, but that lost too much heat.
Even if it only performed as well as the stock nozzle, it's good to know i can at least use a volcano nozzle to get enough clearance to experiment with stuff like nonplanar and sequential printing, which would be great for a few projects i'm working on.
I was also thinking about how it allows you to increase the gantry height in your slicer settings, allowing you to print slightly taller items 'one at a time' instead of 'all at once' when printing multiple items.
I don’t even own a 3D printer but I’ve followed your channel for a couple years. I just get excited to see new videos because your testing methodology, data analysis, and engineering is top notch.
At $69 delivered for a Ender 2 Pro off ebay as an "unrepair" (a customer return, mine had never even been assembled), what's holding you back? Ender 3 pro's are $79 delivered, same unrepair customer returns...
@@brianmi40 maybe he just does not have the usecase. if you do not tinker a lot or are not interested in novelty or minifigure prints, affordability/availability does not matter.
@@eccomi21 But with a 3D printer you always have something to tinker on: the 3D printer itself, especially if it's cheap, a little flawed, and not locked down against modifications. It's an ideal hobby.
I love how you are like "look at all the awesome stuff others are doing" ...... "Lemme show you how to do it on the cheap but still quality" You are very appreciated good sir!
Just saw the insert soldering tips. Those things are bangers, especially since they advertise M900 compatibility which previous tips I've seen don't seem to cover due to incorrect lengths which I've seen others say burns out ceramic heaters. Basically an instant buy. I can't believe no one has made this product given how relatively simple it is. It doesn't even have the type of price premium I'd have expected.
Stefan, your suggestions worked perfectly for me. I used a Volcano long nozzle on my Ender 3V2 with 2 brass nuts to lock against the hotend block. After adjusting the Creality touch sensor and re-setting the Z-offset, it printed my test square perfectly. I've not made any redirect for the cooling air so it might require a little re-direction so that the air is pointing to the nozzle tip (as standard) and not on the extension. Next step is to turn up a bit of brass and make a silicone sleeve to optimise heating. It was always a pain to visulaize the printng process, now I can see the extruder perfectly on very small prints. Thankyou!
i know this is hella old, i've just tried doing this on my ender 3v2, and i keep getting underextrusion even on 10mm/s flow, my normal hot end can do 12 without any issue, any tips?
I've squeezed a bit more performance from my DIY "volcanoid" solid copper hotend by adding high temperature thermal paste (400 °C stable) to fill the air gap in the threads. (Don't use regular thermal paste)
@@aurimasknieza7320 no it serves the opposite effect. But do not worry your printer is nowhere near such sensitivity that paste will be needed. Such a printer would require Slicer to adjust PID settings based on flow rate.
@@cutterboard4144 I searched for thermal paste that's made for high temperature sensor mounts (exhausts, heater etc.), found a company that sells 5 gram syringes of that stuff. It's labelled "TG 20031" though that might just be that company's product ID and not a general term.
When I saw the thumbnail I thought oh geez. But like always you backed it up with data and showed your work. Great job. This opens up a ton of options for printers that lack the ability to easily replace heater blocks. I'll def give this a go.
I did the Volcanizer mod on my printer with a 0.6mm nozzle on a Ender 3 v2. Works great and shaved so many hours off my prints and still looks great. I used a m6 steel nut and spacers with thermal compound between each for isolation of the brass nozzle. I mostly print functional bigger parts and for my application great mod!
Always love a bit of data challenging preconceptions. To me this raises an interesting option with non-planar 3d printing if it ever takes off. If you need more clearance from your print head assembly to get the angles you want just use the volcano nozzle and nut method.
Just had a great idea: Simply buy some 6 or 7mm ID silicone tubing, slide it over the exposed volcano nozzle, and cut to length. Or buy 10mm or whatever is necessary to slide around the nuts. Super simple insulation against the cooling fans that's cheap and easy to remove.
Cool, did pretty much exactly that and got +60% more flow. P.S. With hardened steel volcano nozzle there much less of an effect w/o a brass nut, which makes sense.
I went to the hardware store today and picked up a handful of 6mm x 1.0 nuts. I filed the contact surfaces of a single nut flat, screwed it onto a 0.6mm volcano nozzle, and mounted it on my standard E3D hotend and heater block. The results have been amazing! I have been able to push my delta printer to 120 mm/sec speeds without any flow problems. I'm sure I can probably go faster, but considering that your method has already allowed me to go from reliably printing at about 70 mm/sec to 120, I am super happy! Thank you for the great video and for all of your careful research on this subject.
This is a great experiment, and the results are very surprising, I was thinking of changing the hotend on one of my printer to a volcano, but if you can get similar, if not the same, results by just plugging in a volcano nozzle, maybe I don't need the volcano hotend after all, thanks Stefan!
This video addresses a question I asked myself not even a week ago. I gave up on finding out the difference between the Rapido hotends and thought I'd never get a satisfying answer. Thank you for proving me wrong. Fascinating!
Great content as usual. Thanks. I recently covered my soldering iron to prevent my fingers getting burned by the long exposed heating section (cheap soldering iron). I used car exhaust tape, basically glass tape with some high temperature adhesive impregnated. The adhesive becomes like glass when heated and the hot part is well insulated, or better at least. The tape wrapped around my soldering iron now gives me more warning and time to yank my fingers away. I would think that high temperature fibre glass tape as used in stoves and other heating element wiring would nicely slip over the long nozzle and reduce cooling from the fan
You are a Saint. Sharing experienced practical knowledge. I see it brings you and others joy. Very inspiring. Now off to wrap some copper (16ga house) wire around some nozzles and twist it snug with pliers. Inspiring indeed : )
Funny you made this video. I put a new hotend on my Vyper and the nozzle sat to high where the z end stops would hit before the nozzle hit the bed. So I put a volcano hot end in and it worked good. Very nice video.
Thanks to your video I change regular mk8 0.6 type nozzle to volcano(fake one) 0.6 nozzle with two steel nuts. It's insane that i went from max 12mm³/sec to near 25mm³/sec and above this values filament forms in something like spring under extruder toothwheel ! Thank You - its working brillant !
I just installed a volcano nozzle on an original CR10, I added also klipper with RPI, bl-touch and locked the bed with nuts. Let me tell you that the best improvement on quality and speed came out after using the Volcano. I cannot believe how good are the prints now, and so fast....
I've been running exactly this setup for a while now, didn't have any issues with it even at high flow rates (20+mm3/s) Only problem I had is that a strong part cooling fan can mess with sensitive thermal runaway protection in Klipper. Relaxing settings a bit there helps though.
Brass or copper nuts are probably worse for performance because they add only a little heating outside the nozzle core threads but lose more heating through their higher conduction to the air. Titanium nuts that are better insulators would probably perform the best.
Two days ago I was faced with blocked nozzle on my ender 3 pro and did not have any more spare nozzles, hence I used a more commonly available nozzle as it has the same thread but longer. So I reduced the threads in the heartbreak and used that to compensate for accommodating the workaround nozzle and interestingly I got the same perfect print resolution and finish. Very same concept to what you have explained. I totally agree with you on this concept
Awesome findings Stefan!! Now hear me out, I have an idea for a quick follow up. Use one of your modified volcano nozzles you made for the DIY CRT nozzle video and use it with the brass nuts. The ones with the copper wire inserted in it. Those results could be even higher and it would be cheap to make a really high flow nozzle.
first the cr-10 upgraded with volcano heatblock, then the diy cht nozzles, and now volcanizer. i know volcano heatblocks and nozzles are already cheap nowadays, but man the accessibility of your solutions and mods are just an armlength away, and you've got the data to prove it! also, tom's video on the 0.6 nozzle makes a lot of sense too. i wish there were more stefans and toms in the community. keep the reprap spirit alive!
I love your work Stefan! I recently bought a Rapido UHF and was surprised to learn that for the extra price you pay you get basically…a nut (plus a volcano nozzle).
and the 2nd silicone sock. HF and UHF version did cost exactly the same at the store I ordered. With the HF version you receive an extra hardened steel nozzle instead of the UHF stuff.
@@CentaXBerlin2 oh right the long sock.. I guess a hardened nozzle would be a better choice for me, if I had the chance to choose that (ordered from AE a while ago)
Nice to see this tests. I have had such a setup a long time ago but never really tested its performance (yet) but found the replacing of standard nozzle with vulcano worked well except for the loss of Z-hight. So after a while it was replaced again with a standard nozzle on that printer. I had planned to replace one of my printers with a vulcano - with your real testresults in mind I will probably just replace the nozzle now. Thanks!
Hej Stefan, great video as always. I'm thinking maybe the copper plated steel or brass nuts mostly act as an insulator when using cooling. Also, great to see the regular CHT beats even the Volcanizer. Just let us know in case you also want to ompare all the above against using a full Bondtech CHT nozzle for Volcano..
Thanks for once again being top tier with both your methodology and frontier thinking. You’re as always impressively thorough. So; while these tricks can be great for simply increasing the max flow rate drastically, the long melt zone will also cause more oozing and hence, a loss of detail and a severe risk of extensive stringing. To strike a good balance seems easiest doable by using a Bondtech CHT nozzle which I use today. As the cheap Chinese knock-offs are not made with chamfered sinked holes like the original Bondtech CHT, they cannot be recommended for anyone wondering if this is a viable economical shortcut. But to be fair, it is possible to actually do this yourself if you have the tools for it.
You've done a number of videos now on high flow set ups that I've greatly appreciated. However one thing I think that would be great to see is how these various high flow setups perform in an intricate print with retracts, z hops, short layers, etc. It'd be really cool to find a high flow setup that also happens to accurately perform the chimney(arguably one of the most difficult area's of the speed benchy) as well as it performs the rest of the boat.
I want to see more advancement in hot ends. Things like the Revo that wrap the cartridge around the nozzle, and other novel experiments. It's so frustrating trying to adjust a traditional hot end
This is awesome. Im sure somebody has done this previously in the past, but i love seeing people experiment with their printers now adays, even with such a saturated market for all sorts of proprietary accessories and upgrades for 3d printers.
Using a copper heat block helps a lot. I have been printing with pretty good results --- with a volcano+copper heat block+1.2 mm nozzle+10% over extrusion --- at flow rates around 40 mm^3/sec.
I'd like to see a similar video showing differences between different wattage heater cartridges. For example: I find the standard 30 watt heater cartridge to be too weak to reliably run a Volcano, but now that there is a 40 watt and now even a 50 watt from Slice Engineering, it would be interesting to see how they affect performance even on a standard heater block.
Slice apparently even has a Magnum+ that can use two 50W. I dunno who needs 100W in a printer unless you are high flowing some very high temp materials.
@@filanfyretracker The 80 watt sure is a beast with the super volcano, but it would be nice to see if we could get similar specs on a hot end that doesn't have such an extreme lever arm or maybe a shorter melt zone (for oozing purposes).
I think it's Blasphemous that around two thirds of your audience aren't subscribed to you ! Love your work keep it up mate, I appreciate what you do ! :D
When you dont have a proper sock or if your sock is damaged you can repair it with high temp RTV automotive silocone. The temps will be plenty good and it bonds REALLY REALLY WELL... dont let it cure on your silicone work pads. You could coat the nozzle for the test and then peel it off of you want to change it. If you are super keen make a thinwall PLA form to fill with RTV. Peel off after cure and you have an encased nozzle.
Hypothesis: There may not be very much of a heat gradient. Yes there will be a drop off in heat towards the nozzle because it's farther away from the heater. However, the filament is coming from above and closer to the heater. With the filament moving the temperature might be a lot more balanced throughout.
This is not true. I did as he said. The printer does not print at the same temperature because the hotend is too cold. I managed to get it to print at a temperature of 10 degrees above normal. Only in this case it is completely incomprehensible what was the point of fencing all these crutches, if you could just raise the temperature.
@@hate-conductor You're misunderstanding the experiment. He wasn't printing. He was running flow tests. He keeps the temperature the same throughout the video in order to find and measure the difference between the methods. If you tried one of these methods then, yes, you may need to increase the temperature to get consistent prints again. However, since you didn't say anything about flow or print speed it doesn't make any sense to call these methods "crutches". You might be able to print at a higher speed and not realize it. Or it might not work because of your machine and setup. None of this is a guarantee. Also nothing you've said disproves or even addresses my hypothesis. Nothing here at all measures heat drop off.
@@VagabondTE i have tried this method with 0.6mm, 0.8mm. and even 1mm nozzle size and it rarely prints well, clogging seems to be an issue, increasing the temperature exacerbate the problem, I use both brass nut and regular nut and both produce similar results, I gave up using this method and go back to regular nozzle
nice video. the main drawback for a standard prusa user (such as me) would be overwriting printers software. Other than that not sure if it would not create problems with the sensors mount. So a possible custom sensor mount. that being said this is definitely worth looking into
I have purchased quite expensive Copper heatblock for my v6 thinking it would help melting performance. But after testing I found that it does not improve hot-end flow by any measurable amount. Copper heatblock even visibly increased ringing artifacts due to its weight. At these flowrates heat transfer through plastic itself is the biggest bottleneck in flowrate, that is why Bondtech CHT is so good. Maybe copper heatblock would be more useful with a CHT nozzle? Needs testing.
The heat capacity of the copper will help to stabilize temperatures and are more suitable for higher temperatures. Though they won't help increase flow in probably 98% of cases.
@@CNCKitchen I think You are correct. I did my tests using PLA at 210°C which is on the low-end of FDM 3D printing temperatures. I should probably redo these tests using something like Nylon at 270°C. I have ordered the CHT nozzle. Excited to test these combinations.
I have a brass v6 heater block with a 50w cartridge I think that with copper sleeve with a volcano nozzle might out preform volcano based on extrusion deviation. At high flow rates
You've shown, what I try to do every project. Take what you have and find a way to make it better (that just what the MFGs have done!) to suit your needs. Thanks for all the great details!
Stefan! Try the reverse of the "copper" nut! You were right about the gradient and increasing the thermally conductive cross sectional area of heat flow with real copper and then insulating it (even if insulation is just a less conductive plating like steel or nickel) will have better results since it will have a lower h value! Newton's law of cooling!!
Inspired by this video, I did another variation of this. Screwed the volcano nozzle completely through my Ender 3 V2 (MK8) hotend, then a long (about 10 mm) M6 nut to couple the nozzle to my bi-metal heatbreak :)
Delta T is the highest in the top of the heater. By the time the filament enters the extension it's already heated quite a bit. So I'm the extension not that much heat needs to be added. Having the hottest bit on the top could actually be an optimum in heat transfer.
The downside is that the temperature will drop significantly towards the end so even if the heater is at 210C, the nozzle tip may only be 200C, preventing you from getting that extra heat in. You could compensate by raising the heater to 220C, but then when you aren't extruding, everything will heat up to 220C. Ideally you would want to control the temperature of the filament as it comes out of the nozzle. So having the heater closer to the nozzle tip and having the cooler end of the nozzle at the top would allow you to preheat the filament before getting to the nozzle and heater block. This would leave less of the filament at high temperature and for less time.
Which is why the copper results are so close to the results with nuts. The key element here is that the losses in the copper are not as big as the decrease of needed energy by the plastic. That will change as you said - longer nozzle and eventually the copper will actually cool the plastic.
Das ist ja interessant, danke dafür! Habe meine Hotend Kombinationen auch selbst gefräst (Heatsink) und zusammengestellt, als Heatbreak Slice Engineering Copperhead. Und auch mit der V6 CHT Nozzle (0.4) gefahren. Musste aber feststellen, dass sie für meine PETG und PCTG Drucke einfach zu unsauber gedruckt hat. Habe eine Brozzl Copper drinne und bisher keine Unterextrusion und wieder saubere Wände. Auf eine Volcano Düse hätte ich aber mal Lust und daher danke für das coole Video!
OK so what if you put down some thermal paste on the threads and between the nuts, and between the nut and block. Probably wont' affect temps much. But might affect your gradient across the tip. Then combine that with a silicone sock.
I would suppose that effect might be related to the bigger real temperature at the nozzle. I know, that you kept the measured temp same, but you might have changed the heat capacity of the system with all these additions, so old PID parameters resulted to a bigger real temperature, which affected extrusion results.
Do you think a Volcanizer™ is a reasonable alternative to a full Volcano hotend?
Seems legit!
Looks like you could also use a modified heater block with two heater cartridges, and use the same nozzle for high flow and low-oose depending on whether both heaters or just the lower one is powered?
(Although maybe it would mean the heat break is higher than optimal)
i think it's a good alternative to the full volcano. I am wondering what the tool is called/where did you get the tool for holding the block to help install/remove the hotend at 6:30-6:35 in the video?
No, the cheapest option I found for the nut was $20 or more. For less than that I can get the brass nuts or even get a volcano block. If the nut was cheaper, I would heavily consider it.
I've literally been using a mod like this on my CR10s5 for ages now. With a titanium outer shell and a brass internal lining press fit into the titanium. It works perfectly. I used a full brass set-up, but that lost too much heat.
Manufacturers: To get the best flow rate, you'll need a new hotend from us.
Stefan: I get plenty of flow with these nuts!
He has the nuts to speak up!
I get it being correct and thus timeless and all but still a missed chance at writing it as "deez nuts"
@@Kalvinjj Deez nuts give you superior performance.
@@Kalvinjj Stefan: check out my new hotend idea, I call it deez
Manufacturers: I've never heard of that method, what is deez
Stefan: Deez Nutz
enough nuts can solve every problems
keeping track of this amount of data and then presenting it in a video like this is incredible. Great work Stefan!
For this one it was really tough tbh. I hope I still was able to bring along the main points.
@@CNCKitchen for even a newbie like me, you do an excellent job explaining the data and real world uses! Thank you so much for all you do!!!
He is just a scientist.
Even if it only performed as well as the stock nozzle, it's good to know i can at least use a volcano nozzle to get enough clearance to experiment with stuff like nonplanar and sequential printing, which would be great for a few projects i'm working on.
Great point! Removing the hex might make it even better usable for this application.
I was also thinking about how it allows you to increase the gantry height in your slicer settings, allowing you to print slightly taller items 'one at a time' instead of 'all at once' when printing multiple items.
I don’t even own a 3D printer but I’ve followed your channel for a couple years. I just get excited to see new videos because your testing methodology, data analysis, and engineering is top notch.
Awesome! Thank you! Appreciate it.
At $69 delivered for a Ender 2 Pro off ebay as an "unrepair" (a customer return, mine had never even been assembled), what's holding you back? Ender 3 pro's are $79 delivered, same unrepair customer returns...
@@brianmi40 maybe he just does not have the usecase. if you do not tinker a lot or are not interested in novelty or minifigure prints, affordability/availability does not matter.
@@eccomi21 for sure, was just informing that Covid has led to all time best deals on printers…
@@eccomi21 But with a 3D printer you always have something to tinker on: the 3D printer itself, especially if it's cheap, a little flawed, and not locked down against modifications. It's an ideal hobby.
I love how you are like "look at all the awesome stuff others are doing" ...... "Lemme show you how to do it on the cheap but still quality" You are very appreciated good sir!
Just saw the insert soldering tips.
Those things are bangers, especially since they advertise M900 compatibility which previous tips I've seen don't seem to cover due to incorrect lengths which I've seen others say burns out ceramic heaters.
Basically an instant buy. I can't believe no one has made this product given how relatively simple it is. It doesn't even have the type of price premium I'd have expected.
Stefan, your suggestions worked perfectly for me. I used a Volcano long nozzle on my Ender 3V2 with 2 brass nuts to lock against the hotend block. After adjusting the Creality touch sensor and re-setting the Z-offset, it printed my test square perfectly. I've not made any redirect for the cooling air so it might require a little re-direction so that the air is pointing to the nozzle tip (as standard) and not on the extension. Next step is to turn up a bit of brass and make a silicone sleeve to optimise heating. It was always a pain to visulaize the printng process, now I can see the extruder perfectly on very small prints. Thankyou!
i know this is hella old, i've just tried doing this on my ender 3v2, and i keep getting underextrusion even on 10mm/s flow, my normal hot end can do 12 without any issue, any tips?
I've squeezed a bit more performance from my DIY "volcanoid" solid copper hotend by adding high temperature thermal paste (400 °C stable) to fill the air gap in the threads. (Don't use regular thermal paste)
I see what you did there. :D
Would automotive copper grease do well in such application?
@@aurimasknieza7320 no it serves the opposite effect. But do not worry your printer is nowhere near such sensitivity that paste will be needed. Such a printer would require Slicer to adjust PID settings based on flow rate.
what is the high temperature paste made of?
@@cutterboard4144 I searched for thermal paste that's made for high temperature sensor mounts (exhausts, heater etc.), found a company that sells 5 gram syringes of that stuff. It's labelled "TG 20031" though that might just be that company's product ID and not a general term.
When I saw the thumbnail I thought oh geez. But like always you backed it up with data and showed your work. Great job. This opens up a ton of options for printers that lack the ability to easily replace heater blocks. I'll def give this a go.
Doing my to show what work or not. Have fun playing around with the idea.
Thanks for the content, I always enjoy your investigations and findings 😁
Thanks! Appreciate it!
I did the Volcanizer mod on my printer with a 0.6mm nozzle on a Ender 3 v2. Works great and shaved so many hours off my prints and still looks great. I used a m6 steel nut and spacers with thermal compound between each for isolation of the brass nozzle. I mostly print functional bigger parts and for my application great mod!
For hotend heat isolation I use teflontape for water pipe sealing. Cheap and common. Result is amazing.
Always love a bit of data challenging preconceptions.
To me this raises an interesting option with non-planar 3d printing if it ever takes off. If you need more clearance from your print head assembly to get the angles you want just use the volcano nozzle and nut method.
This is an incredible amount of testing and the data is displayed clearly. Very nice work, thanks for experimenting and sharing your results!
This is going to change how hot ends and nozzles are designed. Great work, Stefan.
Use a piece of silicone tubing to insulate the exposed nozzle threads.
Good point.
Just had a great idea: Simply buy some 6 or 7mm ID silicone tubing, slide it over the exposed volcano nozzle, and cut to length. Or buy 10mm or whatever is necessary to slide around the nuts. Super simple insulation against the cooling fans that's cheap and easy to remove.
Your data and testing are second to none. Thank you Stefan
This video saved my qidi tech x plus from getting dumped, bless you kind sir.
I'd love to see this tested with the newer CHT volcano nozzel
Yes is it that new ? i can't find any review of it !
@@coced I only saw it recently while looking for a hotend for my SR, with no reviews
CHT Volcano nozzle on a Dragon HF.
"How much flow can you get?"
"Yes."
Im tempted to buy a few. They seem interesting.
I have a volcano cht on my voron, the performance difference over the standard volcano I had before is significant
Cool, did pretty much exactly that and got +60% more flow.
P.S. With hardened steel volcano nozzle there much less of an effect w/o a brass nut, which makes sense.
Good job!
@@CNCKitchen could you explain how to adapt the z probe for auto bed leveling and z homing when making the nozzle longer?
I went to the hardware store today and picked up a handful of 6mm x 1.0 nuts. I filed the contact surfaces of a single nut flat, screwed it onto a 0.6mm volcano nozzle, and mounted it on my standard E3D hotend and heater block.
The results have been amazing! I have been able to push my delta printer to 120 mm/sec speeds without any flow problems. I'm sure I can probably go faster, but considering that your method has already allowed me to go from reliably printing at about 70 mm/sec to 120, I am super happy!
Thank you for the great video and for all of your careful research on this subject.
This is a great experiment, and the results are very surprising, I was thinking of changing the hotend on one of my printer to a volcano, but if you can get similar, if not the same, results by just plugging in a volcano nozzle, maybe I don't need the volcano hotend after all, thanks Stefan!
Nice job on the lead free brass inserts. Was looking for those and couldn't find them anywhere
We're happy that we decided to go that route. Great that you like them.
I encourage you to continue your well-done videos. Always packed with information on 3d printing.
Thanks, will do!
This video addresses a question I asked myself not even a week ago. I gave up on finding out the difference between the Rapido hotends and thought I'd never get a satisfying answer.
Thank you for proving me wrong. Fascinating!
Happy to hear that! You probably wasn't the only one curious about the inner workings.
So really all they need to do is sell longer nozzles with a fatter cross section except for the small area that threads into the heater block.
I always wondered about using a v6 nozzle in a mk8 heat block because they stick out so far. Great video and info!!
Great content as usual. Thanks. I recently covered my soldering iron to prevent my fingers getting burned by the long exposed heating section (cheap soldering iron). I used car exhaust tape, basically glass tape with some high temperature adhesive impregnated. The adhesive becomes like glass when heated and the hot part is well insulated, or better at least. The tape wrapped around my soldering iron now gives me more warning and time to yank my fingers away. I would think that high temperature fibre glass tape as used in stoves and other heating element wiring would nicely slip over the long nozzle and reduce cooling from the fan
i very much appreciate your detailed scientific approach to anything you test. great video and interesting results!
Thank you!
This is my favorite 3d printing channel because of practical, scientific info like this. Thanks for sharing!
Glad you enjoy it!
You are a Saint. Sharing experienced practical knowledge. I see it brings you and others joy. Very inspiring.
Now off to wrap some copper (16ga house) wire around some nozzles and twist it snug with pliers.
Inspiring indeed : )
Funny you made this video. I put a new hotend on my Vyper and the nozzle sat to high where the z end stops would hit before the nozzle hit the bed. So I put a volcano hot end in and it worked good. Very nice video.
Thanks to your video I change regular mk8 0.6 type nozzle to volcano(fake one) 0.6 nozzle with two steel nuts. It's insane that i went from max 12mm³/sec to near 25mm³/sec and above this values filament forms in something like spring under extruder toothwheel ! Thank You - its working brillant !
Would love how a volcano nozzle with a diy vulcanizer and CHT mod would perform. Thank you for the video, really appreciated!
I just installed a volcano nozzle on an original CR10, I added also klipper with RPI, bl-touch and locked the bed with nuts. Let me tell you that the best improvement on quality and speed came out after using the Volcano. I cannot believe how good are the prints now, and so fast....
I've been running exactly this setup for a while now, didn't have any issues with it even at high flow rates (20+mm3/s)
Only problem I had is that a strong part cooling fan can mess with sensitive thermal runaway protection in Klipper. Relaxing settings a bit there helps though.
Brass or copper nuts are probably worse for performance because they add only a little heating outside the nozzle core threads but lose more heating through their higher conduction to the air. Titanium nuts that are better insulators would probably perform the best.
Awesome! Would love to see how this works with 0.6 and 0.8mm nozzles
Point definitely proven! Very cool numbers Stefan! Great thoughts, easy to understand and digest too. Nice work!
Much appreciated! Happy to hear that the massive amount of data was somehow understandable.
Two days ago I was faced with blocked nozzle on my ender 3 pro and did not have any more spare nozzles, hence I used a more commonly available nozzle as it has the same thread but longer. So I reduced the threads in the heartbreak and used that to compensate for accommodating the workaround nozzle and interestingly I got the same perfect print resolution and finish. Very same concept to what you have explained. I totally agree with you on this concept
Stefan:”you know what increases flow rate?”
Manufacturers:”our new ho-“
Stefan:”DEEZ NUTS”
Awesome findings Stefan!!
Now hear me out, I have an idea for a quick follow up.
Use one of your modified volcano nozzles you made for the DIY CRT nozzle video and use it with the brass nuts. The ones with the copper wire inserted in it.
Those results could be even higher and it would be cheap to make a really high flow nozzle.
Wow great data. Thank you for all the tests and making the great presentation
Dude, that’s nuts!
😂
first the cr-10 upgraded with volcano heatblock, then the diy cht nozzles, and now volcanizer. i know volcano heatblocks and nozzles are already cheap nowadays, but man the accessibility of your solutions and mods are just an armlength away, and you've got the data to prove it! also, tom's video on the 0.6 nozzle makes a lot of sense too. i wish there were more stefans and toms in the community. keep the reprap spirit alive!
Super"volcanoiser" would be cool- only problem being its a really long" lever" if it snags on a print
Excellent work Stefan.
I love your work Stefan!
I recently bought a Rapido UHF and was surprised to learn that for the extra price you pay you get basically…a nut (plus a volcano nozzle).
and the 2nd silicone sock. HF and UHF version did cost exactly the same at the store I ordered. With the HF version you receive an extra hardened steel nozzle instead of the UHF stuff.
@@CentaXBerlin2 oh right the long sock..
I guess a hardened nozzle would be a better choice for me, if I had the chance to choose that (ordered from AE a while ago)
Thankyou. Always great to see ways to increase performance.
5:30 I found your video researching whether I should cut my nozzles to prevent them from protruding from the heater block! :D
Nice to see the CHT nozzles hold their own. I should probably get around to installing mine... Been sitting there for months.
Very great deep dive investigation once again - just what one expects when stepping into the @CNC Kitchen ;-)
I rely on your videos to print faster and better, this information is extremely helpful, thank you
Your latest videos are just mind-blowing!
Appreciate it!
Nice to see this tests.
I have had such a setup a long time ago but never really tested its performance (yet) but found the replacing of standard nozzle with vulcano worked well except for the loss of Z-hight. So after a while it was replaced again with a standard nozzle on that printer.
I had planned to replace one of my printers with a vulcano - with your real testresults in mind I will probably just replace the nozzle now. Thanks!
I have had such a hard time finding good heat set inserts, this is perfect timing!
Hej Stefan, great video as always.
I'm thinking maybe the copper plated steel or brass nuts mostly act as an insulator when using cooling.
Also, great to see the regular CHT beats even the Volcanizer.
Just let us know in case you also want to ompare all the above against using a full Bondtech CHT nozzle for Volcano..
Steel yes, brass no. Vastly different thermal properties
Fantastic video, and really interesting research and results!
High-flow hot-end manufacturers: "Aww nuts!"
This is pretty genius. I recently went full volcano on all my machines last winter
I think its time to test 0.6mm nozzles!!! I'm all in for this testing!!!
Thanks for once again being top tier with both your methodology and frontier thinking. You’re as always impressively thorough.
So; while these tricks can be great for simply increasing the max flow rate drastically, the long melt zone will also cause more oozing and hence, a loss of detail and a severe risk of extensive stringing.
To strike a good balance seems easiest doable by using a Bondtech CHT nozzle which I use today.
As the cheap Chinese knock-offs are not made with chamfered sinked holes like the original Bondtech CHT, they cannot be recommended for anyone wondering if this is a viable economical shortcut. But to be fair, it is possible to actually do this yourself if you have the tools for it.
Thank you very much for your revealed experiment and lots of testing and I learned a lot from your interesting & wonderful videos.
You've done a number of videos now on high flow set ups that I've greatly appreciated. However one thing I think that would be great to see is how these various high flow setups perform in an intricate print with retracts, z hops, short layers, etc. It'd be really cool to find a high flow setup that also happens to accurately perform the chimney(arguably one of the most difficult area's of the speed benchy) as well as it performs the rest of the boat.
Why did i just recently buy the e3d revo Mini again?
Danke für dieses wiedermal beeindruckendes Video! Wer hätte das gedacht...
What amazing testing! As always you shine a light on things too many of us take for granted, and back it all up with scientific method, thanks!
Thank you! Mutant helps me here as well 😉
I want to see more advancement in hot ends. Things like the Revo that wrap the cartridge around the nozzle, and other novel experiments. It's so frustrating trying to adjust a traditional hot end
This is awesome. Im sure somebody has done this previously in the past, but i love seeing people experiment with their printers now adays, even with such a saturated market for all sorts of proprietary accessories and upgrades for 3d printers.
Using a copper heat block helps a lot. I have been printing with pretty good results --- with a volcano+copper heat block+1.2 mm nozzle+10% over extrusion --- at flow rates around 40 mm^3/sec.
I'd like to see a similar video showing differences between different wattage heater cartridges. For example: I find the standard 30 watt heater cartridge to be too weak to reliably run a Volcano, but now that there is a 40 watt and now even a 50 watt from Slice Engineering, it would be interesting to see how they affect performance even on a standard heater block.
That's definitely on my list!
Slice apparently even has a Magnum+ that can use two 50W. I dunno who needs 100W in a printer unless you are high flowing some very high temp materials.
@@filanfyretracker The 80 watt sure is a beast with the super volcano, but it would be nice to see if we could get similar specs on a hot end that doesn't have such an extreme lever arm or maybe a shorter melt zone (for oozing purposes).
I lover your research!
I think it's Blasphemous that around two thirds of your audience aren't subscribed to you ! Love your work keep it up mate, I appreciate what you do ! :D
Thanks!
When you dont have a proper sock or if your sock is damaged you can repair it with high temp RTV automotive silocone. The temps will be plenty good and it bonds REALLY REALLY WELL... dont let it cure on your silicone work pads. You could coat the nozzle for the test and then peel it off of you want to change it. If you are super keen make a thinwall PLA form to fill with RTV. Peel off after cure and you have an encased nozzle.
Hypothesis: There may not be very much of a heat gradient. Yes there will be a drop off in heat towards the nozzle because it's farther away from the heater. However, the filament is coming from above and closer to the heater. With the filament moving the temperature might be a lot more balanced throughout.
Indeed. And it might even carry some heat with it. I need to simulate that at some point.
This is not true. I did as he said. The printer does not print at the same temperature because the hotend is too cold.
I managed to get it to print at a temperature of 10 degrees above normal. Only in this case it is completely incomprehensible what was the point of fencing all these crutches, if you could just raise the temperature.
@@hate-conductor You're misunderstanding the experiment. He wasn't printing. He was running flow tests. He keeps the temperature the same throughout the video in order to find and measure the difference between the methods. If you tried one of these methods then, yes, you may need to increase the temperature to get consistent prints again. However, since you didn't say anything about flow or print speed it doesn't make any sense to call these methods "crutches". You might be able to print at a higher speed and not realize it. Or it might not work because of your machine and setup. None of this is a guarantee. Also nothing you've said disproves or even addresses my hypothesis. Nothing here at all measures heat drop off.
@@VagabondTE i have tried this method with 0.6mm, 0.8mm. and even 1mm nozzle size and it rarely prints well, clogging seems to be an issue, increasing the temperature exacerbate the problem, I use both brass nut and regular nut and both produce similar results, I gave up using this method and go back to regular nozzle
@@MuhammadRFabio What method? I didn't suggest any method.
nice video. the main drawback for a standard prusa user (such as me) would be overwriting printers software. Other than that not sure if it would not create problems with the sensors mount. So a possible custom sensor mount. that being said this is definitely worth looking into
Cool… Wonderful test! Thanks, Stefan!!!
I have purchased quite expensive Copper heatblock for my v6 thinking it would help melting performance. But after testing I found that it does not improve hot-end flow by any measurable amount. Copper heatblock even visibly increased ringing artifacts due to its weight.
At these flowrates heat transfer through plastic itself is the biggest bottleneck in flowrate, that is why Bondtech CHT is so good.
Maybe copper heatblock would be more useful with a CHT nozzle? Needs testing.
The heat capacity of the copper will help to stabilize temperatures and are more suitable for higher temperatures. Though they won't help increase flow in probably 98% of cases.
@@CNCKitchen I think You are correct. I did my tests using PLA at 210°C which is on the low-end of FDM 3D printing temperatures. I should probably redo these tests using something like Nylon at 270°C.
I have ordered the CHT nozzle. Excited to test these combinations.
This is insane the amount of time and work it world take to get the measurements
Try adding a small amount of thermal paste compound at the nozzle thread and in between the add nuts
Some thermal images would be great to see how the temperature of the nozzle and the extruded filament changes with different setups
Thank you for creating these videos! What digital caliper do you use?
Wow!
Again just awesome and massively helping me!
What about using rtv slicone gasket maker for custom insulation? Sure there is the wait time for it to dry.
would be interesting to see the results of the volcano style block with the extender.
I have a brass v6 heater block with a 50w cartridge I think that with copper sleeve with a volcano nozzle might out preform volcano based on extrusion deviation. At high flow rates
You've shown, what I try to do every project. Take what you have and find a way to make it better (that just what the MFGs have done!) to suit your needs. Thanks for all the great details!
Stefan! Try the reverse of the "copper" nut! You were right about the gradient and increasing the thermally conductive cross sectional area of heat flow with real copper and then insulating it (even if insulation is just a less conductive plating like steel or nickel) will have better results since it will have a lower h value! Newton's law of cooling!!
Inspired by this video, I did another variation of this. Screwed the volcano nozzle completely through my Ender 3 V2 (MK8) hotend, then a long (about 10 mm) M6 nut to couple the nozzle to my bi-metal heatbreak :)
Delta T is the highest in the top of the heater. By the time the filament enters the extension it's already heated quite a bit. So I'm the extension not that much heat needs to be added. Having the hottest bit on the top could actually be an optimum in heat transfer.
The downside is that the temperature will drop significantly towards the end so even if the heater is at 210C, the nozzle tip may only be 200C, preventing you from getting that extra heat in. You could compensate by raising the heater to 220C, but then when you aren't extruding, everything will heat up to 220C. Ideally you would want to control the temperature of the filament as it comes out of the nozzle. So having the heater closer to the nozzle tip and having the cooler end of the nozzle at the top would allow you to preheat the filament before getting to the nozzle and heater block. This would leave less of the filament at high temperature and for less time.
Which is why the copper results are so close to the results with nuts. The key element here is that the losses in the copper are not as big as the decrease of needed energy by the plastic. That will change as you said - longer nozzle and eventually the copper will actually cool the plastic.
Das ist ja interessant, danke dafür! Habe meine Hotend Kombinationen auch selbst gefräst (Heatsink) und zusammengestellt, als Heatbreak Slice Engineering Copperhead. Und auch mit der V6 CHT Nozzle (0.4) gefahren. Musste aber feststellen, dass sie für meine PETG und PCTG Drucke einfach zu unsauber gedruckt hat. Habe eine Brozzl Copper drinne und bisher keine Unterextrusion und wieder saubere Wände. Auf eine Volcano Düse hätte ich aber mal Lust und daher danke für das coole Video!
A brass nut with a ceramic tube to slip over it may help retain the heat near the hot end even better.
Haven't you try adding thermal past in between to see if it improve heating and flow?
Super interesting video. That was a ton of research and documentation. Mahalo for sharing! : )
OK so what if you put down some thermal paste on the threads and between the nuts, and between the nut and block. Probably wont' affect temps much. But might affect your gradient across the tip. Then combine that with a silicone sock.
Volcano : you need us for high flow rate
Cnc kitchen: you're nuts
I would suppose that effect might be related to the bigger real temperature at the nozzle. I know, that you kept the measured temp same, but you might have changed the heat capacity of the system with all these additions, so old PID parameters resulted to a bigger real temperature, which affected extrusion results.
PID parameters being slightly off is not going to increase temperature at the nozzle significantly.
This is pretty cool and valuable information. Thank you for doing all this crazy stuff and keeping us well informed. o7
Fascinating. Amazing job Stefan.